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Ken Sublett
(Login Ken.Sublett)
ConcernedMembersMadison
67.142.130.30

Fellowship with the Christian Church

January 18 2011, 12:20 PM 

Assertion: He writes in "The Lunenburg Letter" of 1837 after a lady criticise him for being too liberal in reference to Christians in church bodies that did not practice immersion: "There is no occasion, then for making immersion, on a profession of the faith, absolutely essential to a Christian---though it may be greatly essential to his sanctification and comfort.

Those who are perhaps predistined to sow discord claim that the Church of Christ became a SECTARIAN split from the Christian Church. In fact the Christian church was part of the Disciples. The handshake in 1832 is used as PROOF that the Churches of Christ UNITED or "came over to the Christian churches. However, the Stoneite hand shakers did not practice baptism and denied the ATONEMENT.

http://www.piney.com/AC.Lunenburg.Orig.html

the lady from Lunenburg to write the editor of the Harbinger is in an article entitled "Letters to England-No. 1," which was published in the June, 1837,

None of the false teachers have never read the Lunenburg correspondence. To Campbell a "c"hristian was one who lived according to Christian principles. We speak of a "c"hristian nation. However, a "C"hristian is ONLY one who has obeyed the gospel.

I. With all despatch, then, I hasten to show that I have neither conceded nor surrendered any thing for which I ever contended; but that on the contrary, the opinion now expressed, whether true or false, is one that I have always avowed.

(Footnote in original reads: It is with us as old as baptism for the remission of sins,
and this is at least as old as the "Christian Baptist." Read the first two numbers of that work.)

1. Let me ask, in the first place, what could mean all that we have written upon the union of Christians on apostolic grounds,
had we taught that all Christians in the world
were already united in our own community?

2. And in the second place, why should we so often have quoted and applied to apostate Christendom what the Spirit saith to saints in
Babylon--"Come out of her, my people, that you partake not of her sins,
and that you receive not of her plagues"--
had we imagined that the Lord had no people beyond the pale of our communion!

3. But let him that yet doubts, read the following passages from the Christian Baptist, April, 1825:--

"I have no idea of seeing, nor wish to see, the sects unite in one grand army.
This would be dangerous to our liberties and laws. For this the Saviour did not pray.
It is only the disciples dispersed among them
that reason and benevolence would call out of them,

"&c. &c. This looks very like our present opinion of Christians among the sects!!!
2d ed. Bethany, p. 85.

4. Again, speaking of purity of speech in order to the union of Christians, we say,

"None of you [Christians] have ever yet attempted to show
how Christians can be united on your
principles.

You have often showed how they may be divided, and how each party may hold its own,
but while you pray for the visible unity of the Disciples,
and advocate their visible disunity, we cannot understand you."
March, 1837, vol. 4.

Of those who refuse to preach baptism because the WILL be baptized Christians among the sects--He was one once but he CAME OUT OF BABYLON.

10. But in the last place in the first Extra on Baptism for Remission of Sins, we exclude from the pale of Christianity of the Pedobaptists,

none but such of them as "wilfully neglect this salvation,
and who, having the opportunity to be immersed for the remission of sins,
wilfully neglect or refuse"--"of such," indeed,

but of none others, we say, "We have as little hope for them
as they have for all who refuse salvation on their own terms of the gospel."
1st Extra, 1st ed. p. 53.


1. For those who refused to preach and practice BECAUSE there MIGHT be Christians within the sects, was to him an unforgiveable sin.

2. In 1837 Campbell--as he always did--denied that the Churches of Christ were part of the Christian Churches.

3. Campbell believed that there were Christians within the Christian church sect although in the 1832 the Stoneites did not. All of the efforts to confiscate churches of Christ in written form DENY that baptism is FOR or in order to the remission of sins.

4. If there were baptized believers, he told them to COME OUT OF BABYLON.

VIRTUALLY ALL OF THE DISCIPLES / CHRISTIAN CHURCHES REJECTED INSTRUMENTS ON THE BASIS OF NO BIBLICAL AUTHORITY BUT ALSO BECAUSE IT DESTROYED THE SPIRITUAL (MENTAL) ATMOSPHERE DEMANDED TO WORSHIP GOD: YOU WORSHIP WHATEVER YOU GIVE YOUR ATTENDANCE TO.

THE ADDITION OF INSTRUMENTS FORCED THE OWNERS TO FLEE BABYLON AND GRADUALY CONDITIONED THOSE WHO REJECTED INSTRUMENTS TO ENJOY THE LUST OF THE EYE AND THE LUST OF THE EAR (BARNES)

IF YOU ARE GIVING YOUR ATTENDANCE TO WORSHIP TEAMS YOU CANNOT AND HAVE NO INTENTION OF CENTERING THE SPIRIT ON CHRIST AND HIS WORD.

IT'S JUST A KNOWN PHYSICAL LIMITATION.

The ROLE of the assembly established in the wilderness is:

1Tim. 4:13 Till I come, give attendance to (the public)reading, to exhortation, to doctrine.
1Tim. 4:14 Neglect not the gift that is in thee, which was given thee by prophecy,
with the laying on of the hands of the presbytery.
1Tim. 4:15 Meditate upon these things; give thyself wholly to them; that thy profiting may appear to all.
1Tim. 4:16 Take heed unto thyself, and unto the doctrine;
continue in them: for in doing this thou shalt both save thyself,
and them that hear thee.

 
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Ken Sublett
(Login Ken.Sublett)
ConcernedMembersMadison
67.142.130.29

Damnation for PRETENSE is speaking, singing, playing: any hypocritic art.

January 22 2011, 5:21 PM 

One of the passages quoted by Luther in connection with the synagogue in Romans 15 which with all recorded history denounces music which replaces the Word is Micah which is the VOICE of the VICTIM where music derived from mystery means to "silence the voice of the victim."

Micah 2:1 WOE to them that [b]devise iniquity,[/b]
.....and work evil upon their beds when the morning is light,
.....they practise it, [b]because it is in the power of their hand[/b].

Micah 2:2 And they [b]covet fields,[/b] and take them by [b]violence[/b];
.....and houses, and take them away:
.....so they oppress a man and his house,
.....[b]even a man and his heritage[/b].
Mic. 3:10 They build up Zion with blood, and Jerusalem with iniquity.
Mic. 3:11 The [b]heads thereof judge for reward,[/b]
.....and the [b]priests thereof teach for hire,[/b]

H4242 mekh-eer' From an unused root meaning to buy; price, payment, wages:gain, hire, price, sold, worth.

and the [b]prophets thereof divine for money[/b]:

H7081 qesem keh'-sem From H7080 ; a lot; also [b]divination[/b] (including its fee), oracle:(reward of) divination, divine sentence, [b]witchcraft[/b].

Both divination and witchcraft includes the HYPOCRITES making pretence.
.....yet will they lean upon the LORD,
.....and say, Is not the LORD among us?
.....none evil can come upon us.
Mic. 3:12 Therefore shall Zion for your sake be plowed as a field,
.....and Jerusalem shall become heaps,
..... and the mountain of the house as the high places of the forest.

Jesus pronounced woes upon the Scribes and Pharisees: hypocrites includes preachers, singers and instrument players.

Matt. 23:14 Woe unto you, scribes and Pharisees, hypocrites!
.....for ye devour widows houses,
.....and for a pretence make long prayer:
.....therefore ye shall receive the greater damnation.

I finally saw how the words were used for my morning shock. You are not bound to read it.

Wouldn't it be wonderful that when you finally read Jesus pronouncement of DAMNATION on the hypocrites, which Christ pointed to preachers, singers and instrument players, that by reading the text we discover that the HYPOCRITES (only points to performers), the PRETENCE means:

Enter into a house, entry of the chorus, actors coming on the stage to perform the HYPOCRITIC arts and Crafts Paul excluded

Jesus is not speaking of HYPOCRITES making literal PRAYERS: They call out to make themselves famous, celebrate, celebrate with Abaddon's harp, sing as a minstrel, celebrate in song.

Jesus says they are doomed to DAMNATION. Christ in Isaiah 30 says that hell was prepared for them and the marks in sight and sound will be a sudden invasion of music. John called them sorcerers and consigned them to the Lake of Fire. I will post more and link to a page so you can read for yourself.

 
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Ken Sublett
(Login Ken.Sublett)
ConcernedMembersMadison
72.171.0.140

History refutes lie that Churches of Christ sowed discord

January 23 2011, 12:25 PM 

Again, really? What does history have to do with anything if what we are about is reading Scripture? Why don't we try to apply Scripture correctly rather than Luther's opinions?

History is important to refute and repudiate those who blame Alexander Campbell and others for SOWING DISCORD by rejecting instruments in the Qahal, Synagogue or Church of Christ in the wilderness: Chirst ordained the Holy convocation which was followed when the GENERAL POPULATION was assembled ONLY to hear the Word of God. Division happened primarily in the Disciples / Christian Churches.

The Campbells agreed with Christ:

Church is A School of Christ. Peter affirmed that by pointing to the prophets by Christ and the prophecies made more perfect by Jesus of Nazareth. That is the COMMANDED resources.

Worship is Reading and Musing The Word of God.


[linked image]

That is what Paul commanded:

SPEAK (excludes poetry or music) "That which is written for our learning" using one mind and one mouth. The one mouth points to the human "glossa" which EXCLUDES the glossa or mouthpieces of Judas' wind instrument.

Singing AND making melody (Grace) is IN THE HEART..

MORE ON LUTHER DEFINING ROMANS WITHOUT A TICK TO HIS "VENUE FOR ROCK AND ROLL."

55. It is plainly evident who have abolished divine service and still daily SUPPRESS it.
They are none but that hopeless rabble, the Pope and his blockheads the bishops and priests, monks and nuns,
whose great boast is of their divine services;
who delight to be called the spiritual class and,
by their juggling, grasp the advantages and honors of the world and live in riotousness.

Yet they pretend to help others to heaven with their foolish works and no mention of the Gospel.
Indeed, they persecute and condemn the Gospel,
[color=red]giving Peter just occasion to term them children of condemnation.[/color]

56. Note, Paul says divine service must be rendered with "one MIND" and with "one MOUTH."
We render divine service when we are harmonious,
and when we recognize our common equality and our common blessings in Christ;
when NONE exalts himself above another nor assumes special advantages.

Do you ask how it is we are equal, I reply: All outside of Christ are equally condemned. One needs Christ as much as another.When converted, all receive the same baptism and sacrament, the same faith, the same Christ and Spirit, the same Gospel--in a word, the same God.

Here in this wilderness the heavenly bread is impartially distributed.

Then how can it possibly be right for one to EXALT himself over his fellow spiritually,
one priest above the other? What can he have that surpasses Christ?
And each has the same Christ, and Christ receives each one unreservedly.

Luther and all disciples of Christ understand that all of the epistles CONDEMN the use of music which is a device of those "seing godliness as financial gain" or occupation.

2 Peter 2:13 And shall receive the reward of unrighteousness,
as they that count it pleasure to riot in the day time.
Spots they are and blemishes, sporting themselves
with their own deceivings [delusions] while they feast with you;

All musicians and rhetoricians are equated to parasites.

Entrupo (g1792) en-troo-fah'-o; from 1722 and 5171; to revel in: - sporting selves.
gamêliôi lechei [marriage couch-bed] hêdonais, playing in the wind, exult over, treat haughtily or contemptuously, made a mock of, tinos sumphorais, III. use or abuse at pleasure Paison paizô [pais]
4. to play (on an instrument), Hhymn. II. to sport, play, jest, joke, Hdt., Xen., etc.; p. pros tina to make sport of one, mock him,

[See Plato-Symposium]

http://www.piney.com/ClassPlatoSymposium.html

Symposium;


Then, said Eryximachus, as you are all agreed that drinking is to be voluntary, and that there is to be no compulsion,
I move, in the next place, that the flute-girl, who has just made her appearance,
be told to go away and play to herself, or,
if she likes, to the women who are within.
To-day let us have conversation instead;
and, if you will allow me, I will tell you what sort of conversation.

Jesus CAST OUT the flute girls and minstrels like dung to speak HIS Word.
tên...aulêtrida. It was the fashion at convivia to provide pipers, dancers,

So not even the vile Symposium of the Crooked Generation permitted wine and the flute-girl when there was something to be discussed.

A Levite "musician" who went NEAR any holy thing or IN a holy place was to be EXECUTED: a terminal offense just as was the musical idolatry at Mount Sinai.


 
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Fred Whaley
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173.162.22.85

Ken is winning!!!

January 26 2011, 4:00 PM 

55 current messages

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Keep up the fine work Ken!

Fred Whaley

 
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Ken Sublett
(Login Ken.Sublett)
ConcernedMembersMadison
67.142.130.49

Theiron: Beast "A New Style of Son or drama."

January 26 2011, 9:50 PM 

Some added notes (for students only) to my partial review of Tom Burgess who quotes lots of documents on the psallo word.

http://www.piney.com/Music.Burgess.98.html

Tom Burgess, the instrumentalists and liberals will be in FELLOWSHIP at the Pepperdine lecturship OF and BY and FOR theologians or "doctors of the law" Jesus said who take away the key to knowledge. You can bettcha that there will be no ANTI-instrumentalists there

Hom. Od. 1.125 And a carver lifted up and placed before them platters of all manner of meats, and set by them golden goblets, while a herald ever walked to and fro pouring them wine. Then in came the proud wooers, and thereafter [145] sat them down in rows on chairs and high seats. Heralds poured water over their hands, and maid-servants heaped by them bread in baskets, and youths filled the bowls brim full of drink; and they put forth their hands to the good cheer lying ready before them.
[150] Now after the wooers had put from them the desire of food and drink,
.....their hearts turned to other things, to song and to dance;
.....for these things are the crown of a feast.
And a herald put the beautiful lyre in the hands of Phemius, who sang perforce among the wooers; [155] and he struck the chords in prelude to his sweet lay.

But Telemachus spoke to flashing-eyed Athena, holding his head close, that the others might not hear: Dear stranger, wilt thou be wroth with me for the word that I shall say?
.....These men care for things like these, the lyre and song,
.....160] full easily, seeing that without atonement they devour the livelihood of another,
.....of a man whose white bones, it may be, rot in the rain as they lie upon the mainland,
.....or the wave rolls them in the sea


This is what Jesus said of the Scribes and Pharisees he called hypocrites by pointing to Christ in Ezekiel 33 marking entertainment preachers, singers and instrument players.

Tom thinks he finds a Psallo type word mening to play the harp. However, the word is psallein. This is in the context of a MUSICIAN so if he plucks a harp then he plucks a harp. However, a kitharista is a harp player: all instruments use compound words to indicateboth pluck or strike AND the name of an instrument.

toi ho phormizn aneballeto kalon aeidein.

anaball , B. more freq. in Med., strike up, begin to play or sing (cf. anabol 11), anaballeto kalon aeidein Od.1.155, 8.266, Theoc.6.20: abs., anabaleo Pi.N.7.77; anabalou Ar.Pax1269: c. acc., eukhn a. t Erti Philostr.Im.1.29.


The PSALLO means ONLY to smite or strike something: this is similar to the word used when Jesus "cast out the musical minstrels like dung" from His healing presence.

Pind. N. 7 Under the yoke of destiny, different men are held by different restraints. But it is by your favor that, even so, Sogenes the son of Thearion, distinguished by his excellence, is celebrated in song as glorious among pentathletes. For he lives in a city that loves music, the city of the Aeacidae with their clashing spears; [10] and they very much want to foster a spirit familiar with contests. If someone is successful in his deeds, he casts a cause for sweet thoughts into the streams of the Muses. For those great acts of prowess dwell in deep darkness, if they lack songs, and we know of only one way to hold a mirror up to fine deeds: [15] if, by the grace of Mnemosyne with her splendid headdress, one finds a recompense for toils in glorious song. Skillful men know the wind that will come on the day after tomorrow, and they do not suffer loss through the love of gain. The rich man and the poor man alike travel together to the boundary of death. [20] And I expect that the story of Odysseus came to exceed his experiences, through the sweet songs of Homer, since there is a certain solemnity in his lies and winged artfulness, and poetic skill deceives, seducing us with stories, and the heart of the mass of men is blind. For if [25] they had been able to see the truth, then mighty Aias, in anger over the arms, would never have planted in his chest the smooth sword

But to you, Thearion, she gives a due measure of prosperity, and while you have gained a bold spirit for fine deeds, [60] she does not impair the wisdom of your mind. I am your friend; averting the dark shadow of abuse, and bringing genuine glory, like streams of water, to the man who is dear to me, I shall praise him. This wage is worthy of good men. If any Achaean man is nearby [65] who lives above the Ionian sea, he will not find fault with me. I trust in my being their representative. And among my fellow townsmen, the glance of my eye is bright; I have not overshot the mark, and I have thrust all violence away from my path. May the rest of my days approach benevolently. Anyone who knows the truth will declare whether I follow a path that is out of tune, singing a twisted5 song. [70] Sogenes, of the Euxenid clan, I swear that I did not overstep the line when I hurled, like a bronze-cheeked javelin, my swift tonguea throw that disqualifies a man's strong neck from the sweat of the wrestling-match, before his limbs fall under the burning sun. If there was toil, greater delight follows. [75] Let me go on. If I rose too high and shouted loudly, I am not too rude to pay my debt of gratitude to the victor. It is easy to weave garlands. Strike up the song! The Muse welds together gold and white ivory with coral, the lily she has stolen from beneath the ocean's dew. [80] But in remembrance of Zeus and in honor of Nemea, whirl a far-famed strain of song, softly

 
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Fred Whaley
(no login)
173.162.22.85

Re: Theiron: Beast "A New Style of Son or drama."

January 27 2011, 8:39 AM 

This is an insightful and inspiring piece. Keep up the fine work Ken.

Fred Whaley

 
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Ken Sublett
(Login Ken.Sublett)
ConcernedMembersMadison
67.142.130.40

Good boy, Fred: one preacher out of the masses is not bad :-)

January 27 2011, 6:29 PM 

Much of the Bible identifies the prevaiing Greek, Roman and Jewish Worship to REPUDIATE the use of music which is always the WEAPON of those "intending to make the lambs dumb before the slaughter." Most children of that time would not fall sucker bait to anyone imposing MUSIC knowing that Jesus spoke of the Jewish Clergy as hypocrites (preachers, singers, instrument players) the MARK of someone entertaining in order to fleece the sheep.

HOMER SPEAK FOR ALL DECENT AND LITERATE SOCIETY:

(Butler 1.2) Then the suitors came in and took their places on the benches and seats.
......Forthwith men servants poured water over their hands,
......maids went round with the bread-baskets,
......pages filled the mixing-bowls with wine and water,
......and they laid their hands upon the good things that were before them.
......As soon as they had had enough to eat and drink they wanted music and dancing,
......which are the crowning embellishments of a banquet,
......so a servant brought a lyre to Phemios,
......whom they compelled perforce to sing to them.


PETER WARNING AGAINST THOSE WHO PRIVATE INTERPRET OR FURTHER EXPOUND FOR PAY BECAUSE THEY CORRUPT THE WORD-SELL BAD LEARNING AT RETAIL.

2 Peter 2:13 And shall receive the reward of unrighteousness,
......as they that count it pleasure to riot in the day time.
......Spots they are and blemishes, sporting themselves
......with their own deceivings [delusions] while they feast with you;

13 hdonn hgoumenoi tn en hmera truphn, spiloi kai mmoi entruphntes en tais apatais autn suneukhoumenoi humin,

Hedone A. enjoyment, pleasure, first in Simon.71, S.l.c., Hdt.1.24, al.; prop. of sensual pleasures,

Hgeomai , 2. c. dat. pers. et gen. rei, to be one's leader in a thing, theios aoidos . . hmin hgeisth . . orkhthmoio Od.23.134; h. tini sophias, ds, Lead, command in war.

God HIDES Himself from the Wise or Sophias: skilled in music and singing, in divination, in rhetoric

Truph- ,softness, delicacy, daintiness, 2 Ep.Pet.2.13; II. luxuriousness, wantonness, tn gunaikn h t. Ar.Lys.387; t. kai akolasia, t. kai malthakia, give oneself airs, be dainty, fastidious, Spoiled pets in the EKKLESIA

......Aristoph. Lys. 387
......Have the luxurious rites of the women glittered
......Their libertine show, their drumming tapped out crowds,
......The Sabazian (like the Jews) Mysteries summoned their mob,
......Adonis been wept to death on the terraces,
......As I could hear the last day in the Assembly?

......This is defined as the worship by the women of Tammuz in the Temple set up for pagan idolatry.

http://www.piney.com/MuTammuz.html

That is why ALL of those using music AS worship are forced to appeal to the sacrificial exorcist musicians God never commanded

No one is so ancient that they did not know that musical prophesying (witchery) was the world's OLDEST profession. Scholars note of the religious musicians who sang AND played an instrument (Anti-instruction) was "drunk, perverted or just having fun."

This is the PLAY at Mount Sinai: God turned them over to worship the starry host or Sabazianism: Music in the presence of God when He intends to teach is always deemed without redemption.

Paison paizô [pais] 4. play on a musical instrument, h.Ap.206: c. acc., Pan ho kalamophthogga paizn Ar.Ra.230; dance and sing, Pi. O.1.16. 5. play amorously, pros alllous X.Smp.9.2; meta tinos LXX Ge.26.8; of mares

HOMER SHOWING THAT SOMEONE NEEDS TO STAND IN THE GAP AND WARN THE TINY REMNANT.

Hom. Od. 1.3 As soon as he touched (the psallo word) his lyre and began to sing Telemakhos spoke low to Athena,
with his head close to hers that no man might hear.

"I hope, sir," said he,
......"that you will not be offended with what I am going to say.
......Singing comes cheap to those who do not pay for it,
......and all this is done at the cost of one whose bones lie rotting in some wilderness
......or grinding to powder in the surf. (That PSA prefex, Sop, Psallo)
...... If these men were to see my father come back to Ithaca
............they would pray for longer legs rather than a longer purse,
............for wealth would not serve them;


AND PETER WARNED ABOUT THOSE WHO DO NOT SPEAK THAT WHICH IS RECORDED FOR OUR MEMORY.

http://www.piney.com/2.Peter.1.html

2Pet. 2:14 Having eyes full of adultery,
......and that cannot cease from sin; beguiling unstable souls:
......an heart they have exercised with covetous practices; cursed children:
2Pet. 2:15 Which have forsaken the right way, and are gone astray,
......following the way of Balaam the son of Bosor,
......who loved the wages of unrighteousness;

......2 Cor 2:17 For we are not as many, which corrupt the word of God:
......but as of sincerity, but as of God, in the sight of God speak we in Christ.

......Kapeleuo (g2585) kap-ale-yoo'-o; from kapelos , (a huckster); to retail, i.e. (by impl.)
......to adulterate (fig.): - corrupt kapêl-euô , A. to be a retail-dealer, drive a petty trade..
.......kapêleu' drive a trade, chaffer with your vegetable food Hdt.1.155

2Pet. 2:16 But was rebuked for his iniquity:
......the dumb ass speaking with mans voice forbad the madness of the prophet.
2Pet. 2:17 These are wells without water, clouds that are carried with a tempest;
............to whom the mist of darkness is reserved for ever.
2Pet. 2:18 For when they speak great swelling words of vanity,
............they allure through the lusts of the flesh,
............through much wantonness, those that were clean escaped from them who live in error.
2Pet. 2:19 While they promise them liberty,
............they themselves are the servants of corruption: for of whom a man is overcome, of the same is he brought in bondage.




 
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Fred Whaley
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173.162.22.85

Re: Good boy, Fred: one preacher out of the masses is not bad :-)

January 28 2011, 8:37 AM 

This is another insightful and inspiring piece. Keep up the fine work Ken.

Fred Whaley

 
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Ken Sublett
(Login Ken.Sublett)
ConcernedMembersMadison
67.142.130.14

Bobby Valentine, Pepperdine, Unleashing the Holy Spirit

January 27 2011, 9:14 PM 

All of the sowing of discord in the last few decades derives from men who believe that if THEY believe something or just want to do it they have the endorsement of the "Holy Spirit" person. One of the discorders at Pepperdine this year claims that "a" spirit told him that God commanded instrumental praise and you had better not disobey. Of course, the PATTERNISM is for the burnt offering of the GOATS which Christ in the Prophets say that God did not command.

My first review will be my notes on K.C.Moser the "revived" authority on the Holy Spirit and other false teachings.

http://www.piney.com/Bobby.Valentine.Holy.Spirit.Unleashed.K.C.Moser.html

 
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Ken Sublett
(Login Ken.Sublett)
ConcernedMembersMadison
67.142.130.35

Review of Jay Guin: A new argument for instrumental music.

February 20 2011, 3:25 PM 

Jay Guin Thinks that knowledgable members of the Church of Christ believe.

That God commanded instruments for the temple worship.
The Temple has been replaced by the church.
Because people "worshiped" God with instruments outside of the temple.
It is authority for believers to conduct the assembly with "instrumental worship."

http://www.piney.com/Jay.Guin.Instrumental.Music.Old.Testament.html

First, no literate person in recorded history believed that God commanded king, kingdom, temple, sacrifices of innocent animals and instrumental noise to serve the slaughter priests.

Secondly, Christ ordained the qahal, synagogue or church of Christ in the wilderness as a school of the Word: for the irreverent Christ outlawed vocal or instrumental rejoicing.

Jay uses David "making merry" while moving the Ark to Zion as authority for music in the School of Christ. In fact, people are probably guided "beyond the sacred pages" to use as THEIR authority that which was always a mark of God's judgment.


Jay Guin: When the ark was being brought to Jerusalem, David and the people celebrated and worshiped with instrumental music as spontaneous worship and not as part of the formal liturgy of the Tabernacle.

(2Sa 6:5 ESV) 5 And David and all the house of Israel were making merry before the LORD, with songs and lyres and harps and tambourines and castanets and cymbals.


David was causing a large body of people and not just those of the tribe of Levi to "MAKE MERRY" which is the same rising up to PLAY performed at Mount Sinai. This was a sin beyond redemption and God abandoned them to their lusted after 'worship of the STARS."

I believe this is a cold, calculated way to separate people based on the MARKS. It is the confession of John's prophecy in Revelation 17-18.


[linked image]
[linked image]
[linked image]

So mock: eat, drink and make merry for you are an ACTOR of an event of Biblical Proportions.



 
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Ken Sublett
(Login Ken.Sublett)
ConcernedMembersMadison
199.27.128.187

What is the meaning of anathema?

March 14 2011, 10:00 PM 

People like to pronounce curses on you if you quote too much Bible in context, especially if you define words based on their meaning at the time of writing. The MYTHOS versus the LOGOS of post modernism doesn't worry about the text: they are tasked to write NEW MYTHS which always change with the culture. Culture is always that thing which is always changing on you.

http://www.piney.com/Logos.Mythos.Word.Versus.Music.html

Jesus was prepared to be the personified LOGOS and that is why He was so deadly on the musical minstrels. The neo-trinitarians or polytheists rely on the "spirit" person to guide them beyond the sacred pages: songs and sermons have no other meaning.

I have added the meaning of "Anathema" which is clearly defined as any performer: Scribes and Pharisees, hypocrites defined by Christ in Ezekiel 33 as "speakers, singers and instrument players" have self-dedicated themselves in a restored ceremonial system depending on the Levites for their patternism. The Levites cursed by Jacob had no inheritance in Israel.

When people dedicate themselves pretending that they add glory and honor to the word of God, they have slipped beyond the pale and "cannot be redeemed" and must be burned. God didn't command burnt offerings or the accompanying exorcism music. Therefore, once you sell your body into that ANATHEMA you cannot be redeemed.

http://www.piney.com/Adcox.Galatians1.1-10.html

The Book of Enoch quoted extensively in the New Testament defines those who fell into the music trap as those for whom God comes in judgment for.

Jude 13 Raging waves of the sea, foaming out their own shame; wandering stars, to whom is reserved the blackness of darkness for ever.

Jude 14 And Enoch also, the seventh from Adam, prophesied of these, saying, Behold, the Lord cometh with ten thousands of his saints,

Jude 15 To execute judgment upon all, and to convince all that are ungodly among them of all their ungodly deeds which they have ungodly committed, and of all their hard speeches which ungodly sinners have spoken against him.

Jude 16 These are murmurers, complainers [blaming Fate], walking after their own lusts; and their mouth speaketh great swelling words, having mens persons in admiration because of advantage.


1113. goggustes, gong-goos-tace´; from 1111; a grumbler: murmurer.

1114. goes, go´-ace; from goaw goao (to wail); properly, a wizard (as muttering spells), i.e. (by implication) an imposter: seducer.

goês A. sorcerer, wizard, Phoronis 2, Hdt.2.33,4.105, Pl.R. 380d, Phld.Ir.p.29 W.; g. epôidos Ludias apo chthonos E.Ba.234 , cf. Hipp.1038; prob. f.l. for boêisiHdt.7.191.

Epôidos [epaidô] I.singing to or over: as Subst. an enchanter, Eur.: c. gen. acting as a charm for or against, Aesch., Plat. 2. pass. sung or said after, morphês epôidonc alled after this form,
II. in metre, epôidos, ho, a verse or passage returning at intervals, a chorus, burden, refrain, as in Theocr.

 
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Ken Sublet
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2 Chronicles 33 proves that Ch 33 connects instruments to witchcraft.

April 8 2011, 10:51 PM 

2 Chronicles 33 proves that Instrumental Music patterned by 2 Chronicles 29 is universally understood to be witchcraft or sorcery. The testimony ends with Revelation 17 and the Babylon mother of harlots using the lusted after "fruits" in Revelation 18 as speakers, singers and instrument players. John says that the hypocritic operatives trying to defeat Jesus and His Word HAD deceived the whole world. They have been unleashed by Apollo (Abaddon, Apollyon) as SUN WORSHIP in Jerusalem and in a church near you. They Lake of Fire was prepared for anyone using their own imagination and saying that it is the will of God.

The 100% False Teachers using Hezekiah's Reformclaim that the SPIRIT told them that "God commanded instrumental praise and we should not disobey." This falls BETWEEN the pagan, musical rituals of 2 Chronicles 28 and chapter 33 where music is identified as the Worship of the Sun gods (Apollo, Abaddon, Apollyon). The SACRIFICIAL MUSIC was a PLAGUE STOPPING ceremony used to COLLECT the people close to Jerusalem to protect the KING'S hide. The PROOF TEXT false teachers use proves that they have been seduced by the same demonism.

2 Chronicles 28 speaks of the idolatrous worship
......which had polluted the Temple.
2 Chronicles 29 is a plague stopping animal sacrifice.
......God DID NOT command sacrifices OR the instruments.
2 Chronicles has Manassah restoring the Demonish:
......the words for singing and playing instruments proves
......that it was demonism.

http://www.piney.com/2.Chronicles.33.html

If in doubt read Acts 7 which proves that god ABANDONED Israel to worship the starry host because of musical idolatry at Mount Sinai.

I have looked up the Greek and Latin words all of which point to the worship of Apollo (Abaddon, Apollyon) in Revelation. John calls the sorcerers who HAD deceived the whole world.

How can you account for a man willing to lie about all of the Bible and recorded history ONLY causing up to 1/2 of the owners to cast themselves out of their synagogue. To be able to fool even half of the people is the meaning of Lying Wonders: it certainly is a sign.

 
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Ken Sublet
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ConcernedMembersMadison
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Why God HIDES from the WISE and Jesus does not pray for the WORLD

April 17 2011, 11:50 AM 

The problem on both sides of the issue is that they DENY Christ and are indeed ANTI-Christs and blasphemers by hiding from the fact that Christ defined the future REST in inclusive and exclusive terms. Peter affirms that Jesus Christ led by that same Spirit made the prophecies more certain. As Jesus commanded that "we teach that which HE commanded to be taught," in 2 Peter 1-2 Peter outlawed private interpretations or further expoundings: a MARK of a false teacher is that he does not teach "that which is written for our learning." Christ was EXPLICIT: we are just dumb and dumber.

Luke 11:48 Truly ye bear witness that ye allow the deeds of your fathers:
......for they indeed killed them, and ye build their sepulchres.
Luke 11:49 Therefore also said the WISDOM of God,
......I will send them prophets and apostles,
......and some of them they shall slay and persecute:
Luke 11:50 That the blood of all the prophets,
......which was shed from the foundation of the world,
......may be required of this generation;
Luke 11:51 From the blood of Abel unto the blood of Zacharias,
......which perished between the altar and the temple:
......verily I say unto you, It shall be required of this generation.

John 6:44 No man can come to me,
......except the Father which hath sent me draw him:
......and I will raise him up at the last day.
John 6:45 It is written in the prophets,
......And they shall be all taught of God.
......Every man therefore that hath heard,
......and hath learned of the Father, cometh unto me.

Baptism is the MARK or SEAL that one is a Disciple of Christ beginning in the Prophets. By being deliberately ignorant of the Prophets they blasphem the Spirit of Christ by denying that He outlawed all of the performing arts and crafts. They further blaspheme by claiming that their vain and evil imagination is the Spirit person speaking to them. Christ defined them in Jeremiah 23.

......Acts 2:41 Then they that gladly received his word were baptized:
......and the same day there were added unto them about three thousand souls.

Romans 1:2 (Which he had promised afore by his prophets in the holy scriptures,)

Ephesians 2:20 And are built
......upon the foundation of the apostles and prophets,
......Jesus Christ himself being the chief corner stone;

Ephesians 3:5 Which in other ages was not made known unto the sons of men,
......as it is now revealed unto his holy apostles and prophets by the Spirit;

Heb. 1:1 God, who at sundry times and in divers manners
......spake in time past unto the fathers by the prophets,
Heb. 1:2 Hath in these last days spoken unto us by his Son,
......whom he hath appointed heir of all things,
......by whom also he made the worlds;

James 5:10 Take, my brethren, the prophets, who have spoken in the name of the Lord,
......for an example of suffering affliction, and of patience.

1Peter 1:10 Of which salvation the prophets have enquired and searched diligently,
......who prophesied of the grace that should come unto you:
1Peter 1:11 Searching what, or what manner of time
......the Spirit of Christ which was in them did signify,
......when it testified beforehand the sufferings of Christ, and the glory that should follow.
1Peter 1:12 Unto whom it was revealed, that not unto themselves,
......but unto us they did minister the things, which are now reported unto you
......by them that have preached the gospel unto you with the Holy Ghost
......sent down from heaven; which things the angels desire to look into.

God the One Father in heaven made Jesus of Nazareth to be both Lord and Christ. When the father "breathed" on Jesus as the Son (Word) it was articulated into audible words. Jesus commanded that we teach that which HE commanded to be taught: if they cannot understand that then it is a MARK that God hides himself from the WISE (Sophists: preachers, singers, players, actors) and Jesus will not PRAY for those of the WORLD:

kosmos , metaph., of ornaments of speech, such as epithets, Id.9.9 (pl.), Arist.Rh.1408a14, Po.1457b2, 1458a33; hadumel k. keladein to sing sweet songs of praise, Pi.O.11 (10).13 (s.v.l.).
Pind. O. 11 My tongue wants to foster such themes; [10] but it is by the gift of a god that a man flourishes with a skillful mind, as with anything else. For the present rest assured, Hagesidamus son of Archestratus: for the sake of your boxing victory,
...... I shall loudly sing a sweet song, an adornment for your garland of golden olive,
...... [15] while I honor the race of the Western Locrians.
There, Muses, join in the victory-song; I shall pledge my word to you that we will find there a race that does not repel the stranger, or is inexperienced in fine deeds, but one that is wise and warlike too.


2Peter 1:19 We have also a more sure word of prophecy;
...... whereunto ye do well that ye take heed,
......as unto a light that shineth in a dark place,
......until the day dawn, and the day star arise in your hearts:
2Peter 1:20 Knowing this first, that no prophecy of the scripture
......is of any private interpretation. (further expounding)
2Peter 1:21 For the prophecy came not in old time by the will of man:
......but holy men of God spake as they were moved by the Holy Ghost.

2Pet. 3:2 That ye may be mindful of the words which were spoken before by the holy prophets,
......and of the commandment of us the apostles of the Lord and Saviour:

 
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Ken Sublet
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CENI

April 18 2011, 11:37 AM 

There is no preacher at any scholarly level who knows or needs to know that Christ spoke through the Prophets and Apostles.
Jesus called the Scribes and Pharisees, hypocrites and in Ezekiel 33 names self-speakers, singers and instrument players. A hypocrite literally speaks only to those PERFORMIN clergy roles for which they have no ROLE and no DOLE.

It is amazingly prophetic that the "angels of light" make a cottage industry out of tellying the dupes that God never said anything about Commands, Examples and Inferences (CENI). They hold "workshops of evil" and mock those who believe that when Christ speaks it is AFFIRMATIVE: if He says "command them what I have commanded to be taught" He does not have to tell the NON-DELUSIONAL people that "you can ALSO teach out of your evil imagination." This is obviously the WACO SYNDROME

CHRIST SAID OF THOSE WHO BUILD ON THE FOUNDATION OF THE NATIONAL SCRIBES.

Stand in the gate of the Lords house [courts], and proclaim there this word,
......and say, Hear the word of the Lord, all ye of Judah,
......that enter in at these gates to worship the Lord. Jeremiah 7:2

Thus saith the Lord of hosts, the God of Israel,
......Amend your ways and your doings,
......and I will cause you to dwell in this place. Jeremiah 7:3

Trust ye not in lying words, saying,
......The temple of the Lord, The temple of the Lord,
......The temple of the Lord, are these. Jeremiah 7:4

Jer. 8:8 How do ye say, We are wise, and the law of the LORD is WITH US?
......LO, CERTAINLY IN VAIN MADE HE IT;
......THE PEN OF THE SCRIBES IS in vain.

For I spake NOT unto your fathers, nor commanded them
......in the day that I brought them out of the land of Egypt,
......concerning burnt offerings or sacrifices: Jeremiah 7:22

Jer. 23:16 Thus saith the LORD of hosts,
......Hearken not unto the words of the prophets that prophesy unto you:
......they make you vain: they speak a vision of their own heart,
......and not out of the mouth of the LORD.

Jer 23:17 They say still unto them that despise me,
......The Lord hath said, Ye shall have peace;
......and they say unto every one that walketh
......after the imagination of his own heart,
......No evil shall come upon you.

Despise tthe Word of God of God and using your own words is:

Blasphm-e , pf. A. beblasphmka D.18.10:speak profanely of sacred things, eis theous Pl.R.381e; offer rash prayers,

1. Because Christ as Spirit spoke ONLY through the prophets.
2. Those who use use the pattern of the Lying Pen of the Scribes, in fact despise and ignore the SPIRIT message.
3. Christ in Jeremiah defines that as blasphemy

Hebrew: H5006 nâats naw-ats' A primitive root; to scorn; abhor, (give occasion to) blaspheme, contemn, despise, flourish, X great, provoke.

Any time hyou fabricate (work) a sermon which does not SPEAK that which is written for our learning, and substitute your own self-centered performance, that defines a hypocrite and a blasphemer.



 
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Ken Sublet
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ConcernedMembersMadison
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The Invasion of the Soul snatchers

April 26 2011, 5:40 PM 

It is amazing how many young men are out there cutting down the church which gives them an unlawful dole for an unlawful and destructive role.

They take advantage of the blogs etc and spread their venum and are quite able to prevent you from telling them that "the kings have no clothes." Even at graduate schools it seems that they have missed Bible reading 101a.

Jay Guin, Matt Dabbs and the PROGRESSIVE churches of Christ love Danny Corbitt's book which I have reviewed. Here is a sample from Matt Dabb's censored blog:

http://www.piney.com/Danny.Corbitt.Matt.Dabbs.Ripening.Issues.html

No one was so simple minded as to have missed the universal connection between music and making the lambs dumb before the slaughter.

-Xenophon, Socrates, Symposium 2
Habakkuk knew that the superstitious really believed that the musical sounds were the "voice of demons" living inside of the instrument: that is why the Catholics BAPTIZED bells, books, candles and pipe organs.

When the tables had been removed and the guests had poured a libation and sung a hymn, there entered a man from Syracuse, to give them an evening's merriment. He had with him a fine flute-girl, a dancing-girlone of those skilled in acrobatic tricks,and a very handsome boy, who was expert at playing the cither and at dancing; the Syracusan made money by exhibiting their performances as a spectacle

[2] They now played for the assemblage, the flute-girl on the flute, the boy on the cither; and it was agreed that both furnished capital amusement. Thereupon Socrates remarked: On my word, Callias, you are giving us a perfect dinner; for not only have you set before us a feast that is above criticism, but you are also offering us very delightful sights and sounds.

Xen. Sym. 3 After this the boy, attuning his lyre to the flute, played and sang,
......and won the applause of all; and brought from Charmides the remark,
......It seems to me, gentlemen, that, as Socrates said of the wine,
......so this blending of the young people's beauty and of the notes of the music
......lulls one's griefs to sleep and awakens the goddess of Love.

Sure, it is raw lust they use to attract the "bipolars"

This may be the Love we keep hearing about. However, Paul warned:

Ephesians 5:17 Wherefore be ye not unwise,
......but understanding what the will of the Lord is.
Eph. 5:18 And be not drunk [methun] with wine, wherein is excess;
......but be filled with the Spirit; (The Word of Christ Col 3:16; John 6:63)
Eph. 5:19 Speaking to yourselves
......\ in psalms and hymns and spiritual songs,
..........\ singing and making melody in your heart to the Lord;
Eph. 5:20 Giving thanks [praying] always for all things
......UNTO God and the Father
......in the name of our Lord Jesus Christ;

Kat-aule ,A. charm by flute-playing, tinos Pl.Lg.790e, cf. R.411a; tina Alciphr.2.1: metaph., se . . -s phob I will flute to you on a ghastly flute, E.HF871 (troch.):Pass., of persons, methun kai katauloumenos drinking wine to the strains of the flute, Pl.R.561c; k. pros khelnidos psophon to be played to on the flute with lyre accompaniment,



 
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Anonymous
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ConcernedMembersMadison
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Re: The Invasion of the Soul snatchers

April 30 2011, 11:08 AM 

4.30.11 John T. Willis 2. "Sing" is vocal; "make melody" is instrumental. Psalms 33:2-3; 144:9; 149:1, 3 make this crystal clear. Amos 5:23 further verifies this reality. People forget that God turned Israel over to worship the starry host because of musical idolatry at Mount Sinai. The Levites were under the KING and the COMMANDERS of the army: they made war and not worship. We will examine these passages in context.

http://www.piney.com/John.T.Willis.Instrumental.Melody.html


 
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Ken Sublett
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ConcernedMembersMadison
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Blasphey is saying that God commanded Instrumental "worship."

August 15 2011, 12:32 PM 

The Churches of Christ were never remotely connected to the Disciples / Christian Churches. They were the first to say that God Commanded Instrumental Worship and we MAY go and do likewise. The Mantra has accelerated to saying that GOD COMMANDED INSTRUMENTS and we will be disobedient if we do not comply.

If God DID NOT Command instruments even when He turned them over to worship the starry host.

Then Christ in Jeremiah says that they BLASPHEME the Holy Spirit


The Direct Command is to build the church on the foundation of the Prophets (by Christ) and the prophecies made more certain by Jesus of Nazareth.

All of the prophets repudiate the Jewish Monarchy as robbers and parasites: the Scribes had a lying pen and Jesus quoted Ezekiel 33 to NAME preachers, singers and instruments as hypocrites. Yes, you can have all of the Phds in the world and never be allowed to grasp the fatal fall from grace caused by musical idolatry at Mount Sinai. If you pay for the Free water of the Word you are violating the command of Christ in Isaiah 55.

http://www.piney.com/Instrumental.Music.Worship.Old.Testament.html

Anyone who claims that God commanded anyone to use instrumental music in a worship setting is:

Terminally ignorant
Or terminally evil.

Not even Judas--whose bag was for carrying the mouthpieces of wind instruments--knew that he was indwelled by Satan -- the Son of Perdition -- until Jesus gave him the SOP mark which is the rood meaning of PSALLO.

In all of the Bible and contemporaneous accounts--beginning with clay tablets--the fall into musical idolatry meant that you have fallen and cannot get up.

If you enable those who blaspheme the Holy Spirit of god then you are a blasphemer: God has no pity on the blind being led into the ditch (Pit meaning hell).

 
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Ken Sublett
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ConcernedMembersMadison
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Re: Maury Hills a Church of Christ

September 24 2011, 12:50 PM 

bump to top concerning the Judas Prophecy, fulfillment at the first advent and now being fulfilled before the second advent.

 
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Ken Sublett
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They burn witches, you know?

December 10 2011, 4:43 PM 

You can click on these blue links and be a DISCIPLE. HOW ABOUT THAT BLOOD ON THE MOON?

MAGICUS , a, um, adj., = ,

I.
of or belonging to magic, magic, magical (poet. and in post-Aug. prose): artes, Verg. A. 4,
493
: magicis auxiliis uti, Tib. 1, 8, 24: arma movere, Ov. M. 5, 197: superstitiones, Tac. A.
12, 59
: vanitates, Plin. 30, 1, 1, § 1: herbae, id. 24, 17, 99, § 156: aquae, Prop. 4, 1, 102
(5, 1, 106): di magici, that were invoked by incantations (as Pluto, Hecate, Proserpine), Tib. 1, 2,
62
; Luc. 6, 577: linguae, i. e. hieroglyphics, id. 3, 222; but lingua, skilled in incantations, Ov.
M. 7, 330
; Luc. 3, 224: cantus, Juv. 6, 610: magicae resonant ubi Memnone chordae,
mysterious, id. 15, 5.






 
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Ken Sublett
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Your institute is NOT A Church of Christ.

January 28 2012, 9:01 PM 

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There are thousands of churches being taken over across America.

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Many of the current members of the Madison Church of Christ still don't know what happened.
Some never will know! This book is for them as well.

Madison Church of Christ was a 60 year old church. At one time it was one of the largest churches in the US, and the largest Church of Christ.

It thrived for many years on the vision of it's elders and those of it's ministers. Those visions undoubtably came from the the inspired word of Jesus Christ.

At sometime in the last 10 years there was a deliberate plan by a majority of the elders to take the Madison Church of Christ into a more worldly realm.

They used secrecy, covert planning, and outside sources to scheme and to change the format and direction of the Madison Church of Christ.

The Elders knew that the membership would never approve such a plan. Using the tools of the "Community Church Movement"(consultants, books, seminars, meetings,planters,seeders) they slowly started initiating change so it was never noticed by the members until it was too late.....

At the heart of the plan was the fact that old members were going to be driven off so new techniques could be used to go out and reach the unchurched through new "Contemporary Holy Entertainment" methods developed by the "Community Church Movement"

Old members had to be kept on board long enough to get their plans ready, or the funds would not be there to pay for the new building. So by the plans very nature, it had to be secret.

The church had no plan in effect to renew or approve elders. There was never any need. The elders had always been "as approved by God". 10 of the last 15 elders would begin to shed some doubt on that.

The Elders did not even need a majority at first, because some of the elders went along unwittingly.

This edition starts shortly after some of the members begin to smell something strange in January 2001. Later editions may go back and fill in some of the timeline.

To even start to understand whats happening here, you must read the background materials in the first of the book.

This is only the first edition, and not the end. New editions will be printed as needed. To keep abreast of current changes, please visit our web site; http://www.concernedmembers.com/madison

Here is the list of players;

5 Godly Elders
10 Not so Godly Elders
120 "Deacons" (allegiance unknown)
2,800 - 4,000 church "members"
2 "teners" (people who have publicly confessed to have broken all ten commandments)
Unknown number of "sinners" (This is what the 10 elders call us.)
Unknown number of "demons" (Flying everywhere, to many to count)
 

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