arbiter17 (Login arbiter17) from IP address 75.128.151.105
After having read a number of posts over a period of time concerning erratic accuracy with RWS/Diana rifles,I thought I would post this as general information that hopefully may help new shooters.
1.New spring piston air rifles can take up to a THOUSAND rounds down the spout before the powerplant(piston seal)breaks in and the gun produces consistent velocities.Inconsistent velocities can result in vertical shot strings for obvious reasons.
2.Trigger control and follow through are critical to consistent accuracy.These guns,once sighted in,will strike the target precisely where the sighting equipment is aligned when the trigger releases the piston.At this point,everything in the compression/firing cycle occurs so fast that their is insufficient time to cause the round to change alignment.
3.Fatigue and concentration.Spring guns are fairly heavy,awkward things to maintain in a shouldered,still position for any period of time.Becoming physically and/or mentally fatigued can occur relatively quickly in a shooting session even if you are in good physical condition.This will affect trigger control and release.
4.Barrel must be free of lubricants.Any lubricants introduced into the barrel will change shot speed until burned off via the heat of air compession in the shot cycle.Cleaning the barrel frequently can cause accuracy headaches.For the same reason,do not lubricate pellets for use in spring powered airguns with anything that can combust.I use dry pellets straight from the tin-no washing,no additional lubrication.
5.Learn to shoot with open sights.Scope shift caused by poor or loose mounts,or scopes with internal damage that is not apparent will frustrate your attempts to shoot well.Learn to shoot your rifle with open iron sights during the break in period(1000 rounds).Use this time to perfect your shooting skills(including learning to recognize when #3 above takes place).After the gun is broken in is the time to consider mounting optical sights.
6.Make sure stock and sighting equipment screws are tight.Don't "reef" on them till they strip,just be certain they are tight.
7.In my experience,the fault lies with the shooter about 95% of the time.These guns are well made,accurate devices.There are issues with the device that can cause problems,but when I miss,it's nearly always because of ME.
Consistency,practice and awareness are three major keys to shooting well.Hope this helps.
Wow, what a great post! I personally agree with everything that you said and those have been my personal methods with a new rifle from day one. I currently own a model 54 that I shot almost 2 boxes of CP's through before I mounted the new Leaper's droop mount and my scope. This definitely let the rifle break in first as I got use to the feel and weight of the rifle and the semi-recoiless mechanism. (I say semi-recoiless because anyone who has shot even a tuned 54 compared to a pcp knows that you still feel jolt and slight recoil with this rifle, the mechanism removes approximately 60% of the recoil).
I was mistaken in the original post.It's more like 98% the fault of the shooter when the shooter misses.Being able and willing to identify the cause of the problem and then admit to it is also key to good shooting.
I for one, have pretty much done everthing you included in your post. Over 2000 rounds, shoot when rested, trigger control (pretty much needs a monk to master this trigger), no excessive cleaning, etc, etc.
Tonight, I laid my 48 to rest at the deep end of my pool. 9 feet down until the cover comes off next spring. May she rest in peace.
Good Luck to all the rest of you who continue to struggle with accuracy issues with Diana rifles. I will no longer be amongst you, but will keep you in my prayers!!
you rushed that air gun and blamed the trigger and I am here to tell you there is nothing WRONG with the trigger, the only thing wrong was your impatience
we gave you all the possible advice to help you but you must understand we cannot solve your problems until you eliminate all possible conditions that made that air gun shoot like that in your hands. a trigger does not make that air gun perform like that it had to something else, which you overlooked
I hope this is a bad joke about resting the 48 in the bottom of 9 feet of water because there will NOT be a next time to shoot that air gun accurate in the next 100 years
now go and retrive that air gun!!
warren
PS: and sleep over it tonight
and remember "it's 30% the gun and 70% the shooter"
Primarily because rust stains on the pool bottom are a pain in the rumpus!!
Just another round of scope mount issues. No warning - just went crazy all of a sudden.
As for patience - Its been the better part of a year since I bought this gun. STILL trying to get it to shoot reliably and accurately. I assure all of you that I appreaciate your input and have considered/tried everything that's been suggested.
The trigger does stink in my humble opinion. Humble is not a stong enough word. Trying to shoot this gun has brought me to my knees.
If you believe the problem lies with the trigger , do your self a favor and send it to John in PA. He worked his magic on my 350 pro compact trigger and man I got to tell ya WOW!!! Smooth isn't the word for it , a real nice first stage then a little resistance and pow. I no longer pull off the target.John received my trigger on Tues & by Weds it was back in rout to me. It feels like a completely different gun now.This was the first time I sent something out I do all my own work, and now I'm thinking of sending the hole gun because if he can do this good on a trigger I cant imagine what he can do to a hole gun. Just my .02
what the heck is that large flat screw on he back end of the diana scope rails for? it is inadequate as a scope stop. is it for a reciever sight? it seems to be on all the dianas.
"THANKS, AND ANOTHER QUESTION September 20 2008, 9:06 AM
what the heck is that large flat screw on he back end of the diana scope rails for? it is inadequate as a scope stop. is it for a reciever sight? it seems to be on all the dianas "
Yup for differant sights, DO NOT USE as a scope stop it will sheer off.
Phil
Seems redundant to sink another $200+ tuning a new gun that should never have left the factory in the first place.No such BS with my Wiehrauch 80K/.22 smooth and consistant from day one.Straight up $500 and go shoot with a proper scope rail to boot!I like the RWS guns but not having to pay double the original cost to get them to shoot.I restored a 40 year old Hungarian .177 rifle and it never let me down or was HOLD SENSITIVE from day one.Pointed were it shot.................New spring and soaked old leather seal in Neat's Foot Oil and better than new.Total cost about $15...Harold
I'm just venting a little frustration I've been having with a RWS 34 reguarding a harsh factory spring and barrel droop so bad iron sights fall off and it's still hitting 2 feet low.Damned if I'm going to bend my barrel to get it to shoot.I have the new Leaper's on it but accuracy sucks and it is so harsh it shakes the screws out of the gun every 25 shots or so.Now that I'm in for a penny in for a pound I guess .Will have to either get a Maccari spring kit or dump it and get Weihrauch 50[R-9]Beeman.PS that 40 year old childhood Hungarian air rifle I just rebuilt has never failed once total cost new $25...........Diana/RWS needs a custom shop where guns arn't sold unless they are right and dump the rest to China they can make SKS's out of them along with melted railroad track..............
FWIW - I bought a used 52 this spring. I've done some stuff to it (maccari spring) and originally got an inexpensive scope (BSA 3-12 at Sportsman's Warehouse) and cheap mount. I've since replaced the mount with a good Beeman mount and I now know the scope is absolutely rock solid. I'm new to this - hadn't shot any type of gun for 40+ years until this spring. Basically - it took me about four months to figure out how to hold the gun when I shoot it so that it performs quite consistently. I still think I have a breech seal problem since it's shooting about 80 fps less than when I got it - but it shoots consistently when I do my part. Plan to look at the breech seal this week. I've heard lots of reports about these guys busting cheap scopes, but the BSA is still holding in there. I did quite well at our FT match yesterday.
Also FWIW - I realized about two weeks ago that when in FT position I really have to wiggle my feet and legs around until I'm pointed directly at the target without muscle tension. If it takes anything to hold it there then the recoil will definitely pull me off in unrepeatable directions. After I do the breeck seal, I plan to check bench shooting again - last time I looked I was shooting better groups from FT position than the bench.
Héctor J Medina G (Login HectorMedina) 189.164.97.30
That's called the "natural position"
September 22 2008, 6:07 PM
and it is most definitely an important aspect in ANY kind of shooting. The more challenging the shooting is, the more important acquiring the "natural position" is.
I close my eyes and get comfy, then open them and see where I am pointing at.
Then correct accordingly till I am pointed straight at the target.
Then I take the shot.
I try to get into the "Natural Position" from the start, and getting up and down, up and down, up and down . . . helps in getting to know which is your "Natural Position".
Do take the time to learn this, as it is of paramount importance.
right now i am just getting used to the gun. i am shooting in my private office at a range of about 15 feet. first. the gun has a balance point. mine is near the checkering just forward of the trigger guard. violate the balance point and shots string vertically. i lay the forarm in the cradle of my upturned palm at a nuetral balance point. side pressure from either side results in horiszontal stringing. my hold is very relaxed and not hard into
my shoulder.
i take the slack out of the tigger and watch that front sight as i tighten down on the trigger. i want the shot to surprise me so i don't flinch (or i flinch after the pellet is gone.)
my breathing is critical. even though i am very fit for a 63 year old (48 resting heart rate) and i do a lot of aerobic cycling i have to watch my breath control. i sometimes back off the trigger if i feel like i am holding my breath too long. it is also important not to try to hold a full lung. i find a deep breath or two and then an outward breath through pursed lips relaxes me and steadies my hold. i want no tension anywhere including my diaphram.
my groups are improving quite rapidly but even at this short distance it is easy to pull a flyer. this is a body control issue i think. there is a certain
zen like quality to the shooting process. we want it to become second nature without engaging too much mind. (remember the admonition of Tom Cruiz's instructor in "the last samari" he said "no mind". in other words don't think it to death. practive is very important and an imediate feedback loop helps you
to pinpoint your errors. dry firing is ok( not good for our guns though) but nothing teaches faster than actual pellets hitting a target.
i changed out my front sight and replaced it with a whole new fromt piece with a globe and a skinny post with a little ball on top. this is a very nice sight and much more precise than the original post on these 52s. the little ball is the same distance from center of the bore as the old post. my shots are striking same horizontal plane but are much more precise in their grouping.
i am waiting for my beeman micrometer peep to come in the mail as well as my
precision pellets. i ordered four different pellet types. the ones i am using now are the crossman 7.9 grain "compettion" wad cutters. these cannot be the optimum pellet for this gun. some are tighter than others in the bore and they are very cheap at 3.98 for 250. also, this gun needs to be slowed down in velocity either by a weaker spring or heavier pellet. we can't get optimum accuracy with pellets going 1000fps. enough!