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HILLCREST CHURCH OF CHRIST,ABILENE,TX.,USA

January 29 2002 at 7:46 PM
  (no login)
from IP address 65.80.180.107

I am a member at Hillcrest Church of Christ in Abilene, TX. We have been experiencing similar problems in our church that Madison Church of Christ has.

I have read everything I can get my hands on about the Church Growth Movement including your website and links.

In an attempt to reconcile differences in our church, the elders requested that everyone sign up for a meeting on Wednesday night (these meetings were
spread over several weeks in order to keep the groups small). The idea was to have a representation from each class at each meeting. Two elders would be present in each meeting and they would have one moderator. The only stipulation put on the meeting is that it has to be "positive".

Did you experience anything like this at Madison? I know the moderator in our meeting and I don't think it is an attempt at the Delphi Technique.

How can I get my points across about the error of the changes without getting negative? Do you have any ideas? Our meeting is tomorrow night, Wed Jan 23, 2002.

Any ideas would be appreciated.

Thank you in advance.

Kevin Hamm

 
 Respond to this message   
Response TitleAuthorDate
 The TimeLine - What Happened This Week Jan 29, 2002, 8:17 PM
  Re: The TimeLine - What Happened This Week Feb 25, 2002, 4:06 PM
   Get your head out of the sand Feb 27, 2002, 2:21 AM
  Same story all over the country. Mar 22, 2002, 9:52 PM
   You have a better perspective... Mar 28, 2002, 5:46 PM
   Preacher from Texas? Nov 24, 2005, 6:21 AM
   What took You so longRobert DorlingJun 29, 2008, 6:52 PM
  Educated guesses? Sep 3, 2002, 12:46 PM
   The Best I Could Do Under the Circumstances Sep 13, 2002, 2:56 PM
    I'm praying for you Kevin Dec 10, 2002, 10:35 PM
     Always Makes Me A Little NervousConcernedMembersDec 11, 2002, 9:23 PM
      No dust under my feet Dec 15, 2002, 4:28 PM
      nervousBible believerDec 6, 2004, 4:52 PM
       No Comparison Feb 22, 2005, 6:11 PM
     Know that I have been praying for you for over a year Dec 12, 2002, 3:05 AM
     It appears James Hall is not on staff Dec 13, 2002, 1:23 AM
      Correction: James Hall is a youth intern Dec 14, 2002, 12:07 PM
     Judgement CallCathyDec 14, 2002, 7:56 PM
      Na Na NaJudging CathyDec 17, 2002, 11:27 PM
       Re: Na Na Na Dec 18, 2002, 10:05 AM
        Re: Re: Na Na NaJust a brotherDec 29, 2002, 8:16 PM
     Christian PornographyLaughing HystericallyDec 17, 2002, 11:31 PM
      HeHeHe AND NaNaNaCathyDec 30, 2002, 12:25 AM
       nanana back at youheheheDec 31, 2002, 6:54 PM
        Re: nanana back at you Jan 2, 2003, 12:28 AM
         Get RealI am rubber.....Jan 2, 2003, 6:24 PM
          interesting take...... Apr 2, 2003, 6:03 PM
           Growth is only through God?Gary ColeMar 21, 2005, 9:44 PM
   Re: Educated guesses?CathyNov 15, 2002, 12:15 AM
    ...just so you know...BrentOct 30, 2003, 4:28 PM
     Brent, that is my concern Nov 2, 2003, 5:31 PM
      ...well.....BrentNov 3, 2003, 11:49 AM
       Brent, some clarification is in order Nov 4, 2003, 1:15 AM
   Thanks for sharing.Kindness HealsFeb 17, 2013, 1:25 AM
  Poor dear brother - Leave! Oct 26, 2002, 6:15 PM
   Very goodJoe McKnightNov 24, 2002, 9:15 AM
  Meeting Jan. 23 Oct 28, 2002, 6:49 PM
   Kevin. Have you ever heard the gospel of Jesus? Apr 4, 2003, 11:36 PM
    interesting response, let me just say this... Apr 8, 2003, 1:04 PM
     Hmm... let me ponder a while Apr 9, 2003, 6:01 PM
      Brent...Common ground? Apr 12, 2003, 8:35 AM
       ....interesting..and I will respond... Apr 21, 2003, 3:26 PM
    Nothing New, Paul May 3, 2003, 11:06 AM
     One question...and a few references May 7, 2003, 3:41 PM
      good examples...but lets look closer... Jul 7, 2003, 12:09 PM
       good examples...agreedChuck SonnJul 12, 2003, 7:44 PM
       question Jul 13, 2003, 11:10 PM
        Sorry about the delay...Brent BellSep 15, 2003, 5:39 PM
         Spirit of truth Sep 29, 2003, 4:24 PM
          so are you saying.... Oct 7, 2003, 3:38 PM
           How did you hear that? Oct 8, 2003, 7:44 PM
            Re: How did you hear that?Mark WaggonerOct 9, 2003, 11:55 AM
             Re: Re: How did you hear that? Oct 10, 2003, 6:19 PM
              Let me be more specificPaulOct 12, 2003, 11:01 PM
               Re: Let me be more specificMark WaggonerOct 15, 2003, 8:45 AM
                Divine Power Oct 20, 2003, 11:28 PM
                 Concerning Miracles Oct 22, 2003, 11:59 PM
                 Re: Divine PowerMark WaggonerOct 23, 2003, 11:39 AM
                 Concerning "Logos" and "Rhema" Oct 23, 2003, 1:32 PM
                  Is this what you meant about "rhema" and "logos"? Oct 26, 2003, 12:24 AM
                   Re: Is this what you meant about &quote;rhema&quote; and &quote;logos&quote;?PaulOct 27, 2003, 6:26 PM
                    Re: Re: Is this what you meant about rhema and logos? Oct 28, 2003, 11:48 PM
                     What has happend to this site??tomOct 29, 2003, 9:04 AM
                 The complete verse of 2 Peter 1:3 for the record Oct 25, 2003, 10:32 PM
                 Concerning "that which is perfect" Oct 26, 2003, 1:24 AM
            I think I see our difference....Brent BellOct 21, 2003, 10:51 AM
             Re: I think I see our difference....PaulOct 22, 2003, 10:40 PM
              ...so you ARE saying.....Brent BellOct 23, 2003, 12:36 PM
               Brent, Kevin and Mark Oct 23, 2003, 11:10 PM
                Re: Brent, Kevin and Mark Oct 25, 2003, 10:29 PM
                 Timothy and Trophimus Oct 27, 2003, 6:19 PM
                  can i just suggest....BrentOct 29, 2003, 4:21 PM
                   Re: Brent's suggestion Oct 30, 2003, 1:41 PM
                   Brent, Kevin & Mark, HEAR YE, HEAR YE Nov 13, 2003, 8:49 AM
                    RE: Hear Ye, Hear Ye Nov 15, 2003, 12:24 PM
                     Re: RE: Hear Ye, Hear Ye Nov 15, 2003, 4:52 PM
                      ....I might just buy that.....AnonymousNov 17, 2003, 2:56 PM
                       Re: ....I might just buy that..... Nov 18, 2003, 3:10 PM
                        ..to clearify...BrentNov 20, 2003, 1:27 PM
                      One more Hear Ye, Hear Ye Nov 17, 2003, 11:58 PM
                       Re: One more Hear Ye, Hear Ye Nov 18, 2003, 3:27 PM
                        Picking and Choosing Dec 4, 2003, 4:21 PM
                         Let's go visit Rick Perry Dec 4, 2003, 6:06 PM
                          Let's not Dec 4, 2003, 6:35 PM
                           Picking and choosingPaulDec 5, 2003, 9:20 AM
                           figure of speech Dec 7, 2003, 3:19 PM
                            Hello, anybody out there? Jan 11, 2004, 4:18 PM
                             Here's to knowing HimPaulJan 31, 2004, 10:28 PM
      Response to references Oct 23, 2003, 10:59 PM
       Re: Response to referencesPaulOct 23, 2003, 11:30 PM
        Re: Response to Response to references Oct 25, 2003, 10:06 PM
         Word gymnasticsPaulOct 26, 2003, 4:30 PM
         Re: Re: Response to Response to referencesMark WaggonerOct 27, 2003, 8:37 AM
          the mapPaulOct 27, 2003, 6:36 PM
           Re: the mapMark WaggonerOct 28, 2003, 9:22 AM
          the perfectionPaulNov 11, 2003, 6:22 PM
           Re: the perfectionMark WaggonerNov 17, 2003, 9:59 AM
            Re: Re: the perfectionPaulNov 22, 2003, 8:07 AM
             Re: Re: Re: the perfectionMark WaggonerDec 1, 2003, 1:09 PM
              eyes that see Dec 4, 2003, 8:37 AM
               Ears that HearMark WaggonerDec 10, 2003, 8:50 AM
        quick question...BrentOct 30, 2003, 4:10 PM
         Re: quick question...PaulNov 9, 2003, 5:27 PM
          ...opps!...brentNov 11, 2003, 2:04 PM
           Re: ...opps!...PaulNov 11, 2003, 6:11 PM
            ..I'll agree...too a degree...BrentDec 1, 2003, 5:52 PM
       Re: Response to referencesPaulOct 28, 2003, 3:44 PM
        Re: Re: Response to referencesPaulOct 31, 2003, 6:38 PM
  Re: The TimeLine - What Happened This Week Mar 4, 2003, 10:29 PM
   Ken Young Information Mar 5, 2003, 1:30 AM
    Ken Young information Jun 18, 2003, 3:36 PM
 Prepare yourself and others Jan 31, 2002, 10:04 PM
  Prepare yourself and Others Apr 3, 2003, 9:54 PM
 Sorry Feb 1, 2002, 9:42 AM
 Sorry Feb 1, 2002, 11:05 AM
 MIRROR MIRROR Feb 12, 2002, 12:47 PM
 Is it Seminary or Cemetery Feb 19, 2002, 10:58 AM
 Just who is the worst enemy ?Joe McKnightFeb 19, 2002, 11:09 AM
 Deceived by distractionJoe McKnightMar 9, 2002, 12:51 PM
 Is God's love conditional?Joe McKnightMar 9, 2002, 1:18 PM
  Re: Is God's love conditional?a concerned reader at ACU.EDUMar 12, 2002, 11:44 AM
   Who are you? Mar 15, 2002, 3:27 PM
    I don't buy it...Bible believerDec 6, 2004, 5:44 PM
 Praise the Lord & Pass the Ammunition Aug 1, 2003, 1:12 PM
 Join "E-MaiL Truth" group May 21, 2005, 3:21 PM
  Do everything in love. I Corinthians 16:14 Sep 22, 2005, 2:29 AM
   Very Good Beginning Sep 24, 2005, 12:46 AM
   Re: Do everything in love. I Corinthians 16:14Mark WaggonerOct 13, 2005, 9:42 AM
 question Apr 28, 2007, 2:54 PM
  Re: questionStephenMar 7, 2009, 11:24 AM
   Hillcrest Update!Tom BriteSep 26, 2012, 9:57 AM
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...........................THE BOOK

What Happened At the Madison Church of Christ?


There are thousands of churches being taken over across America.

This book is only about one of those churches. It's about the Madison Church Of Christ. By studying the methods used here along with the resource references you might be able to inoculate your church. At the very least you will recognize the signs early on.

Many of the current members of the Madison Church of Christ still don't know what happened.
Some never will know! This book is for them as well.

Madison Church of Christ was a 60 year old church. At one time it was one of the largest churches in the US, and the largest Church of Christ.

It thrived for many years on the vision of it's elders and those of it's ministers. Those visions undoubtably came from the the inspired word of Jesus Christ.

At sometime in the last 10 years there was a deliberate plan by a majority of the elders to take the Madison Church of Christ into a more worldly realm.

They used secrecy, covert planning, and outside sources to scheme and to change the format and direction of the Madison Church of Christ.

The Elders knew that the membership would never approve such a plan. Using the tools of the "Community Church Movement"(consultants, books, seminars, meetings,planters,seeders) they slowly started initiating change so it was never noticed by the members until it was too late.....

At the heart of the plan was the fact that old members were going to be driven off so new techniques could be used to go out and reach the unchurched through new "Contemporary Holy Entertainment" methods developed by the "Community Church Movement"

Old members had to be kept on board long enough to get their plans ready, or the funds would not be there to pay for the new building. So by the plans very nature, it had to be secret.

The church had no plan in effect to renew or approve elders. There was never any need. The elders had always been "as approved by God". 10 of the last 15 elders would begin to shed some doubt on that.

The Elders did not even need a majority at first, because some of the elders went along unwittingly.

This edition starts shortly after some of the members begin to smell something strange in January 2001. Later editions may go back and fill in some of the timeline.

To even start to understand whats happening here, you must read the background materials in the first of the book.

This is only the first edition, and not the end. New editions will be printed as needed. To keep abreast of current changes, please visit our web site; http://www.concernedmembers.com/madison

Here is the list of players;

5 Godly Elders
10 Not so Godly Elders
120 "Deacons" (allegiance unknown)
2,800 - 4,000 church "members"
2 "teners" (people who have publicly confessed to have broken all ten commandments)
Unknown number of "sinners" (This is what the 10 elders call us.)
Unknown number of "demons" (Flying everywhere, to many to count)
 

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