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Jason Shepherd false Shepherd at Madison Part A

October 20 2013 at 3:00 PM
Ken Sublett  (Login Ken.Sublett)
ConcernedMembersMadison
from IP address 184.63.107.21

Jason Shepherds CREED--since he is the FRONT MAN--carrying out the CONTRACT will be examined here.

http://www.piney.com/Jason.Shepherd.Madison.Church.of.html

Since they volunteered to fall into Strong Delusions each of their CREED ARTICLES must be a deliberate ANTI-Christian path because no Disciple of Christ could ever make such terminal confessions.

Whatever evil lurks at the bottom of the snake pit, Jason Shepherd has been the false leaders preparing the youth and is the FRONT for elders turned WOLVES craunching the bones of the flock they have invaded.

The Fullness of the GODHEAD does not mean that God has three HEADS or in the words of LU and John Mark Hicks, three centers of consciousness. Having God (Theos) or Jesus Lord (Kurios) dwell IN use is conditioned on our being filled with divine influence marked by Keeping the WORDS Jesus spoke from GOD. In the same sense WE dwell in Father-Son to the extent we keep God's commandments (John 14).

The PAGAN Godhead had many family members and the MEANING and mark is that they will be filled with Enthus-O-Mania or having the "gods" take control of their body while they sing or do anything but examine yourself during the Lord's Supper.

[linked image]


    
This message has been edited by Ken.Sublett from IP address 184.63.107.21 on Oct 20, 2013 3:05 PM


 
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Ken Sublett
(Login Ken.Sublett)
ConcernedMembersMadison
184.63.107.21

Jason Shepherd The trinitarian GODHEAD part B

October 21 2013, 12:35 PM 

When you go "Word Mining" it is easy to loose the point. The point is that Jason Shepherd. Even if you have all of the Phds from a LU or ACU you are conditioned not to go beyond proof texts and never tracing out how words were used by Paul and others.

The word for GODHEAD was the PAGAN THESIS of trinities or families of God specificially identified by the ENTHUSIASM of their religious worshipers.

As ANTITHESIS, Jesus is NOT the pagan godheadS nor is He said to be God other than God's speaker or LOGOS. The fullness or Divine Nature instead dwells in Jesus and in all believers who are baptized to receive A new, holy spirit. One filled with the nature of God does not, cannot ever never think of God as an object to be appeased or controlled by Rhetoric and Music which was always known to be Satan's CONTROL lifeless instruments or carnal weapons. The FEELING they plan to induce and lie about is that of Apollyon the leader of the Muses. The arousal SILENCES the spiritual or mental nature and therefore music was always called soothsaying or sorcery because it "made the lambs dumb and dumber before the coming slaughter."

[linked image]

 
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Dave
(no login)
130.127.42.38

Here You Go!

November 5 2013, 1:11 PM 


 
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Donnie Cruz
(Login Donnie.Cruz)
ConcernedMembersMadison
99.177.250.192

Re: Here You Go!

November 5 2013, 11:58 PM 

Thanks, Dave.

That's been the missing page for quite some time now. (I'm wondering if many of the members have lost track of the number and the names.)

Just a bit of history: There were 15; 5 resigned/left during the upheaval; and there have been replacements/additions approved/appointed by fellow elders. Currently the count is 11 (as shown on the page). Should there be a reduction in the number of elders that's proportionate to the current membership count?

1. Will someone be able to identify who is/might be the acting "chief shepherd"?

2. It would be an interesting survey if members of the church (among various age groups of young, old, etc.; "worship style" preference--traditional or contemporary; etc.) were asked about the church office preference: (a) "elders" vs. (b) "shepherds." [Is this the trend: a shift from "those 'mean' and strict elders" to these "kinder and gentler shepherds"?]

3. Who is more popular these days [i.e., being able to know or identify the person or name] between: (1) "the Worship Leader" and (2) any of "the shepherds"?

4. Since the "worship experience" rather than real Bible study is the emphasis when the "saints assemble" ... and since we hardly see the "shepherds" on stage, including someone leading the shepherds' "prayer," WHO is the real and active "church" leader or leadership? Would it be: (a) the highly-salaried "Worship Leader"? Would it be: (b) the "Pastor" [church of Christ "minister"]? Would it be: (c) "the Shepherds"?

5. Notice the "name" of the church on that web page. How much longer will it be before the name "of Christ" is going to be removed or dropped?

 
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Dave
(no login)
130.127.42.38

It is What It is

November 6 2013, 10:56 AM 

Your response (and many more such as this last one), Donnie, is the reason why I have decided to forgo any further discussion and/or responses here at concernedmembers. I haven't lost hope in you, for I know that God can do anything and everything, but further discussion with you and the CM staff here is futile. There is your interpretation and then there is hell for anyone else that offers interpretations that differ from yours.

Just trying to see how you would deal with me supplying those elders' names.

Luke 16
29 Abraham replied, They have Moses and the Prophets; let them listen to them.

30 No, father Abraham, he said, but if someone from the dead goes to them, they will repent.

31 He said to him, If they do not listen to Moses and the Prophets, they will not be convinced even if someone rises from the dead.

 
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Bill
(no login)
74.179.243.235

Re: It is What It is

November 6 2013, 12:59 PM 

Dave wrote of Donnie: "There is your interpretation and then there is hell for anyone else that offers interpretations that differ from yours."

Since Donnie and Ken have labeled people with different interpretations as "blasphemers" and "antichrists," they have as much as consigned those people to hell. The following list contains examples of interpretations that Donnie and Ken reject; thus, according to Donnie's and Ken's implications, people who embrace such interpretations are worthy of hell:

1. Jesus is eternal and was with God in the beginning.

2. Jesus is identical to the Logos/Word in the beginning.

3. The Holy Spirit is not only a separate being but is also the spirit of God.

4. "Trinity" means the Godhead consists of three separate "persons" of Father, Son, and Holy Spirit.

5. Jesus is God.

6. The Holy Spirit is God.


 
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Donnie Cruz
(Login Donnie.Cruz)
ConcernedMembersMadison
99.177.250.192

Re: It is What It is

November 7 2013, 1:09 AM 

Assumption 1: Jesus is eternal and was with God in the beginning.

Scripture responds: "The Word" (LOGOS) was in the beginning with God; the same Word (LOGOS) was God [the original text renders: "And God was the Word"]. John 1:1.

Assumption 2: Jesus is identical to the Logos/Word in the beginning.

Scripture responds: The Word/LOGOS was in the beginning with God; the Word/LOGOS was made flesh (became Jesus, the Son of God; made both Lord and Christ by God). John 1:1,14.

Assumption 3: The Holy Spirit is not only a separate being but is also the spirit of God.

Scripture responds: There is only one Spirit (I Cor. 12:13; Eph. 2:18; 4:4). The spirit OF God the Father or the spirit of the Lord Jesus Christ is "the Holy Spirit" and is NOT APART nor SEPARATED from God -- but the bishops of the Roman Church, the Roman Emperor and paganism invented the Trinity and designated "the Holy Spirit" as the Third Person God. [Worse than that is that Bill believes there are two (2) Spirits.]

Assumption 4: "Trinity" means the Godhead consists of three separate "persons" of Father, Son, and Holy Spirit.

Scripture responds: Oops, so sorry, the Scripture does not support the man-invented, pagan-based Trinity doctrine of Person No. 1 God, Person No. 2 God, Person No. 3 God.

Assumption 5: Jesus is God.

Scripture responds: "God was manifest in the flesh" [in the person of Jesus Christ] (I Tim. 3:16); the Word/LOGOS in the beginning was made flesh (became Jesus) two millennia ago. Of course, Jesus said it himself: "All power is given unto me in heaven and in earth" (Matt. 28:18).

6. The Holy Spirit is God.

Scripture responds: Scripture avers: "And grieve not the holy Spirit OF God" (Ephesians 4:30). Bill does not understand the preposition "OF" and incorrectly grammatically substitutes "IS" for "OF."

Bill does not recognize the colossal difference (even grammatically) that:

(a) "the holy Spirit OF God"
----------- is not the same as -------------
(b) "the holy Spirit IS God."

 
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Bill
(no login)
74.179.15.196

Re: It is What It is

November 7 2013, 4:28 AM 

Donnie, thank you for recycling...again...your arguments that you've posted many times in other threads. The six "assumptions" as you call them are interpretations of Scripture that differ from yours. Given the fact that the Scriptures do not explicitly condemn those differing interpretations, then Dave's recent assertion--that you believe hell awaits those with different interpretations from yours--is quite ironic. Since you did not deny Dave's assertion, then it must be true. In other words, you believe that anyone who has a different interpretation is bound for hell, despite the fact that no such condemnation exists in Scripture. Your mindset is quite appalling, to say the least.


 
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Donnie Cruz
(Login Donnie.Cruz)
ConcernedMembersMadison
99.177.250.192

Letting the Scripture Speak

November 7 2013, 10:27 PM 

(1) Bill, thank you for allowing me to respond to YOUR RECYCLED assertions. Yes, they were numbered assumptions because you failed to provide a single scripture for each assumption.

(2) No rebuttal from you? I know. We know. It is difficult to rebut the Scripture with man's best conceptualization.

(3) Dave's assertion about "hell"? A scripturally competent Christian should have nothing to worry about it. If one is worried, that may be a good trigger for him to search the scriptures daily (Acts 17:10-13 and those in Berea).

(4) My assertions are Scripture-based. And you say -- that "mindset is quite appalling." I think I like that comment. happy.gif

 
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Bill
(no login)
74.179.244.54

Re: Letting the Scripture Speak

November 7 2013, 11:21 PM 

Don't be obtuse, Donnie. Most people believe that their interpretations of Scripture are correct, even when they really are not. But Donnie, being overly confident of his own interpretations, believes that people are bound for hell if their interpretations differ from his or Ken's. Donnie and Ken believe they have a monopoly on Scriptural interpretations. THAT kind of mindset is appalling.

 
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Donnie Cruz
(Login Donnie.Cruz)
ConcernedMembersMadison
99.177.250.192

Re: Letting the Scripture Speak

November 8 2013, 12:44 AM 

"Bound for hell...."? You did not/would not hear me say that.

 
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Bill
(no login)
74.179.12.182

Re: Letting the Scripture Speak

November 8 2013, 2:10 AM 

Donnie, you very well know that you don't have to say, "S/he is bound for hell" or "S/he is going to hell" to consign people to hell. Let's put it this way: You believe that people who interpret the Scriptures differently from you will not fare well at the Final Judgment. Cutting to the chase, you believe that such people will be damned. Is that not true? You and Ken have collectively denounced people with different interpretations as "blasphemers" and "antichrists"; hence, you have as much as consigned them to hell. You have assumed a role that God reserves only for Himself.

On the other hand, Donnie, should you choose to back-pedal and say, "I don't believe different Scriptural interpretations will automatically land people in hell," then something you said prompted Dave to write the following about you: ""There is your interpretation and then there is hell for anyone else that offers interpretations that differ from yours."

I submit that Dave got that idea from reading your and Ken's collective denunciations of people with different interpretations as "blasphemers" and "antichrists."

 
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Anonymous
(Login Ken.Sublett)
ConcernedMembersMadison
184.63.107.21

Re: Letting the Scripture Speak

November 8 2013, 8:22 PM 

1John 2:18 Little children, it is the last time: and as ye have heard that antichrist shall come, even now are there many antichrists; whereby we know that it is the last time.

To deny that Jesus of Nazareth was a MAN of flesh and became son, Lord, Christ etal BECAUSE God Made Him to Be so is the definition of Antichrist. If you say that He was HE WAS GOD because the WORD is GOD then you insist that Jesus WAS AND IS the ONE GOD who came in the flesh then John defines you as an antichrist.

1John 2:22 Who is a liar but he
.....that denieth that Jesus is the Christ? He is antichrist,
.....that denieth the Father and the Son.
1John 2:23 Whosoever denieth the Son, the same hath not the Father: (but)
.....he that acknowledgeth the Son hath the Father also.

Jesus in John 14 acknowledges only A GOD the Father and A SON the Man Jesus of Nazareth. John has acknowledged only the two actors: One is the ONE God and His Agent ONE MAN Jesus of Nazareth. If you say that Jesus was a God person who returned to His God status you cannot read John 6 which ASKS "what if you se the SON OF MAN return from whether the SON OF MAN originated then you refuse to read the text.

1John 4:3 And every spirit that confesseth not that Jesus Christ is come in the flesh is not of God: and this is that spirit of antichrist, whereof ye have heard that it should come; and even now already is it in the world.
2John 7 For many deceivers are entered into the world, who confess not that Jesus Christ is come in the flesh. This is a deceiver and an antichrist.

Long after Jesus was translated into the Spiritual realm, Paul said;

1Timothy 2:5 For there is ONE God,
and one mediator between God and men,
the MAN Christ Jesus;

Trying to make Jesus born of a woman already existing as a Divine person has no other sensical motive other than to defend the trinity. If you deny that their is ONE GOD you are ANTICHRIST because Jesus acknowledged that there is ONE GOD then you tell Jesus that He is a liar and that is AGAINST Jesus Christ.

I HAVE NO IDEA HOW MANY BEINGS THERE ARE IN THOSE OTHER DIMENSIONS. However, if you say that Jesus WAS-IS Word then you refute the claim of Jesus and John. If you put words into the mouth of God then it is reasonable that you put words into the mouth of those who quote scripture.

Again it was the SON OF MAN Who returned to somewhere and not THE ETERNAL SON OF GOD.

 
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Bill
(no login)
74.179.203.59

Re: Letting the Scripture Speak

November 8 2013, 9:49 PM 

Let's not split hairs. Jesus the living Logos is the eternal Son of God--in heaven before He was born, on earth as a man, and back in heaven after His ascension. Jesus has always been the living Logos, the Son of God. On earth, Jesus identified Himself as the "son of man." He was both divine (Son of God) and human (son of man). Therefore, when Jesus the son of man ascended back into heaven, He ascended as the Son of God. Jesus as the son of man and Jesus as the Son of God are identical, not two separate beings.

If you do not accept what is written in the paragraph above, that is your prerogative, based on your free will. It is your prerogative simply to say, "I do not agree." However, it is NOT your prerogative to consign others to hell as "blasphemers" and "antichrists" because their beliefs clash with yours. DO NOT be foolish. DO NOT assume the role of God.

 
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Donnie Cruz
(Login Donnie.Cruz)
ConcernedMembersMadison
99.177.250.192

Here's How and When We Let the Scripture Speak

November 8 2013, 11:26 PM 

Bill,

You may have just lost your ... ... ... scholarship. You are now guessing. But that's your problem.

It's good that I have already compiled the following and posted it all in another thread. It's easy to provide scripture references to help....

Bill, the REAL "Son of God" is expressed in the New Testament almost 50 times in the following manner:
  • "that thou tell us whether thou be the Christ, the Son of God" (Matt. 26:23)
  • "with thee, Jesus, thou Son of God" (Matt. 8:29)
  • "Of a truth thou art the Son of God" (Matt. 14:33)
  • "the Christ, the Son of God" (Matt. 26:63)
  • "if thou be the Son of God" (Matt. 27:40)
  • "I am the Son of God" (Matt. 27:40; John 10:36)
  • "truly this was the Son of God" (Matt. 27:54)
  • "the gospel of Jesus Christ, the Son of God" (Mark 1:1)
  • "Thou art the Son of God" (Mark 3:11; John 1:49)
  • "truly this man was the Son of God" (Mark 15:39)
  • "shall be born of thee shall be called [FUTURE] the Son of God" (Luke 1:35)
  • "Thou art Christ the Son of God" (Luke 4:41)
  • "Jesus, thou Son of God" (Luke 8:28)
  • "Art thou then the Son of God?" (Luke 22:70)
  • "And I saw, and bare record that this is the Son of God" (John 1:34)
  • "in the name of the only begotten Son of God" (John 3:18)
  • "shall hear the voice of the Son of God" (John 5:25)
  • "believe on the Son of God" (John 9:35)
  • "that the Son of God might be glorified" (John 11:4)
  • "thou art the Christ, the Son of God" (John 11:27)
  • "that Jesus is the Christ, the Son of God" (John 20:31)
  • "that Jesus Christ is the Son of God" (Acts 8:37)
  • "that he is the Son of God" (Acts 9:20)
  • "declared to be the Son of God with power" (Rom. 1:4)
  • "the Son of God, Jesus Christ" (II Cor. 1:19)
  • "Jesus the Son of God" (Heb. 4:14)
  • "that Jesus is the Son of God" (I John 4:15)

Notice how "personable" these expressions which are found in the New Testament [ONLY]? In personal communication between Jesus Christ and those with whom He was in contact? Here on earth?

 
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Donnie Cruz
(Login Donnie.Cruz)
ConcernedMembersMadison
99.177.250.192

Re: It is What It is

November 7 2013, 1:25 AM 

I think it's time to get real with what's happening at Madison.

Dave, you were doing so great in getting involved with the discussion. We agree; we disagree. But at least you responded to specific questions -- unlike the ever evasive Bill.

 
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Head Shepherd
(no login)
74.179.244.153

Keeping it real

November 7 2013, 9:07 AM 

Donnie it is time to get real about what's happening at Madison. What do you want to know? Future plans? Hidden agenda? Ask away.

 
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Donnie Cruz
(Login Donnie.Cruz)
ConcernedMembersMadison
99.177.250.192

Re: Keeping it real

November 7 2013, 10:44 PM 

Greetings!!!

Maybe I'm not keeping up with what's happening at Madison enough. In Dave's response to my post above, I noted that he vehemently objected to my itemized questions and comments about the congregation.

You said, "Ask away." I thank you for the offer. So, I'm offering you the opportunity to let us know of those "future plans." Are there "hidden agenda" that I'm ignorant about?

Thanks in advance!!!

Donnie

 
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Humility
(no login)
98.87.37.202

Thanks, Head Shepherd

November 8 2013, 12:54 AM 

"Head Shepherd", you should not blow your cover with this description. Keep yourself anonymous. We all now know who you are.

Two questions I have:

1. Is it scriptural to have a "head" shepherd?

2. When do you intend to take "Madison Church of Christ" off the site, and call it the "Madison Church"?

 
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Head Shepherd
(no login)
166.147.120.37

Re: Thanks, Head Shepherd

November 8 2013, 9:36 PM 

Soon!

 
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...........................THE BOOK

What Happened at the Madison Church of Christ?


There are thousands of churches being taken over across America.

This book is only about one of those churches. It's about the Madison Church Of Christ. By studying the methods used here along with the resource references you might be able to inoculate your church. At the very least you will recognize the signs early on.

Many of the current members of the Madison Church of Christ still don't know what happened.
Some never will know! This book is for them as well.

Madison Church of Christ was a 60 year old church. At one time it was one of the largest churches in the US, and the largest Church of Christ.

It thrived for many years on the vision of it's elders and those of it's ministers. Those visions undoubtably came from the the inspired word of Jesus Christ.

At sometime in the last 10 years there was a deliberate plan by a majority of the elders to take the Madison Church of Christ into a more worldly realm.

They used secrecy, covert planning, and outside sources to scheme and to change the format and direction of the Madison Church of Christ.

The Elders knew that the membership would never approve such a plan. Using the tools of the "Community Church Movement"(consultants, books, seminars, meetings,planters,seeders) they slowly started initiating change so it was never noticed by the members until it was too late.....

At the heart of the plan was the fact that old members were going to be driven off so new techniques could be used to go out and reach the unchurched through new "Contemporary Holy Entertainment" methods developed by the "Community Church Movement"

Old members had to be kept on board long enough to get their plans ready, or the funds would not be there to pay for the new building. So by the plans very nature, it had to be secret.

The church had no plan in effect to renew or approve elders. There was never any need. The elders had always been "as approved by God". 10 of the last 15 elders would begin to shed some doubt on that.

The Elders did not even need a majority at first, because some of the elders went along unwittingly.

This edition starts shortly after some of the members begin to smell something strange in January 2001. Later editions may go back and fill in some of the timeline.

To even start to understand whats happening here, you must read the background materials in the first of the book.

This is only the first edition, and not the end. New editions will be printed as needed. To keep abreast of current changes, please visit our web site; http://www.concernedmembers.com/madison

Here is the list of players;

5 Godly Elders
10 Not so Godly Elders
120 "Deacons" (allegiance unknown)
2,800 - 4,000 church "members"
2 "teners" (people who have publicly confessed to have broken all ten commandments)
Unknown number of "sinners" (This is what the 10 elders call us.)
Unknown number of "demons" (Flying everywhere, to many to count)
 

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