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They sung a hymn and went out

July 4 2011 at 2:01 PM
Ken Sublett  (Login Ken.Sublett)
ConcernedMembersMadison
from IP address 173.245.48.89

Matthew 26:30 And when they had sung an hymn, they went out into the mount of Olives.

http://www.piney.com/Matthew.26.Sung.Hymn.Went.Out.html

Or maybe not. Those willing to sow discord and damage God's children by appealing to often one-time events and then conduct what they call a worship service (service means hard bondage) prove that they cannot define "disciple" or "ekklesia."

The command for the church was to PREACH the word of god by READING IT. Paul issued this command to timothy including defining any doctrinal content and using Scripture to comfort one another. That simple "pattern" is repeated so many times to prove why Jesus didn't speak to the clergy without parables and Paul's letters are set-ups to fool the foolish who USE them rather than

Acts 2:14 But Peter, standing up with the eleven, lifted up his voice, and said unto them,
.....Ye men of Judaea, and all ye that dwell at Jerusalem,
..... be this known unto you, and hearken to my words:

Acts 13:27 For they that dwell at Jerusalem, and their rulers,
.....because they knew him not,
..... nor yet the voices of the prophets
.....which are read every sabbath day,
.....they have fulfilled them in condemning him.

Acts 15:21 For Moses of old time hath in every city
..... them that preach him,
.....being read in the synagogues every sabbath day.

Ephesians 3:4 Whereby, when ye read,
.....ye may understand my knowledge in the mystery of Christ)

Colossians 4:16 And when this epistle is read among you,
.....cause that it be read also in the church of the Laodiceans;
.....and that ye likewise read the epistle from Laodicea.

1Thessalonians 5:27 I charge you by the Lord
.....that this epistle be read unto all the holy brethren.

1Timothy 4:13 Till I come, give attendance to [public] reading, to exhortation, to doctrine.

Revelation 5:4 And I wept much, because no man was found worthy
.....to open and to read the book
.....neither to look thereon.

Too bad that God was not competent to define HOW He wanted His inspired message delivered to the churches.


 
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AuthorReply
R*
(no login)
173.245.56.191

Re: They sung a hymn and went out

July 4 2011, 4:12 PM 

How sad it is. sad.gif

Ken can't be his own man. Ken, if singing is wrong, just tell it like it is brother. Are you afraid to ruffle Brother Bill's feathers?

 
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Ken Sublett
(Login Ken.Sublett)
ConcernedMembersMadison
173.245.48.89

not my job.

July 4 2011, 4:18 PM 

I'm not into right and wrong, can and can't but you cannot be a so called New Testament church demanding commands, examples and inferences to be the one true church if you cannot find a direct command to Sing one to another.

None of us are aware of any qahal, synagogue, ekklesia school of the Word of God.

 
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R*
(no login)
173.245.56.191

Re: not my job.

July 4 2011, 4:31 PM 

Just as I thought!

 
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Donnie
(Login Donnie.Cruz)
ConcernedMembersMadison
173.245.56.155

We Must Continue to Search the Scriptures

July 5 2011, 4:20 AM 

R*:

Just a few brief comments:

1. Who's said that singing is wrong? Provide an exact quote.
2. Is there a difference between "sing" and "sing to one another"?
3. Can you find a scripture where "sing" is a command?
4. Can you find a scripture where "sing to one another" is a command?
5. Can you find examples of those who "sang" although "sing" was not a command?

Please note the usage of each word or expression stated above: (a) sing, (b) singing, (c) sang, (d) sing to one another, (e) sang to one another.

Ken is correct in asserting that there is no direct command to "sing one to another" [be careful about this expression] found in Scripture as a command to NT believers. I haven't found one. Maybe it's been overlooked [didn't search well enough].

Would you immediately inform us when you find such a direct command as "sing one to another"?

 
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R*
(no login)
98.81.113.140

Re: We Must Continue to Search the Scriptures

July 6 2011, 1:49 PM 

I must first say that I have a lot of respect for Ken. He is very well educated and a great guy. I think he told me he lived in NW Alabama at one time.happy.gif On the other hand, I am not nearly as educated as Ken on the Bible. The problem I have is understanding what Ken writes sometimes. I become frustrated and become short with Ken. That's my bad. I'm picking it out. Please drive on!

 
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Ken Sublett
(Login Ken.Sublett)
ConcernedMembersMadison
67.142.130.27

No offense.

July 6 2011, 2:28 PM 

I think that there is some evidence that acquired practices or something you repeat over and over and over becomes a part of your genetic makeup. That's why it becomes almost impossible to rewire your brain.

Those who define words on a scholarly level are not the same as the utilitarians especially those who see godliness as a means of financial gain or occupation. Godly preachers know before they start that Paul has identified the hard road they will have to take. On the other hand most religionism is produced by preachers is performance based because they see the sheep skin as the end of their discipleship rather than the beginning.

Forcing them to look at the word SPEAK as the active verbe and the Text as the resource is likely to get you treated violently by violent men. Paul knew about tampering with silversmiths and men using little girls with the Pythian spirit.

And said unto them that sold doves, Take these things hence; make not my Fathers house an house of merchandise. Jn.2:16

Emporion (g1712) em-por'-ee-on; neut. from 1713; a mart ("emporium"): - merchandise.

Emporos (g1713) em'-por-os; from 1722 and the base of 4198; a (wholesale) tradesman: - merchant.

Emporos ê kapêlos: wholesale or retail dealer. This comparison often appears in Plato (cf. Soph. 223 d, 224 d, 231 d) and in later writers. On the terms, see Rep. ii. 371 d ê ou kapêlous kaloumen tous pros ônên te kai prasin diakonountas hidrumenous en agorai (those engaged in buying and selling, sitting in the market-place), tous de planêtas epi tas poleis emporous; Soph. 223 d, Polit. 289 e. Becker Charicles (Göll) ii. 183 ff. -

Hawking pôl-eô sell oneself across the counter, sold at a high price for exportation,
b. sell or farm out offices, priesthoods, etc., [tas archas] Arist.Ath.62.1; epi toisde pôloumen tên hierôsunên tou Dionusou SIG 1003.2 (Priene, ii B.C.).


I believe that it is a fact that the music issue came about in the rush to build a bigger plant and collect the most people. They got in over their head and say music as a way to save the infiltrators and property at the expense of the owners. The Purpose Driven church as used and maybe abused was that they could affort to loose half of the owners and make it up with new carpetbaggers.

My genetic code has the hand-eye urge to pick out cotton from among the thorny boll and dodge the stinging worms we called Saddle Backs.


    
This message has been edited by Ken.Sublett from IP address 67.142.130.49 on Jul 6, 2011 3:52 PM


 
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Ken Sublett
(Login Ken.Sublett)
ConcernedMembersMadison
173.245.48.89

Many are called FEW ARE CHOSEN: Follow multitute if you wish

July 4 2011, 7:22 PM 

There is no greater message from Jesus Christ than the massed multitude has always been addicted to the use of music to make the lambs dumb before the slaughter. If you listen to the Levites making exorcism in a church near you, the word anathema means that you have been set up and dedicated to be worshipped in your temple: you cannot be redeemed and must be burned.

[linked image]
[linked image]

Further proof is that the clear evidence can and will become invisible before your eyes.

 
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Dave
(no login)
173.245.56.179

Do the Dance

July 5 2011, 8:51 AM 

Keep dancing boys, but when the Word says that Jesus sung, it is good enough for me.
And YES, Ken, and Donnie, Ephesians 5:19 is a command to sing to one another (meaning vibration of the vocal cords). SPEAKING to one another is using the song to communicate through the heart. People can sing songs all day and not consider the meaning of the words or have them come through the Spirit. It is STILL a song that utilizes the vocal cords.

 
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Ken Sublett
(Login Ken.Sublett)
ConcernedMembersMadison
173.245.48.89

Righting 101

July 5 2011, 12:38 PM 

God is pretty smart: why is there no direct command:

When you come together you shall sing that which is written for your learning.

Or:

When you come together you may sing whatever you wish in whatever way you wish.

Paul speaks in parallelism to FOOL those with no right to know. The second part of a verse may be ANTITHETICAL to the first part: makes sense since SPEAKING and SINGING are defined as mutually exclusive.

Here is a reason why Paul told people to HOLD IT or keep silent that which NEGATES the first art:


[linked image]

ALL (as in ALL musical terms and names of instruments are rooted in destructive of a spiritual mind.

This may be wrong, but making a sound and smiting something is NOT conducive to SPEAKING that which is written for our learning with one mind and one mouth. Early people like Calvin could never stretch that beyond unison singing of the Bible text.

 
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Dr. Bill Crump
(no login)
173.245.56.77

Oh, Such Dancing

July 5 2011, 12:45 PM 

Dave wrote: "Keep dancing [sic] boys, but when the Word says that Jesus sung [sic], it is good enough for me."

That should be: "Keep dancing, boys, but when the Word says that Jesus SANG [past tense], it is good enough for me."

Since there is no mention of IM in Eph. 5:19, only singing should be good enough for Dave as well.

Dave also wrote: "And YES, Ken, [sic] and Donnie, Ephesians 5:19 is a command..."

That should be: "And YES, Ken and Donnie, Ephesians 5:19 is a command..." Only use a comma to separate three or more elements in a series, including the last two. If there are only two elements in the series connected by "and," drop the comma.

Here's an example of proper usage: "And YES, Ken, Donnie, Jimmy, and Dr. Crump, Ephesians 5:19 is a command..."
Reference: http://grammar.ccc.commnet.edu/grammar/commas.htm

Dave continues to dance around grammar. He also dances around Donnie's questions in other threads. happy.gif


 
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Dr. Bill Crump
(no login)
173.245.56.77

Re: They Sung [sic] a Hymn and Went Out

July 5 2011, 12:49 PM 

Try this: They SANG a Hymn and Went Out.

 
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Ken Sublett
(Login Ken.Sublett)
ConcernedMembersMadison
173.245.48.89

they HYMNED and went out

July 5 2011, 1:06 PM 

Hymn is like prayer: we SPEAK in the Gree and Latin.

If you want to do four-part-fanny with one of the few Biblical hymns as a FAMILY affair and the GO OUT and return again at the next appointed time of the year, I can buy that.

The other reasson paul is using antithetical parallelism since he does no want you to hoot like owls or enchant is that psallo is a SMITING with your finger and SHOOTING you in the heart and shootiing love arrows with your lyre. Means HOLD the vocal souns: hold the shooting out hurtful things!

[linked image]

Psallo is NEVER use to Play A Harp in any Greek literature: it just means SMITE with your fingers and NEVER with a plectrum. It only includes the DESTRUCTIVE influence: they shot out hymns and made the heart strings sing but MUSICAL MELODY has several words Paul could have used. By using ANTITHESIS he was pretty sure that you would not try to SPEAK and SING AT the same time.


 
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Dave
(no login)
173.245.56.179

You Go Bill!

July 5 2011, 5:49 PM 

William, I do understand. My message is true, so what else can you attack?
You go right ahead, but SHPULD you do it?

SHPULD you?

How could you miss that one if you use a spell check? I don't use one. Can't you tell William? So what is your excuse?



 
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Dr. Bill Crump
(no login)
74.179.247.75

Re: You Go Bill!

July 6 2011, 12:47 AM 

Dave, I'm a bit worried about you. Hmmmm... Since you keep typing "SHPULD," I wonder if, indeed, your craving for the dope has affected your vision. Maybe you SHOULD have your eyes checked; or better yet, lay off the dope. happy.gif

 
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Donnie
(Login Donnie.Cruz)
ConcernedMembersMadison
99.177.249.211

Reading 101

July 6 2011, 1:04 AM 

Dave wrote:

Do the Dance
July 5 2011, 8:51 AM

Keep dancing boys, but when the Word says that Jesus sung, it is good enough for me.
And YES, Ken, and Donnie, Ephesians 5:19 is a command to sing to one another (meaning vibration of the vocal cords)....

+++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++

Dave is confusing events and occurrences with commands and directives:

This is an EVENT: "[41] Now his parents went to Jerusalem every year at the feast of the passover." (Luke 2)

This is an EVENT: "[30] And when they had sung an hymn, they went out into the mount of Olives." (Matt. 26)

This is an EVENT: "[25] And at midnight Paul and Silas prayed, and sang praises unto God: and the prisoners heard them." (Acts 16)

This is an EVENT: "[3] And they sing the song of Moses the servant of God, and the song of the Lamb...." (Rev. 15)

This is a COMMAND: "[17] Pray without ceasing." (I Thess. 5)

This is a COMMAND: "[22] Abstain from all appearance of evil." (I Thess. 5:22)

This is a COMMAND: "[19] Repent ye therefore, and be converted, that your sins may be blotted out...." (Acts 3)

A VERY IMPORTANT NOTE FOR DAVE: There is not a single event or occurrence in the New Testament during which the NT Christians ever operated musical devices in the gathering of saints. There is NO COMMAND to play any kind of musical instrument when NT believers gather to "teach and admonish one another" and to "let the word of Christ dwell in you richly."

 
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R*
(no login)
98.81.113.140

Re: Reading 101

July 6 2011, 10:41 AM 

Donnie, where are we going with this? Are you saying we are commanded to sing only in our hearts?

 
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Dr. Bill Crump
(no login)
74.179.203.61

Re: Reading 101

July 6 2011, 12:55 PM 

I don't believe R* is obtuse, although he may feign obtuseness for comedic purposes. wink.gif As Ephesians 5:19 clearly states, we are to sing (obviously using our physical voices) and make melody in our hearts. No musical instruments are even mentioned. The true melody that accompanies our singing is to be made in our hearts. It's not that difficult to understand; however, those who deliberately choose to be obtuse will make it unnecessarily difficult.

 
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Dr.Bill Crump
(no login)
74.179.209.138

Re: You Go Bill!

July 6 2011, 8:46 AM 

Dave, I'm a bit worried about you, because you continue to write "SHPULD" over and over. As you may recall, that's perseveration. At first I naturally thought you didn't know how to spell, but I thought I'd give you the benefit of the doubt: perhaps you have an eye problem. Is your eyesight blurred or impaired in some way that you can't clearly see your keypad? Maybe you SHOULD have your eyes examined. wink.gifhappy.gifwink.gif

 
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R*
(no login)
98.81.113.140

Re: You Go Bill!

July 6 2011, 12:51 PM 

I'm glad Dr. Crump cares so much about our grammar mistakes! This "shpuld" make your day, Bill. wink.gif



[linked image]

 
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