(Login grantorinojohn) Member from IP address 172.198.25.227
Since looking on this post I have seen quite a few worn cams like mine. I never seen so many and was wondering why this is. I just put in a new cam in mine and now I am wondering if I should break it in the way Crane says it should be done at 1500 rpm for 20 mins. Perhaps I should use some 50 weight oil as well or is that too thick? The person that had the car before me wipe out a lode and I had to clean and wipe the motor of metal chips. What is the best way to break them in? Thanks
and I stress the non detergent part. Detergent in most oils will wash off the cam lube quickly. Could be why many have break in problems. After the 20-30 minute break in, drop the oil and filter, hot.
Modern oils have little to no anti scuff agents since most newer engines have roller tappets/followers.
I believe this is what is the cause of the rash of cam failures in recent years.
Since I have wiped my cam, I have discovered that you need to add a bottle of GM EOS (engine oil supplement) which contains a lot of zinc disulphyde (sp?).
This will add a ton of anti scuff properties to the oil.
Comp makes a similiar product.
The EPA made all the oil manufacturers stop putting zinc in their oil. Due to that, A LOT of people are having problems when trying to break in cams. Comp says it is due entirely to the lack of zinc in oil. And it is not just a Comp problem, they are all in the same boat. My girlfriend's dad wiped out 2 cams in a row this spring in his windsor. Luckily Comp replaced the first one at no charge, but not the second one.
Zinc Dialkyldithiophosphate
Organic zinc compounds are found in virtually every major brand of oil, both motorcycle and automotive. Organic zinc compounds are used as severe pressure, wear reduction additives, and are subsequently found in larger amounts in oils specifically blended for high-revving, turbo charged and racing engine applications. Zinc in your oil is great but is only effective when there is actual metal-to-metal contact within your engine. Under the most extreme conditions, zinc compounds react with the metal to prevent scuffing.
In virtually every major brand of engine oil, Zinc is part of the standard additive package.
Research shows that more zinc does not give you more protection. More zinc merely prolongs the protection. Unless your engine application includes extreme operating conditions, adding extra zinc compounds to your oil is waste. High zinc content can lead to deposits on your valves, and spark plug fouling. High zinc content causes premature deterioration of catalytic converters.
PLEASE NOTE - An update courtesy of Morris "Moe" Shouse - 11/14/01
Your tech info about oil additives is good, but a little out of date. The EPA made the automotive oil makers to remove Zinc dialkyldithiophosphate, in 2000. The best way to get it back is buy Engine Oil Supplement from Mopar its $5.25 for 16oz. GM has E.O.S. also but its $7.
I found this out when I came across a motorcycle site. This guy changed oil and used automotive oil. He found that his clutch acted funny. He called a buddy, and found out that Zinc dialkyldithiophosphate has been removed from automotive oils but not bike oils. Cause most bikes don't have Cats on them. The EPA thinks that the zinc might get into the Cat-verter and mess it up. The guy went and got motorcycle oil put it in and the clutch worked just fine. So we can thank our EPA for screwing us again.
Okay, I don't know if you can still save $1.75 buying from Dodge. But is there merit to adding zinc (dyno or synthetic) once the engine has been broken in?
Heavy duty diesel oil might be an option. Made for engines designed to last half million miles or more. Diesels don't typically have cats so maybe the oil hasn't been sacrificed.
for breaking in a new engine? Brand X oil + additives, or Brand X motor cycle oil? What about synthetics? And do I continue to use the zinc additives every oil change after break in?
"regular" 10-30 + the zinc, drain after 15 minutes and do it again for 500 miles, after which 10-30 Mobil 1 plus zinc. But will the REAL teacher please stand up?
I was not aware that the epa had knocked zinc out of oil , but there is a new product that david vizard gave 5 stars too, and that is oil extreme . It's main attribute is that they were able to figure out how to get more calcium carbonate ( limestone ) to stay in suspension . CaCO3 fills in asperities and makes them smoother which produces a better ring seal among other things .This oil or additive (they sell both ) has high pressure strength in excess of most other oils owing to the film strength which is greater in they're product ( longer polymer strands ).
The links to the motortecmag article where Vizard tested it are dead now , but I read it and Vizard was impressed ,take my word for it .
Oh Yeah you can get " zinc phos " from places like Hach it is used as a reagent in many forms of water sampling , I know I've done it . I don't know if they sell it separately or not though ...Anyway if you get the stuff raw WATCH OUT ! it's piezen !!
use nd straight 30 weight and a break in lube on the cam . After you get it broken in you can throw a bottle of the concentrate into you're favorite oil . If it's true that you can't get oil with zinc phos in it anymore you're gonna have to throw in some e.o.s. or oil extreme or something to compensate , for the benefit of the cam/lifter interface if nothing else.
Have used GM EOS and Bardahl 1 and the oil has the same color and weight. The cans are identical except for the colors and lettering. Bardahl could be the supplier as GM, Ford and Mopar buy there oil and put their label on it. I brought this up as the Bardahl is way cheaper, I buy it at WalMart.
When I installed a new cam, with clevite cam guard on the lobes, I poured the contents of the EOS over the lifter gallerys just before installing the intake.
the cam maker sent. Some say 15 minutes, some say 1/2 hour, some at 2000 rpm, some 2500 rpm. One thing they agreed on was to vary the rpm, never to leave it constant and don't go below 1500 rpm.
The real teacher here is Joe, he taught me about making sure that the lifters turned in their bores by a helper turning over the cam while you had two pushrods gently pushed into the lifters. I was enquiring about a used cam and lifters going into a different block, but I'm sure he said that this also applied for new cams too. Joe are you there? May the real teacher talk now.
as you helper is filling the rad with water, checking for leaks, noises, putting out carb fires [if you put the diz in 180 degrees out] and you are playing the throttle, watching the guages, sitting on pins and needles with fingers crossed!
Just remember the eye! that blood shot eye with wings, ha ha.
Guess I have my work cut out. A buddy of mine just installed a new manifold and he didnt put enough gasket seal in the back of it so its leaking oil. See if I can cheat or have to pull it. Oh well that is what its all about. Thanks again
but then neither is wiping out a cam lobe a cam. 
