Dr. Bill Crump (no login) from IP address 207.69.50.152
In order to “mark” or identify change agents or those in sympathy with the change movement, we must first realize that the changes are designed to make the postmodern church more acceptable to the world at large. Thus, those who formerly shunned the Rock-solid “old paths” of the Gospel will now more readily fill church seats, and these churches will “grow.” We must also realize that these change agents/sympathizers (hereafter simply referred to as “change agents”) will most rabidly defend their cause and will take great offense at Bible-based opponents who challenge their unbiblical agenda.
Having diligently studied the changing church and the Church Growth Movement (CGM) for more than two years, I’ve observed that the change agents have devised a small arsenal of “weapons” for use against criticism and exposure from the biblically discerning:
1. Change agents may deny having any knowledge of the term “change agent” and may further manipulate themselves to appear as the undeserving, innocent victims of “abuse” from Bible-based “bullies.” This elicits sympathy from undiscerning, passive observers and paints the strong opponents as cruel and heartless.
Someone obviously in sympathy with the change movement once responded in this manner: “I don’t know who are the CGM change agents you are talking about. I am a Christian. I do not represent anyone or speak for anyone, any more than you representing anyone or speaking for anyone, or do you think you do?”
2. Attempting to shame their opponents into silence, change agents may hurl all manner of unsavory terms against them. The most common of these include “judgmental,” “intolerant,” “unloving,” “unchristian,” “divisive,” “uncooperative,” “legalists,” “gossips,” “slanderers,” and “troublemakers.”
In taking issue with the principles of the Concerned Members.com web site (thus implying allegiance with the change movement), someone typically responded with, “Talking behind people's backs and gossipping [sic] and slandering them is no way to conduct your life as a Christian.” Ordinarily, that’s definitely true. According to change agents, however, ANY criticism of their unbiblical agenda is considered gossip and slander. This is totally at odds with commands from Scripture to expose those who promote false doctrines.
3. Change agents may use ridicule, sarcasm, and character assassinations against their opponents.
In a typical response to Bible-based criticisms against Rick Warren’s purpose-driven books, someone once stated, “Your observation is warped. Let those who have read the book form their own impression about the book, and form their opinion about you…Are you playing with a full deck? Does your elevator go all the way to the top floor? You tell me.”
4. Change agents may assert that, as long as you love everybody and have a “heart” for Jesus, everything else is disputable. This implies that biblical doctrine is disputable and that Bible-based criticisms from opponents are invalid. Everything is reduced to one opinion against another, preference against preference. The only absolute truth in this reasoning is that there is no absolute truth.
Responding to a Bible-based opponent of the change movement, one person stated, “It is the Love we have for one another that Jesus affirmed in prayer to His Father that is the identifying mark of His Disciples, not our music, our theology, our passion for the truth. Our Love for One another.” This is most revealing, for it closely mimics a statement that Rick Warren makes on page 124 in his book, “The Purpose-Driven Life”: “Jesus said our love for each other - not our doctrinal beliefs - is our greatest witness to the world.” This is a clear example of misusing Scripture to downplay strong biblical doctrine (and its supporters).
5. Using diversion tactics, change agents may skirt the issue and imply that their opponents’ time would be better utilized in benevolent activities rather than in pursuing “irrelevant” debates.
When asked if she was aware of the Concerned Members.com web site and what it represented, one woman, a member of a church that embraced the CGM, blew it off with the remark that she was too busy feeding the hungry and clothing the naked to investigate it further. Being involved in benevolence is a Christian virtue, but we cannot use that as an excuse to remain blinded to and tolerant of those who would introduce false doctrine into our midst.
There may be other weapons employed, but the ones discussed above are those which I have seen most commonly in use. I invite other Christian opponents of the change movement to share the experiences that they have had in dealing with change agents. Christian opponents of the change movement must never resort to the same tactics with which change agents often respond to Bible-based challenges. That only gives the change agents the edge. Christian opponents must continue to thwart unbiblical doctrine with the Bible Itself, using the very Word of God as a Shield.
The church needs to change if it's going to last,
We can't hold tenaciously to beliefs of the past.
If to the masses we're going to appeal,
We'll have to preach "grace only," love, and certainly zeal.
But do not preach against dancin' and drinkin'
That type of preaching is yesterday's thinkin'
Discuss philosophy and weight loss—quote notable PhD's
Baby-boomers delight to hear from people with degrees!
Women preachers—once forbidden—to the ladies you must cater.
After all, everyone knows that Paul was just a woman hater.
And kids need separate worship—traditional church is too dry.
"Give us entertainment and frolic," our spoiled teenagers cry.
The NIV is our version of choice, because it's so easy to read.
Forget that it's rank and ripe with Calvinistic creed.
Give us some actors, some drama, please—they liven the worship hour.
We're tired of Bible thumpin' sermons that leave us bored and sour.
We need a smooth preacher—one that never offends.
He better make us happy—on this his job depends!
His sermons should be short and cute; but his doctrine need not be true,
Cause doctrine changes with the times (I heard that at ACU).
A minister to youngsters—they need our attention.
He'll take them to Disney World, and, oh, did I mention,
They must be entertained, and be sure to water down the truth,
Lest they leave and join themselves to the Baptist or Methodist Youth.
Give me "Image" or "Wineskins," now that's good stuff.
Even if bereft of scripture and filled with religious fluff.
I hate "Contending For The Faith;" "Firm Foundation," I won't read.
I like articles written by Max Lucado, and some by Michael Weed.
Now the really progressive minds attend the Jubilee.
I saw Rubel there, and he wants to know, "Where'd you get your PhD?"
There's my hero—Rubel Shelly, along with his protege Steve Flatt,
Rubel's chair is empty—I'll sit here, and proudly say, "I sat where Rubel sat."
Now where am I? There's lots of folks here. It must be Judgement Day.
The Lord is talking—I think it's to me, "Excuse me, What did you say?"
The words I hear are sobering—to me they seem so strange,
For the Lord is sternly asking me, "Who said my church needed change?"
____________________________________ Lynn Parker
--used by permission PLUMBLINE -- Editor, Wayne Coats
Vol. 4, No. 5, Dec. 1999
This message has been edited by ConcernedMembers from IP address 67.32.223.10 on Mar 7, 2004 2:04 PM
I really believe that it is a mistake to use ridicule and sarcasm, whether in prose or poetry, to thwart the Church Growth Movement and its change agents. Although the facts summarized in "Agent's View a Raving Change" are undisputable to the biblically discerning, the tone used to convey those facts is clearly laced with sarcasm and ridicule. We need not stoop to that level.
I can only recommend challenging the CGM and its change agents in a straightforward manner, using the Word of God and dignity.
The Hebrews in Zephaniah's days were a "nation that (had) no shame" (Zeph. 2:1). Jeremiah rebuked them saying, "they were not at all ashamed, neither could they blush" (Jer. 6:15). Today we have working among us a movement of men who are determined to impose their unscriptural changes upon the Lord's church. They are men with no shame. Like all other apostates before them they are not willing to walk away and start their own congregations, build their own buildings, found their own schools and other good works. They have a different plan.
They are not ashamed:
To operate under the false pretense that they are faithful members of the Church of Christ when all the while they are working to undermine and destroy her, to lead away disciples after them (Acts 20: 30).
To use deceit to snatch away a building from those who built and paid for it. Captured meeting houses are like trophies in war. Possession of them saves years of work and thousands, even millions of dollars. They provide a cloak of respectability to those who are operate out of them. They shrewdly keep their purposes veiled until they have gave sufficient power to claim the property. Such is a form of legal theft.
To speak disrespectfully of great servants of God who blazed the trail and paved the road before them. Such ingratitude is wicked.
To turn their backs on pure Biblical Christianity for a cheap imitation created by men.
To publicly teach doctrines contrary to God's Word. The most glaring examples being that salvation is by grace alone (Heb. 5:9) and that baptism is but a declaration of ones salvation (Acts 22:16), and that women may fill roles of public leadership in the church regardless of Paul's prohibition (I Cor. 14:33-34).
To pervert the Word of God to justify their new beliefs and programs. The whole idea of "a new hermeneutic" is to allow them to justify beliefs and practices that are contrary to the divine Word.
To sow discord and division among God's people. Before this movement reaches its zenith their will be broken churches throughout the land and a broken brotherhood. Such division God hates (Prov. 6:16-19).
To exchange the church Jesus for which died; the one he built and is head of; for an honorable seat among their denominational neighbors. Before they can be accepted in those circles they must renounce the unique and exclusive nature of the church which Christ built. When that is done what they have left is not a church that belongs to Christ
May those brethren who are acting so shamelessly renounce their schemes for imposing changes on the church and humbly ask the Master for forgiveness before they face Him in judgment and their shameful deeds condemn them.
It is becoming all too clear faithful churches are losing the battle for souls. Men brethren what shall we do? I believe that those who are able should hold open debates to publicly critisize and expose false teaching. When one teaches in error unknowingly they should be quietly corrected, however when one teaches error willfully they should be corrected publicly and the false teaching be made a specticle in light of God's Word. It seems as though many faithful churches have and are becoming less zealous. Let us take examples from the Bible, reformers, and restorers. Often in the past when heresies crept in and corrupted God's people little to nothing was done until it became a large problem. What we are experiencing is not something that occured over night but through active preaching of God's Word with prayer and fasting I am more than confident that we can endure and overcome this greavous time.
I don't know that "traditional" churches of Christ will survive. If my assumptions are correct, the majority of churches of Christ are aging and growing smaller. Many of the younger people are leaving the church either by going to denominations or leaving the faith completely.
The Churches of Christ that are growing are following the megachurch-Willow Creek methodology (Oak Hill, Madison, etc). that's where the younger generations are going.
Re: Will churches of Christ survive? (John, June 1 2004, 1:16 PM)
June 3 2004, 6:58 AM
John, I believe that there will always be brethren who will persevere till the end. II Peter 1 states: “[10] Wherefore the rather, brethren, give diligence to make your calling and election sure: for if ye do these things, ye shall never fall: [11] For so an entrance shall be ministered unto you abundantly into the everlasting kingdom of our Lord and Saviour Jesus Christ.” [KJV]
Much of the problem with church youth has to do with teachings coming from denominational sources and charismatic influences—and the root of the problem stems from the fact that the eldership in many a congregation is not scripture-literate and has allowed this problem to compound. Furthermore, many “novice” elders and “young” preachers and “YOUTH MINISTERS” [perhaps, the culprit] have been greatly influenced and mentored by prominent change agents operating in the brotherhood. [I agree with Brian Morgan that we need to “mark” these agents and “expose” their false teachings. I think that this website is doing just that more and more.]
In regard to mega churches following the Saddleback/Willow Creek “Community Church” methodology, I agree with your assessment of where the younger generations are going. It remains to be seen if Oak Hills in Texas will outnumber the 16,000-member Saddleback Community Church in California. Oak Hills has dropped the name “of Christ” from how the church is to be identified. Max Lucado has revised and improved upon the scriptural design and purpose of baptism—just one of several doctrinal issues! The church’s worship schedule (as approved by its elders, of course) includes “South Room Services with musical instruments during this Service” at 10:00 and again at 11:30. I guess, we’ll just have to wait when someone tells us that, as a result, many members are seeking fellowship somewhere else.
In Madison’s case, when the “WORSHIP LEADER” [a “spiritual” leader who “leads the regular members into the presence of God”] and the PRAISE TEAM [a.k.a. “Church of Christ” choir] performances were phased in, many faithful brethren were alienated and felt [or made to feel] compelled to seek fellowship with those of kindred minds and spirit elsewhere. The 1500-1700 combined worship attendance now is nothing to brag about, when compared to the 3100+ count not too long ago. (Don’t be fooled by their excuse now that “numbers don’t count—fellowship does.” Yet, no one will argue the fact that great fellowship at Madison always abounded anyway, especially during the Ira North era.) Again, the numerical growth expected after the “upheaval” at Madison remains to be seen.
Here's the real question: Do you feel like the churches of Christ will be a viable fellowship of Christians 100 years from now? Based on the current demographics of the churches (as I put it in my first post), I just can't see how they will survive.
Read Matt 10:32 and Romans 8 for starters. If the Church remains faithful to Christ how can it fail?
There are congregations in my locale that are growing from 3 areas which God has provided.
1. The unchurched. (those that the CGM says a traditional church cannot bring in)
2. New people in the community.
3. Those who grew tired of gimmicks, or were "beat up" by CGM churches.
About number 3.
Many are finding that the gimmicks that become more and more bold at the CGM churches are only efforts to create "buzz" to get more "unchurched" in the door. What they are in reality doing is getting those going from one CGM church to another to see what the "buzz" is about.
Question: “Do you feel like the churches of Christ will be a viable fellowship of Christians 100 years from now?”
Answer: Yes, of course! Again, I’m quoting II Peter 1— “[11] Wherefore the rather, brethren, give diligence to make your calling and election sure: for if ye do these things, ye shall never fall: [11] For so an entranc e shall be ministered unto you abundantly into the everlasting kingdom of our Lord and Saviour Jesus Christ.” [KJV] The kingdom (church) of Christ [on earth] referred to in Matthew 16, will be the same kingdom of Christ when the end comes. So, here’s another passage that speaks of the body of believers, the “called out,” that will endure to the end. I Corinthians 15: “[23] . . . afterward they that are Christ's at his coming. [24] Then cometh the end, when he shall have delivered up the kingdom to God, even the Father; when he shall have put down all rule and all authority and power.”
The passages clearly indicate that so long as [and there will be] members of this body remain steadfast, the church will survive. And 100 years from now—is a great question to wonder about. If history were to repeat itself, we need not look beyond some 100 years ago when the church was plagued by musical instrument and other issues. Per religious census officially separating the Christian Churches (instrumentalists, the “progressives”) which lopsidedly outnumbered the “remnants”—the churches of Christ (the “conservatives”), the memberships have reversed through the decades since 1906. The same could happen again. Even with the prominent change agents (the Maxists and the Rubelites) operating in the brotherhood, decrying the church with their culture-driven gimmicks to transform, conquer and control—the church will prevail.
Do you think debates are what people want to hear??? You obviously do not understand the problem. People do not want to hear debates, they want to know they are loved. have you ever heard the term that "the CofC shoot their dead"?
Man, get off of your bloody pulpit and start LOVING people. The CofC is dying because we are more concerned with "form and function" and not concerned enough with people. The people will go to other churches and be fed. I am not really concened about that. I am concerned with the attitude that you exhibit. The problem is the attitude, not the form and function.
This post is a clear and perfect example of Weapon #4 (see intial post above) which change agents and their advocates attempt to use against Bible-based opponents of the Change Movement. For those who haven't reviewed Weapon #4, I reproduce it now:
"4. Change agents may assert that, as long as you love everybody and have a “heart” for Jesus, everything else is disputable. This implies that biblical doctrine is disputable and that Bible-based criticisms from opponents are invalid. Everything is reduced to one opinion against another, preference against preference. The only absolute truth in this reasoning is that there is no absolute truth."
"Responding to a Bible-based opponent of the change movement, one person stated, “It is the Love we have for one another that Jesus affirmed in prayer to His Father that is the identifying mark of His Disciples, not our music, our theology, our passion for the truth. Our Love for One another.” This is most revealing, for it closely mimics a statement that Rick Warren makes on page 124 in his book, “The Purpose-Driven Life”: “Jesus said our love for each other - not our doctrinal beliefs - is our greatest witness to the world.” This is a clear example of misusing Scripture to downplay strong biblical doctrine (and its supporters)."
Change agents and their advocates seem to become quite agitated and disturbed over those who stand for absolute biblical Truth, as the semi-anonymous post by "JD" clearly illustrates. Such reasoning erroneously implies that those who stand for such Truth are "unloving" (perhaps even judgmental, intolerant, un-Christian, etc., we've heard it all before). Yet far from desiring to win the approval of the "masses," we will continue to fight for the Truth, exposing doctrinal error as it arises, as we are commanded in Scripture. This process often alienates (weeds out) those who care nothing for pure doctrine, who wish to "worship" according to their own agenda, instead of worshiping biblically "in spirit and in truth."
No, J, like the lie "YOU ARE THE INCREDIBLE SHRINKING CHURCH," is like the other SLANDER that they SHOOT THEIR WOUNDED. Remember?
Unfortunately, the shooters are the same old wounders. Remember?
Except now they are not MINISTERS. Shelly etal have in their postmodern rejection of the Word (and the Worder) invented PROFESSIONAL DEACONS to serve the Ministers-become-masters. They have also invented (I just love this one) Located Missionaries. Or even worthy of Jay Leno: "Located evangelists--meaning located travelling salesmen." That's why they need to tell the beyond- redemption about TITHING to finance a replacement for Jesus: "Musical ministers to lead you into the presence of God." Carol Wimber of the Vineyard (new wineskins and skinners) knows that the 'heavenly feeling' is not from a holy Spirit.
If you are still a "teamster for Jesus" I will tell you that being unable to understand the word BURDEN and REST, the new Prophets, Chanellers and Facilitators from Osburn's ACU and probably ALL once-Christian colleges, have stolen from the owners. This is because Jesus has poked out their eyes and plugged their ears so that they are replacing the bread and water of the free Word with Jonestown KoolAid. And they KNOW it because they are AGENTS who have tried to MOUNT UP TO HEAVEN and the only way down, taught By Judas, is by a short rope from a high place. A high place is a bema: a pulpit. The rostrum is the "towers"which Jesus has torn down along with the SHAQAL or takers of the WAGE. Remember, Paul asked: "Where are the wise" meaning sOPHISts or serpents.
Watch for the truth taught clearly by Jesus which is deliberately perverted: Satan has prepared them by making them into "doctors of the law (pharisees), Scribes (book and song writers) and Hypocrites. Hypocrites are not just missing they mark: they are the SECTARIAN musical and rhetorical performers known as sorcerers and therefore PARASITES. They are eating up the widows's home and kicking them out of her home to make room for the YOUNG PEOPLE who AIN'T gonna swarm to Shelly's VENUE FOR ROCK AND ROLL. The scattered widows in Hohenwald still shed tears in their new church home but blessed are those who weep and WOE to those who care less about the "grey hairs."
I don't know if you all have read this article but it is an great way to expose error. This article is about a science dabate. If there are capeable debaters they should invite several denominational leaders to a similar debate. Christians should correct the sinner with love, but when the sinner openly and willfully teaches wrongfully a harsh rebuke is called for. Note in the article "it is impossible to defend the lie" this is a universal truth. In light of truth the lie is exposed.
In November 2002, Dr. Hovind’s intellectually stimulating presentation on Creation Science humiliated Temple University professor, Dr. Richard Weisenburg before an audience of five hundred. After the debate, Dr. Weisenburg said that he was “warned by his colleagues”, but decided to be the “sacrificial lamb.” Stephen White of Soldiers For Christ said, “The Evolution Hoax was unmasked during this debate and we are ready to do it again.”
“These professors who teach evolution are starting to use common sense, for it is impossible to defend the lie that humans evolved from a rock,” said Michael Marcavage of REPENT AMERICA.
Perhaps to escape humiliation, the following professors decided to refrain from defending “scientific evolution” in a formal debate with Dr. Kent Hovind:
At the University of Pennsylvania
Anthropology Department: Harold Dibble, Janet Monge, and Robert Schuyler
Biology Department: Arthur Dunham, David Roos, Paul Schmidt, and Paul Sniegowski
Chemistry Department: Ronen Marmorstein and Eric Meggers
Psychology Department: Dorothy Cheney, Paul Rozin, Robert Seyfarth, and Francisco Gilwhite
At Temple University
Anthropology Department: Johathan Friedlaender, Leonard Greenfield, Anthony Ranere,
and Christie Rockwell
Chemistry Department: John Williams
Geology Department: Edwin Anderson and David Grandstaff
Religion Department: John C. Raines
When in 1936 Francisco Franco led his uprising against the Spanish Republic, four columns of soldiers besieged Madrid. When asked how he hoped to capture the capital with so few troops, Gen. Mola responded that he had a “fifth column” within the city who were supporting his efforts. That fifth column were those citizens of the city who were sympathetic to Franco’s rebellion.* With their help the rebels overthrew the government and gained control of the nation. Thus has come down to us the epithet “Fifth Column.”
The church has always been a city under siege by the enemies of Christ. In most generations there has been a fifth column within her walls more than willing to embrace the enemy. We can understand atheists, infidels, hedonists, corrupt and evil sinners of every kind and sectarians who hate the church. The thing that is baffling is that element in our fellowship who hold the church in contempt and devote themselves to her undoing.
Ensconced in many of our Christian Schools and in numerous pulpits of our churches are a band of men who have no sense of loyalty to the Christ or his church. They labor to convince gullible young Christians that the church has failed, that the lessons they have learned are not the message of Christ. They tell them Christ has many churches (denominations) and that good people can be saved without the necessity of baptism. They plant doubts and questions in their minds and sow discontent. They turn younger members against the older leaders of their congregations. They seek to discredit great Christian leaders of past generations. They encourage worldly women to aspire for leadership roles in the public life of the church. They urge brethren to venture out and participate in fellowship activities with other religious bodies who are in competition with Christ. They foment strife in congregations that often results in chaos and division.
While the open and alleged enemies of the church attack from without, this fifth column works to weaken resistence from within. In many cases naive elders and preachers have no idea that these traitors are at work within their congregations. When the conflict finally erupts they are shocked to find that their position has been undermined and they are outnumbered. Their only options are surrender and join them or admit defeat and leave. Wise shepherds know their flock. They inform themselves about problems within and without their congregations. Left unhindered a fifth column can be responsible for the capture of a church by the forces of error.
* Thanks to LaGard Smith for this information (Sodom’s Second Coming, p. 154).
____________________________________ John Waddey, Editor Christianity: Then and Now
E-Mail: johnwaddey@aol.com
This web site is not part of or approved by any Church!
...........................THE BOOK
What Happened At the Madison Church of Christ?
There are thousands of churches being taken over across America.
This book is only about one of those churches. It's about the Madison
Church Of Christ. By studying the methods used here along with the resource
references you might be able to inoculate your church. At the very least
you will recognize the signs early on.
Many of the current members of the Madison Church of Christ still don't
know what happened.
Some never will know! This book is for them as well.
Madison Church of Christ was a 60 year old church. At one time it was
one of the largest churches in the US, and the largest Church of Christ.
It thrived for many years on the vision of it's elders and those of
it's ministers. Those visions undoubtably came from the the inspired word
of Jesus Christ.
At sometime in the last 10 years there was a deliberate plan by a majority
of the elders to take the Madison Church of Christ into a more worldly
realm.
They used secrecy, covert planning, and outside sources to scheme and
to change the format and direction of the Madison Church of Christ.
The Elders knew that the membership would never approve such a plan.
Using the tools of the "Community Church Movement"(consultants, books,
seminars, meetings,planters,seeders) they slowly started initiating change
so it was never noticed by the members until it was too late.....
At the heart of the plan was the fact that old members were going to
be driven off so new techniques could be used to go out and reach the unchurched
through new "Contemporary Holy Entertainment" methods developed by the
"Community Church Movement"
Old members had to be kept on board long enough to get their plans ready,
or the funds would not be there to pay for the new building. So by the
plans very nature, it had to be secret.
The church had no plan in effect to renew or approve elders. There was
never any need. The elders had always been "as approved by God". 10 of the last
15 elders would begin to shed some doubt on that.
The Elders did not even need a majority at first, because some of the
elders went along unwittingly.
This edition starts shortly after some of the members begin to smell
something strange in January 2001. Later editions may go back and fill
in some of the timeline.
To even start to understand whats happening here, you must read the
background materials in the first of the book.
This is only the first edition, and not the end. New editions will be
printed as needed. To keep abreast of current changes, please visit our
web site; http://www.concernedmembers.com/madison
Here is the list of players;
5 Godly Elders
10 Not so Godly Elders
120 "Deacons" (allegiance unknown)
2,800 - 4,000 church "members"
2 "teners" (people who have publicly confessed to have broken all ten
commandments)
Unknown number of "sinners" (This is what the 10 elders call us.)
Unknown number of "demons" (Flying everywhere, to many to count)