Europe - AP
Display Says U.S. Has Worst Genocide
Thu Apr 8,10:01 PM ET
BRUSSELS, Belgium - A display praising the merits of peacekeeping that cited the killing of native North Americans as the world's worst genocide shouldn't be considered a jab at the United States, Belgian defense officials said Thursday.
Defense Ministry spokesman Gerard Vareng denied criticism that the display carried an anti-American message.
The display, shown at the monument of the Unknown Soldier in Brussels this week, was meant to honor Belgian soldiers who died in humanitarian missions.
It included a panel listing North America as the continent of the world's worst genocide with a death toll of 15 million, starting with Christopher Columbus' 1492 arrival in the New World but giving no end date.
The daily De Standaard called the display that was also covered extensively in a defense ministry publication insulting to Washington.
It said Defense Minister Andre Flahaut, who has tangled with U.S. officials in recent months, effectively blamed the United States for killing 15 million people "in a genocide that continues to this day."
The newspaper complained about a "curious" list of genocides that mentioned Nazi Germany, Rwanda, Cambodia, Armenia and other countries but ignored killings in the Soviet Union under Josef Stalin and Europe's colonial past in Africa, including Belgium's role in the Congo.
Vareng said "the peacekeeping display was the work of historical experts. They took the list of genocides and the numbers of people who died in them on the Encyclopedia of Genocide" by Israel W. Charny, head of the Institute on the Holocaust and Genocide in Jerusalem.
He said the two-volume encyclopedia, published in 1999, is a "very serious book that deals with all kinds of genocides."
The ceremony this week at the Monument of the Unknown Soldier coincided with the 10th anniversary of the Rwandan genocide in which at least 500,000 people died. Estimates have ranged as high as 1 million.
the guy is a moron, but facts stand
by: MatthiasNijskens (27/M/Belgium)
this minister of defence of ours is truly VERY stupid; that's unfortunately the price to pay in democracy: sometimes moros get elected...
The list of genocides in that article is indeed incomplete, but the existing genocides actuallay happened...people like to forget it sometimes.
Re: the guy is a moron, but facts stand
Major point. Since 1776, what is the count? Also: The 15 million number seems a bit high given the state of agriculture and very small size of population centers.
Why was Mao left off the list? Or Stalin?
Includes Spain, Portugal, France?
Spain killed a few million Native Americans. Is that included in the total?
In any case, the young USA grew strong hy eating children (American Indians). Slaves and indentured servents did their part too. A violent age.
The bastard knows exactly where and
how the millions were killed, but his list is influenced by the marxist ideas. Fascists are bad, and imperialists are bad. But no 'progressive' murderers should be mentioned. Even if they killed twice as many people as the mentioned ones.
Well, it's true
Throw in the African slaves who died on the way, and the body count is horrific.
These people died for our freedom too.
Dutch Genocide In The Pacific Islands
I seem to recall the Dutch, in a bid to keep control of the spice trade of nutmeg, used genocide to gain and keep control of some of the Islands around Indonesia, back in the day. I think they paid Japanese settlers to do most of the dirty work, but it was the "Duch Master's" plan.
There is enough genocide to go around: Dutch, France, Spain, Briton, China (tibet, and the Uighurs), Japan (China & Korea), And all of the native and minority populations of EVERY Muslim nation on earth.
Remember...Turkey was once Byzantine and Istanbul was called Constantinople, had no ethnic Turks until they invaded and claimed the land and survivors for Islam.
Re: Dutch Genocide In The Pacific Island
It is well founded, as the Dutch had the most horrific reputation (as most if not all Germanics did) for cruelty even in contemporary times and they did slaughter entire populations - on small islands.
I have yet to see where France committed genocide (as opposed to massacres, which we did) but I am open to new knowledge.
I guess the Mongols slipped by
by: squigoth (43/M/Killeen TX)
Now they knew how to do genocide the right way: they never got cought...LOL Mongols (distant cousins of Native Americans) did the most horrific of crimes and wholesale massacres throughout Euroasia.
Re: I guess the Mongols slipped by
by: el_tigre_larry (M/Grove City, OH)
How about the Chinese Cultural Revolution? How many died there?
How about the Communist takeover of Vietnam?
How about the killing of aboriginal people in Northern Canada and Australia?
And what about the Spanish Inquisition?
Come on, we can take about this until our tongues fall out, but the real message in the article was about a European politician's opposition to someone that he dislikes. How many Native Americans did President Bush kill or order killed? Why didn't this display come out when Clinton was in office?
Think about those questions!!!!!!!!
Every power has conquered another group to gain power. Ask the Native Americans, ask the Irish, ask anyone who has been integrated into another society. Still, from the Native American point of view, Europeans invaded their home, claimed to be their friends, introduced them to alcoholism, previously unknown diseases, and lust for money, then turned on them and regarded them as inhuman savages, herded them like cattle onto reservations, and killed them for not becoming like the Europeans who now called themselves Americans. We say that our country is founded on the principles of religious freedom, life, liberty, and the pursuit of happiness, but only if that means you want to speak English and make lots of money, all the while saying what everyone wants to hear.
If you truly believe that American Indians have not been treated badly, explain why, out of all groups in the US, they have the highest rates of poverty, alcoholism, and suicide. We have reservations in our country as bad off as any third world country (Pine Ridge, to name one) and we turn a blind eye towards them while "liberating" Iraq, halfway across the world. The only time American history got it right was in reporting the massacre of General George Armstrong Custer and his army, and even then people tried to make him the hero. How would we feel if some powerful government came over here and waged a war to liberate the oppressed Native American community from the tyranny of Euro-descendant American rule? Every coin has two sides, people, and we should all examine both of them.
Pot calling the Kettle black?.
by: cyberstud_pr (M/US)
Belgium has the audacity of judging another nation's mass killing?. Hey Belgium, what about all those mass killings you did in Africa under the rule of King Leopold of Belgium?. You really should check your own history of murders before you talk about other countries. Bunch of lousy hypocrites!.
Disease vs intentional murder
by: jftjftjft2000 (M/N.H.)
Isn't it true that diseases caused most of the deaths of Native Americans, because their immune systems were not prepaired for this type of outside contact? If this is the case then this would certainly be different than murder per se. I think most people have heard of the blanket business. However, I think the small pox blanket theme would account for an extremely small % of those killed by disease.
Worst Killings in History:
by: neutron_truth2002 (29/M/USA)
Heres the BIG LIST !
1. Mao (China) : 40 - 50 million people.
2. Stalin (USSR): 25 - 30 million people
3. Hitler (Germany): 6 million
4. Gen Yahya Khan (Pakistan): 2.5 million
5. Pol Pot (Cambodia): 1.5- 2 million
6. Rwanda: 1.5 million.
The next lot:
Native Americans were displaced.
Aborgines were displaced too.
Islamic zealots and Christian colonists killed
either spreading their religion or in the process of colonizing.
Death tolls would not be as high however as those perpetuated in the 20th century.
However say deaths due to negligence in adminstration are there. E.g many famines in India were due to British adminstrative and political negligence and definitely avoidable.
It wasn't genocide
it was nature, Humans have always wiped out the weaker tribe. yup, it is biology and it cycles over and over untill the top predator becomes the deposed and the cycle begins again with what is then left. we'd sort of hoped we'd become creatures more like sheep but it isnt gonna happen. these situations will continue as the behavior of what we are untill we are not. http://www.hawaii.edu/powerkills/20TH.HTM
its scary to folks like me who have had it all (at the expence of all else) for so long to see what we know must happen-happening but it is what these pompous monkeys are, have always been and will be.
the bottom line is
that can be drawn from the American messages on the board is that "we are not so bad, there have been worse genocides in the past" Well, congrats on the 2nd or 3rd - whatever, place.
The world according to McGut
by: pounce_uk (42/M/England)
>>"How many civilians have you killed in Serbia, in Kosovo, in Afghanistan, in Iraq?"<<
Well Neil, the civil war in Yugoslavia killed a lot more people than the people who died when America wnet in to put a stop to it.
Kosovo I will give you. But note the only reason the world went in, was because the media painted the picture that thousands were getting killed.. Remember that do you?
Afghanistan funny how more people have died in the years since Russia invaded in 79 than since the Americans removed the taliban
Please even with the current crop of deaths it isn't even a shade on the deaths that happened under Saddam.
Please try again. McGut.