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Donnie Cruz
(Login Donnie.Cruz)
ConcernedMembersMadison
23.127.32.146

Re: The Pope's Lunacy

August 18 2017, 12:27 AM 

Dave,

You're correct. It's not a debate. It's not a debate when you accept any creed without question.

Face it. The questions I posed were just too complex for those who are unprepared to provide answers.

Here's a bit of information for you. It's about the Council of Nicaea. (Source: www.britannica.com)

Council of Nicaea, (325), the first ecumenical council of the Christian church, meeting in ancient Nicaea (now İznik, Tur.). It was called by the emperor Constantine I, an unbaptized catechumen, or neophyte, who presided over the opening session and took part in the discussions.

The council ... incorporated the nonscriptural word homoousios (“of one substance”) into a creed (the Nicene Creed) to signify the absolute equality of the Son with the Father.

 
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Dave
(no login)
66.112.162.15

Cooling It

August 18 2017, 12:46 AM 

Additional Information

I am not your bro

Idiot

Merriam Webster

: a foolish or stupid person

Dictionary.com
Informal. an utterly foolish or senseless person:

 
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Ken Sublett
(Login Ken.Sublett)
ConcernedMembersMadison
24.151.202.16

Re: Cooling It

August 18 2017, 10:24 AM 

The value of blasphemy and ANATHEMA (dedicated to adorn God's work or Word] is that you are FREE to say anything you wish:

Matt. 5:22 But I say unto you, That whosoever is angry with his brother without a cause shall be in danger of the judgment: and whosoever shall say to his brother, Raca, shall be in danger of the council: but whosoever shall say, Thou fool, shall be in danger of hell fire.

4469. rhak-ah´; of Chaldee origin (compare H7386); O empty one, i.e. thou worthless (as a term of utter vilification): — Raca.

 
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Bill
(no login)
99.179.116.207

Re: The Pope's Lunacy

August 18 2017, 11:22 AM 

It's no longer a debate when Donnie keeps asking the same "questions" over and over because the answers we've given him many times over are not what he wants to hear. For that and other reasons I've listed previously, Donnie's so-called "debates" perished long ago. Go out and find something more productive to do with your life.

 
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Dave
(no login)
66.112.162.15

Ken

August 18 2017, 1:13 PM 

Hey, Ken if you quote a wise saying does that mean you are wise? If you speak a foolish idea does that mean you are a fool?

Take your time with this one......LOTS of time. Dictionary, thesaurus, piney.com, grace forum posts, faithmatters.com old posts, reach deep. A couple of page answer would be awesome.

 
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Donnie
(Login Donnie.Cruz)
ConcernedMembersMadison
23.127.32.146

Re: The Pope's Lunacy

August 18 2017, 10:27 PM 

FYI, Bill, these few questions recently had not been asked before. The questions were/are still related to the topic at hand that Dave keeps bringing up, i.e.,

"And Jesus came and spake unto them, saying, All power is given unto me in heaven and in earth. (Matt. 28:18, KJV)

A serious student of the Bible, even if unbeknownst to him that he acquired a particular dogma from the pope or the RCC, would really study the Scripture even more and do extensive research. Research including historical evidences which prove that Eusebius (260-340 A.D) quoted from the early manuscripts (not translations) "in my name" rather than "in the name of F-S-HS." But that's for another time and a different thread.

The point being that where Jesus said "given unto ME" ... it follows that "in my name" is original-text-based Matt. 28:19 and the commission to make disciples "in his name" in the books of Mark and Luke. It also matches all the other passages dealing with being baptized in the name of Jesus Christ all throughout the New Testament.

The logic flow remains the same -- why, when, what happened when: (1) God gave (2) Jesus ALL POWER. So, here are the questions that had NOT been asked prior to this week:

  1. What was Jesus BEFORE God gave him ALL power? Was Jesus powerless? Was he powerful but not as powerful as God?
  2. What was Jesus AFTER God gave him ALL power? Did he then become equal with God in power and authority?
  3. What are the differences between: (a) the Giver of power [God] and (b) the Receiver of power [Jesus] in terms of their "being"? Are they really just one being?
  4. If Jesus was/is God from the beginning [which is your teaching], why would God still need to give God [Jesus] ALL power?

 
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Donnie
(Login Donnie.Cruz)
ConcernedMembersMadison
23.127.32.146

Re: Cooling It

August 18 2017, 10:30 PM 

Ken, you beat me to quoting the above passage for the mad Dave.

 
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Donnie
(Login Donnie.Cruz)
ConcernedMembersMadison
23.127.32.146

'ALL Power to Me' (Matt. 28:18) and 'In My Name' (Matt. 28:19) Are Related

August 19 2017, 4:16 PM 

When God gave Jesus ALL POWER, "in my name" was appropriate and sufficient when Jesus commissioned: "Go into all the world ... in my name."

Eusebius was present at the council of Nicea and was involved in the debates between Arias and the pagan view of Athanasius that became the trinity doctrine. If the manuscripts he had in front of him read “in the name of the Father, and of the Son and of the Holy Spirit,” he would never have quoted instead, “in my name.” So it appears that the earliest manuscripts read “in my name,” and the phrase was enlarged to reflect the orthodox position as Trinitarian influence spread. (Taken from an article, "Does Matthew 28:19 Have Added Text")

Surprise, surprise!!! "The Church" that evolved into becoming the Roman Catholic Church admits to having changed the text in Matt. 28:19 (cf. Catholic Encyclopedia).

FROM: "... in my name"
TO: "... in the name of the Father, and of the Son, and of the Holy Ghost."


Look at the other "commission" passages (that the RCC did not change the original text):

And he said unto them, Go ye into all the world, and preach the gospel to every creature. He that believeth and is baptized shall be saved; but he that believeth not shall be damned. And these signs shall follow them that believe; In my name shall they cast out devils; they shall speak with new tongue (Mark 16:15-17, KJV)

And that repentance and remission of sins should be preached in his name among all nations, beginning at Jerusalem. (Luke 24:47, KJV)

Had the R.C.C. not changed the original text in Matt. 28:19 [the only one passage with the Trinitarian translation], all three (3) "commission" passages which command "to go into all the world" would indicate "IN MY NAME." After all, Philippians 2:9 clearly states: "Wherefore God also hath highly exalted him, and given him a name which is above every name."

 
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Dave
(no login)
66.112.162.15

Admit It

August 20 2017, 8:47 PM 

"Admit it: you support the pagan-based Trinity creed that the bishops of Rome approved in the Nicean Council."

 
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Donnie
(Login Donnie.Cruz)
ConcernedMembersMadison
23.127.32.146

Re: Learning the History of the Pagan-Based Trinity Creed

August 20 2017, 9:41 PM 

You are getting there, Dave -- slowly but surely. Something you had little or no knowledge of before ... or something you kept denying. Keep reading, studying and researching (on your own) historical evidences.

Hopefully, you've noticed in a recent post: "... the pagan view of Athanasius that became the trinity doctrine."

"St. Athanasius [ca 293-373AD] was the greatest champion of Catholic belief on the subject of the Incarnation that the Church has ever known...." (Catholic Encyclopedia).

 
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Ken Sublett
(Login Ken.Sublett)
ConcernedMembersMadison
24.151.202.16

Re: Learning the History of the Pagan-Based Trinity Creed

August 20 2017, 10:04 PM 

John Calvin on Genesis One is in agreement with the EXPLANATIONS of the Nicene Creed:

http://www.piney.com/HSCalvin.html

"Christians, therefore, properly contend, from this testimony, that there exists a plurality of Persons (personae or masks in the church Fathers) in the Godhead.

God summons no foreign counsellor; hence we infer that he

finds WITHIN HIMSELF something distinct; as, in truth,
his eternal WISDOM and POWER reside within him.

Christians, therefore, properly contend, from this testimony, that there exists a plurality of Persons (personae in the church Fathers) in the Godhead.


The Spirit OF Christ made it perfectly clear to those with A holy spirit.

He hath made the earth by his power,
he hath established the world by his wisdom,
and hath stretched out the heaven by his understanding. Jer 51:15

When he uttereth his voice, there is a multitude of waters in the heavens;
and he causeth the vapours to ascend from the ends of the earth:
he maketh lightnings with rain,
and bringeth forth the wind out of his treasures. Jer 51:16

Calvin: But Augustine, beyond all others, speculates with excessive refinement,

for the purpose of fabricating a Trinity in man. For in laying hold of the three faculties of the soul enumerated by Aristotle, the intellect, the memory, and the will, he afterwards out of one Trinity derives many.



    
This message has been edited by Ken.Sublett from IP address 24.151.202.16 on Aug 20, 2017 10:08 PM


 
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Donnie Cruz
(Login Donnie.Cruz)
ConcernedMembersMadison
23.127.32.146

Re: Learning the History of the Pagan-Based Trinity Creed

August 20 2017, 11:49 PM 

Speaking of Genesis 1, we notice that "God SAID, let the.../let there be..." 10 times in that chapter alone. When God SAID, God SPOKE. What God SAID was His WORD. It was, therefore, the WORD of God [no, we're not talking about the Bible] -- what God SAID or uttered.

There is a parallel between Genesis 1 and John 1 in that both passages mention "in the beginning." I believe that THE WORD [THE LOGOS] in John 1:1,14 is THE WORD of God as Genesis 1 indicates God SPEAKING. The LOGOS in John 1:1 is actually the LOGOS OF God -- what God said, spoke or uttered. It was THE WORD (THE LOGOS) of God that was in the beginning with God -- not another Person or God as Trinitarians believe -- that became FLESH in John 1:14.

Unfortunately, there are those who just cannot accept the fact that the original text of John 1:1 was mishandled by biased Trinitarian translations and by the misapplication of modern English grammatical rules (e.g., capitalization, gender identification, etc.).

God (the Father that the Bible references) did NOT become flesh. Rather, it was the LOGOS (the WORD) of God which became flesh (John 1:14) -- God's Word that was with Him in the beginning.

NOTE the difference between: (1) God became/was made flesh VERSUS (2) the LOGOS (WORD) of God became/was made flesh. Truth is that God did not become a man; God did not become Jesus.

Truth is that the Word which was in the beginning with God -- that's what became flesh; that's what became Jesus 2000 years ago.

 
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Ken Sublett
(Login Ken.Sublett)
ConcernedMembersMadison
24.151.202.16

Re: Is Jesus Just ANOTHER god?

August 20 2017, 11:54 PM 

The Beginning in John 1 is not the first creation destroyed by water. The New Creation as the Kingdom of Church is of spiritual things and not dirt. I ran across Augustine who goes beyond the CREED which was imposed and explains the intrinsic triad nature of God just like Scripture. There is ONE GOD Who has all of the powers within and One Mediator between the One God and Man, the MAN Christ Jesus.

I am amazed at how many times Jesus is called a Man and the Son of Man and all wings of religionists say, nope! Jesus WAS God: Jehovah became Jesus. God is never bashful about slapping arrogant people with strong delusions so that they believe their own lies and SELL THEM FOR A FORTUNE because almost all humans are OF the World and Jesus doesn't pray for these earth men who are earthy.

I can't get anyone to bite on the clear definition of DUST proves that Adam was an Aborigine and God made or educated him and breathed the breath of life into him and he became a LIVING SOUL. Being INspirited the tiny, little flock can READ and HEAR the Word. So, don't expect most to make the journey you have made.

The BRANCH is from the stump but branch is also the base of the Menorah which holds seven lamps or the seven spirits OF God all related to divine knowledge.

[linked image]


    
This message has been edited by Ken.Sublett from IP address 24.151.202.16 on Aug 21, 2017 12:07 AM


 
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Dave
(no login)
66.112.162.15

Admit It.....NOW

August 21 2017, 12:01 AM 

"Admit it: you support the pagan-based Trinity creed that the bishops of Rome approved in the Nicean Council."

 
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Donnie
(Login Donnie.Cruz)
ConcernedMembersMadison
23.127.32.146

The Pagan-Based, Catholic Trinity Creed

August 21 2017, 2:12 AM 

Dave,

You are the proponent of the Trinity dogma; I'm not. The pagan-based Trinity dogma!!! You have supported this dogma, and you're teaching others the same man-invented creed that was approved in the 4th century.

I have learned that you will continue to support the pagan-based Trinity creed despite the historical evidences that prove it is a human creed rooted in paganism. It's sad that many of its followers did not know it, do not know it, will never know it.

 
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Dave
(no login)
66.112.162.15

You Made the Accusation-Not Becoming of a Christian

August 21 2017, 10:55 AM 

"Admit it: you support the pagan-based Trinity creed that the bishops of Rome approved in the Nicean Council."

 
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Donnie
(Login Donnie.Cruz)
ConcernedMembersMadison
23.127.32.146

Re: NO: Let the Scripture Do the Accusation

August 21 2017, 11:51 PM 

Dave,

The Roman Catholic Church owns and perpetuates these creeds, heresies and human traditions:
  • Trinity
  • Prayers for the dead and the sign of the Cross
  • Veneration of angels and dead saints
  • The Mass
  • The worship of Mary, "Mother of God"
  • Extreme Unction
  • Purgatory
  • Prayers directed to Mary, or to dead saints.
  • Papacy
  • Worship of the cross, images and relics
  • Canonization of dead saints
  • The celibacy of the priesthood
  • The Rosary, or prayer beads
  • The sale of Indulgences
  • The dogma of Transubstantiation
  • Confession of sin to the priest
  • The Immaculate Conception of the Virgin Mary
  • Papal Infallibility
  • Assumption of the Virgin Mary
  • Sprinkling Baptism
  • Infant Baptism
  • Penance
  • Perpetual virginity of Mary
  • ... and more

How pagan!!! and man-made!!!

The Trinity is the central doctrine of the Roman Catholic Church; all their other doctrines and teachings are based upon the Trinity. These doctrines were all HATCHED from the SACRED EGG -- the Trinity.

Well, Dave, I know ... I know you do not believe and follow all that pagan stuff that's prevalent in the Roman Church with the exception, of course, of the Trinity dogma.

The Scripture teaches:

That we henceforth be no more children, tossed to and fro, and carried about with every wind of doctrine, by the sleight of men, and cunning craftiness, whereby they lie in wait to deceive. (Ephesians 4:14, KJV)

Now the Spirit speaketh expressly, that in the latter times some shall depart from the faith, giving heed to seducing spirits, and doctrines of devils (I Timothy 4:1, KJV).

 
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Dave
(no login)
66.112.162.15

Edit

August 22 2017, 10:08 AM 

Do Not Edit My initial title.

 
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Kenneth Sublett
(Login Ken.Sublett)
ConcernedMembersMadison
24.151.202.16

SPIRITS promoting MUSIC are DEMONIC

August 22 2017, 9:37 AM 

[linked image]


    
This message has been edited by Ken.Sublett from IP address 24.151.202.16 on Aug 22, 2017 9:51 AM


 
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Dave
(no login)
66.112.162.15

Wake Up

August 22 2017, 10:10 AM 

Ken, Get it in gear and change the title back to what I originally had. If you like that title then start your own separate post.

 
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...........................THE BOOK

What Happened at the Madison Church of Christ?


There are thousands of churches being taken over across America.

This book is only about one of those churches. It's about the Madison Church Of Christ. By studying the methods used here along with the resource references you might be able to inoculate your church. At the very least you will recognize the signs early on.

Many of the current members of the Madison Church of Christ still don't know what happened.
Some never will know! This book is for them as well.

Madison Church of Christ was a 60 year old church. At one time it was one of the largest churches in the US, and the largest Church of Christ.

It thrived for many years on the vision of it's elders and those of it's ministers. Those visions undoubtably came from the the inspired word of Jesus Christ.

At sometime in the last 10 years there was a deliberate plan by a majority of the elders to take the Madison Church of Christ into a more worldly realm.

They used secrecy, covert planning, and outside sources to scheme and to change the format and direction of the Madison Church of Christ.

The Elders knew that the membership would never approve such a plan. Using the tools of the "Community Church Movement"(consultants, books, seminars, meetings,planters,seeders) they slowly started initiating change so it was never noticed by the members until it was too late.....

At the heart of the plan was the fact that old members were going to be driven off so new techniques could be used to go out and reach the unchurched through new "Contemporary Holy Entertainment" methods developed by the "Community Church Movement"

Old members had to be kept on board long enough to get their plans ready, or the funds would not be there to pay for the new building. So by the plans very nature, it had to be secret.

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The Elders did not even need a majority at first, because some of the elders went along unwittingly.

This edition starts shortly after some of the members begin to smell something strange in January 2001. Later editions may go back and fill in some of the timeline.

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Here is the list of players;

5 Godly Elders
10 Not so Godly Elders
120 "Deacons" (allegiance unknown)
2,800 - 4,000 church "members"
2 "teners" (people who have publicly confessed to have broken all ten commandments)
Unknown number of "sinners" (This is what the 10 elders call us.)
Unknown number of "demons" (Flying everywhere, to many to count)
 

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