How do we tell other countries, with a straight face, that they can't have nuclear weapons, when we have over 8000 of them? It's not that I want Iran to have nukes, I don't. I don't want anyone to have them. Nevertheless, they are a proven deterrent and they garner a certain amount of respect (or fear depending how you look at it). So I get why a country would want to have them.

I also I don't get why countries seeking nukes don't just say "OK, we'll give up our pursuit of nukes, if you destroy yours and allow inspectors in your country to verify, just like you're asking us to do?"

I seems to me that we're never going to be free of nuclear weapons unless we get serious and take the lead.

Cause we're Amurica. Duh.

One of the "Welcome to Vancouver" signs (i can't remember which road it was on, maybe Oak Street) used to say "Nuclear free zone" or something like that. I liked it.

But I agree, yall shouldn't be allowed to have them either.

But where would we get our nice warm feeling of mutually assured destruction without them!?

There's a song about this:

First we got the bomb, and that was good,
'cause we love peace and motherhood.
Then russia got the bomb, but that's okay,
'cause the balance of power's maintained that way.
Who's next?

France got the bomb, but don't you grieve,
'cause they're on our side (i believe).
China got the bomb, but have no fears,
They can't wipe us out for at least five years.
Who's next?

Then indonesia claimed that they
Were gonna get one any day.
South africa wants two, that's right:
One for the black and one for the white.
Who's next?

Egypt's gonna get one too,
Just to use on you know who.
So israel's getting tense.
Wants one in self defense.
"the lord's our shepherd," says the psalm,
But just in case, we better get a bomb.
Who's next?

Luxembourg is next to go,
And (who knows?) maybe monaco.
We'll try to stay serene and calm
When alabama gets the bomb.


I am

There's a song about this:

First we got the bomb, and that was good,
'cause we love peace and motherhood.
Then russia got the bomb, but that's okay,
'cause the balance of power's maintained that way.
Who's next?

France got the bomb, but don't you grieve,
'cause they're on our side (i believe).
China got the bomb, but have no fears,
They can't wipe us out for at least five years.
Who's next?

Then indonesia claimed that they
Were gonna get one any day.
South africa wants two, that's right:
One for the black and one for the white.
Who's next?

Egypt's gonna get one too,
Just to use on you know who.
So israel's getting tense.
Wants one in self defense.
"the lord's our shepherd," says the psalm,
But just in case, we better get a bomb.
Who's next?

Luxembourg is next to go,
And (who knows?) maybe monaco.
We'll try to stay serene and calm
When alabama gets the bomb.


I am

Mevin, do you trust Iran? Do you completely trust that those in power over there are 100% thinking of self-defense and that they would never ever think of using nukes as an offensive weapon and also that they would never secretly think of slipping a nuclear weapon into the hands of groups that we already know have no problem whatsoever with causing death and destruction against those countries that they in their own minds have decided need to be destroyed?

If you don't and if it was your country, wouldn't you do everything reasonable in your power to try to prevent this from happening, even if it means saying and doing things that don't seem 'fair'?

Potato, do you think the citizens of Iran trust the US? Do they completely trust that those in power over here are 100% thinking of self-defense and that they would never ever think of using nukes as an offensive weapon and also that they would never secretly think of slipping a nuclear weapon into the hands of groups that consider enemies?

If they don't and since it is their country, wouldn't they do everything reasonable in their power to try to prevent this from happening, even if it means saying and doing things that don't seem 'fair'?



ETA: I wish there was a song about this.

You spelled nucular wrong. Dummy.

Emokid is throwing slomo dove at my face, I guess that means he flipped me the bird

Aurora, you make a valid point.
And I guess it just comes down to an "us against them" thing.
The problem is, though, that I truly think that the odds of a them against us nuclear attack is far greater than an us against them nuclear attack and I don't see anything unreasonable in us trying to prevent that.
Maybe I don't live in Israel but I do work in NYC and wonder about the possibility of such attacks almost every day.

That's completely fair, Potato. It's just that there are people in Isreal who probably feel the exact same way you do, whether or not they rightly feel that way.

It sucks, but everyone is someone else's Iran.

I get that we can't trust Iran and if I were an Israeli that would be doubly true. But I don't see how we're ever going to expect the world to disarm if we don't show some real leadership in that area. Of course that would require trust, which is in short supply these days.

I don't think it would be a big deal for Iran to develop the bomb. It's not like they would be stupid enough to use it and virtually guarantee that they will be wiped off the face of the earth.

 

Jiggy's looks like a banana. -Lizzlee

I'd love to see more high tech nuclear power plants in this country. These plants are safe, France has had them for decades without a nuclear release. France---arguably the most environmentally conservative first-world nation. We could turn these bombs we have lying around into GHG-free electricity.

Randy Newman's "Political Science"

No one likes us-I don't know why
We may not be perfect, but heaven knows we try
But all around, even our old friends put us down
Let's drop the big one and see what happens

We give them money-but are they grateful?
No, they're spiteful and they're hateful
They don't respect us-so let's surprise them
We'll drop the big one and pulverize them

Asia's crowded and Europe's too old
Africa is far too hot
And Canada's too cold
And South America stole our name
Let's drop the big one
There'll be no one left to blame us

We'll save Australia
Don't wanna hurt no kangaroo
We'll build an All American amusement park there
They got surfin', too

Boom goes London and boom Paris
More room for you and more room for me
And every city the whole world round
Will just be another American town
Oh, how peaceful it will be
We'll set everybody free
You'll wear a Japanese kimono babe
And there'll be Italian shoes for me

They all hate us anyhow
So let's drop the big one now
Let's drop the big one now

"Because if it's not Love
Then it's the Bomb, the Bomb, the Bomb, the Bomb, the Bomb, the Bomb, the Bomb
That will bring us together" The Smiths

My worry over Iran having a bomb is that because it is a theocratic state it is all the more dangerous in their hands.  Some of those who believe they are on God's side may not worry excessively over using a bomb since they believe their religion is correct and in any case the world is going to end anyway. 

Likely the leadership in Iran is pragmatic and worldly enough to see the nuke for what it is . . . a deterrent.  Still . . . they've got complete nutjobs like Ahmedinejad running off their mouths about the Holocaust being a hoax.  If even a few of them actually believe their own Bullshit . . . their having a bomb could be very very worrisome. 

Also, if they have a bomb the likelihood of regime change is just slightly better than it is for North Korea.  The North Koreans (arguably the most oppressed people in the world) have no hope for real change because Kim's got his nuke.  If Kim Jong-il's reign is threatened he will consider using the thing.  One would like to think that he is rational enough not to . . . but look at precedents on a smaller scale like Jonestown Guyana.