I am just wondering what kind of oil grade should i use ?!

10w40 ? 20w50 ? opinions please...

Use olive oil.

Either.
L8tr
E

use the 20w50, thats what my mechanic recommonds for mine due to the age of these motors...

20W50 is really the best choice...

A friend of mine builds competition heads for a living and periodically does some testing on oils.

Basically, he tested the heat, shear, and lubrication properties of a variety of oils, both synthetic and mineral-based. He used a Datsun L-series head (set up on a bench), and added a small quantity of each oil to different rockers. He then ran it at high revs until they destroyed themselves.

Results:

1. Castrol Formula R (previously known as GP50) - mineral based 25W50
2. Daylight
3. Everything else

Interestingly, he said that all the synthetic oils were crap.

Oh, and another thing, apparently the recipe for Formula R is changing for 2006, so these results only apply up until then.

Suggest to your mate that he has performed an entirely useless test to determine actually how long a follower will last deprived of oil supply.
This is entirely unrealistic in the world of pressure fed oil systems.
In the real world, I would suggest that the crank would have long ago run its bearings before a follower nipped up.
That particular methodology, which is an old advertising gimmick used at automotive trade fairs and shows, has been proven many times over to be of little or no value in determining actually how "good" an oil is in actual use.
He may be a head wizard, but he dun know much about lubricatig oils and how to evaluate them LMAO.
Tell him that Google is his friend.

I think we've had about 3 "what oil for FJ20?" threads now.... Persoanlly I use Penrite HPR15 semi syn.

Ive tried many and my engine runs very nice and quiet on Penrite 20w-60 HPR30. Penrite is very good in my view. I flog the crap out of it every time i drive it

Evan,

Riddle me this, Batman - if the tests he is performing were of no use, why would he be testing the 2006 blend of Formula R? Did I mention anything about depriving followers of oil? In the real world, have you ever run an engine low on oil? Your suggestion implies you haven't.

The short of it is, the tests are done with all the oil you want, under high load - the sort of loads that top fuel drag cars put on their valve train. He is definitely no amateur.

I would suggest that Google is your friend a little too much. You should go and spend more time "doing" - you will learn alot more...

"Did I mention anything about depriving followers of oil?" heheh...ermm yeah you did actually.("Apply a small amount of oil" was the phrase I believe).
"In the real world, have you ever run an engine low on oil?" Well, yes frequently...mentioned again!

and so-on.
Believe whatever you like M8. Pay your money and make your choices.
I actually wrote a detailed point by point response to this dross but im not going to be dragged into some flaming contest nor dignify it by commenting any further.
L8tr
E

No, no flames. Not interested either. On re-reading my original post, I do understand why you said what you did. I wasn't bothered to go into detail, and thus confusion was borne.

Oddly, on the (overhead cam) motors that I have seen with oil deprivation, the cam lobes and followers are the first things to suffer.

It is nice to know that you did take the time to respond point-by-point, and then take the time again to remove it for a concise response.

At the risk of being a fire lighter putting a small amount of oil on a L Series rocker/cam lobe and running it at high speed is a nonsensical test anyway . I'm at a loss as to what this is supposed to evaluate . No engine can survive that kind of treatment no matter what kind of valve train .
I've been down the road of L Series engines with FIA grinds (on imported billets)that have scuffed lobes and rockers when oil formulations have changed . To be truthfull larger L Series FIA grinds ie 76 deg for rally have a square nose and with high spring rates really give the rocker interface a caining . When Penzoil stopped importing their Pennsylvania crude based oil in US measures containers and went to 44's which were blended with local base stock rubbish (now sold in 5L containers) people had no end of valve train woes . Penzoil refused to admit anything had changed but we knew .
FJ20's are reasonably easy on oils particularly with their direct cam lobe on inverted bucket valve train . Obviously this changes with increases in revs heat and spring rates . I think its wrong to simply write off synthetic oils though there is a problem with the offical classification of synthetic oils . The real ones have been tried and proven in competition bikes that rev way beyond what competition cars do and stand up to it easily . I've heard nothing but glowing reports of Castrol R Synthetic 10W60 , and while I've not used it I know of people who assemble their own race engines who do .
What your friend needs to do is build an L Series with a big cam and heavy springs and run it under real world conditions to test lube oils - there is no other way .

As I said previously, the "small amount of oil" thing was me choosing words poorly. The tests are about seeing how much scuffing happens - in my book, scuffed is destroyed. If he'll let me, I'll take some photos of the results.

He already has built an L Series with a big cam and heavy spings (goodness knows how many) - his 180B rally car is a very well-known piece of machinery in NSW rally circles. It is already running more than what you suggest. In fact, he is in the process of experimenting with an 80 degree cam with 16 mm of lift.

I use Castrol R Synthetic 10W60 myself (in an FJ20). You are right, with standard lift and valve spings, it is a fine oil and does the job nicely, but FJs aren't rough on the valve train - small valves, light springs, low lift. I am now swapping to Formula R on his advice. That, and it is half the price!

The question was asked about what oil to use. I did nothing more than rehash the test results of a well-respected head technician. If you do nothing more than drive your car to work most days and never rev it above 3500 rpm, you could probably get away with using Home Brand oil. If, on the other hand, your engine spends its entire life in the 4500 - 7500 rpm range (as mine does), then your lubrication requirements are somewhat different. Motorbikes are different again. Top Doorslammers yet again.

The short of it is - there is no single right answer. It all comes down to reputation and the size of your wallet.

Did your mate test a "small" amount of olive oil? Olive oil is used only in the best european vehicles such as ferrari and porsche.

I don't think so, no. Got a particular brand that I should suggest? After all, olive oils ain't olive oils...

Would you be surprised if I told you that L Series cam development is way ahead of the 76 deg FIA profiles ? Shorter timed higher lift cams make better average torque than the works profiles . All sorts of things have been tried from 500cc Honda "Isle of Man" grinds to BMW grinds with various results . Eventually there comes a time when the power losses to drive big profiles against crushing spring loads gets out of hand . The sort of valve reliefs needed to clear the piston crowns compromises combustion efficiency and so on and so forth .
For the ultimate he needs to ditch the single cam head , even if it is the rare 219 casting (ask), for the Formula Pacific L/Z twin cam head . It was homologated for some classes in the 160J and Stanzas , not sure about 180B . Also 1600/510 will be lighter (better power to weight) than 180B's if he's serious about winning . He no doubt knows all of this .
Cheers A .

Yeah, he knows all of this - so do I. For rallying the L/Z head is only homologated for use in the 710 Violet SSS and the PB210 Sunny Excellent - the latter of which I owned (until last weekend) the only rally version in the country.

So yeah, I know.

E-mail to continue and we'll let this thread die...

Cheers,

Matt

fountainmass*NOSPAM*@gmail.com (obviously without the *NOSPAM*)

Just an update - as you are probably all aware, the 2006 blend of Formula R is now out, in its new (gold)packaging and called Castrol Edge. We have been reliably informed that they did not go ahead with the recipe that was tested, but with one very close to the old one.

Cheers,

Matt