http://www.turkishdailynews.com/FrProbe/latest/dom2.htm#d23
Turkey on the Threshold of a Social Explosion
· While the economic crisis in Turkey deepens day by day, the number of unemployed and poor people has increased and created a social depression in society. Depressed people show their reactions with suicide, murder and usurpation, but it is a fact that Turkey is on the threshold of a social explosion
· Unionists, who state that the crisis will not be overcome merely by recovering economic indicators, note that the social and psychological dimensions of the crisis are more important and it will take a long time to bring it to a simple level
· Besides millions of unemployed people, in a country where the minimum wage is TL 122 million and a civil servants wage is approximate TL 295 million, the figure, which is necessary for a four-person family to survive, is TL 825 million
· According to a State Planning Organization report, 15 percent of the Turkish population survives on $1, which is the minimum daily food expenditure per person, and 38 percent survives with $1.5, which meets only basic needs.
Guzin Yildizcan
The Economic crisis, which occurred on the 78th anniversary of the Turkish Republic in 2001, caused the public to become poorer and brought it to the threshold of a social explosion. While $1 was 1 lira 68 kurus at the time of the establishment of the Republic in 1923, now in Turkey, which could not overcome the crisis despite the support of the International Monetary Fund (IMF) and the World Bank, the dollar rate now varies between TL 1.5 and TL 1.6 million.
While banks, industrial facilities and a number of small-sized enterprises were closed during the process of the economic crisis, 1 million people lost their jobs. Those who did not loose their jobs are continuing without wage increases, despite 80 percent annual inflation. Moreover, they survive with less earnings in comparison to last year. While all these are taking place, the fact that the state has restricted social services, such as health and education creates a lack of confidence and worry about the future of society.
Yes, people in Turkey become poorer day by day in an environment where injustice in income distribution increases, and they are in a social depression. However, the dimension of the crisis is always determined with economic indicators and it is discussed how foreign currency rate, inflation figures and interest rates will come to a smooth level. The social and psychosocial dimensions are passed over with the words: "Turkish society is patient, the Turkish Republic is powerful. We previously experienced economic crises and got away from them, we will also overcome this."
Many people are going mad, and murder is also becoming a fact of life. According to sociologists, it is not logical to explain the reasons why an unemployed father who could not pay a TL 200 million debt committed suicide; another father killed his children for similar reasons; a mother whose children had to go to sleep hungry went to the mental hospital; a non-commissioned officer rained bullets on bank branches; and a young person who left his school to work but got involved with usurpation gangs, as individual depressions. They state that such events are social depression.
In addition, the statistics which showed how Turkish families got poorer within a year, are definite enough to prove that depression is not individual. Besides millions of unemployed people, in a country where the minimum wage is TL 122 million and the approximate civil servants wage is TL 295 million, the minimum figure necessary for a four person-family, that means the "poverty line," is TL 826 million according to the August data of Turkey Kamu-Sen (Public Union). The poverty limit was 550 million lira in August 2000.
One third of Turks are poor
The State Planning Organization (DPT) announced Turkey's "Poverty Report" last month. The report divided poverty in two ways, "the cost of minimum daily food expenditure per person" and "the cost of basic daily need expenditures per person."
According to the method in which daily food expenditure was determined as $1, some 15 percent of the Turkish population (about 68 million) lives on the poverty line. Besides food expenditures, when daily expenses for basic needs is determined as $1.5 per person, about 38 percent of the population, which is 25 million people, is poor. Therefore, some 34 percent of the urban population and 30 percent of the rural population are poor.
According to the account, which was made with the basic needs method, 42.2 percent of poor people consists of children between 0-14, 52.7 percent are between 15-64 and 5 percent are above 65. Some 26.9 percent of poor people are illiterate, 22.7 percent are literate but did not obtain an education, 42.5 percent graduated from primary school, 5.1 percent from middle school, 2.7 percent from high school and 0.01 percent from university. Some 46 percent of poor people don't work because they are retarded, sick, retired, students or old. Some 53 percent of them are employed. Some 44 percent of people who live on the poverty line, despite working, consist of people employed in a family business. Looking at this table, which reveals that one third of the population is poor, it seems that it hard to say, "Turkey will overcome this crisis. Social explosion will not occur."
While the government does not look at the crisis from the perspective of the social dimension, the officials of employee's unions state that there is a serious crisis in Turkey. They point out that poor people, who think that they are footing the bill for the crisis, are depressed psychologically. Unionists say: "You can overcome the economic crisis by balancing foreign currency and interest figures and receive supplementary funding from the International Monetary Fund (IMF), but it is very difficult to abolish the criminal gangs which appeared during the period, make young people return to school, bring dissolved families together and get rid of psychological depression, which was created by a lack of confidence in the future." Unionists, who note that Turkey is in a social crisis, explained the dimension of the crisis to the Turkish Daily News.
'There is a social crisis'
Stating that the crisis is being observed only from the perspectives of the interest-foreign currency-stock exchange, Labor Confederation (Hak-Is) Chairman Salim Uslu states that the social dimension of the crisis has been overlooked. Uslu, pointing to the social crisis, says, "What is more important is to see how poor people understand the concept of poverty rather than determine the poverty limit." He explains how they understand it as: "Poor people think that they are excluded from society. They are uneasy because they have no social security for unemployment, sickness and old age. They think that they are forced to foot the bill for the economic crisis, sunken banks, war and graft. They also think that they will be uneducated for many years because they cannot benefit from education and health services, therefore they will continue to work as an unqualified employee, and that equality in income distribution will never be provided."
Uslu, who states that many poor families had taken their children from school to make them work, recalls that 960,000 people had lost their jobs in 2001. Noting that these poor people, who have no social security, tend to become marginal, Uslu says, "These people have abandoned any hope of help from existing legal social and political organizations, and now try illegal ways, and they will continue to do so." Uslu explains what people who feel themselves being excluded from society, will do in the future: "They will be involved in usurpation gangs, car parking mafias or establish their own gangs. They will take shelter in ethnic and religious groups."
He notes that the share of the budget for expenditures, which are necessities of a social state, reduce day by day, and states that 26.1 percent has been allotted from the budget for education, health and culture expenditures in 1992, but this figure has reduced to 13.4 percent in 2002. Noting that unearned income in industry reached 43.6 percent in 2002, while it was 17.9 in 1992, Uslu states that social state activity was lost. He points out that society is under tension psychologically, and says: "There is a social explosion but it is claimed not to exist, there is individual violence in Turkey because of a lack of democratic reaction. Reactions cannot be organized, but is it possible to explain the increase in suicides, murders in families and usurpation with individual psychology? They are completely the results of social depression."
Uslu also thinks that the rich people's psychology is also not normal, and says: "People cannot spend their money and are also reluctant to deposit their money in a bank. They either keep it at home or transfer it abroad because they have money worries about the future. Nobody can predict the future of the country." He states that even if the economy came to a smooth level, it won't be easy to overcome intimidation, degeneration and depression in society, and thinks that it is not possible to change mentalities which accept everything be legal in order to have something, or want to abolish everything that cannot be owned, by increasing employment and production.
'Social explosion is within an ace'
Confederation of Turkish Labor Union (Turk-Is) General Secretary Salih Kilic says, "In an environment,where unemployment is at a high level, the wages of employees do not increase, and inflation is at 80 percent, it is not possible to deny that society is prone to a social explosion."
Kilic, who stated that people were queuing up at five a.m. in Ankara to buy cheap bread, and the number of people trying to find something to eat in the garbage early in the morning was very high in comparison to the past, says that this situation increases the fear of a social explosion.
Claiming that there are measures which will reduce the incomes of workers instead of preventing unemployment or increasing the wages in the programs, which are implemented to get away from the crisis, Kilic says that a social explosion is inevitable in a place where unemployment and poverty cannot be solved.
He said: "Poverty causes uneducation because people force their children to work in order for them to contribute to the family income. Some 1.6 million children are working today, and 1.1 million people are unregistered employees, they are fake workers. The number of unemployed people is 3 million according to some and 5 million according to others. What the state should do is to employ unemployed people rather than children and fake workers."
Not only employees' unions but also employers' unions state that there is social explosion. Noting that a social explosion cannot be defined by people working on the streets, Turkey Employers' Unions Confederation (TISK) Chairman Refik Baydur says: "If suicides, murders, robberies increase in a society, if families cannot send their children to school, this is a social explosion. If a person is hungry and naked, it is meaningless to say to him 'be patient'." Baydur, who states that the social situation should be considered in such a society after the economy recovers, says: "An intelligent employer should not overlook social crisis, because all of us are living in the same society. It is necessary to find a way to the benefit of everyone, including employer, employee and unemployed people. It is meaningless to resist the crisis by enduring poverty."
Baydur, who recalls that 400,000 places of employment were closed and 750,000 workers had lost their jobs, says everybody is low-spirited, those having money and jobs are reluctant to spend because of the indefiniteness and lack of confidence.
I think the recent discussions seem to become more personal or reflection of past problem onto the subject of matter at hand. Nevertheless, I will give my version of story because the subject is related to not only my personal interest but also my academic one (I have been working on poverty, how to measure it and its consequences along with child labor, especially in TC).
First of all, if you did not make generalization without some research and posted your last text at first place, you would not get as much as reaction you got at first place. You constantly revise your comments so it is difficult for me to take one as base of discussion. The ideas in my last post (which timucin seems to agree on most of them) and the article you post above as reaction do not seem to contradict to each other but i have some reservation about it.
First of all, let's clear some confusion.
I thought, we have been discussing whether latest economic crises in TC will eventually lead an social rebellion, so end of TC as we know (it is your hypothesis). Then, the question whether turkish people have experience sudden poverty due to the crises or it has been that way but the latest crises worsen the already bad injustice in wealth distribution. Finally, the trade and idea relations.
1. I (or I think timucin) never claim that there is no social unrest or (everybody happy) related to crises. It is a classical sociological example (fact) that economical crises (or war-like situation) cause many social and psychological problems in a given society. Emile Durkheim ("the rules of sociological method") clearly showed that the economic situation and its relation to suicide rates in 1900s. Following the study, hundreds of study have been conducted on poverty and its effects on social variables (e.g., family functions, crime, IQ development, birth rate, suicide, etc) (if you are interested in this subject i can provide you the sources). So, it is not big surprise what has been happening in TC. But, the question still remain unchallenged whether these social or psychological depression, explosions will eventually lead social rebellion or revaluation. (I will wait your research result before giving my answer with its reasons but the short answer is NO).
The above article even missed many other public depression examples (e.g., a 18 year street vendor hang himself in front of turkish parliament, the early farmer/small business demonstration, never ending individual demonstration in front of prime minister office, everybody throwing something to the old leader!!, etc.)
I do support the main idea behind the above article but it does not mean it reflects full truth. I do support it because this kind of reactions is necessary to get attention of government to "real issues". Somebody has to be voice of poor people.
For example, I do not have problem establishing 850 million as the poverty line, which reflect the ideal one but still do not reflect turkish reality.
There is endless debate about how to measure poverty. The union leaders take easy one by importing the west standard in turkish one (e.g., they have list of items and their prices on city-major market). But, the poverty line is equivalent to about 600$$ and the poverty line in USA is about 900$!!! Can you see the irony?
This kind of poverty calculation does not take consideration many factors. For example, people buy many of their daily product from street, public market (pazar), many receive food supply from their villages, some of them do not pay electricity bill, many sit in government own land (gecekondu), the government provide cheap rental, some of them have 2 jobs, many (especially children and women) works illegally (so does not appear on family budget).... etc. I do not claim or discuss that at least 25-30% people have been going through hardship or the life is easy to many even though the current crises. I think, the people of TC deserve better after the enduring poverty (70 years). But, it has not reach the level that ordinary people will turn against state and take their faith on their own hand (I do not have problem with this!) because as sociology explain every society form kind of "balance" on different point as reaction to social or economical realities of the society.
2. Sudden poverty
We should have kind of time frame to make such comparison. If we consider the condition of TC before 1980, where the per capita was around 1000$ with total GNP around $20 Billion. The recent numbers after crises is the per capita is around 2500$ with $200 billion. But just, one year ago (1999), the per capita was abound 3000$ with $250B GNP. So, compare to 1980, there has been rapid growth and turks are better even after the crises but compare to one year ago there are about 20% poorer. Sure, if we compare to EU standard, we have been poor all the way.
The serious economical crises are not a new thing for turkish people. I can give you at least 10 such example. The latest one was in 1994 with 60 percent devaluation (and similar reaction such as suicide, hunger strike, etc.). But, what makes the latest crises is the worst one: First of the social structure has changed very dramatically in last 15 year. About %70 percent of people used to live in rural area before to 1980 but the figure changed upside down, about % 70 live in "cities" in 2000 (most of them in ghetto like places, "gecekondu"). So, in past, the state economical station had very little effect on ordinary people because they were "self-sufficient" . But, after the crises, million and million people are unemployed in cities with little qualification and large families to take care... They are "left" by their not optimistic faith! Second one, the domestic and foreign debts has reached such a level that the government had nowhere to go but follow the infamous IMF remedies (so they cannot just bail out as they did in past)...
About income distribution.
For me, it is kind of irony that I have been discussing that we (TC) do (did) not have strong economy (due to the distribution) one year ago at different form with a nationalist fellow but I have been trying to show that it is not the end and many problem caught the elite attention is not new problems (just appeared after after the crises) today.!!!
I have a doctorate thesis of one of the DPT fellow, according to data collected during 1996-1997, 62% of turkish people considered as poor, under poverty with similar standard used in above article (%15 is very poor, %23 of them just around the poverty line and %9 of them has possible candidate) (Erdogan, 1997). SO, there is not huge gap!!
As you express, the government did not put freeze on salary. They have been adjusting the income level with inflation rate and the minimum income committee just had meeting to increase the minimum income. However, the reflection of inflation increase on salary is not prompt one and therefore, there is %20 "real" decreases in income level in current time being.....
3. About trade-info flow:
If you read my post carefully, you will see that my point was "trade is no more the only way to distribute ideas or knowledge across societies as it was case before. So, we still need trade.
Also, when I talk about global technology i was not just mean internet or computer but TVs, newspaper, cellphone, tourism, etc. BYT as I explained earlier, the "social balance" has been taking in TC related to internet. Yes, people might not have money to buy computer but compare to west, there are so many internet cafes with very cheap rate in every cities of TC (like chine and India). So you do not have to have one to get in!! (There is more serious problem than money to reach internet such as language problem, etc.). (That is why i do not like "orientalists").
Also, you imply that the new ideas (or other info) will stop reaching TC due to lack of import!! But, Turkish people have been overwhelmed by the economic discussion, analysis on TV. They have been watching the indicators of social depression (e.g., attempts of suicide, the empty kitchen, the poverty, and the bread line) as almost "reality show" every damm day. (About 90% of them have TVs and the broadcasts are free). Even, there is a real "reality show" in which the participants try to survive with minimum wage!!!! So, there is no lack of information or new ideas! Oh, I forget newspaper, radio, etc.....
Peace, artun
This increase in economy in Turkiye is only for rich people. A lot of productions have been destroyed dramatically. Moreover, this increase is only a manipulation, not based on native production. Most of the Turkish people are poor now, and day by day the number of the poors are increasing. Especially, because of the destruction of native production, most of the Turkish people become only a simple worker and servant in their country. The increasing economy is not for Turkish people, is for swindlers. Moreover, the dept of the Turkish state is tremendously increasing. In conclusion, I can say that the increase in economy is illusion and not reflect the most of the Turkish people's economy.
If you read the Turkish agriculture pacts with USA and EU, you can see that the destruction of Turkish agricultural production. EU and USA wanted Turkey to buy the products from them, even Turkey also produces. Day by day, Turkey is being the slave of global emperialism, the Turkish politicians do not care of the future of Turkey. Most of them wants Islamic republic, others want to divide Turkey, anothers want Marksist revolution and control Turkey. They are against of the fundamentals of Turkey. Except Marksists, they try to make Turkish people poor to rule them. Firstly, they have been destroying the agriculture production of Turkey. They have killed a lot of important intellectual Turkish poeple. The fundamentals of Turkey is based of the ideas of Mustafa Kemal Ataturk, in Turkey we call it Ataturkculuk, the others say Kemalizm. USA, EU, most of the radical Muslims, Marksists,... want to destroy the fundamentals of Kemalizm, because the Kemalizm makes Anatolia independant Turkish state. Anyway, the politicians have been taking a lot of debt from other states. Without production they have always been taking depts, enormuous depts. In conclusion, Turkey which is a country has the more traitors in the world and it is the victim of global emperialism. If Turkey goes like this, you will see the fall of Turkiye, unfortunately.
I think Turkey and Turkish people are better off now than they were before. It is not only the rich people who have profited from the changes in the last years, but the capacity of Turkish people to own and spend have increased. This may not be everyone's deram and it is certainly not mine, but it is indisputable that Turkish people are more urban, more modern, more capitalistic and much richer in general.
Sorry, emergency. I have to go. I will continue later.
Nowadays there is hot money entry to Turkey, by those moneys Turkey tries to stand. Most of the foreigners come to Turkey not to produce, by stock exchange they gain more money and the stock exchange is in the hands of foreigner capitalists. In the world, there is a big money exchange but most of it is black money, especially in Turkey. Turkish agricultural production have been destroyed. It is not understood wrong that I am against technological production. There is technological production, it is really good but they have destroyed agricultural production. Do you know the agricultural power of America? America has technological and agricultural power, Turkey can be powerful in those productions but especially they have been destroying agricultural production of Turkey. A lot of farmers are very poor. Moreover, technological production is not in the hands of national production. In both ways Turkey is in the hands of foreigners. I do not say that Turkey should not trade, I say Turkey should trade but it is not trading. In every area Turkey loses its national power. A lot of third world state's people are only servants in their country and they try to make Turkey like that. If the hot moneys are taken from Turkey, the economy of Turkey suddenly collapse. Turkish people can buy electronic production, because it is normal that the cost of electronic prodcutions are decreasing after two or three years later, as you know that a servant can afford those things. The problem is not buying those technologies, the problem is Turkey is becomimg slave state, loses its national power. And you should not beleive traitor Turkish government surveys, they are fully lies. It is like what the media told to American people about New Orleans that took damage by Katrina. Not Turkey, a lot of country under thread of global emperialism. Please, you should not beleive in lies and illusions. Only a small group is becoming richer, the rest are in very terrible situation.
We know that Turkey is not going to be slave state. What is a slave state? I think you are exageratting a bit. But, what is the nationalist power of Turkey anyways?
You are right that not every person who brings his/her money to Turkey comes to produce and create jobs. Hot money is always a problem. However, you are forgetting that hot money exists also internally. Turkish citizens are also part of the hot money problem. Turkish industrialist may not leave the country in one night, since they have their investments to worry about. But, there are those Turkish citizens who take their money outside and they do. Therefore, the problem exists also internally.
You should also keep in mind that if hot money leaves a country, it is because something is already going wrong in that particular country. Hot money leaves those countries where things are starting to look bad. Hot money’s only interest is to make money, so it would not care in which country it is as long as it makes money. However, you are implying that hot money may leave just to hurt a country. It may of course hurt the country it is leaving, but it will leave because there is already a crisis. It does not start a crisis; it simply increases its effect.
Turkey can certainly control the movement of hot money by limiting capital movements, but this would limit her in other areas as well. Turkey wants this money to get richer or to become a stronger country. I agree that not everyone is getting richer in Turkey, but this is not limited to who are rich already, either. I do not trust your depiction that the heavy majority of people are living in terrible conditions. I live in the same country and this is certainly not my observation.
You are also stuck too much on the idea that imperialism is simply destruction and all it does is to create slave states. I do not like imperialism either, but the root of the problem is capitalism. Most of the Turkish anti-imperialist seem to forget this detail and do not get to the root of the problem. They are anti-imperialist but not anti-capitalist. Having a nationalist capitalism does not fix the problem. The same inequality of income, the constantly growing gap between haves and have-nots will be there with capitalism as well. Some will be richer than others. Having plenty of farmers/peasants does not fix the problem either. The US has a strong agriculture, but it has a very small farmer population. So, what difference does it make if I am a slave of an outside capitalist or a Turkish capitalist; slavery is slavery. In fact, it may possible that as a slave, I may have better chances in a bigger system than being stuck in a nationalist system that is more instable and vulnerable.
I think you miss the last times of Ottoman Empire. Look carefully, there are a lot of foreginer banks, HSBC, Fortis nowadays, many of them. Turkish production is not national, our shoes, jeans, cars, lots of things are not belong to our national production. Turkey had very good agricultural production, It has been destroyed. Turkey started to produce car, airplane very earlier times but canceled. We loose our independant national caracter. Dont you remeber 1980? Dont you remember 2002-2003? Turkey has been become open-land for foreigners. We should trade, I do not say anything about trading, but we do not have control. The control have been given long time ago. Moreover, trading is very risky unfortunately, everybody cheats with eachother. The situation is becoming similar situation of Jews in Germany. Jews were rich but they were slave, and you know the rest. There is no increasing on production(especially national production) in Turkey, it means everything is baseless. Look at other third world states, except Turkey, most of them rejected and canceled most of the global capital, they have inclined to national capital and most of them are in better situation and day by day they are growing nationally. But we are living the last times of Ottoman Empire, if this situation goes like this, our end will be the same as Ottoman Empire, if you do not have historical conscious, my words are meaningless.
There are many foreign banks and there are many Turkish banks. Banks are banks and I don't like them whether they are foreign or not. You seem to be ignoring my question that why I should care whether I live under nationalist capitalism or global capitalism. By the way, I know no nationalist capitalist economies with no ties to the other capitalist economies (that is, independent). So, all you are saying is that I should have a Turkish boss rather than a foreign one, and I am asking you what difference this makes since a capitalist is a capitalist whatever nationality it comes in.
I hardly think that the situation in Turkey is similar to what it was in the last days of the Ottoman Empire. Your arguments simply don't convince me that I should go national and that Turkey will do much better if it opts for a nationalistic perspective and agenda. I will perhaps be more inclined towards a more non-capitalistic option, but I wil not choose nationalistic capitalism. I do not see much merit in a life controlled and run by state capitalism, and nationalistic perspectives usually lead to societies run by states.
You should remember that in the same year 11 banks were robbed by the owner of the banks, the important thing is all they were robbed in the same year. The government have destroyed individual development, all powers have been given to corporations. The depts are increasing, not decreasing. Many small individual productions have been destroyed. Then, when we look at the big picture, Turkish industry is too much depend on foreign industry and the individual development have got very very big damage. It means they do not want others to become powerful and independant. Moreover, I think you do not like Kemalizm, which made strong economy in 1930s by using state production and they almost did not have nothing. In addition, government does not pay its depts to many Turkish people or do not want to pay. Two days ago a farmer cried, do not you see or you do not want to see. I do not trust Turkish corporations and government, becasue the history is the fact all of those situations, especially 1980. I think you should hear once more that sentence of Ataturk:"Hangi istikbal vardır ki baskalarının marifetiyle gerceklestirilmiş olsun".(Is there a freedom which have made by others?). The control should be in the hands of us, then we can trade so independantly. The honor of Turkey, which was made by Ataturk, has been destroyed, and I think you know how. The potantial of Turkey is so much, but they do not let us to use it, especially our slave government and corporations prevent us. I think you know what our potentials are, if you really live in Turkiye. Global capitalism could be good but it is not today and I do not believe it will be.
I do not put down what the young Turkish Republic achieved in the 30’s. I may not agree with some of its features, but I cannot deny that something was achieved and a national economy on this land was established for the first time. How strong it was is a question that we should answer by restricting ourselves to the conditions of the 30’s. I do not think that the Turkish economy of 30’s is comparable to today’s economy. Owing to their specific conditions, they are two different things. It would be like comparing apples to oranges. However, one may try to show if the Turkish economy of the 30’s would make it in our era, would be enough for this country of 70 million people with many desires and very different spending habits. I seriously doubt it. Many things are different now. Neither the economic structure nor the habits and methods of the 30’s (that is, Turkey in 30’s) would be able to deal with today’s economic problems and pressures. The Turkish people of the 30’s were interested in spending less for the sake of the new nation, in letting the government have full control over the economy, in giving up their rights for the nation, some social utopia or some different sense of satisfaction. Now, nearly 80 years later, not everyone in Turkey would agree with these ideals, aims and principles. We now have different desires, habits and goals. Can Kemalism take on this new job? I hardly think so. I don’t think it even has a clue. The present day Kemalism does not really offer real solutions. It is a way of dealing with our frustrations and appointments by creating a utopia, a utopic period when everything was great. Yet, everyone was actually poor. How long can people stay poor? How long can people be told not to be interested getting rich, owning things? This alone is enough proof to show that the so-called Kemalist economy, which is nothing other than a primitive form of state economy, would not even make it beyond the 30’s. . Thanks to the Second World War, it made it to the beginning of the fifties.
If you want to convince me, you should probably cut the rhetoric and concentrate on answering the questions I have been asking. One of them was why I should care who my boss is, if we are to stay in a capitalistic form of economy and the other one was what makes you think that the economy of 30’s can deal with the problems of a today’s economic reality. Do you expect that people will start spending less and sacrificing more for the sake of the collective whole without considering anything in return for themselves (and I am not talking about a war)? This is what they did in the 30’s. It was also the time of the closed economies and totalitarian and authoritarian political systems, but this is not the case anymore.
Yes, today's economical mentality does not care national borderlines. It does not care nations also, and personally the nations are not very important. The problem is, some guy wants to create new Kingdom all over the world. Even, they do not let other individuals to develop, if they do not want. Moreover, the governmental controls almost in their hands and you say it is freedom, but it is not. Especially, they destroy the eastern contries' economies like what they do in Turkey. They create traitors from those countries by their money and destory the power of that nation. The deal of war has changed. Mostly, this war is not done by guns but when necessary they use guns like they do in Iraq. In addition, by their money they use psychological methods to shape people by injecting some mentalities to poeple in order to make people live according to their aims. Unfortunately, it is very very easy if you are really very rich. Moreover, you have understood me wrong that I do not support close economic mentality, also Kemalizm do not support it. Also, Kemalizm do not prevent the use of capital, Kemalizm balances individual power. By doing so, any man does not and cannot dare to create like what todays rich capitalist try to do. Do you suppose that Europa wants Turkey to become powerful, although they restricts Turkish economy in various way? You said that the conditions of 1930s were very different. The biggest problem is, the imperial menatlity has never changed. By capital, they destroy indivdual economical developmant of others who are different from them. They are selfish and the laws let them do those disgusting deeds. Although they do not do very much in their western countries they do in especially eastern countries. But they step by step growing and waiting the time to control even eastern countries. There is no freedom, every step of you helps them to become richer, you think you are free but in reality you are not, they use you, even you use others. I think you should watch Matrix and Lord of The Rings, because it is easy to watch, because I think you support easy but destructive and deceptieve mantalities whether consciouly or not. You should know one think, I want real individual freedom but capitalist fundmentals destroy it in various ways.