If this sucks I may lose faith in humanity. This could be the greatest comic of all time, and I recommend it to anybody, especially if you don't like comics. This will convert you if you have an appreciation for any kind of literature.
... that said the comic versions of League of Extraordinary Gentlemen was awesome, V for Vendetta was amazing, the Silver Surfer origins were classics and the Hulk is pretty damn cool no matter how you slice it and they all managed to completely jack those stories up so anything is possible i guess.
Iron Man, The Wathcmen and possibly the new Hulk may be my only hope to see comics given their due on screen. Of course it could be that, comics are just better to appreciate with a decent imagination and a book, then a live action movie that rarely can live up to your mind's interpretation.
P.S. I swear I'm not a crazy comic nerd in person I know this kinda sounds like it, but man o man I'm not. I think I should just stop posting about comics and comic movies and leave myself in my already moderately deep self dug grave.... sits back with foot firmly in mouth
Turk - no worries. The re-vamped version of 'Batman' was/is friggin' awesome (and that is merely PG-13).
With 'Watchmen' (which I have had half an ear to the rail to since production began), director Zach Snyder (do I HAVE to mention the awesomeness of the 'Dawn of the Dead' remake again?) said it was gonna be a 2 1/2 or 3 hour long (hard) R-rated film, which probably bodes well for schmendricks like us.
The Watchmen has been a keystone in my graphic novel collection since I was in highschool. The years this has taken to finally see the light of day were to the benefit of the film. Many very, very talented people looked at making this, and I appreciate that fact. Thought went into who would make this, how and when.
The recent Batman pictures all draw their imagery directly from Frank Miller's Dark Night series (specifically, look at the discovery of the Batcave in DKR and the film), and Sin City belongs on anyone's list of perfect print-to-screen conversions of graphic novels.
So far, Alan Moore's work has never been properly translated on screen.I see no reason to expect goodness from this. There is no way it can improve on the comic and since I've read that, I've seen the best it can be.
You'll go see it and you know it. Plus, why so worried? Its in more than capable hands. I hear that Snyder fellow did pretty well adapting that 300 movie, and his Dawn remake bested the original IMO. I have plenty of faith in this one.
Dante I hate to say 300 was a good comic adaptation since the movie made me a tad angry, due to it's opportune timing and bordering on extreme racism, however it was very faithful to the comic and it was pretty damn stylishly put together. So I'm hoping he can do the same except this time with some better material.
Ok to begin with lets examine the Greeks/Persians in simplest terms.
Greeks - European, White, Christian, sexy as hell with those type abs and chiseled features that just make you want to... uhrm... I mean attractive to girls and insanely honorable and brave. O and I forgot the most democratic monarchy on the face of the planet where there are no slaves and corruption is a hindrance not the standard operating procedures.
Persians - Middle Easterners, black/brown, freakishly short or tall, deformed, owns slaves, everything about them is dark, dishonorable, ruthless, weak, over all just bad terrible people.
A movie pitting these two forces together, just happened to be released at the height of middle eastern /US aggression. I think this was one of the most opportune movies of all time. It was released after Sin City which is, as you know, written by Frank Miller, which was widely popular. It's based on a comic book movie, when comic movies are very popular. And it focuses on the superiority of the western world over the eastern world, when that very conflict is at its climax. I can see this being looked back on in 50 years and being compared to the propaganda films of WW2 and the Cold War. I mean the only difference is the special effects.
Now I just want it to be known that I don't identify with the Persians in the story, Turks aren't Persians, if anything Turks have more conflicts with people originating in the middle east then any other country, so the fact that the targets of the propaganda are middle easterners, it's just the fact that this actually happened almost subliminally, hidden in plain sight behind slow motion and amazing abs.
Well, yea. But its a comic book movie. Its supposed to be grossly over the top. Its not a historical drama and it doesn't pretend to be. Its little more than a cartoon. If I didn't know better I'd say it sounds like you forgot the source material and were expecting some kind of period piece. Our heroes and villans here are going to be the pretty boys and our villans are going to be monsters.
As for the propoganda...you are absolutely entitled to your own opinion and all, and it is an interesting one that I've never heard before, but this is Hollywood we're talking about here. Does anyone more vocally carry the liberal torch than that town? Do you really think that even 2% of the actors/director involved with this movie take a "pro war" stance? Also, this is pure summer popcorn fare. I just don't believe, especially considering the target audience here, that it in any way influenced someone's thoughts on foreign policy. In fact, considering the people who were so hard up for it, I just don't think there were many complete thoughts beyond "Dood friggin awesome he leik, totally rawked that guy!"
I've kept the source material very much in mind when making these distinctions. If you go back and look at all the propaganda spread for WW2 and the Cold War 85% were in comic/cartoon form.
I also agree that yes it was a comic book movie and however fantastically exaggerated it was it was "based" (I use the term loosely) on an actual event. That fact alone tends to link the movie to reality.
Now the liberal actors/directors I really don't think they have any say in a movie like this. All the actors in there were not big enough names to demand script changes and/or did not have the ability to turn down large chunks of money thrown there way just because it didn't agree with their liberal sensibilities. You'll notice it was suspiciously devoid of Susan Sarandon/Tim Robbins or anybody remotely in that ultra-liberal hollywood camp. I mean they were using stunt people and at best B-Level actors to fill integral roles, they knew that the key to this movie were the special effects and the ass kicking the 300 Spartans gave to the endless hordes of Persians.
After that's all said and done I actually think I own the original graphic novel it's based on and yes it was very faithful to it so I'm pretty sure Watchmen will be good also.
300 was not propaganda. The early propaganda cartoons and movies you referred to were influenced by a government office in Hollywood designed to bring such things about. No one within the government bore any influence on this film. It got made because someone wanted to make it and it just happened to be while Iran and the US were rattling sabers at each other. To say that this movie was in any way propaganda assumes that there is a well oiled machine that throws money to and fro and vaults our society from one geopolitical crisis to another. It's just not so. 300 was fiction based on some "real" stories. Crash was liberal propaganda, designed to make people think about treating each other better. 300 was summer popcorn piffle, designed to make teenagers excited.
Also, keep in mind, Iran is not an arab country. The Root of it's name is "Aryan" and native persians were blue eyed and fair skinned. This movie's complete departure from reatily marginalizes any propaganda value it might have had.
Go find some Russian films from the '60s. Those guys knew something about propaganda.
Honestly Turk, and with humility and respect, I'm telling you it was not propaganda.
@Marney - First I don't think I ever mentioned the word Arab so I don't know where ya going with that one. Second, you're correct maybe it wasn't a politically driven propaganda film, I may have come across as saying it was literally propaganda which is not my intent I was just comparing it to the early propaganda flicks to put the spot light on the racism involved. Persians at the time controlled all of the middle east and surrounding area and all the ethnicities and cultures that currently exist there (aside from some of the jewish community that moved there and the Turks) meaning that the Persian army in the movie was a cross section of all the cultures in the area at the time. I would have to say that while it may not have originated from a political camp it is a blatant attempt (successful) at cashing in on hostilities and political tensions by vilifying a whole people.
@Dante - could you see her as Leonidas? Throwing up the peace sign as she kicks people into the endless pit.
...no gigantic worldwide conspiracy, we can agree to disagree on the rest. I just don't think that anyone who had anything to do with this movie was ever thinking about world politics until Iran started blathering on about it.
As for the mention of Arabs, no you didn't mention it, but this was a discussion about race and the Middle East, so it bore mentioning that the movie never demonstrated this fact about the iranians. A hallmark of true propaganda is that you take a little known fact (Iranians are aryans) and twists it in some sinister way (cast the bad guy and his troop from Karate Kid, complete with costumes as one of the most badass outfits in the Persian empire).
It's nice to have a civil raciopolitical discussion.