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IF ANOTHER CENSUS WERE TAKEN

May 23 2007 at 1:25 AM
John Waddey  (no login)
from IP address 70.156.11.9

-----Original Message-----
From: [fortify_your_faith@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf of John Waddey
Sent: Saturday, May 19, 2007 2:44 PM
To: fortify_your_faith@yahoogroups.com
Subject: [fortify_your_faith] A Lesson to Fortify Your Faith - 05/19/07


IF ANOTHER CENSUS WERE TAKEN

Dear Christian Friends:

Today's lesson looks at a decisive even in our past history and from it draws lessons for the present. George Santana rightly observed that he who does not learn the lessons of history is doomed to repeat the mistakes of history. Please share this with every Christian in your email address book. Feel free to make copies to share with those where you worship. Truth makes us free. Ignorance and error assure our defeat.

— John Waddey


___________________________________


    IF ANOTHER CENSUS WERE TAKEN


    In 1906 Mr. S.N.D. North of the U.S. Census Bureau went to Nashville to speak with David Lipscomb. He wanted to know if he were correct in assuming that there was a division within the ranks of our brethren? North was not a member of the church, but he detected significant differences between those who styled themselves "progressives" and those who wished to continue in the same way and manner their predecessors had served the Lord. Bro. Lipscomb sadly confirmed his suspicions. Plans were then made for a more discriminating census to determine the specific numbers for each camp.

    Bro. J. W. Shepherd was commissioned to supervise the project for our brethren. He found that only 149,658 members gathered in 2,649 congregations could be found within the churches of Christ while those who preferred to worship with instruments of music and have societies to do the work of the church numbered 982,701 members in 8,203 churches. That was a sobering day for those of our people who did not think the problem was all that severe; those who felt it would eventfully fade away if just ignored; for those who could not bring themselves to stand up and fight for the truth of the gospel; for those who felt the issues were not all that important.

    A few brethren had seen the flood approaching, they knew it was sweeping all before it. They had warned and pleaded but many turned a deaf ear, some even thought they were alarmists, or narrow mossy backs who were not keeping up with changing times. Some blamed them with being troublemakers.

    Churches of Christ of today are greatly indebted to Bro. David Lipscomb and the little band of men who stood with him in the face of that flood of apostasy. They saved the day by their determined stand for the ancient gospel and for the purity of the church. We now see them as heroes, but it took a few years before folks realized that they were the true and faithful knights who had risk all to save the kingdom of Christ from those who were bent capturing it and distorting it into something other than what Christ had ordered.

    Since the 1960s another band of progressives have been busily at work among us. At first there were just a scattered few of them. Some of them found a fertile breeding ground in the tolerant environs of some of our Christian schools. There they quietly labored to strengthen their grip on the schools and to influence the young men and women who came under their influence. Now that second generation has arisen to leadership posts in our churches and schools. We know them as change agents. No longer are they a small minority, working quietly behind the scenes, they are numerous and bold. They have ensconced themselves in many of our largest congregations and in many of our schools. Their advocates are on the lecture circuit among our schools and churches, spreading the doctrine of change. They are openly calling for a change in our worship, our faith and our practice. They want women in leadership posts in the church; they want choirs and special singers in our worship. They want to change the terms of salvation and membership in the church of Christ. They want a different atmosphere in worship; despising the worship of the past they want entertainment and excitement. They want a new approach to preaching. No more of the old book, chapter and verse proclamation. They want story telling and drama. Some of them want instrumental music in their worship.

    As dangerous as this band of rogue change agents is, another danger confronts us of even greater magnitude. It is the lack of concern, the unwillingness to address the issue, the failure to take a strong stand against these innovations that affect large numbers of our brethren. Peace at any price is another name for surrender to the enemy. For at least 20 years this spirit has prevailed among us. If tomorrow a census were taken to determine which congregations are willing to tolerate and go along with the change agenda and which are determined to continue in the old paths of the gospel, I tremble to think what the results would be. If such a poll were taken in your congregation, what would the finding be? Brethren, our situation is just as critical as that of our brethren a century ago. While so many sleep, the enemy is sowing tares of error in the fields of the kingdom (Matt. 13:24-30). I plead with all who love the church to awake to the danger. Arm yourselves and man the walls while you can. To tarry is to invite disaster.


___________________________________
John Waddey, Editor
Christianity: Then and Now

E-Mail: johnwaddey@aol.com

 
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AuthorReply
allen coffman
(no login)
68.53.218.87

Bro. Lipscomb goes to hell and heaven

May 23 2007, 11:23 PM 

Bro. Lipscomb at the end of his walk on earth is called on. He awakens in a warm, bright light and is face to face with a gleaming un-named angel. The angel leads Bro. L upto the gates of hell.

Bro L calls out, "are there any instramentalists in there?"

"Yes", comes the answer.

"Are there any missionary society members in there?"

"Yes"

"Are there any Diciples in there?"

"Yes"

"Are there any non-instamental Church of Christ members?"

Yes"

He is immediately transported to the gleaming gates of Heaven.

Again, Bro. L calls out,"are there any instramentalists in there?"

"No", comes the answer.

"Are there any missionary society members in there?"

"No"

"Are there any Diciples in there?"

"No"

"Are there any non-instamental Church of Christ members?"

No"

He pauses for a few minutes and then replies loudly, "Who is in there?"

"Christians," is the unison response.


 
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CCRM-Concerned
(no login)
170.141.109.33

Isn’t it a very serious matter?

May 25 2007, 4:18 PM 

Allen,

I’ve been trying to figure out your motive for posting “Lipscomb goes to hell and heaven.” It’s kind of funny if you look at it from that standpoint. But I did not detect in your post any sense of urgency, concern and loyalty to the church.

Brother Waddey stated, “That was a sobering day for those of our people who did not think the problem was all that severe; those who felt it would eventfully fade away if just ignored; for those who could not bring themselves to stand up and fight for the truth of the gospel; for those who felt the issues were not all that important.”

Allen, some of the many questions for each of us—and that includes you—are that: if we are concerned, as change agents continue to make their moves, that marked division is inevitable because it is common knowledge that ecumenism has never worked; and if another census were taken, what would the new statistics reveal.

 
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allen coffman
(no login)
209.215.126.20

passionate not concerned

May 25 2007, 5:23 PM 

cccm-c

I am very passionate in my teaching about our relationship with Christ.

I believe that our "come worship with us" mentality to church membership, fellowship and evangelism has led us to idol worship in the church of Christ. We have left out the relationship with God through Christ that the entire revelation of God from Genesis to Rev. reveals to us.

Locations for gathering, song services, communion, water baptism, Bible study, service opportunity, sunday school, Christian universities, prayer, breath, life, relationships, preaching, teaching, prophecy, discipleship and evangelism are all tools. Holy tools used by the Holy Spirit to bring our lives after rebirth in Chirst's resurection power into complete maturity of Christ-likeness.

As God's children tend to do, we frequently trade the relationship for the tools. We trade the destination for the road signs. That is unfortunate. And, as Dr. Crump eloquently told in his story, many will stand before Christ and hold up his or her idol in self-justification. Sadly, he will say, "I never knew you."

I see us moving into a day where more are coming back to Holy Communion with God. Most of the arguements in the church of Christ tend to be those propping up a flimsy faith not in God but his or her religious idol of choice on both sides.

 
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Dr. Bill Crump
(no login)
66.217.165.46

Can Heaven Wait?

May 24 2007, 2:33 PM 

A man dies. Not knowing where he is, he wanders around until he stands before huge, pearly gates. He knocks on the gates, hoping that someone will help him. Presently, a distinguished being in shining white robes approaches.

"May I help you?" asks the remarkable being.

"Where am I, and who the heck are you?" asks the one without.

"This is the entrance to Heaven, and I am the Keeper of the Gates thereto. Perhaps you have heard of the 'pearly gates'?"

"Well, whadda ya know! I'm dead! And I'm about to enter Heaven!" said the one without.

"Not so fast, my son," said the shining one. "Only faithful Christians may enter Heaven. Were you a faithful Christian while you were on Earth?"

"I went from one denomination to another, trying to find the one that was the least boring. Those that had the latest and hottest rock music, drama, entertainment, and the shortest sermons I attended the most. So yeah, I was 'faithful.'"

"Did you fully believe that Christ was the Son of God, did you confess His name before mankind, did you repent of your sins, were you baptized for remission of sins and salvation, as Christ had commanded, and did you live a life totally committed to submitting yourself in obedience to His Authority and in service to mankind?"

"Look, man, my church just preached that 'love' was all that was necessary. That 'obedience' jazz wasn't worth a hoot, because we were told that Christ saved everybody from the cross, so we didn't have to DO anything. Now stop giving me grief and OPEN THEM GATES--NOW!"

"My son," said the shining one, "you are much too impatient--and rude. But it is not my place to judge you. I will confer with my Lord and Master to see if your name has been written in the Book of Life. Please wait."

The shining one departed but almost immediately returned, for it took only a fraction of a second to learn the truth about the one without.

"I regret to inform you that Christ, my Lord and Master, does not find your name written in the Book of Life. You have been weighed in the balances and have been found wanting. Therefore, I cannot admit you to Heaven. Christ became the Author of eternal salvation only to those who were willing to trust him enough to obey all that He commanded them. He didn't command much, but it is apparent that some, such as yourself, didn't take the time to learn of Him as you should have."

"But-but-but, what about Christ and the cross? Didn't He save everybody on planet Earth from the cross?"

"My son, Christ made salvation available to all mankind from the cross, but you and everyone else were given free will whether you wanted to comply with His few, simple conditions for salvation or trust in yourselves. You chose the latter. Heaven is only for those who are truly obedient, not for slackards and rebels. I am so very sorry, as is my Master, for He had really not wanted anyone to perish. But just as He has mercy for those who repent and become His children through obedience, He has as much judgment and punishment for those who are not His children."

With that, the scene immediately changed to flames, heat, intense pain, and agony, as the one without was cast into the outer darkness, where he spent eternity weeping, wailing, and gnashing his teeth.

He who hath an ear...

 
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Ken Sublett
(no login)
69.19.14.21

BAD stats?

May 25 2007, 12:39 PM 

I think that it is a mistake to LUMP churches of Christ with the Disciples.
The two grew from two separate roots: the disciples came out of the Christian Church and early history shows that the few in Tennessee were fed by O Kelly who sprang from the Methodists who Sprang from the Anglicans or Episcopals. The Anglican church and all of its daughters were not true Protestants but the English version of Catholicism where most kings fought Rome.

At Cane Ridge the charismatic--almost Devil worshipers--gave rise to that wing of "restorers" but the Reformers led by the Campbells did not come out of that and repudiated them. Most of the preachers fed into the Campbell movement along with Baptists who were turned off by the excesses.

At that time there was no doctrinal commonality between the groups; some, like Stone preached "union" without respect to the doctrinal divide. There were instances of the two groups meeting in the same building but that ceased when the organ and society (an English "catholic" idea] were promoted to the breaking point.

Lipscomb knew that the two BRANCHES never agreed: he also noted that for the first time in history they used the PSALLO argument in 1878.

By the time of the 1906 census simply DENIED the DISCIPLES ther claim to OWNERSHIP of the Church of Christ. I have a centenial edition of the Declaration and Address which shows the DENOMINATIONAL structure.

It was a full Decade later in 1926 that those who had some commonality with the Church of Christ SECTARIANED out of the Disciples and formed their own less-rigid NACC.

So, don't let the STATS worry you: the small group known as Churches of Christ never JOINED the DISCIPLES because of their ROOTS as "King-led Catholics." That smaller group is the TOTALITY of "protestants" which was out STARTING POINT long before 1906.

The Christian Church loves to lie that the church of Christ SECTED OUT of the THEIR group when the Christian Church is the only SECTARIAN split from the Disciples while churches of Christ were NEVER part. The Christian church had another RESTRUCTURE in about 1968.

The DISCIPLES went on to be just another "Catholic Like" group. Someone needs to do a count on their size and look at the size of the Christian Church Denomination (NACC) at the same time.

Churches of Christ are NOT a Catholic based (high church) as Alfred T. Degroot clearly defines the Christian Church. The DEFECTIONS have been by Dupes who conspired through the Unity Meetings--such as the 2006 DLC--to seduce a few through deliberately lying ABOUT God and TO God and about all known Biblical and historical information. Rick Atchley confessed (we already knew) to a decades-old "hidden agenda."

LET 'EM GO, the REMNANT theology means that God is ALWAYS trimming the faithful through floods and fires--burning up the chaff: "Shall He find faith when He returns." No, almost none so DON'T get into a PANIC because Prophesy was that Jesus would never CRY OUT meaning to call mass meetings: if you want to find Him, says Paul, you have to go OUTSIDE the masses and suffer reproaches.

SMALLER is the only MARK that you have not been taken CAPTIVE: rejoice in the day of small things.

 
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...........................THE BOOK

What Happened at the Madison Church of Christ?


There are thousands of churches being taken over across America.

This book is only about one of those churches. It's about the Madison Church Of Christ. By studying the methods used here along with the resource references you might be able to inoculate your church. At the very least you will recognize the signs early on.

Many of the current members of the Madison Church of Christ still don't know what happened.
Some never will know! This book is for them as well.

Madison Church of Christ was a 60 year old church. At one time it was one of the largest churches in the US, and the largest Church of Christ.

It thrived for many years on the vision of it's elders and those of it's ministers. Those visions undoubtably came from the the inspired word of Jesus Christ.

At sometime in the last 10 years there was a deliberate plan by a majority of the elders to take the Madison Church of Christ into a more worldly realm.

They used secrecy, covert planning, and outside sources to scheme and to change the format and direction of the Madison Church of Christ.

The Elders knew that the membership would never approve such a plan. Using the tools of the "Community Church Movement"(consultants, books, seminars, meetings,planters,seeders) they slowly started initiating change so it was never noticed by the members until it was too late.....

At the heart of the plan was the fact that old members were going to be driven off so new techniques could be used to go out and reach the unchurched through new "Contemporary Holy Entertainment" methods developed by the "Community Church Movement"

Old members had to be kept on board long enough to get their plans ready, or the funds would not be there to pay for the new building. So by the plans very nature, it had to be secret.

The church had no plan in effect to renew or approve elders. There was never any need. The elders had always been "as approved by God". 10 of the last 15 elders would begin to shed some doubt on that.

The Elders did not even need a majority at first, because some of the elders went along unwittingly.

This edition starts shortly after some of the members begin to smell something strange in January 2001. Later editions may go back and fill in some of the timeline.

To even start to understand whats happening here, you must read the background materials in the first of the book.

This is only the first edition, and not the end. New editions will be printed as needed. To keep abreast of current changes, please visit our web site; http://www.concernedmembers.com/madison

Here is the list of players;

5 Godly Elders
10 Not so Godly Elders
120 "Deacons" (allegiance unknown)
2,800 - 4,000 church "members"
2 "teners" (people who have publicly confessed to have broken all ten commandments)
Unknown number of "sinners" (This is what the 10 elders call us.)
Unknown number of "demons" (Flying everywhere, to many to count)
 

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