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Jay Guin Still trying to get David to be worship minister

February 19 2011 at 11:32 PM
Ken Sublett  (Login Ken.Sublett)
from IP address

Jay Guin, like all of the pro-instrumentalists, are left with the Monarchy or kingdoms period which was not based on the Law of Moses.

It seems hopless that so many highly-educated men keep quoting Old Testament verses and believe that if we can find David playing a harp somewhere--never in a tabernacle- they wre worshiping with instrumental music. Even if these events are solitary and separated by centuries there is some "spirit" that wants to use this for imposing instruments in the church which is A School of the Word of Christ (only)

Here is some background from his view that if people worshiped God with instruments before or outside of the temple, then the normal preacherling appeal to a "changed law" pattern is no longer valid.

However, most of we who have not been discorded by music, understand that neither king, kingdom, temple or sacrificial system was commanded by God. You can quote absolute statements all day long and there is a fixation that "God commanded musical worship under the OLD law but we live under a NEW law which did not command instruments." My guess is that you cannot find half a dozen preachers who have not missed that simple fact if they obeyed the direct command to PREACH the Word by READING the Word as Paul commanded Timothy.

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Ken Sublett
(Login Ken.Sublett)

Can people really become UNABLE to read BLACK text on BROWN paper?

February 20 2011, 4:14 PM 

Jay Guin: When the ark was being brought to Jerusalem, David and the people celebrated and worshiped with instrumental music as spontaneous worship and not as part of the formal liturgy of the Tabernacle.

(2Sa 6:5 ESV) 5 And David and all the house of Israel were making merry before the LORD, with songs and lyres and harps and tambourines and castanets and cymbals.

David was causing a large body of people and not just those of the tribe of Levi to "MAKE MERRY" which is the same rising up to PLAY performed at Mount Sinai. This was a sin beyond redemption and God abandoned them to their lusted after 'worship of the STARS."

I believe this is a cold, calculated way to separate people based on the MARKS. It is the confession of John's prophecy in Revelation 17-18.

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So mock: eat, drink and make merry for you are an ACTOR of an event of Biblical Proportions.

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David Gustafson
(Login DavidGustafson)

Jay Guin, like all of the pro-instrumentalists

March 2 2011, 3:04 PM 

Jay Guin is not a pro-instrumentalist.

He is just not an anti-instrumentalist.

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Ken Sublett
(Login Ken.Sublett)

Not true

March 2 2011, 4:48 PM 

Not true: Jay has used all of the Bible mentions of an instrument to prove that instruments are acceptable. He does not, now one does, consider the context of a nation abandoned by God and a NOT COMMANDED animal slaughter.

He comes down with a judgmental fist against those who DEFEND themselves against hostile takeovers.

Jay simply knows that his eldership knows better.

If you badmouth those who REFUSE to be imposed on and defend those whose congenital defect was trying to "unify" churches of Christ into using instrument, they you are IN FAVOR of instruments.

I have reviewed all of his papers and he is clearly an agent of musical discord.
The almost universal method even if you have a dozen Phds is to find a phrase which fits your patternism and THAT becomes inspired even if the context ALWAYS is in the context of those God has ABANDONED without redemption.

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...........................THE BOOK

What Happened at the Madison Church of Christ?

There are thousands of churches being taken over across America.

This book is only about one of those churches. It's about the Madison Church Of Christ. By studying the methods used here along with the resource references you might be able to inoculate your church. At the very least you will recognize the signs early on.

Many of the current members of the Madison Church of Christ still don't know what happened.
Some never will know! This book is for them as well.

Madison Church of Christ was a 60 year old church. At one time it was one of the largest churches in the US, and the largest Church of Christ.

It thrived for many years on the vision of it's elders and those of it's ministers. Those visions undoubtably came from the the inspired word of Jesus Christ.

At sometime in the last 10 years there was a deliberate plan by a majority of the elders to take the Madison Church of Christ into a more worldly realm.

They used secrecy, covert planning, and outside sources to scheme and to change the format and direction of the Madison Church of Christ.

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At the heart of the plan was the fact that old members were going to be driven off so new techniques could be used to go out and reach the unchurched through new "Contemporary Holy Entertainment" methods developed by the "Community Church Movement"

Old members had to be kept on board long enough to get their plans ready, or the funds would not be there to pay for the new building. So by the plans very nature, it had to be secret.

The church had no plan in effect to renew or approve elders. There was never any need. The elders had always been "as approved by God". 10 of the last 15 elders would begin to shed some doubt on that.

The Elders did not even need a majority at first, because some of the elders went along unwittingly.

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5 Godly Elders
10 Not so Godly Elders
120 "Deacons" (allegiance unknown)
2,800 - 4,000 church "members"
2 "teners" (people who have publicly confessed to have broken all ten commandments)
Unknown number of "sinners" (This is what the 10 elders call us.)
Unknown number of "demons" (Flying everywhere, to many to count)

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