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Kenneth Sublett
(no login)

Re: praise him NOT as a RITUAL!

June 8 2004, 11:21 PM 

Isaiah 53 prophesied of the musical attack of the people "piping" trying to pollute Jesus into the Dionysic song and dance:
    For he shall grow up before him as a tender plant, and as a root out of a dry ground: he hath no form nor comeliness; and when we shall see him, there is no beauty that we should desire him. Isaiah 53:2

    He is despised and rejected of men; a man of sorrows, and acquainted with grief: and we hid as it were our faces from him; he was despised, and we esteemed him not. Isaiah 53: 3

Grief defines Messiah's singing a hymn or "grieving out a hymn."
    Chalah (h2470) khaw-law'; a prim. root [comp. 2342, 2470, 2490]; prop. to be rubbed or worn; hence (fig.) to be weak, sick, afflicted; or (causat.) to grieve, make sick; also to stroke (in flattering),... woman in travail, be (become) weak, be wounded.

    Surely he hath borne our griefs, and carried our sorrows: yet we did esteem him stricken, smitten of God, and afflicted. Isaiah 53: 4

    But he was wounded for our transgressions, he was bruised (abraded to bits like the word psallo or melody) for our iniquities: the chastisement of our PEACE was upon him; and with his stripes we are healed. Isaiah 53:5

    BRUISED IS: Daka (h1792) daw-kaw'; a prim. root (comp. 1794); to crumble; trans. to bruise (lit. or fig.): - beat to pieces, break (in pieces), bruise, contrite, crush, destroy, humble, oppress, smite.

    Daka (g1793) dak-kaw'; from 1792; crushed (lit. powder, or fig. contrite): - contrite, destruction.

Jesus would be MUSICALLY MOCKED. The word PSALLO from which the POWERS OF THE AIR get "music" is based on the Twanging bow string which "sings" you to death.
    Psocho (g5597) pso'-kho; prol. from the same base as 5567; to triturate, i.e. (by anal.) to rub out (kernels from husks with the fingers or hand): - rub.
    Psomion (g5596) pso-mee'-on; dim. from a der. of the base of 5597; a crumb or morsel (as if rubbed off), i.e. a mouthful: - SOP.

Being "wounded" is the word for flute player, pollute, prostitute:
    Chalal (h2490) khaw-lal'; a prim. root [comp. 2470]; prop. to bore, i. e. (by impl.) to wound, to dissolve; fig. to profane (a person, place or thing), to break (one's word), denom. (from 2485) to play (the flute):.. gather the grape thereof, * take inheritance, pipe, player on instruments, pollute, (cast as) profane (self), prostitute, slay (slain), sorrow, stain, wound.
Judas and clergy would "blow an alarm" to panic or triumph over Jesus:
    But when the congregation is to be gathered (Qahal=synagogue=church in the wilderness) together, ye shall blow, but ye shall not sound an alarm. Num 10:7

    Ruwa (h7321) roo-ah'; a prim. root; to mar (espec. by breaking); fig. to split the ears (with sound), i. e. shout (for alarm or joy): - blow an alarm, cry (alarm, aloud, out), destroy, make a joyful noise, smart, shout (for joy), sound an alarm, triumph.

    All we like sheep have gone astray; we have turned every one to his own way; and the Lord hath laid on him the iniquity of us all. Isaiah 53:6

    He was oppressed, and he was afflicted, yet he opened not his mouth: he is brought as a lamb to the slaughter, and as a sheep before her shearers is dumb, so he openeth not his mouth. Isaiah 53:7

    Oppressed is: Nagas (h5065) naw-gas'; a prim. root; to drive (an animal, a workman, a debtor, an army); by impl. to tax, harass, tyrannize: - distress, driver, exact (-or), oppress (-or), * raiser of taxes, taskmaster.

    Nagash (h5065) naw-gash'; a prim. root; to be or come (causat. bring) near (for any purpose); euphem. to lie with a woman; as an enemy, to attack; relig. to worship; causat. to present; fig. to adduce an argument; by reversal, to stand back: - (make to)

    But I was like a lamb or an ox that is brought to the slaughter; and I knew not that they had devised devices against me, saying, Let us destroy the tree with the fruit thereof, and let us cut him off from the land of the living, that his name may be no more remembered (recognized). Jer 11:19

    Shachath (h7843) shaw-khath'; a prim. root; to decay, i. e. (caus.) ruin (lit. or fig.): - batter, cast off, corrupt (-er, thing), destroy (- er, -uction), lose, mar, perish, spill, spoiler, * utterly, waste (-r).

However, Jesus said:
    Come unto me all ye that labor and are heavy laden, and I will give you rest. Mt.11:28
The labor was imposed by musicians and rhetoricians and sOPHISts (serpents) to create spiritual anxiety to makey you violate the LAW OF TITHING and the LAW OF GIVING so the poor give to the rich.
    Phortizo (g5412) for-tid'-zo; from 5414; to load up (prop. as aa vessel or animal), i.e. (fig.) to OVERBURDEN with ceremony (or SPIRITUAL ANXIETY): - lade, be heavy laden.

    Phortos (g5414) for'-tos; from 5342; something carried, i.e. the cargo of a ship: - lading.

    Phoros (g5411) for'-os; from 5342; a load (as borne,) i.e. (fig.) a tax (prop. an individ. assessment on persons or property; whereas 5056 is usually a gen. toll on goods or travel): - tribute.

Jesus only accepts worship in the NEW PLACE of the human spirit which becomes A holy spirit at baptism when we request cleansing from God. Then the rest of the Bible speaks of worshi in THE SPIRIT: musicial creators of anxiety CANNOT go there: all they can do is stand around the strait gate making it harder to find.
    Rejoice IN THE LORD ALWAYS. I will say it again: Rejoice! (be calm) Let your gentleness be evident to all. The Lord is near. Do not be anxious about anything, but in everything, by prayer and petition, with thanksgiving, present YOUR requests to God.
    And the PEACE (quietness, rest) of God, which transcends all understanding,
    will GUARD your hearts and your minds IN Christ Jesus. Philippians 4:4-7

People who have minimized the WORD by refusing to "teach it as it has been taught" CANNOT, WILL NOT grasp that. Jesus said PRAY IN THE CLOSET. Why? The PEACE will GUARD your heart just as a warrior Levite would execute a singer or musician who tried to enter into the "school of the Bible" and the "Most Holy Place" where worship takes place. But whuutt-uh ubout Davuud and his nakud danncce-ut?

Remember Psalm 150? Some of these instruments were profane: others could not be used in the temple even to smother the smell and sound of the slaughter of innocent animals. Well, the Psalms are poems and poems tend to be poetic. Therefore, the Psalmist restricted the INSTRUMENTS to those WHICH HAVE BREATH. Remember? Well, Habakkuk knew that musical instruments were idols or the HOMES of the idols. David often wanted to AWAKEN his lyre!
    Woe to him who says to wood, 'Come to life!' Or to lifeless stone, 'Wake up!' Can it give guidance? It is covered with gold and silver; there is no breath in it. Hab 2:19

    But the LORD is in his holy temple; let all the earth be silent before him." Hab 2:20

Being anxious is a PRODUCT of the assembly such as Corinth where "your assembly does more harm than good." The direct command of Jesus was to pray in your closet or the quietest, darkest center of the house.

The ONLY way NOT to be anxious is to "come learn of Me" as Jesus said:

    Merimnao (g3309) mer-im-nah'-o; from 3308; to be anxious about: - (be, have) care (-ful), take thought.
    Merimna (g3308) mer'-im-nah; from 3307 (through the idea of distraction); solicitude: - care.
    Merizo (g3307) mer-id'-zo; from 3313; to part, i.e. (lit.) to apportion, bestow, share, or (fig.) to DISUNITE, differ: - deal, be difference between, distribute, divide, give part.

At baptism Jesus cleanses us and accepts us as DISCIPLES. This was DELIBERATELY to remove His disciples into "heavenly places" where the powers of the earth could not get in unless INVITED.

How utterly arrogant that the same "musical" people still INSIST that Jesus was a liar: you must PAY them to sing, play and preach!

So called "musical worship" is deliberated imposed knowing that it WILL DELIBERATELY SOW DISCORD. The goal is to aggrandize the performers and sell CDS. They KNOW that they will DISUNITE and created DIFFERENCES in churches with the totality of the Bible and church history calling them liars.

Both Peter and Paul could grasp that if you OPEN A CRACK the vipers will sneak in. That is why Paul could grasp Jesus Who said that we MUST worship IN the new PLACE of the human spirit. Paul said WHERE worship takes place and WHY if you make it a phoney ceremony the DOGS will want to eat from the table:
This will GUARD your heart from ANYTHING outside. Why? Why, because anyone who wants to FACILITATE your worship has an agenda from the POWERS IN HIGH PLACES (the podium is a high place or bema of paganism)
    Beware of DOGS, beware of evil workers, beware of the concision. Phil 3:2

    For we are the circumcision, which worship God IN THE SPIRIT, and rejoice IN Christ Jesus, and have no confidence in the flesh. Phil 3:3

Singers, clappers, dramatists, instrumentalists and rhetorical speakers appeal to the FLESH. Therefore, most churches put their total confidence into what they DO in the FLESH. It is impossible to GIVE HEED to theatrical performers (lusting or gagging) and give heed to God in Christ and His Word which is spirit and truth.

Don't try to WORK too hard or too legalistic: Jesus died to give us rest from burdens and burden laders. He never promised to be with more than two or three who come to HIM for rest and as He promised: "Come learn of me." Trying to "worship" God with our bodies or waving hands has 100% of everything I have ever found is CHARISMATIC which pagan, sexual and perverted sexual, emasculated and sex-changed "priests."

Next, I will show you that Judas whose "Judas bag" was a servant of the Kosmokrator: it carried the mouthpieces of wind instruments. It claimed to "speak in tongues" but "of the cosmos." Paul clearly claimed that the WORD is our our only instrument. We cannot use the "lifeless instrument" or "carnal weapon." The Hoplon could be a musical instrument as indeed ALL loud singing and playing instruments were instruments of Warfare.

We can always identify the principalities and powers in high places: they are doing everything in their little heart to PREVENT you from hearing the voice of God in Christ. This is Paul's unique "worship" word. The church is a synagogue or school of the Bible. What can we say of people who insist that they must sing, clap, dance, play instruments and dramatize (hypocrite sect) while Jesus is trying to speak to us as SPIRIT through His Word? I shudder for you because you are fulfilling the MARKS and the time is right--I pray with all my heart.


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John n
(no login) & the Siblet church of satan's snake venom. . .

June 9 2004, 10:59 AM & the Siblet church of satan's snake venom. . .

Ken says - "Singers, clappers, dramatists, instrumentalists and rhetorical speakers appeal to the FLESH. . ."

The Bible says - "praise him with harp and lyre" Psalms 150

Ken says - "Trying to "worship" God with our bodies or waving hands has 100% of everything I have ever found is CHARISMATIC which pagan, sexual and perverted sexual, emasculated and sex-changed "priests."

The Bible says - "praise him with tambourine and dancing" Psalms 150

Ken says - "Next, I will show you that Judas whose "Judas bag" was a servant of the Kosmokrator: it carried the mouthpieces of wind instruments. It claimed to "speak in tongues" but "of the cosmos."

The Bible says - "praise him with the strings and flute" Psalms 150

Ken says - "What can we say of people who insist that they must sing, clap, dance, play instruments and dramatize"

i say - We can say that people who worship God with instruments are following scripture, that is what we can say.

The Bible says - "praise him with the clash of cymbals, praise him with resounding cymbals" Psalms 150

As much as Ken may want that Psalms 150 wasn't in the Bible, it is, and it was written by David, the man, whom God said was after his own heart.

Ken says - "We can always identify the principalities and powers in high places: they are doing everything in their little heart to PREVENT you from hearing the voice of God in Christ."

i say - yes, yes you did get that one right Ken.

Your heart is quite little. . .

Your fear of Christ's work inhis body,his church,his bride, is quite evident. . .

May God the Father, the Godof Jesus of Nazareth our Lord, show the mercy to you that you are so void of. . .

May the God of David, Abraham, John and Paul release you from the torment of the demons within you. . .

May he give you the peace Satan has robbed from you. . .

May you in turn put as much effort into sharing Christ's love with your own family as you put into the venom of Satan you spew about the world. . .

Jesus if the Christ, and The Christ is King

john n

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David W Keys
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Psalms, Hymns, and Spiritual songs

June 9 2004, 1:04 PM 

Certainly we cannot judge a person who choses to worship the Lord without instruments of praise. We are to worship the Lord with our whole heart, soul and mind. This can be done without instruments.

On the other hand the New Testament tells us to praise the Lord with Psalms.
These are understood to have musical accompany.
As were the Psalms of David.

Cannot see where its say a Psalm is no longer a Psalm in the New Testament.

Another verse in the NT tell us we will be judged with the judgement we use against others.

If we can understand that our righteousness was imputed to us, "credited", by the righteouness of Christ,
when he lived a sinless life and become the perfect sacrifice for OUR sins once for all time. That when he said IT IS FINISHED, he meant the work of righteouness to save our souls is complete, endless controversies about music and such become very insignificant.

If we thing our actions and our performance and our righteousness have any contibution to our salvation, it becomes our whole life, because then our performance, or in other word OUR getting it right and following the right path etc, etc is what saves, not the FINISHED work of CHRIST.

When we say some person cannot be saved if they use instruments of praise, or that it is a salvation issue, you have drawn a line so thin with such a judgement that yourself would have to live a pefect life, for the word says we all stumble in many way.

Its His righteousness not ours.

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(no login)

Re: praise him NOT as a RITUAL!

June 9 2004, 2:37 PM 

    And it was so, that when they that bare the ark of the Lord had gone six paces, he sacrificed oxen and fatlings. 2 Sam 6:13

    And David danced before the Lord (the ARK) with all his might; and David was girded with a LINEN EPHOD [a woman's garment] 2 Sam 6:14

    Josephus warned that the Levite singers and musicians had DESTROYED the nation once and were going to do it again.
    So David and all the house of Israel brought up the ark of the Lord with SHOUTING, and with the CLANGOR of the TRUMPET. 2 Sam 6:15

    Teruwah (h8643) ter-oo-aw'; from 7321; clamor, i. e. acclamation of joy or a battle-cry; espec. clangor of trumpets, as an alarum: - alarm, blow (-ing) (of, the) (trumpets), joy, JUBILE, loud noise, rejoicing, shout (-ing), (high, joyful) sound (-ing).

I saw them blowing trumpets with Halal males raising hands around the Asherah poles at Jubilee 98. The idea of holding a JUBILEE came from the Pope but it UTTERLY REPUDIATES the fact that God in Christ fulfilled the Jubilee just as He did Passover. They had tried to wash away baptism with Max Lucado in Jubilee 97. They KNEW that they were blowing the BATTLE CRY just as surely as "musical ministers" sound the Battle Cry against the Word and Jesus as the ONLY mediatory without song or sermon.
This has the same meaniong of the battle cry of all nations: this is not worship but the signal for OPEN WARFARE. The "singers and musicians" use their earthly hands and talent to threaten people away from their own property. At Mount Sinai when they rose up to PLAY it was the musical, idolatrous worship of the Egyptian triad. As usual, it involved sexuality and homosexuality
    Ruwa (h7321) roo-ah'; a prim. root; to mar (espec. by breaking); fig. to split the ears (with sound), i. e. shout (for alarm or joy): - blow an alarm, cry (alarm, aloud, out), destroy, make a joyful noise, smart, shout (for joy), sound an alarm, triumph.
This was the battle cry: in Numbers 10:7 when the ASSEMBLY or synagogue (Qahal) was to be called together they could sound the trumpet but not in the form of the alarm or triumph over. It was the TRIUMPH OVER which the pagan Jewish singers and musicians from the signal of JUDAS would attempt to mock and defeat Jesus with the fear of warfare.
    And as the ark of the Lord came into the city of David, Michal Sauls daughter looked through a window, and saw king David leaping and dancing before the Lord; and she despised him in her heart. 2 Sam 6:16

    Then David returned to bless his household. And Michal the daughter of Saul came out to meet David, and said, How glorious was the king of Israel to day, who uncovered himself to day in the eyes of the handmaids of his servants, as one of the vain fellows shamelessly uncovereth himself 2 Sam 6:20

    "Nah-na, nan-a-nan-uh: you are just jealous!"

    And David said unto Michal, It was before the Lord, which chose me before thy father, and before all his house, to appoint me ruler over the people of the Lord, over Israel: therefore will I play before the Lord. 2 Sam 6:21

This Play is identical to the "play" or mocking, singing and GRINDING which Samson was forced to perform in the king's house. Well, grinders, as in Revelation 18 along with the singers and musicians were also concubines and prostitutes. The word David used is h7832 which is identical to h6711 which was the PLAY as Israel "rose up to play" meaning the musical idolatry of Egypt.

Michal had no more dealing with him and David made sure that all but one crippled son of Saul were killed: one made into a human sacrifice. When David praised he made himself vile: God cannot punish the insane in all cultures.
    Qalal (g7043)kaw-lal'; a prim. root; to be (caus. make) light, lit. (swift, small, sharp, etc.) or fig. (easy, trifling, vile, etc.): - abate, make bright, bring into contempt, (ac-) curse, despise, (be) ease (- y, -ier), (be a, make, make somewhat, move, seem a, set) light (- en, - er, -ly, - ly afflict, -ly esteem, thing), * slight [-ly], be swift (- er), (be, be more, make, re-) vile, whet.
    And I will yet be more vile than thus, and will be base in mine own sight : and of the maidservants which thou hast spoken of, of them shall I be had in honour . 2 Sam 6:22

David was never the song writer or praise leader for the temple: this happened after his death. Then the temple SOWED DISCORD and fell within five years of Solomon's death and civil war. When David prophesied or praised with slavers drooling from his mouth he intended to show the Philistine king that he should be pitied for his insanity.

The "praise" in Psalm 150 is sometimes used in a good sense that people sing and jump around when something good happens. However, the dominant meaning of PRAISE is:
    Halal (g1984) haw-lal'; a prim. root; to be clear (orig. of sound, but usually of color); to shine; hence to make a show, to boast; and thus to be (clamorously) foolish; to rave; causat. to celebrate; also to stultify: - (make) boast (self), celebrate, commend, (deal, make), fool (- ish, -ly), glory, give [light], be (make, feign self) mad (against), give in marriage, [sing, be worthy of] praise, rage, renowned, shine.
The word lucifer (ZOE superior to Jesus or Logos) is derived from the word PRAISE more than the light of VENUS. If you take this literally as a COMMAND for Christian "worship" here is what you are engaged in:
    Heylel (h1966) hay-lale'; from 1984 (in the sense of brightness); the morning-star: - lucifer.

    Praise ye the Lord. "MAKE YOURSELF MAD" before God in his sanctuary: praise him in the firmament of his power. Psa 150:1

    "MAKE YOURSELF MAD" for his mighty acts: praise him according to his excellent greatness. Psa 150: 2

    "MAKE YOURSELF MAD" with the sound of the trumpet: "MAKE YOURSELF MAD" with the psaltery and harp. Psa 150: 3

    "MAKE YOURSELF MAD" with the timbrel and DANCE: "MAKE YOURSELF VILE" with stringed instruments and organs. Psa 150: 4

    "MAKE YOURSELF VILE" upon the loud cymbals: "MAKE YOURSELF MAD" upon the high sounding cymbals. Psa 150: 5

    Let every thing that hath breath praise the Lord. Praise ye the Lord. Psa 150: 6

David also claimed that God loved him because he was "PERFECTLY SINLESS." The statement that David was "a man after God's heart" was said when he was young. Furthermore, it just means that God picked him. All of the monarchy would lead Israel and Judah into captivity and death.

Halal has about the same meaning as:
    Chalal (h2490))khaw-lal'; a prim. root [comp. 2470]; prop. to bore, i. e. (by impl.) to wound, to dissolve; fig. to profane (a person, place or thing), to break (one's word), to begin (as if by an "opening wedge"); denom. (from 2485) to PLAY (THE FLUTE) - begin (* men began), defile, * break, defile, * eat (as common things), * first, * gather the grape thereof, * take inheritance, PIPE, player on INSTRUMENTS, pollute, (cast as) profane (self), PROSTITUTE, slay (slain), sorrow, stain, wound.
Which is interchangeable in two Psalms with:
    Nagan (h5059) naw-gan'; a prim. root; prop. to thrum, i. e. beat a tune with the fingers; espec. to play on a stringed instrument; hence (gen.) to make music: - player on instruments, sing to the stringed instruments, melody, ministrel, play (-er, -ing..

    And they come unto thee as the people cometh, and they sit before thee as my people, and they hear thy words,
    but they will not do them:
    for with their mouth they shew much love,
    but their heart goeth after their covetousness . Eze 33:31

    And, lo, thou art unto them as a very lovely (sexual) song
    of one that hath a pleasant voice,
    and can PLAY well on an instrument:
    for they hear thy words,
    BUT they do them not. Eze.33:32

Remember that PSALLO or MELODY is a Greek and not a Hebrew word. The Hebrew just means PRAISES. However, all forms of the word "psallo" or making melody relate to warfare against the "gods." The "musical" words speak of ORGE which can mean "just get irrationally angry." It also means what happens in the musical, charismatic pagan worship rituals. They were all, like David, an attempt to show God how humble he was by making himself as vile and repulsive as possible.

The pagans were actually in OVERT WARFARE with their gods: you can get more by threats than prayers.

These words are heavily laced with the LOCUST. Apollo had been worshipped because he defeated the Locusts or "muses" or musical performers. John alludes to the Classics when he tells us that Apollo, Abaddon or Apollyon will unleash the locusts. They will make music for some but STING others with their tails. We are there.

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One who knows OC
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For the record

July 21 2004, 12:49 PM 

For the record...
1. Ken is nuts.
2. This is a waste of time
3. John York doesn't preach at Otter Creek, although he is a great preacher!
4. It's about time people stopped listening to the "spritual terrorists" among us...namely those who write such wacked out stuff as I have read here.
5. I have a lot invested in the ministry at OC. Ken has no impact on the good work that is happening for the Kingdom there. We stand with spiritual armor against such petty schemes and feeble arrows.
6. There is a world of people out there who need Christ. Newsflash...they aren't interested in this kind of debate. I agree with an earlier commentor up there..get off your butts and make a difference.

a brother in Christ, whether you like it or not

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Kevin Hamm
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Why this is important

September 2 2004, 1:41 AM 

Jam 5:19 Brethren, if any of you do err from the truth, and one convert him;

Jam 5:20 Let him know, that he which converteth the sinner from the error of his way shall save a soul from death, and shall hide a multitude of sins.

Prayerfully Onward,


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(no login)

Re: Why this is important

September 3 2004, 1:40 PM 

It saddens me that we spend so much time bickering among ourselves, and so little time comparitively reaching out to those who do not know Christ.

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Kenneth Sublett
(no login)

Lucifer-Zoe identity

August 15 2004, 6:15 PM 

> Lucifer Harry Thurston Peck, Harpers Dictionary of Classical Antiquities (1898)
    is Phosphorus (Phôsphoros, "the bringer of light"). The name of the planet Venus, when seen in the morning before sunrise. The same planet was called Hesperus, Vesperugo, Vesper, Noctifer, or Nocturnus, when it appeared in the heavens after sunset. Lucifer as a personification is called a son of Astraeus and Aurora or Eos, of Cephalus and Eos
1 Lucifer, or Hesperus, may for its beauty be connected with Aphrodite (and so got the further name of Venus ).
    2 The cult of Aphrodite flourished among all the eastern peoples.
    3 Venus.
    4 Hermes being the god of escort or attendance.
    5 Mars, Jupiter, and Saturn
> lampas lights used in Bacchic ceremonies, or in festal processions, phainete, faggot, luchnis, helios identified with Apollo, Abaddon or Apollyon of the book of Revelation.
    2. faggot, Plb.3.93.4 metaph., of the sun, the coming light, of lightning, metaph., of life, lampada gar zôas. Hêliou astêr, of the planet Saturn (666)
Both eos and zoe apply both to light and life. Eos and Zoe are both identified as th mother or sister or even lucifer herself:

> Eos is used of the Musae who were the musical arbitrators or mediators. They are life or phôs, Êôs the goddess of dawn, Latin aurora.
    2. day, katêïen es dusin ê. Musae; mesatê ê (arbitrator).

    Hislop notes the universal message of women or effemate males being seduced by the serpent, nachash or "musical enchanter." In the message of Revelation they are sorcerers or witches.

    4th, the whole system must be dovetailed together. As the mother of the gods was equally the mother of mankind, Semiramis, or Astarte, must also be identified with Eve; and the name Rhea, which, according to the Paschal Chronicle was given to her, sufficiently proves her identification with Eve.

    Rheia , Ep. for rhea, rha (qq. v.), (sts. elided, Il.15.356, Od.17.273), Adv. of rhaidios, easily, lightly, freq. in Hom. (v. infr.) and Hes. (Op.6, al., but rhea ib.5); theoi rheia zôontes the gods who live at ease, Il.6.138, Od.4.805; toutoisin men tauta melei, kitharis kai aoidê, rheia lightly, pleasantly,

      kithar-is ,means chraismêi (to ward off) and with aoidê. Kitharists were known to perform the "pretend" task of sorcery and were therefore parasites.

      Odes are not to be sung audibly but "in the heart" because they are spells or incantation.

    Hislop notes:As applied to the common mother of the human race, the name Astarte is singularly appropriate; for, as she was Idaia mater, "The mother of knowledge," the question is, "How did she come by that knowledge?" To this the answer can only be: "by the fatal investigations she made."

    It was a tremendous experiment she made, when, in opposition to the Divine command, and in spite of the threatened penalty,

      she ventured to "search" into that forbidden knowledge which her Maker in his goodness had kept from her.

      Thus she took the lead in that unhappy course of which the Scripture speaks--"God made man upright, but they have SOUGHT out many inventions" (Eccl 7:29).

    Now Semiramis, deified as the Dove, was Astarte in the most gracious and benignant form. Lucius Ampelius calls her "the goddess benignant and merciful to me" (bringing them) "to a good and happy life." In reference to this benignity of her character, both the titles, Aphrodite and Mylitta, are evidently attributed to her. The first I have elsewhere explained as "The wrath-subduer," and the second is in exact accordance with it. Mylitta, or, as it is in Greek, Mulitta, signifies "The Mediatrix." The Hebrew Melitz, which in Chaldee becomes Melitt, is evidently used in Job 33:23, in the sense of a Mediator; "the messenger, the interpreter" (Melitz), who is "gracious" to a man, and saith, "Deliver from going down to the pit: I have found a ransom," being really "The Messenger, the MEDIATOR." Parkhurst takes the word in this sense, and derives it from "Mltz," "to be sweet."

    Now, the feminine of Melitz is Melitza, from which comes Melissa, a "bee" (the sweetener, or producer of sweetness), and Melissa, a common name of the priestesses of Cybele, and as we may infer of

      Cybele, as Astarte, or Queen of Heaven, herself; for, after Porphyry, has stated that "the ancients called the priestesses of Demeter, Melissae," he adds, that they also "called the Moon Melissa." We have evidence, further, that goes far to identify this title as a title of Semiramis. Melissa or Melitta (APPOLODORUS)--for the name is given in both ways--is said to have been the mother of Phoroneus, the first that reigned, in whose days the dispersion of mankind occurred, divisions having come in among them, whereas before, all had been in harmony and spoke one language (Hyginus).

      There is no other to whom this can be applied but Nimrod; and as Nimrod came to be worshipped as Nin, the son of his own wife, the identification is exact.

Katein means to bring down or to go down to the grave. Dusin means the setting or hiding place of the sun. Musae

Harry Thurston Peck, Harpers Dictionary of Classical Antiquities (1898) defines the MUSES who "ministered" to Apollo or Abaddon or Apollyon in the book of Revelation.
    And the voice of harpers, and musicians (Muses), and of pipers, and trumpeters, shall be heard no more at all in thee; and no craftsman, of whatsoever craft he be, shall be found any more in thee; and the sound of a millstone shall be heard no more at all in thee; Rev 18:22
The craftsman is the Greek Techne: they include stage directors and house or theater builders. The "grinders" in Hebrew speak of the concubines or prostitutes.
    Musae (Mousai). In Greek mythology the Muses were originally the nymphs of springs, whose waters gave inspiration, such as Hippocrené, Castalia, etc.; then goddesses of song in genera. They are all female and are considered goddesses dwelling in Olympus, who at the meals of the gods sing sweetly to the lyre of Apollo. They are the nine daughters of Zeus. [Apollo is at times the sun god or Saturn. Saturn's Chaldee (sounding brass, astrology) number is 666.

      (1) Callio(pé (she of the fair voice), in Hesiod the noblest of all, the Muse of epic song; among her attributes are a wax tablet and a pencil.

      (2) Clio (she that extols), the Muse of history; with a scroll.

      (3) Euterpé (she that gladdens), the Muse of lyric song; with the double flute.

      (4) Thali-a (she that flourishes), the Muse of comedy and bucolic poetry; with the comic mask, the ivy wreath, and the shepherd's staff.

      (5) Melpomené (she that sings), the Muse of tragedy; with tragic mask, ivy wreath, and occasionally with attributes of individual heroes-- e. g. the club, the sword.

      (6) Terpsichoré (she that rejoices in the dance), the Muse of dancing; with the lyre.

      (7) Erato (the lovely one), the Muse of erotic poetry; with a smaller lyre.

      (8) Polymnia or Polyhymnia (she that is rich in hymns), the Muse of serious sacred songs; usually represented as veiled and pensive.

      (9) Urania (the heavenly), the Muse of astronomy; with the celestial globe.

> Zoe has the same meaning as Eos . The word ZOE in gnosticism is the mother-sister of "jehovah" and superior to Logos or Jesus Christ. She is the SHINING ONE and also the giver of life. The word for life is ZOE.
    zôê-living, i.e. one's substance, property

    zeidôros , on, zea-giving , zeidôros aroura, some authors derived it from zaô,= biodôros , life-giving, Aphroditê Emp.151 ; Êelios. Lucifer is the Hebrew heylel, from brightness. zeidôros used with pherô (Locr. pharô burden). hêlios, êelioio to see the light of life, Helios, the sun-god. Hêliou astêr, of the planet Saturn (Number is 666). Heliacal Rising is about the end of September. but also eis phôs ienai to come into the light, i.e. into public,

    zôos; zôon helein (heresy) tina to take prisoner,

    zôos alive, living, Homer, Hdt., etc.; zôon helein tina to take prisoner, Il.; zôon labein Xen.

    zôogoneô to be viviparous, produce alive, parthenon, of Zeus. zôê,= graus, the scum on milk,

    zeô to bubble up with passion or rage. zôoô to impregnate.

    I. to live, Hom., etc.; elenchiste zôontôn vilest of living men, Od.; zôein kai horan phaos êelioio Il.; rheia zôontes living at ease, of the gods, id=Il.; zôn katakauthênai to be burnt alive, Hdt.:--also, zên apo tinos to live off or on a thing, Theogn., Hdt., etc.:-- to zên zôê

    II. metaph. to be in full life and strength, to be fresh, be strong, atês thuellai zôsi Aesch.; aei zêi tauta [nomima] Soph.; zôsa phlox living fire.
Mid September to Mid October is the Heliacal Rising to MARK the season but will not give the day or hour. I would stay at home. It is simply NOT possible to believe that MUSIC is not radically condemned throughout the Bible and is always associated with people who have made the terminal decision to spit out the Word they once MAY have tasted. Paul to the Hebrews warns of those who sow discord and wreck the reverence:

God is still a consuming fire: and that is what they are praying for.

Ken Sublett

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Desparate is out

September 14 2004, 11:50 PM 

The new Zoe Group CD is out and it's called Desparate. I highly recommend picking it up.

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Kenneth Sublett
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C. Leonard Allen "Church of God Review"

October 2 2004, 7:27 PM 

C. Leonard Allen has his drip, drip of new books all the time. Unfortunately, C. isn't too keen on the Biblical or historical facts and OOZES a virulant contempt for churches of Christ who did not and will not BOW TO BAAL when the musical priesthood PIPES.

Furthermore, with Max Lucado and Rubel Shelly he is promoting the "Holy Trinity" of the Family of Gods which is blasphemy. Nevertheless, bashing your more spiritual brethren has always been a way to MAKE a fast BUCK or....

By separating out the god family or tribe or standing committee they can tell you with a straight fact that ALL THAT'S LEFT is seven facts ABOUT Jesus. All of the rest is up for grabs. That means, according to Shellyites "partnering with God" for a new set of authority which fits OUR culture.

The "authorities" from the church of Christ and Charles Wesley BOTH repudiated the TRINITY or polytheism and BOTH repudiated "music" as something only those devoid of A holy spirit might enjoy. Unfortunately, the Church of God "scholar" of the Wesly Church of God does not have a clue even as C. Leonard and others of the NEW SCRIBAL CRAFT know nothing of people they quote.

The obligatory PUNCH IN THE PAUNCH is to accuse churches of Christ with getting its theology from John Locke: They ALL say that and I am betting that not a ONE of them has read John Locke or they could not lie about the FATHER of their political and religious freedom to peddle untruth.

We have looked at the ZOE GROUP posted review by a church of Goder and one suspects that he is looking for ENDORSEMENTS for his many NEW books. Aren't we being FLOOD AWAY as a church with stuff spewing out of pagan mouths?

I have done a quick study but you can read the ACTUAL words of those lied about in this PROMO for Hate Mongering. We will fix it if the SPIRIT PERSON moves us separate and apart from and beyond the sacred page.

Iam listening to a ZOEY song right now and the close harmony is exactly what the Jewish Encyclopedia says that Jesus would have heard: screeching and screaming and it HURTS my serotonin pool and makes me want to FLEE.

Ken Sublett

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Look to the Hills Conference

October 4 2004, 3:50 PM 

I'm surprised you all haveen't mentioned that the Zoe Conference was held this weekend and denominational speaker brian McLaren was the keynote speaker. Jeff Walling and Mike Cope were also significant speakers, and Brandon Scott Thomas, Keith Lancaster, and Ken young lead the songs.

According to the Zoe group website, there were almost 1100 poeple there. Is Look to the Hills becoming the new Jubilee?

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Re: Look to the Hills Conference

October 4 2004, 6:23 PM 

Yes, I noticed the boasting about the attendance when I was doing some work on the Stone Campbell Movement the new pneumatologicl movement of those BLOWING the winds of change. The Stone Campbell Sect lies that the Restoration movement was fathered by Barton W. Stone at Cane Ridge which is quite identical to ancient and modern devil worship. After the REFORMATION, John Calvin devoted a lot of attention to a RESTORATION MOVEMENT. The Campbells returned to the Bible for faith and practice. The "prophets, chanellers and facilitators" once out of ACU claimed that restoring the church to the New Testament model was a primative frontier mindset. I am working on Calvin and you might click through looking for RESTOR..

The Stone Campbell workshop is, like the ZOE GROUP as was Jubilee, a TRAFFICKING seminar. I will bet every GROUP and GROUPY trying to get them to CUT a CD or give them some promo will be there. And don't forget the architects, acoustics engineers, Audio equipment peddlers, book peddlers, published CDs, fund raisers,Recording Studios, agents, booking agents, brochure printers and two fishes and several loaves and don't forget, lots of RICE.

Furthermore, Red Neck Rob can collect more than a thousand to watch lawn mower races. And the walking horse people can get more than that to watch crippled and twisted horses "walk."

Further furthermore, watching theatrical performers is like watching an air race to see the flaming smash up or WASTED TIME AGAIN.

"Of particular interest is the way that early modern playwrights, music theorists, and theater apologists addressed this conflated language of the "enemy," by echoing the same connections between sexuality and playing found in the most virulent antitheatrical tracts.

"As this paper will demonstrate, by "playing" with the conflated language, these writers defended their art,

justifying their existence in a society that was both seduced and repulsed by them. By claiming the polemical antitheatrical language, these players escaped from the ideological margins to which their opponents had tried to relegate them.

Using the artifices of mimesis (imitation) and comedy they pointed out and

defused their opponents' anxieties about music, theater, and sexuality,

creating a space for players in the cultural mainstream

Here is a new attack page exposing the "naked" Stone Campbell Movement which are the good people who facilitated the GREAT LEAP FORWARD at Madison from about 3,300 (5,000 elder's count! Sound about right?) to about 1,400 or so with 325 in the jail.

You will notice that there is a small chain of performers who can seduce the non spiritual out to get their money and applause to give SOME meaning to people who believe that A holy (wholly) Spirit God can be worshipped in houses made by human hands or by the HANDS themselves. Worship is in the NEW PLACE of the human SPIRIT and charismatic worship has let the WRONG spirit slip in.

Yes, Look to the Hills is a Jubilee (for the atonement) offspring.

Ken Sublett

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Re: Look to the Hills Conference

October 7 2004, 8:51 AM 

Just seems to me that people should know what's going on with the tbrotherhood.

by the way, McLaren's webstie is Interesting teaching there

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Kenneth Sublett
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October 7 2004, 8:54 PM 

Yes, I have read some of the stuff. People think that if you can sell something you will SUCK IN THE SEEKERS. He is "pastor" of a Community Church which is where Otter got its tale. I can guarantee you that if Jesus was the HEAD KNOCKER of one of these pandering and peddling programs these people WOULD NOT listen to Him.

In fact, the musical mocking PROVES that they have the MARK of Cain which means a musical note and the MARK of Judas which was part of the flute case because he was a thief. If they will SILENCE the voice of the SON Who speaks the only thing we are going to hear from the FATHER, they would not hesitate to do Him damage. The case is defacto proven: you worship those to whom you GIVE HEED. It simply cannot be refuted.

Furthermore, God makes it absolute that He will provide a MARK where they did not have a clue to the meaning of ZOE (life) just as the charismatics have no clue that CHARA or GRACE was a perverted goddess with a perverted priesthood. Christ the SPIRIT in Scripture uses the GRACE or CHARA word to fool the fools (Matthew 13). ALL of these slurped up words are POINTERS: we are supposed to be smart enough to LOOK where Jesus or Paul POINTS so that we do not have to use sexual practices to BIND THE SPIRIT AND FLESH TOGETHER. That is, we do NOT have to prove our legalism and superstition by thinking that the AROUSAL is a "holy" spirit.

I suppose that you can be so disconnected from the HEAD that you would invite any false teacher in as the ATTRACTANT if you are 100% mercenary. However, ANY quality of spirituality and minimal knowledge of the Living Word through the Written Word would not feed the people a SERPENT when they think that they are getting BREAD.

Brian believes in BELIEVER'S BAPTISM which originated in 1525 and is identical to the ancient PAGAN BAPTISMS. Again, the pagans thought that they were being baptized BECAUSE they were already pure and it was just SHOW AND TELL. This means that ZOE, their church and the local scholarly facilitators PREACH just what Brian believes.

100% of the Bible, contemporaneous documents, the Classics, the church Fathers, founders of denominations, medical science and common sense repudiates the MUSIC concept as a WORSHIP scheme. The Lucifer Principle is to BLEED OFF worship due only to God and performed in the NEW PLACE of the human spirit devoted to prayer and the Word as the Spirit, Life, and Truth AS OPPOSED to these word concepts worshipped in paganism.

The NEW SCHOLARS have led the "women and children" to repudiate 100% of the evidence and claim that just the opposite is the truth. How and why do they do that? It's a Mark: the Locusts are musical performers. The apollo is the abaddon or apollyon John had in mind in the book of Revelation.

In the same way, the prophecy was of God washing His people, Mark defines baptism as the beginning (most important teaching), the last great command of Jesus before He was MUSICALLY MOCKED to the cross, Peter's understanding that along with Paul and everyone believing that Jesus MEANT it when He made baptism the MEANS in the sense of time and place where we REQUEST A holy spirit or A good conscience or consciousness. The fact that they are not remotely baptizing people is that they are NOT helping them to be the Disciples of Christ who are the ONLY Christians. No, don't spill out that "sincere" junk: if you are a disciple of these TRAFFICKERS you CANNOT be a disciple of Christ. The are the original MUSICAL SECTARIANS and I hope they are getting fitted for a millstone.

While the early "church of Christ" began to "boil the frog" by adding sprinkling as CLINICAL BAPTISM, the church fathers and everyone up to ZWINGLI preached that baptism was REQUIRED. Luther: faith only meant that you believed the BIBLE ONLY and because the Bible told him so, faith only meant BAPTISM ONLY. Now, to suddenly decide that these jokesters can PARTNER with God to make that obsolete is the MARK of God pouring out His CUP of wrath by making them into BUFFOONS.

But, not to be too judgmental: if they wanted to PURCHASE my typing out the Bible and make me WEALTHY I worry that the "flattery" would be the final TESTING OF SATAN and I, too, might become a "singing and harp playing prostitute." They kill prophets, you know, and applause is the MARK that God is God and these people are not. I think that the "scholars" among them know that you cannot differ with the BIBLE GURU and keep getting your bread buttered (or whatever) but Jesus and Paul warned you that following the Suffering Servant demands being despised and rejected of men and probably having to find an honest job if you don't have the MARK. I can prove what I say: just wait for one of them to try to prove that Jesus didn't mean what He died for. Yes, Jesus died for congregational singing. But, not A Cappella which means "the castrated ones" because MECHANICAL instruments were not useful in the Sistine Chapel where they COULD NOT be used in the presence of the Pope. That means that they believed that you HAD BETTER NOT try to get into the presence of God in Christ (the Spirit) with a machine.

For PRACTICAL PURPOSES Brian POURS: that proves that they will not follow Jesus anywhere!


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And your point is....

October 4 2004, 11:25 PM 

So what are you trying to say? Are you trying to say that ZOE is BAD??? We had a women minister attend the ZOE conference this weekend and she said that it was FANTASTIC!!


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Kenneth Sublett
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Re: Look to the Hills Conference

October 5 2004, 10:15 AM 

Fantastic \Fan*tas"tic\, a. [F. fantastique, fr. Gr. ??????????? able to represent, fr. ????????? to make visible. See {Fancy}.] 1. Existing only in imagination; fanciful; imaginary; not real; chimerical.
2. Having the nature of a phantom; unreal. --Shak.
3. Indulging the vagaries of imagination; whimsical; full of absurd fancies; capricious; as, fantastic minds; a fantastic mistress.
4. Resembling fantasies in irregularity, caprice, or eccentricity; irregular; oddly shaped; grotesque.
There at the foot of yonder nodding beech, That wreathes its old fantastic roots so high. --T. Gray.
Syn: Fanciful; imaginative; ideal; visionary; capricious; chimerical; whimsical; queer. See {Fanciful}.

The chimera

The ??????????? is:

phantas-iôdês, fantastic, unreal, imaginary
2. ph. hupnoitroubled by dreams
II. showy, pompous, of persons,

pompa-ticus showy, pompous, splendid: femina, pompa-ti(ce- , with display, pompously, Vulg. Amos, 6, 1;
    Amos 6:1 WOE to them that are at ease in Zion, and trust in the mountain of Samaria, which are named chief of the nations, to whom the house of Israel came
    Amos 6:3 Ye that put far away the evil day, and cause the seat of violence to come near;
    Amos 6:4 That lie upon beds of ivory, and stretch themselves upon their couches, and eat the lambs out of the flock, and the calves out of the midst of the stall;
    Amos 6:5 That chant to the sound of the viol, and invent to themselves instruments of musick, like David;
    Amos 6:6 That drink wine in bowls, and anoint themselves with the chief ointments: but they are not grieved for the affliction of Joseph.
    Is.5:12 And the harp, and the viol, the tabret, and pipe, and wine, are in their feasts: but they regard not the work of the Lord, neither consider the operation of his hands.
    Is.14:11 Thy pomp is brought down to the grave, and the NOISE of thy viols: the worm is spread under thee, and the worms [maggots] cover thee.

God DID NOT say that a father and son could have ritual sex with the same "church" PROSTITUTE (always a musician) IF they were concerned with CAUSING the grief of the whole NATION. The MAGGOTS speaks of HELL which had been king Solomon's MUSIC GROVE.

panêgur-ikos of or for a PUBLIC festival or ASSEMBLY, poluteleia, kosmos,
II. generally, solemn, festive, logos festival oration, such as those pronounced at the Olympic games, panegyric, eidos [tês rhêtorikês] A RHETORIKES performed the function of SORCERY.
2. flattering, false, of style, showy, ostentatious, opp. alêthinos, D.H.Dem.8; of persons, pompous, gunê sobara kai p.

The JUDAS BAG was for carrying the mouth pieces of wind instruments. It is made up of SPEAKING IN TONGUE and OF THE WORLD or KOSMOS

pompous, is like TRIUMPH OVER: In Psaul 41 "Judas will not TRIUMPH OVER Jesus." That was OUTLAWED for the synagogue and it means to "play music and 'make a joyful noise before the Lord'." That was the Levitical Warrior "musicians" PANIC MUSIC.
    "Philodemus considered it paradoxical that music should be regarded as veneration of the gods while musicians were paid for performing this so-called veneration. Again, Philodemus held as self deceptive the view that music mediated religious ecstasy. He saw the entire condition induced by the noise of cymbals and tambourines as a disturbance of the spirit.
      He found it significant that, on the whole, only women and effeminate men fell into this folly.

    Accordingly, nothing of value could be attributed to music; it was no more than a slave of the sensation of pleasure, which satisfied much in the same way that food and drink did.
Paul commanded DON'T PLEASURE YOURSELVES just as Jesus DID NOT PLEASURE Himself. ONLY then can you GLORIFY GOD with ONE MIND and ONE VOICE and then only if you speak THAT WHICH IS WRITTEN.

Zoe is EVE and Paul told you that EVE was wholly seduced by the serpent which was a MUSICAL ENCHANTER. Zoe is LUCIFER the "singing and harp-playing prostitute." Zoe is zoon the BEAST PEOPLE or Aphrodite or Helios meaning Rubel Shelly's S.U.N. god to think of the S.O.N. God

I think their GUEST CELEBRITY to collect the flies THINKS that "this too will pass" and the TROUBLERS IN ZION will wake up some day and do a JUDAS for the woe they have brought on the churches--who WILL NOT GO THERE and God is using the "musical locusts" to separate those with the MARK OF CAIN (a musical note) from those MARKED by Christ at baptism and by the WORD.

J.D. did the women "ministers" chase away your preacher?

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Re: Look to the Hills Conference

October 7 2004, 3:35 PM 

I just read through the postings on this topic. There is very little that answers the originators question that was asked months ago. Otter Creek has a good website for information. I don't know how John York was put into this mix - Tim Woodroof is the minister at Otter Creek NOT John York. If you profess to know about a church, should you not get the name of their minister correct???

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Kenneth Sublett
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February 12 2005, 3:56 PM 

FHU has a slick-Willie habit of inviting in NEUTRALS or Pro-instrumentalists and then stacking the deck with people who CANNOT defend the Biblical and 100% historical repudiation of MUSIC in worshiping of God.

This time it was WOODMONT HILLS and OTTER CREEK versus Marlin Connelly and Philip Slate neither of whom is equiped to UNMASK the fibs and fabrications of those LUSTING to sow discord.

The Theme is A LIGHT TO THE NATIONS: these are the same people who sent out a MISSIONARY TEAM dressed as gargoyles (griffins or demons) to musically and theatrically spread the LIGHT. Lucifer is the son of the morning and ZOE is the MOTHER GODDESS and giver of both light and life.

Terry Briley will speak about ISAIAH and undoubtedly tell everyone about the worship in ISRAEL: "There's nothing wrong with their worship." We have take the flat of the beaver to that whopper.

In 1991 they had Bill Swetmon "dressed up" as neutral but was ready to ZAP the "traditionalists" who didn't know what hit them. Of course, if you are more than careless with the TRUTH it is pretty hard to defend.

It simply is NOT remotely possible to defend such universally-perverted "worship" without lying about the FACTS.

Psallo and Josephus: lies

Gregory of Nyssa: lies

The odes of Solomon: lies

Clement of Alexandria's PERMISSION: lies

Clement of Alexandria REMOVES the FHU permission:

Unfortunately, FHU never made an attempt to correct the false teaching they promoted by publishing the book.

See the Abominable Branch as singing with instruments

Tim WILL NOT debate this issue on this FORUM because he knows that ONLY at lectureships which give DIVINE PERMISSION to teach error and AMONG THE SCHOLARS could he get away with false teaching.

He is permitted to use an ANNIE MOUSE dodge and offer just ONE PROOF as authority to deliberately TRY to convince others to join the MUSICAL HERESY.

If someone can post or mail me a transcript we will UNMASK them.

Ken Sublett

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I Love Otter Creek

March 28 2005, 1:01 PM 

First of all, Ken, Tim won't respond on this forum because he has better things to do. Like, oh, I don't know, minister to the hurting people in our community. (Hummm....maybe some of us should follow his Christ-like example).

Secondly, whoever was talking about Zoe's latest release, it's awesome. I was there when they recorded a large bit of it, and it's a great CD. I can't wait to get my own copy.

And, finally, the debate about OC is fruitless. We are not going to change our worship methods because of some crazies out in cyber space somewhere. We have an awesome church. An amazing group of people who love God and who will jump at any available opportunity to serve Him. OC is a missions-minded church that has changed my world.

I am honored to call everyone at OC "family."

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Ken Sublett
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I love Beavers

March 28 2005, 6:02 PM 

Lewis (buried up the hill) and Clark loved beaver until they discovered the AWESOMNESS of dog.

I keep forgetting: do otters have ROUND tales or FLAT tales?

I know about Beavers: they dam up my Piney creek.

No one ever expected Tim to respond: that is the oath of silence to trivialize both the Bible and those who defend it. Tim won't respond because Tim CANNOT respond. He depends on MUSIC to do mind control so he can tell you all of those urban legends and accept an UNLAWFUL and ungodly wage from ungodly and legalistic TITHING and the unlawful and legalistic LAW OF GIVING. The Law of SANGING makes the unholy trinity without which Tim would have to tune up his banjo or sell used computers.

Check out this FREE SERMON (nothing Christian is for sale and nothing for sale is Christian) to see that you are going to build YOUR church on the Foundation of the Apostates and Profits.

No literate person can believe that ANY form of music is not TOTALLY CONDEMNED in the Bible and UNIVERSALLY a mark of warfare and the perverted religionism where Sophia and Zoe replace Inanna, the holy whore of Babylon. Right on time for Revelation 18:22.

I need to feed you some of the material which makes it certain that the Bible and most of church history connects performance preachers to "singers and musicians" as practicing sorcery and are therefore PARASITES. You have been taken captive and ZOE or LUCIFER or the EVE principle has taken you captive and OF COURSE it is just AWESOME. But, uh! Our God is an AWEFUL God and for those who lack reverence and Godly fear He is still A CONSUMING FIRE. Isn't that one of the Zoeite themes? Along with LOOK TO THE HILLS which means to worship the HILL or MOUNTAIN gods because you cannot READ them words after you get discorded with Music. That is why Jude and the book of Enoch promises that God will come GET YOU with ten thousand of His saints to publish the MUSICAL DISCORDERS introduced by Miss Lucifer. "Only women and effemiante males fall into it" as we are told.

I have posted a reply to an HONEST question over on Ibelieve which proves that images and SINGING were introduced in the 4th century as BOOKS FOR THE ILLITERATE.


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...........................THE BOOK

What Happened At the Madison Church of Christ?

There are thousands of churches being taken over across America.

This book is only about one of those churches. It's about the Madison Church Of Christ. By studying the methods used here along with the resource references you might be able to inoculate your church. At the very least you will recognize the signs early on.

Many of the current members of the Madison Church of Christ still don't know what happened.
Some never will know! This book is for them as well.

Madison Church of Christ was a 60 year old church. At one time it was one of the largest churches in the US, and the largest Church of Christ.

It thrived for many years on the vision of it's elders and those of it's ministers. Those visions undoubtably came from the the inspired word of Jesus Christ.

At sometime in the last 10 years there was a deliberate plan by a majority of the elders to take the Madison Church of Christ into a more worldly realm.

They used secrecy, covert planning, and outside sources to scheme and to change the format and direction of the Madison Church of Christ.

The Elders knew that the membership would never approve such a plan. Using the tools of the "Community Church Movement"(consultants, books, seminars, meetings,planters,seeders) they slowly started initiating change so it was never noticed by the members until it was too late.....

At the heart of the plan was the fact that old members were going to be driven off so new techniques could be used to go out and reach the unchurched through new "Contemporary Holy Entertainment" methods developed by the "Community Church Movement"

Old members had to be kept on board long enough to get their plans ready, or the funds would not be there to pay for the new building. So by the plans very nature, it had to be secret.

The church had no plan in effect to renew or approve elders. There was never any need. The elders had always been "as approved by God". 10 of the last 15 elders would begin to shed some doubt on that.

The Elders did not even need a majority at first, because some of the elders went along unwittingly.

This edition starts shortly after some of the members begin to smell something strange in January 2001. Later editions may go back and fill in some of the timeline.

To even start to understand whats happening here, you must read the background materials in the first of the book.

This is only the first edition, and not the end. New editions will be printed as needed. To keep abreast of current changes, please visit our web site;

Here is the list of players;

5 Godly Elders
10 Not so Godly Elders
120 "Deacons" (allegiance unknown)
2,800 - 4,000 church "members"
2 "teners" (people who have publicly confessed to have broken all ten commandments)
Unknown number of "sinners" (This is what the 10 elders call us.)
Unknown number of "demons" (Flying everywhere, to many to count)

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