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Ken Sublett
(Login Ken.Sublett)
ConcernedMembersMadison
67.142.130.16

Worship is in the PLACE of the human sopirit

March 2 2011, 2:54 PM 

Music is never a word connected with worship in the Bible: those who worshipped while the not-commanded animals were being burned as a curse fell on their face.

In the church the only worship word is to give attention to the Word of Christ in the Prophets and apostles: that is because church is a School of the Word and not a worship service.

You cannot worship God in a house built by human hands or by the works of human hands: you CAN make it impossible for others to worship IN THEIR MIND as they give attention too the Word. Christ who inspired the prophets said:

Hab 2:18 What profiteth the graven image that the maker thereof hath graven it; the molten image, and a teacher of lies, that the maker of his work trusteth therein, to make dumb idols?

All ancient and modern neo-pagans believed that the noises which came out of a musical instrument proved that it wass the god or house of the god: modern pagans repudiate the songs and sermons of Christ and believe in delusions that THEIR words are more powerful. Strong delusions produces Lying Wonders which are all of the performing arts and crafts.

Hab. 2:19 Woe unto him that saith to the wood,
.... Awake; to the dumb stone, Arise,
....it shall teach! Behold,
....it is laid over with gold and silver,
....and there is no breath at all in the midst of it.
Hab. 2:20 But the LORD is in his holy temple: let all the earth keep silence before him.


Silence is: Taceo B. [select] Transf., for silere, of animals and things, concr. and abstr., to be still, noiseless, quiet, at REST (mostly poet.):meditating canis ipse tacet,

Jesus died to give us REST: blessed silence while He speaks ONLY through His Word.

Which includes silencing:

cno , ccni, cantum (ancient I. Neutr., to utter melodious notes, to sing, sound, play. C. Transf., of the instruments by which, or (poet.) of the places in which, the sounds are produced, to sound, resound: canentes tibiae, Cic. N. D. 2, 8, 22: maestae cecinere tubae,

The tibia is a "lifeless instrument" Paul condemned: it is made of the shin bone.

Many are called but few are chosen meaning tested as by fire as a DISCIPLE. Not many need or want to be Disciples of Christ: the image of the LOCUSTS in Revelation means that he has separated them out from the Body of Christ which is A School (only) of Christ (only).


 
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Dr. Bill Crump
(no login)
74.179.10.176

Re: More Confusion - Church to Monastery

March 2 2011, 3:22 PM 

"I can do all things through Christ which strengtheneth me" (Philip. 4:13 KJV).

It's amazing that so many postmodernists take that passage and twist it into, "I can worship any way I want and however I want through Christ, Who winketh His eye and giveth me a license to do anything and everything that seemeth right in my own eyes."

 
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Ken Sublett
(Login Ken.Sublett)
ConcernedMembersMadison
67.142.130.16

Response to David

March 2 2011, 3:28 PM 

I say, Do open up your Bible and show where God said to do the "five acts of worship" on Sundays.

"Notice: This is a moderated forum. Your post will not show up until a moderator approves the message."

Why the notice? Are you afraid? If you have the truth, then you should not be afraid.


Moderated means that the forum has to have a humanoid on hand: the major moderator works for a living and is not always available.

No posts are censured like some wimpy burger forums: your post may be placed in a proper category but never ignored.

THERE IS ONLY ONE ACT OF THE SCHOOL OF THE BIBLE WHICH IS NOT A PAGAN WORSHIP CENTER DOING CEREMONIAL LEGALISM LIKE MUSIC TO APPEASE THEIR GOD:

This is well defined inclusively and exclusively by Christ (the Rock) Who ordained the Qahal, synagogue or Church of Christ in the wilderness.

It was INCLUSIVE of Rest, Reading and Rehearsing the Word: what disciples do.
It was EXCLUSIVE of vocal or instrumental rejoicing: what reverent disciples do not do.

http://www.piney.com/Synagogue1.html

The SEVENTH DAY of the Week was when all of the Pagan SUN or STAR worshipers met: both that and the tithe were Babylonianism. The Sacrificial system PROFANED (instrumental noise) the Sabbath because God had abandoned them to worship the starry host BECAUSE of musical idolatry at Mount Sinai.

http://www.piney.com/Exodus.32.html

The Gentiles atttended the Syngogues to escape the usual pagan and perverted musicl worship where music means "to make the lambs dumb before the slaughter" so they could demand "lay by in store" to fleece the widows. That is why they were, like Timothy, WISE unto salvation.

Acts 15:18 Known unto God are all his works from the beginning of the world.
Acts 15:19 Wherefore my sentence is, that we trouble not them,
......which from among the Gentiles are turned to God:


Turned or Converted means to obey in baptism. No ceremonial was ADDED to the meaning of SYNAGOGUE or ekklesia as A School of Christ.

Acts 15:20 But that we write unto them, that they abstain from pollutions of idols, and from fornication, and from things strangled, and from blood.

Acts 15:21 For Moses
....of old time hath in every city (not at the Babylon-like temple)
....them that preach him,
....being read in the synagogues every sabbath day.


Preaching as in private interpretation was excluded 2 Peter 1
Corrupting the Word as in "selling learning at retail" was forbidden.
"There was never a praise service in the synagogue or ekklesia." Disciple above the toddler age know better than that.

The Lord's Supper is to show forth the DEATH of Christ: we don't hum, whistle, clap.
Show forth is an EVANGELIZING or preaching word: the only commanded preaching.

There is no "Law of preching" but the Anti-5-act sects will not give that up.
There is no "Law of singing" but the Anti-5-Act sects will not give that up.
There is no "Law of giving" but the Anti-5-Act sects will not give that one up.

So if you have a Musical Team which costs and a preacher which costs be advised that YOU HAVE NO HONEST FUNDING. Jesus called the Scribes and Pharisees, hypocrites and in Ezekiel 33 named "false preachers, singers and instrument players" all the marks of lusting after money.

ONE ACT: Elders as the sole Pastor-Teachers (Eph 4) prepare the people to RESIST the cunning craftsmen or rhetoricians, singers and instrument players. Then, you can do ekklesia by PREACHING the Word of Christ (prophets and apostles) by READING "that which is written for our learning" Romans 15.

The Lord's Supper is a teaching/confessing VISUAL AID.

No one in recorded history violated those Commands, examples and inferences before singing as an ACT was imposed and sowed discord about the year 373.

The fact that the 5-Act-Sect cannot be proven does NOT give anyone the authority to ADD instruments because anyone past reading 101a knows THAT instrumental noise was outlawed and anyone who knows the meaning of "disciple of Christ" knows WHY.

 
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Shelby Anderson
(Login aw2012)
24.253.243.201

Needing to be true to yourself/ hypocracy of The Church Of Christ

March 19 2015, 12:52 AM 

I go to a Church of Christ. I was raised in the Church of Christ. When churches like Quail Spring C of C in Oklahoma went with instrumental music, I had a problem with it. My problem was not from biblical text, or "staying true to what Jesus commands". They were a Church of Christ, and they needed to know who they were, and not try to be who they aren't. Being a Disciples of Christ church would let them introduce instruments into services. Same as if they started doing Mass and bringing in priest for confession, they would need to change to a Catholic Church.

My main problem with your view about "The Lord's Church" is exactly that. What makes you, or in fact ANYBODY on the face of this Earth, feel they have the right to do the work of "my Lord" and judge. Being a man raised in the "Lord's Church", I know how you think, so let's crack open the Bible and see what gives you, or anybody the right to judge a person or church.

Matthew 7:1 Judge not, that you be not judged.

Luke 6:37

Romans 14:12 So then each of us shall give account of himself to God. Therefore let us not judge one another anymore, but rather resolve this, not to put a stumbling block or a cause to fall in our brother's way.

And my personal favorite;
John 8:7 He who is without sin among you, let him throw a stone at her first.

This is just a small example of what Jesus expects of us. My first response to you is anger that you, and you are not the only one, believe that the Churches of Christ are the only ones that have it right. However, I am called to be humble by Jesus, because he will take care of the judgement, like he took care of the Pharisees and Sadducees. Matthew 3:7. I will not claim I am only one of a few to be saved come judgement time, because that is reserved for no man.

 
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Ken Sublett
(Login Ken.Sublett)
ConcernedMembersMadison
184.20.116.93

Quail Springs Instruments.

March 19 2015, 2:38 PM 

Romans 14:12 So then each of us shall give account of himself to God. Therefore let us not judge one another anymore, but rather resolve this, not to put a stumbling block or a cause to fall in our brother's way.

And my personal favorite;
John 8:7 He who is without sin among you, let him throw a stone at her first.

This is just a small example of what Jesus expects of us. My first response to you is anger that you, and you are not the only one, believe that the Churches of Christ are the only ones that have it right. However, I am called to be humble by Jesus, because he will take care of the judgement, like he took care of the Pharisees and Sadducees. Matthew 3:7. I will not claim I am only one of a few to be saved come judgement time, because that is reserved for no man.


We don't do "heaven and hell" but what is the meaning of IS IS. One of the "staff" at Quail Springs was brought into my local happy congregation to convert it into a community church driven by the Purpose Driven error. Specificially to reject fellowship with the "country bumpkins" and bond with a Church of God. That intended to impose female ministers, "praise singing," and debunking baptism. The failed goal was to impose instruments. The preacher went on to work for Quail Springs and locally to take over a congregation and do what he failed to do when opposed: you would call that judging. Judging is when about 2/3 of the owners at Quail Springs were forced to leave: Judging is passing sentence and imposing it on others.

Jesus called the Scribes and Pharisees, hypocrites. The Spirit OF Christ in Ezekiel 33 named performance preachers for hire, singers and instrument players. So, NOT being forced to use instruments and RESTING false teaching doeth not a hypocrite make.

Romans 14 and 15 FORBIDS anything beyond "using one mind and one mouth to speak that which is written for our learning."

The right to REFUTE comes with the public hate mongering against anyone who will not "unify" by using instruments. A disciple of Christ in the Prophets and Apostles gets to teach that which has been taught and resist those who claim the right to lie, cheat and steal your property and flock. They hold workshops with the Christian Church learning how to "transistion" the PREACHER'S church into the instrumentalist. They DO violate direct evidence from Genesis to Revelation. We can say that without being JUDGED as judgmental. Forgive the picture but this forum does not allow me to shout in color and bold.. I can supply links so you don't have to depend on my exact copying of recorded facts.

FIRST, it is important to define the WEAK in Romans 14. That does not mean that they are going to hell but they do not get the right to "doubtful disputions" which means the right to their OWN OPINION. WE get the right to refute if they get the right to knowingly sowing discord so they can get your property for the instrumental sect.

[linked image]








 
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Ken Sublett
(Login Ken.Sublett)
ConcernedMembersMadison
184.20.116.93

Some Greek on Romans 14

March 20 2015, 4:25 PM 

It is true that each INDIVIDUAL has the right to go to the temples and buy MEAT and probably consume it in the marketplace in the absence of refrigeration,.

It is true that they can observe DAYS which applies to the days when either meat or vegetables were on sale. Others seeing new believers in the marketplace were not to judge their spirituality because the "Kingdom" does not consist of diet or keeping of days. The kingdom is within us and does not come with observation meaning religious services.

However, in Romans 14 and 15 Paul excludes anything but the WORD when people with individual preferences gather together: everyone is silent about their private opinions and listen or "use one mind and one mouth to speak that which is written for out LEARNING."

Instrumental discords us that to say that THEY have the right to decide to do something not connected to the Word and Roman 14 says that YOU do not have the same right to oppose them.

[linked image]





 
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Tom Brite
(no login)
66.87.120.190

Re: Some Greek on Romans 14

March 21 2015, 8:42 AM 

Did they sell the Quail Springs building yet?

 
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Ken Sublett
(Login Ken.Sublett)
ConcernedMembersMadison
184.20.116.93

Re: Some Greek on Romans 14

March 21 2015, 1:38 PM 

I knew that it was for sale but haven't heard anything: they did a good job about saying that it was too big to support and they were moving into another building.

My "investment with the Lord" in Seattle may have been the first one to go instrumental after they bonded with a Christian Church. The preacher played banjo, his wife played piano and a son played guitar! The preacher deserted and moved on. He is still called to the workshops to tell people how to transistion to instrumentals: Just steal the property and turn it over just like Machiavelli told them to do.

They sold the building and are moving into a skating rink or something in a shopping center. The rationale was that they could better reach the people.

The body count at Richland Hills is about where they began the retrograde but that includes two or three sister congregations.

That's good: Paul said heresy was necessary as a pruning operation.

 
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Ken Sublett
(Login Ken.Sublett)
ConcernedMembersMadison
184.20.116.93

Re: Some Greek on Romans 14

March 21 2015, 2:21 PM 

The Springs
14401 N. May Ave

The building is unoccupied and they are meeting at Spring Hills Mall. That is puzzling unless they are too small to be seen. They bonded with the Baptist Church accross the street but when you BOND with a denomination or seek "UNITY" you can bet that they intend to take you over or take you out. I am supprised that with the Oky U's views they have not rushed in a new swarm. Going out of business sales are good for the better congregations in town.

http://www.loopnet.com/Listing/18440881/14401-N-May-Ave-Oklahoma-City-OK/
Special Purpose Property For Sale

Price:
$6,250,000
Building Size:
70,000 SF
Price/SF:
$89.29
Property Type:
Special Purpose
Property Sub-type:
Special Purpose (Other)

Property Use Type:
Vacant/Owner-User
Lot Size:
20 AC
Listing ID
18440881
Last Updated
31 days ago



    
This message has been edited by Ken.Sublett from IP address 184.20.116.93 on Mar 21, 2015 2:35 PM


 
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...........................THE BOOK

What Happened at the Madison Church of Christ?


There are thousands of churches being taken over across America.

This book is only about one of those churches. It's about the Madison Church Of Christ. By studying the methods used here along with the resource references you might be able to inoculate your church. At the very least you will recognize the signs early on.

Many of the current members of the Madison Church of Christ still don't know what happened.
Some never will know! This book is for them as well.

Madison Church of Christ was a 60 year old church. At one time it was one of the largest churches in the US, and the largest Church of Christ.

It thrived for many years on the vision of it's elders and those of it's ministers. Those visions undoubtably came from the the inspired word of Jesus Christ.

At sometime in the last 10 years there was a deliberate plan by a majority of the elders to take the Madison Church of Christ into a more worldly realm.

They used secrecy, covert planning, and outside sources to scheme and to change the format and direction of the Madison Church of Christ.

The Elders knew that the membership would never approve such a plan. Using the tools of the "Community Church Movement"(consultants, books, seminars, meetings,planters,seeders) they slowly started initiating change so it was never noticed by the members until it was too late.....

At the heart of the plan was the fact that old members were going to be driven off so new techniques could be used to go out and reach the unchurched through new "Contemporary Holy Entertainment" methods developed by the "Community Church Movement"

Old members had to be kept on board long enough to get their plans ready, or the funds would not be there to pay for the new building. So by the plans very nature, it had to be secret.

The church had no plan in effect to renew or approve elders. There was never any need. The elders had always been "as approved by God". 10 of the last 15 elders would begin to shed some doubt on that.

The Elders did not even need a majority at first, because some of the elders went along unwittingly.

This edition starts shortly after some of the members begin to smell something strange in January 2001. Later editions may go back and fill in some of the timeline.

To even start to understand whats happening here, you must read the background materials in the first of the book.

This is only the first edition, and not the end. New editions will be printed as needed. To keep abreast of current changes, please visit our web site; http://www.concernedmembers.com/madison

Here is the list of players;

5 Godly Elders
10 Not so Godly Elders
120 "Deacons" (allegiance unknown)
2,800 - 4,000 church "members"
2 "teners" (people who have publicly confessed to have broken all ten commandments)
Unknown number of "sinners" (This is what the 10 elders call us.)
Unknown number of "demons" (Flying everywhere, to many to count)
 

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