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March 25 2003 at 3:08 PM
John Waddey  (no login)
from IP address


We all understand that God did not assign a specific name to his church. Rather, several different names are used to designate his people: church of God, church of the Lord, churches of Christ and the church. When there was but one body of people in the world that honored Christ as their founder, head and Lord there was no need for any further identification. We, however, live in a society were there are upwards of 1500 different kinds of churches. This situation creates a state of confusion as to which body of people one is referring to when he speaks of or asks about "the church." This situation necessitates that we have some way of identifying ourselves so we can communicate, find each other and point others to a body of brethren in a given place.

In the early days of the Restoration Movement three different streams of people came together to unite on the Bible and restore the faith and practice of the original church. Those led by Alexander Campbell most often referred to themselves as Disciples of Christ. Those led by Barton Stone most often used the name Church of Christ. Those coming from the James O'Kelly, Elias Smith and Abner Jones movement preferred the name Christian Church. There was not a strict adherence to any particular one of these names and all the brethren recognized each other as fellow-Christians serving God in one body. When schism occurred at the end of the 19th and the beginning of the 20th centuries, those preferring to have instrumental music, missionary societies, women in positions of church leadership, etc., generally identified themselves as Christian Churches/Disciples of Christ. Our brethren distinguished themselves by the biblical name Churches of Christ, found in Rom. 16:16. Over a period of 25 years this distinction of names became virtually complete. Our brethren continued to hold and use the name Churches of Christ, not because it was the exclusive Bible cognomen for the church but because it was biblical and was helpful in identifying our people, wherever they might be.

Over the last 40 years, as liberalism slowly eroded the Biblical foundations of many of our younger preachers and they in turn failed to properly instruct and indoctrinate our people, a new generation of leaders arose who seemed to be ashamed of their association with the brotherhood of people known as Churches of Christ. They craved acceptance with their neighbors of the Evangelical churches. They did not want to bear the stigma of being exclusive and different from the worldly churches around them. Since they no longer believed the exclusive message of salvation and the one church of Scripture, they did not want to be publicly identified with those who still held to such exclusive beliefs. Hence they began to cast around for a name that would do two things:

  • It would mask from the people of their community that they were affiliated with other Churches of Christ.

  • It would make them appear like other "Community Churches" that were experiencing phenomenal growth. We know that many of those who have taken this route have chosen as their models, "Non-denominational Community Churches" such as the Saddleback Community Church of Orange County California and Willow Creek Church in Barrington, Illinois and Robert Shuller's Crystal Cathedral. Of course those churches are thoroughly denominational in their faith and practice since they prefer the doctrines and commandments of men rather than the authority of the New Testament of Christ as their standard. Numerous Baptist, Methodist, Reformed and other denominational congregations have also taken this same moniker of "Community Church." It seems that some of our brethren prefer to be identified with such groups rather than with their brethren of Churches of Christ.

  • Another probable motive is that under the name of Community Church, the typical congregation places little or no emphasis on doctrinal loyalty. Thus a typical Community Church might employ a Methodist minister this year and a Disciples of Christ man the next, and a female Presbyterian the following. Indicators are that some of our brethren who have chosen this route have a similar laxness about doctrinal standards. Church for them is all about fellowship, fun, doing good and feeling good. Such things as abiding in the doctrine of Christ (II John 9-11) are given little emphasis.

Those of our people who have chosen to identify themselves as Community churches seem to have a commonality about them. They all have embraced the agenda of the change movement, which seeks to transform our people into the likeness of our denominational neighbors. Such things as salvation by grace through faith before immersion, a de-emphasis on the importance of baptism, a willingness to tolerate the use of instrumental music in worship, a willingness to allow women to assume leadership roles in the life of the church, acceptance of denominational churches as in good standing with God and other related issues seem to be part and parcel of those wishing to be known as "Community Churches." Several of our Universities and Colleges have given encouragement to the Community Church movement: among them Abilene Christian University, Pepperdine University and Harding Graduate School of Religion.

It would be as scriptural to identify ones congregation as the Community Church of Christ as the State Street Church of Christ. But for most of these folks, they want the "Community Church" without the "of Christ" designation. As Jesus said we can only judge them by their fruits (Matt. 7:16-21). The direction of this movement is away from New Testament Christianity and from obedience to the message of Christ. It is away from the brotherhood of Churches of Christ of which they once were a part. In my judgment it would be a mistake for a congregation to take such a name as it creates confusion as to who they are. It also identifies them with those who are abandoning the Bible as their standard of faith and practice. It reflects on their part a sense of shame to be identified with the gospel and the body of Christ. Paul was not ashamed of the message he preached (Rom. 1:16). With Jesus, he gladly endured the shame of the cross (Heb. 12:2; Gal. 5:11) and so should we. If the world despises us for what we believe and stand for, so be it; they hated Jesus for his faith and convictions (John 15:17-20).

John Waddey, Editor
Christianity: Then and Now


This message has been edited by Donnie.Cruz from IP address on Sep 6, 2005 4:15 AM

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Horace Johns
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To: John Waddey

March 29 2003, 2:40 AM 

I would like to commend you on your message. You explained the situation in such simple words even the leaders of theh Madison denomination should understand it.

The sad part is that probably none of the "leaders" will read it. If so, they would not pay any attntion to it. Maybe, if we could get Mr. Gingles to talk to the Holy Spirit to come to a leaders' meeting and explain it to them or does he reserve that gift for himself. I'm sure Don Finto would come over if Mr. Gingles asked. I understand he has close ties to "the apolstle". Since Joe Boehm supports Finto, maybe he will talk to him when he comes for the meeting.

Or, maybe Jeff Walling will talk to the Spirit when
he is here. If not, all hope is not lost. The big one, Max Lucado, will be around soon. I'm fairly certain that Head Elder Dozier or Ass't Head Elder Hoppes will be given the gift soon so I guess your message will be lost in never, never land.

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Donnie Cruz
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Re: To: John Waddey (by Horace Johns) March 29 2003, 2:40 AM

September 16 2003, 2:56 AM 

Mr. Johns:

Sometimes I wonder how much of this “speaking to the Holy Spirit” is going on with some of the leaders of certain congregations moving toward that direction. If not, then, the Holy Spirit whispering in a clear voice to them individually or to the church collectively? (Speaking of Madison, someone should be reminded that the MCOFC website needs updating. I’m sure that the remaining elders have selected additional elders, and the site does not yet show their pictures. Also, please verify the hierarchical structure of the leadership.)

As you know there are large congregations of the church that now have this type of organization—some form of a hierarchy. And, it’s really confusing because there are now different ministers and other leaders (including THE WORSHIP LEADER) in the mix. In these instances, I wouldn’t be surprised if each of these congregations now had a Head Elder and an Assistant Head Elder [or at least currently serving as “Acting” or “Interim” Head Elder, etc.]—and it’s just not known to the membership yet.

Have you read about Max Lucado, one of the most prominent change agents, as reported in “What Happened at Madison This Week”? The Holy Spirit “spoke” unequivocally to LUCADO and the other ministers, as well as to the elders [?], about their mission. So, now, ashamed of the name of Christ, they have officially changed the name from “Oak Hills Church of Christ” to “Oak Hills Church” [implication: “Oak Hills Community Church”].

These prominent change agents have strong influences at Madison: Don Finto, Rubel Shelly, Jeff Walling, Joe Beam, Lindsey Garmon, Larry Sullivan. One recent MUSICAL WORSHIP guide quoted a statement by MAX LUCADO, as if the scriptures didn’t have enough to quote from. And you are predicting the “big one, MAX LUCADO, will be around soon”?

Donnie Cruz

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Donnie Cruz
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Re: To: John Waddey (by Horace Johns) March 29 2003, 2:40 AM

September 17 2003, 1:27 PM 

Mr. Johns:

Sometimes I wonder how much of this “speaking to the Holy Spirit” is going on with some of the leaders of certain congregations moving toward that direction. If not, then, is it the Holy Spirit "whispering" in a clear voice to them individually or to the church collectively? (Speaking of Madison, someone should be reminded that the MCOFC website needs updating. I’m sure that the remaining elders have selected additional elders, and the site does not yet show their pictures. Also, please verify the hierarchical structure of the leadership.)

As you know there are large congregations of the church that now have this type of organization—some form of a hierarchy. And, it’s really confusing because there are now different ministers and other leaders (including THE WORSHIP LEADER) in the mix. In these instances, I wouldn’t be surprised if each of these congregations now had a Head Elder and an Assistant Head Elder [or at least currently serving as “Acting” or “Interim” Head Elder, etc.]—and it’s just not known to the membership yet.

Have you read about Max Lucado, one of the most prominent change agents, as reported in “What Happened at Madison This Week”? The Holy Spirit “spoke” unequivocally to LUCADO and the other ministers, as well as to the elders [?], about their mission. So, now, ashamed of the name of Christ, they have officially changed the name from “Oak Hills Church of Christ” to “Oak Hills Church” [implication: “Oak Hills Community Church”].

These prominent change agents have strong influences at Madison: Don Finto, Rubel Shelly, Jeff Walling, Joe Beam, Lindsey Garmon, Larry Sullivan. One recent MUSICAL WORSHIP guide quoted a statement by MAX LUCADO, as if the scriptures didn’t have enough to quote from. And you are predicting the “big one, MAX LUCADO, will be around soon”?

Donnie Cruz

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Donnie Cruz
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Oak Hills Church: a Community Church

October 3 2003, 3:15 AM 


. . .
Our fifth major initiative will, hopefully, serve to lower this [“spatial”] barrier: simultaneous Sunday morning services in the South Room and a fourth service on Sunday night. Let's use the new "South Room" to host worship services concurrent with the second and third service in the main Worship Center. A video of the first service message will be shown and an opportunity to worship will be provided. We will begin this gathering in late fall 2003. In early 2004, we will launch a Sunday evening service. I will present the same message from Sunday morning and we will target twenty and thirty year olds.

Recognizing the power of contemporary music, these new assemblies will be instrumental. A soft keyboard beneath an altar call, the sound of a cello during communion service ... these tools enhance outreach. After fifteen years and several thousand sermons, I am convinced instrumentation reaches hearts. … Motivated by a desire to touch more souls, we feel it is wise to use this tool. The three Sunday morning services in the main Worship Center will remain non-instrumental. In this way, ample choices will be offered to all members.
. . .
Some people find the name "Church of Christ" to be an insurmountable [“social”] barrier. Scripture urges us to remove cultural hindrances while remaining scripturally true. … Our seventh initiative calls for an alteration of our name. ... We can reach more souls by modifying "Oak Hills Church of Christ" to "Oak Hills Church" . . . While we deeply appreciate our heritage in the Churches of Christ, we recognize the hindrance the name creates for some. … We recognize the emotional struggle this decision spawns for some.
. . .
In the early nineties, our Lord called us to be a force for unity among San Antonio churches. We, for the first time, "swapped pulpits" with Trinity Baptist Church. This was a major move and we came to it cautiously. I remember Charles Prince preaching on the topic of Christian unity and urging us to "not consult our fears." We didn't and God blessed the church for it.
. . .
Over the last few weeks He has moved in great force again. God has given us our vision. The call to be a city-impacting church has come through loud and clear. Our elders enjoy an uncommon unity and conviction. The ministers, without exception, enthusiastically embrace this vision. Our marching orders are in hand.
. . .

Max Lucado
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ ]]]

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Donnie Cruz
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“Oak Hills drops 'Church of Christ' -- It's about time!”—Kenneth Sublett explains

October 3 2003, 3:22 AM 

“Oak Hills drops 'Church of Christ' -- It's about time!”—Kenneth Sublett explains:
It is not a problem: it is in the book and it is all coming true. To paraphrase Isaiah's treatment of Israel as His Vineyard, the remnant will be a "tiny drop of good juice, out of one rotten grape, off one bare cluster, off one dead vine, from one vineyard whose walls have been broken down by God to let in the BEASTS to eat up the harvest and let the briers and thorns obliterate that which God provided free of charge.” In my circle, this mighty apostasy hit home when PK insisted that we MUST BREAK DOWN THE WILLS. We did and the beasts came in to eat up our lunch and souls. People die (Amos 5, 6, 8; Isaiah 5) by hungering and thirsting for the word and CANNOT find it in any church I am aware of. John Waddey's estimate of only 15% who have not been LED into apostasy may be too generous.

The pattern repeats;

Luke 21:25 And there shall be signs in the sun, and in the moon, and in the stars; and upon the earth distress of nations, with perplexity; the sea and the waves roaring;

Both Lucado and Shelly deny that Christ came fully in the flesh and both promote (maybe to sell books) thinking of the S.O.N. God as the S.U.N. god. They both repudiate Christ and even friend John Mark Hicks warns about their INCARNATIONAL THEOLOGY as denying that God came in the flesh.

Did you see MARS almost IN the Sun last night: it won't happen again for a long time. I was truly astounded at the sight where the MOON shined much like the SUN and the WARRIOR GOD glowed angry red. Has there been more distress of nations?

The SEA is derived from SALT. Is there anything there? Has there been a time when the SEA upon which stands the holy whore Circe (church) has had less SALT? Waves are "agitated."

Roaring is from:

Echeo (g2278) ay-kheh'-o; from 2279; to make a loud noise, i.e. reverberate: - roar, sound.

THOUGH I speak with the tongues of men and of angels, and have not charity, I am become as SOUNDING brass, or a tinkling cymbal. 1 Cor. 13:1.

These were instruments of warfare and also of those looking for a SPIRIT to guide them.

This word speaks of the TEAM who came to wail for the Dead girl. When Jesus CAST THEM OUT it was like casting out Dung. But who can deny that MUSICAL WORSHIP (even in the most conservative churches) creates such emotional anxiety that LEARNING is not possible?

Those waves roaring may be from NAVIGATING THE WINDS OF CHANGE.

While this applied to that generation, prophecies have an ongoing message. Therefore, Jesus would say to us undergoing the same abomination which is desolating the church by allowing SINGERS and MUSICIANS to enter the Holy Place as the type of the body or Church of Christ we are repudiating the ONCE FOR ALL TIMES SACRIFICE of Jesus Christ who was then Mocked by the Levitical musicians (warriors) trying to melt His heart.

Luke 21:28 And when these things begin to come to pass, then look up, and lift up your heads; for your redemption draweth nigh.

Rev 19:18 That ye may eat the flesh of kings, and the flesh of captains, and the flesh of mighty men, and the flesh of horses, and of them that sit on them, and the flesh of all men, both free and bond, both small and great.

Rev 19:19 And I saw the beast, and the kings of the earth, and their armies, gathered together to make war against him that sat on the horse, and against his army.

Well, now is the time we should know more about prophecy which is being used by the BEAST to defeat the church.

And God has blinded eyes and plugged up ears so that no one listens.

Ken, living expectingly as the SIGNS match with the date.

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“When You Change Your Name, You Have Changed Your Values”

October 3 2003, 3:26 AM 

“When You Change Your Name, You Have Changed Your Values”

Although the name has changed, Lucado said the church's core values will not. We must wonder how has taking the name of Jesus Christ off of the church sign in front not changed the values. Are they ashamed of the name of Jesus Christ?

Jesus said, "For whoever is ashamed of Me and My words, of him will the Son of Man be ashamed when He comes in His glory, and the glory of the Father and of the holy angels" (Luke 9:26). Christians wear the name of Christ; they love the name of Christ; and they are willing to suffer for the name of Jesus Christ. Lucado, however, thinks it is more effective evangelistically as a Christian not to put the name of Christ on the sign.

Some today are now rejecting the use of that name, claiming that it is sectarian. Others are rejecting the name because they, frankly, do not want to be associated with the undesirable behavior that some members of the “church of Christ” have manifested. The old statement that “those people believe you have to be a member of the church of Christ to be saved” has led some to be ashamed of anything that uses the phrase, “church of Christ.” Consequently, a new generation of churches of Christ has adopted some alternative names. Some now go by “Community Church,” putting the phrase “a church of Christ” on the sign in small letters. A minister favoring the change recently gave this explanation:

The truth is that the name “Church of Christ” carries the baggage of an exclusivistic mentality to many people in our culture. “Oh, yeah,” somebody says, “those are the people who think they’re the only ones going to heaven.” One lady said that she never would have come into our building if she had known we are a “Church of Christ.” Once she came in and experienced the presence of God in this body, however, she isn’t about to leave! She and her children--from a very different denominational background--are reveling in the experience of Christ in this community of faith. (Rubel Shelly, "What Is Your Church's Name?", Lovelines, Vol. 24, No. 5, Feb. 4, 1998.)

Such statements show that some are embarrassed and ashamed of the phrase “Church of Christ.” I must wonder if such people will one day be ashamed of the phrase “family of God” when they suppose that there is too much offensive baggage associated with that name. I wonder if they would change their personal name if some member of the family should disgrace it. Many of those postmodernists who are so quick to embrace the unconditional love and grace of God are slow to forgive what embarrasses them.

It is not an accident that this generation has adopted some new names, nor is it surprising that these new names suggest a change in attitude and may say more about the nature of the new congregations than is at first intended. A nearby denominational group subnames itself, “The People’s Church.” What does that say? I suppose that the members of the congregation wanted the community to know that they were a church “of the people,” i.e., that the common people of the city are part of the congregation. Perhaps they wanted to play up their large size and their appeal to people. Perhaps they wanted the community to know how “in tune” they were to the common opinions and beliefs. My thought was
this: if the church belongs to the people, how can it belong to Jesus Christ? If the desires of people are its driving force, how can Jesus be its Lord? Something of this same idea might also be said of the “community” church. Perhaps the idea is that the church is to be identified with the community. This has a fine marketing appeal, but where is the Lord glorified? Does Oak Hills Church now belong to Oak Hills or to Jesus Christ? When they substitute orchestras for Biblical worship, they are not living after the teaching of Jesus.

The words “church of Christ” are not a formal name so much as they are a description of who we are. The Scriptures do not give any title to the church, but no one should doubt that the church uniquely belongs to Jesus. Jesus is the builder of the church (Matt. 16:18); He is the One who purchased it with His blood (Acts 20:28); He is the one and only foundation of the church (1 Cor. 3:11); He is the head of the church (Eph. 1:22,23); and He is the one and only Savior of the body (Eph. 5:23). When Jesus spoke of the church, He called it “my church” (Matt. 16:18); and when Paul describes the congregations, he calls them “churches of Christ” (Rom. 16:16). There is much to be said in associating the church to the name of Jesus Christ.

It must be further pointed out that we as Christians do whatever we do in His name. When we were baptized, it was in the name of Jesus Christ (Acts 2:38). When we pray, we pray in His name (John 14:13,14). We give a cup of cold water in His name (Mark 9:41); we gather in His name (Matt. 18:20); and we suffer persecution for His name’s sake (1 Pet. 4:14-16). Repentance and remission of sins are preached in His name (Luke 24:47); we believe in His name (John 1:12); and we have life in His name (John 20:31). Peter reminds us that there is “salvation in no one else; for there is no other name under heaven that has been given among men, by which we must be saved” (Acts 4:12). Indeed the apostles taught in His name (Acts 5:41), Philip preached His name (Acts 8:12), and Paul bore His name before the Gentiles (Acts 9:15). It is His name that is to be magnified (Acts 19:17); His name that we are to call upon when we are baptized (22:16); and His name that washes, sanctifies and justifies us (1 Cor. 6:11). Saints are those who call upon His name (1 Cor. 1:2). It was in the name of Jesus Christ that Paul both exhorted the Corinthians and turned the wicked man over to Satan (1 Cor. 1:10; 5:4,5). Paul describes the name of Jesus as that which is above every name (Eph. 1:21); and it is the name at which every knee will bow and every tongue confess to the glory of the Father (Phil. 2:9,10). Whatever we do in word or deed, we are to do in the name of the Lord Jesus (Col. 3:17); and His name is to be glorified in us (2 Thess. 1:12). Even slaves are to live worthy of the name of Jesus Christ (1 Tim. 6:1). Consequently, those who name the name of Jesus ought to abstain from wickedness (1 Tim. 2:19). The name we name is more excellent than the name of the angels (Heb. 1:4). To His name we offer a sacrifice of praise, the fruit of our lips (Heb. 13:15). When we minister to saints, we show love to His name (Heb. 6:10). The name of Jesus Christ, by which we are called, is a fair name (James 2:7); it is the name in which we are to glorify God (1 Pet. 4:14-16). We must hold fast to that name (Rev. 2:13), fear His name (Rev. 11:18), and never deny His name (Rev. 3:8). With all these emphases on the name of Jesus Christ, it is unthinkable that any Christian would abandon it.

Should the church wear the name of Jesus Christ? Yes. Should the church denominate that name? No. The phrase “church of Christ” ought always to be a description of who we are and whose we are. Those who are critical of our use of that name, saying we have somehow denominated it ought to be careful that they are not guilty of the same error with other descriptions.

According to the newspaper, "Oak Hills' core values are similar to those of other evangelical churches, emphasizing the need for faith in Jesus' sacrificial death and resurrection for salvation. Oak Hills also believes salvation doesn't come through baptism, but that baptism is the initial step of obedience after salvation." If Max and Company are so ashamed of the "church of Christ" that they are removing it from their signs, then perhaps they are finally being honest. Their core value is Evangelical; they have ceased to be New Testament Christians.

Much of this is taken from my book, Adrift, pp. 113-117.

Phil Sanders

John Waddey’s review of ADRIFT says it is “A BOOK YOU MUST READ”:
”Much of what has been and is being said and written against the change movement afflicting our brotherhood deals with the visible symptoms of the problem. Bro. Phil Sanders, as a skilled physician, probes deeper and identifies the specific disease that has invaded the hearts and minds of many of our brethren. The disease is "Postmodernism" an affliction of the heart and mind affecting multitudes both in and out of the church.

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John Waddey
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October 5 2003, 2:49 AM 

Granted some preachers among us have been "shouting wolf" for the last 35 years. Time and again brethren looked but could not find the wolf. After a while, many became inured to the warnings of the wolf-warners. They finally decided those who were constantly sounding the alarm did not merit their attention. Such a response was just what Satan hoped for. Now, with their eyes closed and ears plugged, he could do his work of infiltrating churches with no serious opposition. Muffled and blindfolded, preachers and elders neither saw nor heard as the Adversary's minions did their work. First they captured the administration and Bible departments of some of our schools. The Father of Lies embolden a few our successful young preachers to launch a program of change. Intoxicated with the taste of their "new wine," they worked evangelistically to recruit others to join their campaign.

When more responsible watchmen saw these real wolves savaging churches in many places and sounded a warning, the majority of our preachers and elders still had their blindfolds and earplugs in place. They could not hear. Many did not wish to hear or see. Such knowledge is disconcerting. Warnings were brushed aside as scare-mongering, complaints from preachers jealous of others' success, nitpicking or other ignoble motives.

Last month (Aug. 03) a leading change agent issued a bold announcement that rang a bell even the deaf could hear and caused a flash of light that pierced the thickest blinders. Max Lucado, the most daring of the change agents and the darling of our liberal brothers, preached a sermon announcing a new agenda for his Oak Hills Church of Christ in San Antonio.

<> Their name would be changed to "Oak Hills Church." His logic was, "Some people find the name ‘church of Christ' to be an insurmountable barrier...Let's seek to remove any barrier that would hinder a person from hearing the Gospel." Immersion is also a barrier to many. Jesus as Lord is a barrier to Jews and Muslims!

<> He proposed: "establishing Oak Hills Campuses in other sections of the city. These satellite churches will at least initially, be a part of the Oak Hills family... Our multi-site churches could stay linked together by viewing a video of the sermon from the ‘mother church.'" In the world of Catholicism, this is called a diocesan form of church government.

<> Instrumental music would be used in their Sunday evening services for young adults. Max said, "I will present the...message and we will target twenty and thirty year olds. Recognizing the power of contemporary music, the new assemblies will be instrumental...A soft keyboard beneath an altar call, the sound of a cello during communion service...I am convinced instrumentation reaches hearts...We feel it is wise to use this tool." Note his absence of Scriptural authorization for this change. For change agents "feelings" trump Scripture when it gets in the way.

<> In an interview in the San Antonio Express-News (9/6/03), Vic King, Oak Hills' minister of missions, said "Oak Hills' core values are similar to those of other evangelical churches." He continued, "Oak Hills also believes that salvation doesn't come through baptism, but that baptism is the initial step of obedience after salvation."

<> Their core values were said to be like the "Evangelical" churches. In "lay" terms, this refers to Baptists, Reformed Churches, Assemblies of God and other "conservative" denominational bodies.

<> Bro. Lucado also said, "Our Lord called us to be a force for unity among San Antonio Churches. We, for the first time, ‘swapped pulpits' with Trinity Baptist Church."

Now I ask those who preach and those shepherd our churches: Can you see the wolf? Yes, Bro. Lucado is gifted and an effective, successful writer. Yes, he has had far greater acceptance among those outside our brotherhood than any other writer. Yes, he did attend Abilene Christian University. Yes, he once was a missionary and a preacher of truth and righteousness. Please, take off the blindfold, remove the earplugs and see the sad and ugly truth. This brother and the church he serves have abandoned New Testament Christianity for the appealing fields of "Evangelical" Protestantism. Like Hymenaeus and Alexander, they have made shipwreck of the faith (I Tim. 1:19-20). Given his high visibility, his popularity and success, Bro. Lucado will influence many young men to emulate his example.

As unfortunate as this case is, Bro. Lucado and Oak Hills congregation are but one example of scores of others who have done likewise. A tidal wave of error is sweeping across the face of our brotherhood. It will eventually reach your congregation. The time to prepare for this invasion and protect your flock is now! Ours are not premature or unfounded warnings. The wolves are already within the fold. Many casualties have already been suffered. For the sake of the Lord Jesus and his holy church, rise up and be the faithful watchmen and shepherds God expects you to be!

John Waddey

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Carl Straight
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yeah max,

October 10 2003, 4:30 PM 

I really like bro, Max Lacudo, he is awesome, I too am a former member of the Church of Christ, and I feel that we are saved by grace through faith, and that baptized is a result of our Faith in Christ...Carl

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Donnie Cruz
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Repent and be baptized THAT your sins may be remitted

October 11 2003, 4:20 AM 

Karl Marx was a very renowned economic/political philosopher. You know, Carl, Max is a very popular “religious” philosopher today. His website describes him in “UpWords” (his teaching ministry) as a prolific writer “with more than 28 million books in print”—he is wealthy! (Hmmm … wonder why?) His philosophy or logic is that the name “of Christ”—appended to the name of the church He established and whose gospel only is to be preached—is an “insurmountable [social] barrier.”

There is a very popular 1988 song titled “Awesome God … Our God Is an Awesome God.” The word “awe” is defined as “a feeling of wonder and reverence; fear and reverence; dread mingled with reverence.” Whether or not the “praise” singers honestly express “fear and reverence” as they do the loud programmed, rhythmic clapping while singing this song, my question to you is this: Since Max Lucado is “awesome” to you, how much of that “feeling of wonder or fear and reverence” would you attribute to the man who no longer teaches the unadulterated truth of God?

That’s quite a bold and an honest confession of your current membership, as well as Max’s, which is ___________? [Well . . . you didn’t specify]. Based on your claim, I would assume that you and Max, as “former” members of the church of Christ, had been baptized before in order that your sins would be forgiven. But since you have discovered (or imitated from the Baptist religion) this “new truth” of being saved first before baptism, did you have to go through a “reversal” or a re-conversion process—done differently this time? Did you this time have to first “accept Christ as your personal Savior to get saved [have your sins remitted], then, be [re-]baptized AFTER being saved?

In case you have forgotten, let me remind you of this very familiar passage: “… Repent, and be baptized every one of you in the name of Jesus Christ FOR [the original Greek word “eis” means: so that, in order that, toward or UNTO] the remission of sins, and ye shall receive [clear conscience:] the gift of the Holy Ghost” (KJV). (The Baptists substitute “because of” for the word “for” in the text.) A parallel passage that also explains conversion and refreshing [clear conscience] ONLY AFTER repentance and baptism is found in Acts 3:19—“Repent ye therefore, and be converted, that your sins may be blotted out, when the times of refreshing shall come from the presence of the Lord.” (KJV)

Donnie Cruz

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John Waddey
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October 16 2003, 7:03 AM 

Churches of Christ are faced with a revolution in their camp. A band of skilled, articulate men have launched a movement to reform (i.e. change) the faith, worship and practice of the brotherhood. If they are successful, we will no longer be a church modeled after the Biblical pattern; the church our fathers and mothers knew. The seriousness of the challenge is illustrated by the contrasting views of the church held by those who are promoting change and those who are determined to cling to the old paths of the Biblical standard.

Our view of the church is that it is stable and unchanging in its essence. We want to believe and worship just as the first disciples did and as faithful saints have since the beginning. The church was established by Christ (Matt. 16:18) and given a standard of faith and practice conceived in heaven, suitable for all men of all nations and forever binding on those who wish to please him (Matt. 28:20). Their view, in contrast, is of a church that theoretically can be different in every age, culture and community. Their churches are the products of their culture and are shaped by those who are significant leaders. They reject the idea of the Bible as our divine pattern and ridicule the idea as “patternism.”

Our view is that the Church of Christ is the spiritual body of Jesus in this world (Eph. 1:22); purchased by his blood (Acts 20;28); established by Christ (Matt. 16:18). It is God’s family of saved people (I Tim. 3:15), that will live with him in eternity (I Cor. 15:24; Rev. 21:2). Their view is that the Church of Christ is a human organization founded by Alexander Campbell and Barton Stone in the early 1800s. At best, it is only a denomination, merely a part of the real church. They see it as seriously flawed and of no lasting value. To them, one’s salvation certainly does not depend on being a part of it.

Our view is that the faith, worship and work of the church have been ordained and commissioned by Christ (I Cor. 11:23). The Scriptures provide us all things that pertain to life and godliness (II Pet. 1:3-4). They constitute a “pattern of sound words” to which we are to cling (II Tim. 1:13). We are explicitly taught to “observe all things whatsoever (Christ) commanded” (Matt. 28:20). In his Testament, Christ sets forth the doctrines we are to believe, the kind of worship we are to offer and the mission his church is to pursue. Our duty is to acknowledge him as Lord (Rom. 10:9) and render submissive obedience to him in every way (Heb. 5:9). They see belief and worship as something derived from our history and culture; that human leaders have set the standards for the church. They specifically deny that there is a standard or pattern to which we must conform. They can adapt their message and worship to meet the felt needs and demands of society. They feel comfortable in allowing or doing things Scripture specifically forbids such as placing women in positions of public leadership in the church (I Cor. 14:33-34).

These examples demonstrate that although these two groups of people both call themselves Churches of Christ, they clearly are different in important and significant ways. In fact they represent two different kinds of churches; one divine, the other human; one guided by Scripture, the other by the will of man. Just as counterfeit money looks remarkably like genuine money, so the churches of the change movement appear to the unsuspecting to be Churches of Christ, but their similarity is only surface and their value is no more than that of a counterfeit bill. Christ built but one church (Matt. 16:18); He has “but one body” (I Cor. 12:20). Although counterfeits may exist and even flourish in our midst, they will not stand the inspection of the Great Judge of all (Matt. 7:21-23).

John Waddey

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John Waddey
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October 20 2003, 4:18 AM 

This is a valid question that millions of folks have pondered. To help put it in focus ask yourself: Is one medicine as good as another? Or one doctor? Is one car as good as another? Or one airline? When you are traveling, is one direction as good as another? When balancing your checking account is one answer as good as another? Is one political candidate as good as another? Is one school as good as another? Is a counterfeit bill as good as a genuine piece of currency? Or a forged check of equal value with a good one? Of course, the answer to all of these questions is no. One is not necessarily as good as the other; in many cases one is downright inferior or even worthless.

Only in the realm of religion would we even consider such a statement to have any merit. In any other area, to affirm that one thing is as good as another would cause us to be laughed off the platform. Christ purchased a church (Acts 20:28); he built a church (Matt. 16:18); he is savior of a church (Eph. 5:23); he is head of a church (Eph. 1:22). That church is undisputedly of ultimate value and benefit to all who become members of it. New Testament writers speak of it as an exclusive, unitary church. They call it "the" church. They tell us there is one body or church (Eph. 4:4-5). Across the centuries, men and women have established hundreds of churches of their own design and making. Who would say that any one of them is of equal value with that church which Christ built? Christ's church existed long before any human denomination, sect or cult was created. Our eternal destiny depends on our being members of the church which is God's saved family (Eph. 5:23). It behooves us therefore to be members of that church which Christ built. Paul referred to this body when writing to the Romans, saying, "All the churches (i.e., congregations) of Christ salute you" (Rom. 16:16). No other church is equal in value to that of Christ.

John Waddey

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John Waddey
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November 29 2003, 2:00 AM 

There are churches on every hand; all kinds of churches: Catholic, Protestant and others, big churches, fancy churches, small and plain churches. Let me tell you about a very unusual church THAT HAS:

• No rock bands or professional entertainers; just simple worship to God with hymns and spiritual songs sung by all (Ephesians 5:19).

• No showmen or comedians; just plain, ordinary Christian teachers who preach God's Word to those assembled (II Timothy 4:1-2).

• No cathedrals, or temples; just plain, functional meeting houses in which to worship and serve the Lord.

• No magicians or "miracle" workers; just normal, intelligent Christians doing the will and work of Christ in the church and in the community. Helping the poor, ministering to the ill and doing good in the name of Christ.

• No denominational structure or government; just congregations meeting, conducting their own business, choosing their own leaders and serving God as they understand Scripture to direct.

• No human founder to honor or follow, no human doctrinal system to believe or obey; just disciples honoring Christ by believing in him as God's Son and obeying his will as revealed in his New Testament.

• No sectarian or denominational names to be known by; just members who are called Christians (I Peter 4:16) and congregations called "Churches of Christ" (Romans 16:16).

• No political agendas or involvement; just Christians working to promote a kingdom, "not of this world" (John 18:36), who pray for kings and all in high places (I Timothy 2:1-2) but do not try to manipulate or control government.

"WHAT A STRANGE AND UNUSUAL CHURCH; I can't imagine such," you may say. To see just such an unusual church, visit The Church of Christ near you.

John Waddey

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Elmer LaRue
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December 5 2003, 7:55 AM 

John,thanks to you for an apt discription of the Lord's church. I have read after you for the past several years and enjoy the plain gospel teaching that eminates from you brother.If memory serves me [and it doesn't always] I have attended a few meetings or lectureships in which you participated.Thanks again and keep up the good work. Yours in Christ. Elmer LaRue

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Stephen R Armstrong
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Brother beware

December 5 2003, 2:42 PM 

Wonderful article, but if we are not careful the church as we know it, the church of the scripture, will change before our very eyes, just like the soceity we grew up in is gone, all in the name of progress and tolerance. Contemporary praise and worship services for our young people - fellowship with groups such as Promise Keepers & denominational groups, acceptance of alternative lifestyles. As God is the same yesterday, today, and forever, so shall the church of Christ be the same in the eyes of Jesus, our Lord. I just pray that we continue to be that church and not change with the times. One thing is for sure, those of us that see unscriptural changes coming in our local church and say nothing, will pay the price, eternally! May God give us the strength and courage to stand with him and His Word. Come apart from the world or you will come apart!

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John Waddey
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December 6 2003, 5:22 AM 

Many brethren are like the man from Missouri: They won't believe a report until they have seen with their own eyes. When we warn brethren that apostasy is sweeping our brotherhood under the guise of changing us, many folks just can't believe it. I sometimes wonder just what it would take to persuade them. You who doubt the report, I ask to consider the following:

• If you knew for a fact that some preachers are teaching that sinners can be saved by grace before and even without baptism for forgiveness of sins;
• If you visited congregations of our people who are using women to lead in public worship, teach adult classes with men present and even preach from their pulpits;
• If you observed congregations of the Church of Christ participating Billy Graham Crusades;
• If you could see congregations mixing the Lord's Supper with a common meal;
• If you visited a sister congregation engaged in special Easter and Christmas services;
• If you attended a class or service in a church of Christ where instrumental music accompanied the singing of hymns;
• If you heard with your own ears gospel preachers teaching that the Churches of Christ are really just another denominational body, that we were founded by Alexander Campbell;
• If you could read the words of Christian teachers advocating that we should fellowship denominational churches since they are acceptable to Christ;
• If you heard preachers ridicule and reproach the deceased great heroes of our brotherhood and downplay their achievements:
• If you saw with your own eyes congregations torn asunder by promoters of change and houses of worship built and paid for by brethren who opposed all of the above stealthily taken by false brethren;
• If you knew that some Christian Universities founded and funded by our people are now promoting all of the above;

Would you be convinced that great and serious problems have befallen the Lord's Church in our day? With deep regret I must tell you that such is in fact the case. Furthermore unless we act quickly and decisively the tidal wave of error may well sweep everything before it. I implore you not to stop your ears and close your eyes to the dangers we face. Every faithful man and woman is needed to help preserve the blessed church of our Lord Jesus.

John Waddey

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Donnie Cruz
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"The Community Church Movement"

September 6 2005, 4:42 AM 

The Community Church Movement

The community church movement has grown out of a denominational background. The chief models are the Willow Creek Community Church in Illinois and the Saddleback Community Church in California. The textbook for the movement is The Purpose Driven Church by Rick Warren. Some of the characteristics of community churches, are the following:

  1. Contemporary music. At Willow Creek a pop singer has replaced the choir, and a 10-piece rock band has replaced the organ.

  2. Eliminating denominational names. Most community churches are disguised denominations, that is, they still hold to Baptist or Methodist creeds and teachings, but the name has been changed. As this movement has infiltrated churches of Christ, the name church of Christ has been diminished or eliminated.

  3. Casual emphasis in worship, both in style and dress.

  4. Different kind of leadership model rather than elders who have authority.

  5. Praise teams and entertainment orientation in worship.

  6. A greater emphasis on “self”, including one’s own feelings and emotions.

  7. De-emphasis on doctrine, and among churches of Christ, an emphasis of the restoration plea.

  8. A market-driven program, that is, striving to provide what people want or what they are seeking, rather than what God says they need.

Concern Even in the Denominational World

In his book, Ashamed of the Gospel, John MacArthur writes against the “market-driven” approach to religion. Here is how he describes the philosophy behind the community church movement: “Provide non-Christians with an agreeable, inoffensive environment. Give them freedom, tolerance, and anonymity. Always be positive and benevolent. If you must have a sermon, keep it brief and amusing. Don’t be preachy or authoritative. Above all, keep everyone entertained. Churches following this pattern will see numerical growth, we’re assured; those that ignore it are doomed to decline” (pp. 45-46). “Preaching—particularly preaching about sin, righteousness, and judgment—is too confrontive to be truly satisfying. The church must learn to couch the truth in ways that amuse and entertain” (p. 23). In contrast to such a philosophy of preaching that entertains, the Bible commands preaching that convicts the heart and moves the sinner to repentance (Matthew 4:17; Luke 13:3; Acts 17:30; 26:20; 20:21; 2 Corinthians 5:9-10; Acts 24:25 “And as he was discussing righteousness, self-control and the judgment to come”).

  • Please note that we can preach the truth, urge people to repent, expose error and still greet people in a warm and friendly manner. Jesus ate with sinners and continued to preach the truth. We can make people feel welcome, but we are making a mistake if we want them to avoid any discomfort at all. The Word of God will naturally cause any sinner to feel uncomfortable at times (Hebrews 4:12; John 16:8; Acts 2:37). Remember, life is not about avoiding discomfort.

  • People who wanted sinners to feel no discomfort were labeled as false prophets in times past, (Isaiah 30:10; Jeremiah 8:11). Spiritual growth many times requires being convicted and being uncomfortable (Matthew 5:3-4).

An Old Problem

In his book, MacArthur quotes often from the 19th century Baptist preacher Charles Haddon Spurgeon. Spurgeon was probably the most well known denominational preacher of his time. He became concerned with what he saw as a “down-grade”, meaning that he saw faith going downhill (we would say the “slippery-slope”). The Downgrade controversy began with Spurgeon’s publication of two anonymous articles by a fellow Baptist, which lament trends away from biblical fundamentals, compromises with the world, and the unwillingness of even otherwise orthodox preachers to oppose those whose soundness was questionable. He saw evangelicals using entertainment as a tool for church growth, and he believed that was subverting the church’s priorities. He feared that frivolous diversions and carnal amusements in the church would eventually destroy people’s appetites for real worship and preaching of God’s Word. Paul seems to have described the same worldly attitude in 2 Timothy 4:3, and Isaiah saw the same problem among his contemporaries (Isaiah 30:9). We need to remember that there is another kind of “worldliness” besides drinking and fornicating. It is the worldly desire to be seen as sophisticated, to fit in, to no longer be different, to be viewed as “cool”, “hip”, “on the cutting edge,” and on what the world would call “a winning team” (Romans 12:1-2). Indifference toward doctrine is only one step away from indifference to immorality (Romans 1:23-24).

Among Liberal Churches

Various schools supported by liberal churches of Christ are known to be promoting the Community Church, these are Abilene Christian University, Harding University, Oklahoma Christian University, Lipscomb University, and Pepperdine University. The Downtown Church, the joint world of the Highland Church of Christ, and Harding Graduate School of Religion, has borrowed from denominationalism by employing the use of a praise team to replace the song leader, the clapping of hands during the singing; the presence of icons in worship, and testimonials from the congregation. Other practices that are usually associated with the movement in liberal churches are, drama presentations, observing religious holidays, dedicating babies, children’s worship, and the adoption of instrumental music in worship.

False Compassion

Even when these churches arise in the denominational world, the philosophy often is that the mainline group isn’t warm or compassionate towards unbelievers. Doug Varnado, preacher for the Hendersonville Community Church, was recently forced out as a faulty member at David Lipscomb University because where he serves began employing, on a periodic basis, recorded instrumental music in worship. In an interview he noted, “It’s unimportant if the church adds instrumental music on occasion. More important, is a faith community that shows compassion for people seeking God at the end of the 20th century”. The trouble with this statement, and others that seek to downgrade doctrinal matters, is that true compassion means truly bringing people out of darkness into God’s light, which includes God’s view of things, including how He wants to be worshipped.

  • Often people will try to justify the absence of any doctrinal or convicting preaching by saying that they want people to feel comfortable in the assembly and eventually these topics will be addressed. First, I have found that once one adopts this attitude, those topics never get addressed, for there is never a “convenient time” once you have bought into the idea that people should always feel comfortable (2 Timothy 4:2).

  • True compassion means recognizing the facts that a person is lost, that they believe things that are false, and that until those issues are addressed, they can’t be saved (Acts 17:22ff; 3:14). It is noteworthy, that Jesus didn’t put-off confronting people with what stood between them and eternal life (Mark 10:21).

The Name

Various liberal congregations have dropped the designation “church of Christ”, arguing that people are turned off by such terms. But such a name is Biblical (Romans 16:16). I have found that dropping the name virtually equals dropping what the name represents, that is, the church that is following Christ, New Testament Christianity, and the church that Jesus founded. Secondly, such is a deceptive practice. It is better to be honest and upfront with people, than try to lure them in under false pretenses ( 1 Peter 2:1 “putting away all guile”).

Targeting Your Audience

Far from going out and trying to save everyone (Mark 16:15), the community church movement often targets a select group of people whom they are trying to attract. MacArthur notes, “Why do you suppose nearly all the user-friendly churches identify their ‘target market’ as young suburban professionals and other moneyed groups? Why are so few of these churches targeting the poor and inner city? The answer may be obvious. One leading pastor in the movement says, ‘A pastor can define his appropriate target audience by determining with whom he would like to spend a vacation or an afternoon of recreation’. It would be hard to imagine a ministry philosophy more at odds with the Word of God than that” (p. 126). Paul actually found that “suburban professionals”, rejected the truth (1 Corinthians 1:26; Matthew 11:5).

False Growth

Willow Creek, which is held up as the model of church growth, recently did an internal audit, in which they found that only 2% of their growth consisted of new converts. The rest of the people simply came from other churches in the area. MacArthur observes, “User-friendly, entertainment-oriented, market-driven, pragmatic churches will probably continue to flourish for a while. Unfortunately, however, the whole movement is based on current fashion and therefore cannot last long. When the fickle winds finally change, one of three things may happen. These churches will fall out of vogue and wane; or they will opt to change with the spirit of the age and very likely abandon any semblance of biblical Christianity; or they will see the need to rebuild on a more sure foundation” (p. 188). (See Acts 17:21; Ephesians 4:14). Such congregations have made the mistake of giving people what they think they need, instead of what God says they need. “Those who advocate a contemporary style of worship tell us that if we want success and growth in the church, and if we want to keep our young people, we must do things in new and different ways. But, consider this: When the ‘new’ wears off and the ‘different’ becomes customary, what happens then?” (The Spiritual Sword, October 2000, p. 27) . One cry that was heard in the denominations and is being heard in liberal churches today is that “We are bored” with the same old songs, prayers, and preaching, but people also become bored with entertainment as well. People were bored with the Olympics, claim to be bored by the present World Series and so on. The truth of the matter is, as long as one is selfish, eventually everything will seem boring to you. I like the following comment: “Instead of attempting to renovate worship for our own benefit, what we need to do is cultivate our appetites for pure, New Testament worship (John 4:24; Habakkuk 2:20)” (p. 27).


Mark Dunagan/Beaverton Church of Christ/503-644-9017

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(Login Senotonom205)

Re: "The Community Church Movement"

September 7 2005, 2:55 AM 

Ahh, We are so good at taking what believe is the translation of biblical text and making it what want it to say. We as Church of Christ members have the audacity to claim we are the only non-denominal church, and we say that all these community churches are just denominations in disguise? Hmm well i would argue that we are nothing more than a denomination in disguise. I love the arrogance that you all have to believe that our church is the orginal church formed at Pentacost as if our ways of thinking are directly from the bible. What you should all do is spend some time studying the path of Christianity from Palestine, to Italy, To Turkey, To England and eventually to the United States and then maybe you would realize that Church of Christ is simply an offshoot of a thought process that has been carried down. Im sure that many of you would claim that Martin Luther was some sort of Anti-Christ yet without him there would be no Church of Christ. I am a Member of a Church of Christ but im not as arrogant as all of you to believe that my translation of the Text is the right way. First off you all read the KJV. Im not sure if you intellegent concerned members know but the original texts were Written in Greek which I have studied and I can Assure you that the KJV is far from accurate, But im sure you just as arrogant as to believe that your bible is the Real one and the Greek that Paul wrote in is some sort of language of Satin. Also you fail to even investigate any circumstances for the text of the bible. Do you honestly believe that everything written in the NT was focused for your biblical doctrine?? Im sure many of you cannot even name one of the Apostolic Fathers who helped to form the bible. By the way did you know that the Holy Canon which was not finalized till 325AD was formed by Constantine who just happened to be the first to form the Universal church also known as Catholic....Uh Oh i bet that throws a Kink in your exclusiveness. Im sure you will throw some poorly translated Texts at me in response to this and carry on thinking that your way is the right way but your Way is Dying. It is dying as your generation Ages and within 50 Years you will only be looked on as Extremists in christianity. You people fill the same Role that Radical Islamists do in Muslim Relgion. But that doesnt matter does it they are all satanists anyway. Enjoy passing misguided judgement, and please respond telling me about how Liberal Professors are filling my head with this "Knowledge Stuff." Continue to be Uneducated so that when you spew your Ignorant banter the educated of the world will simply shake their heads and just excuse your actions. Im sure this wont even get posted but its ok because if a Moderator reads it I will be happy. Im sure God is very happy with you right now because you have taken his will and made it fit into your idea of religion. Enjoy

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Dr. Bill Crump
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Re: "The Community Church Movement" (Christian Scholar)

September 7 2005, 11:34 AM 

Christian Scholar's post seems more of an attack on the King James Bible than discussing the Community Church Movement as such. Very well, Christian Scholar claims to have studied Greek and therefore contends that the King James translation of the New Testament is "far from accurate." I would therefore ask the following of Christian Scholar:

1. What specific Greek New Testament edition (Traditional Text [Textus Receptus, Received Text], Critical Text, etc.) did Christian Scholar use as a comparison to draw his/her conclusion?

2. Since the King James Bible provides a literal, word-for-word translation of the Greek New Testament (formal equivalence translation), let Christian Scholar produce at least twelve New Testament passages (or many more if desired) which clearly demonstrate the most profound of alleged inaccuracies of the King James translation. Let the proof be so clear that we cannot do anything but discard our KJVs.

3. Since it is obvious that Christian Scholar rejects the KJV, let him/her not only recommend a specific New Testament translation which is allegedly the most accurate and reliable when compared with the Greek, but also cite ample reasons for this recommendation.

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(no login)

Re: "The Community Church Movement" (Christian Scholar)

September 8 2005, 8:32 PM 


He won't be able to. This is part of the "brain washing" that is occuring at these "mega churches" to try and keep their congregations from understanding exactly how far off the path they have travelled.

You's a simple issue. First, they make you feel all warm and cozy. THEN they discredit ANYTHING that disagees with their stance (a legitimate translation of the Bible) so you are left to trust only them (who are led by the Holy Spirit but not the Then the leaders will let you know which PARTS of each translation they agree with. How else will they keep you from the truth? They certainly don't want you to think for yourself.

It is so sad and such a well-known tactic for cults. What surpises me is how many adults fall for it. The Catholics have used it for the point that most of their members do not own a Bible, much less have ever studied one.

However, our Christian Scholar does NOT come across as one that is very knowledgeable about Greek/Hebrew or he would know that his comments are erroneous and go against any decent Greek scholar. He wouls also know more about the history of the KJV and how many different scholars were involved. He would know that the versions agreed to by these Mega Churches were not translated by Greek Scholars from the original text, but were "culturized" by present day evangalists to make the Bible easier to understand. More bluntly, they were written by poor biblical preachers who didn't like what the original text said (or how it was said) and made up a version that in NO WAY can relate back to the original Greek version.

Our scholar is also very unaware of the history of the Church as it moved across Italy into Europe and then America. He would know that the C of C and other divisions did survive throughout the centuries and were persecuted by the Catholics for their refusal to disobey the Gospels and follow the Pope. He would know that these Churches were almost identical to today's "mainstream" smaller church of Christs. He would also know that the Mega Chruch issue has been debated for centuries and has always been a problem every 150 years or so with the younger generations. This is not a "new" issue nor are their ideas of entertainment "new".

What our scholar fails to realize is that he is speaking to those who are aware of the history of the Church and are very much aware of the issues behind certain translations. He really should have read this website better before posting. Its sad to say, but I do discredit his understanding of Greek text...for his hypothesis is very "immature" and his understanding of the KJV is weak.

I feel this is just an attempt to express anger at people who threaten his "internal dialogue" and beliefs.

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...........................THE BOOK

What Happened at the Madison Church of Christ?

There are thousands of churches being taken over across America.

This book is only about one of those churches. It's about the Madison Church Of Christ. By studying the methods used here along with the resource references you might be able to inoculate your church. At the very least you will recognize the signs early on.

Many of the current members of the Madison Church of Christ still don't know what happened.
Some never will know! This book is for them as well.

Madison Church of Christ was a 60 year old church. At one time it was one of the largest churches in the US, and the largest Church of Christ.

It thrived for many years on the vision of it's elders and those of it's ministers. Those visions undoubtably came from the the inspired word of Jesus Christ.

At sometime in the last 10 years there was a deliberate plan by a majority of the elders to take the Madison Church of Christ into a more worldly realm.

They used secrecy, covert planning, and outside sources to scheme and to change the format and direction of the Madison Church of Christ.

The Elders knew that the membership would never approve such a plan. Using the tools of the "Community Church Movement"(consultants, books, seminars, meetings,planters,seeders) they slowly started initiating change so it was never noticed by the members until it was too late.....

At the heart of the plan was the fact that old members were going to be driven off so new techniques could be used to go out and reach the unchurched through new "Contemporary Holy Entertainment" methods developed by the "Community Church Movement"

Old members had to be kept on board long enough to get their plans ready, or the funds would not be there to pay for the new building. So by the plans very nature, it had to be secret.

The church had no plan in effect to renew or approve elders. There was never any need. The elders had always been "as approved by God". 10 of the last 15 elders would begin to shed some doubt on that.

The Elders did not even need a majority at first, because some of the elders went along unwittingly.

This edition starts shortly after some of the members begin to smell something strange in January 2001. Later editions may go back and fill in some of the timeline.

To even start to understand whats happening here, you must read the background materials in the first of the book.

This is only the first edition, and not the end. New editions will be printed as needed. To keep abreast of current changes, please visit our web site;

Here is the list of players;

5 Godly Elders
10 Not so Godly Elders
120 "Deacons" (allegiance unknown)
2,800 - 4,000 church "members"
2 "teners" (people who have publicly confessed to have broken all ten commandments)
Unknown number of "sinners" (This is what the 10 elders call us.)
Unknown number of "demons" (Flying everywhere, to many to count)

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