Came across this gem on a US school site the other day.

The teacher answered questions about pro and cons of the metric system.

This is an excerpt pointing out metric disadvantages:
"Metric units are not always appropriate amounts for convenient use. The 2-liter bottle seems to have become "natural," "

Now let's extend that thought a little further. Why has it become "natural", because people got used to it would be the logical answer. Be daring now and take the final step. It is now used like other USC units and has become CUSTOMARY. That in a nutshell is how people would absorb all metric measurements. Simple isn't it?

What that teacher did not realise is that he negated his argument that metric (2L bottles) are not always appropriate.

Is this supposed to be profound or something? Much of the metric system is historical and customary for many people. It is custoamry to use the millimetre even when otherwise using English. What is your point?

I would like to point out that if we made rulers that went down to 1/32 inch, the millimeter would likely fall into disuse.

As far as the 2 liter bottle example for a school lesson, Eric (metre) ought to e-mail that teacher and warn of the potential for confusion among the students. You see, while the packaging is ‘2 liters’ the serving size is 8 fl. oz. Eric likes to let us believe that he has the best interests of the public in mind. Since he seems to think that those sorts of conversions among units are confusing, it would only make sense for him to warn teachers of this danger.

I agree niles, although I think 1/24" would be better. I named the 1/32in unit the "di-in", tentatively, and the 1/24" unit the "petine", just ot make it more palatable to some folk.

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I would like to point out that if we made rulers that went down to 1/32 inch, the millimeter would likely fall into disuse.
>>

Maybe then companies would start making rulers that are marked every half millimeter. Then we'd have to go to 1/64ths of inches. Then they would start marking quarter millimeters. Then...

Re: Customary metric February 25 2004, 9:49 AM

Is this supposed to be profound or something? Much of the metric system is historical and customary for many people. It is custoamry to use the millimetre even when otherwise using English. What is your point?

Not much point elaborating the obvious.

Re: Customary metric February 25 2004, 10:19 PM

I would like to point out that if we made rulers that went down to 1/32 inch, the millimeter would likely fall into disuse.

As far as the 2 liter bottle example for a school lesson, Eric (metre) ought to e-mail that teacher and warn of the potential for confusion among the students. You see, while the packaging is ‘2 liters’ the serving size is 8 fl. oz. Eric likes to let us believe that he has the best interests of the public in mind. Since he seems to think that those sorts of conversions among units are confusing, it would only make sense for him to warn teachers of this danger.


How superbly irrelevant.

Bud, 1/4mm / 1/100in is basically the smallest size our eyes can determine anyway, so that is where it would end. Regardless, I think 1/24 in is a much better idea- the petine.

Bud, I may be mistaken, but I don't think that the average cheap, plastic ruler could accommodate the half mm (the lines are too thick). In any case, metricators wouldn't stand for it; they would insist that the mm be divided into micrometers, which really wouldn’t fit on such a ruler.

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Bud, I may be mistaken, but I don't think that the average cheap, plastic ruler could accommodate the half mm (the lines are too thick). In any case, metricators wouldn't stand for it; they would insist that the mm be divided into micrometers, which really wouldn’t fit on such a ruler.
>>
I know, I was joking about that. My message was that how finely you choose to divide a unit is entirely arbitrary, and has nothing to do with the nature of the system itself. Therefore, the argument that metric is better because the millimeter is more exact than the sixteenth of an inch makes no sense.

Bud:
>>
I know, I was joking about that. My message was that how finely you choose to divide a unit is entirely arbitrary, and has nothing to do with the nature of the system itself. Therefore, the argument that metric is better because the millimeter is more exact than the sixteenth of an inch makes no sense.
<<

Whover said that? Somebody just recently pointed out that all measurement systems are arbitrary, except the imperial one, which is based on human body parts. Mind you they still argue, whose body it shall be. But they are unanimous in ignoring women completely.

Consider this: it is easier for a woman to meet a man than it is for a man to meet a woman. Or, to put it a different way- if we make the foot unit, for instance, slightly larger than the average man's foot, the man can add his thumb (or whatever to it to make up the distance). The woman can have two hands and thumbs side by side and makes approx the same distance. However, if the measure is based on a natural man or woman's foot or somewhere inbetween, it is difficult for those larger- quite common everyday people- to make the measure up with their body parts.

Consider this: it is easier for a woman to meet a man than it is for a man to meet a woman. Or, to put it a different way- if we make the foot unit, for instance, slightly larger than the average man's foot, the man can add his thumb (or whatever to it to make up the distance). The woman can have two hands and thumbs side by side and makes approx the same distance. However, if the measure is based on a natural man or woman's foot or somewhere inbetween, it is difficult for those larger- quite common everyday people- to make the measure up with their body parts.

To explain that gem to people should keep you busy for the rest of your life.
Do yourself a favour and complicate the lot in true imperial fashion. Have 2 different feet, yards, inches.
Just prefix them with dainty, so women can actually identify with them. She was 5' and 3 dainty inches tall. Sounds even nice. That should make everybody happy.

MAte, let's take the shaftment unit (half a foot/ distance across hand with thumb outstretched). If I have my thumb as close to my hand as possible, I end up with about 4.5", if I stretch my thumb out as far as it will go, I get around 6.5".

See?

Everyone, man or woman, has these anthropocentric measures handy, as it were, as we can adjust various parts of ourselves to give us an approximate measure for that unit. For instance, I always use the length of the last bone on my thumb as a 1.5" measure, but not the width of my thumb as a 1 inch measure as some might.

Do you get this?

You see, it might be easier for a woman, or an average man, to take their foot, and then place their thumb next to it, or two fingers, or whatever, and produce a pretty good approximation of the length unit. However, it would be more difficult for the man with a 12.5" foot, and consequently much larger hands etc, to adapt to create a good approximation of a standard based on the woman or average man (9-10")

Prediction:

The entire post from Bryan will be reproduced - almost looking like metre (eric) is posting as himself.

But then it will be ended by a brief insultative bit of text that actively encourages a "no-win" predicament to the argument.

Let's see....

Re: Customary metric March 1 2004, 8:30 AM

MAte, let's take the shaftment unit (half a foot/ distance across hand with thumb outstretched). If I have my thumb as close to my hand as possible, I end up with about 4.5", if I stretch my thumb out as far as it will go, I get around 6.5".

See?

Everyone, man or woman, has these anthropocentric measures handy, as it were, as we can adjust various parts of ourselves to give us an approximate measure for that unit. For instance, I always use the length of the last bone on my thumb as a 1.5" measure, but not the width of my thumb as a 1 inch measure as some might.

Do you get this?

You see, it might be easier for a woman, or an average man, to take their foot, and then place their thumb next to it, or two fingers, or whatever, and produce a pretty good approximation of the length unit. However, it would be more difficult for the man with a 12.5" foot, and consequently much larger hands etc, to adapt to create a good approximation of a standard based on the woman or average man (9-10")

Sorry, could you explain this again please?

I don't believe I can explain it any more simplistically. Perhaps somebody else would be kind enough to oblige you.

I should have put money on my prediction!!!

the odds would have been 1-1000 on.

Re: Customary metric March 2 2004, 12:08 PM

I don't believe I can explain it any more simplistically. Perhaps somebody else would be kind enough to oblige you.


Please understand, I have problems understanding inch wired brains.

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Please understand, I have problems understanding inch wired brains.
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Metre, you have a problem because you think you have a problem.

If you approached Bryan's post without any prejudice, you would have no trouble understanding it. A twelve year old could understand it.

But as long as you keep telling yourself negative things about imperial, you will never get it.

...and what makes me lol is that he's admitted in the past that he does not understand metric because he was brought up the imperial way and *no-one* can understand more than one system!

Re: Customary metric March 3 2004, 6:36 AM

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Please understand, I have problems understanding inch wired brains.
>>

Metre, you have a problem because you think you have a problem.

If you approached Bryan's post without any prejudice, you would have no trouble understanding it. A twelve year old could understand it.

But as long as you keep telling yourself negative things about imperial, you will never get it.


Problem is, nobody except a few wayward people, find anything positive about cumbersome imperial units. I wonder why this is so?

Most people who use English W&M get on fine with them. Most people in metricated nations prefer metric as that is what they are used to. I know many people from metric nations who have moved to Britain or america and get o perfectly well with English and, in fact, quite like it.

It is all about what you are used to./ The reason so many people prefer metric in the world is simply due to the fact that they have been forced to use metric, and so now are used to it.

Re: Customary metric March 4 2004, 1:06 PM

Most people who use English W&M get on fine with them. Most people in metricated nations prefer metric as that is what they are used to. I know many people from metric nations who have moved to Britain or america and get o perfectly well with English and, in fact, quite like it.

metre:
You mean the language of course, agreed. Metric people consider imperial a pain in the neck full stop. Whether you like it or not.


It is all about what you are used to./ The reason so many people prefer metric in the world is simply due to the fact that they have been forced to use metric, and so now are used to it.

metre:
Of course they don't mind 5, or 6 simple units. You don't have to be an Einstein to pronounce those, but ask them to perform a simple task like working out how suare yards of new carpet they have to buy, or how to arrive at a quantity of 1 part of oil to 50 parts of petrol if your tank hold 12 gallons and most of them are hopelessly stuck..

Apart from Australians and NewZealanders and some other small countries, nobody has been forced for the last hundred years, or so, to use metric. Mind you all of those people are damn glad to be rid of useless old units.
You imperialists suffer from selective vision and hearing. Let me state it again, who apart from Britain and America is trying to catch up with decent measurements? Europe, Asia, The Middle East, Africa, South America, Australasia?

You are wrong, metre, wrong as a wrong thing.

I think we all know that Bryan - that's why we humour him - it's easier to bait the idiot!

I mean, look at this: "You mean the language of course, agreed. Metric people consider imperial a pain in the neck full stop. Whether you like it or not"

I wonder where he gets that from?
Considering I doubt he has any friends then I REALLY doubt he has any european friends.

I have - quite a lot actually. And they all find imperial to be quite nice and are eager to learn.

My friend (and best man) has aquired an italian girlfriend and she was talking all night about imperial measures! (ok, I know what you're thinking). Next time I saw her she knew it all! And she expressed all her measurements in imperial --- erm --- moving on....

I like eric's "you imerialists" blast - considering what he has admitted in the past!!!!

Now enough of me - lets bait eric a bit more!

GIGO? March 5 2004, 10:22 AM

You are wrong, metre, wrong as a wrong thing.

Of course if YOU say so.

Thank yo for agreing with me, old man.

lol!

(that's not "lots of love", eric!!)

Sans teeth, sans eyes, sans taste, sans everything. March 8 2004, 8:45 AM

Thank yo for agreing with me, old man.

My pleasure boyo.