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the other forum

May 4 2004 at 5:37 PM
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Matt  (Login Matt98032)
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from IP address 4.242.69.3

 
I'm new to this furum, and was wondering why there are 2 FE forums, and apparently the other one is locked so you can't join!

 
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Larry Hampton
(Login 1320lane)
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68.15.100.216

It's not locked, but the admin is in the Navy and is shipped out, who is the admin here?

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May 5 2004, 10:33 AM 

Used to be here, that you didn't have to join, or log in. I'm not sure of the total history of these two boards, but this is as I understand it:

Anthony Sissini either started or took over this forum, but the admin passwords got lost and there was no longer admin control. Not that big of deal, but occasionally there would be someone trolling along stirring stuff up (SS comes to mind) and there was no way to ban the offenders. True, you don't have to read everything others post, but I think it was keeping some genuine posters from replying to some threads. Anthony started the new forum, but with no admin rights here, he couldn't delete this forum. Some liked this forum because they didn't have to register to post something (fear of Big Brother I guess). So as far as I know, this forum is just an orphan trudging along by itself.

All this may not be correct, but that's the way I understand it from what I've heard and have been able to piece together.

Larry Hampton

 
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Theo
(Login racecrafterFE)
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217.184.38.100

Lemme give you a short run down on "Why the f## do we have 2 forums"?.

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May 5 2004, 4:18 PM 

Hi Larry.
This Forum was created by Jeff H. He was absent for a long time and simply didn't know what was going on in this board. During his absence some serious trolling and bashing took place and a group of participants finally decided to create a new moderated forum where things could be controlled.
There was an other group that didn't want to give up their ground just because some sick troll managed to seduce some people to respond and make things even worse. I was w. the group that didn't want to give up and the more the separating group put their heads together pointing their fingers on us, the more I felt homebound. It all came to a disgusting point when the initially small group of separators had convinced the masses. Quite some seemed to progressively find their thrills in bashing trolling and even insult the remainders of this original forum. It was a ridiculous war which wasn't intended or foreseen by Anthony when he created the new forum.

Fortunately the pioneers took the trolls with them to the new grounds, which gave us "the stubborn" a nice rest for a while. Then SS, one of at least two trolls that I'm aware of came frequently back to stir up the forum. I decided to contact the Network admins a couple of times and a few other guys did too. This helped in the end and we're now having a nice forum again although not moderated.

The worst thing that I personally experienced during this period was seeing how a well respected forum participant was trying to reach the Network admins in order to either get this forum's account rights or to DELETE it although everybody was aware of how difficult and exhausting it was for the remainders to defend this place against trolls. He was one of many that didn't even respect their forum mates’ freedom of having a different opinion on this issue. Not only that a new controlled place was established, the original forum had to be either controlled too or deleted in favour of the new place. The remainders that didn't want to give up would have been forced to move too if this plan had come true.
Unfortunately this orig. forum's entry in the Network index list disappeared for some unknown reason. Instead only the new forum is listed. Consequently this forum's traffic which used to rally w. the new place, dramatically decreased.
However, all this took place a long time ago and things got mostly straightened out I guess. Although a few stubborn FE rednecks mainly try to keep things rolling in this forum, many participants ping pong both forums anyway. I just wanted to shed a light on what you've heard from the hear say.
Regards

P.S. Jeff H. lost his account password. This forum is not moderated anymore.





 
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Larry Hampton
(Login 1320lane)
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68.15.100.216

Theo, I wasn't bashing this forum by my post and I hope it didn't come across like that...

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May 7 2004, 10:53 PM 

I joined this forum before I joined the other one. I simply did it because there was more activity over there and I liked not having to put up with SS's BS. I rarely check this forum anymore and wasn't aware of Jeff H's involvement in the creation of this forum. I see from his post below that he has been more of a lurker anyway, and that's fine, I did the same before I stupidly volunteered to put this FE Nats event on. Don't get me wrong, the event will be great, but it's really taking a toll on me timewise. I'll be glad when its over with though as it is pretty stressful. I'm doing most of it myself, although I'm having some help from a couple of forum members (Sol Stewart for one) and Rick Kirk (FE guru), but I'm doing most all the legwork and organizing. I'm not a control freak, but I haven't been able to give anyone any reins to take over part of something because it's all woven together and sometimes I have to make decisions on the fly. Hopefully if I choose to do one next year, I'll be able to turn over part of it and let that person know that what their doing may effect these other things that someone else is taking care of and that they need to coordinate stuff.

I'm just glad there was a forum created to begin with. I still don't follow why you've chosen to remain here as I've seen some of your posts which were quite informative. I guess I just don't understand what went on between those that stayed behind and those that went on that were causing problems with those that stayed. I can see you're passionate about your reasons, and that's fine too, but I worry that there may be some good stuff over here that gets missed over there that would be good for the FE as a whole. I know you can check both places, but I tend to find a place that gets me most of my info accurately and just stay with that. For example, there's several good Mustang forums, VMF, Stangnet, Mustangs&More, but I've stuck with Stangnet as I had joined early on (I'm not sure when the VMF board was created).

Larry

 
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Theo
(Login racecrafterFE)
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213.20.134.246

Don't worry Larry.........

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May 8 2004, 2:05 AM 

.....I didn't get it this way at all. The opposite is the case. I think that you're a sensitive guy who is dedicated to creativity in conjunction w. harmony. I highly respect your work and idea to make this wonderful FE event come true. I think that's a fantastic way to bring the cars and the people together. I whish I could be there but unfortunately that's not gonna happen, as my boat hasn't enough gas to cross the Atlantic.
Sorry for being short at this time of the day. The kids are already waiting to go for the horses, repairing their bicycles etc. etc.
I'll be back in the evening and give you briefer respond on your post.
See ya

 
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Theo
(Login racecrafterFE)
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213.187.81.129

Yo Larry,

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May 8 2004, 3:18 PM 

Yo Larry,
Please read what I responded to Jeff. It might answer a few of your questions. I haven’t been participating for quite a while since my real life is very demanding and there’s mostly no time for nothing. I’m only dropping in once in a while with long periods in between.
I’m not posting only here. It’s just that once I happen to drop in, my short time will limit me in a way that makes me think to rather read or write two or three posts in this place than in the new forum which I’m too tired to follow up all these gozillions of posts late at night. I like the other forum as well, whish I had enough time to read or write there too. I still think that this place needs all the support you can provide. It is a place which is still frequented by appx. 10 000 people per month I guess. There are FE people en masse that lurk and as you can see there are also quite a few people who post their questions too. We can possibly be of some help and we can redirect them to the new forum too.
I don’t have the impression that anyone who likes to post in this place is having any segregation in mind. We all know that the masses are over there and that for the same reasons you mentioned most of the knowledge has moved from here to there. The guys that keep on posting here only, certainly have their personal reasons that we should respect as well as those who don’t want to post here.
As I once wrote in a previous post. Due to the fact that a bunch of people feel very well in the original forum and as nobody can delete this forum anyway, we do have two forums. Let’s make the best out of it.
Again, the FE event is a fantastic idea and a great sensation to come. I always though about how it would be meeting the guys in person that you’ve known for a couple of years. I’m sure it will be an interesting and great fun event. I’m curious to see photos one day.
Good luck and keep it up man.

 
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Jeff H.
(Login wsu0702)
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67.168.86.173

Ok....Here's the real reason.....

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May 7 2004, 8:29 PM 

...for the need to create the second forum. I created this forum in the spring of '99. I was bored one Saturday afternoon and while surfing the web I ran across a Network54 forum (I forget which) and was impressed by the content and level of participation. I noticed that there was a "To create your own forum click here" button so I figured why not. At the time I was collecting FE parts for a restoration project and thought it would beneficial if there was a website devoted to FE engines. The password rules for establishing the account were fairly strict and I was not able to use one of my standard passwords. I advertised the web site on a few other Ford sites and waited to see what would happen. The forum got a few posts the first week and then it completely dried up. The only posts were of the "is anybody out there" variety. I pretty much wrote it off as a failure. I got really busy at work and about the same changed internet service providers. A couple months later I came back to the forum and was surprised to see that there was quite a bit of activity. I was happy to be a lurker and learn from the knowledgable FE guys who were answering posted questions. Some time later the trolls (i.e. Stanley Steamer, etc) invaded the forum and started annoying all of us forum regulars. Posters started asking "who controls this forum?" I tried to log back in as adminstrator but could not remember the password I had used when I created the forum. Of course there was the "forgot password? Click here" button but when I did it sent it to my old e-mail address (wsu0702@sprynet.com) which I no longer had access to. I even called sprynet and tried to my account re-activated but was unsuccesful. I e-mailed Network54 and explained the situation but got no response. I called...and called...and called until I finally got a human on the phone at network54. When I explained my situation I was basically told that I was an idiot for forgetting my password and that there was nothing she could do to help me. This really pissed me off because I correctly answered every specific question about my acount that she asked. At this point I just gave up. In hindsite I should have marched down to their offices (I lived in the SF bay area then) and threatened violence until they gave me control of the forum back. So there ya go....that's the reason why there was definetly a good reason to create a 2nd moderated forum. I truely apologize to everyone for losing control of this forum. Over the years I have seen several posts proclaiming that I abandoned the forum. This was not the case and I just wanted to make everyone aware of the whole story.

 
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Larry Hampton
(Login 1320lane)
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68.15.100.216

Sorry Jeff, I thought Anthony created it.....

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May 7 2004, 11:10 PM 

That's why I put as I understand it. I got bits and pieces and sorta put them together, I knew I didn't have the whole picture, but I wan't sure anybody knew all of the story and I didn't know the one who had created it still posted here.

I wasn't sure when Theo started posting here, for some reason I though that was after I had joined as I didn't remember seeing his name when I first joined here.

My own opinion, I don't like it, like I told Theo, I think there's some good stuff here that gets missed by most of us over there that is for the good of all FE, but I don't have a problem with those that do like it. It's not like I hate it, its more like I'm sad that it's split up. I have no problem with those that fight for what they believe in, but I guess I'm a just a lemur that went with the masses. I really don't treat this forum like an Us & Them deal, but more like a distant cousin you only see once in a while. If the problem hadn't arose in the first place, there'd only be one forum and it would have been here and I'd have been happy as a clam.
I'm not trying to create animosity between the two forums, I don't want you or anyone else to think I'm bashing this forum, all I'm aggrevated with is the circumstances that same about to cause the split to begin with, which probably most everyone on both forums can agree with.

The only reason I decided to volunteer my services for the FE Nats is that I see all the aftermarket stuff that's starting to be made and I thought that if I can do something to spark an interest in new FE'rs and get them and all the manufacturers of FE parts together, maybe we'll see some more stuff coming out in the future which should cause some prices to go down.

I hope as many of you can come to the event as possible.

Larry

 
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Theo
(Login racecrafterFE)
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Jeff, I hope.........

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May 8 2004, 3:11 PM 

.....you didn't get it the wrong way. I remember when you dropped in and informed us about what had happened to your password.
I wasn't referring to you when I mentioned the person who was trying to access control over the orig. forum. That's just an other story. It filled me with anger 'cause this person was and still is very influential and was very well aware of how much the remaining participants of your forum loved it and how much effort they were putting in to keep it going. His aim was to either keep the orig. F. as an "only read" archive or to delete it, if my memory serves me right. I felt that this person's ambition and personal feeling towards some people in this board had gotten over his head. Fortunately the network admins didn’t give away the password.
The whole issue was of a quite political, maybe of a philosophical character too. It was about how much control does man need and about how to handle the hools.

I voted for ignoring them in this particular situation, rather than giving up the chance (experiment) to self regulate things. I was against the implementation of more control. IMO “control” has taken way too much place in our modern lives. I thought that we should start to control ourselves rather than controlling others. This means resisting responding to nonsense. Every challenge should be considered as a chance to learn, although some ruffling feathers is O.K. once in a while. Others (just a few at this stage) couldn't wait to be in a moderated forum and IMO they didn't give the orig. forum a chance.
Once the new forum was established the worst part for the orig. forum began after a while. Spam increased and became worse then ever before plus people dropped in trying to poach participants especially new visitors. Some even disrespectfully claimed that the orig. forum only had a low level of knowledge and wouldn't be worth spending time. That didn’t feel very good. It went on for a real long time and probably would have had a humiliating effect if we the so called "stubborn" weren't such a thick-skinned bunch of FE rednecks. I don't want to speak for all the guys who kept this forum going, but I think that the unspoken consensus on our policy was that we shouldn't give up this place and just take the extra mile to post here AND there. If you go to the new forum and type my name into the search engine you'll find posts of mine. Same goes w. most of the other guys here. Unfortunately Anthony has deleted the link to the orig. forum which he wisely had implemented in his header before. In the MEL Forum that I'm running I've linked both forums, the orig. and the new forum.
No need to apologize Jeff. I can’t remember anyone blaming you for something.
Regards

 
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