ARM has just received this written message from one of our 'spotters':

"When I wrote to you on 20th May last year I mentioned metric distance signs for a garden buildings firm near Wendover, Bucks.

"The old, weathered, signs (which I had amended) have now been replaced by brand new ones - in yards!!"

Tony, how can signs in metres confuse people? The British population must be pretty dumb if they cannot picture for example, 100 metres (the size of a 100m running track).

I read in the Daily Mail a couple of weeks ago that you were going to be changing the metric signs at the Tower of London. Has it not occured to you that many people who visit the Tower of London may be foreigners who understand metres rather than yards?

Oh and by the way, I saw a roadworks sign the other day saying "Lorries turning 400m". I'm not going to say where it is though.

"Oh and by the way, I saw a roadworks sign the other day saying "Lorries turning 400m". I'm not going to say where it is though."

Good, that should keep them guessing!

I'm in the same position.

Richard,

In the U.K., we have around 1 to 2 million road traffic signs, around 99.9% of which are in our own language, i.e. miles, yards, feet and inches.

Moreover, the law of this country (Traffic Signs Regulations 2002) requires that all distances and dimensions (heights and widths etc.) must be in our own langauge i.e in Imperial units - although the government has permitted authorities to put heights in metric and widths in metric in addition if they want to (very very few do, as it's more expensive and unnecessary).

The Department for Transport itself has gone on record as stating that it would be 'confusing' to use two systems of measurement at one time, especially where something as potentially dangerous as road safety is concerned.

How could you have a system where one minute it was half a mile to a road hazard, then 300 metres, then 100 yards etc.?

And can you tell me of one other nation in the world that has two systems of measurement in use on its road traffic signs (apart from the Irish Republic which is in a messy phase of transition between Imperial and metric).


It would cost around £1 billion-plus to convert our 1-2 million road signs into metric and there is absolutley no enthusiasm for this apart from a tiny handful of metric zealots who want to impose something completely unnecessary, at the same time trying to ensure that expenditure on metric road signs takes precedence over housinng the homeless, helping disabled people, improving our roads, hospitals, schools etc. You might wish to let us know whether you support this £1 billion pound plan.

On your point about foreign visitors to this country understanding metres, of course many of them do, though certainly not the hordes of visitors from the United States. No doubt when they travel here they would understand us better if we spoke all their languages. Part of the joy of travel, though, is to experience something a bit different.

In point of fact, the Tower of London sign you refer to is in three languages. I think the English says: "Entrance Ahead" and there is a translation into French and German. The trouble is, in all three languages, the distance is given as '250m'.

We have planned to change the top part of this sign (i.e. the line which is in English) so as to read '275 yds', and a national newspaper (not the 'Daily Mail') has arranged to photograph us while doing so. I will post further details after our amendment is safely accomplished

"We have planned to change the top part of this sign (i.e. the line which is in English) so as to read '275 yds'"

Then you are contradicting what you previously said. You said we cannot have two systems of measurement on signs (metric and imperial). If one line says 275yds and the next 250m I think that is dual systems on one sign! Which national newspaper is photographing you? Whatever paper it is, they must be desperate for news!

Richard,

The '275 yds' sign we plan to put over the top third of the Tower of London sign is a complete one-off.

We're quite happy for the French and German-speakers to see the queueing distance underneath in their beloved metres.

Bear in mind that those who see it will be queueing for admission to the Tower at a snail's pace, and won't be lorries hurtling down a busy 'A' road at 60 m.p.h. tryig to decipher a sign with two sets of measurements on it, both in smaller writing than if they had had the good sense to leave the Imperial units on their own.

As for the news value of the item, wait till you see the picture

"Has it not occured to you that many people who visit the Tower of London may be foreigners who understand metres rather than yards?"

I love this from people who obviously don't know London.

Ok - one word - "Americans".

And a clue - "these people use the same measurement system for lengths as us".

Does this make any sense?

September 11th
--

<<
"Has it not occured to you that many people who visit the Tower of London may be foreigners who understand metres rather than yards?"

I love this from people who obviously don't know London.

Ok - one word - "Americans".
>>

Figures from the British Tourist Authority show that:

65.2% of tourists in the UK are from elsewhere in Europe (44.8% of money spent).

19.9% are E. Hemisphere long-haul visitors (27 % of money spent)

14.9% are W. Hemisphere long-haul visitors (28.1% of money spent).

By your logic Steve, all signs to the very popular tourist sights should be in metric units.

Martin,

What other aspects of British culture should disappear in order to make life easier for tourists?

Surely, the point of tourists coming to Britain is to experience Britain.

<<"Martin,

What other aspects of British culture should disappear in order to make life easier for tourists?">>

I can just see it when the French come home from a weekend in London and telling their friends that the highlight of their holiday was seeing yards on roadsigns! THRILLING!

It's a good job the French never drive on our roads when they come over for holidays here.

How would they cope with all those miles, yards, feet and inches?

Richard wrote:
<<
<<"Martin,

What other aspects of British culture should disappear in order to make life easier for tourists?">>

I can just see it when the French come home from a weekend in London and telling their friends that the highlight of their holiday was seeing yards on roadsigns! THRILLING!

>>

Ask SteveH - he apparently thinks that it is a good idea to have signs in tourist areas in yards because Americans do not understand metres. I was merely pointing out that only 28% of out tourist revenue comes from Americans - so by Steve's logic the signs in tourist areas should be in metres.

Previously on SkyOne...
<<
"Has it not occured to you that many people who visit the Tower of London may be foreigners who understand metres rather than yards?"

I love this from people who obviously don't know London.

Ok - one word - "Americans".


Figures from the British Tourist Authority show that:

65.2% of tourists in the UK are from elsewhere in Europe (44.8% of money spent).

19.9% are E. Hemisphere long-haul visitors (27 % of money spent)

14.9% are W. Hemisphere long-haul visitors (28.1% of money spent).

By your logic Steve, all signs to the very popular tourist sights should be in metric units
>>>



hmmm, just wondering if you forgot the british visitors to those british tourist spots.

perhaps they don't count - after all "we're all in europe now" !!!!

"I can just see it when the French come home from a weekend in London and telling their friends that the highlight of their holiday was seeing yards on roadsigns! THRILLING!"

Isn't that a bit ignorant to cite just one aspect of Britishness as something the french would talk about when they get home?

Why didn't your post read something like this:

"I can just see it when the French come home from a weekend in London and telling their friends that the highlight of their holiday was seeing a red post box by a road! THRILLING!"

How do you feel now?

Incidentally, ahem, I just came home from Paris and the highlight of my holiday was seeing a croissant in a shop window by the road! THRILLING!



Keep 'em coming Richy....

[silence]

Oh, and are you saying that when British and American people go to France, the thing they talk about when they get home is the French's use of the kilometre? Even as a pro-metric person, I don't think anything of different country's roadsigns when I am on holiday as that would be seriously sad. As somebody who can understand miles AND kilometres, it doesn't really bother me.

On the post box thing. Again, I don't go to France and marvell at the France Telecom phoneboxes so why should the French or any other tourist care about the red British Post box? People go to places like London to see Buckingham Palace, London Eye, etc. Not to see a post box or a road sign in miles!

Not sure about red post boxes, but certainly red telephone boxes - they fall into the "chic" category, along with Mini's and the like.

As any Tourism Officer will tell you, by far the greatest draw for foreign tourists to Britain is our heritage.

So, let's keep it!

<<
I don't think anything of different country's roadsigns when I am on holiday as that would be seriously sad.
>>

Normnally, I don't either, apart from whether they are easy to use (or not) as the case may be. I do, however, notice small features that improve the signs generally (in France, for example, the line separating the hard shoulder from the carriage way is a broken line (not a solid line as in the UK) with a mark space ratio of about 4:1. The reason for this is to help you keep a safe distance from the vehicle in front of you (2 lines or more = safe; less than 1 line = dangerous)

The same french who don't like to put a central reservation between the opposing traffic lanes of the motorway - just a "green bit".

Yup, very safe.

Richard - you've lost the plot, re-read what I posted to see if you can get it.

<<
The same french who don't like to put a central reservation between the opposing traffic lanes of the motorway - just a "green bit".
>>

I did not say that the French motorways were perfect. I was commenting on just one aspect of them.

AS regards the green strip between the two lanes - yes I do recall that there might not have been a central reservation when in the countryside, but a 10 metre green strip with a drainage ditch down the middle instead. I do however recall having seen a safety barrier on at least parts of the Boulevard Periphique.

It might be worthwhile adding that the French do scimp on their safety barriers - had they used more safety barriers, then Princess Diana might still have been alive. I noticed that there was no comment in the UK press about the absence of safety barriers in the French road tunnels. In the case of Princess Diana, a safety barrier would have prevented the car from hitting a stationery pillar head-on at high speed - instead the car would have bounced off the safety barrier back into the carriageway.

A truck can get across a 30ft "green bit" , trough or no trough

I never said that the French roads were perfect did I. I omly said that there were *some* aspects from which we could learn.

I was simply translating your use of metric so that the readers can instantly recognise the distance!

Steve - why did you choose feet instead of yards.

Since 20m is approximately 22yds, my estimate of 10m rounds to "half a cricket pitch".

"Steve - why did you choose feet instead of yards."

Because I CHOSE to! You *actually* said it, look ^^

I'm honestly starting to believe that rather than cynically play the "anti-imperial" game that you actually don't understand the fundamental reasons for 99% of the debate on Imperial vs metric measures.

Look up "choice"