Looking at my first boost project. I've been trying to supress it for 2 years, just can't do it anymore. Gotta try it, see what she yields.

So I some help deciding which of my motors to use for the boost project. Car is an A1 GTI. It's currently equipped with an 11:1, ABA based 2 liter 8v, Eurospec head, 280 cam, blah blah blah, runs beautifully. CIS injected.

Also in my garage is the original low comp JH 1.8. High miles, but ran great, good comp, used NO oil.

As well, a 1.8 16v, and a 2.0 16v.

Which motor should I base my first boost project on? Of course 16v is tempting, but perhaps too ambitious. I want to be conservative in an attempt to ensure success.

The current "Keep It Simple Stupid" approach is to use the 1.8 JH. Fuel it with volvo 240 Turbo CIS that I have. Use a common .42/.48 T3, those are pretty cheap and easy to come by. Not sure which path to go with ignition, but overall, this seems the easiest, cheapest path. For a coupla reasons:

a) don't care if I kill the JH motor. 3 more back ups in the garage already

b) Volvo ran 10.5 psi on a 2.1 liter motor with this injection, should take care of a 1.8 up to maybe 12psi, no?

Again, cheap and straight forward, do what the Volvo factory did for fuel management.

Let's discuss, I'm curious what you guys think about this idea. I'd love a 2.0 16v T with programmable efi, but ya gotta walk before you can run.......

Oh, and I've read the "200 hp with stock reliability" write up, but that G60 management is another $200-300 that I don't have to spend if the vovlo stuff works okay.

Bring it on.....

I think the G60 injection is definatly the way to go.The SNS chips are key to the project though.

the AIC or EIC is the way to go if you're looking for a low budget project, u can pick one up for around 300 bucks and it'll work much better than any volvo/saab crap, it has a MAP sensor built into the unit so it compensated for fuel, i had one and it was the simplest thing to use.
Paul

Thanks Paul, thanks Chuck.


Remember though, this is my first boost project. Success and reliability are the primary goals. Most digi 1 set ups go for $250-300. AIC is $300. CIS from a running Volvo 240T can be had for $50. For 8-10 psi on a 1.8, why wouldn't that work just fine? I mean, Volvo themselves ran a 2.1 liter 8v engine at 10.5psi on that CIS set up, why would it be bad or come up short on a 1.8? Seems like a straight forward, easy to dial, low buck(good!)solution. Doesn't it? Why or why not?

I realize the potential of the Digi 1 set ups, and am very enamored with that idea, but unless I find a screamin' good deal on the set up, it's down the pike......when I say budget build, I MEAN it. I'm between jobs:-(, but I've got ALOT of time right now....

"go build something". I've finally got time. Money, no, but time, yes......I'm building something.

Yes, you're describing my situation exactly. I don't have a job right now but tons of time so I'm tinkering with things.

I'm running a JH with non-intercooled T3 at 6 psi (spiked to 8psi) and the Volvo turbo CIS injection and it's working perfect for me. The Volvo guys say it works to at least 200 horsepower, and I know I'm not anywhere near that yet. I'm probably at 165 or 175 max.

I did just blow the motor, but I'm sure that was detonation caused by the high RPM boost spikes to 8-9 psi. I fixed that problem and lowered the compression so I'm confident that when I get an intercooler I will be running 10-12 psi. And I don't have a knock sensor or anything. I'm using the dual diaphragm vacuum advance that I modified to give more boost retard.
And I got the whole CIS injection for $30. CAn't beat that.

i've landed a pretty good job now, that's the reason why i'm always posting on vwwhortex and here as much as i can, shit's boring and all, but now i got a little money but no time to work on my car. I guess if u can make the cis stuff work then go for it, Chuck would know the cis stuff way better than me, How do u guys do it? audi 5k warm up regulator?
Paul

Volvo used a boost responsive WUR just like the Audi 5k set ups, same function. Same concept deal, I dont believe it's actually the same Bosch part#, IIRC they look dif.

Kevin, curious about something you said. You mentioned you were running a JH, but after you blew the motor, you lowered compression? It's already 8.5:1, how low did you go? That's why I'm considering using my JH, no stacked or copper gaskets and I'm already at 8.5:1. Otherwise, I might just lower the comp on my 2.0 and take advantage of the huge ports and match ported manifolds.

"Otherwise, I might just lower the comp on my 2.0 and take advantage of the huge ports and match ported manifolds."

Already thinking past the conservative limits and goals. I've gotta define my goals for this first build and stick to them no matter how tempting.

Low boost levels, cheap parts, fairly relable. I only need to make more tq than my na 2.0 makes to be happy, sholdn't be too tough.

I tried the volvo WUR and it just ran way too rich. I'm not exactly sure why, but it was obviously dumping too much fuel. So I use the Volvo fuel distributor+air flow meter and stock 81 Scirocco WUR.

Drew, so for the misunderstanding, the head I had on the motor when I blew it was milled pretty radically, so the compression was around 9.4:1. I got a new head and barely cut it so the compression is now like 8.7:1 max. That's what I meant.

And good idea on keeping with your original goals, Because you will encounter lots of little problems here and there, and the simpler your system is, there easier it is to fix the stuff and you obviously know

DO you have to deal with smog laws and smog checks at all? That's what holds me back from doing anything radical at this point.

Yep, we've got smog tests in the county of PA that I live in. I'm 6 miles from the county line where I wouldn't need it, but that's no help.

I just swap odometers around inspection time to make it appear as if the car does less than 5000 miles per year, that automatically exempts me. And some of the early A1 are getting into "classic" status, so that exempts you as well.

So kevin, you found the Volvo wur to be too rich? All the time, just under boost, off boost? Gimme some scoop on that if you would.

Thus far, here's my parts that I've acquired:

JH motor, absolutely stock.
Volvo 240T CIS
Volvo T3 .42 hot/.48 cold side.
Volvo intercooler, pretty large thing
1 1/4 weld els and tees.
wide ratio 5spd

Gotta get my 8v flange , as well as a T3 flange, and it's time to weld.

So far, I've got less than $200 into everything. Need a downpipe, and come ic plumbing, but both of those will probably be mild steel exhaust tubing.

All I want outta this is alittle more hp than my 2.0 8v, and of course gobs more torque.

Kevin, what did you do for a BOV or dump valve?

Yeah I found the volvo WUR to be too rich on boost if I remember correctly. It has the vacuum fitting and when it got boost, the motor stumbled with too much fuel. Maybe I could've adjusted everything, but I just put the old one and and it worked fine, so...

At first when i made the intake piping i didn't run a blowoff vavle, and in like 5 miles I blew a hole in the rubber throttlebody boot. I welded on a fitting for a TurboXS BOV that's routed back into the intake after the airflow meter and before the turbo. You can't hear it, but it works.

There's a fellow I know that "re enforced" his rubber throttle body boot by dipping it in liquid plastic "tool dip" a bunch of times. Seems to be working for now, he's running 12psi at the track. My budget constraints will probably allow for such niceties.

HEy that tool dip is a really good idea. When I put on an intercooler and raise the boost above 6, i'll have to do that.

How do you plan on fitting the Volvo I/C? That thing is a monster.
I tried to just fit a Toyota supra IC and couldn't get it to work because of size issues. I'm probably going to go with a Saab900 IC mounted on top of the motor.

get one installed, it's really not a good idea to run boost without one, they can be picked up for fairly cheap.

How am I going to get it to fit? Not sure just yet. I'm picking it up at Waterfest from a friend for very reasonable money, he's sympathetic to my financial situation. We'll start the trial fitting after that. IIRC, it's 12x18. I'm thinking I end up moving the radiator back as far as I can go, and see if she fits. Worse comes to worse, I've got a Probe IC out there, although the in/out is kinda small, 1.75". I guess that's not too detrimental for this "low on the learning curve" project, however, and it will fit somewhat easier.

Got a knock sensor set up in there already, 11:1 and 90 deg days make it a very good thing.....

Which brings up another question that occurred to me. The less aggressive timing advance of the 85 knock box is probably a very good thing with boost, eh? Maybe I'll try and rig a jumper wire to simulate that wire to pin 11 and get the '85 advance instead of the more aggressive map in my '86 box. Hmmmm.

Its too damm big to fit in the car.Try a probe/626 one.

Knock ignition should work well.

I used a 2.0 16v TB boot on the attack rabbit,and ran 17lbs of boost on that.

Yeah, I realize that the Volvo ic is too damned big to fit in the car, but I was just going to replace the hood with the ic. It's right over the motor but the airflow is good.

Actually, the plan is to cut it so it's not as tall and wedge it in front of the radiator. A buddy of mine has been using truck ICs to make some sweet FMIC for the DSM guys and he gets two or three out of each IC he picks up. I figure that given that, we'll find a way to create a rather large IC that fits pretty well outta this volvo piece. And the Volvo units are CHEAP! Just for fun, price a Spearco, then go on ebay and price a Volvo unit. Heh...

I'm especially willing to go through the effort for the ic - I see it as a valuable safeguard when using CIS.

If all that fails, or is holding me back from completing the project, I do have a probe ic out in the garage as well. It's a bit thick with small inletoutlet, but I'm sure it'll do the trick for my conservative goals.

So a 2.0 16v boot is a tougher creature than the A1 tb boot? Interesting, I have one of those out there already, good info Chuck.

U ran 17psi of boost on the volvo system? how