If anyone ever doubts that Ken Priestlay couldn't hack it in the ISL; they couldn't be more wrong. The guy hasn't lost any off his speed and effortless skating. Most noticeable was the accuracy of his passing and play making skills.
Dundee used him as a defence man. Scored of course. Tony Hand and KP on the ice for much of the time.
DAVE SIMMS, MUST SIGN HIM FOR NEXT SEASON. IT'LL BE A CRIME NOT TO!
Why, because he is a quality player and I will go as far to say better in some aspects than a few players we have at the moment. His speed, skill, vision, goal scoring prowess and playmaking are better than most we have on the team. However, he is not a gritty player and not one for roughing it. In that respect he doesn't add to the team but his pros definitely outway his cons. MB wanted to sign him and on good money too. You can see why since we have a fast team that likes to pass the puck, make the plays and shoots a lot. Not hear anyone shout 'SHOOT' from the crowd this year.
The reason for my post was to reassure those fans that KP is past it are very much mistaken.
On the note about the team, I'm delighted with the team but if we do as well as we think then how many players do you think we will be able to keep? Not very many because they'll be off for greater paying teams. Hence I said get KP for next year.
KP looked so good, because along with a certain Mr Odelein, he's my favourite all time Steeler . I'm sure the smooth skating, passing etc are still noticeable, but would he still be an impact player at the much higher level of the ISL?
Remember, if we'd signed KP as we tried to do, then it's unlikely that we'd have got both Syzsky and Darling, because of the money KP was after. Would that have strengthened or weakened our team?
I for one would prefer to remember KP as the player he was (who will ever forget his 5 goals to win us the Championship down at LPS?).
However, should he sign for us again next season, It would certainly be exciting to see him again.
..........There's no bigger KP fan than me. I even spent a considerable amount of money on 2 of his Pittsburgh Game Worn Jerseys.
But there is a BIG difference between BNL and ISL. I too would rather remember KP as the dominant force he was than just another player in today's ISL. As for next year, don't forget he'll be yet another year older!
Just to answer your question yes he would still be an impact player in the ISL in my opinion. I suppose Mike Blaisdell thought so too. Not sure about KP taking two existing player spots because I never heard or saw that. I will ask MB if that is true. If it is true then MB must think higher of KP than I.
I don't believe that there is a huge difference between ISL and BNL. I've noticed a drop in standard most likely due to drop in wage cap. Coventry spend £350k on their players. Dundee played okay against Eagles and it was close in the second game. Bearing in mind that Eagles are supposed to be one of the stronger teams this year it begs the question how would the top BNL teams fair with the bottom ISL teams.
Finally, I am dubious that there will be an ISL next year and the two leagues joining up. The wage limit is similar and so is the skill level.
I expect we'll disagree about the ISL/BNL but time will tell if there is an ISL next season. The 'Steelers Director' also seriously doubts it.
scuff (Login houseofsteel) Forum Owner 62.64.200.174
So the..
September 24 2002, 4:08 PM
..BNL people will be willing to pay out for a 'franchise' when they have no need to do so now, or the ISL people will be willing to write off varying amounts of money (assets) from 250k upwards then in order to band together..
Losing money is a habit many clubs excel at. Steelers lost £250k last year.
BNL team in Sheffield’s new rinks could force Steelers to be that BNL team. This town isn’t big enough for two teams. In a meeting with some of the Directors this BNL team is a serious concern and threat to the Steelers. League woefully inadequate of teams. ISL no sponser and a TV deal all the clubs pay for and the usual way round of TV paying clubs.
is no more than what Brian Storey said to the Dronfield SSSC before the season started..the transcript of which was posted on this and other forums around the hockey world..
I'm not saying KP would take the spot of 2 players, what Blaiser said was that if we had got KP, there would have been less money remaining for the last defenceman.
Hence KP would have had Syszky's spot and we probably wouldn't have had enough money left to sign someone of the quality of Darling.
.....There may not be much difference between ISL & Coventry, Dundee & Guildford, but there's a world of difference between ISL and the rest of the BNL.
At least, generally speaking, the ISL is a pretty balanced league. With the BNL there are 3 teams against the rest.
If. as some would have us believe there are so many people disillusioned with the ISL that they still won't go then surely Sheffield is big enough for two teams. Those that currently have thrown their teddy's out will watch BNL while those of us that want to watch a higher lever will watch ISL.
And back on the subject of KP I still say that yes he will be a star in the BNL, but with the youth, size and experience of the ISL D-men he would struggle in today's ISL, unfortunately.
Hmm, the ISL is pretty much balanced. Stewart let no man say you haven’t a sense of humour! We are just a few weeks in the season and we have all seen enough to know Belfast and Sheffield will be challenging for all prizes this time. There’s been some right cricket scores reminiscent of 10 years ago.
I’m glad you agree that the top BNL teams are not that different to some of the ISL teams. This is exactly the reason why I think that the ISL and BNL will join together. We all appreciate that the league is woefully small. Just having the three teams you mention will boost the league to 10. The ISL consider 12 to provide a sustainable league. Considering the Storm nearly didn’t have a home because of cash flow problems, teams losing money hand over fist I can see the ISL, in its present form, will be dead at the end of the season.
The logical and natural approach would be to have two leagues with hopefully a promotion / relegation battle at the end. One league would be too large. The TV companies would consider a league of 12 far more credible than a league of just 7. Hopefully, then these TV companies would be willing to plough money into the league instead of taking it out of it.
The funny thing about the blurring of standards of the two leagues is that in the close season of discontent some where saying they would never watch the low standard of BNL, and here we now are. We had Rickety Ron gracing us last season and actually making a difference in the team. We now have 6 youngster playing for us.
As for those disillusioned with the ISL statement, I believe some of those are back but still not happy with the ISL, are you? Others have left for good. If Steelers stay in the ISL charging £12 a game and a BNL side starts up with a few favourites of yester-year, including KP, paying £350k wages thus having a similar quality of the ISL, charging £6-8 a game, playing against far more teams, the loss of just 500 to 1000 Steeler fans would be a death blow for current ice hockey. Moreover, lets not forget that this is the last year under the contract with the Arena. Yes, makes one think doesn’t it.
This is my last post on the matter but before I go I chuckle over your last line. If KP is past it then what about the senior Rick Brebant? Before trying to apply logic regarding KP just go and see him. He’s a pleasure to watch.
.... in the BNL! As for Rick, the ONLY reason he is still competitive is because he has remained at this level. Kenny took 3 years out. I don't care what sport you are talking about you cannot take that time out and come back at the same level. Even Mario Lemieux couldn't!
Lets look at your economic model for a BNL team, based on your figures of £6 - £8 per game, therefore an average of £7.
2000 people (the figure I heard the new rink will hold)at £7 each = £14,000.
Assuming 10 teams play each other 3 times. 27 home games =£378,000.
Minus team salary of £350,000 = £28,000.
Ice pad rental minimum of £1000 per game =£30,000
Total = £2000 loss
And that's on a FULL HOUSE EVERY WEEK.
And that's without things like Insurance, Kit, Non playing staff wages.
Moving on to other points. Whilst there have been some high scores in the ISL, each team has proved it is capable of beating any other on a given night. Not something that can be said about the BNL.
With regard to the top 3 BNL teams joining the superleague teams. Guildford won't. They had the opportunity at the inception of ISL and turned it down. I also cannot see any BNL team putting up the franchise money. And by the same token no ISL team will wave goodbye to thier investment.
As for promotion and relegation. Are you new to Hockey? It's been done before. All that happened is that the wealthier (Stronger) teams got promoted and the poorer (weaker) teams got relegated.
Whilst I would agree that the ISL has a long way to go merging with the BNL is not in the best interests of either league.
Have you seen Ken Priestlay play? He played better than Tony Hand and far better than Teeder Wynne. Both did not have any time off. Again MB wanted him back so, ignoring my actual observations at a real life game, I would back MB’s judgement over your logic no matter how well you try to present it.
Now for your well presented logical financial break down of a BNL league. I must point out that this is not my economic model but is indeed fact in the real world. Your presentation was very interesting but you assume a lot and forget other sources of income such as sponsorship. The fact is Hull Thunder, a club that does make ends meat, charged £8 for adults and £6.50 for concessions. Once again this is fact and you can see the proof by just looking at their web site. Therefore, this has far more substance than basing theories on assumptions.
Your next line regarding one ISL can beat another ISL on the day, will I disagree with this, no. There could be a case when either Belfast or Sheffield could suffer a bout of injuries, suspensions or team hit by flu, however all things being equal Belfast and Sheffield will dominate. Bracknel will be bottom of the league near Manchester and Nottingham, Eagles and London will be in no mans land. There is no point in arguing this only time will tell.
Looking at your next statement. The ISL is haemorrhaging money and so are the ISL clubs. What’s the loss of a £200k franchise when they lose that in one year anyway. Steelers lost £250K last year. Who said the top league would be anything like the ISL but in name. Basically, the FBNL clubs are in a better position than we are. We need them far more than they need us. The ISL and associated clubs may consider waiving the franchise is a price worth paying for a stronger league. Once more, all this is opinion. We could argue this until we are blue in the face but again only time will tell.
Finally, with respects to your promotion / relegation statement. Yes I know it has been done before since I have been following Steelers from day one. Promotion / relegation games provide great interests for the teams involved and gives something all teams can aim for. The ISL is basically pointless but for noting the positions of individual clubs relative to one and another. With promotion and relegation creates year on year change and interest as poor clubs go down and new blood comes in. In that respects the current ISL league is boring.
I wasn’t planning to reply to your post but I felt that I had to correct some of you well thought-out theories.
I don’t really want to spend any further time on this discussion and so will not respond any more thus giving you the luxury of ‘last word’.
....... Unfortunately not yet, the only time Dundee have been down this way it clashed with a Steelers game and being a Steelers supporter I watched them in Manchester. Having said that it does not surprise me that he was better than Tony and Teeder Wynne, he always was. I wonder why those two left ISL though, could it be that they were struggling to keep up? MB wanted him back!. It is my understanding that Kenny approached MB. Let's not forget that even in his prime, Kenny, as awesome as he was, was not a Blaiser type of player.
I don't dispute the admission prices at Hull. But, how do you know they are making ends meet or that they are indeed spending as much as £350,000? Looking at their stats I doubt that they are. Additionally I suspect the rental on Hull Ice Rink will considerably cheaper than the new ice pad in Sheffield will be. The attendance for the Hull - Dundee match was 1070 (including a large number os Steeler fans), a maximum take of £8560.
As for the ISL. Sheffield didn't have illness or injury when Manchester beat them at the MEN, nor did Manchester the following week when Sheffield won. As I said on any given night!
ISL teams are heamoraging money. Any trading losses during a season are written off against tax. To walk away from a £250,000 franchise fee is a different thing entirely. As for making a stronger league I cannot see how joining the BNL would make for a stronger league. Sheffield, Manchester et al would have to have weaker teams in order for the likes of Solihull MK, Edinburgh and indeed Hull to compete, if the didn't we'd be back with the 23 - 2 score lines again. I was present at the Hull / Sheffield "training game" last season I couldn't watch that week after week.
As for us needing them more than they need us. What we need is for all the minor leagues to act as feeder teams so that one day the ISL will have a decent number of British players and Tony Hand will cease to be the only Brit based player drafted into the NHL.
I don't remember promotion relegation being much fun for teams like Slough and Peterborough. Once the Arena in Cardiff is finished, McSorly, in my opinion, will abandon the BNL and rejoin the ISL. So too will Newcastle if they caqn just get the attendance figures up a bit.
You seem to forget that Hockey is a North American sport. Promotion and relegation do not happen. Name me one country that has it in the Hockey world. The league title is not the important title, it's the Playoffs.
Thanks for giving me the last word, I'm not one to turn down a free offer. Oh and I have at least had the courage to put my name to my opinions.
. I'm sure the smooth skating, passing etc are still noticeable, but would he still be an impact player at the much higher level of the ISL?