In the beginning, there were the Jesus People. They had long hair and short memories and they emerged from the 1960s with a unique fusion of evangelical faith and pop culture. They loved fellowship, but didn't like frumpy churches. They trusted their feelings, not traditions. They loved the Bible, but not those old hymnals. So they started writing, performing, recording and selling songs. The Contemporary Christian Music industry was born.
And, lo, the counterculture became a corporate culture, one that was increasingly competitive and relentlessly contemporary, constantly striving to photocopy cultural trends. Out in the mega-churches, the definition of "worship" changed and then kept changing -- Sunday after Sunday.
Even though this industry "makes claims for musical diversity among its ranks, it is primarily a reflection of current folk, pop and rock styles," noted veteran pop musician Charlie Peacock, speaking at a recent conference on "Music and the Church" at Baylor University in Waco, Texas. "Even today's successful modern worship music is composed of these and does not have a distinct style of its own."
The "bandwidth" of worship music today is actually quite narrow, he said, even if black gospel and "urban" music is included. This reality is especially obvious if the industry's products are contrasted with the dizzying array of church music found around the world and across two millennia of history.
Today, the bottom line is almost always the financial bottom line.
While believers lead the companies that dominate Christian music, secular corporations now own these smaller companies, noted Peacock. Clearly this is shaping the "Christian" music sold in religious bookstores and mainstream malls. But this corporate culture is also affecting worship and the heart of church life.
"The industry cannot be expected to always have the best interests of the church in mind," Peacock told nearly 500 scholars, musicians, entrepreneurs and clergy. "Christians within the companies may. But the overriding ideology of the system is to serve the shareholder first." Serving the shareholders means an endless stream of new products, fads and artists -- just like in the secular world. The new always vetoes the old and the saints don't use credit cards or own stock. Thus, CCM is dominated by pop, rock, urban and new worship music. Classical Christian music is below 1 percent on the charts.
Most worship leaders are trying to blend these radically different musical elements, reported pollster George Barna, describing a survey of Protestant worshippers, pastors and "worship leaders." Sometimes the easiest solution is to have different services for different audiences -- a strategy the Barna Research Group found in three out of four churches. Thus, the GI Generation attends a different service than the upbeat Baby Boomers or the mysterious young faithful of generations X and Y. The result looks something like an FM radio dial.
"What we know about Americans is that we view ourselves first and foremost as consumers," said Barna. "Even when we walk in the doors of our churches what we tend to do is to wonder how can I get a good transaction out of this experience. ... So, what we know from our research is that Americans have made worship something that primarily that we do for ourselves. When is it successful? When we feel good." And sometimes people feel bad. According to the pastors, only 9 percent of the surveyed churches were experiencing conflict over music. But it's possible to turn those statistics around and note that 90 percent of all church conflicts reported in this study centered on musical issues.
Is peace possible? Peacock concluded that it will be up to ministers and educators to argue that there is more to worship than the niches on a CCM sales charts. The industry can play a valid role in shaping the content of Christian music, he said, even in "contributing to the congregational music of the church. Still, the industry is at the mercy of a consumer with narrow tastes. Until this changes, it can't possibly function as a definitive caretaker and should not be asked to. "This means that the stewardship of Christian music from the Psalms, to Ambrose, to Bach, to Wesley, to the Fisk Jubilee Singers and more, belongs to the church and the academy."
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Terry Mattingly (www.tmatt.net) teaches at Palm Beach Atlantic University and is senior fellow for journalism at the Council for Christian Colleges & Universities. He writes this weekly column for the Scripps Howard News Service.
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Mattingly's quote from George Barna says much about people's worship priorities:
"What we know about Americans is that we view ourselves first and foremost as consumers," said Barna. "Even when we walk in the doors of our churches what we tend to do is to wonder how can I get a good transaction out of this experience. ... So, what we know from our research is that Americans have made worship something that primarily that we do for ourselves. When is it successful? When we feel good."
Barna's words remind me of a statement I once heard from a Southern Baptist pastor in Nashville, TN. Preaching from the pulpit, this pastor remarked that he came to church each Sunday spiritually "drained" from the cares and woes of the previous week and couldn't wait to be "filled up" spiritually for another week! That is, he came to GET spiritually, not to GIVE spiritually. "Worship" for him was a passive experience, in which he showed up and expected God to bless him with good feelings.
Too often our worship priorites are totally fouled up. Worship should be a time when we come to church already completely filled with God's grace (which in itself should create "good feelings") such that we can't wait to pour out our praise and adoration TO HIM. If we let the cares and woes of the previous week rob us of our spirituality, then we are in no frame of mind to worship God in spirit and in truth, and our "worship" is unacceptable. Pure worship is NOT about US, it's totally about denying the self and giving ALL to God.
But today's post-modern churches believe otherwise. Hence, why else would they spend millions to build "worship centers" with "the look and feel of performing arts centers"? Everything there is geared to please the worshipers-consumers, to keep them coming back to consume more entertainment. Where's the "worship" in that?
James Burch asked a question: the answer got lost in the archives. He asked:
What about while singing? June 24 2004, 9:26 PM
Just found this website, after reading discussion, I still need an understanding about clapping during "Song service". Is it appropiate or not.
SONG SERVICE is such a profoundly obscene term that my mind struggles to take it all in. This is not unusual. Remember that Paul told the musical, charismatic Athenians that they needed to graps that "in Him we live, move and have our being." Jesus said I will return to you as "another" Comforter (Anothen means a fuller but different dwelling with and in you). That means that the SPIRIT world exists side by side with the 4 dimensioned physical world. Only to those who believed and were baptized did Jesus promise to sweep out the "demons" and make our spirit A holy spirit. Then and only then is it possible to see as obvious that which religion as the grandest "cottage industry" will kill you for saying out loud. The total message is that it is music which blinds the eyes and plugs the ears "lest they should hear, repent and be healed."
FIRST: SONG
Remember that the passage which the "religious" world cannot grasp is that Paul said SPEAK to "one another." Or in Colossians, Teach and Admonish one another. In Romans 15 Paul defined a SYNAGOGUE which is exactly what Jesus died to build: there was no praise or song service in the synagogue. In chapter 15, he solved all of the DIVERSITY issues by telling the Romans to use ONE MOUTH and ONE MIND to speak "that which is written." Speak in Ephesians 5 is PREACH and not SING.
Jesus said that God only SEEKS those who worship in the PLACE of the human spirit. The spirit is the mind is the heart. Because Paul had been taught by Christ as Spirit he understood. However, like Jesus and warned about by Peter, Paul spoke in clear as God's light can make it, but in language which cannot be grasped even as in a dull mirror. As the speaking is external for the purpose of teaching and comforting by the Spirit of Christ which is the Word of Christ (John 6:63), both the singing and melody is in the HEART where, in Col 3:16, it exercises GRACE which is the "divine enfluence on the heart."
Paul said SPEAK in the external sense. Especially in the Greek, when you speak metrical material using the normal inflections of the language, you ARE singing in the cantillation sense. However, odeing, like melody in the external sense create panic (under the influence of Pan, the beast of Revelation) has a destrutive result.
Aeidô to sing, Il., etc.:--then of any sound, to twang, of the bowstring, Od.; to whistle, chant.
Sing and praise are two different words. Aeido includes Tollo Latin raise up consume in speech making. This is why MUSICA and EXEGESIS has the same goal and effect
Aeido is used with TETTIX which is the locust of Revelation. "The male makes a chirping or clicking noise by means of certain drums or 'tymbals' underneath the wings." This has the same meaning as HAND CLAPPING. "It is a simile for sweet sound made by the Mousôn prophêtai. These are the locusts or musicians of Revelation 18:22. Modern teams confess to being MUSICIANS, they claim that their songs are inspired and claim that they can "lift you into the presence of God." That is, they claim to be God the Messiah. Therefore, at just the right time, they rose from the netherworld and are the locusts under Abaddon. Find the fella who promoted musical worship teams and you have your APOLLYON.
Aeido has the same meaning as aeirô. It means "to lift up for ONESELF,raise or LEVY a tax -- TITHING to raise or stir up, to undertake a long war. Metaphor to be lifted up, excited. Words such as enthusiam derive ONLY from "Enthu O mania"
These words include the word HERESY. A heretic or sectarian is not one who chooses not to be FORCED into using instruments. A heretic is one who CHOOSES to take or lift up or carry away YOUR "house." His weapons are MUSIC to arouse you with SINGING in the external sense. This is to STING you with the locust tails which have scorpion venum. This is why both in the Old and New Testament God promised to build a "house" in the hearts of mankind and not a mega-temple dedicated to Circe. Remember the STING or MARK: the use music and excitement to DRIVE AWAY those with the mark of the Word and Baptism. They hold captive the HERETICS in the "house" they have stolen. If you can find a church which is guilty then you have the high seat in the "theatron" or spectacle of the prophesied end times.
SERVICE
External oiding, melodia or Cantus carry the idea of creating excitement or panic. ALL musical terms and names of instruments send the MARK of Lucifer's attempt to BLEED OFF worship for herself.
SERVICE of the Levitical "singers" spokeof HARD BONDAGE related to that of Abaddon. The same is true. Music or the Muses including all fine arts were under the control of Apollo or Apollyon.
The only EXTERNAL odeing and playing as minstrels in the New Testament speak of the polluted and polluting minstrels. Jesus CAST them out more violently than I had previously grasped.
Jesus built an ekklesia which is synagogue in the Greek. This was a school of the Bible and a place of prayer. It held several open sessions through the week and was a place were you could find a scholar who would teach you the Word of God. It is a fact that at the time of Jesus males at 5 were entered into synagogue schools (under males for heaven's sake) while the girls were schooled in skills needed for their roles. In German they called church SKUL.
If you find a School of welding or Cosmotology being overwhelmed by a band of singing and clapping juveniles, and it improves the EDUCATION, then I might change my mind. If you would not insult the instructor then think about what you are TRYING to do to God.
So far, God has let me see this fact and you cannot comprehend the violence heaped on the heads of anyone who declares, "But the king HAS no clothes." If this was NOT true then some scholar would tell you that he has a speck of evidence that the Christian Synagogue has any AUTHORITY or NEED for music. They could surely find a sentence which does not have the SPIRIT 100% of the time saying that music and the names of instruments used to AROUSE people with song or speech is NOT deliberately STINGING them so that they CAN NO LONGER hear the Word. Remember also that if you could get people to comprehend that AROUSAL services are evil, the whole SUPERSTRUCTURE, [T. Campbells word], would come tumbling down. And as surely as God speaks through His word it WILL HAPPEN and with its contribution to the GNP the ride on the back of the whore will end and a great, fatal depression will hit the world.
Hand clapping speaks of the confused MALES making DRUMS or CYMBALS out of their "cupped hands" which are identical to the "cupped cymbals" of Paul's warning that instruments speak of WARFARE or someone trying to CONVERSE with the angels: the claim of musical worship teams.
I do believe that many people are entering the doors of the church to make "themselves" "feel" better. I also believe that "if" our worship is geared as closely as possible to the examples in the Bible, "We" will "feel" better. The Bible is not just for life after death, it is also for life before death. I once heard Bruce White make a statement like that.
The "singing" of the worship service is to help steer our mind/heart/spirit. It is a very good thing when done with the spirit of the assembly gathered in mind. It is to help us focus our concentration on our purpose for being there. It is "not" just to charge our batteries or to give us a reason to come watch and listen. It is all about "Participation", from the congregation, directed toward God.
If we are "friendly", "humble" and "loving" to one another, "unified" in "Spirit" and "Truth" which means without un-necessary earthly props or physical stimulations, we (as/in a congregation) "will" all "feel" better, have "peace" and be closer to God.
Col. 3:2 "Set your mind on things above, not on things on the earth."
3:23 "And whatever you do, do it heartily as to the Lord and not to men."
If clapping is physical because you must use your body to do it, then singing is physical. We must use our vocal chords to sing. Reviewing a song in one's mind is not singing.
We can review a song in our minds, we can mentally assent to something, but in order to outwardly express anything, we must use our physical bodies. There is no difference between physically singing and physically clapping - in either from where they arise or the fact that they can both express a spiritual response from the person.
Physical singing is what is envisioned in Scripture; not silently reviewing a song. The Bible anticipates physical worship, not mental exercises.
The voice is used as a physical instrument to reflect a spiritual prompt. Clapping can be the same.
However, clapping can be used as can our bodies, to register agreement with something that occurs or that we become aware of during an assembly. In those cases, it need not be a spiritual response at all.
H.Roberson
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Brother Hoyt,
You can sing, say amen, pray or a variety of other things in your heart or mind, but to clap, you must use your physical body. That makes it physical. If you clap in your mind, it's really not clapping.
I am a musician, and to play an instrument, I must use my physical body. The instrument has no spirit of its own and even if I use my spirit to bring life to it, it still, has no spirit. If I play the instrument in my mind, the instrument is really not being played.
When you clap, you are using your physical body as an instrument which is not of/in your spirit but where your spirit as well as the spirit of God resides.
Mr. Roberson,
Even though you use your vocal cords to sing, the music is coming from your spirit/mind. You "can" sing in your spirit or mind without even making a sound. It may not be singing to "you", if you don't hear it, but nevertheless we can all do this. Whether or not you are "Reviewing" a song in your mind or using your vocal cords to project the tones is not the point. Singing is the only form of music that is "internal" to your spirit. Clapping, Dancing, Playing an instrument, Eating, Drinking, etc., etc. are "external" and things that your "Spirit" MUST use external devices, including your body, to practice or participate in. More often than not, such things are a detriment to true spiritual worship.
Since we are talking about clapping, and comparing it to singing, I will just re-affirm that clapping is not music at all and it is an agitating sound that is a disruption to the Bond of Peace. Ephesians 4:1-6.
The Bible does 'not' anticipate physical worship! If you go back to the old testament maybe, but we now have a better way, the Spiritual way led by the perfect, 'sinless' high priest "Hebrews 9:11", the lamb of God. John 1:29
We "do not" need to show our agreement to anything earthly when we worship. We need only to show our gratefulness and appreciation to God for "everthing", and the only way to do this, according to Jesus, is in "Spirit" and "Truth".
Anything external to your spirit is, artificial to your spirit. Artificial basically means Man-Made. That, it seems to me, would make it un-true to God since God is Spirit.
Anyone want to call it Legalistic? That's ok with me.
If Scripture does not anticipate physical worship, pray tell, what were those Christians doing when they met together? What did Jesus do when he sang a song with his disciples?
Did all these folks sit around silently? Hardly - they engaged their physical bodies to sing - out loud. It is anticipated that we will sing out loud - to one another. Our singing is physical. Singing is singing, not reviewing a song. Is there some definition somewhere that would define singing - as we practice it in our assemblies - as remaining silent?
If we assume that Jesus, his disciples, and the early church sang out loud, would we not be remiss to define singing as remaining silent?
I guess I just don't understand your thought process that allows our spirit to use one part of our bodies to sing and doesn't allow us to use other parts of our bodies to clap. The starting point is the same, and they both result in physical activity.
You have stated before that in your opinion, clapping isn't appropriate in an assembly (although you've wavered on that at least once). Given that you know your opinion is only your opinion, you continue to adamantly argue that clapping in an assembly is not permissable and you would never attend a place that allows it.
I have difficulty with your knowing it is your opinion, even though you've admitted it isn't sin, and your extreme negative position on the topic. They do not seem consistent.
Singing is not "Physical" music. It is "Spiritual" (from the heart and soul). Only "human beings" were given a soul and CAN sing. A "MONKEY" can clap. Put that in your pipe and smoke on it a while. (not being smart alek, just trying to be a bit humorous).
Even though, usually when we talk about singing, we are talking about making a sound, the POINT is that we don't really have to. I sing all day long in my mind and I'll bet you do too.
I never said that I "defined" singing as remaining silent. I believe that we need to sing out loud but again, that is not the point.
To answer your "pray tell" question... Those Chrisians, as well as Jesus, were SINGING from their SPIRIT.
Clapping must result in physical activity or it is not clapping. Singing does not HAVE TO.
Evidently you did not read my reponse thoroughly so I repeat...
"Whether or not you are "Reviewing" a song in your mind or using your vocal cords to project the tones is not the point. Singing is the only form of music that is "internal" to your spirit. Clapping, Dancing, Playing an instrument, Eating, Drinking, etc., etc. are "external" and things that your "Spirit" MUST use external devices, including your body, to practice or participate in. More often than not, such things are a detriment to true spiritual worship.
Since we are talking about clapping, and comparing it to singing, I will just re-affirm that clapping is not MUSIC at all and it is an agitating sound that is a disruption to the Bond of Peace. Ephesians 4:1-6."
I have not WAVERED on anything! This is not an OPINION. If you are having "DIFFICULTY" understanding this, then I question whether you really understand what SPIRITUALITY is.
I guess we will just have to disagree on this one since it is clear to me that my spirit prompts whatever my body does in response to God, whether it's singing or whatever. I think I have a decent handle on spirituality even if you think I might not.
You apparently think clapping - all clapping in an assembly - is disruptive, although the verse reference you used doesn't say that. There are quite a number of folks that don't think it is and so I suspect for them and their congregations, it's O.K. since your and my opinion on clapping (not as worship) doesn't matter (you remember our discussion about congratulatory clapping at a 50th wedding anniversary announcement). This is really where our discussion started, not in connection with worship at all.
All this noise about clapping when we all agree it isn't sinful and has been done repeatedly in churches of Christ for non-worship events for many years. You've witnessed it and while you may have thought it odd, you have admitted it isn't sin in an assembly to acknowledge an anniversary milestone.
You are exactly right. Your "a) Spirit" does prompt everything that your "b) Body" does. They are A and B "2-two different things". That is the point. I did not intend to sound tacky or dis-respectful about your handle on spirituality. I was just trying to get across that your Spirit and your Body are different things.
The verse referenced "Ephesians 4:1-6" was to emphasize the word "PEACE". The first Part of the definition of "Peace" is "a State of tranquility or quiet". The first part of the definition of "Tranquil" is "to be Free from Agitation of mind or Spirit".
Congratulatory clapping is directed toward human beings and yes, is not connected with worship at all.
I do not think that clapping is sinful. It is a very useful and effective tool for teaching young people who may not have a clear vision of spirituality yet.
I do believe that clapping or any other Physical practice is "Wrong" and is the "Wrong Influence" for a congregation of christians who are mature or old enough to understand the "difference".
[The following article is cited from POWER, a monthly publication of the church of Christ in Southaven, MS. Emph. by D.C.]
LET GOD DO THE CLAPPING
by Bobby Duncan
From time to time a question arises concerning the practice of clapping during our worship periods to show our approval of something said or done. This practice is, generally speaking, relatively new among churches of Christ. That fact within itself does not make the practice either right or wrong. Neither does the fact that it is a practice borrowed by our denominational neighbors from the entertainment industry, and then by churches of Christ from our denominational neighbors. The rightness or wrongness of an act is determined, not by its antiquity or its novelty, nor by who has or has not made it a practice, but by whether or not it is in harmony with the teaching of the New Testament.
Clapping during worship fits into the agenda of those who are trying to change the church. Some of them have made it plain that worship must be changed to make it more appealing to the worshipper. Calvin Warpula wrote, “I also believe we should let individuals and congregations use the musical format they like without judging them.” Rubel Shelly said, “The inspiring event we call worship in traditional churches has to give way to the exhilarating experience of God that exhibits and nourishes life in the worshippers.” He also said in the same speech, “the church has got to change. If it doesn’t change, my kids are not going to stay with it.”
These statements suggest that worship must please the worshipper. They ignore the fact that worship is designed to honor God. When the design of worship is to entertain the worshipper, we expect those being entertained to show their approval by clapping.
There is the same authority for clapping in Christian worship as there is for playing a piano or organ. It is doing something for which there is no divine authority. Furthermore, those among our brethren who first started clapping in worship are the same ones who have stretched the tent of fellowship over the denominational world, and who will not say those who use the instrument in worship sin in so doing. While clapping has now caught on with some who are otherwise, it should be remembered that hand clapping in worship was originally borrowed from the denominations by some who believe those in denominations have God’s approval.
Who is being applauded when there is hand clapping in worship? Are those who clap their hands doing so to honor God? If so, they are seeking to honor God in some way He has not authorized instead of how He has directed. “God is a spirit: and they that worship him must worship him in spirit and in truth” (John 4:24).
If hand clapping is something of value in our worship, then why didn’t God prescribe it? Could it be that those who initiated this practice think they have thought of something God overlooked? Or, did God simply not know of its great value? Brethren with such wisdom would do well to read First Corinthians 3:18:20, “Let no man deceive himself. If any man among you seemeth to be wise in this world, let him become a fool, that he may be wise. For this wisdom of this world is foolishness with God. For it is written, He taketh the wise in their own craftiness. And, again, The Lord knoweth the thoughts of the wise, that they are vain.”
Those really interested in the peace and harmony of the church will not insist on clapping in worship. They themselves will agree that clapping is not necessary in order to have scriptural worship. They will acknowledge also that clapping is not an act God has prescribed. Therefore, they must confess they can worship scripturally and conscientiously without applauding. In love for those who conscientiously oppose it, and in the interest of peace and harmony, it should be omitted.
Occasionally one will be heard to say that hand clapping is no different from saying, “Amen.” But there is one slight difference: saying, “Amen,” is authorized in scripture: 1 Corinthians 14:16, “Else when thou shalt bless with the spirit, how shall he that occupieth the room of the unlearned say Amen at thy giving of thanks, seeing he understandeth not what thou sayest?” Where is the verse which mentions clapping hands in worship?
I would emphasize that I am not one who is opposed to change, provided the change is in harmony with the will of God, and provided the change will be an improvement. However, if we are to improve our worship, it will not be by adding other acts, but by improving the worshippers.
If there is to be applause in connection with our worship, let it be by God; He is the only audience. All of us are participants.
_________________________ Bobby Duncan has passed on to his reward, but “still speaketh” through his excellent writings.
This message by Bobby reflects the generally gentle nature he demonstrated in most of his writings. However, his articles suffers from some of the same problems as does Mr. T. Pierce Brown's.
He begins with a very cogent observation in that he allows that the merits of a thing have nothing to do with who else does the thing; that the thing is to be evaluated on its own merits.
Unfortunately, Bobby fails to remain committed to that precept:
"Clapping during worship fits into the agenda of those who are trying to change the church." and,
"Furthermore, those among our brethren who first started clapping in worship are the same ones who have stretched the tent of fellowship over the denominational world, and who will not say those who use the instrument in worship sin in so doing. While clapping has now caught on with some who are otherwise, it should be remembered that hand clapping in worship was originally borrowed from the denominations by some who believe those in denominations have God’s approval."
Clearly, Bobby does care who else uses, advocates, or supports a thing. In making that clear, he destroys the unbiased basis of the article.
Bobby's general argument seems to be that God is the audience of worship. While that may be the case, God is not the only audience of our assemblies, which Bobby unwittingly acknowledges:
"“Else when thou shalt bless with the spirit, how shall he that occupieth the room of the unlearned say Amen at thy giving of thanks, seeing he understandeth not what thou sayest?”"
Clearly, God is not the only Bible-authorized audience of whatever we do in our assemblies. Some slight further reflection tells us that this has always been so. A Gospel sermon is aimed at sinners, as are 99% of our "invitation songs" (not mentioned in scripture). Neither have God as their object, but other humans. We are to sing and make melody in our hearts to God, but we are also to speak to one another in our singing. There are at least two audiences to our singing: God and others in attendance. In the Ephesian reference, the attendees may be envisioned to be other Christians, but in the 1 Cor reference, the unlearned, or inquirer, or non-Christian is in view. We have then, God, other Christians, and non-Christians who are the audiences of our assemblies.
No, God is not the only audience in our assemblies.
Bobby also misses the point of the verse he decides to use here. The point of the verse is not to authorize 'amen,' but to make certain that what goes on in the assembly can be understood and appropriated by those in attendance. The only point that can be gleaned from this verse is that if the assembly of the church is confusing and not understandable by those in attendance (not God), its usefulness in the Kingdom is dubious and those participating need to fix their approach. It proscribes confusion, not specific activities. A corollary would be that our assemblies are to conducive to communicating the Gospel to those in attendance however we communicate it. The mode of communicating is not addressed in this verse; simply the point of the assembly being 'understandable.'
As a side note, this verse, if it authorizes an amen, only does so for the untrained inquirer. It does not do so for Christians. What it does for Christians is charge them with making their assemblies places where that outsider would be moved to say 'Amen.'
Bobby also seems to confuse an assembly en toto, with worship. If worship's only object is God, then only those things which are directed at Him specifically are worship. Announcements, invitation songs, songs that edify or admonish, and virtually all sermons are not, by definition worship. These things are all directed at humans, not God. They therefore do not fall within the pale of 'worship.'
I suppose that Bobby would allow that if we did something that wasn't worship during an assembly, it would be OK for us direct that at someone other than God. In that instance, Bobby's argument that God has not expressed a desire to receive applause would fall flat. In fact, we have shown that the majority of our assembly time are not worship and therefore, any argument that suggests that only God-approved worship items can occur during an assembly is falacious.
Bobby seems to think that the peace and harmony of the church is paramount. Such is not always the case. The maturation of Christians is the utmost consideration. People that 'truely value peace and harmony' may do so, but understand that God's requirement for growth must be balanced and in some cases will overtake the peace and harmony of a particular congregation. I believe that Paul admonished the Corinthian church for ignoring their calling of God. They were likely happy doing what they were doing but Paul was willing to cause them some discomfort for their own good.
But some might argue that applause is optional and therefore those who like it should not be pushing it on those that don't like it. I suppose the reverse question would also be true: "If I don't like it, but I know it's optional, why do I insist on having my way over it?" This question is especially appropriate for mature Christians.
In short, Bobby's article has about as much strength behind it as does Mr. Brown's - which isn't much.
walter h. rosenbrock sr. (no login) 24.117.122.123
clapping
September 17 2006, 4:39 PM
Bro. Roberson & Bro. Bennett:
On the subject of clapping during song worship, we all need to remember that as CHRISTIANS we are supposed to strive to be like christ. If there is anyplace in GOD'WORD that tells us that CHRIST did this , then I am all for it if it doesn't detract from the worship. I do not know of anyplace in the bible that tells of CHRIST doing this, so, until I am shown where JESUS clapped when singing, then I think it is wrong because you are than adding to the word of GOD. As we all know, we are commanded not to add to or take away from the word of GOD.
A recent denominational church bulletin I received made reference to a "bell choir." A difficulty has arisen; the audience has taken to applauding when the bell choir sounds. The bulletin note said that the bell choir is "providing beautiful music to assist in our meditation upon the sacrificial death of our Savior." The minister chastises the church for applauding, telling them, "The applause tends to break the meditation we are seeking to produce. At a time when our hearts and minds are to be focused on Christ, clapping tends to pull us away from that. There are times when clapping is fine and appreciated," says this denominational preacher, "but perhaps the time we meet around the Lord's table is not one of them."
And so the request is made: no more clapping for the bell choir!
I have never heard this bell choir, but I know why people are clapping: they think they are being entertained. They are applauding the show.
Worship is not entertainment.
When we worship God, we are not the audience. We are not even spectators. We are supposed to be participants. God is the audience! Our worship is directed heavenward, and that is why we don't applaud each other.
Picture this scene: "That was a wonderful prayer, brother Tom, Dick, or Harry ... and sister Bertha, Sally, or Suzie looked so godly while taking the fruit of the vine; ... let's give them a big hand." (Thunderous applause.) Nobody is thinking about Jesus.
We come together as the body of Christ to worship, honor, venerate, serve, and reverence the God of heaven through Jesus. We don't gather with tooting, banging, strumming, and bell-ringing to amuse one another.
Our worship is toward God. "Thou shalt worship the Lord thy God, and him only shalt thou serve" (Matt. 4:10). "The hour cometh, and now is, when the true worshippers shall worship the Father in spirit and in truth: for the Father seeketh such to worship him. God is a Spirit: and they that worship him must worship him in spirit and in truth" (John 4:23-24).
By the way, if a bell choir creates a meditation that enables us to take better the Lord's Supper, I wonder why God didn't know that and include that in the biblical pattern?
This denomination's problem is not just with the bell choir, but involves their whole understanding and application of the purpose and pattern of worship. Many denominations know they have a problem; they don't know what it is. What they are reaping is bad fruit from the seeds they planted of departing from God's Word.
Would to God we could see and avoid that same trap. Brethren Shelly and Harris in their book, The Second Incarnation, say things about worship that are ridiculous, including recommending "raucous celebration ... jubilation ... applause and cheering" (pp. 139-140).
If applause takes the mind off of Jesus when partaking of the Lord's Supper, why wouldn't it do the same thing any other time during worship? We need to maintain jealously the simplicity and dignity of worship in spirit and truth.
Ringing bells would be classified as "clanging cymbals." Paul equated the booming bass and tinkling (screaming) cymbals to "weapons" of warfare or to sorcery. Because worship is "holding the thought of God in your mind or spirit, the preside-over musicians and the noise makes worship impossible. Whatever the "sincerity quotient" the result is that Satan has such groups which is consistent with the remnant concept that only a FEW are chosen out of all those who are called. This fits end- time prophecy 100% if you grasp that prophesies of the first advent did not inform the best "scholars." Thomas Paine in black text:
keladeô [kelados]
I. to sound as rushing water, to shout aloud, in APPLAUSE
2. of various sounds, to utter a CRY, cry aloud, of BELLS TO TINKLE, of the flute, k. phthongon kalliston id=Eur.
II. trans. to sing of, celebrate loudly, etc.
phthongos is
I. any clear, distinct sound, esp. the voice of men, Hom., attic; also of animals, Soph., Eur.
II. generally, a sound, as distinguished from a voice (phônê ), Plat.:--of musical sounds
Corrupt is the Greek:
Phtheiro (g5351) fthi'-ro; prob. strength. (to pine or waste): prop. to shrivel or wither, i.e. to spoil (by any process) or (gen.) to ruin (espec. fig. by moral influences, to deprave): - corrupt (self), defile, destroy
Phthoggos (g5353) fthong'-gos; from 5350; utterance, i.e. a musical note (vocal or instrumental): - sound.
Niqqud (h5350) nik-kood'; from the same as 5348; a crumb (as broken to spots); also a biscuit (as pricked): - cracknel, mouldy. [This is the SOP Jesus broke for Judas as a MARK. Satan came into Judas and being found out fled. The Judas Bag was for "carring the mouthpices of wind instruments." Psalm 41 prophsied of this MUSICAL attack.
Calal (h6750) tsaw-lal'; a prim. root [rather ident. with 6749 through the idea of vibration]; to tinkle, i. e. rattle together (as the ears in reddening with shame, or the teeth in chattering with fear): - quiver, tingle.
Chalal (h2490) khaw-lal'.. wound, to dissolve; fig. to profane (a person, place or thing), to break (one's word),denom. (from 2485) to play (the flute): defile, break, defile.. take inheritance, pipe, player on instruments, pollute, (cast as) profane (self), prostitute, slay (slain), sorrow, stain, wound.
Thomas Paine witnessed a small boy slowly twisting in the wind imposed by the clergy for stealing bread. Thomas Paine was an expert on the Bible but probably rejected it because ALL religions had built an evil SUPERSTRUCTURE for their own profit. He notes:
But the men most and best informed upon the subject of theology rest themselves upon this universal article, and hold all the various superstructures erected thereon to be at least doubtful, if not altogether artificial.
The intellectual part of religion is a private affair between every man and his Maker, and in which no third party has any right to interfere.
The practical part consists in our doing good to each other.
But since religion has been made into a trade,
[NOTE: French: "since the most scandalous hypocrisy has made of Religion a profession and the basest trade." -- Editor.]
the practical part has been made to consist of ceremonies performed by men called priests;
and the people have been amused with ceremonial shows, processions, and BELLS.
By devices of this kind true religion has been banished; and such means have been found out to extract money even from the pockets of the poor, instead of contributing to their relief.
[NOTE: French adds: "du superflu de la richesse." (from their superfluous wealth). -- Editor.]
No man ought to make a living by Religion. It is dishonest so to do.
Religion is not an act that can be performed by proxy. One person cannot act religion for another. Every person must perform it for himself;
and all that a priest can do is to take from him; he wants nothing but his moneyand then to riot in the spoil and laugh at his credulity.
NOTE: The ten preceding words are replaced in the French by: "to take from us not our vices but our money." -- Editor.]
The only people who, as a professional sect of Christians provide for the poor of their society, are people known by the name of Quakers. Those men have no priests. They assemble quietly in their places of meeting,
and do not disturb their neighbours with SHOWS and NOISE OF BELLS
Religion does not unite itself to show and noise.
True religion is without either. Where there is both there is no true religion
[NOTE: "A Religion uniting the two [noise and show] at the expense of the poor whose misery it should lessen, is a curious Religion; it is the Religion of kings and priests conspiring against suffering humanity." -- Editor.]
The first object for inquiry in all cases, more especially in matters of religious concern, is TRUTH.
Didn't Jesus say something like that: "worship is in the new PLACE of the spirit cleansed at baptism as a REQUEST for A holy spirit or a good conscience (consiousness or co-perception) and in TRUTH. Spirit and Truth are of the Mind which IS the spirit of mankind. "Enthus O mania" as enspirited or charismatic (sexual and worse) coupled (a Freudian slip) with FALSE HOOD from the mouth of a Sermonic or Musica or Mantic or Magica song speaks of worship as THRESKIA or Charismatic or is OF THE DEVIL because Jesus said the SONS of the Devil "speak on their own."
Again, Thomas Paine rejected the Bible primarily because "religion" and especially "Christenism" built evil systems rather than trying to understand Scripture. His bitterness undoubtedly stemed from being ignored even when it is certain that he was a fundamental FOUNDING FATHER of American freedom: especially freedom FROM systems built on ignorance of the Scriptures. He, along with John Locke, grasped that tyranny is normally RIDING on the back of false religions.
The following words (and many more) are intimately linked to define the "threskia" form or the worship of Orpheus (its inventor), Dionysus (the new wineskin god), Apollo, Rhea (Zoe) and others. A heretic is one who uses "spiritual anxiety created by religious ritual" to LIFT UP to take away your property for themselves.
When the Israelites rose up to PLAY at Mount Sinai they repudiated the Covenant of Grace and engaged in perverted worship of the Egyptian Triad. God refused to give them REST. When Messiah came He gave the REST but the traffickers didn't take long to get the harness on most people and get them out bearing burdens both financially, spiritually and emotionally. You remember that Isaiah 28 was used by Paul to define speaking STRANGE TONGUES (never gibberish or praise songs). This and music has been used for spiritual tribuating people. One of the prophesies begins:
Wherefore hear the word of the Lord, ye SCORNFUL men, that rule (dominate) this people which is in Jerusalem. Isa 28:14
Because ye have said, We have made a covenant with death, and with hell are we at agreement; when the overflowing scourge shall pass through, it shall not come unto us: for we have made lies our refuge, and under falsehood have we hid ourselves: Is.28:15
Therefore thus saith the Lord God, Behold, I lay in Zion for a foundation a stone, a tried stone, a precious corner stone, a sure foundation: he that believeth shall NOT make haste. Isa 28:16
Judgment also will I lay to the line, and righteousness to the plummet: and the hail shall sweep away the refuge of lies, and the waters shall overflow the hiding place. Isaiah 28:17
THE DEFINITION OF REST FOR BELIEVERS
The Word "BELIEVETH" as in the Great Commission is putting one's trust in Jesus Christ by obeying without question. Believeth is not just failing to believea few facts.
The Hebrew word is:
Aman (h539) aw-man'; a prim. root; prop. to build up or support; to foster as a parent or nurse; fig. to render (or be) FIRM or faithful, to TRuST or believe, to be permanent or QUIET; mor. to be TRUE or certain; once (Isa. 30:21; by interch. for 539) to go to the RIGHT HAND: - hence assurance, believe, bring up, establish, / fail, be FAITHFUL (of long continuance, stedfast, sure, surely, trusty, verified), nurse, (-ing father), (put), trust, turn to the right.
And thine ears shall hear a word behind thee, saying, This is the WAY, WALK ye in it, when ye turn to the right hand, and when ye turn to the left. Is.30:21
The WAY is the eishodos. One gets INTO the way or road until one gets INTO Christ and the remission of Sins at the DOOR which is Christ Jesus. No one comes to the Father but through the Son. We are not so JUDGMENTAL that we rewrite the Bible because someone MIGHT be saved without baptism. That is playing God: seeing God and the Word in a mirror.
Shaqat (h8252) shaw-kat'; a prim. root; to REPOSE (usually fig.): - appease, idleness, (at, be at, be in, give) QUIETNESS, (be at, be in, give, have, take) REST, settle, BE STILL.
Shall NOT make haste is a direct command: Make Haste is
Chuwsh (h2363) koosh; a prim. root; to hurry; fig. to be eager with EXCITEMENT or ENJOYMENT: - (make) haste (-n), ready.
Woe unto them that draw iniquity with cords of vanity, and sin as it were with a cart rope: Isaiah 5:18
That say, Let him make speed, and hasten his work , that we may SEE it: and let the counsel of the Holy One of Israel draw nigh and come, that we may know it Isaiah 5:19
And thou shalt say, I will go up to the land of unwalled villages; I will go to them that are AT REST, that dwell safely, all of them dwelling without walls, and having neither bars nor gates, Eze.38:11
And they answered the angel of the Lord that stood among the myrtle trees, and said, We have walked to and fro through the earth, and, behold, all the earth sitteth still, and is at rest. Zec.1:11
Paul defined the Christian synagogue (united to learn but from diverse backgrounds) as a place where you are CHRIST LIKE: you do not PLEASE yourself which is one of those perverted concepts.
For even Christ PLEASED not himself; but, as it is written, The reproaches of them that reproached thee fell on me. Rom 15:3
Pleasure or Please speaks of MAKING HASTE or lifting up and carrying away (heresy) another person's mind AND property for personal use:
Aresko (g700) ar-es'-ko; prob. from 142 (through the idea of exciting emotion); to be agreeable (or by impl. to seek to be so): - please.
This word relates directly to a word included in HERESY. A heretick takes away by CREATING spiritual anxiety which Jesus died to ELEMINATE. If you are paying the TAX of tithe or "law of giving" to get someone to PLEASUR you you must grasp that they are in the link which includes KLEPTOMANIA.
Airo (g142) ah'ee-ro; a prim. verb; to lift; by impl. to take up or away; figurative to raise the voice, keep in suspense the mind
The way people DELIBERATELY slap God in the face by creating panic or excitement is a word related directly to airo and heresy:
Aeidô. to sing, THEN of any sound, to TWANG, of the BOWSTRING, whistle, of the wind, to ring, of a stone struck, to sing in one's praise
People who violate the VERY PURPOSE for God coming in the flesh do so with a HIGH HAND because they are agents of an alien power and, like Lucifer the singing and harp playing prostitute, simply DO NOT want people to hear the Words in song and sermons as the Spirit of Christ has delivered them. Peter outlawed further expounding because the word.
Rubel Shelly and Max Lucado and all of the little ditto heads say that the Holy Spirit is God's Song Writer and Dance Master! The Spirit of Christ says:
THE Lord is my shepherd; I shall not want.
He maketh me to lie down (repose) in green pastures: he leadeth (protects and makes me sparkle) me beside the still waters.
He restoreth my soul: he leadeth me in the paths of righteousness for his names sake.
Rubel Shelly wants to "partner" with God and rewrite scripture to fit OUR culture. However, the "olden" God inspired the Bible writers to POINT to the carnal practices of THAT culture. That demands leaving the olden Scriptures behind as well as the olden God because these pseudo-scholars have become DISCONNECTED FROM THE HEAD. Those who can believe them should just eat drink and make merry--as they are assuredly doing. They are dancing the dance of DEATH and CANNOT stop if we can believe Scriptures evidence about "music."
Edward Fudge says that "if we can rewrite Acts 2:38 then it means" what his Baptist (c. ad 1525). It is not only unspiritual to define God's words with a DIFFERENT DICTIONARY it guarantees that God will send strong delusions so that the deluders believe their own lies. And, strange as it seems, the world if FILLED with people who want SOME ONE to "put God in His place." It is fulfilled prophecy so do not grieve.
Jer 3:[6] WEB Moreover Yahweh said to me in the days of Josiah the king, Have you seen that which backsliding Israel has done? she is gone up on every HIGH MOUNTAIN and under every GREEN TREE, and there has played the prostitute.
Jer 3: [7] I said after she had done all these things, She will return to me; but she didn't return: and her treacherous sister Judah saw it.
Jer 3: [8] I saw, when, for this VERY CAUSE that backsliding Israel had committed adultery, I had put her away and given her a bill of divorce, yet treacherous Judah, her sister, didn't fear; but she also went and played the prostitute.
Jer 3:[9] It happened through the lightness [SINGING, lowing noises] of her prostitution, that the land was polluted, and she committed adultery [apostatize] with stones and with stocks.
Stocks are with trees made into various forms. A similar word means "a hired workman" and WORSHIP LEADERS were menials. It also means to EXACT things like TITHES. The FIR was used for lances and musical instruments.
And David and all the house of Israel played before the Lord on all manner of instruments made of fir wood, even on harps, and on psalteries, and on timbrels, and on cornets, and on cymbals. 2S.6:5
The stone is EBEN but it means to build as a mason would build.
In the Vulate, 3;9 is:
Jer 3:[9] propterea tradidi eam in manu AMATORUM suorum in manus filiorum Assur super quorum insanivit libidinem
Amatorum to find pleasure in, delight in: nomen, ORATIONEM, vultum, incessum alicujus amare, A. Amare se, of VAIN MEN, to be in love with, to be PLEASED with ONE'S SELF, also, to be selfish
You remember that Lipscomb--which now has a DEGREE in WORSHIP MUSIC, etc.--brought in Farmer's Branch musical and sabbatarian to TEACH the aspiring preachers RHETORIC. That means that you can get a degree in SELF LOVE. But, this is the same Bible guru who says of Isaiah and worship: "There's nothing wrong." This is the silly mantra that what God calls spiritual prostitution was condemned because they just had a bad mental attitude. That is not what Amos was condemning.
But, then Jesus warned us not to be fools when He said that "the doctors of the Law take away the key to KNOWLEDGE." Sure, "worship music" is calculated by Satan to take away KNOWLEDGE. Spirit is KNOWLEDGE which God in Christ FEEDS us only to the extent that we speak HIS Words one to another. So, here is the MARCHING ORDERS FROM Jesus and Paul: do not, I say, do not, give your wages for what is NOT bread. If you SUPPORT these people you are ENABLERS. A musician or performance preacher did and does perform the evil task of the SORCERY and that is why they are called PARASITES. You may need a 12 step program to peel the dead albatrosses off your backs and out of your kid's "food bank" with the Blessing and REST of Jesus. If you PAY them for non-Biblical roles then YOU are the BLIND and God has NO MERCY for the BLIND who have been once enlightened by the Word (Heb 6). And for those who do not treat God with reverence and holy fear GOD IS STILL A CONSUMING FIRE.
This LOVE Word is usually applied to gods or goddesses such as Phaethon, Hester amarus and cupidus [the little guy who shot Apollo's kind of "arrows."]. Phaethon speaks of Helios or the S.U.N. god Shelly wants to honor, and they heyel form speaks of Lucifer or ZOE Therefore, these Jews were not engaged in NORMAL sexual immorality: they were deeply into the same pagan worship which they brought with them from Egypt and practiced and built temples for in Jerusalem. That is the NEW STYLE WORSHIP and there can be no doubt.
EZEK (Vulgate) XXIII. The word of Yahweh came again to me, saying, [2] Son of man, there were two women, the daughters of one mother: [3] and they PLAYED the prostitute in Egypt; they played the prostitute in their youth; there were their breasts pressed, and there was handled the bosom of their virginity. [4] The names of them were Oholah the elder, and Oholibah her sister: and they became mine, and they bore sons and daughters. As for their names, Samaria is Oholah, and Jerusalem is Oholibah. [5] Oholah played the prostitute when she was mine; and she doted on her lovers, on the Assyrians [her] neighbors, [6] who were clothed with blue, governors and rulers, all of them desirable young men, horsemen riding on horses. [7] She bestowed her prostitution on them, the choicest men of Assyria all of them; and on whoever she doted, with all their idols she defiled herself. [8] Neither has she left her prostitution since [the days of] Egypt; for in her youth they lay with her, and they handled the bosom of her virginity; and they poured out their prostitution on her. [9] Therefore I delivered her into the hand of her lovers, into the hand of the Assyrians, on whom she doted
Doted is: Agab (h5689) aw-gab'; a prim. root; to breathe after, i. e. to love (sensually): - dote, lover.
You must remember that the MUSICAL BANDITS use the Levitical musicians who made NOISE and not music, and whose SERVICE was HARD BONDAGE like the word ABAD or ABADDON OR APOLLYON. They want the TITHE because they have clearly RESTORED the LAW and are beyond-redemption legalists. Furthermore, the MUSIC is derived from the Sacrificial system ONLY in Canaan, only in Judah and only in Jerusalem and only in the COURT YARD of the temple. And ONLY when mocking thousands of innocent animals as types of Lord Jesus Whom they musically MOCKED but did not defeat.
And John in Revelation identifies JERUSALEM with these same PROSTITUTES in Jerusalem and Samaria:
And their dead bodies shall lie in the street of the great city, which spiritually is called SODOM and EGYPT, where also our Lord was CRUCIFIED. Re.11:8
Therefore, only if you get a Phd from a once-christian school are you able to pass this garbage through your lips (double edged swords) and WRITE as SCRIBAS what would get NORMAL people flunked out of the Card Class in the School of Ethics. If you know about David or have watched the movie version of Sodom you will see that not even the vilest sang songs and played the instruments with different tones. That needs no ethics or morality but would defy minimal common sense.
Ezekiel defines these LOVE SONGS and MUSICAL INSTRUMENTS to explain how Jerusalem and Samaria DOTED on their lovers: treating God and Ezekiel as they would a musical prostitute. The LOVE word is:
Egeb (h5690) eh'-gheb, from 5689; love (concr.), i. e. amative words: - much love, very lovely.
And they come unto thee as the people cometh, and they sit before thee as my people, and they hear thy words,
but they will not do them: for with their mouth they shew much love, but their heart goeth after their covetousness. Ezek 33:31
And, lo, thou art unto them
AS a very LOVELY song
of one that hath a pleasant voice, and can play well on an instrument:
for they hear thy words, but they do them not. Ezek 33:32
And when this cometh to pass, (lo, it will come,) then shall they know that a prophet hath been among them. Ezek 33:33
Uwgab (h5748) oo-gawb'; from 5689 in the orig. sense of breathing; a REED-INSTRUMENT of music: - organ
Of the same message Jesus warned:
Ye hypocrites (paid theatrical performers), well did Esaias prophesy of you, saying, Matt15:7
This people draweth nigh unto me with their mouth, and honoreth me with their lips; but their heart is far from me. Matt 15:8
Remember that Chalal one of the "praise words" is translated to mean "steal your inheritance, prune your vines, play the flute, pollute or prostitute. Jubal from which we get JUBILEE used instruments to TAKE CAPTIVE people to sell people THEIR OWN animals under the guise of PROTECTING them:
And his brothers name was JUBAL: he was the father of all such as handle [meaning without authority] the harp and ORGAN. Gen 4:21
Jubal is from Yabal which means to "bring forth with POMP or to lead into captivity.
Job spoke of the pagan, sexual fertility rites practiced in Jerusalem. They thought that by singing, dancing, playing instruments and ENJOYING one another the gods OWED them prosperity. Universally, sing, dancing, music or ORATION was and is believed to bring one into the presence of God or to bring God down to dance on the TEAM AS A PLATFORM. The gods, you see, also enjoyed the sexuality performed FOR him by the AGENTS or priests and priestesses.
THEY send forth their little ones like a flock, and their children dance. Job 21:11
THEY take the timbrel and harp, and rejoice at the sound of the ORGAN. Job 21:12
THEY spend their days in wealth (pleasure, loving, sweet, pleasant, joyful), and in a moment go down to the grave. Job 21:13
THEREFORE they say unto God, Depart from us; for we desire not the knowledge of thy ways. Job 21:14
Not only is the unholy prostitute church LUSTING for these things, their MANTRA which PROVES that they have a new revelation from the SPIRIT PERSON is that EVERYTHING IS OK: keep everyone pleasant, happy, COOL, and OUR PERSONA will be OUR way to "save more souls." Isn't that the Purpose Driven Cult repeating itself? The word WEALTH does not mean just MONEY but:
Towb (h2896) tobe; a good or good thing, a good man or woman; the GOOD, goods or good THINGS, good men or women), beautiful, best, better, bountiful, cheerful, at ease, fair word, be in favour, fine, glad, good graciously, joyful, kindly, kindness, liketh best, loving, merry, most, pleasant, / pleaseth, pleasure, precious, prosperity, ready, sweet, wealth, welfare, (be) well ([-favoured]).
NONE of the instruments of Psalm 150 were ever in the holy place or most holy place of the temple. The PRAISE word here is halal which is the same as Chalal. It means to celebrate, stultify, make boast, FEIGN self mad, rage, SHINE or give in marriage. Heylel or LUCIFER is from this praise word which spoke of LIGHT and then SOUND. In fact, all of these INSTRUMENTS have BREATH and scripture says that idols DO NOT HAVE BREATH. Therefore, because Psalm 150 is a POEM it is treated POETICALLY by scholars.
Praise him with the timbrel and dance: praise him with stringed instruments and ORGANS. Ps.150:4
This is the MUSIC component of SPIRITUAL ADULTERY which is the end-time PROSTITUTE religion focused on LOVE MAKING with music. The other component of MAKING LOVE and of spiritual PROSTITUTION involves rhetoricians or sOPHISts (serpents) or ORATORS who deliver SET SERMONS as opposed to the word SERMO which is the Latin of Paul's word meaning to DIALOG or COMMUNE one with another.
God prophesied of the end-time religion being COMMERCIAL and therefore the repeating of holy prostitution. Why is it so outrageous to say that: "Nashville, Apollo has landed" and DUG UP the Locusts, muses or musical performers. That means that without hesitation all that we know of the Bible, history and the persona of performers this is the same RELIGIOUS PROSTITUTION where people SELL their bodies and talents with no less guilt than a woman who SELLS her services. We will look at ORATORS as a peddling of this service and is propelled by SELF LOVE willing to share--for a price, always for a price.
A worldly businessman once commented that anyone or anything could be bought if the right amount of money is put on the table. It is a sad truth that many politicians can be bought if enough money or power is offered. Even some churches have been bought and sold. I speak not of church property, but of religious institutions whose announced purpose is the worship and service of God. Simon, the Samaritan Sorcerer, incurred the wrath of heaven when he thought to obtain the gift of God with money (Acts 8:19-21). As Christians struggle to survive in a secular, materialistic society they must be resolved that they will never allow themselves to be bought nor sold.
Our faith is not for sale. Our faith is codified in the New Testament of Christ. He has warned us against adding to or taking away from it (Revelation. 22:18-19). If someone dangles a million dollars before us on condition that we abandon just one of our Lord's commandments we must reject it with scorn. To compromise would be to "make shipwreck concerning the faith" (I Timothy 1:19).
Our standards are not for sale. Christ has set forth basic standards of Christian conduct and behavior for his people. Those Christian virtues and values stand in stark contrast with those of contemporary America. Pressure is felt on every side for us to compromise our standards and lower them so that impenitent sinners of the world will feel comfortable while they camp in our midst. The church in Corinth tried this and was rebuked by Paul (I Corinthians 5:1-13). This we cannot do. Anyone who wishes to be a Christian must repent and be baptized (Acts 2:38). Without repentance his baptism is no more effective than a swim in the river. Every member, great or small, is expected to "live soberly, righteously and godly in this present world" (Titus 2:12).
Our integrity is not for sale. Congregations, like individuals, have or have not integrity. Integrity means "Adherence to a code of moral... or other values: utter sincerity, honesty and candor: avoidance of deception, expediency, artificiality or shallowness of any kind" (Webster's New International Dict.). Some folks will pretend to be what they are not, if there is the prospect of gaining money or recognition. That a faithful congregation can never do. We must be faithful to our Lord and our calling if we must stand totally alone. With Job we must declare, "Till I die, I will not put away mine integrity from me" (Job. 27:5).
The leadership of our congregations is not for sale. It is not unusual for worldly churches to bestow offices upon those with wealth, influence or power. A Texas church appointed the late President Lyndon Johnson to its eldership; flagrant, calloused sinner though he was. Paul reminds us that in Christ there is neither Jew nor Greek, bond nor free, male nor female (Galatians 3:28) and we could add that there is neither banker nor borrower, nor president nor pauper, nor chief nor Indian. We are all one in Christ. Only those should asked to lead whose lives and spiritual commitment are worthy. Jude blasted those who showed respect of persons for the sake of advantage (Jude 16).
Our souls are not for sale. In literature, there are numerous stories of those who sold their souls for fame, fortune, wealth or romance. Most of us have known people who have made this tragic mistake. Churches can do the same. To have worldly respect, prominent members, large numbers, a great income, a fine house of worship, some lower their standards and forsake their Lord's paths. They do not blush to do so. For that they will pay a fearful price. That we cannot and must not do!
If being true to the Savior means that the church will remain a small band of humble disciples, forever meeting in a rented hall, so let it be. Far better is it to be little in the eyes of sinful men and to be blessed in the eyes of the heavenly Father. When Satan comes inquiring, may he always find posted on the door of every church, in large, bright letters, a sign reading, NOT FOR SALE.
Remember that Stephen said that God turned Israel over to worship the Heavenly Host. Lucifer is identical to several terms related to the Astrial Deities. What we see--especially under the MONARCHY where the elders fired God and hired a DOMINANT PASTOR to fight their battles--is a king, kingdom, temple and worship "like the nations." God said that the kings were to lead them into captivity and death because in rejecting God (Christ the Spirit) they were TERMINAL and were still blind until they TURNED to the Lord whi is THAT Spirit (2 Cor. 3).
Rubel Shelly sees the Exodus as a PATTERN for our own worship and community (commune). He and everyone else greedly run to the Levitical Warrior musicians (noise makers) whose service was HARD BONDAGE which is Abaddown, Abaddon, Apollyon or Apollo for PROOF TEXT. Remember that Bruce White runs to the PRIESTOOD for tithing authority. This began as a connection between LUCIFER and ZOE as Saturn, Venus (Lucifer-Zoe), Jupiter (the harvester) and the S.U.N. god instead of the S.O.N. God.j
hêlios which connects with all of the LIFE words including ZOE is the sun-god identified with APOLLO pollo, Dionysus, D.Chr.31.11, etc.
2. Hêliou astêr, of the planet Saturn, astêr, Choerob.):--star (v. astron), aster' opôrinôi, Arktouros the chief star in the constellation, shooting star or METEOR. Aster or STAR always meant a PERFORMING STAR.
Arktouros the star Arcturus, Bearward, the time of his HELIACAL RISING. i.e. the middle of SEPTEMBER
opôrinos , late summer, aster' opôrinôi Sirius, the star whose rising marked the beginning of that season
opôra the part of the year between the rising of Sirius and of Arcturus (i.e. the last days of July, all Aug., and part of Sept.),
And another angel came out of the temple, crying with a loud voice to him that sat on the cloud, Thrust in thy sickle, and reap: for the time is come for thee to reap; for the harvest of the earth is RIPE. Re.14:15
The word MELODY in Hebrew also means a PRUNING HOOK!
Opora (g3703) op-o'-rah; appar. from the base of 3796 and 5610; prop. even-tide of the (summer) season (DOG-days), i.e. (by impl.) ripe FRUIT: - fruit.
Let both grow together until the harvest: and in the time of harvest I will say to the reapers, Gather ye together first the tares, and bind them in bundles to burn them: but gather the wheat into my barn. Mt.13:30
Grow together speaks of something such as the Word which bound both the good and evil together until SUDDENLY as if a miracle had come, the SYNAGOG of Satan popped up to divide.
Sundesmos (g4886) soon'-des-mos; from 4862 and 1199; a joint tie, i.e. ligament, (fig.) uniting principle, ontrol: - band, bond.
And not holding the Head, from which all the body by joints and bands having nourishment ministered, and knit together, increaseth with the increase of God. Col.2:19
This gathering speaks of the chaff is the MARK that the church is being carried off as BOOTY by those "navigating the winds of change"
Sullego (g4816) sool-leg'-o; from 4862 and 3004 in its orig. sense; to collect: - gather (together, up).
sulagôgeô, ( [sulon] ) carry off as booty, lead captive
Sule speaks of "seizing the ship or cargo" believing that it belongs to them: it is a reprisal meaning to be ENGAGED IN PRIVATEERING. Taking the booty from warfare. The similar Greek word is APOSTERIZO meaning PLEONEXIEA or GETTING MORE THAN MY SHARE: "the character and conduct of a pleonektês, greediness, grasping, assumption, arrogance.
We noted that HERESY means to LIFT UP something which belongs to you to carry it away for their OWN use. The weapon is singing which PLEASURES or creates an EXCITING "worship service." Unfortunately, it is the worship of a STAR or STARS. A similat word is Hupekklepto meaning to shoplift or carry off SECRETLY.
Similar to: hupek-kleptô , carry off secretly, hupekklapenta
Col 2:[5]WEB For though I am absent in the flesh, yet am I with you in the spirit, rejoicing and seeing your order, and the steadfastness of your faith in Christ. [6] As therefore you received Christ Jesus, the Lord, walk in him, [7] rooted and built up in him, and established in the faith, even as you were taught, abounding in it in thanksgiving. [8] Be careful that you don't let anyone ROB you through his philosophy and vain deceit, after the tradition of men, after the elements of the world, and not after Christ.
Or: [8] Blepete mê tis humas estai ho SULAGOGON dia tês PHILOSOPHIAS kai kenês apatês kata tên paradosin tôn anthrôpôn, kata ta stoicheia tou kosmou kai ou kata Christon:
sulagôgeô, ( [sulon] ) carry off as booty, lead captive, includes: rob, despoil, ton OIKEN. This means to DESPOIL THE HOUSE or OIKOS which includes to: Despoil the House oikos the house of a god, a temple, your FAMILY and HOUSEHOLD GOODS--Substance
If you are not ASSEMBLED to give heed to the Words of Christ in song and sermon, the word Sunago (g4863) to lead together, i.e. collect or convene; SPECIFICIALLY to entertain (hospitably)
In a hostile sense, join battle, begin the battle-strife, polemon or "preaching as a Profit."
It means to "pit two warriors one against the other, engage in fight, Collect or LEVY soldiers, collect slaves for work.
If you grasp the Vineyard, Newwineskin or Joel's Army you know that these people believe that they are going to be God's NEW right hand man (Jesus was the old HAND). They will hand out rewards and KILL those who oppose their rulership.
However:
And the FRUITS that thy soul lusted after are departed from thee, and all things which were dainty and goodly are departed from thee, and thou shalt find them no more at all. Rev 18:14
The FRUITS are defined by ALL of the Bible and secular history: They are the ones who COLLECT. They are the ones who ENTERTAIN. They are the ones who LEVY soldiers and their money by the 40 DAY temptation process and THEY are the ones who LEVY a tax or tithe on you to pay THEM for what God in Christ has already done. Proof of what the TRAFFICKERS uses as ODEING to LIFT UP you, your family and your FINANCES for their OWN use and pleasuring. This process is the only real meaning of HERESY.
And the voice of harpers, and musicians, and of pipers, and trumpeters, shall be heard no more at all in thee; and no craftsman, of whatsoever craft he be, shall be found any more in thee; and the sound of a millstone shall be heard no more at all in thee; Rev 18:22
Nashville, Apollo has landed. This is one tiny step for man but one GIANT leap of apostasy and loss when God sends in Saturn or Apollo to HARVEST the crop to be stamped in a vast WINEVAT. Yes, the PRUNING HOOK is a musical instrument in Hebrew.
YOU think about the MARKS because the Apollos with the MUSES (locusts as musical performers) will lie and cannot find ANY EXCEPT. Paul would say that little does it matter because fools love to be fooled.
Again I say: the Bible uses words of ITS culture. To understand we cannot follow Rubel Shelly and crew and work out OUR salvation which he believes allows only the COMMUNITY to read, interpret and speak the NEW meanings which we work out in PARTNERSHIP with an Infinite God based on OUR CULTURE. Sure, we translate Homer by using the meanings of words in Russian!
These "pregnant" words POINT to the meaning of concepts which, beginning in Genesis, are WORLDY concepts used by Satan for his children and agents. Moses was inspired to write to REPUDIATE the concepts of Babylonianism. They created man as a "labor saving device" out of clay and the blood of an evil god: blow in the lower end of the little clay man (pipe) and the gods (elohim) poured forth breath (spirit) which they claimed was inspired. This has not changed.
The available resources for any WORD is like a huge lake: dip in at any point and you will find concepts which are ALWAYS evil on the human plain. God's grace is not 'unlimited forgiveness for unlimited sins' but translating us to a spiritual plain where grace is the POWER to follow the will of God WITHOUT any sexual bribery.
We have noted that to be grace centered boasts of being charismatic or perverted and there is NO exception in the POOL of THAT culture. When John spoke of the locusts with scorpion tails a student of that time would know that he was pointing to the MUSES (all liberal arts) as locusts as musical performers. They were UNDER Apollo or Abaddon who, restoring his ancient seeker center or Oracle of Delphi has turned the locust loose to pour forth smoke and haze using music and sexual perversion. Is there any reason to doubt that when you connect pleasuring the erotic centers with music my BRING ON continuous seeking and thinking of what will reproduce that feeling.
The sting in the tail is something like singing HIGH PITCHED human odes or hymns. Clapping or body drumming is the MARK of the locust. The Jewish encyclopedia and the human experience of a sensitive mind would see modering 'singing' as screeching or howling. A Musicologist says that it contains but masks the DOG BARKS at midnight or the WATER DRIPS of a Chinese torture chamber. I try to be systematic but the RESOURCES but it just overwhelms you and STILL there is nothing about external "worship" performed by locusts which is not RADICALLY CONDEMNED. It's all Satan's victory and the fact that a few OUTERS turned the NEW STYLE WORSHIP loose by lying about all of the Bible is one of Satan's lying wonders: It would be hard to find anything in history--including the Red Sea--which has been more miraculously FLASHING like lightening (Phos, Aster, Lucifer, Zoe) all around the world.
The locusts in Revelation separate or MARK people into two SECTS. The faithful, word and baptism marked people just FLEE as one of the EFFECTS OF music which produces endorphins. For those marked by Apollo (Cain means a musical note), they THINK that they are having a supernatural but admitted sexual climax with the "spirit." (Carol Wimber, Vineyard and all maddening musical prophesying). However, it is a fact that high pitched or complex harmony GRINDS the soul into bits (Psallo, Sop). They HOLD the lost captive until the time of Judgment. Believe me, the total history (Enoch, Jubilees, Adam and Eve, etc) is that when you have been STUNG the effect is a rise in homosexuality and you will NEVER GET back into the presence of the Living Word. Romans 1 speaks of the Garden of Eden, the Flood and Israel in Canaan.
Skorpios means a scorpion or an ENGINE of WAR for discharging ARROWS. We have tried to get the point across that MELODY or PSALLO speaks of literal arrows of Apollo intending to SHOOT your heart and make you dead. The so called "musical" connection is that of singing EXTERNAL hymns which is equivalent to "pulling the bowstring and SUDDENLY letting it go to LEAVE A MARK." Hymns are also SHOT OUT as are love arrows. Pan the perverted half goat (beast) and cupid are examples.
Skorpios like sOPHISts (serpent) has a hidden meaning: s"KORPIOS"
Kopis is a CHOPPER or CLEAVER or broad curved knife just as CARNAL WEAPON includes LIFELESS INSTRUMENTS. The pruning hooks means to PLUCK to gather in.
The purpose is "to strike, smite, knock dowwn, to cut off, chop off, of ships, to be shattered or disabled by the enemy, stricken in mind
Also: To hammer, forge, stamp (Mark) to coin oneself money, to cut small, chop up or pound in a mortar. Psallo or melody means to "twitch or twang" is from Psocho meaning to TRITURATE or grind into a fine powder..
Skorpios also points to beat one's breast through grief. Epikopto means to STRIKE down and then to mourn for any one, cut short, bring down from high estate, check, impede, PRAXEIS, reprove: philosophers refute, it means charaktêra stamp which is the MARK. Smite one's breast, wail for of disease, afflict. injure, hêdonai which connects to volupto.
This sounds like the tettix or locusts as the Choerob: Cicala, Cicada, a winged insect fond of basking on trees, when the male makes a chirping or clicking noise by means of certain drums or 'tymbals' underneath the wings
And when they shall say unto you, Seek unto them that have familiar spirits (a sounding empty wineskin), and unto wizards that PEEP (Chirp), and that mutter: should not a people seek unto their God? for the living to the DEAD? Is.8:19
To the law and to the testimony: if they speak not according to this word, it is because there is no light in them. Is 8:20
And they shall pass through it, hardly bestead and hungry: and it shall come to pass, that when they shall be hungry, they shall fret themselves, and curse their king and their God, and look upward. Is 8:21
They hoped to get Jesus and others to SING and DANCE while they piped. The songs were threnodes which were songs FOR and WITH the dead as Amos warned. Thrêneô sing a dirge, wail, Mousai (muses) aoidên . . ethrêneon were singing a doleful dirge, oxutonous ôidas, epôidas ; humnou.
Pxutonos, on, sharp-sounding, piercing. of sound. The connected word cheroplêktos means on, struck by the hand, cheroplêktoi . . doupoi the sound of beating with the hand, It means phreno manês, distracted, maddened, phreno-morôs , Adv., ( [moros] ) suffering from a calamity to the mind, Or MANIA the MADNESS of those in Corinth who spoke and sang out of their OWN minds or spirits. The uncovered PROPHESIERS in 1 Cor 11:5 had probably been the singers, clappers and pretenders to inspiration in the pagan oracles. However, the Corinthians DID NOT speak gibberish which was ONLY the product of MANIA produced by music, drugs, body motions and PROFIT.
In the literature moira means A part as opposite the Whole; division of a people, of an army, a political party; portion or share which falls to one, esp. in the distribution of booty
The "scholars" have been blinded or intentionally closed their minds in order to become MUSICALLY SECTARIAN to "carry off their share of the booty." Don't they all write books, songs and sell CDs and follow the LUCIFER PRINCIPLE of bleeding off worship due ONLY to a SPIRIT God in our own SPIRIT devoted to the WORD as it has been taught?
Kathaireô: put down, CLOSE THE EYES OF THE DEAD, of sorcerers, bring down from the sky, overpower, seize, fetch down as a reward or prize of the Agonist: like the simple HAIREIN meaning to take and carry off. We showed you the connection between Aireo which is LIFTING them up by EXCITEMENT. The TOOL is Aoding with non-Biblical, erotic praise songs which strokes all of the pleasure centers.
We told you that to FALL from the presence of the Living Word in The Book of Enoch as explained in three dozen other documents meant that they were SPIRITUALLY dead. They had been seduced to come down to the dark soil of the Cainites (Kenites, Jerusalem Jews) by the use of wine women and song. As explained in Romans 1 the purpose was to fracture souls so that perverted sexuality was so that SATAN the elder could enjoy you. That is why all religious musicians were known as the "harem of the gods."
The CULTURE of that period where Shelly etal says that the people WORKED out their salvation meaning to "partner with God" to produce the Bible, shows us that music was to induce sexual perversion or to superstitiously worship the DEAD.
Sophocles, Ajax (ed. Sir Richard Jebb)
Chorus
Surely his mother, companion of antiquity and [625] grey with age, when she hears that he has been afflicted with the ruin of his mind will raise a loud cry of wailing. It is not the nightingale's piteous lament [630] that she, unhappy, will sing. Rather in SHRILL-toned odes the dirge will rise, while the hollow sound of BEATING HANDS and the shredding of grey hair will fall upon her breast.
Absolutely, they are wailing for the woes coming upon them but they will not grasp it because their misleaders have convinced them that WORSHIP is Enthus O mania or MADNES (or puking) which proved that it was "the god within." By repudiating Baptism (without the weasel words) they have REFUSED to request A holy spirit so they can discern the Word. Discern does not mean new revelation: it means that God removes the veil so that it is POSSIBLE to read words like SPEAK and not translate it to mean SING CHARISMATICALLY.
Sophocles, Electra (ed. Sir Richard Jebb)
Chorus
[233] It is nevertheless with goodwill, like a true-hearted mother, [235] that I dissuade you from BEGETTIN misery upon miseries.
Electra
"[236] But what limit has nature begot for my affliction? Tell me, how can it be right to NEGLECT the DEAD? Has such a seed been sown in any mortal? May I never have such men's esteem; [240] never, when I am close to prosperity, may I dwell in ease, hindering the wings of SHRILL lamentation so as to deprive my begetter of his HONORS!
"For if the dead is to lie a wretch, merely dust and nothingness, [245] while his slayers do not pay back to him blood for blood in penalty, [250] then shame and reverence will vanish from all humanity.
That is why Jesus cast the musical minstrels out like dung: they were continuing the most ancient and ignorant superstition: that you can WORK REAL hard using speech and music to INFLUNCE God Who IS NOT DEAD and therefore He will CAST you out like Lucifer was CAST OUT which in Hebrew means: "To take your inheritance, prune your vines (melody), play the flute, pollute or prostitute as in Revelation 18:22.
The OLD WIVES TALES or babbling included the catalog of songs which were ALWAYS personal until the person was DEAD. For instance, if you sing Fanny Cosby then you speak where Twila speaks and therefore you WORSHIP her. Jesus is not DEAD and therefore only HE has the right to control His songs and sermons and YOU have no authority to make substitutes: unless you confess that He IS dead as the core gospel demands. It always seemed like VICTORY songs as at Mount Sinai but God was pouring out His wrath and they looked to the outsiders as LAUGINGSTOCKS or GAZINGSTOCKS (Theater or spectacle of pseudo worship). In Corinth, they looked MAD or insane pointing directly to the SCORPIONS or LOCUSTS who STING you with maddening music whose words are Anti-Christ because they lament Him as dead.
Amos used a word which says that they, and you, were have a musical festival WITH and FOR dead ancestors. The book of Revelation speaks to these superstitious musical laments and told us that the Dead who die in the Lord are happy: they HOLD and never PLAY their harps. Go thou and do likewise.
Some of the expressions derived from the above post follow—they’re bolded or underscored. These expressions well describe the “musical festival” during the assembly in which Keith Lancaster is THE “WORSHIP LEADER.” In case you, as a reader, didn’t know, the assembly or gathering of the saints, by “contemporary worship” standards, is not worship unless there is a Worship Leader. Therefore, the Worship Leader leads his followers, the regular folks, into God’s presence … Wow! [Please check this out in your Bible and let me know your findings]:
Our heavenly Father, Whom we worship, does not have a “Praise Team.” But Mr. Lancaster’s “Praise Team” is his “musical performers” in the worship theatre. They are the “SCORPIONS or LOCUSTS who STING you with maddening music … The sting in the tail is something like singing HIGH PITCHED human odes or hymns.” One Sunday this month, the Praise Team was humming the tune to “The Old Rugged Cross” during the partaking of the cup. Why? Well, it was performance. Keith’s team could have just as easily sung the words: “On a hill far away stood an old rugged cross, the emblem of suffering and shame … I will cling to the old rugged cross, and exchange it some day for a crown.”
So what happens when the NEW STYLE WORSHIP is turned loose? The EFFECTS OF music which produces endorphins are evident. They hope to get Jesus and others to SING and DANCE while they pipe. Again, on that Sunday, the Worship Leader and his team were singing, “This Is How We Overcome.” That same line is sung and repeated at least 7 times in a row in the song. What an experience it was for me personally [being facetious here, I think] when some commotion caught my attention during the singing of that song. You see, the song has these words: “You have turned my mourning into dancing; you have turned my sorrow into joy….” It was there in plain view: two young men were actually making a 360-degree turn [they performed this twice] while singing “you have turned.” At the end of this musical piece, the Worship Leader initiated the congregational applause, and the regular rhythmic hand clappers “obeyed” the Worship Leader.
Donnie, thanks for the comments: it all fits the prophesied pattern. And, in Paul's words, since fools love to be fooled, they are just gulping down the KoolAid and loving it. That would bother me just as Waco troubled me if they were not doing what they have CHOSEN to do long ago. People take the wrong fork in the road and it is utterly impossible to get off the buss. My advice in the coming months is to GET OFF and walk with Jesus. I am not a prophet but all of the evidence points to mid September to Mid October as Joe's festival marked by the STAR'S Heliacal rising. Aster or star ALWAYS carried the meaning of an abnormal but abnormally appealing personality.
I sometimes wonder if I am being led down a rabbit hole filled with rattlesnakes when I look at the Greek and Hebrew resources. I could accept my delusion as accused IF I could launch into the resources ANY WHERE and NOT find our new style "worship leaders" identical to those of the pagan temples where, as Carol Wimber (Vineyard, aka New Wineskins symbol) claims that the NEXT TO LAST act was having sex with the Spirit--Just before 'giving of means.' It has been prophesied in ALL respects if you look for the SIGNS as covered with smoke and haze. Satan's sons would not be wiser than the sons of God if they could be easily detected. I thrill when I catch a glimpse of the "woman" called Lilith in the Jewish legends: after the ACT OF WORSHIP Adam was surprised as what a huge, hideous, repulsive creature she was.
You will remember that when Saul was TURNED into another man the word means PERVERT. His manic prophesying turned the masculine warriors against him until God proved that he could lead. Demanding a king or "dominant elder" was the final blow and God intended to lead the CHILDREN from Canaan land into Babylon. The musical Levites were not WORSHIP LEADERS but WARRIOR musicians intending to PANIC you to death or captivity while making you FEEL the joy of the foreplay. Yes, she is the Babylonian Prostitute: named CIRCE in John's symbols which the "new style preacher" need to denounce.
We know that THEIR LEADING was into captivity and death. These were the same "Levites" who strangely had Canaanite names for their bands and who were still PIPING (to steal your inheritance, to pollute, to prostitute in Hebrew) hoping that John wore SOFT clothing and Jesus and others would sing and dance to prove their TURNING (twice 360 degrees) covers the KOSMOS.
If we believe Jesus these are spirits from old. John says that Abaddon or Apollyon would dig up the locusts or musical ministers. They will MARK or separate those with the MARK of the beast from those who have the MARK of the Word and baptism. The "plagues" in revelation sound like someone coming to your AID with a used needle.
The Jewish clergy was not made up of true Jews: they claimed to have Abraham for their father but Jesus said that they had the wrong spiritual MOTHER. Hagar speaks of Egypt, Mount Sinai, Jerusalem and Slavery. They were Kenites or Cainites or Canaanites but not Israelites. Therefore, John calls Jerusalem Egypt and Sodom. Because Satan (Lucifer, Zoe, Abaddon) is not a fool, and we know that most churches have been TAKEN CAPTIVE, it would be an outrage if he had not FILLED the pulpit which God in Christ never declared empty.
The anti-God clergy wanted to MARK Jesus as DIONYSUS (son of Zeus) or the New Wineskin "god" who was part of the abomination of desolation in the holy precincts at Jerusalem. Josephus speaks of the Levitical Singers who wanted to put on linen (clergy) garments and sing again. They were warned that they (LEVITICAL MUSICIANS) had led the nation into captivity and death once and they would do it again. But, Jesus did not BOW to Baal and that is the image of CASTING OUT the musical minstrels LIKE DUNG as Lucifer (Zoe) had been cast out at first. The dance was the "rising up to play" which David performed in the buff:
Orcheomai of the Pyrrhic dance, playing the flute, singing hymns:
Schema: Play the flute and 2. appearance, OPPOSITE the reality, show, pretense, fashion, manner, a figure in Dancing, figures, gestures. The MUSES in Revelation 18:22 cut a figure fit for hell.
2. represent by dancing or pantomime, orcheisthai tên tou Kronou teknophagian, o. ton Aianta (Atlas)
Kronos ho, Cronos, is BIOS. Later interpreted as, = CHRONOS, cf. Arist.Mu.401a15. Bios, ho, life, i. e. not animal life ([ZOE]), but MODE of life
2. He is the planet SATURN (666). This is the MARK of Farmer's Branch SABBATON or the Babylon seventh day worship: hêmera Saturday, Hêmeros, sabbatôn, title of Artemis in Arcadia,
II. nickname for a dotard, old fool. He is like Jupiter whose SICKLE in Hebrew is the name of a MUSICAL INSTRUMENT.
Kronos or bios or MODES of life is associated with Rhe who is Zoe or Eve of whom Paul warned the usurping, run ahead women. He is associated with ZEUS and PAIS which the PLAY the perverted clergy wanted to engage Jesus in the market place or AGORA or place of assembly--church, no less.
The dancing with Kronos or Zoe or Eve was for the purpose of:
teknophagian meaning the devouring of children
II. metaph., leap, bound, orcheitai de kardia phobôi A.Ch.166 , cf. Anaxandr.59 ; Thessaliê ôrchêsato Thessaly SHOOK, TREMBLED, Call.Del.139.
Kardia is heart or the center of joy or fear.
More Orcheomai When the hands lift up and the voice goes shrill and the body begins to gyrate it is not WORSHIP: it is FEAR. Pure Panic caused by Pan the homosexual BEAST in the book of Revelation where his ten horns are his PANpipes representing little goats trying to rise above the plains to LOOK TO THE HILLS.
Phobos , ho, ( [phebomai] ) panic flight, the usual sense in Hom. He is Apollo or Apollôn who creates THERAS thêras phobôi or fear of the WILD BEASTS (parallel to ZOE, the BEAST and "female instructing principle"). He/she creates panic and the rejecting of scruples.
The PLAY at Mount Sinai and the PROPHESYING when Saul was TURNED and David's naked dance was ALWAYS something reserved for women or strange men. When males begin to twitch mark it down that a signal has been sent and received.
When we LOVE someone we understand that it is a personal thing: when we LOVE God there are no fathers and brethren to make it WORK. When we worship God is it also personal and it is one of the most obscene and outrageous things that DUES PAYING AUDIENCES set still to hire someone to DO or LEAD the worship. That puts you back at base ZERO with absolutely no spiritual knowledge left. Remember the talents: if you don't use YOUR approach to God He will take it away from you. A sign of lostness beyond redemption is sitting in the spectator's seat and applauding those who spirit in the face of a Holy God. God gives us no burden for the blind.
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I have to jump in here. My daughter and I really got into CC music years ago. We got so burned out on the whole thing, we haven't listened to it in 3 years. I was just talking with my 17 year old daughter and she was saying it all seemed so "artificial".
Let me give you a little background. My mother was a nanny for a man that was in advertising and entertainment here in Tulsa. He handled a few of the top names in CC music. He had to quit because the whole situation brought him so close to losing his faith. He said that some of his clients would be walking around taking God's name in vain immediately before the concert would start, "praise God through the concert", then after it was over, go back to their potty mouths and hateful attitudes. He also had one of his clients, one of the biggest names in CC music, joke with him all the time that a few times, girls would come up to him after a concert and say, "God told me you were here and lonely and wants me to offer myself to you" This top name in CC said he had taken the opportunity to avail himself of the "services" the girls offered because "who was he to argue with God". He said that not all of the CC entertainers were like this, but more were like this than you'd imagine. He was so upset about the whole thing and quit promoting CC entertainers all together.
Another thing...back in October of 2003, Michael W. Smith and Mercy Me came here to Tulsa for a concert. During the concert, Bart Millard gave a speech about what he thought heaven would be like. After the speech, they showed a video of teens testifying about what they thought heaven would be like. One young man on the video said, "heaven will be full of hot girls where you can do anything you want with them" Then audience laughed and there were a few cheers. What a thing to say! It was planned, too. It was on a video that was shown. They knew what was on the video. The next day, the Tulsa World's music writer wrote a review of the concert and quoted this statement. How embarassing for the christian community. Some people around here were complaining about the statement, but others were saying, "whatever it takes to bring kids to the Lord". And it was "un-christian to criticize a brother in Christ"
My daughter and I went to a 4-Him concert a few years ago. We really enjoyed the music, but the way some of the teen girls were dressed and what they were yelling out to the group didn't sound "christian" at all. It sounded like they were worshipping the guys instead of the Lord.
While I'm on my tirade, when we used to watch CC music videos to TV, we got to noticing that "some" of the ladies singing were dressing very provacatively and trying to act sexy while singing these "praise" songs. Made us uncomfortable.
I'm not saying "all" CC entertainers are like this. The thing is, if your children listen to these artists, please keep reminding them not to start worshipping the artist. I could tell a lot of girls, imparticular, were so infatuated with these singers at the concerts that their minds were only on the singer, not the Lord. I've taken heat for expressing my viewpoints on this before, and I'm sure I will again. I realize that "nobody's perfect", but those that hold themselves up as contemporary worship entertainers should be more careful about their personal and private lives.
I did have a lot of respect for Rich Mullins, though. He may have had me fooled, but he seemed sincere and like he loved God."
I personally don't listen to Christian rock or Christian contemporary or whatever you call it, but I think this poster's experiences with it says a lot about what's possibly behind a lot of it, as well as the dangerous emotions and feelings that it can stimulate. This type of music is closely associated with the "praise team contemporary type singing" that has invaded such churches as Madison.
Dan Lucanrini's book, "Why I Left the Contemporary Christian Music Movement: Confessions of a Former Worship Leader," presents much revealing information about the mindset of the CC music industry from one who was on the "inside." Just as the poster on the IBelieve site told of the ungodly lives that many (but not all) CC performers led, Lucarini tells a similar story from personal experiences.
At the church where I was a former member, CC music reigned. On one Sunday before Christmas, the "praise team" presented several rock renditions of traditional Christmas carols during a worship service. As the drums crashed, as the beat pounded, and as the electric guitars screeched, some of the teenage girls standing in the pews were swaying their hips and gyrating to the rhythm, as if they were in a secular rock concert, as if they were "coming on" to the performer and "gettin' down."
At that same service, a man came on stage and presented a solo rendition of "What Child Is This?" on the electric guitar. The performance began in traditional fashion, then suddenly he let loose with the wildest rock/jazz arrangement while prancing, jumping back and forth, and waving his instrument around in the air. The crowd went crazy with thunderous applause and jumped to their feet in a standing ovation. Was the crowd's response indicative of worshiping God or the performer?
"Whatever it takes to get kids to the Lord" is the pragmatic philosophy of the Change Movement. Yet by choosing the world's music for the Church, that philosophy deliberately ignores and defies Romans 12:2 and James 4:4.
I think your church has missed it. Sorry to say. When someone isnt allowed to show emotion that is sad. Is it wrong to tap your foot? Where is the authority for the song leader to use his hand to lead? Let stop picking out the specs out of each others eyes.
I think the preceding is a “dislocated” post (August 20, 2004, 4:45 PM). It appears to be “in response to” the initial post, an article by Terry Mattingly titled, “WORSHIP FOR SALE, WORSHIP FOR SALE.” Yet, not really—since it said, “I think your church has missed it.” Go figure and see what this poster really meant by “your church.” Oh, well….
“When someone isn’t allowed to show emotion?” Emotion—yes! Performance—no! Shedding tears of joy when someone becomes a child of God—that’s emotion! When someone does loud programmed, rhythmic and rehearsed handclapping to get God’s attention, as well as the attention of those in attendance—that’s cheerleading and performance!
“Is it wrong to tap your foot?” No … just don’t step on someone else’s foot. No … unless I hear the annoying noise from where I sit in the balcony. No … unless it is a distraction to those near or around you. It is definitely not wrong when you do it and you’re all alone.
“Where is the authority for the song leader to use his hand to lead?” [I’m glad you did not mention “contemporary worship leader”—ah … the “leader” who leads his “followers,” the regular folks, into God’s holy presence. That would be a different topic altogether.]
Well, that’s a fair question regarding someone who leads or starts singing. But that’s really like asking where is the authority for using air conditioning or heating during worship—that you can answer yourself. I must say, though, that I have yet to hear the sound or noise produced during the hand motion. Now, when it becomes distracting, the hand probably deserves a slap.
“Let stop picking out the specs out of each others eyes.” I think I understand what you’re trying to say here. I also understand that it is not a question. But this statement has been thrown at those who do not succumb to the pressures of change in DOCTRINE, beliefs and practices where changes are either wrong or unnecessary. These are folks who stand for the truth and who see no need to improve upon God’s will for the church. WHY DON’T WE REVERSE THE SITUATION? Why don’t you tell the change agents instead? They’re the ones who have created these problems in the first place! Uh-oh!
Arguments over merely tapping your foot to a hymn and nothing more in a worship service would seem trite and trivial. But it's a far different matter when churches subscribing to the Change Movement take on the look and feel of performing arts centers with worship services that cannot otherwise be distinguished from pop-rock concerts, Broadway musicals, and nightclub floor shows.
Biblical passages such as Romans 12:2 and James 4:4 admonish Christians to be a separate group from the world, that is, not to conform to the world's standards. This certainly means to exclude the world's influences from worship. But by bringing the world's music and other worldly gimmicks into worship services (drama, dance routines, skits, praise teams, rock bands, choirs, orchestras, soloists, ensemble groups, other instrumentalists, etc.), the worship becomes like the world by adopting its appearances, sounds, and actions. Instead of being holy and reverent, such worship becomes nothing but "entertainment," designed to please the crowd, not to adore God.
Contrary to the philosophy of many, a worship service is not the place to promote "talent" and receive the accolades of men. There are concert halls and theaters in abundance where performers who live for the spotlight and applause can shake and gyrate their bodies provocatively to provocative music and have their dreams fulfilled. Promoting such "talent" only focuses attention on the performer, which is expected in the theater; in a worship service, a performer only robs God of His glory with attention to self.
God needs neither our "talent" nor our gimmicks; he desires our unadulterated worship.
We at this web site battle the unbiblical Change Movement by promoting adherence to all biblical principles, especially those as set forth in Romans 12:2, James 4:4, Matt. 7:15, Romans 16:17, and First Cor. 14:40. By doing so, have we really "missed it"? Friends, we're right on target.
Here is a link just received in the mail. It reports on all of the MEGA-MOUTHS in the spiritual daisy chain of self-promoting "ministries" and "book of the Mouth club" well reported on by John Waddey.
Old Al Maxey rides on the backs of working people and must spend about 100% of his time scooping up LEGALISMS which we violate. The premise is that this gives us the authority to use INSTRUMENTAL MUSIC in "worship." His latest is that the definition of the Show Bread was that it must be WHEATEN. But, lordy, here we got a girl who is allergic to WHEATEN so what are we gonna do if we have to make BARLEY bread for communion?
Well, firstly, we not gonna use his proof text for authority because it ALSO included some innocent animals to be crucified to MAKE the priests pure enough to eat the shewbread. Now, in the Tabernacle and later Temple, the showbread was in the Holy Place where no singer, musician or preacher could dare to go. That symbolized the synagogue (for the civil state only) while the "common" people synagogued where loud instruments and singing were outlawed for BOTH.
Barley and rye were connected with Babylonism which the Law repudiated in its symbols. Both barley and rye had been used to invent beer. Both supported ERGOT the component of LSD.
Secondly, the import of LEAVEN in the Bible and the Greek resources preaches against people who in honoring the death of Christ tend to SWELL UP. The word is directly related to AEIRO which is almost identical to ODING. People inflated themselves and the "audience" with singing and music to FERMENT them in order to CARRY THEM AWAY for their own use. This is the meaning of HERESY.
Thirdly, the word in connection with the Lord's Supper does not restrict itself to wheat. In the writings of the time leaven and intoxicants were connected. I have never heard of anyone in the "non-instrumental churches of Christ" (A RACA or curse word) dividing over the "bread." Therefore, Al Maxey defends the SECTARIANS who were those who ADDED instruments after 1850 years of almost no one using them. By their intimate connection in word definitions, SECTARIANISM or HERESY was and is almost always FACILITATED by the use of OEDING to help the preacher LIFT up himself and the audience with the SPECIFIC PURPOSE of "carrying them away for his/her OWN use and profit."
I have linked to Ezekiel which links to some others in the GRACE CENTERED STABLE:
6. Now as many of the Levites, (26) which is a tribe of ours, as were singers of hymns, persuaded the king to assemble a sanhedrim, and to give them leave to wear linen garments, as well as the priests
for they said that this would be a work worthy the times of his government, that he might have a memorial of such a novelty, as being his doing.
Nor did they fail of obtaining their desire; for the king, with the suffrages of those that came into the sanhedrim, granted the singers of hymns this privilege, that they might lay aside their former garments,
and wear such a linen one as they desired; and as a part of this tribe ministered in the temple,
he also permitted them to learn those hymns as they had besought him for.
Now all this was contrary to the laws of our country, which, whenever they have been transgressed, we have never been able to avoid the punishment of such transgressions.
ALL of those on their hate campaigns against NON-INSTRUMENTAL churches use the same lying MANTRA that they became anti-musical SECTARIANS when they refused to participate in churches which FORCED instruments onto them. They have to lie about God, the Bible, church history, restoration history and the VERY MEANING of words. But the story of Enoch, Jubilees, Adam and Eve and 3 dozen other posted resources is that when people MOUTH or USE their defense of legalistic and superstitious MIND CONTROL to 'suppliment God' they have fallen from grace and they will never get up. The story of Genun (Jubal etal) proves that they are OBSESSED (Abcessed) with trying to get people to AFFIRM their heresy.
If you can READ Dr. Crumps statement you will understand that the VOODOO beat (modern "hymns" all) deliberately TAPS INTO a God-given instinct intended to PROTECT you from the growl of a saber toothed tiger just behind you. If you make a "religion" out of exciting or inciting this instinct and then LYING by telling people that the PANIC FEELING (Pan the beast of the "horns" perverted and all the rest) is the LITTLE SPIRIT fellow jumping and jiving--are by Satan's indwelling--mortally damaging souls; making them FLY according to Ezekiel using musical prophesiers. Spiritual people will ALWAYS feel the sickness being imposed upon them to make the PLATES TINKLE and flee, or while passing the Sirens, stuff their ears with wax.
“A Refresher Course in Instrumental Music” (by John Waddey)
January 20 2007, 5:05 PM
A Refresher Course in Instrumental Music
A century has passed and the wheel of error has turned full circle. That which our predecessors took as a settled issue has now revived in our own ranks. This is not a dispute with representatives of the Disciples of Christ, Christian Churches, or some denominational body. These advocates are our own brethren. They have turned their backs on the worship they embraced and practiced when they first came to Christ and his church, preferring the ways of men to that.
They have no new arguments to offer. Most of them simply reason it doesn’t matter to God how we offer our praise to Him. This old error is like the virus that struck the little child with chicken pox and then 60 years later struck again as shingles. Never forget that Truth makes us free from error and sin (John 8:32). Prepare yourself, teach your brethren, confront and defeat all who try to corrupt the worship of the church. The following books will amply supply the needed ammunition to defeat the advocates of instrumental music.
Instrumental Music in Worship. M. C. Kurfees (Order from the Gospel Advocate, P.O. Box 150, Nashville, TN 37210.)
Otey-Briney Debate. W.W. Otey and J.B. Briney (instruments and missionary societies).
Stark-Warlick Debate. J. Carroll Stark and Joe S. Warlick (instrumental music in worship).
Hardeman-Boswell Debate. N.B. Hardeman and Ira Boswell (instrumental music in worship).
Wallace-Barber Debate. G.K. Wallace and Burton Barber (instruments in worship).
Wallace-Hunt Debate. G.K. Wallace and Julian Hunt (instruments in worship).
Shelly-Dunning Debate. Rubel Shelly and Dewaine Dunning (instruments in worship).
Highers-Bingham Debate. Alan Highers and Given Blakely (instruments in worship).
Of course these books vary in the capabilities and scholarship of the disputants. But in them you will find virtually every argument man has devised to justify the use of instruments of music in worship and adequate replies thereto. The valuable books can likely be found in the libraries of Christian Schools. Some will allow checkouts. JHW
[Source: Christianity: then & now (John Waddey, Editor; Volume 6, Number 6, February 1, 2007)]
Ray Downen from the Christian Church began to post Dwayne Dunning's book in rebuttal and for a time posted links to my reviews: that stopped before he finished the book.
Dunninng's argument are the same as those by Tom Burgess who collected most of the instance where PSALLO is used to PLUCK but neve meaning PLAY or make music. He never quotes the rest of the context to show that ALL of the prooft texts the musicators rest on point explicitely to older males plucking the harp strings to seduce a young boy for an "act of worship." He had his hair "plucked" and defined by a similar word. Burgess contradicts Kurfees and I have posted rebuttals there also. The same arguments were used more violently at Richland Hills were every musical notice in the bible and church history is lied about with a high, heavey hand.
Dunning is, like most of those who cannot enjoy their "liberty" unless they get affirmation from those they SECTED OFF from. That is why there has been such underhandedness as "using' men like Max Lucado (instrumentalist) to debate the Christian church (instrumentalist) at The Tulsa Soul Wrecking Workout and the NACC meeting with Rick Atchley (instrumentalists) debating the same instrumentalists.
I have posted--and will clean up--the rebutta to the Ray Downen and Dwayne Dunning as far as Ray published parts of the Book:
This will link to sections 2 through 5. You don't have to get past part one to see that there is NO ONE promoting the ANTI-church of Christ movement who does not lie about God and lie TO God in order to OUTRUN the non-instrumentalists who ARE NOT CHASING THEM. They see a HOSTILE ATTACK mounted against the musicators when in fact it is a paranoid need to silence is the continued teaching of that which has been taught which associates instrumental worship with Satan, sacrificial altars as TYPES of sacrificing Jesus Christ, prostitutes or Sodominte. Or, as one church Father allows, idle children "just for fun."
I have Kurfees first "sermon" in a pamphlet (original) and his book on Instrumental Music. If anyone needs an excerpt I will post it. Even Kurfees lacked the resources to search the ancient literature which would confirm that there is NOTHING in recorded history which refutes anything he says. The discussion of PSALLO is based on older resources but in fact the word PSALLO (if used by Paul in the original) firstly speaks of WARFARE related to Apollo or Apollyon and the Muses whom John used to define the operatives of the Mother of Harlots (Rev 17) as Sorcerers (Rev 18) which is the MARK that the candles have been REMOVED probably at the same time Jesus removed the name of CHRIST from their mind.
The second use speaks of the blood-red rope which the authorities used to FORCE people from the agora or marketplace where they sold radishes, bodies of young boys, singers sang and instrumentalists competed INTO the ekklesia (church) which was for EDUCATION ONLY.
Way down the list is the concept of SHOOTING OUT SONGS. There is NOTHING but blood and warfare in the Word and that is why Paul MADE SURE that it did not BREAK OUT into the SPEAKING arena.
bill-
When you say: "But it's a far different matter when churches subscribing to the Change Movement take on the look and feel of performing arts centers with worship services that cannot otherwise be distinguished from pop-rock concerts, Broadway musicals, and nightclub floor shows."
That exposes you as a person who either has never been to a contemporary worship service where God is being praised, OR a person who does not truly know what worship to God is. Contemporary worship is the opposite of secular entertainment. Try this, it may help. Go visit a church with contemporary instrumental music, and LISTEN TO THE WORDS! If you don't see worship to God, your problems are deeper than what anyone here can help you with.
Oh yeah, you also said: "We at this web site battle the unbiblical Change Movement by promoting adherence to all biblical principles..."
donald can't answer this question, so why don't you give it a shot. How exactly ARE you "battling" the non-existent "change movement"??? What action are you taking?
You "warn" people via a website?
You "adhere" to biblical principles? (which is questionable from you at best, but that's another issue)
What ACTION can a person take? What can a bona-fide-Bible-believing-Christian DO to stop the evil stormtroopers of the "change empire"?????
As I said earlier on several occasions, I was formerly an organist for a Baptist church. That church went contemporary with a rock band and praise team. The "music" was so loud with screeching guitars and pounding, crashing drums that NO ONE could hear the words being "sung." Not much "edification" there. The whole scenario mimicked a rock concert. I stayed around for a while until I saw that this was going to be the way that church "worshiped," which was not worship at all. It was merely entertainment.
So have I ever been to a contemporary service? You bet! Better to let all things, including worship, be done decently and in order (1 Cor. 14:40).
Amazed said: "How exactly ARE you 'battling' the non-existent 'change movement'??? What action are you taking?"
Those who claim that a "Change Movement" doesn't exist and that we are just a bunch of fear mongers belong to one of two camps: either they are not discerning enough to see the apostasy that has turned many churches away from New Testament principles, or they are indeed a part of that very movement and would convince others that such a movement is just a myth.
It's been said that the greatest trick the devil ever pulled was to convince the world that he's just a myth. Hence, many believe in neither hell nor accountability for sin. Likewise, if the change agents convince the undiscerning that the Change Movement is a myth, it's much easier to take over their churches and make them apostate.
The way to battle the Change Movement is to educate people about what that movement is, its pitfalls, and its fallacies. The entire Concerned Members web site exists to do just that. Hence, we warn people via the Internet. Here, people will find links to timely articles by experienced Christian writers such as Paul Proctor, Berit Kjos, and others who have seen the ravages of churches taken over by change agents.
Some find it objectionable or scorn the use of the Internet for such a purpose. No doubt the change agents are the very ones who raise such objections, because they fear that if people are informed, they will be watchful and prepared to cast out the interlopers. What better means to reach many thousands, yea, millions of readers than by the Internet? If the Gospel can be preached via the Internet, the world can also be warned that wolves in sheep's clothing have infiltrated the Church with a despicable, worldly agenda that would make the Church an apostate of Satan himself.
Once the change agents have taken over a church, it's difficult to turn the situation around--it's gone too far, like a malignancy with widespread metastasis. That's why churches must be prepared and watchful to insure that the change agents are not allowed to compromise the Gospel ever so slightly yet progressively with political correctness, man-contrived doctrines, denominational preferences, and entertaining gimmicks that draw large crowds lusting for a good time.
bill-
The problem with I Cor. 14:40, is that "decently" and "in order" are subjective terms aren't they? I fully agree that all should be done decently and in order. I have been to many old-school acapella services that were not. The church I currently attend has a rock band. Every service is decent and in order.
Remember: Reverent DOES NOT equal Boring.
As far as the non-existent change movement goes, you made an incorrect statement. There are actually THREE camps. The one you left out is the one inhabited by rational people that love God and want the best for His church, but are not under the illusion that there is a vast conspiracy of "agents" meeting together to plot the downfall of the Church of Christ denomination.
If there was a "change movement", believe me, I'd join it.
We are, however, getting closer on your action-items to stop the straw-man change movement you have created. All you said in your answer is basically: "We warn people." I KNOW THAT. That's what I said in my original post. My question is STILL, "What can the "millions" of people you claim you are reaching, DO with your warning"????
You say:
"That's why churches must be prepared and watchful to insure that the change agents are not allowed to compromise the Gospel ever so slightly yet progressively with political correctness, man-contrived doctrines... blah, blah, blah..."
Here is my question yet again:
IF the churches are "prepared and watchful" HOW are they to "insure" that these things don't happen? ACTION is what I'm looking for here bill, action. Not warnings, not words, not fake preparation. Action. What can they DO about it?
I will give you a hint: It's starts with "N" and ends with "OTHING"
The “Change Movement” is a byproduct of the NEW AGE psychology in religion which promotes worldwide ecumenism. It initially gained acceptance in the denominational world—with the perception of a global church that encompasses all religious groups—but, unfortunately, has crept into churches of Christ. Among churches of Christ that have succumbed to this New Age religious ideology, the emphasis has been—and contrary to what we have learned from the Scripture concerning its foundation and its founder—that the church that Jesus Christ built on Pentecost is a just another denomination.
Unbeknownst to you and others of your persuasion, you’ve been brainwashed into thinking that the church of Jesus Christ is no different than the Christian Scientist and the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter Day Saints (Mormon), or any of the other denominations of your categorization. So, you have arrived at the premise or expression called “Church of Christ denomination” from the NEW AGE psychology—not from the church that you have left for the “Rock Bandage” fellowship. I’m sure that your new found denomination entertains you very well, and that you have all the freedom to persuade others to join your church “on the rocks.”
Not Impressed:
Tradition is just a matter of preferrence. Tradition is good, but so is the changes going on in the church. They are BOTH GOOD! LIFE IS GOOD!!!
Right Bill?
They are both good because neither nixes the Scriptures. One PREFERS it this way, while the other PREFERS it another way. I think it is AWESOME that a congregation can live in harmoney by promoting the two seperate camps (traditionalists and Contemporary), by having two different services on Sunday. So why all the fuss??? Are you still worried that if an instrument is brought into the service that we will look too denominational? It has nothing to do with that, but whether it is antiScriptural....which we have proven over and over that it is not antiScriptural.
GOD IS GOOD!!!
AMEN!!!
Uh oh.....I forgot that I wasn't going to post here any longer.
Servant, tell us about this book that you claim to be writing. Are you under contract with a reputable publisher to write this book? If so, what is the company, and did you receive a sizeable advance (exact figures are not necessary)? Have you already composed a title? When is the proposed date of publication? We are indeed interested in your upcoming work.
The Simplistic Approach to “Tradition”—Types of Traditions NOT Differentiated
February 23 2007, 1:36 PM
Servant,
It’s a shame, Servant, that as an elder who would not object to … but promote, endorse, approve or condone the use of instrumental music in your non-instrumental congregation, you have lumped together all forms of traditions. The Bible clearly speaks of different forms of traditions (cf. the gospels; I Peter 1:18; II Thess. 2:15; Gal. 1:14; II Thess. 3:6; Col. 2:8).
Your bloviation regarding these matters can only create confusion and division in the church you still claim to be a member of. It appears that you have no regard for the body to be of the same mind and of the same judgment as the Holy Scripture indicates.
Servant, I am not authorized to change Christ’s doctrine and APOSTOLIC TRADITIONS, and neither are you. But if you meant to say “changing human tradition(s),” then, I’m fine with that. Changing the assembly time from 10:00 am to 3:30 pm does not violate God’s directives. Changing the observance of the Lord’s Supper to a “fellowship meal” or from the first day of the week to Wednesday, Thursday or another day of the week DOES violate God’s directives.
Do you still not see the difference? If so, other examples of human traditions that are wrong would be the Roman Catholic Church’s teachings as worshipping Mary as the “Mother of God” or the hierarchical positions in the RCC (papal, the bishopric, etc.)
If nothing else, let me point out that you are mistaking “preferences” for apostolic teachings and traditions.
The Catholic Encyclopedia confesses that instruments along with candles and all of the stuff was ADDED because it was COMMON TO ALL PAGAN CULTS. If they thought that the Bible authorized it AND they did not have to use their RIGHT TO CHANGE they would have used Scripture. These additions were made by new priests converting to Christianity to get PAID and were not baptized believers.
However, the Catholic knew the ropes and NEVER engaged in congregational singing with instrumental accompaniment: the organ played by the local professionnals and composers added preludes, interludes and recessionals. For the PRECENTER (the first heresy largely pervading the church says McClintock and Strong) it set the PITCH.
The Catholic Encyclopedai still defines congregational singing as SCRIPTURAL and DESIRABLE to restore. The organ was never used in the presence of the Pope who conducted the ONLY official mass in the Sistine Chapel where he introduced tht A capella team from france.
If there was a jot or tittle of evidence NOT CONDEMING instruments all of those people would not have to lie about EVERY musical passage and historical scholar. Lying TO God and ABOUT God is without redemption.
Could you explain to me how you have come to the conclusion that the new form of worship, which was started as a marketing gimmick, is not entertainment based?
Personally, I find people who are clapping, dancing, riding motorcycles, rockwall climbing, dancing around with their guitar as part of the worship service quite entertaining. I can't say that they EVER made me think about God, in fact, I felt about as far away from Spiritualness as I could get.
Who exactly are we entertaining during these services? When did worshipping God become something that has to be fun and exciting? Is He not enough for us? I didn't realize worship was about making US the center of attention. And to think, all this time I thought God was our focus. Silly me.
The First Christians sat on rocks/ground for days on end, listening to Jesus speak in parables. Now, I'm not meaning to be slow here, but the last time I read one of his sermons/parables, I didn't see anything to start clapping and getting physically excited about. In fact, I found his sermons and the Apostles sermons to be quite serious and thought provoking. Nothing that I would see mixed with a band or stomping/clapping choir. Instead, as Paul teaches us, I take it very serious and very somberly (Yes, the word SOMBER is used in relationship to assembly - SHOCKING!) This is my soul and eternity I'm working on here, not the Christian American Idol.
You know, the Jews tried to liven up their services and God left them to their enemies. He definitely had issues with the Jews trying to change up his instructions. Why do you feel he has "lightened up" and become more "open" to such things? Are you saying God was flawed and had to "evolve" to keep up with us more modern/intelligent humans of the 21st century?
PPB, over at FaithSite, one poster claimed that when we get to heaven, we'll be shouting and dancing, clapping and playing in the "heavenly band" with "smiling faces" (implying that reverent worship is gloomy and boring). He made it sound like being in heaven will reproduce the worldly, entertainment-oriented, boisterous, rock-and-roll-type "worship" services now prevalent in many churches of the Change Movement.
I submit that until such time as Christ authorizes us here on earth to behave as hedonists and wild animals, then we must abide by Christ's command to sing and make melody in our hearts without the "assistance" of musical instruments or other entertaining gimmicks, for neither IM nor entertainment are authorized on earth in Christian worship. We must also abide by the New Testament's directive that we do all things decently and in order (1 Cor. 14:40), for God is not the Author of confusion but of peace (1 Cor. 14:33). Shouting; loud, boisterous rock music; running amok; and emotional outbursts with adrenaline highs in worship are not only false indicators of "faith," but they are the very epitome of confusion and the antithesis of "peace."
Just because one is able to maintain self-control and self-discipline in reverent worship is certainly no indicator that one is dour, sad, and unhappy. On the contrary, it is even more indicative that one has the "peace of God, which passeth all understanding" (Phil. 4:7).
Is Church Music Exclusively Congregational Singing?
by Lawson Mayo
Is church music exclusively congregational singing? Yes! Both history and Scripture point to the validity of this. Neither instruments nor special music (i.e., choirs, sextets, quartets, trios, duets, etc.) are sanctioned by God as being acceptable forms of music in congregational worship. Other innovations such as hand clapping, foot tapping, humming, and vocal imitations of musical instruments, are equally unscriptural. You can search for a commandment, an example, or an inference to justify these self-satisfying innovations, but your search will be in vain. The only Biblical authorisation for church music is congregational singing (Colossians 3:16; Ephesians 5:19).
Although instruments were used in many types of activity (including Hebrew Temple worship) they were not used in the early church. Its a well documented fact that early Christians worshipped for a number of centuries without the accompanying strains of instrumental music. Joseph Bingham, one of the most learned scholars of the Church of England, confirms in his book, Antiquities of the Christian Church. Without mincing words, Bingham simply states:
Music in the church is as ancient as the apostles, but instrumental music is not.
Lyman Coleman, another accurate scholar, offers this noteworthy statement:
". . .musical accompaniments were gradually introduced; but can hardly be assigned to a period earlier than the fifth and sixth centuries. Previously they had their place in the theatre rather than in the church. "
Professor John Girardeau, of Columbia Theological Seminary, makes this reinforcing comment:
"...the church although lapsing more and more into defection from the truth...had no instrumental music for several hundred years. "
Professor Girardeau also records that the Calvinistic Reformed Church had ejected instruments from its services as an element of Popery (Music in the Church, p. 179).
"It is impossible to find anything concerning the origin of instrumental music in the New Testament, but these statements show very definitely that scholars, in the field of church history, recognise instrumental music in the worship as an innovation which did not make its appearance until many hundreds of years after the church had its beginning. Encyclopedias of religious knowledge, coupled with church histories, confirm quite definitely that instruments were introduced a number of centuries after the death of the apostles."
In the Greek church, musical instruments never came into use; only after the eighth century did they become common in the Latin church, and then with much opposition from the monks.
While still on the subject of historically documented quotations regarding music in the early church, there is another significant quote that I want to share. It not only sheds some light on the introduction of instruments, but also on the special music upheaval that were facing in the church today. Listen carefully. Lyman Coleman said that:
". . .the tendency of instrumental music was to secularise the music of the church, and to encourage singing by a choir."
Did you hear that? Coleman, who is considered to be an accurate scholar among religious historians, states that instruments were introduced not only to secularise church music, but also to encourage singing by a choir -- interesting isnt it, in light of the changes that are taking place in our age! Where does our authority lie: in the world or in the Lord?
Let me tell you, my brethren, there is no room for the world in the church! When secular trends invade the sanctity of our worship, Satan wins. Yet, in our brotherhood today, we are hearing a drumming echo of a defiant people from ages past. But the Bible doesnt say we cant, is the loud, bold, urgent, immature, self-seeking cry of our day. Everyone else is doing it, is the insubmissive, rebellious statement of our age. Eternal consequence doesnt seem to matter as long as we can cater to our self-satisfying whims.
Regarding such attitudes, let me say this: sin is sin even if everyone else is doing it, and right is right even if no one else is doing it. Furthermore, the Bible doesnt have to say thou shalt not: thou shalt not use instrumental music; thou shalt not have solos, trios and choirs; thou shalt not clap your hands, tap your feet or imitate musical instruments with your voice. The positive commands that God set forth in His inspired Word negates the need for any further elaboration; it nullifies the need for any further instruction. This is an irrevocable fact.
To obey or not to obey, is a choice of the heart that each of us freely makes. One can justify that which he does, but the justification will not make it right in the sight of God. This is true in every aspect of our Christian life whether it be in the realm of modest dress, type of recreation, or appropriate music in worship.
But I like my guitar; I want to play it while I sing praises to my Lord: this is an actual quotation that weve heard since weve been in Australia. In all fairness to my Australian brethren, however, I must tell you that the words were uttered by an American who no longer lives in this country. Nevertheless, the possibility of playing instruments in worship was planted in the minds of those who looked to this person as a spiritual pace setter in the church. Many followed the lead of this young woman and her successful husband. The seeds of error they scattered during their tenure here will, in all probability, someday germinate, take root, and grow. I make mention of this; firstly, because Im concerned; secondly, to alert you to the secular trends that are coming into our country; thirdly, to show how such trends weaken the cause of Christ. Rather than following the trends of the world, Christians should be setting the trends for the world to follow.
We are the light of the world (Matthew 5:14-16). If we allow the winds of change to extinguish our lights, we will lose our illuminating effect.
Weve been sanctified (I Corinthians 6:11). Weve been purified (I Peter 1:22). Weve been washed by the blood of the Lamb (Revelation 1:5). Weve been set apart to be a peculiar people -- a special people (I Peter 2:9). Denying ungodliness and worldly lusts, we should live soberly, righteously, and godly, in this present world. (Titus 2:12).
As a whole, the younger generation of the church no longer objects to musical instruments in the worship service; they say the issue should not be a test of fellowship. But this is not the main battle line. No. Satan, through the medium of change agents has turned our attention to the realm of special music (i.e., solos, choirs, etc.), and those who oppose the change are branded as troublemakers. It is said that we are hampering the noble effort to make worship more meaningful. It is also said that we are creedal and divisive. But, as Dave Miller points out in his book, Piloting the Strait, those who are promoting special music are clearly the disrupters. And yet (as Dave also points out), they are masters of acting innocent in this regard.
They are likewise specialists at moving from the New Testament allows special music to the New Testament promotes special music. The militancy with which innovators are now advancing their agenda is shocking and heartbreaking. (Miller, Piloting the Strait).
Shocking! Heartbreaking! Indeed! If God through the Spirit guided the apostles into all truth: which He did (John 16:13), and if by divine guidance their music consisted solely of a capella singing by the congregation: which it did (Ephesians 5:19; Colossians 3:16); should not this be our practice today? I think so! Secular trends are not safe criteria for Christians to follow; neither are personal whims.
To follow the lead of the change agents is a soul-destructive course which should be avoided at all cost. Instrumental music and special music (i.e. choirs, etc.) are inconsistent with New Testament teaching. Therefore, it is unnecessary, unwise, and unscriptural to incorporate these innovations into our worship services. Matthew 28:18-20 leaves the church no liberty in regard to the elements of worship (including music).
When we examine this passage closely, we see: firstly, that the apostles were to teach all things which Christ commanded them; secondly, logically implied, the apostles were to teach nothing but what Christ commanded; thirdly, the church should obey the apostles teachings. Again I say, this leaves no liberty in regard to the elements of worship.
There are those who sometimes claim that instrumental music should be used in Christian worship because David, the singer in Israel, sang praises to God with the accompanying strains of an instrument (Psalm 150:3,4). But, we must remember that David introduced instrumental music into Hebrew worship some 400 years after Gods commandments were issued on Mt. Sinai (II Chronicles 29:25). God tolerated instrumental music in worship, but later the prophet Amos pronounced a curse upon those who, like David, introduced instrumental music into worship: Woe unto them that...sing idle songs to the sound of the viol, and invent for themselves instruments of music like David (Amos 6:5). Thus even under the moonlight age of Judaism, instrumental music in worship was questioned. (Haun, The Kind of Music God Wants).
Perhaps it should be noted that while instruments were tolerated in worship under the Old Law, Christians are no longer under the Old Law (Colossians 2:14). Perhaps it should also be noted that God through Paul says that those who try to justify something today because it was sanctioned (or tolerated) under the Old Law are fallen from grace (Galatians 5:4). We do not use instruments of music in worship because we are of Christ; not of David (Galatians 3:24). When we rightly divide the Word, this truth comes into focus more clearly (II Timothy 2:15).
All New Testament references regarding the type of music that God condones, in both public and private worship, state that Christians are to sing.
Matt 26:30 & Mk 14:26: When they had sung an hymn, they went out...
Acts 16:25: At midnight Paul and Silas prayed and sang praises....
Rom 15:9: I will sing unto thy name...
I Cor 14:15: I will sing with the spirit and the understanding...
Eph 5:19: Speaking to yourself in psalms and hymns...
Col 3:16: Admonishing one another with psalms and hymns...
Heb 2:12: In the midst of the congregation I will sing thy praises...
James 5:13: Is any merry? Let him sing Psalms...
Whatever might be said in favour of instrumental music, no one doubts that we are worshipping God in truth by simply singing and making melody in our hearts; neither are we going beyond what is written (I Corinthians 4:6).
Many who advocate the use of an instrument in Christian worship turn to the book of Revelation, citing passages that speak of harps in heaven, and conclude that whatever is suitable in heaven should be permitted in the church (Revelation 14:2,3). We must keep in mind, however, that Revelation is highly figurative; it draws symbolic pictures. Did John actually hear harpers harping with their harps? No! He heard 144,000 singing praises to the Lamb of God like unto harpers harping with their harps; the melody was just that beautiful; if God should choose to have harps in heaven, it still would not sanction the use of such on earth. The principle of acceptable worship is not what will or will not be in heaven, but what God wills here on earth. There will be a sea of glass, jasper walls, and a golden street in heaven, but we dont attempt to reproduce those within the church.
Another argument for the use of instrumental music in worship is that its use is parallel to that of song books. Some cannot distinguish between a book that keeps silent during worship and an organ which, if anything, drowns out the voices that God would like to hear.
Delton Haun, in his tract: The Kind of Music God Wants, suggests an exercise that might be profitable. Take a pencil and paper and draw a line down the centre of the page. Label one column: Commandments of God. Label the other: Commandments of Men. Then use these columns to classify a dozen or so things which are commonly practised in religion today. For example: preaching, prayer, Lords supper, baptism, etc. Include a proof text for as many as possible.
Under which heading would you place preaching? Commandments of God. How do we know? Because preaching is commanded in II Timothy 4:2. What about prayer? What about counting prayer beads? What about the Lords supper? What about burning incense? Under which column would you put each of these items? Now, in all frankness, in which column must we place instruments of music? Can you see how we are obliged to place it under: Commandments of Men, owing to the fact that authorisation for such in worship cannot be found in the New Testament. It simply isnt there! From this simple exercise, can you see how, in vain we worship teaching for doctrines the commandments of men? (Matthew 15:9).
It was no oversight on the part of God that instruments have been omitted from church worship. His divine power hath granted unto us all things that pertain to life and godliness. (II Peter 1:3).
Before we zero in on special music in the church, lets think for a moment about the word: psallo. Since the original meaning of the word was to touch, pluck, strike, etc., some claim that this Greek word implies accompaniment with man-made instruments. In the New Testament, however, psallo is always translated to sing because the melody is made by touching the chords of the human heart. Hence the heart is the only instrument permitted by the Lord in expressing divine praise. If, perchance, psallo meant to sing with instrumental accompaniment, the apostles violated the confidence that Christ placed in them, for they did not use musical instruments as they sang; neither did they teach the early church to use them. On the contrary, instruments were not introduced until the church had apostatised.
Now, lets turn our attention to the supporters of special music that are causing such a ripple in the church today. Like the instrumentalist, special music supporters draw attention to practices outside the New Testament; however, if one wishes to be a New Testament Christian, he must remain within the guidelines of the New Testament. Old Testament worship and early church digressions provide no assistance whatsoever in determining divine protocol for New Testament worship in the church today. Our worship must be derived exclusively and warranted by the pattern of worship thats set forth in the New Testament.
As already pointed out, church historians record the use of choirs as a post-first century development, and describe the earliest worship of the church as being exclusively congregational. Records also show that many reformation and restoration leaders voiced opposition in regard to special music issues.
A solo or choir, by definition, excludes the collective whole (i.e., the rest of those assembled). The moment the soloist or choir (or any other select number of singers) isolates itself for the purpose of presenting a programme of special music (whether it be one song or several) it becomes an unscriptural item in the house of the Lord.
From whence comes the innovators authority for such? Well, strangely enough, they use Scripture: I Corinthians 14:26, Colossians 3:16, and Ephesians 5:19. On what premise do they base their argument? Lets see if we can unravel their threads of confusion.
Firstly, I Corinthians 14:15,26: What is it then?...I will sing with the spirit, and I will sing with the understanding also (vs. 15). How is it then, brethren? when ye come together, every one of you hath a psalm, hath a doctrine, hath a tongue, hath a revelation, hath an interpretation. Let all things be done unto edifying (vs. 26). To quote David Miller:
Anyone who insists that Paul was referring to solo singing in these two passages could not prove it if his life depended on it. At least four other equally plausible interpretations fit the context. Each one has a psalm could refer to: (1) inspired solo-singing that terminated with all other miraculous gifts; (2) song leaders; (3) recitation of an inspired psalm (i.e., poem); and (4) hymn writers teaching the congregation a new song. Evidences for hymn writers in the early church are seen in the references by Justin Martyr (Apology, v,28), Tertullian (De Anima, c.9), and Eusebius (Ecclesiastical History, v,28) (Piloting the Strait)
Regarding evidences for hymn writers in the early church, McClintock and Strong state:
Here we have not only testimony to the use of spiritual songs in the Christian Church from the remotest antiquity, but also that there were hymn writers in the apostolic Church, and that their songs were collected for use at a very early date of the Christian Church. (Cyclopaedia of Biblical, Theological, and Ecclesiastical Literature, Vol 6, p. 757)
The word psalm (psalmos) simply refers to an authoritative writing. Again, as Dave points out in his assessment of changes in the church: When the word psalm does refer to a song to be sung (rather than merely read or studied), the term itself contains no indication regarding under what circumstances it is to be sung. Change agents act as if the passage ought to be translated -- each one has a solo!
If anything, Corinths problem lay in the fact that individuals were being disruptive in the assembly by failing to take their turn, but exactly what they were failing to do in an orderly fashion is ambiguous. We must not allow this one passage to alter the meaning of clearer passages which set forth specific guidelines regarding music in the church.
It must be noted, however, that special music advocates also quibble over the clear meaning of Ephesians 5:19 and Colossians 3:16. For example, some say if an individual can speak or read to the congregation, he or she could also sing the same material to the congregation. In their words: There is no significant difference in singing praises and saying praises. But (as Ive said before) every worship practice must be authorised and sanctioned by God. Solo singing cannot be justified on the basis of solo reading or preaching. There must be separate authority for each. As far as that goes, reading, teaching, and preaching differ vastly from singing. Its true, they share a common factor; they both teach and admonish -- but they are not the same. Singing is done in such a way that everyone assembled participates at the same time; whereas, by definition and design, preaching cannot and must not function at the same time. Such would create confusion in direct violation of the principle of peace and order that is to be maintained in public worship (I Corinthians 14:31,40). However, singing may be engaged in by everyone at the same time, which is precisely the thrust of Ephesians 5:19 and Colossians 3:16.
Herein lies another quibble. Special music supporters reason that those (like us) who oppose special music in the assembly must hold to the view that the entire congregation must sing every word simultaneously. This (as you can quickly see) would rule out the singing of songs that have predominant bass and alto parts in which some singers have a few seconds of silence while the others sing. In other words, while we point our finger and say: You cannot have choirs and solos, they point their finger and say: If we cannot have choirs and solos, you cannot sing in four-part harmony. This reasoning, of course, simply fails to grasp the essence of reciprocity.
To fully appreciate the meaning of Colossians 3:16 and Ephesians 5:19, certain grammatical features of the Greek language must be grasped. From these grammatical features, certain observations and conclusions can be drawn. For example teaching, admonishing, and singing are not separate, unrelated activities...Pauls reference to singing is his way of completing and clarifying his initial instructions regarding teaching and admonishing...After all the grammar has been examined and after all the arguments have been presented, one fact remains powerfully clear: A simple, unbiased reading of Ephesians 5:19 and Colossians 3:16 leaves the reader with the clear sense that God wants the church to assemble together and to sing together. The unprejudiced reader would certainly not get the impression that Paul was encouraging solos and choirs (Miller, Piloting the Strait)
While every single Christian in the assembly may not sing every single word of the song at precisely the same moment, the language of Scripture makes clear that all are obligated to participate together. The act of segregating the soloist or choir group by its very nature militates against reciprocity. The whole point of a choir is for some to sing while others listen in silence with no intention of participating together vocally...Notice, then, the three possibilities with regard to the song service: (1) part of the congregation may be quarantined from the rest of the congregation to sing one or more songs by themselves while the rest of the membership function as spectators; (2) the entire congregation may participate together in all the songs; (3) the entire congregation may engage in simultaneous singing with everyone saying the same words at the same time. Both the second and third possibilities conform to the reciprocity requirement of Ephesians 5:19 and Colossians 3:16. The first possibility simply does not. (Miller, The Spiritual Sword, Vol.25, No.1)
In the words of Brother Wayne Jackson:
"It is a tragically sad fact that there are multitudes of deceived people in the religious world who, rather than having a God-oriented faith, have a man-centred religion. More specifically, they have an auto-centric religion. That expression simply suggests that such people direct their religious lives consistent with what pleases them; Jehovahs will is not consulted in the matter."
To quote further from Brother Jackson:
"When Gods standard of truth for regulating genuine worship is dismissed, and feelings are relied upon, the floodgates of apostasy and perversion are thrown wide open. Those who respect Heavens will, will circumscribe their emotions with Truth, and not let their feelings run wild."
To bring our quotations closer to home, Brother Glen Tattersall wrote in the September, 1996 issue of Onward and Upward:
". . .to have any other music in New Testament worship other than what comes from a sincere heart is to add to what God has commanded. Unfortunately many today want to vary what the Scriptures say -- not to be pleasing to God, but rather to please and entertain themselves! Jesus warns that those who do, render their worship in vain. (Matthew 15:9)."
In my own mind, I have wondered why, after a hundred and fifty years of unity, the issue of music in the church has resurfaced; more specifically, why has special music emerged with such velocity and strength? Could it be that the old guard has let down its guard? Or has the old guard (in their vigilance to do battle with the instrumentalist) left the back door ajar, allowing Satan to enter from another direction? As a result, special music has crept in as an enhancer rather than marching in as an intruder. For sure, enhancement seems to be the premise on which the innovators stand. But, I ask, how can anything contrary to Gods Holy Word serve as an enhancer in worship? How can Christians justify using such a feeble focusing point? Special music in the worship of God is as much of a violation of Gods instructions as the use of instruments, and thus sinful. Underscore that point! Special music is a sin that needs to be repented of (Romans 3:23). Innovations that will spark up the singing and give new life and meaning to our worship need to be exposed and expelled. We must be careful, lest these sparks burn up the good works of God. Those among us who want to engage in a particular method of worship for the purpose of producing an aesthetically pleasing alternative, are self-focused and self-condemning members of the body of Christ. Not only must we (as a united force) lift up our voices in song, we must also (as a united force) lift up our voices in opposition to the soul-destructive trends that have invaded the sanctity of our worship.
While I am exposing digressions and issuing warnings, let me cite one more danger zone in regard to music in the church. Some are now insisting that congregations may require the use of a worship team (i.e., men and women who are either situated in front of the assembly or scattered throughout the auditorium with their own microphones to strengthen and enrich the congregations singing).
The first time I happened on to such a situation was about three years ago while travelling in the States. For convenience sake, we worshipped with the nearest congregation to our motel rather than taking the time to seek out a well-known, doctrinally sound group. On the surface, everything seemed normal as we entered the building. Bible class went well -- I was even asked to give an impromptu report on our work in Australia.
Then the worship hour began, and there they were: five of them (three men and two women) all lined up in a row just across the aisle from where we were seated: each with a microphone; drowning out everyone else in our section. Mind you now, this was a congregation of several hundred. I have no idea how many of these worship teams were scattered throughout that great auditorium. As far as that goes, I didnt even know there was such a thing as a worship team in the church until that eventful day (guess I had been away from the States too long). For a brief moment, I entertained the thought that maybe I had given my enlightening report to the wrong group; maybe I wasnt even in the Lords church.
Talk about strengthening and enriching -- the only thing it strengthened for me was a resolve to be more careful about where I stop for worship when travelling; it certainly did nothing to enrich the worshipful attitude that I should have had. Instead, it left me feeling frustrated and angry with my brethren for allowing such an innovation. I learned later that worship in the church is now subdivided into participatory and presentational formats. Solos and choirs fall under the label presentational -- Im not sure which category worship teams fit into. In my mind, however, they present a bit of hype and glitter that is out of character with Gods divine will.
For one to achieve a state of righteousness that glorifies God, one must pattern his worship according to the specifications that are laid down in Gods Word. This includes church music which must, of necessity, be exclusively congregational singing: no instruments; no special music; no worship teams; no self-satisfying innovations of any sort.
May God help us find contentment and satisfaction in simple, unpretentious New Testament worship. May we rediscover the heartfelt fulfilment and genuine excitement that can only come from simple submission to the words of our great God and Father. (Miller)
BIBLIOGRAPHY
Haun, Delton. The Kind of Music God Wants. Delton Haun Tract Co.
Jackson, Wayne. Worship--By Feelings of Faith. Spiritual Sword, Oct. 1978
Miller, David. Solos and Choirs in the Worship Assembly. Spiritual Sword, Oct. 1993, pp. 26-31.
Miller, David. Piloting the Strait. Pulaski TN: Sain Publications, 1996
Sanders and Squire. Church Music. Vermont Ave. Church of Christ, Los Angeles, CA.
Tattersall, Glen. Music in the Ears of God! Onward and Upward, Sept. 1996.
Pulled one out of the closet, didn't ya Donnie? Got to keep things stirred up, and understandably so.....
We were talking about an older respected church of Christ preacher, Gus Nichols, and a debate that someone had attended many years ago. The person attending the debate said everyone in the church of Christ called it a victory, but so did all the ones in the denominational church where the opposing man preached.
Kinda like here with everyone believing that their way is the right way, which is fine and good....UNTIL they start pointing fingers and accusing the other side of being wrong and sinful.
What were you doing talking about Gus Nichols? I'm so surprised that you weren't talking about the Change Movement preachers or the "change we can believe in" in politics. That's what the change agents in the church and the politicians have in common -- change, transform, restructure, reorganize the original church or the U.S. constitution.
So, did you ridicule Gus Nichols? Whose side were you on? Either? Neither? Is one church as good as another?
Since you've gone so far as to talk about an old, respected preacher, I have a suggestion for your next meeting: learn about the great men of the Restoration Movement. We have been doing a little bit of that here and now -- Thomas and Alexander Campbell, Barton W. Stone, et al -- but no response from truth seekers like you as yet?
BTW, has your congregation employed yet the services of the "Praise Team" [the "Baptist CHOIR" for the "new-and-improved church of Christ"]?
Don't worry and be surprised about this thread alone. There will be more coming.
Truth is ... it's only the truth that we speak to Dave about
October 5 2010, 6:20 PM
Sorry, Dave, but if you learn more about your heritage, the Restoration Movement -- not the Change Agents and their "change we can believe in" -- we will both be speaking the same truth and the same language.
Your problem is that you've gone too far to the left, liberal way that you claim to be the new way.
Nope!!! Jeremiah 6:16 says this --
"Thus saith the LORD, Stand ye in the ways, and see, and ask for the old paths, where is the good way, and walk therein, and ye shall find rest for your souls. But they [the change agents] said, We will not walk therein."
While those boasting about infiltrating and diverting, there have been few converts to the use of instrments. This has been mostly as a separate "congregation" using the same space to attract more contributors. They are in fact a divided group and God still hats those who sow discord.
There are many more who have added "special music" by hiring "worship teams" where singing is performance by the few for the many. These also oozed into existence by driving out the owners.
More profound has been the Jubilee's defining the ONLY role of church as "worship" which is defined as worshiping with the works of the human body: performing rhetoric and performing music. "Music" occurs in the historic sense only when the whole body moves in 'symphony' as dance.
This makes the whole church (with small enhancement groups performing in situ) into a musical worship team where the goal is on the perfection of performance.
That probably has afflicted many more than we are able to count. No one in the Bible or historic church SANG as a form of ceremonial legalism thinking that they could "work" their way into God's favor. Or, attract those who could not be attracted by using the commanded text "that which is written for our learning."
Once you think that singing is just an act disconnected from the Biblical text, it no longer is performed to teach and admonish one another and "Comfort with Scripture." (Rom 15).
That means that new style song books and the non-word ACappella consists of songs composed to be accompanied with instruments. That's why adding instruments becomes a smaller step.
Congregational singing has been removed from the Biblical text but no one "introduces" congregational singing for the sole purpose of chasing away the owners and selling their instruments defined as "machines for doing hard work" this is "mostly in making war" or in "creating the shock and awe" or ecstasy which can be sold as worship.
This web site is not part of or approved by any Church!
...........................THE BOOK
What Happened At the Madison Church of Christ?
There are thousands of churches being taken over across America.
This book is only about one of those churches. It's about the Madison
Church Of Christ. By studying the methods used here along with the resource
references you might be able to inoculate your church. At the very least
you will recognize the signs early on.
Many of the current members of the Madison Church of Christ still don't
know what happened.
Some never will know! This book is for them as well.
Madison Church of Christ was a 60 year old church. At one time it was
one of the largest churches in the US, and the largest Church of Christ.
It thrived for many years on the vision of it's elders and those of
it's ministers. Those visions undoubtably came from the the inspired word
of Jesus Christ.
At sometime in the last 10 years there was a deliberate plan by a majority
of the elders to take the Madison Church of Christ into a more worldly
realm.
They used secrecy, covert planning, and outside sources to scheme and
to change the format and direction of the Madison Church of Christ.
The Elders knew that the membership would never approve such a plan.
Using the tools of the "Community Church Movement"(consultants, books,
seminars, meetings,planters,seeders) they slowly started initiating change
so it was never noticed by the members until it was too late.....
At the heart of the plan was the fact that old members were going to
be driven off so new techniques could be used to go out and reach the unchurched
through new "Contemporary Holy Entertainment" methods developed by the
"Community Church Movement"
Old members had to be kept on board long enough to get their plans ready,
or the funds would not be there to pay for the new building. So by the
plans very nature, it had to be secret.
The church had no plan in effect to renew or approve elders. There was
never any need. The elders had always been "as approved by God". 10 of the last
15 elders would begin to shed some doubt on that.
The Elders did not even need a majority at first, because some of the
elders went along unwittingly.
This edition starts shortly after some of the members begin to smell
something strange in January 2001. Later editions may go back and fill
in some of the timeline.
To even start to understand whats happening here, you must read the
background materials in the first of the book.
This is only the first edition, and not the end. New editions will be
printed as needed. To keep abreast of current changes, please visit our
web site; http://www.concernedmembers.com/madison
Here is the list of players;
5 Godly Elders
10 Not so Godly Elders
120 "Deacons" (allegiance unknown)
2,800 - 4,000 church "members"
2 "teners" (people who have publicly confessed to have broken all ten
commandments)
Unknown number of "sinners" (This is what the 10 elders call us.)
Unknown number of "demons" (Flying everywhere, to many to count)
