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when a girl was due to be caned at your school, did it cause a buzz?

April 7 2011 at 9:47 PM
Sammy 

 
Hello, Contributors,

At my comprehensive school (1975-1981), it was extremely rare for a girl to be caned. Us lads could cop it quite a bit and apart from a little ribbing from classmates, it was soon forgotten and in most cases was never even talked about.
However, I was wondering, if on occasion a girl was due to be caned, if it caused a real buzz or a stir at any contributor's school? If it got round the school that a girl was due to be caned what was the response?
Was it a big talking point? What was the mood like? Did any girl have to endure a lot of questioning from fellow pupils?

A fascinating debate this could be

Thanks all,
Sammy

 
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Jenny

Re: when a girl was due to be caned at your school, did it cause a buzz?

April 8 2011, 3:42 PM 

Hi Sammy

At my school, girls were just as likely to get the cane as boys. Slightly more likely in the case of some, who had the mistaken idea that the rules didn't apply to girls and, even if they did, girls were exempt from punishment.

We didn't get advance warning of canings either so there was never really a situation where a girl (nor a boy) was "due to be caned". The sequence of events was simply: commit a serious offence; get caught and sent to the headmistress sad.gif; get the cane.

The most the rest of us would know was that someone had been caught and sent to the Headmistress. If we knew what he or she had been caught doing we'd have a good idea of whether he or she were going to get the cane but we wouldn't know.

When a girl got the cane, if was no different from when a boy got. A bit of sympathy perhaps, that's all. The only questioning was usually along the lines of "How did you get on?" There was rarely any teasing as we all knew it could be our turn tomorrow.

In those schools where it was very rare for a girl to be cane, there probably would be a lot of interest and I can think of two reasons for that. First, the rarity of the event would be a talking point in itself. Secondly, if boys were caned for offences for which girls were usually let off or given some minor, "token punishment", there would also be a sense of satisfaction amongst the boys as, finally, at long last, justice was being done.

 
 
Sammy

Re: when a girl was due to be caned at your school, did it cause a buzz?

April 9 2011, 4:06 PM 

Thank you Jenny
It was nice of you to respond and I Take and accept your points.
Oh, well, that was another post down the swannee
I'm disappointed that it did not create much interest
Just thought I wouild ask something different

No interest at all Gutted to be frank
But thank you, at least, Jenny!!!!
cheers
Sammy

 
 

StevefromSE5

Re: when a girl was due to be caned at your school, did it cause a buzz?

April 9 2011, 5:53 PM 

SAMMY

Not a waste-some of us have been busy gardening!

You may've read on here from me re those magical evenings at Aylesford recreation ground & the girls who got caned at Sec Mods. I recall 2 of the 4 who got it had the fact regaled to our little "study group" by lads therein who attended the same school.

Logically, then, it must have been a bit of an event for the lads to give it a drumroll, as it were. As I recall, neither girl was particularly gruntled about the disclosure, but both were looked after by the gentlemen amongst us, and there were several, who ensured they felt a lot better by the end of the evening.

This was partly effected by extra cigarettes(just what the doctor ordered when you've been caned for smoking), a nice manly cuddle & a swift walk down to the village & an illegal but satisfying couple of lager and limes. I do hope someone provided, or at least offered, the same TLC for Jenny.


Steve

 
 
prof.n

Re: when a girl was due to be caned at your school, did it cause a buzz?

April 9 2011, 6:05 PM 



Hi Sammy,

Don't be despondent: on this forum you need to learn patience, many threads grow slowly , some are returned to after considerable time.

On the actual topic I can't add much having been to a boy's independent boarding school : except to say that our sister school did use the cane,albeit less than the boys school, and should , for example anyone's girlfriend get caned, there was immense , if prurient interest . Although my then girlfriend went to a different school, I was close in my final year to the then Head Girl, who related to me, in considerable detail, her caning in the fifths for smoking!That was quite memorable !

 
 
neilfrommanc

Re: when a girl was due to be caned at your school, did it cause a buzz?

April 9 2011, 10:11 PM 

I certainly find this of interest Sammy, however as I went to an all-boys school I can't add to the subject. It would only cause a buzz if one went to a mixed sex school where girls COULD be caned but generally WEREN'T - at a few schools like Jenny's this was not the case as girls were caned reasonably frequently, and at many other mixed sex schools girls weren't caned at all on principle.

Hopefully a few others may be able to give a factual response.


 
 
Jenny

Re: when a girl was due to be caned at your school, did it cause a buzz?

April 11 2011, 3:09 PM 

Hi Steve

Not a waste-some of us have been busy gardening!

Same here. The weather was far too good to to spend time sitting in front of a computer screen so my husband and I spent the weekend clearing bramble from around our "picnic area" ready for Bealtaine (May Day).

This was partly effected by extra cigarettes(just what the doctor ordered when you've been caned for smoking), a nice manly cuddle & a swift walk down to the village & an illegal but satisfying couple of lager and limes. I do hope someone provided, or at least offered, the same TLC for Jenny.

I wasn't ever treated that well after I'd been caned. sad.gif I suppose part of the reason was that, often, I wasn't the only one of our group.

The cane is much more effective with girls than with boys (or is that meant to be the other way around? wink.gif ) so, unlike a certain boy wink.gif, I didn't go off for a smoke immediately after being caned for smoking. Later, in the evening, well away from school, I wouldn't have said "no" to the offer of a cigarette or an alcoholic drink - I never did like lager & lime though.

 
 
Jenny

Re: when a girl was due to be caned at your school, did it cause a buzz?

April 11 2011, 4:03 PM 

Hi Sammy

As Neil has pointed out, the number of schools where girls could be caned, but were caned much less often than boys, is likely to be quite small.

What I think would be interesting is to get an idea of the feelings of boys in those sexist schools were boys were caned and girls weren't - even when a mixed sex group had been caught offending (smoking for example) together. What was the general feeling in such schools when the boys were caned and the girls let off completely or given some ( what was obviously intended as a) "token punishment"? Did other girls feel the boys had been treated unfairly? Did, even, those girls who were let off think the boys had been treated unfairly? A lot of men have told me they thought such sexism was unfair but it's also been suggested that boys have no objection to that type of discrimination. Dr Dominum said (here) - "As I've said previously, I think if we asked a boy in my school whether he believed girls should be caned just because boys are, 90% would say no."

I seriously doubt that's a common view amongst boys and I haven't met any men who agree with it but perhaps the men I know are all atypical.

Another point of interest would be the feelings of boys in sexist schools when certain female low-lifes contrived to get boys unfairly caned - knowing they (the low-lifes) wouldn't receive any significant punishment if their plan were exposed. It seems this abuse wasn't all that unusual. It might even have been caused by the schools' sexist policies1



Neil used the word "principle" which, although probably technically correct, tends to imply something good. I don't consider sexism a good thing so I won't call it a "matter of principle" more like a complete lack of them.




 
 
prof.n

Re: when a girl was due to be caned at your school, did it cause a buzz?

April 11 2011, 4:22 PM 


Hi Jenny

The cane is much more effective with girls than with boys (or is that meant to be the other way around? wink.gif )

I take the joke but seriously it made me think. Psychologists who maintain these sweeping generalizations which are ' largely' correct , have overtime done us a great disservice .

For example. I was on the no cane list because

A) I was an alpha student. Does that mean I was bright and successful , or does it mean I was bookish? Could be either . Yes if you are bright you will mix with other bright students, and many of them are quite bookish, nerdish, wimpish, take your pick, but it doesn't go for everyone .

B) Because I came from a one parent ( female ) family . Naturally this meant my mother was a weak little women unable to face the nasty things in life like her son getting a caning, without making a protest or hysterically withdrawing him from the school. Might have been true on societal 'typologies' , but actually couldnt have been further from the truth. Yes she was opposed to corporal punishment , but a timid little lady .no way when she wanted to be she was a s tough , determined and single minded as anyone.

Clear social typologies which in their day carried some credibility. But in my case they were totally wide of the mark. Jackie on the other hand knew me as an individual and judged that a good caning would actually pull me up sharp, and it did!

But it wouldn't have worked for everyone. The boy who vied with me for the number one spot in class, would be a case in point. Cane him and not only would he probably have come to pieces, but he would have literally hated that staff member from then to eternity. Two apparently externally similar profiles , ( he had a father , but who certainly would have withdrawn him under such circumstances).

If psychologists want to do something useful, dont spend time being lazy and looking for commonplaces about self defining social categories ( sex, race, intelligence etc.), rather develop simple effective and accurate diagnostic tests for everyday use , which can help teachers understand the psychological positioning of their students, then they will know far better who will benefit from a caning. or any other disciplinary intervention, and who will be damaged.

 
 
Philuk

Re: when a girl was due to be caned at your school, did it cause a buzz?

April 11 2011, 8:12 PM 

I went to large mixed comprehensive school in northern England in the mid 1970's, corporal punishment was still in use for both boys and girls although it was very rare for a girl to receive the cane. A girl would have had to have done something really bad to receive a caning and she was more likely to have been slippered for most offences that a boy would expect to be caned for, truancy, smoking etc.
That said I can recall at least two incidents of girls being caned, two girls for stealing some money from an old lady, and a serious case of bullying. I remember at the time we didn't find out about it until after the canings had taken place but it still caused quite a stir amongst the rest of the school, filling us all with intrigue and excitement as to what had taken place.

 
 
Jenny

Re: when a girl was due to be caned at your school, did it cause a buzz?

April 11 2011, 11:21 PM 

Hi prof.n

Psychologists who maintain these sweeping generalizations which are ' largely' correct , have overtime done us a great disservice.

Exactly! Generalities are fine as a zeroth-order approximation but, all too often, that approximation is taken as an absolute rule and was used to force children to comply with their sex stereotypes. Some girls might prefer needlework to metalwork but I'm far happier with a ball-pein hammer in my hand than a needle. sad.gif Some boys might prefer woodwork to cookery but not all do. Individual differences are ignored in favour of the generality. Some schools exempted girls from CP for no reason other than that they were girls and thus too frail to withstand it - no matter how tough the misbehaving girl were. At the same time, a much frailer boy would be beaten because "boys need to be toughened up". As I showed here, the idea that girls might be harmed by CP but boys were unlikely to be could result in more boys than girls being so harmed.

I suppose I was quite "bookish" but that didn't mean I was well behaved. I could misbehave with the best (worst?) of them. wink.gif

Jackie treated you as an individual contrary to your supposed typology. Not many headteachers did that. Some were even prevented from doing so by external regulations - probably based on the general but erroneous idea that all girls are frail.


 
 
Jenny

Re: when a girl was due to be caned at your school, did it cause a buzz?

April 12 2011, 1:28 AM 

Hi Philuk

I went to large mixed comprehensive school in northern England in the mid 1970's, corporal punishment was still in use for both boys and girls although it was very rare for a girl to receive the cane. A girl would have had to have done something really bad to receive a caning and she was more likely to have been slippered for most offences that a boy would expect to be caned for, truancy, smoking etc.

I know, from personal experience of being on the receiving end of both, the slipper is not necessarily less severe than the cane. Nevertheless, it's clear the intention at your school was to treat girls more leniently than boys or, at least, appear to do so. How did the boys feel about that?

It seems rather strange that a school would want to appear unfair but, presuming you are the same PhilUK who posted here, girls got the slipper though their knickers. Was it perhaps considered a quid pro quo for their "only" getting the slipper?


 
 
Philuk

Re: when a girl was due to be caned at your school, did it cause a buzz?

April 12 2011, 11:49 AM 

Hi Jenny,

No I don't remember thinking of the girls as being treat anymore lenient than we (boys) were, indeed the Deputy Headmistress in charge of the disciplining of the girls had a fearsome reputation and by all accounts could whack just as hard as the Headmaster.
I'm sure six of the plimsoll with just knickers for protection was just as painful as six of the cane across the taut seat of a boys trousers and as equally a terrifying experience.

 
 
Jenny

Re: when a girl was due to be caned at your school, did it cause a buzz?

April 14 2011, 1:48 PM 

Hi Philuk

Thanks for replying.

I had a feeling that might be the case but I wasn't sure because, when I was at school, the slipper was considered a less serious (although not necessarily less severe) punishment than the cane. It was strange in a way because, although a slippering could be severe, it was seen more as an inconvenience than anything serious. We wore plain skirts at my school so there was no need for them to be lifted when we got the slipper or cane, we got it just the same as the boys. I would have been a bit miffed if I have been caned for something when an equally guilty boy "only" got the slipper. It was the same the first time I got it. I thought it unfair that another girl and I got three strokes across our hands when the two boys we'd played truant with got three through their trousers.

It's a common problem when children are punished differently for the same offence. At first sight, the practice in your school of caning boys but "only" slippering girls appears to be unfair to boys. At the same time, requiring girls to lift their skirts whilst allowing boys the protection of their trousers appears unfair to girls. The question is whether the two cancel out or, at least, are considered to do so amongst the recipients. From what you say, the school succeeded in that is respect of "serious" punishments.

Was the slipper used in class for minor, classroom offences? I was quite often called out to the front to get the slipper across the seat of my skirt but, as girls had to lift their skirts, what happened at your school?


 
 
Philuk

Re: when a girl was due to be caned at your school, did it cause a buzz?

April 15 2011, 1:26 PM 

Hi Jenny,

The only time classroom slipperings took place was if it was a boys only lesson, for things like talking and fooling around.
If it was a mixed class, boys would be told to wait behind at the end of the lesson and slippered afterwards, when the rest of the class had dispersed obviously, girls would be reported to the deputy headmistress and slippered in private, usually in the Heads study.

 
 
Jenny

Re: when a girl was due to be caned at your school, did it cause a buzz?

April 20 2011, 4:37 PM 

Hi Philuk

If it was a mixed class, boys would be told to wait behind at the end of the lesson and slippered afterwards, when the rest of the class had dispersed obviously, girls would be reported to the deputy headmistress and slippered in private, usually in the Heads study.

It seems that, contrary to my initial impression, your school was attempting to treat pupils fairly. At my school, I think most classroom slipperings were for talking and fooling around too. Quite a few classroom slipperings were for failing to do detention or lines - usually given for talking or fooling around. wink.gif

The main objection I have to boys being slippered in class and girls having to wait until after the lesson or longer, to be slippered in private, was that it was unfair to girls. For the boys it's all over and done with whilst the girl has to spend the rest of the lesson knowing what's in store for her. I preferred getting it in class but, as both boys and girls had to wait, your school's method wasn't unfair.



 
 
 
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