Moody Waters suggests that the WATER in baptism is really amniotic fluid: he could probably taste the difference.

Other Vocal-Joes jump to defend anything anti church of Christ. What he/she misses is that the Bible and history is being REPUDIATED and that repudiates the WORD which defines who will bun in hell. Both intend to PREVENT the truth from being spoken.

JESUS CHRIST ILLUSTRATED THE MEANING OF BAPTISM as CONVERSION or The New Birth. This was the meaning of proselyte baptism or "commercial" baptism or of adoption:

And Jesus called a little child unto him, and set him in the midst of them, Matthew 18:2
And said, Verily I say unto you, Except ye be CONVERTED,and become (be born) AS little children,
ye SHALL NOT ENTER into the kingdom of heaven. Matthew 18:3

Now, the Jesus anticipated the APISTOS and also used the word BORN of WATER and the SPIRIT. Conversion or being born of WATER and SPIRIT REgenerates the human spirit so that we are LIKE little Children and free from sin.

Nicodemus believed that Jesus was from God but was told:

Jesus answered and said unto him, Verily, verily, I say unto thee, Except a man be born AGAIN, he CANNOT SEE the kingdom of God. John 3:3
Nicodemus saith unto him, How can a man be born when he is old? can he enter the second time into his mothers womb, and be born? John 3:4

Nicodemus did not know that he must be born again and FROM ABOVE.

Jesus answered, Verily, verily, I say unto thee, Except a MAN (already born of the flesh)
be born of WATER and of the SPIRIT,
he CANNOT ENTER into the kingdom of God. John 3:5

You need A holy spirit or A good conscience which means a CO-PERCEPTION before you can SEE the kingdom which is WITHIN YOU and which is a SPIRITUAL kingdom not related to the FLESH. 1 Peter 3:21 says that BAPTISM SAVES US because we REQUEST that God give us A good concsience so whe can SEE the Spirit truth.

Now, we have CONVERTED meaning to be BORN AGAIN. Without being CONVERTED you cannot ENTER the kingdom. The church of Christ is the KINGDOM and we are ADDED to the church only AFTER we have been baptize

Pure water excludes AMNIOTIC FLUID or blood or wine baptism of paganism.

Heb 10:22 Let us draw near with

a true [truthful] heart in full assurance [to carry out fully] of faith,
having our hearts sprinkled from an evil conscience,
and our BODIES washed with pure WATER.

Nicodemus saith unto him, How can a man be born when he is old? can he enter the second time into his mothers womb, and be born? John 3:4

Nicodemus

had been born of amniotic fluid: [NOT PURE WATER}
he is an older man
Jesus said YE MUST BE BORN AGAIN [from above]

In the FULFILLMENT after Pentecost we see BOTH the new birth and conversion as a result of FAITH when we COMPLY by being baptized.

Then Peter said unto them, repent

and be baptized every one of you in the name of Jesus Christ
FOR the remission of sins,
and ye SHALL receive the gift of the Holy Ghost. Acts 2:38

The same Peter called A holy spirit A good conscience.

Baptism, which corresponds to this, now saves you, not as a removal of dirt from the body but as an APPEAL to God for A clear conscience, through the resurrection of Jesus Christ, 1 Peter 3:21

A clear Conscience is what allws us to SEE THE KINGDOM of God within us and UNDERSTAND the Words of God which are HIDDEN to unbelievers. A good conscience is:

Suneidesis (g4893) soon-i'-day-sis; from a prol. form of 4894; Co- perception, i.e. moral consciousness; - conscience.

Suneido (g4894) soon-i'-do; from 4862 and 1492 [SPIRITUAL EYES]; to see completely; used (like its prim.) only in two past tenses, respectively mean. to understand or become aware, and to be conscious or (clandestinely) informed of: - consider, know, be privy, be ware of

At the same gathering Paul repeated the direct command to be baptized:

Repent ye therefore,
and be CONVERTED,
that your sins may be blotted out,
when the times of refreshing shall come from the presence of the Lord; Acts 3:19

Refreshing is the Greek:

Andronikos (g408) an-dron'-ee-kos; from 435 and 3534; man of victory; Andronicos, an Isr.: - Andronicus.

The Latin "baptisma" MEANS regeneration. To be born again is:

Na-ti-vitasI. birth, nativity, municipem aut nativitas aut adoptio.
2. A generation: usque ad quartam nativitatem, Tert. adv. Marc. 4, 27 fin.

The SEED is the WORD of GOD: there can be no SPROUTING or GENERATION until the WORD has been planted into an honest heart.

Luke 8:9 And his disciples asked him, saying, What might this parable be?
Now the parable is this: The SEED is the WORD of God. Luke 8:11

The text proves that the RAISING UP connected to Satan's MUSIC is what plucks the SEED out of the heart. Jesus said MY WORDS are SPIRIT and LIFE. Therefore, when the SEED WORD is planted into the heart it must GERMINATE and then bring forth fruit.

Those who claim that they are born WITHOUT hearing the Word of God blaspheme by calling Jesus Christ (the only Spirit) a liar. The GENERATON at Baptism refers to Luke 4:27

Mk 4:26 And he said, So is the kingdom of God, as if a man should cast seed into the ground;

Mk 4:27 And should sleep, and rise night and day, and the seed should SPRING and grow up, he knoweth not how.

Mk 4:28 For the earth bringeth forth fruit of herself; first the blade, then the ear, after that the full corn in the ear.

Mk 4:29 But when the fruit is brought forth, immediately he putteth in the sickle, because the harvest is come.

Those who refuse to COMPLY call Jesus Christ a liar: they are defined by the word APISTOS. That means that they are openly hostile to the Word of God. That is why Moody Waters and Vocal Joe work so hard to silence the WORD of God. It all fits the PROPHETIC TYPE of those whom John REFUSED to baptize because they are mortal enemies of God: consiounsly, subconsiously or unconsiously.

This is NOT a debate about the meaning of the Scriptures: no scholar agrees with Moody Waters and Vocal Joe. Therefore, it is the OUTWORKING of the meaning of APISTOS which means a REBEL or a REVOLTER against a Holy God. I know who is the winner so enjoy the space of EXCLUSIVISM and LEGALISM.

Hello, Piney-hiney.

Now I see he is posting on GCM.

Some moonie kept inviting me out of FaithSlight and told of the wonders of Grace Land so I whizzed over there to see how fast the grace would be poured over piney.

Looks like it is as moribund as FaithSlight. The same old "preacher's schools" with the same old "tritheism" heresy of the up wing or down wing of the RM. Calling God a person or three persons could have gotten you burned real good in the olden days: I think God will or has burned anyone good. Did you notice that the DOVE was LITERALLY the Holy Spirit? Well, then the Holy Spirit is a dove and FLUTTERS DOWN like a dove.

Now, since the dove person didn't ENTER Jesus that means that HE didn't have a SPIRIT? I think they get that "the wind BLEW over the waters" confused as "The Holy Spirit fluttered over and HATCHED it." Since, God rides on the wings of the spirit (wind) that PROVES that the Holy Spirit IS in fact a dove--much less than a preacher man! But, then Jesus said that was parabolic and Job said so in two places. Jesus said that was to HIDE the truth from the clergy (the unworthy).

They even have a meaner walt over there!

However, I remember that the commission was to GO and preach "all ye that labor and are heavey laden by preachers and singers and staff infection COME learn of me." Now, that makes ALL staff as mad as the Silversmiths who had to remove Paul from their traffic. Sure, I know that if I lie they would love me to death.

The message is to PRESENT the Gospel and not to argue it: there are those OF FAITH and when they HEAR the word (like the woman at the well) they will recognize the voice of the shepherd. Then, the preacher MOVES ON. If the the ANTIBIOTIC does not match the GERM then the direct command is to SHAKE DUST.

So, I need to lay down the facts such as PSALLO is a warfare and perverted pagan word and see if there is a hit or a miss and then move on. All of the Bible passages and The Book of Enoch proves that when people fall sucker for the MUSIC MARK they are "hard wired" and they will never change. All of the posters on forums have developed a hard shell and are MARKED one way or another.

So, lonesome cannot happen when you grasp my outreach EXORCISING the demons of the "law of giving, the law of sanging and the law of listening to preachercating." You would be surprised how many need someone to tell them that the whole thing is a massive shell game. They knew it all along but the patterning is hard to break out of. The "music" invasion is the LAST GASP of those who find the 'attendance thin and the collections drying up.'

You watch but you won't listen. The only difference between S.E.s right wing and your Left wing is about $50,000.00 a year more for the pastor and LOTS of little staff infectors and LOADS more spiritual burdens they LADE on you to keep you from thinking. So, who is the fooled?