Great Moravia

Great Moravia (Old Church Slavonic approximately Велья Морава, Slovak Veľká Morava, Czech Velká Morava, Latin Magna Moravia) was a Slavic empire existing in Central Europe between 833 and the early 10th century. Its core territory lay on both sides of the Morava river, in present-day Slovakia, the Czech Republic and Austria.
The Empire was founded when Prince Mojmír I unified by force the neighboring Principality of Nitra with his own Moravian Principality in 833. Unprecedented cultural development resulted from the mission of Saints Cyril and Methodius, who came during the reign of Prince Rastislav in 863. The Great Moravian Empire reached its greatest territorial extent under King Svatopluk I (871-894). Weakened by internal struggle and frequent wars with the Frankish Empire, Great Moravia was ultimately overrun by Magyar invaders in the early 10th century and its remnants were later divided between the Kingdom of Hungary, Bohemia, Poland, and the Holy Roman Empire.
__________________________________________________________________________

I think this will do for translation of the oldest known Slavic Empire in Europe. First, Samo' s was just a tribal unity not empire.

Only after this one followed Kievan and Russian ones and others.
Or can anybody tell me who had any slavic empire before Great Moravia in Europe that has written evidence ?
So I consider this era the most significant one in all Slavic history.

I.

Velju Moravia

Vel-Moravia bil Slavju imper ktor egzistil vo Sredju Europ mezx 833 i ranju 10ju storocxie. Toi jadroju oblast lezxil na obdva bregis om reka Morava, vo tut-denju Slovakia, Cxehia i Austria.

Imper bil osnovilju gda Princ Moimir I nasiluo sodinil sosedju Princ-krain Nitra so jegoi Moravju Princ-krain vo 833. Bezprimerju kulturju razvitie usledil posolie Sviatnikifs Ciril i Metod, ktor pridili podcxas korolenie om Princ Rastislav vo 863. Vel-Moravju Imper dosagil svoi naivelju teritorju prostrenie pod Korol Sviatpluk I (871-894). Slabilju usled vnutrju borba i cxastoju voinas proti Frankju Imper, Vel-Moravia bil koncuo proehalju ot Madarju vtorgatelis vo ranju 10ju storocxie i toi socxastis bil pozdue razdelilju mezxu Madarju Korolstvo, Bohemia, Polakia i Sviatju Rimju Imper.

Po Slov'anski-N:

Velika Morava (po Staro Cerkovno Slov'anski priblizko Велья Морава, po Slovakski Veľká Morava, po Čehski Velká Morava, po Latini Magna Moravia) bila Slov'anska imperija rozmestena v Central'noj Europe mežu 833 i načalo des'atogo storočija. Serce jej teritoriji bilo na obojih stronah r'eki Moravi, v tutdeni Slovakiji, Čehskoj Repulike i Austriji. Imperija bila načata kogda Princ Mojmir I [čitaj pervi] zavojovat sosedske Kn'ažestvo Nitra i sojedinil s Moravskim Kn'ažestvom v 833om roče. Bezprecedentne kultural'ne rozvojan'e bilo nasledkom misiji Sv'atih Kirila i Metodija, kto prišli pri Prince Rastislave v 863om roče. Velika Moravska Imperija dos'agnula naj višu rozmer pri Krole Svatopluke Iom (871-894). Oslabena vnutr'enami borbami, i častimi vojnami s Frankijskoj Imperijoj, Velika Morava bila rozbita Magjarskimi napadnikami v načalo 10ogo storočija i jej ostatki bili rozdeleni mežu Krolestvom Vengrijskim, Bohemijoj, Polskoj, i Sv'atoj Rimskoj Imperijoj.

Velikij Moravija

Velikij Moravija byl Slavianskij imperija sushchestvujushchij v centralnyj Evropa mezhdu 833 i v rannij desijatyj stoletija. Sentr territorija svoj lezhat na oba strona reka moravom, v sovremennij Slovakija Cheshskij Respublika i Avstrija.
Imperija byl osnovyvalij kogda Princ Mojmir I jedinyj sosednij Knjazhestvo Nitram so ego sobstvennyj Moravskij Knjazhestvo v 833. Bezprecedentnyj kulturnyj pazvitije sledoval ot missija
Kirilom i Metodium, kto prikhodil v techenije carstvovanije Princ Rastislavom v 863.
Velikij Moravija raztjanutyj najvelikij territorija pod Korol Svatopluk I (871 – 894).
Oslabilij posredstvom vnutrennij borba i chastyj vojna s Frankiskij imperija, Velikij Moravija byl nakonec covershat ot Vengerskij zakhvatchiki v rannij desijatyj stoletija i svoj ostatoki bili zatem razdelennyj mezhdu Korolevstvo Vengriam, Bogema, Polsha i Sviatoij Rimskij Imperija.

Eugeniusx

to byl perevod po-MZhR (Mezhdunarodnyj Zhargon Russkij).
U MZhR est tak mnogij slovo kak u Russkij jazik.

Eugeniusx

Hey, iopq. I liked that Slov'anski-N version. But is this language determined by some "official" documents, or is just result of brilliant improviasation?

In other words: could I look at grammar?

yes, that's the document I used. Note that I used the alternative version of the female declensions and -ij adjective ending instead of -i.
I also used 6 dictionaries and chose the most common and well-understood forms of each word. I wrote it late at night so it has some mistakes so here is the fixed version:


Velika Morava (po Staro Cerkovno Slov'anski priblizko Велья Морава, po Slovakski Veľká Morava, po Čehski Velká Morava, po Latini Magna Moravia) bila Slov'anska imperija rozmestena v Central'noj Europe mežu 833 i načala des'atogo storočija. Serce jej teritoriji bilo na obojih br'egah r'eki Moravi, v tutdeni Slovakiji, Čehskoj Republike i Austriji. Imperija bila načata kogda Princ Mojmir I [čitaj pervi] zavojovat sosedske Kn'ažestvo Nitra i sojedinil s Moravskim Kn'ažestvom v 833-om roče. Bezprecedentne kultural'ne rozvojan'e bilo nasledkom misiji Sv'atih Kirila i Metodija, kto prijdili pri Prince Rastislave v 863-om roče. Velika Moravska Imperija dos'agnula naj višogo rozmera pri Krole Svatopluke I-om (871-894). Oslabena vnutr'enimi borbami, i častimi vojnami s Frankijskoj Imperijoj, Velika Morava bila rozbita Magjarskimi napadnikami v načalo 10-ogo storočija i jej ostatki bili rozdeleni mežu Krolestvom Vengrijskim, Bohemijoj, Polskoj, i Sv'atoj Rimskoj Imperijoj.

Let´s have a look to the grammar:
Slovio has three forms of a noun: subject case, object case and plural, n.pr.

Pes, pes-um and pes-is

Slovinanski-N has 12 (twelve!!)
some of the forms look alike which makes things even worse:

Slovianski: pes kusit kot. Kot kusit pes
Slovio: pes kusit kot-um, kot-um pes kusit itd. This is not possible with Sl-N.

Like in English Slovio has to forms for 1.Person Singular Sl-N has 6 (six!)
Like in English Slovio has only one form for the adjective good, namely dobr-ju, Sl-N has TWENTY-FOUR!!!

Honestly speaking, who wants to learn it?

What's use to know a simple language if nobody understands you?

Slovianski-N-type languages are the only really useful Slavic conlangs, because they allow you to be understood by non-freaks ( i.e. Slavs who aren't crazy about language construction).

Maybe it's easier to learn Slovio. Let's say... it takes about 5 minutes vs. 2 hours. But in fact it the same: it doesn't matter how long you have to learn language if it's still less than one day. But the result of Slovianski-N is quite more impressive.

Do you see that caption in the bottom of the window? "BESED - Slaviansk forum ..." etc. Obviously it's possible to write such phrases in more understandable for ALL the Slavs way. So why not to do that?

TO IOPQ:

I've noticed a couple of mistakes in your translation (at least I think they are mistakes):

- "zavojovat sosedske Kn'ažestvo" -- should be "zavojovaL" and "sosedskO" I guess
- "v načalo 10ogo" -- I'm not sure, but I guess "v" should be used with that locative case, i.e. "v načale".

Hellerick pisal.

What's use to know a simple language if nobody understands you?
===
Slovio is not a simple language. It is more universal than Sl-N. You and me like Sl-N somehow; actually, because it is a "copy" of a natural Slavic language. But who on earth will learn a language "spoken" by one person only? Why not learning instead a real Slavic language?
===
Maybe it's easier to learn Slovio. Let's say... it takes about 5 minutes vs. 2 hours. But in fact it the same: it doesn't matter how long you have to learn language if it's still less than one day. ..
===
Ty zabavnyj, shutnik. Nikto ne uchitsja jazik v odin den.
===.
Do you see that caption in the bottom of the window? "BESED - Slaviansk forum ..." etc. Obviously it's possible to write such phrases in more understandable for ALL the Slavs way. So why not to do that?
===
What do you mean by saying "obviously" here? So, do it. Let´s see which version will be better understood.
May be there is a misunderstanding:"BESED - Slaviansk forum ..." is Slovio!

Eugeniusx

Slovio has three forms of a noun: subject case, object case and plural, n.pr.

Pes, pes-um and pes-is

As far as my knowledge of Slovio is concerned, it has got four basic forms of a noun:

singular nominative: pes
plural nominative: pesis
singular accusative: pesuf, pesug, pesum
plural accusative: pesifs, pesims, pesumis

Slovio has been having four forms of a noun. After introducing the "flexible grammar", it has got 8. Oh, weren't you unsatisfied with the 12 noun forms of Slovianski-N?

Gabriel:
Slovio has been having four forms of a noun. After introducing the "flexible grammar", it has got 8. Oh, weren't you unsatisfied with the 12 noun forms of Slovianski-N?
===
To es krova-guvno sxto ti gvorijsx! Vsektor pisatel bu upotrebit tolk cxtir ili tolk dva ili tolk din form, obmanik!

Gabriel es obmanitel
Gabriel i jegoi priatel es obmanitel (din form)

obmanitelum es Gabriel
obmanitelumis es Gabriel i jegoi priatel (four forms)

Here is new translation, and new language by Hellerick. The language I used here is somewhat similar to Slovianski-N, but it doesn't have cases (except genitive sometimes -- endings U and OV for singular and plural correspondingly), there are no apostrophes, the rules and word-formation are slightly regularized etc. Here we go:

Velika Morava (v Staro-Cerkovni Slovianski priblizko Велья Морава, v Slovakski Veľká Morava, v Čehski Velká Morava, v Latina Magna Moravia). Slovenska imperija bivša v Centralna Evropa mež 833 rok i načalo 10u storokiju. Jejova glavna teritorija ležala na oboje stroni reku Morava, v tutdenske Slovakija, Čehija i Austrija. Imerija bila zakladina kda kniaz Mojmir I so-silno sojednil sosedsko kriazostvo Nitra do sam-jegovo kniazostvo v 833. Neprecedentni kulturalni rozvoj bil rezultat ot misija Sviatov Kirilu i Metodiju, koje priideli vo vremen pravijaniju kniazu Rastislavu v 863. Velika Moravska Imperija dosiagila jejova naj-velika teritorijalna širina pri krol Svatopluk I (871-894). Doslabijna so vnutrena borba i časte vojni so Frankska imperija, Velika Moravija bila do-konec pere-silijna so Madjarske napadniki v načalo 10u storokiju, i jejove ostatki bili rozdeline mež krolstvo Vengrija, Bohemija, Polska i Sviata Rimska Imperija.

---

The verbs hide a surprise in them. But this text isn't the best one to present this feature, so I'll wait for better opportunity to describe it.

I hope the Unicode will be treated correctly now. GRRRR...

Here is new translation, and new language by Hellerick. The language I used here is somewhat similar to Slovianski-N, but it doesn't have cases (except genitive sometimes -- endings U and OV for singular and plural correspondingly), there are no apostrophes, the rules and word-formation are slightly regularized etc. Here we go:

Velika Morava (v Staro-Cerkovni Slovianski priblizko Велья Морава, v Slovakski Veľká Morava, v Čehski Velká Morava, v Latina Magna Moravia). Slovenska imperija bivša v Centralna Evropa mež 833 rok i načalo 10u storokiju. Jejova glavna teritorija ležala na oboje stroni reku Morava, v tutdenske Slovakija, Čehija i Austrija. Imerija bila zakladina kda kniaz Mojmir I so-silno sojednil sosedsko kriazostvo Nitra do sam-jegovo kniazostvo v 833. Neprecedentni kulturalni rozvoj bil rezultat ot misija Sviatov Kirilu i Metodiju, koje priideli vo vremen pravijaniju kniazu Rastislavu v 863. Velika Moravska Imperija dosiagila jejova naj-velika teritorijalna širina pri krol Svatopluk I (871-894). Doslabijna so vnutrena borba i časte vojni so Frankska imperija, Velika Moravija bila do-konec pere-silijna so Madjarske napadniki v načalo 10u storokiju, i jejove ostatki bili rozdeline mež krolstvo Vengrija, Bohemija, Polska i Sviata Rimska Imperija.

---

The verbs hide a surprise in them. But this text isn't the best one to present this feature, so I'll wait for better opportunity to describe it.

I hope the Unicode will be treated correctly now. GRRRR...

Ah, nice translation. It has genders, but only two cases, as I see.

I already had fixed some of the things you pointed out, but you did find two mistakes that I missed.

Here is my version again, and I also got a cyrillic version of it too.

Velika Morava (po Staro Cerkovno Slov'anski priblizko Велья Морава, po Slovakski Veľká Morava, po Čehski Velká Morava, po Latini Magna Moravia) bila Slov'anska imperija rozmestena v Central'noj Europe mežu 833 i načala des'atogo storočija. Serce jej teritoriji bilo na obojih br'egah r'eki Moravi, v tutdennoj Slovakiji, Čehskoj Republike i Austriji. Imperija bila načata kogda Princ Mojmir I zavojoval sosedsko Kn'ažestvo Nitra i sojedinil s Moravskim Kn'ažestvom v 833-om roče. Bezprecedentne kultural'ne rozvojan'e bilo nasledkom misiji Sv'atih Kirila i Metodija, kto prijdili pri Prince Rastislave v 863-om roče. Velika Moravska Imperija dos'agnula naj višogo rozmera pri Krole Svatopluke I-om (871-894). Oslabena vnutr'enimi borbami, i častimi vojnami s Frankijskoj Imperijoj, Velika Morava bila rozbita Magjarskimi napadnikami v načale 10-ogo storočija i jej ostatki bili rozdeleni mežu Krolestvom Vengrijskim, Bohemijoj, Pol'skoj, i Sv'atoj Rimskoj Imperijoj.

Велика Морава (по Старо Церковно Словьански приблизко Велья Морава, по Словакски Veľká Morava, по Чехски Velká Morava, по Латини Magna Moravia) била Словьанска империйа розместена в Центральной Еуропе межу 833 и начала десьатого сторочийа. Серце йей територийи било на обойих брьегах рьеки Морави, в тутденной Словакийи, Чехской Републике и Аустрийи. Империйа била начата когда Принц Моймир I завойовал соседско Кньажество Нитра и сойединил с Моравским Кньажеством в 833-ом роче. Безпрецедентне културальне розвойанье било наследком мисийи Свьатих Кирила и Методийа, кто прийдили при Принце Растиславе в 863-ом роче. Велика Моравска Империйа досьагнула най вишого розмера при Кроле Сватоплуке I-ом (871-894). Ослабена внутрьеними борбами, и частими войнами с Франкийской Империйой, Велика Морава била розбита Магйарскими нападниками в начале 10-ого сторочийа и йей остатки били розделени межу Кролеством Венгрийским, Бохемийой, Польской, и Свьатой Римской Империйой.

GS-Slovianski:

Velika Moravija bili slov'ansku imperija sus^zc^zestvovac^zu v seredininu Evropa medz^zu rok 833 i ranu rok-sto des'atu. Ogo glovnu teritorija lez^zali na vse dva strone prinadlez^zac^zu k reka Morava, v teperu Slovakija, C^zehija i Avstrija.

Imperija bili nac^zinanu, kogdi princ Mojmir po sila jedinili blizku Nitranski Kn'az^zestvo s svoj sobstvenu Moravsku Kn'az^zestvo v rok 833. Bezprimerovu kulturinu razvivan'e proistekali iz misija ot sv'atu Kiril i Metodij, ktoru prihodili podc^zas vladan'e ot princ Rostislav v rok 863. Velika Moravija dohodili teritoric^zku rozmer najvis^ze veliku pod krol' Svatopluk 1u (871-894). Slabu ot vu borbe i c^z'astou vojne protiv Franksku Imperija, Velika Moravija bili konc^zovuo rozbinu ot vengarsku vtorgnutel'i v ranu rok-sto des'atu i ogo kusoki poslednu bili vis^ze pozdnuo delinu medz^zu Vengarija, Bohemija, Polakija i Sv'as^ztena Rimska Imperija.

You can see an appearancely more advanced version on http://editthis.info/gazeta_slovian/Great_Moravia