February 12 2009 at 5:30 PM No score for this post
"I" (Ionnes? Igor? Ivan?) wrote (in other thread):
"...for [the] majority of the Slavs ... don't accept any other slavic languages regardless [whether] those grammars are easy or difficult, natural or auxilliary. The common slavic people simply accept only their own mother tongues and unfortunatelly English, German, French, Spanish, ....
Once again I repeat - it's not the matter of the fact if the Slavic people accept natural, auxilliary, difficult or easy - grammar langs but if they are willing accept any other language at all. The simpliest way for them is to speak in their mother tongues or if they are made by situation then English but at the moment they will not accept any of other languages at all.
This is nowaday's reality.
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Steeven here...
Very interesting comment from "I".
And it seems to me to be valid.
I do not believe, however, that Slavs' "non-acceptance" of using another Slavic Language _ even a "ConLang" _ as a medium for better communication, is intentional. It just "is."
I do believe that the success of a ConLang will come from the non-Slavic speaker - and I give you an example with which I am working every day.
The company I work for - based in the United States - is doing business (right now) with people in Croatia and Serbia and Czech Republic. I am the only Slavic speaker in the company. Many of the European people do not speak or write English very well, so, for the last several months "we" have been using Slovio as the medium of alternate communication.
This has worked well for my non-Slavic speaking co-workers; but the Slavic-speakers want to communicate in a SLovio that is "more Slavic" - and so they "add" their own declensions and conjugations to Slovio words. This baffles my co-workers, who do not understand declensions and conjugations - especially when there are no "prepositions."
We have recently been experimenting with an AUX-LANG suggested by Michal Borovicka from the Slavic-Unity besed. The Slavic speakers initially did not want to use it; or wanted to change it. However, they have become now very agreeable to its structure.
I have instructed my co-workers on how it works and they understand it (or are getting "better" at it).
In short, my non-Slavic speaking co-workers are very willing to adopt Slovio - in order to better communicate with their counterparts in Slavia - BUT, we've had to "enhance" Slovio so that the Slavians would better accept SLOVIO. The "trial" is still on. And things change weekly (we modified as past particple suffix from "-mju, -mij, -mja" to "-nju, -nij, -nja, -njo, -nje" etc. because Slavic speakers did not want to use "m").
I would like to present - or have Michal Borovicka present - this aux-lang to you - which is based upon SLOVIO + ROZUMIO + SLOVIANSKI + SLOVIENSK - to you, if you are interested?
Please let me know if you are interested? ...by emailing me:
steeven@inbox.com or steevenusx@yahoo.com
I am not "here" as a mere diletante experimenting with ConLangs and AuxLangs. I am actually USING a Slavic AUXLANG - with 33 other people in my company - to communicate from ENGLISH TO PAN-SLAVIC and vice-versa.
I would very much appreciate your reviews, comments and suggestions.
So, the simple grammar was too complicated for them?
How willingly they participated? Were they aware about the experiment?
Most people I know would not be able to participate in any linguistic experiments -- it's just too difficult to... uhm, be conscious about grammatic nature of what they speak.
Steeven, stop torturing people. You should not enforce on them any words or rules, you should passively observe and take notice what kind of pidgin they'll develop -- most likely something heavily influenced by English.
Thank you for your positive support.
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My/our efforts have been to create a medium of successful communication exchange between several peoples. Hopefully, this will result in a better life for everyone.
I want to express my special thanks to MARK HUCKO for his wonderful contribution to the effort of establishing greater understanding and peace among people.
That his efforts have in turn spawned your enthusiasm to create ROZUMIO and the other good efforts for SLOVIANSKI, SLOVIENSK itd, are even more reason to commend MARK.
BLAGODARIJM TE MARK HUCKO!
I also applaud the efforts of GABRIEL SVOBODA, JAN van STEENBERGEN, ONDREJ RECNIK, IOANNES, IOPQ (IGOR?) and everyone else who I don't "know" who has endeavored to expand upon MARK HUCKO's genius.
While some may regard each of your "auxlangers" efforts as adversarial, I really see them as gifts from your HEARTS to achieve a common Unity. Thank you GENTLE MEN.
I again voprosit:
"Who among you would be interested in reviewing and assisting MICHAL BOROVICKA in his latest endeavor? ... called "SLOVIOSKI"
(again, with all due respect to MARK HUCKO...this is an aux-lang intended to complement SLOVIO - and by doing so, to "bring in" Slavic speakers who have otherwise not been attracted to Slovio).
My email address is: steeven@inbox.com
Or perhaps we should just post the "PROPOSAL" here? ...DA? .....NE?
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I conclude this writing by quoting HELLERICK's September 2006 answers to the question:
Why learn Slovio?
1. Slovio is an opener (starting-tool) for non-Slavs who want / or have to learn one or more Slavic languages
2. Slovio is a gift for expatriated Slavs who live for long even for generations especially in Romance and Germanic speaking countries. And who, after looking at declination tables of any Slavic languages, give it up to be perfect in their own mother tongue.
3. Slovio is great to be used in foreign countries where Slavs of different nations meet each other.
4. I use Slovio to contact different Slavic organisations. And they do understand me.
5. In Slavic forums like here I have almost no problem to communicate using Slovio.
6. i tak dalej
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After couple of years I realised that all our projects (Slovio, Slovianski and my one - Sloviensk) are useless. The majority of the Slavic peoples will not learn any of these languages either they are too lazy, or they do not consider these language perspective for future.
Lately, I found out that the only way for all us - Slavs (regardless it will be difficult for foreigners or not, is to make a big list of different words that are in every natural slavic language and creat some common vocabulary just from these different words. As we all know there are a lot of words in every slavic lang that are already common or very similar so we don't have to do naything with them.
As for the Slavic grammars - I propose all the slavic natural grammars to be used as they are in our originals.
The language will be free and every slavic nation can use its own grammar and our already common vocabulary but those words that are different, shouldn't be used any more and just those that will be chosen as our common.
By this, the language can be used immediately, without learning any grammar and vocabulary just that one which is different, although evern this will be unified into general understandable for all.
No other way exist for now because otherwise any auxilliary (all-slavic) langauge will be at that positions which Esperanto has now - the language just for couple of hundreds, around the world scattered people with no practical usage.
Steeven, we have to, first, be aware of one important thing : DO WE NEED THAT LANGUAGE FOR US (SLAVS) OR FOR FOREIGNERS (without any knowledge of any of the Slavic languages) ?
If this language is to be for us then we don't need any auxillirary grammar or other than majority of our vocabulary. What we need and what make our slavic mother tongues somehow mustual less intelligible is to : UNIFY OUR DIFFERENT WORDS that already exist in our mother tongues.
If you make an experiment with some article that would be translated into all the Slavic langauges and then replace these "mutual strange words like : Z'RALOK, AKULA, REKIN,.... - that means shark in slovak/czech, russian, polish languages with some common words that would be the same in every slavic lang, you'll see that we basicallly don't need any auxilliary language, just unifying different words and that's all.
You'll find out that with keeping of our mother tongue grammars and unified vocabulary we are able to understand everything from that article.
As for the Slavic grammars - I propose all the slavic natural grammars to be used as they are in our originals.
The language will be free and every slavic nation can use its own grammar and our already common vocabulary but those words that are different, shouldn't be used any more and just those that will be chosen as our common.
By this, the language can be used immediately, without learning any grammar and vocabulary just that one which is different, although evern this will be unified into general understandable for all.
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That is an excellent idea -- in concept.
We tried something like this several months ago - before I "discovered" SLOVIO - in order to foster better and direct communication between our Czech and Yugoslav speakers. It was a disaster. Aside from the very basic words in each language (prounouns, helper verbs - was, is), the grammars between the languages - while seemingly alike/similar - were nonetheless obstacles; and they simply stopped communicating - returning to English (on top of this, was the fact that the English-only-speakers were totally left out of picture - having to try to understand two different schematics of irregular declensions and conjugations). It was a disaster.
SLOVIO has been the best solution. The modest additions we have recently made by merging "BOROVICKA's ENHANCEMENTS" to the formula, has thus far greatly improved the European-side of acceptance and, more importantly, PREFERRED USE of SLOVIO.
We have downloaded the SLOVIO dictionary onto our servers to create a separate, accessible library of words created by our collective group of "colleagues" that have come up just within our own "operations."
We still run into problems with "native" words being used over Slovio words - which are problems only because the person in Prague cannot understand the Yugoslav word (& vice versa) - and, of course, our English-speakers don't have any clue whatsoever.
Ah. Such sweet torture.
(Hellerick??? Hellerick??? Where fore art thou, Hellerick??)
Steeven, but I cannot believe that if using the same words but with different slavic grammars (even Czech or e.g. Slovenian or Serbian or Bulgarian) that the text is ununderstandable for us.
If the Czech would read e.g. Slovenian text in slovenian grammar but with equal vocabulary, then he/she should understand the whole text and vice versa.
(of course, they will not if the texts are using a lot of different words).
Steeven, I don't deny any auxilliary language but have a look at the present day situation among people. I am sure that if you "invented" any super auxilliary language, the people will not accept it.
As I wrote before, the only way is to be done now - create just common (unified) slavic words that are each other different (nothing else).
I thank so you very much for you thoughts and ideas.
In response to your comments, I offer the following:
1. This endeavor is still in experimental form (i.e. the "Slovio-Slovioski" communication between and among the English-only-speakers and Slavic-only-speakers).
2. It has become (surprisingly) a very enjoyable exercise among all parties. My co-workers are actually enthusiastic about learning a "new language" and getting paid during the process. The same thing is true for our Slavic-speaking colleagues.
3. The nature of the use of SLOVIO and SLOVIOSKI is (right now) strictly in EMAIL. No one is writing letters; and no one is communicating via SKYPE in SLOVIO (I do speak via SKYPE with my Praha colleagues - the only challenge there is that they must usually speak in a combination of English+ Czech, because I have diffculty understanding their spoken Czech (I can 90% understand their written Czech); while I can speak to them in Polish and they understand about 90% of what I say (actually, I have now been using a combination of Polish and Slovio, when I speak to them).
I have not been successful in speaking with my Yugoslav colleagues in anything but English. Yugoslav is so different from Polish and Russian. While my involvement in the various Slavic forums has helped, a full sentence in Croatian/Serbia is impossible for me right now. So on phone or in Skype I speak with their 2 reasonably fluent English speaker or thier 1 Russian speaker. I have encouraged everybody to join the discussions in this and the other Slavic forums (but I don't know if anyone has).
4. The English-speakers write in SLOVIO + some SLOVIOSKI (it is still difficult for the English-speakers to understand the Slavic Declensions (in English it only exists in pronouns and even those are disappearing in daily speech). Word order is critical for the English speakers. They become especially confused when the word order is not SUBJECT VERB OBJECT. So the Slavic-speakers try to keep this word order.
5. The Slavic-speakers are now writing in SLOVIOSKI - trying to use the S-V-O format when emailing to the English-speakers - but natural Slavic order when between and among themselves (Czech & Yugoslav).
Surprisingly, the Serbs have no issue with the Latin alphabet (I thought they would).
6. None [not one] of us writes in Cyrillic. This is probably because everyone's computer keyboard is in the Latin alphabet, and to switch over to Cyrillic is very challenging for the non-Cyrillic users (I myself have a separate Cyrillic computer, with an actual Cyrillic keyboard, but I rarely use this anymore, because we are not doing business (yet) in Russia. This may change soon).
Will we succeed?
I do not know.
I know that this experiment will show us "what works and what does not work."
That all of these different-language speaking people seemingly enjoy this experiment, is a good harbinger (vystava, herold, prevectnik, nagovjestiti, hlasatel).
Of course, we may fail; but so far, everyone is open-minded and excited.
At the same time, I would very much appreciate the expertise of the members of this forum - hopefully with an open mind & "good spirit" - to offer their respective comments and suggestions.
Steeven, if you do your words unified, you don't have to use any other language.
You and Polish/Czechs don't understand the former Yugoslavs because there are more different words than among e.g. Czechs,Slovaks and Polish. Although the Slovaks understand more Polish than e.g. Czechs and vice versa.
There's no need to make some auxilliary grammar among the slavic languages, just those to unify those different words.
On the other hand you have to choose what any auxilliary language should serve for. Is it for understanding between e.g. English/Americans and the Slavs or just among the Slavs themselves.
If you need E/A should understand the Slavs then you really need some simple-grammar auxilliary language to create. Or to make E/A learn that difficult slavic grammar structure.
I am fully agree with these words, Ioan! If the dictionary is maximum commmon and understandable, then you can use your own grammar and still be understood. Ofcourse, there are some nuances in each languages, but generally Slavic grammars are very close to each other.
I don't agree that the Slovio dictionary is that great. If I did, I wouldn't be writing a new Slovianski dictionary. The Slovio dictionary is a lot of different Slavic words chosen at random. So it looks like they were carefully chosen, but they were not.
is great becasue have 50000 words and what have slovianski ? 2000 words or some more ?
we cant wait for several years , until u all who made slovianski done entire dictionary
maybe is not 100% good , but majority of slavs understand
All what we do with our auxilliary pan-slavic languages are just playing on the playground.
We all must be conscious that none of our auxilliary pan-slavic languages will be accepted even minority of the slavic population (and I am not telling about majority).
All our effort with all our pan-slavic languages is just in the level of lingvistic enthusiasm - not practical usage.
After all, why do the Slavs need any auxilliary language ? Is it for themselves or for foreigners ?
If it's for themselves then they don't need any other language than they've already got in the form of their natural slavic mother tongues (just to "adjust" some different words and it works).
If it is for foreigners then I don't assume that at conferences, international debates, summits or business meetings will be such language used. First, the westerners must see that such language is usefull and working in every-day usage. Then the foreigners must see that such language is used in every slavic country, in every slavic television, radio, magazines, newspapers, schools, institutions, offices, by politicians, police, emergency units, courts, et cetera.
Then, the foreigners will recognise that such language is in fact usefull and worth to learn for communication in the Slavic countries.
Otherwise, they will go on with English in these countries as it is now.
Germans, Americans, Spanish, Japanese, Chinese, Arabs don't need any auxilliary pan-slavic language unless it is widely used and really practised everywhere in the Slavic countries regardless it has very easy, or difficult grammar, 500, 5000, 50 000 or 500 000 words in its vocabulary.
The question is if such language would ever be accepted by all. Not only majority but just minority of now population in these countries is not so mentally and slavic-patriotically developed that they would accept such inter-slavic language. Just have a look around you (if you live in any slavic country) and you'll see that not even officials, political representatives, any institution but also common people do not agree with such project.
I am not writing this because I am against any pan-slavic auxilliary language but because this language project is lost for now. And the future will show if anything is changed but as I see it I will not live so long that I would see this change in thinking of the people (and I am sure that neither of you will as well).
And the same or probably even bigger problem has got Esperanto that is practically useless.
You can use Esperanto ONLY with esperantists NOWHERE ELSE. Yes, you can watch some films, read some books, some magazines but it's only very very limited horizon of usage comparing (unfortunatelly) with English, German, French, etc.
While that language doesn't have world-wide or slavic-wide practical demand there is no need for people to leant it.
I actually dreamed about "this/these" AUX-LANGS last night! Moja svadzxena mne skazala zxe gvorivalem/gvorivalijm poki spativalcij.
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- Slovioski:
spatit - to sleep
spativat - to be sleeping
spativacij - (masc) be sleeping, am sleeping, is sleeping
spativalcij - was sleeping (masc) ili bil spativacij
- Slovio Style
spativaltsju
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IOPQ: You write that you "...don't agree that the Slovio dictionary is that great. If [you] did, [you] wouldn't be writing a new Slovianski dictionary. The Slovio dictionary is a lot of different Slavic words chosen at random. So it looks like they were carefully chosen, but they were not."
Comment: It is important FOR YOU that "the dictionary" contain carefully chosen, Slavic-based words. This is very obvious in the excellent work I see you and your colleagues conduct in the Slovianski forum.
The French Academy (L'Academie francaise) has since 1635 attempted to dictate official French so that random words -- and, God-forbid -- les mots etrangers/foreign words - do not infect (zxuk-polnit!) "la francaise sacree"/the holy French. Obviously, they have failed miserablement (si l'on sait la francaise parlee/ if you know spoken French).
I agree s mojem drugem MICHAL that "the Slovio dictionary is great". And, "No," we are not in hurry for you to expand your Slovianski dictionary; but at the same time, like the French Academy, the "vox populi" - the ludi/ludji" cannot wait for the Slovianski Dictionary.
To boot, as you surely know, SLOVIO is not about the purity of the Slavic language; indeed, no Slavic language follows that "rule." Just look at how many English, French, Latin, itd words and phrases have entered into the main stream of every Slavic language.
The first "rule" of SLOVIO is that "All Slovio words don't have to be of Slavic origin, but they must be the most widely understood words among Slavic-speakers."
Thus, even though I personally am not thrilled about the "Slovio" word "plus" or "negativ," I will use them if they will convey the message.
The success of Slovio will come from foreigners and by sheer dint of its persistent use in commerce. The main medium will be, IMHO, "email." That is how my co-workers are using it, as are their counterparts in Praha and Zagreb and Belgrad - both E/A and S/S (English/American & Slav/Slav).
I think SLOVIANSKI - N is outstanding! Will it become popular with "the people / s ludjami?"
You know that answer.
Will Slovio become popular with "the people / s ludjami?"
I know that it has become popular with my co-workers - 98% of whom do not know any language other than American (and even then, they do not know how to spell properly "there" "their" and "they're"!).
HOWEVER, they most certainly understand "plus" and "cigarit" and "bez-problemju".
So the question is, "Do you want to be on the bus?"
From all I have read, you have chosen to be among the 40 Immortals who steadfastly will remain loyal and true to "the cause" - "la raza." That is virtuous in a world where virtue is transient. And I commend you.
But the bus will not wait. It must go to its next busstop and pick up the people who wish to board it.
"You say that Slavic languages don't follow rules. However, they DO."
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I am sorry. Perhaps I was not clear in my statement.
When I wrote that "Slavic languages don't follow the rules" - I intended to mean that "Slavic languages do not always follow the rule of using Slavic words exclusively in their spoken and written language."
NP: web, internet, TV, weekend
With the overwhelming influence of western european and american television, music, etc., no one nation or language is immune from being "zxukplonilnij by these.
The first "rule" of SLOVIO is that "All Slovio words don't have to be of Slavic origin, but they must be the most widely understood words among Slavic-speakers."
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Yes, they must! But I keep on telling you they don't do right now. How many times have I asked you to explain me a word? Many words are not widely understood among Slavic-speakers. Igor's examples are also of this case. No logic! For example, I am Russian and I know words like boroda, holod, zoloto, korova, OK. But I may learn a simple rule, that when Russian has -oro- our Sl**** auxlang has, for example, -ro- and then I easily understand what krol, ogrod, vron is! If I know that when I write "e" in Russian I write "e" in our Sl**** also, "e", than words veter, deva are absolutely clear for me. Looking at Slovio "vitr", "diev", I personally can remember what I've read about Ukrainian and Polish languages and recognize it, and what if I hadn't read? I can live, OK, if following etymological "yat" our Sl**** writes "vieter, dieva, miesto", I learn it and no problem then! But when it's a mess, it becomes very difficult. I must remember that dievju is an exception. I had no idea what "rodzin" means untill I read that Polish dzi is equivalent to our "di"! And words like "naemenie" leave me wondering, what it is?? Is it widely understood?? I doubt...
So, my proposal. We need to work on the dictionary! We can use what we have, but the work must be continued. We must make corrections to the dictionary.
But I fear that our dear Slovioists won't do anything. Unfortunately, what is temporary - is forever. As Russians say, pospeshish - ljudej nasmeshish.
Rekreacja:
In Polish = odpoczynek - spoczynek.
In Staropolski = Pocziwanie.
Jugoslav languages, rekreacja = poczivat (or some similar form, if i remember well)
Rekreacja, is one of international words accepted in all slavic languages.
"...you can see that each language has an INTERNAL LOGIC that Slovio lacks."
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I agree with you.
And, in "Slovioski" the writer/speaker is absolutely free to choose what he or she wishes to use for his or her word.
Thus, I may tend to choose to use the more "Slavic" of style:
zxena instead of zxen
moj instead of moi
pocxemu (sometimes) instead of pocx
tolko (sometimes) instead of tolk
I hate apostrophs and I do not care if the palitization is depicted or not, or whether there may be confusion between HONEY and COPPER. Ultimately, "they" will figure it out, or I will be receiving a shipment of SERBIAN COPPER instead of HONEY (a true bargain for the price!!)
Similarly, one may choose to use:
broda-strona, br'eg-pr'erva, zloto-hlodny
or
boroda-storona, bereg-pereryv, zoloto-holodny
or
(my choice)
broda-strona, zlota-holodnij
BUT, if the person with whom I am communicating better understands "moi" and "zlato" - then I will probably stick with the SLOVIO DICTIONARY version.
The early bird gets the worm.
Is that "pure"? Negativ
In the end, it will still be whatever prevails. And that may be NOTHING in Ioan's world (as far as ConLangs and AuxLangs go).
Moraczewski,
I am sorry. I did not see your posting. Apparently, this forum is designed so that when one "CLICKS" on "RESPOND TO THIS MESSAGE" - that message response is posted NOT at the bottom, but directly under the original message. So I miss.
I am referring to your message which ended:
"But I fear that our dear Slovioists won't do anything. Unfortunately, what is temporary - is forever. As Russians say, pospeshish - ljudej nasmeshish."
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Good comments in your message.
Unfortunately, it is late morning here in Far Western Slavija (11:30 AM). Today is Valentine's Day, and I promise my wife we go to cinema, ITD. So, being the good husband, and absolutely in love with my wife, I pass you and this forum up until some time later.
I introduced some my friends to Slovio and Slovianski, and they had problems to analyse and find out that broda, brada and boroda are the same word! I tried to tell something about Proto-Slavic *tort/*tolt, but they become fed up with linguistics soon. If there is any rule set, for example, Russian -oro- becomes -ro-, my friends who are not interested in linguistics at least can learn it (as do those who are learning Polish (broda) or Czech or Serbian (brada)), and so can I use this rule - I don't want to look to the dictionary everytime I want to write a word!
It gets worse for non-Slavs! How can they guess that korol and kral is the same word? How can you imagine if one user prefers "kral" and other "korol" - how will an American, a German who doesn't know any Slavic language recognize the word he has learned from Slovio dictionary?
And in the end nothing will prevail, I'm sure, because following your idea, Serb will keep on writing "zlato", "brada" and Russian "zoloto", "boroda" and they will never find a compromise!
And words like "rodzin" will ALWAYS be misspelled by majority of Slavic users and they will confuse non-Slavs (and some Slavs also), who don't know that in Polish language "dzi" is etymologically equivalent to "di"! Sorry that I repeat myself, but some men here still seem to be dug up and don't realise the things.
Moraczewski pisal:
...It gets worse for non-Slavs! How can they guess that korol and kral is the same word? How can you imagine if one user prefers "kral" and other "korol" - how will an American, a German who doesn't know any Slavic language recognize the word he has learned from Slovio dictionary? ...
===
Very easy:
1. Krol, kral, korol > kr:l, kr:l, k:r:l = Karl (Karl der Große = Charles the Great)
2. Broda, boroda, brada > br:d:, b:r:d:, br:d: = beard
3. mloko, .... = milk itd..
Very easy:
1. Krol, kral, korol > kr:l, kr:l, k:r:l = Karl (Karl der Große = Charles the Great)
2. Broda, boroda, brada > br:d:, b:r:d:, br:d: = beard
3. mloko, .... = milk itd..
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Only when the user is able to think that way. This comes only after some excercises, when the user knows what to search in his erudition. People who are not familiar with linguistics and have no knowledge of etymological processes, they won't guess. They can easily get wrong association. Anyway they will be confused, why there is some ambigity in spelling.
I think we should just make some good dictionaries which translate words from one slavic to another slavic language. This way everyone could write in their own language, and if someone doesn`t understand some word he can just look at the dictionary. The only thing we should all laern is prepositions and some adverbs.Non-slavs should, ofcourse learn Slovio.
Da li neko ovde razume ove poslovice na Srpskom?
Triput meri, jednom seci!
Ko rano rani dve srec(tj)e grabi.
Ko je lud ne budi mu drug!
Ako razumete, onda znac(cx)i da je moj predlog na mestu.(na mestu=uredu=ispravan)
You probabli don`t know that in Serbian LUD means crazy, and not human like in Slovio, but you could look for that in a dictionary if we had dictiories on the net.
"Ko rano rani dve srec(tj)e grabi."- Czy to znaczy? Kto rano wstaje dwa serca kradnie? W Polsce to jest albo " Kto rano wstaje , temu Pan Bog daje", lub "Kto pierwszy, ten lepszy"
Pozostale rozumiem, ale brak mi w nich logiki, a moze zle rozumiem ? Dla mnie to jest tak:
"Ko je lud ne budi mu drug!" Nie badz przyjacielem szalenca ?
"Triput meri, jednom seci!" trzy srodki, jedna setka ?
"Tri puta meri, jednom (puta) seci". Put' = times, like in "tri times". Three times mesure, (to) cut (but) one time.
Trzy razy mierza, jeden raz tnij (w satropolskim bylo uzywane siec. Do teraz slowo siekanka, znaczy ciete (dobno) mieso lub cos podobnego.
Seco = siec in Polish. But i must admit, it is not anymore very comonly used word in Polish, nowdays. Normally it is used in the meanings like: siec trawe, lub z'a'c trawe, a,s.
I don`t get it, what`s the point with everyone being Polish around here? Was Hucko, maybe, Polish? Even if he was, that still doesn`t explain why most of the people who write on this forum are Polish.
I don`t get it, what`s the point with everyone being Polish around here? Was Hucko, maybe, Polish? Even if he was, that still doesn`t explain why most of the people who write on this forum are Polish.
Unique, is it not?
And angry ones no less - with strange agendas for which the only thing they have "in common" are that they are "unproductive" agendas - they are TOXIC.
So much effort is made to make others (or their ideas) "wrong" or "stupid".
The big surprise, however, is the long time poster here who turns out to be a closeted, ex-Polish-patriot communist who hates the west (but lives in the west).
Waste of time
The big surprise, however, is the long time poster here who turns out to be a closeted, ex-Polish-patriot communist who hates the west (but lives in the west).
You are right, I wrote the same about it some time ago.
