i'm gonna go a little carzy
so after not haveing any sales this past month the guy that lets me carve at the market said I need to move on. I couldn't argue 30% of nuthn is nuthn, this is the third time in the past year I've had to move my carveing pit. I've only had the knowlege of carving bars and the internet for about 13-15 months... I work fulltime climbing trees, and carve every secound I can. but I still can't figure out how to sell these things! all I want to do is carve - I've almost dyed three times this year working tree service in rochester - but yet I'm here? anyone want a lacky/finisher/sander/sawbit.h. I need a place to go this city isn't workingfor me. only thing I got to look forward to is ridgway. no orders no kids no worries.
NO MORE WINEING ITS GOTTA GET BETTER!!



I thought I had a nice display?

black walnut flowers-good-bad?






trees are getten better

and this one is still 100% all saw. I like to get the girls to stick around a couple days before I grind on them ha ha anyways my new girl- she don't talk much but I like that

I feel for you. I like your "non howdy-bear" style. Take my comments with a grain of salt since I'm only a hobbyist.

There are a lot of factors at work in being a successful artist and/or carver. Location, pricing, your local market, and a host of other factors are all important to your success as a carver.

Carving skill/artistic ability and business skills are mutually exclusive. Visionary artists often starve because of a lack of business and marketing skills. Crappy artists with great people and sales skills often do quite well. Make sure that you work on both sides of the equation. There are a bunch of resources on selling art that are available (that work on the basics, like initiating conversations, being approachable, working the sale, etc.). Personally I hate selling things, and I'm not very good at it.

I appreciate your unique style of carvings. However, your local market may be a "bear market"- meaning that you need to carve the ubiquitious bears, eagles and other "cliche" carvings. Nobody really wants to crank out 100 bear cubs, but that's often what pays the bills and gives you the leeway to do carvings you really want.

Best of luck to you.

theres bears eagles owls an birdhouses - I just don't want to post repost them

THANK YOU JOE i still owe u

your display and carvings are great they probably did not realize your product is an attraction. your sales being down are not your fault thats epidemic everywhere. if your familiar with black forest carvings some say there bavarian but some say a swiss town created them employing 1300 to 1800 carvers in this trade. i feel the next up turn in the economy gatlinburg/pigeon forge tenn will be the place. the reason i say this is they have a giftware trade show at gatlinburg and sevierville tenn the products are mainly imported goods. if they hold shows there that gets my attention that means many dollars of sales are made and the orders placed over and over again all year long. if theres 20-30 carvers up there and some part time that means that area is way underserved . if a swiss town a 100 years ago could employ thousands of carvers what could the jewel of the smokies do your competition would be cheap imports though.

Great carvings. I know that if I didn't have atleast one bear, beaver, eagle, elk, raccoon, or some kind of overly cute done carving to spread around my fun carvings the people in my community would not buy from me. I have some fine pieces that I sit on for some time before I sell them also. I know that when someone stops by my place and says do you have any frogs? If I don't have them you can be sure that there will be a big frog out in front of my place the next week, so the people can see it from the road the next time they drive by.

Hi Link.....
I agree with Sandor's and Ken's comments. It is a very
complicated equation, involving everything from your personality
to your carving ability. I can appreciate the fact that you want
to challenge yourself and try new things, but I do get the impression
from the pictures that you may be more successful if you focus on
the basics. I don't get excited about carving eagles and bears, but
they are the most popular things. The heart and flame for example....
you did a good job with it, and it will very likely sell sooner or
later, but the odds are a cute bear will sell ten times faster.
And, cute usually outsells realistic.....and takes less work.
I like your owls, but they might be cuter (and maybe sell better)
if you shorten the body, make them chubbier. There are of course
exceptions to cuteness....hardly anyone wants a cute eagle or horse,
they want subjects like those to hopefully capture the animal's
character.

If you haven't already done this, consider getting honest feedback
from your "hosts" and customers. The "market" owners should be
in a very good position to give you the feedback you need, especially
if you tell them that you want honest (even if it's brutal!) feedback,
that you want to get better, you want the situation to be mutually
beneficial, etc. Something with your situation isn't working, and
the shop owner has likely heard plenty of customer comments to tell
you if it's pricing, quality, if you rub customers the wrong way,
too much noise and sawdust, whatever the case may be.
Good luck.........Gary

I have a couple shows this month. Get ahold of me and have some inventory ready,we'll move it. Bearden2009@yahoo.com

see ya

Don't blame yourself man, this economy is the worst it's been since the depression. Large, established ompanies that have been in business for 50+ years are going under all over the place. 10% unemployment with prices of everything except chainsaw carvings going thru the roof...people are scared of another winter like last year, with good reason.

I have a sign out front of my location that says. "If I am carving, wave hands FRANTICALLY if you have a question or you need to stimulate my economy!

Contrary to what anyone may hear about Gatlinburg/Pigeon Forge, my shop is well known here and still we have been off by 30-50% every month this year. No area is immune in this economy. People are still coming, but they're not spending. The local business owners I know all say tthe same thing.

what concerns me he is selling nothing 45 % off of what 100,000 150,000 still feeds the family. erv your the only one i see buying new lifts and such dave said hisself he sold thousands of gene webbs carvings. if the carvers would supply the stores wholesale and compete against the chineese imports they might take back business that is bleeding money overseas. you can carve or starve

so lower our prices and carve cheaper .....

lets see I know china doesnt go by yen they by yuan(sp) but lets say the average carver there makes 30 yen a week same as a factory worker does.

ok I think I do better then a factory worker so lets pay him four times that amount 30x4 120 yen .

alrighty then thats 120 yen a week x 4 is 480 yen a month on months with 5 weeks 600 yen ......even if we use dollars instead of yen , I couldnt pay my monthly bills.

30.00 CNY = 4.39438 USD
China Yuan Renminbi United States Dollars
1 CNY = 0.146479 USD 1 USD = 6.82691

hey look this is what a Yuan is

Last I remember China was still a comunist country????

un less they freed Tibet and turned over a new leaf.


come on shop owners should by American and we should wholesale to them at a fair level that we all can make a living.

and there is no way we can do it cheaper then China no way !!!!
you are insane if you try. you will go under.

Link You are a great guy and you are youg, I invited you to sit with us and eat at RW because I thought so.

you just need to carve your ass off because you can mark my word some guy with a wad of money will see your stuff and stop and you wont have what he is looking for.

carve bears ,eagles yes you must but carve a few big master peaces and test yourself push yourself. you will then acomplish what you are trying to do .

the big pieces bring in traffic the carving of them makes you better .....along with alot of study!!!!!!

the point is everyone can nock out a bear fast and owls and this and that....but you have a few show pieces around and you will get orders for big pieces and stump jobs . that will get you thru winter.

this week things will start too loosen up then it will be balls to the walls till dec 24th then dead very dead till RW ......so get at it man you can do it just keep trying to improve one thing at a time and study.

there are no get rich sceems just lots of hard work.


JOHN!!!!! pay attention that goes for you also


cheers my friends
God bless and good luck

JD

jamie i agree with you but not everybody is on your level speed or detail. yes the import competition is fierce but some carvers like brad sharp at his prices speed and detail i think could compete.and show pieces do get the ohh ahhs but the more i read the forums i hear people suffering even you are in terrible debt .i hope things get better faster but everything is cyclical we are in a bargain low end market now . yes there is some rich dudes still buying master pieces i assume somewhere. but some guys are just trying to make it or survive , and erv i have to agree you are a smart businessman i have bought lots of equipment in the 90,s used it and resold sometimes at a profit.and dave gene webb is an excellent carver, rick nasby is a great guy he talked me through better bear fur here . and dave i know your best friend is the man in the mirror but i will still be your friend if i do get me a place up there your welcome and critique me all constructive advice is appreciated.

its the location!!! everytime I leave the city I do O.k.
The months that I did well this summer were the ones were I was no the road or at an event. I have sold more carvings to people from rochester in the addarondecks and the fingerlakes then in the city. people from this city would rather buy a carving when their on thier vacation or road trip. If they bought it from some place down the street it has no story, no ice breaking value(unless they know the carver).

The only reason I'm going crazy is I have to move my winter log pile and carve out in the woods. I got use to carving in front of people and being able to sell at the same time. now I've got to seperate them and carve in privite.

I did find a new road side spot to sell at on the weekends 35min eachway but i think it might be worth it.

I bought the lift used and completed 5 large carvings with it and now I'm selling it for what I paid for it, so the net investment= zero. Once again you don't have a clue what you're talking about! I really hate responding to you at all, but sometimes I just can't help myself.

Yes, listen to the moron speak. He knows everything and gives advice as if he knows what he is talking about. Not only can't you express yourself coherently Buzzard droppings but you can't read either. I actually said I sold hundreds of Gene Webb carvings each year. His carvings sell from $40 up to $200. What he carves has no comparison to chainsaw carving, but you distort that and mix it in with your daydreams about selling bears here. Go ahead and bring your quick carve crap over the mountain and give it a try. It will just make all the carvers here look so much better.
My advice to you, again, time after time is to slow down and learn how to make a proportional, decent bear and then pick up the speed. If you had quality carvings you would still be making sales. Right now your only value is to demonstrate to all the newbies, how not to start out and make a fool out of yourself every time you write something.
As usual, I only write when compelled to respond to your post that distort what you think you know about me. People like you should have to pass a test before you are allowed to operate a computer.
I have to say that you picked a good, possible, partner in Rick Nasty. The two of you make a marriage made in heaven, just like peanut butter and jelly. In February be sure to wave as you pass by, but don't bother to stop. You and Mr. Nasty are the only two people I have given this admonishment to, so you can feel special.

can doc visit you dave

Buzz I concider dave my friend
Daves welcome at our home anytime he likes

He is talented and fun to hang with

I have some of his carvings for sale at my place

please don't bring your drama/opinion) on other peoples posts

I like Dave ! It's a bad year all around. We all have to find our way through the forest, kinda like Lord Of The Rings! Keep yer noses to the grindstone or wave good-bye. YOU are the keepers of your own future, use your noggins, and try everything. And yes, Dave is right.Doc

My opinion.

Your work is fine. I think you need to put a price on that makes people feel like they are not taking advantage of you. Business is business you need to respect your work and the time it takes. Time is money people that have money kn ow that. I'm selling fine. I have a good location and lots of experience I know but I'm sure you can do the same. I don't have a tag on a piece. I talk to people and see if they are interested and then talk numbers. We have small bears at a set price and people pay the same for things but making a connection and being excited about the works is something that helps things sell.

There is a painter in my town who just had a show in a gallery here. He said "my work does not sell". They had an opening spent at least a thousand on promotion and sold nothing. I did very well that same weekend just being open. I think being true to yourself and encouraging people to buy is a key factor in selling.

Art is art, Modern, Folk or fine art. People like to meet enthusiastic people who are true to themselves and their work. They will want something from someone who is passionate. The guy who says "my work does not sell" and it doesn't has no vibe and is looking for answers out side himself. It makes me confused when I talk to him. He does tons of work does it have no meaning?

I met you in RW. My suggestion is to value yourself value yourself and get excited about your work.

Ask folks if they lie your work and if they have a place for it. It's important to be able to close the sale ask them if they want it to take it home.

Best to you. It's not easy that's for sure. It would be great to get a check on Friday from a "real" job but that's a pain too.

Does slamming a mans family name rate respect, maybe with some. As education is a life course, not concluded at any age. So I choose to examine myself and continue to learn. Name calling is a cognitive bias and a technique to promote propaganda. Propagandists use the name-calling technique to incite fears and arouse prejudices with the intent that invoked fear based on fearmongering tactics will encourage those that read, see or hear propaganda to construct a negative opinion about a person, group, or set of beliefs or ideas that the propagandist would wish the recipients to denounce. The method is intended to provoke conclusions and actions about a matter apart from an impartial examinations of the facts of the matter. When this tactic is used instead of an argument, name-calling is thus a substitute for rational, fact-based arguments against an idea or belief, based upon its own merits, and becomes an argumentum ad hominem. [1]
While I dont condone Buzz, using "you statements" and taking ownership knowledge of others finances and/or circumstances. I choose to help educate, and he has been man enough to aknowledge and to practice, speaking for hisself only from here forward. I myself have made big mistakes and choose to educate myself and move forward from here. I would also insist that Dave uses my Father and Sons name in a respectful fashion.
I believe credit and awareness is due where deserved. So I must say that Gary Keenan has offered fantastic advice for personal growth to carvers and people alike with his above statement, which suggests modesty, honesty and courage to the recipients. And I believe he follows his own advice. A great role model, thanks Gary. And Ken Packie another. Barre's advice is eye opening, knowlegable and sincere. there are others in this industry that set great examples, Dayton, Zoe and Chad and others, Jim Madson, and Ken that helps RD. RL Blair's stature is impressive. Accepting honest feedback is key to personal growth. And I'm willing to recieve mine. That I can avoid big mistakes through great role models and honest counselors. Thanks, Rick
Those that can use it and/or appriciate it are welcome to references or any tips that I can provide. www.ricknasby.com

yes I am debt because I am a bad business man. I am surviving because I can carve and I liten to AJ and Dennis and many others that have given advice.

I am a bad business man because in my tool business I ran it like a friend to friend thing. giving everyone a deal even if it wasnt as cheap as baileys it was close to my cost. cant eat that so I am saying and giving the same advice like i have all year. DO NOT LOWER YOUR PRICE.

Link.....you have and the people reading here have gotten some great advice from you starting this post.
take the information and use it. some will work some wont it all depends on location and and all the other things that have been said.

there is no need for me to bash any one for you to figure out what is good advice and bad advice....even some of the stuff that may sound bad could work in the right situation.

one last thing to think about ....the days are shorter and the lack of sun makes us all feel down. I have suffered from depression for years and this season will get to you if the economy doesnt. i find that in the winter I like to have carvers come by and carve with me , it keeps me more productive and I can learn from them and vise versa.

just carve and spend less on forum and you will prospor sooner then later

so get carving

Jamie

And all! The bottom line is keep working at it and sooner or later you'll figure it out for yourself in your area. Marketing is everything! Ask yourself," Who are my customers?" , What are they mostly looking for? What's the most popular price range? How good a salesman am I, and How can I get better at it? Do I look like a business man when customers come, or just some bum with a saw and stuff to sell? Act and Be Professional!Display your work in the best possible light, and don't just clutter the area with carvings.Composition counts in displaying too. Even ducks toll in to the right spot when your decoy spread is set up right, make it look inviting! The amount of success you have is in direct corrolation with the experience you have! Learn everything you can from anywhere you can. Yes this is a vertical learning curve, but do-able if you reaally want it! Good luck! Doc

Very right on and of course yours too Jamie.
I don't chose to give advice on this subject, because my success weighs heavily on my retirement and a cushion income to allow me to do business differently than 95% of you folks. What I see Link is some real nice carvings and the prices, I can see, are reasonable except for the little $40 trees. Learn how to do some dry brush painting to add to their appearance and I would cut the price in half on them. That is just an opinion, not gospel.
Network with other carvers and do an exchange of carvings that each of you give and take the same percentage of sale price.
But like Jamie says, the time of year is an issue and we all say the economy is another issue. Don't give up the day job until you are able to sell enough in the good months to last you through the dead months.
Well lunch is over, back to work, err play is what I call it.

jamie,doc,rick,dave all good advice and i noticed gary had really great advice

except 4 the negative fourm crap theirs some good stuff. I'll post back after this week end at the new spot, (i know the trees are a little high but in two weeks when the price goes down they notice I sold 20-30 of them that way last year It was the only thing that realy sold 4 xmas)