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August 12 2006, 6:07 PM 


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Untruth Buster
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Mt. Juliet congregation ... blessed ... to have Tory & family in the midst."

August 12 2006, 6:17 PM 

And who screamed "FIRE!!!"? Any other than the Fire Chief? The Chief had Nick Boone fired -- he wasn't the singy-clappy-Charismatic-enough kind of guy that could lead the young people to cheerleading-singy-clappy 7-11 "praise" songs and choruses. I would think it was the same Chief who had the leadership tell Tory Tredway [then youth minister] to seek opportunities somewhere else (putting that mildly) -- he was just too nice, too humble and too conservative for the rah-rah-rah kind of spirituality. (Fortunately, one elder from the Mt. Juliet congregation has spoken to me about how blessed the brethren have been to have Tory and family in the midst.)

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Untruth Buster
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Prune ... "the source/root of the upheaval"

August 12 2006, 6:21 PM 


You really like the word "pruning," don't you? Unfortunately, you have misapplied it. Go to the source -- the root -- of the problem. That's what should be pruned. And what's the source? It's not, as you claim, the Fire Chief screaming "Fire!!!" It was the implementation of certain thingies, some of which are the "Worship Leader" and his "Praise Team." That's exactly right -- the source/root of the upheaval. They're the ones that should be pruned.

Therefore, I submit that this is not Madison bashing. Madison is the victim of intrusion. There's a difference.

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Jimmy Wren
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August 14 2006, 12:15 AM 

I would just like to say that I did enjoy the way YTBH answered some of the questions that I ask. I did not direct the questions to her but she was kind to answer and she was kind in the way she answered.

In Christ,

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Jimmy Wren
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More music at madison

August 15 2006, 5:07 PM 

Jill Phillips, Andrew Peterson
Saturday, September 30, 2006 (7:00 PM - 10:00 PM)

Madison Church of Christ
103 Gallatin Pike N.
Madison, TN 37115

Jill and Andy will play at Madison Church of Christ as part of a missions fundraiser.

Check out's home page for a new interview with Jill by husband Andy.... no, that is really not a joke.

One of the replies to the up coming concert stated:

It has been a busy day at work, and I have wanted to say a couple of things on this thread, but have not had the time. In watching this thread, it has to be the fastest growing list I have ever seen on this site.

First, I do not have a problem with bake sales, car washes and other type of fund raisers (including concerts), especially for the youth group to use for missions or other good community projects. I do not see it any differently than how we would justify the use of the internet or television for spreading the gospel. It is a method that is readily available in our modern times. If someone wants to joyfully give of their time in baking cupcakes or washing cars and someone wants to joyfully contribute to a good work, then I see nothing wrong with it.

Now, from someone who has been there, I can tell you that this concert is one step down the slippery slope towards instrumental music in worship. For those of you not Church of Christ, you have seen that those of us that prefer not using instruments (including those that believe it is a sin and those that believe it is only a preference) that this is a very explosive topic. Many of us guard our tradition (doctrine) very carefully and are very proud of the way that vocal singing inspires us.

This concert is right out of the example book of Oak Hills. This will happen a few times, and then an alternative instrumental worship service will be offered not on a Sunday and so on and so on, until it becomes the norm on Sunday morning. If this is what the folks at Madison want, then they have the right to have it implemented, but they should know that this is the direction that they are headed.

In Christ,

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Ken Sublett
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YTBH, Stings Again

August 15 2006, 1:11 PM 

As usual, this creature who labels her/his self as YTBH has launched another attack against CM. Involved seems to be a man named "peck" Callgirl and ServantForHim.

It seems that they may have been involved with someone in the MILITARY in Cyprus to black list members of the church of Christ and outlaw any comments about Madison.

The "military" man in Cyprus may also have a plant at Jabez / Faithsite.

These people should understand that they are involved or have Incited a Federal Crime.

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Max Moon
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August 16 2006, 5:55 PM 

Incited a Federal Crime?

David Matthews at lineoneweb said there were new moderators and no imposters.

How was there a federal crime?

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Ken Sublett
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August 16 2006, 10:23 PM 

Just to push a button, Max, like I learned so well from you.

The Wicked Witches of the Web are at it again: did you also whine like spider?

Pretty soon it will be just the Perpetually Desperate Housewives and a few chicks to carry on some really good bialog. "I am having a headache. Oh, I am having something worse."

I know the moderators don't read stuff (I am quite sure that the daughters of Zoe have taken over there also) so someone said that I used the word "penis." You remember the last howling was that Piney CURSED: quoted John Calvin to ask "why should the ploughing oxen starve and the lazy asses be fed?"

Any old excuse: the site has always been viperishly hostile to the church of Christ.

Whine? Maybe YTBH but MEN? Old YTBH started the downward spiral and now she is whining that SHE TOO got stuff removed. Bad vibes. It IS a debate forum and the GENDER odor will drive everyone away. Paul DID understand the nature of women?

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Max Moon
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August 17 2006, 7:00 PM 

So you are complaining about the FEMALE whiners over at GCM, BRAGGING out about getting posts deleted?

So, then is Dr. Bill a FEMALE?

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Ken Sublett
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Speakers, Singers, Instrumentalists, Dramatists: HYPOCRITES.

August 20 2006, 4:22 PM 

Paul almost always DEFINES the pagan, perverted religions and the SUPERapostles trained from the Greek theater who were trying to take over the young church assemblies for their own profit. Paul had to denounce ANY support from Corinth as the ONLY WAY to MARK the robbers. All performance preaching, singing, playing, drama or ACTS intending to work some effect are OUTLAWED and specificially called HYPOCRITES and ROBBERS. It was of these MANY of whom Paul said: "IF THEY WILL NOT WORK NEITHER SHALL THE EAT."

There simply are NO Staff Infection Roles for an ekklesia or school of the Bible Jesus died for. He freed us from the BURDEN LADERS who use ANYTHING connected to sight or sound to PRETEND to give the Word of God extra power. In fact, no one with a degree in Bible is remotely capable to define SPIRITUAL SUPERIORITY which is the meaning of a PHARISEE.

The PLEASURING MEN spoke directly to all of the PERFORMING ARTS which the demagogues used to take people captive. Paul defines the TASK of all preachers which is to TEACH that which has been once for all times delivered. Secondly, it is not POSSIBLE to be faithful and use the MACHINERY of the hypocrites thinking to "further expound" the Word of God and thereby spit in the face of Jesus Christ.
    But as we were allowed of God
      to be put in trust with the gospel,
      even so we speak;
      not as PLEASING men, but God, which trieth our hearts. 1 Thess 2:4
This PLEASURING includes all of the performing arts of rhetoric, singing, music and drama.
    For neither at any time used we flattering words, as ye know, nor a cloke of covetousness; God is witness: 1 Thess 2:5

      [Gorgias: Socrates 463c] I assign rhetoric; but without noticing that I have not yet answered that, he proceeds to ask whether I do not consider it a fine thing. But I am not going to reply to the question whether I consider rhetoric a fine or a base thing, until I have first answered what it is; for it would not be fair, Polus: but if you want the information, ask me what sort of branch of flattery I assert rhetoric to be.
ALL actors, singers, musicians or speakers belong to the SECT of the Hypocrites:
    Hupokrinô reply, make answer
    2. expound, interpret, explain
    [outlawed by Peter as private interpretation] II. Att., speak in dialogue, hence play a part on the stage, be an actor, kômôidian, of orators and rhetoricians, represent dramatically, use histrionic arts, exaggerate,

    rhêtor-ikos , ê, on, oratorical, hê rhêtorikê (sc. technê). These are the craftsmen lumped with the singers, musicians and "grinders" doing merchandise in the house of prayer. Rev. 18:22

    Canto , I. Neutr., to produce melodious sounds (by the voice or an instrument), to sound, sing, play (class. in prose and poetry; rare in Cic.)
    2. Of the singing pronunciation of an orator , to declaim in a singing tone, to sing, drawl: si cantas, male cantas, si legis, cantas
    C. Hence, because the oracles were of old uttered in verse, of any mysterious, prophetic, or warning utterance, to predict, warn, point out, indicate, make known, say
    III. In the lang. of religion, as v. n. or a., to use enchantments, charms, incantations, to enchant, to charm,

Jesus pointed to Isaiah and also to Ezekiel 33 to identify the HYPOCRITES
    Ye hypocrites [actors, singers, speakers], well did Esaias prophesy of you, saying, Mt 15:7

    This people draweth nigh unto me
      with their mouth,
      and honoreth me with their lips;
      but their heart is far from me. Mt.15:8

    But in vain they do worship me,
      teaching for doctrines
      the commandments of men. Matt 15:9 [songs, sermons, etal]
Ezekiel defines the SECTARIAN HYPOCRITES more fully:
    Also, thou son of man, the children of thy people still are TALKING against thee by the walls and in the doors of the houses, and speak one to another, every one to his brother, saying, Come, I pray you, and hear what is the word that cometh forth from the Lord. Eze 33:30

    And they come unto thee as the people cometh,
      and they sit before thee as my people,
      and they hear thy words,
      but they will not do them:

    for with their mouth they shew much love,
      (Lord, Lord as amorousness - inordinate love),
      but their heart goeth after their covetousness. Eze 33:31

    Indeed, to them you are NOTHING more
      than one who sings love songs (minstrel as a prostitute)
      with a beautiful voice
      and plays (make melody on) an instrument well,

    for they hear your words but do not put them into practice. Eze 33:32NIV

    When all this comes true--and it surely will--then they will know that a prophet has been among them." Eze 33:33

ALL people who use RHETORICAL SKILLS, sing, play instruments, clap or do anything to affect spiritual changed through EXTERNAL means are called hypocrites and in Revelation 18 John calls them SORCERERS.

Those who go to WATCH or LISTEN to any kind of religious performance are ALSO defined by Jesus as HYPOCRITES because the SINGING and MUSIC are the MARKS of people who have NO INTENTION to listening and obeying the WORDS of Jesus which are SPIRIT and LIFE. That is obvious to all but fools loving to be fooled.

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Jimmy Wren
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Re: U.B.

September 23 2006, 4:19 PM 

Brian, You mentioned singing 50 year old song a few post back and I replied that I wasn't sure about the ages of the songs. Last Sunday I made it a point to note the date that was printed by the songs we sang in the am service. Boy! Was I surprised!

The opening hymn:
1893 "Hallalujah, Praise Jehovah"
1921 "The Gospel is for All"
1831 "O For a Faith that will not Shrink"
Next - song before the Lord's Supper:
1350 composed in Latin; tr. to German; translated to English in 1830 "O Sacred Head"
Next - song before the offering:
1897 "Count Your Blessings"
Next - song before the lesson:
1887 "Will You Not Tell It Today"
Next - invitation song:
1944 "Zion's Call"
Next - dismissal song:
1916 "Let the Beauty of Jesus be seen in me"

Some of these songs may have actually been written earlier then the dates posted.

In Christ,

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peck [by D.C.]
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Re: U.B.

September 24 2006, 1:45 AM 

Your obsessive behaviour is disturbing..Elders come and go..youth ministers come and go..preachers come and go..worship leaders come and go...Relax..All of us are members of a congregation that has elders or leadership that don't always make decisions that pleases everyone...It's called normal..not something to make an exceptional event out of...

Goodness,I helped to make a decision to move the Lord's supper table to the back so that the men could sit with their family actually believe some left..but even years later it was still a hot topic..but it still remains that same way today..The elders gave their approval and that was that...

I think DR Phil would say that the root of the problem is not the worship style but an obsessive behaviour connected to it...However,who of us is not in some way in defiance of elderships...It's just normal...A lot of us defy authority but we don't create a website over it...

Please leave off the slander of my folks..For some reason,you do not make me mad,I suppose that I see in you my own weaknesses concerning corporate worship...I'm glad that you care so much and have a tender heart..My thoughts are that you live a life worthy of our Lord and have a lot of people who admire your faith..

God bless,Peck

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Untruth Buster [by D.C.]
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Re: U.B.

September 24 2006, 1:51 AM 

[End of the online conversation]


You keep bringing up extraneous things that have nothing to do with Madison -- the table, decisions don't always please everyone [common knowledge, he-he-he], folks come and go [common knowledge].

Just get to the point. The "Worship Leader" and the "Praise Team" -- these are issues that are splitting congregations, not just Madison.

Evidently, you're not concerned about troubles that CAN BE AVOIDED!!!! You're more interested in a [your] family member than church family members being alienated because of him. So, your own behavior is disturbing to me and to the church you still claim to be a member of.


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(no login)

You are right

September 24 2006, 5:16 PM 

Saying that music and praise teams are splitting churches is like saying that airplanes are what caused 9-11.

Someone did the hijacking and crashing. The issue of music and priase teams has led to some splits. You know why? Because when they are used, LEGALISTIC, REBELLIOUS, UNBIBLICAL, and UNGODLY people REBEL against God and His leaders.

His will is not all the junk that comes from the legalists. Jesus preached and preached and preached AGAINST that kind of stuff until he was tired.

Oh well, whether they repent and beging to do God's will or not, the important thing is, they are not winning. Coming to a congregation near you: INSTRUMENTAL MUSIC!!!! Get used to it.

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...........................THE BOOK

What Happened at the Madison Church of Christ?

There are thousands of churches being taken over across America.

This book is only about one of those churches. It's about the Madison Church Of Christ. By studying the methods used here along with the resource references you might be able to inoculate your church. At the very least you will recognize the signs early on.

Many of the current members of the Madison Church of Christ still don't know what happened.
Some never will know! This book is for them as well.

Madison Church of Christ was a 60 year old church. At one time it was one of the largest churches in the US, and the largest Church of Christ.

It thrived for many years on the vision of it's elders and those of it's ministers. Those visions undoubtably came from the the inspired word of Jesus Christ.

At sometime in the last 10 years there was a deliberate plan by a majority of the elders to take the Madison Church of Christ into a more worldly realm.

They used secrecy, covert planning, and outside sources to scheme and to change the format and direction of the Madison Church of Christ.

The Elders knew that the membership would never approve such a plan. Using the tools of the "Community Church Movement"(consultants, books, seminars, meetings,planters,seeders) they slowly started initiating change so it was never noticed by the members until it was too late.....

At the heart of the plan was the fact that old members were going to be driven off so new techniques could be used to go out and reach the unchurched through new "Contemporary Holy Entertainment" methods developed by the "Community Church Movement"

Old members had to be kept on board long enough to get their plans ready, or the funds would not be there to pay for the new building. So by the plans very nature, it had to be secret.

The church had no plan in effect to renew or approve elders. There was never any need. The elders had always been "as approved by God". 10 of the last 15 elders would begin to shed some doubt on that.

The Elders did not even need a majority at first, because some of the elders went along unwittingly.

This edition starts shortly after some of the members begin to smell something strange in January 2001. Later editions may go back and fill in some of the timeline.

To even start to understand whats happening here, you must read the background materials in the first of the book.

This is only the first edition, and not the end. New editions will be printed as needed. To keep abreast of current changes, please visit our web site;

Here is the list of players;

5 Godly Elders
10 Not so Godly Elders
120 "Deacons" (allegiance unknown)
2,800 - 4,000 church "members"
2 "teners" (people who have publicly confessed to have broken all ten commandments)
Unknown number of "sinners" (This is what the 10 elders call us.)
Unknown number of "demons" (Flying everywhere, to many to count)

Click Here......The Book is Available Now FREE

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