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Royce Ogle Refutes Kenneth Sublett on Instruments

February 5 2012 at 3:12 AM
Donnie Cruz  (no login)
from IP address

Change Agent Jay Guin reported the following about two years ago:
Top 25 Progressive Church of Christ Blogs: Results for March 2010

Posted on April 12, 2010 by Jay Guin

Matt Dabbs and I have been hard at work the last couple of months compiling the data to publish an up-to-date and far more accurate listing of progressive Church of Christ blogs.

... It's enough to note here that the rankings are based on actual page views during March 2010. We can't think of a more accurate way to compare blogs.

The "Previous Rank" column is from Matt's January 2010 ranking based on Alexa and Google Reader subscribers. As you can see, the revised technique has made for some dramatic changes.

Rank .. Prev. Rank ... Author ...... Blog Name

1 ..... 17 .... Edward Fudge ....... GracEmail
2 ..... 1 ..... Al Maxey ........... Reflections
3 ..... 6 ..... Jay Guin ........... OneInJesus
4 ..... 5 ..... Matt Dabbs ......... Kingdom Living
5 ..... 7 ..... Trey Morgan ........ Trey
6 ..... 8 ..... Mike Cope .......... PreacherMike
7 ..... 9 ..... Christopher Heard .. Higgaion
8 ..... 12 .... John Mark Hicks .... John Mark Hicks Ministries
9 ............. Dell Kimberly ...... Who Told You That
10 ............ Matthew Morine ..... Musings on Spiritual Matters
11 .... 13 .... Tim Archer ......... The Kitchen of Half-Baked Thoughts
12 ............ Terry Rush ......... Morning Rush
13 .... 10 .... Patrick Mead ....... Tent Pegs
14 .... 20 .... Milton Stanley ..... Transforming Sermons
15 .... 16 .... John Dobbs ......... Out Here Hope Remains
16 ............ Wes Woodell ........ West Coast Witness
17 .... 4 ..... Jim Martin ......... God Hungry
18 .... 18 .... Larry James ........ Urban Daily
19 .... 15 .... Wade Hodges ........
20 .... 14 .... Tim Spivey .........
21 ............ Jerry Starling ..... Committed to Truth
22 ............ Keith Brenton ...... Blog in My Own Eye
22 .... 22 .... Brian Nicklaus ..... The Blog Prophet
23 ............ Steven Hovater ..... Steven Hovater's Blog
24 ............ Royce Ogle ......... Grace Digest
25 ............ Brett Harrison ..... aliens and strangers

So, do you recognize anyone of the bloggers as a change agent in the brotherhood? It appears that based on the title, the list should be church of Christ congregations. But since the list is not comprised of congregations, these individuals are likely church leaders, ministers and elders. "Progressive" does not represent increased membership in a local congregation. Rather, "progressive" connotes a departure from the Restoration Movement principles and modifying, changing and compromising God's simple truth in order to be more accommodating and appealing to culture, society, the religious community.

Liberal --------> Progressive ---------> Change (Community Church) Movement

This message has been edited by Donnie.Cruz from IP address on Mar 16, 2012 5:04 AM

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Ken Sublett
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This is called the Suck Up List

February 5 2012, 10:59 PM 

I have reviewed most of these and they are all part of a self-promoting utterly False teachers. Their views can be contradicted by any Bible reader so you have to conclude that they are enemies of the Word of God. It is clear that there is only a few Misthinkers and all of the people wanting fame and fortune would sell their mother to get on tha approved bloggers list.

Blasphemy in the Latin versions means that you say that God taught something when God did not and any Bible lover can refute them. You refute them with overwhelming evidence and they come back like ditto heads.

The conspiracy against Messiah would be to ALARM or TRIUMPH over Jesus: this is what is outlawed by Christ for the church of Christ in the wilderness. It means to "make vocal and instrumental rejoicing" when Christ calls us ONLY to Rest, Read and Rehearse the Word of God. Hebrews 41 prophesied a MARK in sight and sound to know when people are deliberately "making the lambs dumb before the slaughter" when the elders are commanded to "teach that which has been taught" or "that which is written for our learning."

I don't think that Judas knew that he was the Son of perdition until Jesus fed him the Sop (same root as Psallo): Satan came INTO judas and he knew that he was a failed agent of Satan. He did the only honorable thing, hung himself and twisted in the wind until he rotted and his guts spilled out.

Over and over SOOTHSAYING or SORCERY or WITHCHCRAFT is not an inherent power but one who stoops to use INSTRUMENTS to unzip or unwind the "stretched string" or wave motion of which we are made. MUSIC is the MARK of the Beast where Beast means "a New Style of music or drama."

Remember the band that vowed not to eat until they neutered Paul:

Acts 23:12 And when it was day, certain of the Jews banded together,
.....and bound themselves under a curse,
.....saying that they would neither eat nor drink till they had killed Paul.
Acts 23:13 And they were more than forty which had made this conspiracy.
Acts 23:14 And they came to the chief priests and elders, and said,
We have bound ourselves under a great curse, that we will eat nothing until we have slain Paul.
Acts 23:15 Now therefore ye with the council signify to the chief captain
..... that he bring him down unto you to morrow, though ye would inquire something more perfectly concerning him:
.....and we, or ever he come near, are ready to kill him.

My guess is that 40 constitutes about the number who have suddenly banded together as merry men to try to bring down the Church Christ where the widows giving kept the miserable mob from starving to death. Muggers and "pastors" always have to HATE people before they can use psychological violance to get honest working pelple who--in the words of Rubel Shelly joining with TBN built a "venue for Rock and Role." Or at Madison a "Theater for holy entertainment."

All of the list of bloggers with the exception of two or three I have refuted, are like the UNCONVERTED people at Corinth who could not read BLACK text on BROWN paper when they PREACHED the word by READING the Word (only)

I believe that, in the words of Jesus, they are MARKED as Sons of the Devil proven by the fact that "they speak on their own." I think that just as the musical idolatry at Mount Sinai made the people a Laughing Stock and sentenced them to Babylonianism without redemption and put under LAW or Ceremonial Legalism


The worship at Mount Sinai is called by Paul and others as the WORSHIP OF DEVILS. If you look at the definition of DEVILS or DEMONS you will find Satan ordained people doing what Jesus called HYPOCRITES self-preachers, singers and instrument players. The "brides" in Revelation performing as sorcerers point to the NYMPH(omanics) who performed the Heiro Gamos or Sacred Sex. When you have whiney boy and fat dirls PERFORMING in a religious sense we have Carol Wimber of Vineyard or Wineskins proving that they are engaging in sacred prostitution.

"In pagan traditions, musical instruments are invented by gods or demi-gods, such as titans. In the Bible, credit is assigned to antediluvian patriarchs, for example, the descendants of Cain in Genesis 4:21. There is no other biblical tradition about the invention of musical instruments." (Freedman, David Noel, Bible Review, Summer 1985, p. 51). (Proof Here).

"Women and girls from the different ranks of society were proud to enter the service of the gods as singers and musicians. The understanding of this service was universal: these singers constituted the 'harem of the gods'." (Quasten)

The literature says that the DEVILS actually participate in this Holy Sex which is about as PROGRESSIVE as the garden Eden where Christ says the devil was "a singing and harp playing prostitute."

All of this has the same effect on the mind-controlled progressives as telling a robber that stealing is not honest.


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Ken Sublett
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Apostate preachers 1 + 0 = whatever you need to prop up failure

February 8 2012, 11:03 PM 


1. Jacob warned people NOT to attend the assemblies of the tribe of Levi.
2. The Levites volunteered to execute 3000 of their brethren because of musical idolatry at Mount
3. Sinai.
4. God then commanded the Levites to "stand in ranks" to execute any godly Jew who came near or into any holy place: these had not been commanded but imposed by God.
5. Saul, the first king Prophesied with the Philistines as a mark that God had abandoned Israel to the human kings to destroy them.
6. Saul would prophesy with psaltery, and a tabret, and a pipe, and a harp, before them; and they shall prophesy:
7. To prophesy with musical instruments is

The Hithpa'el of nb', in the ancient texts, refers to ecstasy and delirium rather than to the emission of a 'prophecy'." (de Vaux, Roland, The Bible and the Ancient Near East, p. 243 Doubleday prphta and prphtes , ae, m., = prophts, I. a foreteller, soothsayer,

8. This would TURN Saul into another man which means in Latin to pervert:

vrus Of animal sperm or semen, A. A poisonous liquid, poison, venom, virus (syn. venenum).
B. An offensive odor, stench, futile virus linguae, Sil. 11, 560: mentis

mto , be forced to leave, be driven from, (b). To differ, be different: c. To change for the worse; pass., of wine, to spoil, turn, adulterated, Plin. 12, 25, 54, § 122. D. To forsake, abandon, leave: mutare, derelinquere,

D-rlinquo , lqui, lictum, 3, v. a. I. In the class. lang., to forsake wholly, to abandon, desert castra, Liv. 39, 50, 5;

Castro , I. To deprive of generative power (both of male and female), to emasculate, castrate, geld. Make effeminate
B. Trop., to enervate, debilitate: castrata res publica morte Africani, weakened (a vulgar figure, acc. to Cic. de Or. 3, 41, 164; Quint. 8, 6, 15)

9. David and the COMMANDERS OF THE ARMY dedicated the Levites to PROPHESY withthe same instruments. To dedicate means that they--Levites and modern imitators--have no inheritance.>d-dco , A. Relig. t. t., to dedicate, consecrate, set apart a thing to a deity or deified person: cannot be redeemed.

1Chronicles 9:33 And these are the singers, chief of the fathers of the Levites, [only]
who remaining in the chambers were free: for they were employed in that work day and night.
1Chronicles 9:34 These chief fathers of the Levites were chief throughout their generations;
these dwelt at Jerusalem.

God's abandonment of Saul to the Philistine form of "prophesying with instruments" was continued by David for the JACOB-CURSED Levites.

1Chronicles 25:1 Moreover David and the captains of the host separated...
to the service of the sons of Asaph, and of Heman, and of Jeduthun,
who should prophesy with harps, with psalteries, and with cymbals:
and the number of the workmen according to their service was:

Gal. 1:8 But though we, or an angel from heaven, preach any other gospel unto you than that which we have preached unto you, et him be accursed.

-Anathêma , /, (anatithmi) A. that which is set up: hence, like agalma sing, play, dance, orchestra, votive offering set up in a temple 3. of a slave in a temple, a. poles devoted to this service by the city, E.Ion310.Cf. anathema.

Anathema is anything so sacrificed or devoted to the Lord and could not be redeemed (Num. 18:14; Lev. 27:28, 29); and hence the idea of exterminating was connected with the word. The Hebrew verb (haram) is frequently used of the extermination of idolatrous nations.

Like modern preachers and "worship teams" (blasphemy claiming to be Jesus Christ) who USE the Jacob-Cursed and Anathemated Levites as their "patternism they are slaves of demon worship (abandoned to worship the starry host at Mount Sinai) and they just FLEECE the lambs as Jesus defined the Scribes and Pharisees as Hypocrites and as speakers, singers and instrument players by Christ in Ezekiel 33."

H622 âsaph aw-saf' A primitive root; to gather for any purpose; hence to receive, take away, that is, remove (destroy, leave behind, put up, restore, etc.):--assemble, bring, consume, destroy, fetch, gather (in, together, up again), X generally, get (him), lose, put all together, receive, recover [another from leprosy], (be) rereward, X surely, take (away, into, up), X utterly, withdraw.

10. ALL of the NACC DUPED deliberate sowers of Discord BOAST about the example of Saul being perverted in the sense that ALL priesthood have been perverted. I don't think they had ANY choice left: when you fiddle with God's Word He sends you STRONG DELUSIONS (always music induced) so that you perform LYING WONDERS which are musical services with the Levite Soothsaying Team standing in the place of Jesus Christ as the ONLY mediator between man and God.

11. In all Biblical instances those who tried to silence the Word of God were "cast alive into the Lake of Fire." In Revelation 18 the speakers, singers and instrument players are UNDER control of the Babylon Mother of harlots.

They serve as "lusted after FRUITS" and John calls them SORCERERS who HAD deceived the whole world. They, too, will be Cast Alive into the Lake of Fire.

12. ANY ONE who tells you that you can worship a Spirit God by stirring up the flesh violating all of the direct commands of God in Christis a liar and blasphemer.

13. No one can find any connection with music and the GODLY people God quarantined in the Church of Christ in the wilderness or remote inference that Christ ordained ONLY A school for DISCIPLES where any music is EVER used. They have no intention of "using one mind and one mouth to speak that which is written for our learning." They have no intention of letting Jesus Christ THE HOLY SPIRIT getting a word in edgewise. Isaiah 33 and 1 Corinthians 1 proves that there will be no PODIUMS or TAKING OF SHEKELS in the Church of Christ.

1 Corinthians 1:20 Where is the wise? (singer, player, actor)
where is the scribe? (writer of sermons and songs)
where is the disputer of this world?
hath not God made foolish [moronic] the wisdom of this world?

Scribe: Grammatikos a scholar 2. one who occupies himself with literary texts, grammarian, 3. concerned with textual criticism, exêgêsis similar to hermeneuma
D.S. 2.29 ; II. explanation, interpretation, Nomos experts in the laws or traditions.
often of the forms of melody used by the muses to work sorcery.

OUTLAWED: Tektonos 3. master in any art, as in gymnastics, Pi.N.5.49; of poets, tektones sophoi (sc. epeôn) Id.P.3.113; tektones eupalamôn humnôn Cratin.70 (ap.Ar.Eq.530); tektones kômôn, i.e. the choreutai [Choral dancer], Pi.N. 3.4; t. nôdunias, i.e. a physician, Id.P.3.6; dexias cheros ergon, dikaias tektonos a true workman, A.Ag.1406.

Sophis-tês , ou, ho, master of one's craft, adept, expert, of diviners, Hdt.2.49; of poets, meletan sophistais prosbalon Pi.I.5(4).28 , cf. Cratin.2; of musicians, sophistês . . parapaiôn chelun A.Fr.314 , cf. Eup.447, Pl.Com. 140; sophistêi Thrêiki (sc. Thamyris) E.Rh.924, cf. Ath.14.632c: with mod

II. from late v B.C., a Sophist, i.e. one who gave lessons in grammar, rhetoric, politics, mathematics, for money, such as Prodicus, Gorgias, Protagoras, a quibbler, c

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Ken Sublett
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Musical Idolatry: no redemption

February 11 2012, 9:53 PM 

Exod 32:6 And they rose up early on the morrow, and offered burnt offerings, and brought peace offerings;
and the people sat down to eat and to drink, and rose up to play

The golden calf represented Apis a real bull calf in Egypt. This represented the always-pagan trinitiyof Osiris, Isis and Horus.

PLAY at Mount Sinai is defined in most pagan religions which the Israelites imitated. The word is


[linked image]

Whe they made SAMSON GRIND or SPORT they sexually abused him

Judges 16:25 And it came to pass, when their hearts were merry, that they said, Call for Samson, that he may make us sport [h7832]. And they called for Samson out of the prison house; and he made them sport [h6711]: and they set him between the pillars

[linked image].

Genesis 39:15 And it came to pass, when he heard that I lifted up my voice and cried,
....that he left his garment with me, and fled, and got him out.
Genesis 39:16 And she laid up his garment by her, until his lord came home.
Genesis 39:17 And she spake unto him according to these words, saying,
....The Hebrew servant, which thou hast brought unto us,
....came in unto me to mock me: h6711.tsachaq

David went naked and PLAYED the harp and played with the camp followers: He confessed that he made himself VILE that hale or "praise word" people grasp without knowing what it is they are holding in their hands.

1Chronicles 13:8 And David and all Israel played [H7832] before God with all their might, and with singing, and with harps, and with psalteries, and with timbrels, and with cymbals, and with trumpets. Went Naked

THE LATIN: Exod 32:[6] surgentesque mane obtulerunt holocausta et hostias pacificas et sedit populus comedere ac bibere et surrexerunt ludere [Ludo is PLAY]

Surgo they rose up in insurrection AGAINST God.

Hêdonais 3. Pl., desires after pleasure, pleasant lusts, X.Mem.1.2.23, Ep.Tit.3.3,
Titus 3:3 For we ourselves also were sometimes foolish, disobedient, deceived, serving divers lusts and pleasures, living in malice and envy, hateful, and hating one another.

What ANY Disciple would know without exception.

[linked image]"The triumphal hymn of Moses had unquestionably a religious character about it; but the employment of music in religious services, though idolatrous, is more distinctly marked in the festivities which attended the erection of the golden calf." (Smith's Bible Dictionary, Music, p. 589).

[linked image]
Ephraim Syrus On Our Lord notes that Sinai was atest. The Israelites were consummate idolaters in Egypt. However, God gave them one more shot at the Abrahamic Covenant. By removing Moses as a visible "authority figure" He wanted to let them answer their own prayer:

18. But when their heathenism from being inward became open, then Moses also from being hidden openly appeared; that he might openly punish those whose heathenism had revelled beneath the holy cloud which had overshadowed them.

But God removed the Shepherd of the flock from it for forty days, that the flock might show that its trust was fixed upon the calf.

And he was there in the wilderness forty days tempted of Satan; and was with the wild beasts; and the angels ministered unto him. Mark 1:13

While God was feeding the flock with all delights, it chose for itself as its Shepherd the calf, which was not able even to eat. Moses who kept them in awe was removed from them, that the idolatry might cry aloud in their mouths, which the restraint of Moses had kept down in their hearts. For they cried: Make us gods, to go before us.

19. But when Moses came down, he saw their heathenism revelling in the wide plain with drums and cymbals. Speedily, he put their madness to shame by means of the Levites and drawn swords.

So likewise here, our Lord concealed His knowledge for a little when the sinful woman approached Him, that the Pharisee might form into shape his thought, as his fathers had shaped the pernicious calf.


If you fall for "musical idolatry" God will "set a king over you in his anger to take you captive without a way of excape."

Then and now, the ELDERS rejected God as their leader and SET A SENIOR PASTOR over them to prove they are not able to "teach that which has been taught."

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Re: Jay Guin and His "PROGRESSIVE" Church of Christ

February 16 2012, 4:49 PM 

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Ken Sublett
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Royce Ogle cannot read either

February 16 2012, 5:23 PM 

I chided Royce until he asked if he could post something--I didn't do that. Royce then picked the comment and then refuted it by accusing me of being senile.

When I have tried to post JUST BIBLE Royce black lists it.

Nothing fair: he is just another sore head who probably got put down by an elder and he rejects any authority.

Say again?

Royce repudiated as not caring much for the Biblical truth: Royce like most of the PROGRESSIVES believes that the Spirit OF Christ is another "people" who guides them the proof being "I gonna play my banjo anyhow."

Royce uses PATTERNISM as a RACA word and psychological violence to try to intimidate those who have NEVER used instruments and who will NOT use instruments and will NOT stop repudiating their "proof texs" gleaned from a topical bible.

He calls NOT playing instruments or approve them LEGALISM. However, like MOST of those selling their bodies he cannot define words to see that God condemns musical instruments when HE IS SPEAKING from Genesis to Revelation and associates singing and playing with the fruity cakes

Legalism is SPECIFICIALLY defined as "teaching the laws of Apollo (abaddon, Apollyon) following the "nomos" or legal patternism for teaching his laws. Besides a musical instrument is a maching for doing hard work. Orgenon is parallel to Ergo which means HARD WORK.

The GUILT CLAUSE: "I know that I deliberately sowed discord and violated the specific teaching of the Bible and church history BUT, you are the guilty party, sectarian, legalistic, hypocrite, patternism for REFUSING to feed my face." Why do they even hold mass workshops to spread that lie? Because, it works, silly.

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Brian Cade
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Re: Royce Ogle cannot read either

February 20 2012, 12:36 AM 

To point out the painfully obvious, it is his blog. He didn't have to let you post at all but did so out of graciousness. You abused his hospitality.

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Ken Sublett
(Login Ken.Sublett)

royce Ogle Refutes Kenneth Sublet on Instruments.

March 14 2012, 3:14 PM 

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(Login BrianCade)

Re: royce Ogle Refutes Kenneth Sublet on Instruments.

March 14 2012, 4:22 PM 

You realize it is against the law to repost copyrighted material without permission, correct?

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There are thousands of churches being taken over across America.

This book is only about one of those churches. It's about the Madison Church Of Christ. By studying the methods used here along with the resource references you might be able to inoculate your church. At the very least you will recognize the signs early on.

Many of the current members of the Madison Church of Christ still don't know what happened.
Some never will know! This book is for them as well.

Madison Church of Christ was a 60 year old church. At one time it was one of the largest churches in the US, and the largest Church of Christ.

It thrived for many years on the vision of it's elders and those of it's ministers. Those visions undoubtably came from the the inspired word of Jesus Christ.

At sometime in the last 10 years there was a deliberate plan by a majority of the elders to take the Madison Church of Christ into a more worldly realm.

They used secrecy, covert planning, and outside sources to scheme and to change the format and direction of the Madison Church of Christ.

The Elders knew that the membership would never approve such a plan. Using the tools of the "Community Church Movement"(consultants, books, seminars, meetings,planters,seeders) they slowly started initiating change so it was never noticed by the members until it was too late.....

At the heart of the plan was the fact that old members were going to be driven off so new techniques could be used to go out and reach the unchurched through new "Contemporary Holy Entertainment" methods developed by the "Community Church Movement"

Old members had to be kept on board long enough to get their plans ready, or the funds would not be there to pay for the new building. So by the plans very nature, it had to be secret.

The church had no plan in effect to renew or approve elders. There was never any need. The elders had always been "as approved by God". 10 of the last 15 elders would begin to shed some doubt on that.

The Elders did not even need a majority at first, because some of the elders went along unwittingly.

This edition starts shortly after some of the members begin to smell something strange in January 2001. Later editions may go back and fill in some of the timeline.

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Here is the list of players;

5 Godly Elders
10 Not so Godly Elders
120 "Deacons" (allegiance unknown)
2,800 - 4,000 church "members"
2 "teners" (people who have publicly confessed to have broken all ten commandments)
Unknown number of "sinners" (This is what the 10 elders call us.)
Unknown number of "demons" (Flying everywhere, to many to count)

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