Best place to buy RWS oilMarch 26 2010 at 4:15 AM
|Ron (no login)|
from IP address 188.8.131.52
Looks like I am going to need some spring oil and cylinder oil for my 34, just wandering where is the most economical place to buy and is there any good substitutes for RWS oils
|March 26 2010, 7:12 AM |
There is a 50/50 split on the use of chamber oil in modern guns. Hector, here, supports it, so I would say chamber oil is OK. My guess is you can order it from UmarexUSA for the RWS brand and PyramydAir for whatever it is they sell.
Many air gunners no longer support the use of spring oil. It's mostly silicone oil, anyway, which has little in the way of metal-to-metal lubricating qualities. The use of any petroleum based oils in either the compression tube (housing the spring) or through the transfer port (where the air comes out) is not advised since the fumes will cause dieseling. This will damage the gun in the long run (and even the short). If you are going to tear the gun down, then you should buy a set of lubes from Air Rifle Headquarters.
This consists of heavy tar for the spring (helps reduce vibrations, too), moly for the piston and seal, and clear lube for the pivot points. Even if you don't tear the gun down (and you should search under tunes to see how to do it safely), you can pull the gun out of the stock and administer a "slot tune". Search on the Yellow forum for how to.
(Yeah, guys, I know that the slot tune is considered unsophisticated but it is far better than spring oil.)
If you don't want to get the heavy tar, you might search on substitutes for it. Air Rifle Headquarters is run by Jim Maccari (AKA "The Spring Man") and he has spent years concocting his superior lubes. But others have found alternatives, especially where his are not generally available.
Hope this helps. I'm sure others will chime in with more info.
|March 26 2010, 7:35 AM |
With all due respect I am still confused, I realize a petrol base oil is bad and it possible to damage the seals with some oils, I am not a perfectionist and was just interested is something that will lube and not damage my gun since it appears dry from the factory, and hate to order on line and pay as much for shipping and handling as the oil cost since oil is all I need and know it wont qualify for free shipping at most dealers
|March 26 2010, 7:57 AM |
So from what I interpret, you would like info on a local dealer that might carry it. I suggest you post what local is for you and maybe someone could help. Cabela's seems to carry the RWS Shooters Kit, but it's like $36, so you may want to reconsider mail order/a different approach like Maccari Tar.....
I didn`t realize..
|March 26 2010, 10:56 AM |
some considered spring oil of no use.No wonder people like Ron have so much to get confused about.I considrer chamber oil worthless,but not spring oil.What I do know for sure is the dry new springer will have heavy friction from piston rubbing as it`s cocked,and the stiffer the spring the higher the friction.I also know 6-10 drops of spring oil will prevent this.I`ve looked at too many guns,seen many ruined to rough cockers for the life of the guns,fron roughed up tubes&piston skirt tops.I`ve used JM`s moly,and his grease from Europe on rear of piston.I`ve found on RWS guns after a couple hundred shots,it all rubs off,and is pushed back as gun is cocked in a neat little grease ring,and gun will get dry again.Only solution,button piston,or a few drops SC oil now&again.Spring cylinder oil may not be the best lube in the world,but it`s the only oil that`s safe to use,and any lube is better than nothing.
You are right Dizz this forum is very controversial and confusing
|March 26 2010, 11:44 AM |
First it was the barrel droop thing I listened to all the evidence and made my best judgment, now its the oil thing and I will listen to all the evidence and make my best judgment. The one thing I do know is like Dizz said, new 34,s are dry or a least mine is. In my opinion even the wrong oil is better than no oil.
|March 26 2010, 1:04 PM |
Dicks sporting goods in my area carries a Gamo spring gun maintenance kit.
or you could place an ad for a sample pack of JMs lubes. a spoon full of each lube is plenty for several guns. you could ad to your ad on Yellow trade for lubes etc.
great idea thanks
|March 26 2010, 1:18 PM |
|March 26 2010, 1:39 PM |
Sometimes I'm confused by what I think is really obvious. But what I think is really obvious obviously isn't obvious..
Found this to be interesting....
|March 26 2010, 3:25 PM |
Purchased a pellet rifle a couple of years ago and it had a small pamphlet in a plastic bag from Dynamit Nobel-RWS Inc. in the box. Apparently pre UmarexUSA or UmarexUSA had a bunch of them left over and put them in boxes containing guns. Anyway in the short maintenance section it talks about chamber oil. They say a drop every 2500 shots will suffice. The next sentence is what really threw me. It says, "This lubricant is a special non-dieseling formula that evaporates within 30 seconds, and leaves a thin film of clear moly." I never had any idea of why their chamber oil was different from other oils. I guess we learn something every day. Another recommendation from them is, "The wearing surfaces at the barrel hinge, and the cocking arm should be lubricated with RWS Moly paste or Dri-Slide as well as the trigger mechanism." Never have heard of RWS Moly paste either. I guess there's lots I have yet to learn.
I also have a lot to learn Larry,
|March 26 2010, 4:26 PM |
There is a wealth of information on this sight and years and years of experience.This sight is really quiet an asset to new guys like myself.
Ron - My Advice is as follows:
|March 26 2010, 4:56 PM |
Log on to Umarex site, or Pyramid Air, or others. Look for the RWS cleaning and lubricating kit. Buy it. Download the owners manual for your gun (if you dont already have one). Read it. Read the directions that come with the RWS Kit. Note that the two give slightly different instructions. Figure out which you want to go with - and stick with the program.
If you are willing to compromise your factory warranty, open her up and put in any of the highly recommended lubes discussed here. While i have not tried them, I trust the judgement and recommendations of those here who have. The will work, and they will prolly improve the performance of your rifle.
Its your choice. I followed ( and still do) the factory recommendations with no trouble. I might well be missing out on enhanced performance, but I'm still having fun1
Good Luck and Good Shooting!!
ps- Im a noob and dont know of what i speak!!!
Thanks! good advice
|March 26 2010, 5:04 PM |
You are right Dizz this forum is very controversial and confusing
|March 26 2010, 6:16 PM |
IMHO, Most forums that are worth anything are very controversial and confusing. There are a lot of opinions out there and not everyone is in agreement and not everyone gives good advice (or they may be giving good advice, but it is interpreted wrong). In any event, your best bet is to evaluate all the advice and do what suits you best.
My personal experience in the lube vs tar area is that all RWS spring guns come dry. Lube is better than no lube. I started out with an RWS Shooters kit as that was easiest for me (only had to take the stock off/not take the gun apart). Over time, I found the unmodified gun would shoot faster with RWS lube than with tar, but faster isn't necessarily better. I also found that chamber oil does indeed diesel if applied too heavily in any spring gun or if applied at all in a Magnum. I heard good things about JM tar and moly; read his info on his site, an started lubing with the installation of one of his spring kits. Much smoother shooting! Then I did a few other guns with just the tar and moly and they also were smoother, so I am sold on the tar and moly approach. You need to use it very sparingly; particularly the tar on the spring.
Ive used 30 wt motor oil on a dry spring and it worked great.
|March 26 2010, 7:19 PM |
That was a Gamo 220. A magnum springer and had no dieseling because its behind the seal. I just put it in the slot. Even left the stock on. Any kind of grease or oil in front of the seal will ignite. JMO.
Funny that you say the heavy tar wears off
|March 26 2010, 10:18 PM |
Seems like most guys say that if you get a gun pro-tuned (and almost all use JM's tars) you probably won't have to lube it again, period. But, I agree. Read the forums and make your own decision. It's your gun. Just passed along what I've picked up from a couple of very lengthy pros/cons discussions, here and elsewhere. And I, personally, would not use motor oil on a spring. Take it out in the sun on a hot day and that 30W isn't going to be thick.
Anyway, chamber oil is mostly pure silicone oil because it has a very high flash point. Hardware stores, or hobby shops that carry R/C cars in which it is used for shocks, should stock it. The RWS stuff with moly is, primarily, the same thing. Just be sure it is pure. And don't mistake Crosman Pelgun Oil for the same thing. That IS 30W non-detergent with red dye added.
|March 27 2010, 9:01 AM |
I don`t think the tar wears off,I`m talking about the ring of moly grease @ rear of piston.Only the rear 1/8 " of piston skirt rubs,and after a while it is rubbbed off,you also have gravity fighting against you.That`s why I said JM buttons are great.Oil on the spring will spatter with each shot&keep top of piston lubed.Just what I`ve found.Have a great day,Dizz
|March 27 2010, 6:47 AM |
I have been using rock drill oil and grease in some of my airguns.
These oils and greases are designed to be injected with the compressed air into pneumatic drills and paving breakers.
These drills typically have 2.5" - 5" diameter, 20-50 lb pistons.
The drills have 2"-5" strokes and operate at 1000-3000 blows per minute.
The drills operate steel piston on steel cylinder.
They run multi million strokes between service intervals.
Piston slam is prevented by a trapped air cushion similar to spring guns.
Dieseling is rare.
I use PetroCananada Ardee 30 Oil and Ardee EP000 grease.
(Ardee = RD = Rock Drill)
The drawback is a strong, somewhat unpleasant, petroleum smell.
JM's kit was about $35, delivered
|March 27 2010, 7:35 AM |
That's the kit with the three generous jars of lube plus $10 minimum postage. If you can add some seals, etc, to the order, it makes it less expensive over all. I know other things work, but his are time tested and proven. If you factor in your time and gas money running around to find alternatives (assuming you don't have ready access to something like the lubes mentioned, above), it's a push.
Redfeather are you sure
|March 27 2010, 7:55 AM |