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Who is AntiChrist?

September 2 2012 at 5:37 PM
Ken Sublett  (Login Ken.Sublett)
ConcernedMembersMadison
from IP address 166.248.82.138

[linked image]

 
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Ken Sublett
(Login Ken.Sublett)
ConcernedMembersMadison
166.248.82.138

The Earnest of the Spirit: Alexander Campbell

September 2 2012, 9:22 PM 

Scripture speaks of the FRUIT of the Spirit in contrast to the works of the Flesh. Paul had a conflict between HIS spirit and HIS flesh.

The Earnest of The Spirit: Alexander Campbell

http://www.piney.com/Alexander.Campbell.Earnest.Spirit.html

"This is...understood by every attentive reader. The original phrase is hagiasmos pneumatos, and is found only in II. Thess. ii. 13; I. Pet. i. 2. In both places it appears to refer to the sanctification of the spirit of believers. It is literally rendered "sanctification [or holiness] of spirit." There is no article in the original and no epithet that suggests the Holy Spirit in either passage.
God has chosen men to salvation through (or by) holiness of spirit;
.....not through the holiness of HIS Spirit,
.....but through the holiness of THEIR spirit.

When Jesus prayed (John xvii.) for the sanctification or holiness of his disciples,
.....it was through the truth: "Sanctify them through the truth;
.....thy word is truth."
The belief of the truth is, therefore, by Paul associated with this holiness or sanctification of spirit.

The Spirit of God is frequently denominated in these days, "the Sanctifier." Let it be granted that it is the Spirit that sanctifies or sets apart men to God, still it must be argued from the Record
.....that he sanctifies them only through the truth or gospel believed.
A sanctified unbeliever is inconceivable;
.....and, as "without holiness [or sanctification of spirit] no man can see the Lord;
.....so, without faith, there can be no holiness, and no action acceptable to God.

All persons sanctified to God to any high office or function, were anointed, and thus consecrated to his special service. So all Christians, being priests,
.....are anointed or sanctified by the Holy Spirit
.....[135] through the obedience of the truth,
.....and sprinkling of the blood of Jesus,
.....cleansing their consciences from dead works to serve the living God."

In this we find the secret of the most usual epithet of the Spirit. It is the Spirit of holiness, because it is the Spirit of truth. It is the Holy Spirit, because by its influence it makes us holy; and these influences which sanctify are always by and through the truth. When God chose men to salvation, it was through sanctification of spirit; and as a means to this, it was through the belief of the truth.

This is opposed to the work of the flesh, the offspring of that principle, which under the law works death. The phrase "fruit of the Spirit," in the connection in which it stands, is equivalent to the fruit of the gospel. The gospel obeyed works out "love, joy, peace, longsuffering, gentleness, goodness, fidelity, meekness, temperance: against such fruit there i s no law" (Gal. v.). Again, says Paul (Eph. v. 8). "Walk as children of light." (Now the fruit of this light [the Spirit] consists in all goodness, and righteousness, and truth.) "Be filled with the Spirit." "Let the word of Christ dwell richly in you," "singing psalms, hymns, and spiritual songs." Thus the phrases "Being filled with the Spirit," and "Having the word of Christ [gospel] dwelling richly in the heart," are explained by the same injunction to sing psalms, hymns and spiritual songs, with grateful hearts to the Lord. Compare Eph. v. 18, 19, and Col. iii. 16.

 
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Ken Sublett
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ConcernedMembersMadison
166.248.81.159

The Always-Pagan trinity at Mount Sinai under Apis the bull calf

September 3 2012, 12:32 PM 


Osiris, Isis and mature Horus

[linked image]

Isis mother of horus and Mary the mother of "god"

[linked image]

Since the "holy spirit" in the neo-Catholic trinity claims to lead you into the presence of God as measured by the "stimulation of pleasure centers" the holy spirit is really the MOTHER as prophesied in Revelation 17.

[linked image]

Here is THE trinity promoted at Lipscomb University: don't they all look like females?

John Mark Hicks LU: Iconic Trinitarianism

http://www.piney.com/John.Mark.Hicks.Our.Triune.God-The.Wonder.of.the.Story.html

[linked image]

Andrei Rublev painted the Holy Trinity around 1411. He was beatified by the Russian Orthodox Church as St. Andrei solely for the extraordinary intensity and majesty of this icon. The image embodies the essence of Trinitarian dogma.

The icon portrays the visit of the angels to Abraham in Genesis 18 but excludes Abraham and Sarah from the picture in order to focus on the dogmatic meaning of the Trinity. The three sit around a table with a chalice as the centerpiece.

The figure on the left--the Father--is arrayed in an indistinct gold (a transcendent tone),
the figure in the middle--the Son--in brown (an earthy tone),
and the figure on the right--the Holy Spirit--in green (the vibrancy of living earth).
Each one is also dressed in blue to represent their equality--THEY are divine.
The unity and diversity of the triune life is thus pictured in vivid colors.


    
This message has been edited by Ken.Sublett from IP address 166.248.81.159 on Sep 3, 2012 12:37 PM


 
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Racnor
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98.81.68.241

Re: The Always-Pagan trinity at Mount Sinai under Apis the bull calf

September 3 2012, 1:08 PM 



Ken, the words of Jesus.


[linked image]




Matthew 28:19


19 Therefore go and make disciples of all nations, baptizing them in the name of the Father and of the Son and of the Holy Spirit,

 
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Ken Sublett
(Login Ken.Sublett)
ConcernedMembersMadison
166.248.129.58

Re: The Always-Pagan trinity at Mount Sinai under Apis the bull calf

September 3 2012, 1:25 PM 

Excuse the image: my recliner is calling! Peter heard this and understood it as did all of the rest of the Bible writers and historic scholarship.

Acts 2:36 Therefore let all the house of Israel know assuredly, that God hath made that same Jesus, whom ye have crucified, both Lord and Christ.

Acts 2:38 Then Peter said unto them, Repent, and be baptized every one of you in the name of Jesus Christ for the remission of sins, and ye shall receive the gift of the Holy Ghost.

Acts 4:10 Be it known unto you all, and to all the people of Israel, that by the name of Jesus Christ of Nazareth, whom ye crucified, whom God raised from the dead, even by him doth this man stand here before you whole.
Acts 4:11 This is the stone which was set at nought of you builders, which is become the head of the corner.
Acts 4:12 Neither is there salvation in any other: for there is none other name under heaven given among men, whereby we must be saved.

[linked image]

 
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Donnie
(Login Donnie.Cruz)
ConcernedMembersMadison
99.177.249.211

Re: The Always-Pagan trinity at Mount Sinai under Apis the bull calf

September 3 2012, 4:41 PM 

Racnor,

Although there are three entities mentioned in Matt. 28:19, it does not prove the Trinity Doctrine, invented by the Roman Catholic Church (cf. Council of Nicea), besides the RCC belief in another Trinity -- comprised of:

(1) the Father,
(2) the Son and
(3) the "Mother of God" known as the "Virgin Mary."

Anyway, based on the illustration, the "CHRISTIAN FAMILY" [? = creative indeed]:


[linked image]

________________ 1. What is the name of the Father?
________________ 2. What is the name of His Son?
________________ 3. What is the NAME of the Spirit OF the Lord? [It is HOLY (undoubtedly an adjective that describes the Spirit OF God, remember?).]


 
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Racnor
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98.81.68.241

Re: The Always-Pagan trinity at Mount Sinai under Apis the bull calf

September 3 2012, 8:53 PM 

Donnie and Ken, I merely posted the words of Christ in a thread named "Who is AntiChrist?". I posted an Image of the Godhead. I said nothing about the mother of God. Why is everyone so upset? Do you not believe in the Godhead? Is Father, Son, and Holy Spirit not in the Bible?

 
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B
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74.240.239.108

Re: The Always-Pagan trinity at Mount Sinai under Apis the bull calf

September 3 2012, 9:15 PM 

Does Racnor believe that "Father, Son, and Holy Spirit" signify three completely separate, independently divine entities, or are they three designations or synonyms for only ONE divine entity?

 
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Ken Sublett
(Login Ken.Sublett)
ConcernedMembersMadison
166.248.85.67

Re: The Always-Pagan trinity at Mount Sinai under Apis the bull calf

September 3 2012, 9:32 PM 

To be consistent, those early pre-trinitarians who thought that father, son and spirit were names, baptized THREE TIMES.

I baptize you in the NAME of the father
I baptize you in the NAME of the spirit
I baptize you in the NAME of the son

Jesus said that HE has all of the authority of Father, Son and Spirit because God gave that to Him. He poured out His heart in John to make certain that it would be impossible for anyone to think that the Son was another "center of consciousness" who had certain talents for HIS dispensation.

With three strokes in "sprinkling" the Catholics do a 666 act

 
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Ken Sublett
(Login Ken.Sublett)
ConcernedMembersMadison
166.248.85.67

Re: The Always-Pagan trinity at Mount Sinai under Apis the bull calf

September 3 2012, 9:26 PM 

Father, Spirit and son or
Father Mother and mostly infantile little son is in ALL pagan triads.

God speaking through Jesus of Nazareth taught the ANTITHESIS of all pagan triads. A scholar from Lipscomb University wrote a book saying that BECAUSE all pagans believed that god was a family it was important that Christianity have its OWN trinity. Wrong.

Father, Son and Spirit are NEVER names of persons or people.

John 14:9 Jesus saith unto him, Have I been so long time with you, and yet hast thou not known me, Philip? he that hath seen me hath seen the Father; and how sayest thou then, Shew us the Father?

How many doctorates or certificates do you need to miss that clear statement?

John 14:10 Believest thou not that I am in the Father,
and the Father IN me?
the words that I speak unto you I speak not of myself:
but the Father that dwelleth IN me, he doeth the works.

John 14:11 Believe me that I am in the Father, and the Father in me:
or else believe me for the very works sake.

John 14:17 Even the Spirit OF truth;
whom the world cannot receive,
because it seeth him not, neither knoweth him:
but ye know him; for he dwelleth with you
and shall be in you.


This is a SHOUTING PROOF that the always pagan "families of gods" is repudiated and proves that what the doubter who wanted to SEE the father believed that Jesus was going to show him another "person." Jesus was the IMAGE of the ONE GOD who has NOT other persons required to have OTHER talents (JWHicks).

Father and Son would be IN or Abide with believers because Jesus said MY WORDS are Spirit

Jesus was MADE TO BE both Lord and Christ: He was a son (as we are) but Jesus was the Spirit OF truth.

John 14:18 I will not leave you comfortless: I will come to you.

Jesus would return with the promise or COMMISSION to be the living Spirit of the Church of which He is head.

John 14:19 Yet a little while, and the world seeth me no more;
but ye see me: because I live, ye shall live also.
John 14:20 At that day ye shall know that I am in my Father,
and ye in me, and I in you


Therefore, the ALWAYS pagan trinity of father, spirit (mother) and son were MADE KNOWN in the God "image" of JUST ONE PERSON. This should prove that God the Father in heaven who made Jesus to be both Lord and Christ and to REPUDIATE the actual three PERSONS of the "god" families does not remotely teach a TRINITY OF CENTERS OF CONSCIOUSNESS (JMHICKS ETAL).

Christians can never do anything but create hostility and warfare with both Jews and Muslims who are NOT Polytheists.

Don't let it worry you if you cannot grasp it.


 
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Donnie
(Login Donnie.Cruz)
ConcernedMembersMadison
99.177.249.211

Re: The Always-Pagan trinity at Mount Sinai under Apis the bull calf

September 3 2012, 10:26 PM 

Ken,

Let's be patient with those who cannot seem to grasp that throughout John's narrative in his book (esp. chapters 14-16) concerning the relationship between the Father and His Son Jesus Christ, the communication is between them:

-- I am in the Father; the Father is in me.
-- I go unto the Father: for my Father is greater than I.
-- I am the true vine, and my Father is the husbandman.
-- Ye believe in God, believe also in me.
-- etc., etc.


Uh-oh, a "third person" is not in the communication process.

What the Trinitarians consider as the third person in the Trinity Doctrine (source: the Nicene Creed, the Roman Catholic Church and the papacy) is evidently ABSENT in the relationship and communication. Why is that?

Let's be patient with them who cannot grasp that by definition, the word "spirit" is a common noun, not a proper noun. Throughout biblical history, the word "spirit" has been defined as "wind, power, life, breath or mind." It is not a proper name as in "Jehovah" or "Jesus the Christ." But, yes, the Spirit OF the Lord is "holy." The word "holy" is an adjective that modifies the common noun "spirit." When the Spirit OF Christ is identified as being "holy," the holy Spirit of the Lord is still NOT a proper name as in "Jehovah" or "Jesus Christ."

"In the NAME (singular) of the Father, the Son and the Holy Spirit [OF the Lord]" does NOT make the Spirit of God being holy, pure and sinless [more adjectives] into another person that the Trinitarians honestly and sincerely but falsely and erroneously claim.

Can someone, please, consult with any of the famous Trinitarians to explain to you or us the following passage in Job 27:3?


"All the while my breath is in me,
and the spirit of God is in my nostrils"


Enough lessons on the parts of speech (noun, pronoun, adjective, etc.) for now.

 
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Ken Sublett
(Login Ken.Sublett)
ConcernedMembersMadison
166.248.85.67

Re: The Always-Pagan trinity at Mount Sinai under Apis the bull calf

September 3 2012, 10:42 PM 

The folly of it all is that scholars and preachers always feel the need to take bits and pieces of Scripture and then fabricate a sermon which they believe and have been taught can have power punched into it by making sermons.

Can it really be true that all of the polytheists have almost never been able to read the very simple teachings of Jesus in John: I betcha that right now preachers and scholars are writing Class Books filled with so much of themselves that Jesus is not allowed to speak.

The elders as vocational pastor-teachers assigned by Christ in Spirit (Ephesians 4) are commanded to teach that which has been taught.

Titus 1:7 For a bishop must be blameless, as the steward of God; not selfwilled, not soon angry, not given to wine, no striker, not given to filthy lucre;
Titus 1:8 But a lover of hospitality, a lover of good men, sober, just, holy, temperate;
Titus 1:9 Holding fast the faithful word as he hath been taught, that he may be able by sound doctrine
both to exhort and to convince the gainsayers.
Titus 1:10 For there are many unruly and vain talkers and deceivers, specially they of the circumcision:
Titus 1:11 Whose mouths must be stopped, who subvert whole houses, teaching things which they ought not, for filthy lucres sake.
Titus 1:12 One of themselves, even a prophet of their own, said, The Cretians are alway liars, evil beasts, slow bellies.
Titus 1:13 This witness is true. Wherefore rebuke them sharply, that they may be sound in the faith;
Titus 1:14 Not giving heed to Jewish fables,
.....and commandments of men,
.....that turn from the truth.
Titus 1:15 Unto the pure all things are pure: but unto them that are defiled and unbelieving is nothing pure; but even their mind and conscience is defiled.
Titus 1:16 They profess that they know God; but in works they deny him, being abominable, and disobedient, and unto every good work reprobate.



 
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Donnie
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ConcernedMembersMadison
99.177.249.211

Re: The Always-Pagan trinity at Mount Sinai under Apis the bull calf

September 3 2012, 10:39 PM 

Racnor,

Believe me: being upset is farthest from my mind.

We're only attempting to simplify matters and make parallel statements to clarify. In my case, you illustrated the Trinity Doctrine. This dogma was initiated by the Roman Catholic Church and the papacy [and unfortunately acquired and inherited by many Protestant Churches].

The parallel is that another doctrine from the same source or inventor of human dogmas, the R.C.C., is this form of Trinity: Father, Mother [the "Perpetual Virgin," though], and Her Son Jesus.

You do an excellent job of illustrating. Can you search online and find us an image that reflects the other Trinity?

I'm serious about this.

Thanks!

Donnie

 
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Scripture
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98.87.120.112

Development of Creeds

September 4 2012, 3:17 AM 

Trinitarianism was not fully developed even at the end of the 2nd century AD (100-199 AD), when Irenaeus an early theologian emphasized the monotheistic nature of Christianity, that is, "one God", and that is the Father. But Irenaeus goes on to say "the Father is God, and the Son is God, for whatever is begotten of God is God" (c. 180, Adversus Haereses (Against Heresies), Irenaeus, 47) Although he implies that the Spirit is divine in his eyes, he sees the three not as three equal persons, but as a single person. The Father Who is the Godhead Itself, with His mind, or rationality, and His wisdom. With this monotheism, Irenaeus obscures the position of the Son and the Spirit as "Persons", to use modern terminology.

2nd century theologians represent the three not as coequal persons as did the Nicene Creed of 325 AD but as a single person, "the Father Who is the Godhead Itself, with His mind, or rationality, and His wisdom" (p. 108, Early Christian Doctrines, 1978, JND Kelly). These thinkers were anxious to offer Christianity as monotheism (one God), obscuring the position of the Son and the Spirit as "persons."

The theories of "Popes" Zephyrinus (198-217) and Callistus (217-222) thought that the theories of Hippolytus and Tertullian led to ditheism (I'm not sure if restorationism recognizes them as popes). Others regarded the Son and the Spirit as expansions or projections of the One God the Father.

I could go on and on, but trinitarianism was not full-blown until the Nicene Creed in 325 AD. This brings us to the application of Restorationism. For those wishing to restore primitive Christianity, therefore, the term trinity is generally "invisible", that is never mentioned.

Scriptures Alone suggest that we should speak where the Bible speaks, and remain silent where the Bible is silent. That our people are not aware of these issues today shows the great dearth existing in the pulpit today, with too much emphases on programs and "smooth" Christianity. Polished Christianity can create a bulging crowd, as long as the membership was taught rightly in the past, but with just a few decades of smooth preaching, all doctrinal foundations are erased and the church is just left with the remnants called "ritual." "Ritual" then itself fails when the membership begins to call in question all the basics. Then it is too late. Smooth preaching began in mid-20th century and has continued until the present.

 
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Ken Sublett
(Login Ken.Sublett)
ConcernedMembersMadison
166.248.83.202

Re: Development of Creeds

September 4 2012, 7:44 PM 

2nd century theologians represent the three not as coequal persons as did the Nicene Creed of 325 AD but as a single person, "the Father Who is the Godhead Itself, with His mind, or rationality, and His wisdom" (p. 108, Early Christian Doctrines, 1978, JND Kelly). These thinkers were anxious to offer Christianity as monotheism (one God), obscuring the position of the Son and the Spirit as "persons."

Well done. They would say that God always has His Word and Wisdom with Him: the Son of God is His Word. I believe that is what the Campbells believed. Alexander was harsh against Calvin for his use of "person" but someone forced Calvin to use "the three aspects of God."

Personae was not a "people" in the modern trinitarian view. If God SENDS FORTH His Word then the Sender and Sent are different and I think that is where the neo-trinitarians run off the track.

 
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Anonymous
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130.127.42.38

Re: Who is AntiChrist?

September 4 2012, 8:56 AM 

Scripture,
You said "Scriptures Alone suggest that we should speak where the Bible speaks, and remain silent where the Bible is silent."

Can you present those Scriptures that support that?

Thank you!

 
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Scripture
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74.179.44.20

Remain Silent

September 4 2012, 11:21 AM 

This is an attempt to focus more on the written word than on our traditions and hand-downs. You may be reacting to those who would like to "beat you over the head" but this is not the intention. The exact wording I believe may come from the 19th century, from the Stone-Campbell movement.

In particular, reference to the "trinity" is an example of using a term, that, although some may see warrant for using it, it is better to use Biblical terms for these matters. If one likes to be under creeds and religious authoritarianism, then he or she can just adopt the creeds of man.

Revelation 22:18-19 gives a warning that is intended to protect the written word from additions and from subtractions. 2 Tim. 3:16-17 refers to the written word being complete--although this was apparently written before our New Testament was collected as a "canon." 2 Pet. 1:21 refers to writers of scripture were moved by God, and not by their own will or desires.

Additionally, creeds can be viewed as speaking where the Bible may not speak (adding to), and not giving all information that the Bible gives (subtracting from).

I know that this is a tall charge to know when to speak and not to speak. Scriptures Alone is in keeping with the Reformation and Restoration movements. I'm not saying that this can ever be completely accomplished.

 
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Scripture
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74.179.44.20

Scriptures Alone

September 4 2012, 11:42 AM 

Also, this is the first great rock on which the Protestant Reformation is founded.

1. "SCRIPTURES ALONE" or "Sola Scriptura".

The alternative was Church Tradition, the creeds, the councils, the encylicals, and the hierarchy of authority that divested every individual Christian from his or her right to read, understand, and apply the Word of God according to their ability and understanding.

Other rocks were 2. Christ, 3. Grace, 4. Faith, and 5. Glory to God.

This is not to enthrone these five or make them a creed!

 
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Ken Sublett
(Login Ken.Sublett)
ConcernedMembersMadison
166.248.83.202

Re: Scriptures Alone

September 4 2012, 7:36 PM 

Early scholars used the term Apostolic Church: that demanded that faith and practice be based on the writings of the Apostles recognizing that no one after them had the authority to make changes.

I would challenge them to find a scholar who did not make Scripture the only rule of faith and practice even when they misunderstood them.

Only our latter day "progressives" mock the idea that God has the right to command, example or even infer for one seeking to know the truth rather than trying to make up a new institution. They collect bits and pieces and make up their OWN.

 
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Ken Sublett
(Login Ken.Sublett)
ConcernedMembersMadison
166.248.79.192

Re: Who is AntiChrist?

September 4 2012, 11:11 AM 

We all butt in around here. That is the UNIVERSAL claim of those who WILL NOT speak where the Bible Speaks but insist that you listen to them fill in the blanks. Isaiah 8 which was breathed on or inspired by the Spirit of Christ and taught by most historical scholarship. Remember that the Monarchy as the progressives PATTERNISM was "A covenant with DEATH and with HELL." God had "turned them over to worship the starry host" at Mount Sinai because they REJOICED (that music thing) in the works of their own hands. All religious performance music was defined by words like enchantment, soothsaying (the Levites), Sorcery or witchcraft. The command in the singing passages is to TEACH and ADMONISH without enhancment by humans.

[linked image]

 
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There are thousands of churches being taken over across America.

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