The maximum number of strokes of the cane a school pupil could receive was six strokes. In my school day it was known as 'six of the best'. I was wondering how many of you actually received the full six and how it was given (all on the bottom, all six on one hand, three on each hand etc.); who administered the punishment? and other information?

The norm in my school was for two strokes on the left hand. Repeat offenders got two on each hand , but I never knew anyone who got six.

One boy ( and there were probably others)got six smacks of the slipper. He was told by the PE teacher to collect a large gym shoe from the storeroom. He came back with the smallest one he could find, so the teacher upped the punishment to six.

At junior school there were regular severe slipperings of at least four, probably a few got six . One teacher used to reverse the slipper and smack you with the heel of it, thankfully I didn't get one of these, but it must have caused bruising, which a normal slippering would not.

Hi Nathan,
I was caned 4 times in my school years and the last time in the 5th year i received the dreaded six of the best from the headmaster along with 4 mates who had been in trouble with me. We all waited nervously outside the heads study as instructed dreading the moment when the door opened and we all lined up in front of the heads desk for one hell of a telling off our eyes fixed on the cane that was placed on one side. After which we had to line up on one side of the room and one by one called forward to bend over the desk to be given 6 really good strokes,amazing how quick it seemed as the first two received their punishment. I was third in line and could feel my legs shaking and stomach churning as i waited my turn, it was scary to say the least.Although 15 i could feel tears welling up in my eyes and the pain of the strokes was agony for a 15 year old.It all seemed over very quick after the apprehension of the waiting etc and afterwards we all went down to the craft block toilets to see the results of the headmasters efforts. As to be expected 5 well marked stinging bums on display but we survived the ordeal and as my father said we got what we deserved and thinking back he was right of course, but what an experience with so many emotions.
Did you get a 6 stroke caning Nathan?

It was the tawse, more commonly known as "the strap" or "the belt", they used at my schools. We had to hold out a hand, or hold out both hands with one on top of the other (usually known as "crossed hands" or "doublers")in order to be punished.

The belts the teachers used were made from very thick, hard and dense tan coloured leather, usually more than 1/4" thick, and about 2 feet long. The "punishing end" of the belt was slit into 2 (and sometimes 3) tails, and they hurt like hell.

A normal punishment was one or two strokes. Some teachers asked for the non writing hand to be presented for punishment, but most simply belted whatever hand the pupil held out. More serious, or repeat offences, might attract 3 or 4 strokes, with 6 being reserved for the most serious offences. I only saw "6 of the best" being administered twice. One was to a S2 boy who had been persistantly truanting and the other to a S3 boy who had beaten up 2 S1 boys in the playground. Both struggled to take their punishment, were slow to get their hands up for the next stroke, and delayed the next application by puffing and blowing, hands between thighs or cupping them to mouth and blowing into them.

The sting of the belt was intense to excruciating for about 10 to 15 minutes after it was administered and then started to diminish slowly over the next hour or so. It was something you never forgot.

Hi Nathan

I had six strokes of the cane on three separate occasions - the second and third time I was caught smoking and once for being caught "out of bounds" with my boyfriend. I usually describe the caning I got the third time I was caught smoking as "six of the VERY best" so I think that would meet anyone's criterion for "six of the best" Whether the other two sixes could be called "of the best" is open to interpretation.

I also received quite a few sixes with the slipper and some of those could be called "of the best" too.

Slipperings given by the PE mistress were usually through my gym knickers but some (for example, "forgetting" PE kit) were through my skirt. Our skirts were never lifted for the cane or slipper but if they weren't long enough to provide coverage when we bent over (as mine often wasn't) we'd get it through our knickers.

Hi Nathan. You said above:


At your school in your time, perhaps. However this was not a universal rule, and there are reliable reports in this estimable Forum of more than 6 strokes of the cane being administered in a scholastic context.

You also said of 6 strokes of the cane:


I was never caned at school but many people who were, and some of those who have had to administer the cane as part of their duties, seem to agree that there was a difference between 6 strokes of the cane and 6 of the best, the latter being substantially more painful as a consequence of the technique used to administer the punishment. Indeed, my esteemed fellow contributor Jenny makes this very point in her post above.

I got 'six of the best' four times at school. I got six strokes at least four other times. At my school, there really did seem to be a distinction - any six stroke caning was called 'six of the best', but there were times it was on an utterly different scale from any other caning.

The first time I got it, I was caught stealing money from the school library. I'd already had what I suppose I could call 'three of the best' (the first few canings I got at school were fairly tame affairs and I'd developed an idea that the cane wasn't that bad - so when my Headmaster caned me for the first time... . the first stroke of what was my first properly done caning came as a great shock I could not believe anything could hurt that much. I thought something had gone wrong and I tried to tell the Headmaster this tried to tell him he was caning me too hard. I was horrified when he told me that he knew exactly what he was doing and that if I didn't bend over again, I'd get extra strokes and when I continued to argue, he pushed me back down and told me I was now getting three instead of the two hed been planning on. After the third when he left me get back up, he told me very clearly that he knew exactly how much he'd hurt me and he could make it hurt even more and I should just try and imagine what six of the best felt like next time I thought about misbehaving.) When I was caught stealing (and I'd arranged things so another boy had been blamed for a previous theft and been caned for it) I knew I was in for it, and the Headmaster did not disappoint. It was excruciating. Six of the best across my underpants.

My second six of the best was similar, but in front of my entire form when I was reported to the school for shoplifting. My third was in private but followed police attending the school to search my locker.

The fourth one came at the start of my last year at school. My behaviour had improved a lot by then - at least I was no longer breaking the law, still got into a lot of little trouble though. The Headmaster took me into his office and gave me six of the best and told me that I would get the same everytime I broke a rule from now on. I think I'd had about half a dozen 'minor' canings the previous year, and he said that they obviously didn't have an impact on me, so from now on, any rulebreaking and it would be six of the best everytime.

I never got caned again. Anytime I thought about breaking the rules, I just remembered that.

But like I say, there were other times I got six, which just weren't that bad. I'm not saying they were enjoyable! Especially as I didn't deserve most of them. But there was a difference between just getting six normal strokes, and getting six that an expert was intent on making an impression on my backside.

When I give six, I try to do that myself. I don't think I'm as good at it as my Headmaster was, but as I said, that last one set me completely straight.

Carter,

I am surprised at your crimes and more surprised still that you admit to them, even semi anonymously, here. You should be aware that students at your school have discovered this forum and posted here. You risk being outed at school.

When I was at school there was a hierarchy of acceptability of offences among the students which did not match the severity on the punishments. Dishonesty and sneakiness were generally condemned by all and there was no sympathy for the offenders. Caned thieves were very slow to be accepted back into the fold. Other offences caused the students little or no offence although we might think some boys were a bit stupid or inept to get caught.

I was only caned twice , once four strokes, second time 'six of the best'.

Are 'the best' different? I would say yes. On receiving the last of the first four, I was told , this one is really going to hurt.....and that was no exaggeration. I was then told : -

'Come back again , and its six like that last one!' Perhaps the fist three weren't seen as achieving what they should

the crime as I've written elsewhere .......'general attitude'.

The sixer didn't come until the sixth form. Again I have written this in detail, but in brief , the head had found posters and literature 'libeling him' displayed in a teaching block. the ever helpful head janitor had provided names of those seen in the areas directly after last classes and he interviewed us all. I could have played three wise monkeys like everybody else , but I didn't. I told him I didn't do it . Accepted. But I knew who did , but couldn't tell him , honor code in the school.


He tried to persuade me . No deal . In the sixth you were suspended , if you preferred caning it was for you to say so. I did.


He offered to give me a one days suspension , timed on a half holiday the effect of which would have been I 'lost' one lesson - double maths. I said no it would be on my school record , cane me pleases instead. that meant under the agreement six of the best. He clearly didn't want to do it , saw it making me a martyr. However my reason for insisting was political . He had already caned two upper fifths for refusing to confirm who was there. I didn't know they had also been insolent and abusive..........they never said that .

After deliberation I insisted on the caning , He did it . I remember peering at his bookshelf , ( he insisted on touching toes, well in my case hands on knees sufficed .) top row and trying to memorize them to distract me from the pain. Not very effective. Anyway he gave me four really hard ones .I felt they were cutting right into me , far worse than I anticipated , and I had to wait between strokes, .....you think.....why did I get myself into this ! I was nearly breaking, and am sure I would have done with two more. But the last two eased off in my view, and I stood them quite well.

When the caning was over I shook the heads hand formally..He told me I'd taken it well, I should be proud, and then let me go to comfort myself .....omg but I stayed unmoved with him!!!. He held an MC . you don't let someone like that see you are in real pain.

But I never went back for another dose!

A fortnight later he offered me a full boarding scholarship for the rest of my time in the school. Was it related ? Dunno.

Frankly I was a bloody fool , making myself a political martyr for the sake of it . Idiot , proud idiot! And when I found out what the fifths had done did I feel stupid!

There are newspaper articles, two books and a TV documentary about my childhood (actually they were primarily about other people, but I was on the edges of what they were doing, and I do appear as a minor 'character') are out there. There's no great point in me trying to hide these things at this point. And with my students, I don't. My major 'crimes' were all committed before I was 13 years old as well. I've no huge problem with anybody knowing I was a very naughty little boy, which is not that far from the truth.

If I'd been involved in drugs, or something like that, I might be worried. But the fact is, I was involved in software piracy and computer hacking. Making sure my students know that, gives me credibility when I tell them that it's something to steer clear of. It's not glamorous, it's not victimless, and it can have serious long term consequences - I was lucky I was only 13 when it all caught up with me, because if I'd been even a year older, I would have definitely wound up in court and stood a good chance of going into youth detention.



The same applied at my school. I was ostracised severely for stealing from the library, and when I was caught shoplifting, it simply confirmed to everybody that I hadn't changed. I was horribly unpopular for a long time - not just because of this, but it certainly didn't help. In fact, I doubt I'd have stolen at school in the first place if I hadn't been so unpopular. Not that unpopularity was an excuse, but I was totally miserable, had no friends, and the money I stole was u It actually started to change after the police came to the school - when newspaper stories were talking about people who'd been 'hacking into NASA' and people knew I had some sort of vague involvement with that, and all I could say was "I'm not allowed to say anything.", I became pretty cool.

Although "six" was a traditional number for maximum strokes it often had no legal basis. Some local authorities specified six, some eight. Private schools might stick to a traditional six but there is plenty of evidence that Ms Thomas at Rodney School, for example, gave more strokes.

At my grammar school only the Headmaster caned, and he usually administered 3 strokes. This was abruptly changed to six with the arrival of a new Head from a well known public school. This was much disquiet about this development, not only from the boys but also from the Senior staff and ultimately the school governors...he did not stay long.

RB

Six of the best was the most severe punishment administered at my school back in the late 1950's early '60's. I guess it might have been awarded on average once every week or two in a school with about 400 boys. Four of the best was much more common.

There were canings probably every school day but mainly 1's and 2's. Sixth form canings were rare but always six strokes laid on with maximum force. There might have been one such caning a term, if that, on average.

A few boys collected 4's and 6's faster than the rest of us collected 1's and 2's. They were inept and lacking in judgement rather than wicked. The caning did not seem to do them any harm but not much good either. However, their canings certainly helped keep the rest of us in line.

I do not know of any boy being suspended or expelled. Apparently, a good caning was able to fix most things. Mind you, serious offences in those days seem rather innocuous by todays standards. Depriving a boy of his education was seen as a very serious matter.

Our geography teacher had a reputation as a ferocious caning. He never needed to cane anyone in my class in the years he taught me.

I never got six myself and was glad of it. One very experienced boy warned me that six really hurt and was markedly worse than four. His butt was poorly padded and similar to mine at the time.

Hi Carter. Well, I have to say that you'd already given a clue here that you know a bit more than average about computing matters. If you were in on what I think you were in on as a boy I have very considerable respect for your technical expertise! I hope that you won't hesitate to step into our Computing Corner thread if you see a topic that interests you.

When certain the full six cuts of the cane was on the cards I used to be full of fear,with my hands clammy,butterflies in my tummy,and trembling in my black leather lace up shoes.Six cuts mean't there was no way I wasn't going to cry and blub like a little boy instead of the big teenager I thought of myself as.The six excruciating cuts were also going to make sitting and concentrating on my lessons impossible as those stinging throbbing stripes were my only concern.O how I would squirm on the hard wooden seat of my desk

I did receive the full six strokes of the cane in high school. My Deputy headmaster gave me six strokes of the cane on my hands and typically the punishment was 3 strokes on each hand but I did witness our woodwork master give one boy all six on the boy's right hand. I can never fully understand why the cane was administered to the hands and I would have preferred to have been caned on my bottom instead.

Nathan,

Perhaps it was because your teacher thought you might prefer the cane across your buttocks that he caned your hands! Since when was a decision on where to administer school CP down to the preferences of the individual pupil about to be punished?

In Scotland the tawse was virtually always administered to the palm of the hands, regardless of how many strokes were to be given. This could be more effective than to a clothing protected bottom and avoided the potential sexual element that might be involved for some in chastising the buttocks.

From a Scottish perspective it is surprising how often you English lads had your bottoms slippered or caned. No wonder all the excitement! I would suggest that the tawse on the hands was sorer, quicker and less humiliating and embarrasing.

Nelly,

Actually I have heard verbatim of a number of schools where choice of punishment between hand or buttock caning was offered.

At one famous London Catholic school the choice was "hand or behind, now or later".

At Kent public school attended by a colleague in the early 1970s boys were invited to select which cane they wished to be used, the choice included a bat like object.

At a Yorkshire Comprehensive, late 60s/early 70s, both boys and girls were offered choice of hand or buttocks punishment.

I believe our dear friend Ms Thomas is reputed to have offered the girls a choice at Rodney.

From what I have heard most people (even girls) preffered to be caned on the buttocks, albeit my sample is small.

Regards

RB

Rodney,

My how you English boys and girls were spoiled for choice, obviously your teachers were far too soft with you! Would you prefer the slipper or the cane, young man? Hands or bottom? Now or later? Hard or soft? Please tell me if it's too sore and I'll do it more gently, or I'll stop right away. Interesting that you have these reports of choices being offered.

Over 150 years ago, when the tawse was administered across the buttocks, boys didn't like the change to having their hands leathered as there was no protection or padding. Perhaps that's why down south many preferred the cane or slipper across the bottom with trousers, skirts and pants to give protection and take away the sharpest sting of the punishment. Nothing like a bit of padding to help protect the rear.

Up here we did as we were told and any choices were left to the teacher. To belt him/them now or at the end of the period? How many strokes and how hard? Single hand or crossed hands? We didn't have to think over the options, all the thinking was done for us. Our function was to obey, get our hands up for the belt and endure what came, like lambs to the slaughter.

I had six strokes of the cane, pretty full on from memory, from the now infamous Mr. Derek Slade when I was a pupil at St George's School in Suffolk. My offense was to have been caught with a copy of a porn magazine called, from memory, 'Fiesta' (nothing at all to do with the eponymous car, I can assure you!), that had been passed around my classmates and had, not to put too fine a point on it, acquired some rather sticky pages by the time it got to me. I was 13 at the time.

I received 6 strokes on my bottom as well as my hands and I think that the 6 strokes I received on my hands hurt more than the 6 strokes I had on my bottom, despite that I had received 3 strokes on each hand when I received 6 of the best on my hands. Thankyou for your replies and best wishes

I'm reading it and I will comment on anything I think I can, but it's actually been about ten years now since I've done any really heavy duty computing (I worked on Y2K and sort of burned myself out). I still tinker. And even then - most of my 'mad skillz' are in areas which aren't that important anymore. There's a lot less X.25 networks around than there used to be and most of the ones that still exist just aren't as fun as they once were - besides what I thought was fun then... well, not a good idea to think of it that way as a mature adult. And the potential consequences are a lot greater than a sore bottom.

I received several lower numbers at school normally two or three strokes but in the fifth form I received three "six of the bests" and yes they really were the best, the last time was on thin PE shorts and that left a long term impression I can tell you.

From the age of 13 to 15 I was caned 3 times, mostly for disruptive behaviour in the classroom of my
Grammar School. The first caning was administered bending over a table to my trousered bottom. The second
in my pants and the third and final one across my bare bottom. The first two occassions were very painful
but the third was so severe over a week past before the bruises began to fade. I was caned slowly and
deliberately with a good 30 seconds between each of the six strokes. Expertly the headmaster aimed to beat my bottom from top to bottom without striking the same place twice. Every stroke that fell reduced me to my knees on the floor screaming out with pain and clutching my buttocks as if to ease the pain. The headmaster on the other hand was enjoying wealding the cane with great force made more painful by the fact that I was of slim build with slender legs and my small firm bottom confined the target areas intensity. When it was over, to relieve the pain, he massaged my bottom with Calamine lotion to reduce the bruising. This continued for a good 10 minutes, telling me all the time that he was sorry to beat me so hard as he was very fond of me. Looking back I wonder whether he received physical gratification from caning me and watching my buttocks quiver as he beat me. Perhaps, if the caning had taken place off school premises I might have been sexually abused. I'll never know.

I was caned a total of four times at my (boys only) secondary school in the 60s, and on two of those occasions I was given the maximum six strokes. The first time was when I was in the third year, aged 14, for fighting in the playground (any boy caught fighting was given six), and the second was in the fourth year, aged 15, for climbing onto part of the school roof to retrieve a football.

Looks like Norman's tale has given him such a bad attack of baloneyphobia that he's lost for words!

Alan Turing is quite correct. I tried and failed to find the right words.

I wonder what Norman wishes to achieve by writing such a post?

I apologise to Alan Turing for mistakenly thinking Your Local Council's post was from him. I can't think how I possibly made that error.

the only time i received the cane at school was in my last year,was when i was 17 year old senior boy, the caning was allways done after school on a friday, as to try and mess up your weekend if you had a girlfrind.Senior boys received only six strokes nothing less,mine was six strokes in the secretarys office after she had left, and was allways done in private.

Double Council Tax for you then, mate!

I get confused very easily, and I am now getting very confused! Surely Steve/Gavin has already told us several times in various threads, once in triplicate, of his epic caning with his girl friend in the school gymnasium. Now Gavin says he was only caned once, in the school secretary's office. Are there two Gavins and one Steve all sharing the same email address, or did the secretary's office double up as the gymnasium? I think we should be told!

Norman may well be related to Gavin/Steve/Gavin - he certainly went to the same sort of funny school. However, for the benefit of those unfamiliar with the inner workings of this estimable Forum, he does at least have his own email address!

Nathan,

I too received "six of the best" at school. This happened on two occasions when I was aged 16 and 17. Both times the caning was given by the Deputy Headmaster in his study while I was bending over touching my toes. It was very painful, although I'm glad now to have had the experience!

On other occasions I, like many in my class, received six whacks across my bottom with a slipper or a leather strap. The strap hurt like hell and left purple welts across each buttock.

The slipper was used more often and in all my school years was the "weapon of choice" for most of my punishments. I received six whacks on several occasions in the third, fouth and fifth years - so aged 13ish to 16.

During my 13 years of schooling I received the cane three times. I received the cane for the first time when I was ten years old when my primary school headmistress gave me three strokes of the cane for general class misbehaviour.

I received "six of the best" at ages 13 and 15. My first offence was for misbehaviour on the way to school and for not having my full school uniform on (I did not have my school cap on). My headmaster gave me the cane on my bottom and I remember having tears rolling down my cheeks and jumping up to rub after each stroke so I made quite a display of myself. My second offence was for truanting class and I was caned with two friends. My friends and I had to wait outside our Headmaster's study with our hands on our heads and noses to the wall. He called each of us and administered our punishments. I was the second boy caned and it was horrible having to listen to my friend receive his punishment before I received mine. I was glad my ordeal was over and I don't remember hearing the third caning as I was focused on how sore my bottom was.

Both occasions left my bottom covered with red tramlines and I had light bruising on my bottom, my second caning also left two angry red welts. We were treated fairly by our headmaster despite what personal opinions others may have as to the merits of school corporal punishment. Ulimately I had broken the school rules and I was punished accordingly and within the appropriate guidelines and standards of the day.

I was a fair-haired fifteen-year-old in the School House at public school. The Head Boy was a 'blood', that is, good at Rugby Football, Cricket, Hockey etc. And he had a crush on me. I didn't want this, feeling absolutely nothing for him. Also it made me unpopular since other boys thought that he treated me differently. They may have been right - though I was not preferred in any conventional sense.

I had eight black marks, which meant Six. I waited in the day room doing my prep with about thirty other boys. Footsteps coming down the long passage.

A boy enters and, smilingly, whispers a message to the prefect taking prep. He departs. At last the prefect looks up. "Lyons to Fiedler's study". I get up shakily, and make my way back down the corridor, out of the building, past the Abbey church, vast and forbidding. Into the study block, up the stairs. Knock on Fielder's door. Wait. "Come in". He is sitting at his desk. When he swings the chair round, I see that the his trousers are swollen at the crotch. There is a cane, lying on the couch. "Well, Lyons, eight black marks. Anything to say?"

"No Fielder," I reply.

"Go and wait for me in the cloisters."

Back downstairs, along the study passage, knowing that the boys are relishing this. To the undercroft. And wait. Eventually, Fielder's footsteps. He appears with the cane.

"Move in front of the notice board. Bend! Feet apart! Lower! That's right, grip your ankles. Wider!"

I can see him through my parted legs as he moves to the side, and folds back my jacket. He flexes the cane between his hands, and lays gently it across my buttocks, adjusting his position. Legs astride. Trousers positively jutting.

The first stroke - as always - didn't hurt for a second or two. But then.......

The second and third came slowly, deliberately. Fielder's left hand was in his pocket, caressing his stiff cock.

The fourth was frightful. My grip on my ankles failed.

"Get down! Down, I said!"

I looked round, pleadingly. His eyes seemed glazed.

"Down!" he hissed. "Or there will be extra strokes!"

I reached down once more. His breath was laboured.

On the fifth stroke, I cried out. The hand in his pocket was moving more quickly now. Then it slowed.

And the sixth! Christ it was awful.

"Alright, off you go then."

I literally limped out of the undercroft out past the Abbey again. A small party from the Girls School was comig out of the main door, giggling. They had obviously heard.

I got six of the cane three times from the headmaster aged 14-15 for accumulated demerits. Bending over, trousers on. Had advance warning but didn't bother with padding. London, 1967-8. The headmaster seemed to regard the punishment as a bit of a chore and didn't hit especially hard.

I found I could take corporal punishment pretty well and once I knew what to expect it didn't really bother me. Preferred it to detention. But the main deterrent to bad behaviour was the fear of a bad report at the end of term which would lead to interminable lectures and a bad atmosphere at home.

I went to a very strict all Boys' Boarding School in the West Country when I was aged 7 in the 1970's. The cane was a feared but daily ritual. As one grew older however (aged about 9) one began to realise that there was real potency in punishment. The early hints of a submissive-dominant role play balance. For people on either side and in between it was often very erotically charged - for the boy being caned / the Headmaster or Prefect caning / Matron afterwards / the other boys viewing the marks, touching them, sensual, sexual, sadistic. It meant many things after those initial split seconds of acute pain! Our School was very traditional so six strokes was the minimum. Never hear of anyone getting less than 6 strokes. rare to get anything else but occasionally a 7th or even 8th stroke. When the Headmaster was especially sadistic the last stroke was deliberately on the top of the thighs just below the bottom. That was never pleasure. So, always six.

"Our School was very traditional so six strokes was the minimum" says Anthony.

I've never heard of any school with a six-stroke minimum.

I find the very idea inherently absurd but, as you say that minimum was not only traditional but 'very' traditional, I'd be obliged if you'd name me a few other schools that had such a minimum.

Lotta, you are a breath of fresh air!

I doubt some of the recent posters in this thread have ever had six strokes. They would not remember it so fondly.

Gary J, who... found I could take corporal punishment pretty well and once I knew what to expect it didn't really bother me... clearly did not experience what I and many others did.

Perhaps these contributors' efforts would be more appreciated in a different forum.

Even in the era just after the war I do not recall six strokes as being the norm, wither on a clothed or bare bottom. As i recall six was reserved for the most serious offences like stealing abd bullying. I also recall that as time moved on, six strokes became even less common as boys were not so tough. Six of the cane is going to leave a boys bottom very sore indeed and is not something that i ever came across that boys got use to.....it was a feared and dreaded punishment.....hence it was rare that six strokes were given.

"I've never heard of any school with a six-stroke minimum."

I'm not so sure about that, an account of public school life I read years ago mentioned
that beating (by prefects) was the routine, and pretty much sole, form of punishment and
that all beatings were six strokes. As the author said, the absurd result of this was that
a boy might get six of the best for such disparate crimes as having his top button undone
or smoking. If you got beaten it was six strokes regardless of what you had done.

David,

With the greatest respect, you really should have spent more time in your English classes while at school.

If a CP regime insists that 6 strokes with the cane (and no greater nor lesser number) be given every time it is used, that may hardly be described as a 'six-stroke minimum' for the simple reason that it is also a 'six-stroke maximum '.

Where have you been my doubting Thomasine?

I haven't seen you posting on here for some time - have I simply missed your posts? If youare making a comeback all the fake posters had better watch out.

Hello WWT,

I have indeed been away from these hallowed pages for some time.

Luckily for all those who value truth and historical accuracy, I have returned with a happy, if somewhat older, heart to continue the struggle against fantasists both near and far, be they sharp as a tack or thick as a brick.

Lotta Nonsense:


I feel that the services of a mathematician are needed here.

This is both a six-stroke maximum, and also a six-stroke minimum. Both statements are true; there is no contradiction between them.

It's possible to believe that neither statement is true; but that belief would be erroneous. The reason hinges on a subtlety of logic, about which Bertrand Russell had something to say. I won't bore you with this now. (Although you could provoke me ...)

Alan,

You say "This is both a six-stroke maximum, and also a six-stroke minimum. Both statements are true; there is no contradiction between them."

With the greatest respect, I did not say differently.

I said it can hardly be described as a 6-stroke minimum - because that description, no matter how accurate in the eyes of mischievous mathematicians, is grossly misleading if used in everyday, non-mathematical life (where most of us tend to hang out if given the choice). It's like telling people you were the tallest boy in your class when, in fact, you were 4' 2" and the only boy in the class.

And a pox on all philosophers!

I was once at a gathering where I was introduced to a philosopher.

"What's it all about then?" I asked.

And, do you know what?

He couldn't tell me!

From the introduction to What's It All About: Philosophy and the Meaning of Life by Julian Baggini, mentioned here.


Lotta, you're not Baggini, are you?

Nice to see Lotta Nonsense is still making such useful and valuable contributions to this board. See you all again in about a year.