2007-05-05, subotak.
V lecx-dom Italju groduf Castellaneta umirali 8 cxlovekis usled otravanie ot dva-azot-oksid, ili takzvanju vesel-gaz. Smertilju pacientis lezxili v otdel intensivju opekaf i vmest kislor polucxili dva-azot-oksid - ktor es usled svoi eufor-efektis normaluo upotrebitju dla anestezia.
5i maj 2007, subota - V bol'nica v italijanski grod Kastelaneta umreli osem czloveki rezul'tatem otrova na dva-azotni oksid, ili takzvani radostni gaz. Ubite pacijenti lez'ali v oddel od intensivno pomaganije i vmesto kislorod dostali dva-azotni oksid, ktori jest priczinoju svoje euforiczne efekti normal'no upotrebjani dl'a anestezija.
Yes, and that's the main problem I told you several times.
The word AZOT will be understood by the Polish, Serbs, Bulgarians, Macedonians and Russians and the rest of the Slavs will not understand this word.
Do you think the Czechs, Slovaks, Croatians and Slovenians will accept this word ?
How many such words are totally different from one group of Slavs to another group of Slavs ? They may be thousand of them. And that will be serious problem.
The best way is to adopt international word for such words e.g. NITROGEN
which is known by more slavs than AZOT or DUSIK that are not known in each slavic country. But "nitrogen" should be because it is taught at Primary schools as official name introduced in chemistry subject.
The word AZOT will be understood by the Polish, Serbs, Bulgarians, Macedonians and Russians and the rest of the Slavs will not understand this word.
Do you think the Czechs, Slovaks, Croatians and Slovenians will accept this word ?
Chauvinists won't accept the inter-Slavic langauge in any form anyway.
The best way is to adopt international word for such words
OK, find international words for "picture", "garden" or "table". This is not the way.
Picture, garden or table are not used internationally. So why looking for such words elsewhere outside the slavic world.
And that chauvinism pays for you as well. You keep also just what you consider it the best for you (not the others).
BTW. your "REZULTAT" is also non-slavic word (doesn't matter if it is used by some slavic langs. Finaly it is foreign word if you like or not.
And the same OXID and GAZ EUFORICZNI EFEKT and ANESTEZIJA are the typical examples of foreign words taken in some of slavic languages. But they are still FOREIGN WORDS.
So, when the foreign word occurs in e.g. russian, ukrainian or bulgarian langs, and even if we have in some slavic languages some slavic substitute for this foreign word, you better take that foreing from those languages. On the other hand if we such word in e.g. polish, slovak, czech or croatian langs, you simply refuse it.
Picture, garden or table are not used internationally. So why looking for such words elsewhere outside the slavic world.
Oh, and who will establish the exact border between internationally used and internationally not used words? My system of adopting words is immune of such dubious reasonings, it always adopts the word most common word used in Slavic languages, and the result would be 99% the same even if it was done by somebody else than me.
(By the way - what would the vocabulary of S-lingva look like if you were a Macedonian, a Pole or an Ukrainian?)
And that chauvinism pays for you as well. You keep also just what you consider it the best for you (not the others).
If it was true, I wouldn't bother about checking at least 9 Slavic dictionaries.
BTW. your "REZULTAT" is also non-slavic word
That depends on the definition of "Slavic". My definition of "Slavic" is "used and understood by Slavs", therefore rezul'tat is Slavic.
doesn't matter if it is used by some slavic langs. Finaly it is foreign word if you like or not.
And the same OXID and GAZ EUFORICZNI EFEKT and ANESTEZIJA are the typical examples of foreign words taken in some of slavic languages. But they are still FOREIGN WORDS.
It doesn't matter if it is a foreign word. Finally it is used and understood by the best possible majority of Slavs, however much you may like it or not.
So, when the foreign word occurs in e.g. russian, ukrainian or bulgarian langs, and even if we have in some slavic languages some slavic substitute for this foreign word, you better take that foreing from those languages.
I took the foreign-origin word in this particular case because it was more common.
On the other hand if we such word in e.g. polish, slovak, czech or croatian langs, you simply refuse it.
I refused it in this particular case because it was less common.
There are also some slavs that do not use the word "rezultat", so they do not understand this foreign word. The slavs use also the word "nitrogen" as well.
So this word should be slavic, too.
(the majority of Slavs - maybe all of them - use the word "nitrogenium" in their educational books of chemistry. And average educated slav that ends up the basic school learnt surely this word in school subject Chemistry.
... I will try to ask some my former classmates from the primary school whether they remember what the Latin name of dusik was, but I am quite sure most of them won't remember it....
Of course, the most of them won't know that but just those who didn't learn properly at school or went behind the schools.
(the majority of Slavs - maybe all of them - use the word "nitrogenium" in their educational books of chemistry. And average educated slav that ends up the basic school learnt surely this word in school subject Chemistry. Of course, the most of them won't know that but just those who didn't learn properly at school or went behind the schools.
The point is that east Slavs, Poles, Serbs, Bulgarian and Macedonians (259 million people, 4,5 votes) certainly remember what azot is, just as Czechs and Slovaks (17 million people, 1 vote) remember dusik and Croatians, Bosnians and Slovenians (10,5 million people, 0,5 votes) remember duszik. So the word azot will just satisfy the majority of Slavs.
The problem is that if you write word AZOT in some inter-slavic newspaper (providing some will be created in the future and providing that in your Slovianski language) an article will be understood just by Polish, Serbs, Bulgarians, Macedonians and Russians. The rest of the Slavs wouldn't understand what is it about unless you write its chemical form N2O).
But if you write AZOTNI OKSID they will know that is about some oxigen but woun't know what form. If you write just like NITROGENOVI OKSID the people who are involved in that topic or just educated at the basic level (finished the primary school) will know what it is about. And it concerns all the Slavs, not just those who have the word AZOT in their dictionaries.
The problem is that if you write word AZOT in some inter-slavic newspaper (providing some will be created in the future and providing that in your Slovianski language) an article will be understood just by Polish, Serbs, Bulgarians, Macedonians and Russians.
The problem is that if you write the word "len" in some inter-Slavic newspaper, the article will be understood by Slovaks only.
The difference is that azot was carefully chosen in order to be understood by the best possible majority, while "len" was not.
But if you write AZOTNI OKSID they will know that is about some oxigen but woun't know what form. If you write just like NITROGENOVI OKSID the people who are involved in that topic or just educated at the basic level (finished the primary school) will know what it is about. And it concerns all the Slavs, not just those who have the word AZOT in their dictionaries.
I make a language for a majority of people, and scientists are definitely not a majority. I will try to ask some my former classmates from the primary school whether they remember what the Latin name of dusik was, but I am quite sure most of them won't remember it. And for such people, i.e. for the majority, it won't be more difficult to check a Slovianski dictionary (in order to look up azot) than to check a Latin dictionary (in order to look up "nitrogen").
Osem pacijentov sercevogo oddela intensivnogo opekanija, bili v kislorodovih boksah, v ktore izza pogreszki bil dani protoksid azota, ubivszi vsih ih.
Italijanska prokuratura poczala rozsledovanije vipadka v juzsnom grode Castellaneta. "Kogda mi najdemo odpovednokov, oni budu surovo karane," kazal predstavitel italijanskoj sluzsbi ohroni zdrovija.
Sercevi oddel intensivnogo opekanija bil otvereni tolko dve sedmici, a aparati robotali tolko dva dnja. Pervo ogledenije govori cze personal splutal trubki od kislorodovih i azotovih balonov.
To bilo posledno iz seriji skandalov smertjami v italijanskih hospitalah v posledne nekolko let. Posledni iz nih je transplantacija HIV-inficovanih nerok nekolkim ljudam v Florence.
Of course, Czechs and Slovaks are Slavs, but not the only Slavs, therefore the text for a pan-Slavic audience should use the more common form, i.e. Florencija.
2007-05-06, posubotak.
Bez dokazis Espanju verhju sud zabranil kandidatie 246 politnikifs ibo sud podozrejt zxe oni es sviazilju s Baskju patriotis. Soglosuo s nezavisju sleditelis takai politju utisk tolk podstrekajt terorizm i napomnijt totalitju rezximis. Poskroz utiskenie Baskju naroduf i demokratiaf v Baskia, Espania polucxil nikai kritikenie ni ot inju krainis Europsoiuzuf ni ot USA. Podobju utiskenie Slavianifs v Madaria, Estonia i v inju pribaltju krainifs es podporitju ot USA, ot Europsoiuz i ot NATO. Esli nesxto podobju slucxil-bi v libkai Slaviansk krain, mi bil-bi neposreduo kritikitju i napaditju.
Slovakie ladohokejisti postupit do s'tirina final vo ladohokeje s'ampionat vo Moskva s vitazenie 4 : 3 nad ladohokejisti ov Belorusia.
Finale gol nasekuril zvezde "duo" Gaborik - Demitra do Belorusie brana.
Ja pozdrovjaju slovacke ledne hokejisti na ih vczeraszno vigranije nad czeski tim!
(Medz'u ino, jest moz'livo videt', czo ti nikogda ne konsultujesz slovniki - "lad" jest tol'ko slovacko slovo, vse ine slovjanske jaziki majut "lod" ili "led".)
2007-05-07, ponedelak.
Vo vcxeraju dvaju i koncju etap prezidentju izvolbaf vo Francia vigral konservatnik Nicolas Sarkozy polucxits 53 proc glosifs. Ucxast v izvolba bil rekordju ibo 85 proc izvolitelifs ucxastili izvolbaf. Posle oglosenie rezultuf v ulcas razllicxju Francju grodifs slucxili protestis. 52-rocxju Sarkozy bu inauguritju om 16-ju Mai.
I propose to all creating our articles our own way without each other criticising if this or that word is more or less slavic or if it is of slavic or foreign origins. I see that the way of mutual criticising leads to nowhere and none of us wants to respect or adopt the other's vocabulary and grammar.
So, the best way will be to publish one's own articles on this web site just as they are. If someone likes it or not. It's everybody's personal opinion if this or that word is better or not.
If somebody will not understand some of my words then I recommend him not to read it or just ask me what it means. Otherwise, we are going to quarrel about what is more or less appropriate, forever.
I will respect what you'll write and if I do not understand something I just ask about it.
Of course, many of us are stubborn and won't accept any conclusion of a discussion, no matter how obvious it may be. But these discussions at least keep the small chance that someone of us will wake up and start think rationally. If it hadn't been for such discussions, I would still spam this forum with my Slovianski-S, GS-Slovianski and other bullshit languages.
What does it mean - "think racionaly" ? Each of us thinks his thinking is rational and validly. The main problem is we have different points of view for certain criteria how would the common language look like.
Regarding to our previos discussions and proposals, I think, we cannot come to common conclusion. There are significan differences in our opinions.
And we are just a few of us. I cannot imagine if this language debate would be on wider levels in each slavic country where several millions people would be involved. It is unthinkable at this stage.
I am not sure if this efforf of making up the common lang would work on each slavic country level or just couple of slavic countries e.g. just common lang for czechs, slovaks and polish or croatians, czechs and slovenians or bulgarians, macedonians and serbs or russian, belorussian and ukrainians or whatever combination you like.
I think the very first think would be creating just local common lang such as the former Yugoslavs did it in the past (serbo-croatian lang) or probably polish-ukrainian one, etc. And then go on with unifying on a "higher level"
e.g. common plish-ukrainian (russian) lang with czech-slovakian-croatian-slovenian one, and so on.
We could later get just one common, out of all these partially created ones.
It's very difficult creating one common lang for more than 300 million people just by discussing 3-5-10 people on this web site. It can never happen that it would work this way we do it here and now. And that who thinks that it would, he is just an idealist or daydreamer. This, what we do now on this web site is just some "playing" to create something that we think could work but which of us has already asked the people they would agree with such principles we have been creating in our languages ? We are just a very small group of people who wish the rest of those millions of the Slavs would accept our languages. But it is just idealism and daydreaming. There is no conception of spreading some of our lang among those people, and even no willingness form political authorities in slavic countries to start teaching such a language in our schools. There are no newpapers, magazines, films, PC games, radio and TV broadcasting in such language and I firmly doubt that there will be any within several tens of years. Where there is no political and institutional will there is no outcome.
We all better try to simplify our natural and national languages first and then attempt to crate something for millions of people.
I told this everthing about some "common all-slavic language" to Mark Hucko in 2005 and nothing has changed since that time. Slovio is at the same level as it was since it was created. And the same fate will be with the rest of "all-slavic" languages, including all forms of Slovianskis and S-lingva as well.
There is not will there are no publicity, no conception of spreading of such language, no massmedia, no implementation into slavic schools, no rising up the number of people that would accept, speak and write in such language, absolutely no interes about such a language. None of them has such a base of followers that would represent some societies, clubs or associations of people devoting to such language. Nothing has been created so far for the last 7 years.
Esperanto or Ido or Interlingua and some more have got at least some dozens of real speakers and writer, some magazines, newspapers some meetings and their clubs but as far as I see there is nothing like with common "all slavic language". Just quarreling and arguing. And moreover we do not have even just one but several "all-slavic" ones.
If any of now existing so called "all-slavic" languages would reach the level just as it is with Ido or Interlingua, then it would be success. But our mutual discussion is just in digital form. Nothing has been published yet.
I sincerly hope that information about native speakers of Esperanto is a fraud. I can't imagine how cruel some parents can be, if they willingly make their children mental invalides with raising them in an artificially crippled language that is not supposed to be "thought in".
An auxlang is auxlang, and it naturally has limits of usage. E.g. I don't know any auxlang that could be used for fiction literature (fiction literature can't be written with their artificially reduced vocabulary), neither I saw a Pan-Slavic language that would be suitable for it.
Of course it's possible to create an all-purpose Pan-Slavic language, but the speakers of real languages would have to bear a very wide compromise, 'cause really universal Slavic elements wouldn't be enough for such language. Cosidering that most Pan-Slavists are nationalists who wouldn't be ready accept unique features of 'somebody else's' languages, I don't think it's possible. Such language most likely would be considered an artlang. (I can imagine that an adequate translation of Shakespeare can be made into Quenya; but in Esperanto -- never.)
7i maj 2007, ponedelok - V vczeraszna i koneczna etapa od prezidentske vibori v Francija vigral konservativec Nikola Sarkozi, ktori dostal 53 procenti glosi. Uczastvovanie v vibori bilo rekordno, za czo 85 procenti izbirateli uczastvovali vibori. Posle to, czo rezul'tati bili dane znat', protesti stali se v ulici od razliczne francuzske grodi. 52-godni Sarkozi bude inaugurovani v 16i maj.
2007-05-07, ponedelak.
Rosju ministr zagrancief, gospic Sergei Lavrov, obvinil Europsoiuz i NATO zxe ignorijut historia i dopuskijut bezuvazxenie i vismeh nad umiralju Sovietju voiakis. Lavrov tozx skazal zxe Rosia bu nigda zabut toi grodnikis ktor umirali v Dvaju Vsetju Voina v borba proti podkorenie i razgnetenie Rosiaf i Soviet-soiuzuf ot nacistju Germania. Podcxas Dvaju Vsetju Voina bili ubilju okol 45-milion Slavianis. Naibolsx zxertvas terpil Rosia, Ukrainia i Polakia.
If you are a real native speaker of Esperanto and your mind isn't cable to perceive anything else but the simplest ideas and binary contrasts (juna/maljuna, rika/malrika) you won't be able to learn any natural language. It would be like make an Orwellian Newspeak-speaker to read a poem of Emily Dickinson. (It's interesting to note that Esperanto shares most features with Newspeak.)
I learned three languages through exposure before puberty, therefore they are all my native languages.
My first language was Russian. My second language was Ukrainian, which is also my mother tongue (even though it's not my first language)
My third language was English, I am fluent in English and my pronunciation is very typical of a Californian. I don't have an accent at all.
