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When thinking how to punish terrorists, the murder of Edward II springs to mind.

November 12 2004 at 7:04 PM
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Edward II (the foolish), an English king of the early 14th century, was murdered by his political enemies. Not wanting any visible signs of foul play, his murderers devised an ingenious way to go about it. They put a tube up his rectum, and they then inserted a red hot poker into the tube and into his bowels until he died. It was said his screams were heard for miles. He was also gay, so it was thought the manner of his death showed great wit.

I think this would be the perfect way to end the lives of captured terrorists. You see, if you execute them, they will be regarded as martyrs by fellow Muslims. Indeed, many terrorist choose to be terrorists so that they can be martyrs and go to paradise. However, if they knew that martyrdom could take this form, they might think otherwise. Quite frankly, having a tube stuck up your a$$ and then having a red hot poker inserted into that tube is not a glamorous way to go.

Think of a hypothetical terrorist, Mohammed. (sic)
He is a rather confused young man, who is enraged by western treatment of the Islamic world. Also, there is not much he can hope to be in life otherwise, so he wants to be a hero for the struggle and be remembered as a martyr. So it's fine if he goes fighting the Americans in Iraq or the Europeans in Europe, and gets captured, and executed. But what if his execution looks like the one I just described? Would he want to be rembered as having been a$$ raped to death? It is something worth thinking about. After all if it is good enough for a king of England, it is surely good enough for a fanatical turbanhead.

"Because our cultural identity has been well defined for thousands of years, we cannot bear a migratory wave of people who have nothing to do with us … who are not ready to become like us, to be absorbed by us … who, on the contrary, aim to absorb us. To change our principles, our values, our identity, our way of life. And who in the meantime molest us with their retrograde ignorance, their retrograde bigotry, their retrograde religion. I am saying that in our culture there is no room for the muezzins, for the minarets, for the phony abstemious, for the humiliating chador, for the degrading burkah."


 
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ChongLi
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The Redcoats (UK)

Re: When thinking how to punish terrorists, the murder of Edward II springs to mind.

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November 12 2004, 8:13 PM 

Bury them in pig fat.

What your saying though is actually quite sick, i dont mean how Edward II died just what your saying on a whole. Youll be pointiing out various torture methods to use on terrorists next.


 
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Re: When thinking how to punish terrorists, the murder of Edward II springs to mind.

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November 12 2004, 8:13 PM 

Anyone have a better idea?
"Because our cultural identity has been well defined for thousands of years, we cannot bear a migratory wave of people who have nothing to do with us … who are not ready to become like us, to be absorbed by us … who, on the contrary, aim to absorb us. To change our principles, our values, our identity, our way of life. And who in the meantime molest us with their retrograde ignorance, their retrograde bigotry, their retrograde religion. I am saying that in our culture there is no room for the muezzins, for the minarets, for the phony abstemious, for the humiliating chador, for the degrading burkah."


 
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Re: When thinking how to punish terrorists, the murder of Edward II springs to mind.

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November 12 2004, 8:15 PM 

Yes, slow asphyxiation in a foul, forbidden substance.

"Because our cultural identity has been well defined for thousands of years, we cannot bear a migratory wave of people who have nothing to do with us … who are not ready to become like us, to be absorbed by us … who, on the contrary, aim to absorb us. To change our principles, our values, our identity, our way of life. And who in the meantime molest us with their retrograde ignorance, their retrograde bigotry, their retrograde religion. I am saying that in our culture there is no room for the muezzins, for the minarets, for the phony abstemious, for the humiliating chador, for the degrading burkah."


 
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Re: When thinking how to punish terrorists, the murder of Edward II springs to mind.

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November 12 2004, 8:24 PM 

"What your saying though is actually quite sick, i dont mean how Edward II died just what your saying on a whole. Youll be pointiing out various torture methods to use on terrorists next."

No, I am quite serious. Old paradigms no longer apply. The terrorists are not afraid of death, in fact they think it an honor. They are killing our people, and that demands punishment. If they are imprisoned, that is not punishment enough. If they are killed, they regard it as martyrdom, and perhaps they even enjoy thinking about death and the "virgins of paradise." Justice has to be served. They are *terrorists*, they think nothing of killing or death. Let them have a taste of what they serve to others. Don't start a fire if you can't take the heat.


"Because our cultural identity has been well defined for thousands of years, we cannot bear a migratory wave of people who have nothing to do with us … who are not ready to become like us, to be absorbed by us … who, on the contrary, aim to absorb us. To change our principles, our values, our identity, our way of life. And who in the meantime molest us with their retrograde ignorance, their retrograde bigotry, their retrograde religion. I am saying that in our culture there is no room for the muezzins, for the minarets, for the phony abstemious, for the humiliating chador, for the degrading burkah."


 
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ChongLi
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The Redcoats (UK)

Re: When thinking how to punish terrorists, the murder of Edward II springs to mind.

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November 12 2004, 8:35 PM 

>>If they are killed, they regard it as martyrdom, and perhaps they even enjoy thinking about death<<

If they are killed, they should buried in pig fat. This prevents them becoming a martyr or going to heaven or some ****. The Russians have recently started doing it(or threatening to do it) to Chechen terrorists.

This way, they cant see suicide bombing as a way to paradise and the seventy seven virgins blahblahblah.

The people that oppose this method on human rights grounds should simply be buried alive(just kidding!)



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Re: When thinking how to punish terrorists, the murder of Edward II springs to mind.

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November 12 2004, 8:40 PM 

didnt we try that the last time around? Dureing the first world war in the middle east?


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Re: When thinking how to punish terrorists, the murder of Edward II springs to mind.

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November 12 2004, 8:42 PM 

"If they are killed, they should buried in pig fat. This prevents them becoming a martyr or going to heaven or some ****."

I don't know if that would work. These people tend to twist things to fit their world view, I'm sure they'd find an excuse somwhere in the Koran that says its okay if you touch pigs if you do it for Allah and so on. On the other hand, you can't argue with heated pokers in your rectum.


BTW, can you hear the song?

"Because our cultural identity has been well defined for thousands of years, we cannot bear a migratory wave of people who have nothing to do with us … who are not ready to become like us, to be absorbed by us … who, on the contrary, aim to absorb us. To change our principles, our values, our identity, our way of life. And who in the meantime molest us with their retrograde ignorance, their retrograde bigotry, their retrograde religion. I am saying that in our culture there is no room for the muezzins, for the minarets, for the phony abstemious, for the humiliating chador, for the degrading burkah."


 
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Re: When thinking how to punish terrorists, the murder of Edward II springs to mind.

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November 12 2004, 8:45 PM 

notanonymous dont you think your more then a little shall we say extream?

we do that and we become no better then they are, I amso doubt you will find any sane person willing to carry out such a sentance


Among other evils which being unarmed brings you it causes you to be despised - Niccolo Machiavelli

http://www.savethebritishforces.org.uk



"...At the going down of the sun
And in the morning
We will remember them"

 
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Re: When thinking how to punish terrorists, the murder of Edward II springs to mind.

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November 12 2004, 8:49 PM 

"we do that and we become no better then they are, I amso doubt you will find any sane person willing to carry out such a sentance"

They say that a liberal society cannot survive when faced with those who do not share its values. Besides, like I said, if it was done to a king of England...\
When you kill others you agree to any reprecussions that might follow. It is as simple as that.



"Because our cultural identity has been well defined for thousands of years, we cannot bear a migratory wave of people who have nothing to do with us … who are not ready to become like us, to be absorbed by us … who, on the contrary, aim to absorb us. To change our principles, our values, our identity, our way of life. And who in the meantime molest us with their retrograde ignorance, their retrograde bigotry, their retrograde religion. I am saying that in our culture there is no room for the muezzins, for the minarets, for the phony abstemious, for the humiliating chador, for the degrading burkah."


 
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ChongLi
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The Redcoats (UK)

Re: When thinking how to punish terrorists, the murder of Edward II springs to mind.

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November 12 2004, 8:54 PM 

>>Besides, like I said, if it was done to a king of England...\<<

This happened during Europes most brutal age though, i'd like to think we had moved from that even if "others" havent.

@ Drkstr

Really? What do you mean, the pig fat thing or the ahem.. red hot poker?



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Re: When thinking how to punish terrorists, the murder of Edward II springs to mind.

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November 12 2004, 9:09 PM 

The poker


Among other evils which being unarmed brings you it causes you to be despised - Niccolo Machiavelli

http://www.savethebritishforces.org.uk



"...At the going down of the sun
And in the morning
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Anonymous
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Re: When thinking how to punish terrorists, the murder of Edward II springs to mind.

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November 12 2004, 9:29 PM 

"This happened during Europes most brutal age though, i'd like to think we had moved from that even if "others" havent"

What are you talking about? The Dark ages were the best. You could live, unlike today, where you merely exist.

"Because our cultural identity has been well defined for thousands of years, we cannot bear a migratory wave of people who have nothing to do with us … who are not ready to become like us, to be absorbed by us … who, on the contrary, aim to absorb us. To change our principles, our values, our identity, our way of life. And who in the meantime molest us with their retrograde ignorance, their retrograde bigotry, their retrograde religion. I am saying that in our culture there is no room for the muezzins, for the minarets, for the phony abstemious, for the humiliating chador, for the degrading burkah."


 
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ChongLi
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The Redcoats (UK)

Re: When thinking how to punish terrorists, the murder of Edward II springs to mind.

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November 12 2004, 9:34 PM 

>>The poker<<

LOl, youre joking right?


@ Notan

The Dark ages ended about 200 years before Edwrad II was born. It depends what you mean by 'live' aswell, the poor were still poor back then you know, life was F-king hard and the majority of european populations would have existed rather than really lived.



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Re: When thinking how to punish terrorists, the murder of Edward II springs to mind.

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November 12 2004, 9:38 PM 

lol I just realised what you where asking! I thought you where asking if I rearly thought useing the poker would make us as bad as them

Nah we tried the pig fat I will try to dig out the info


Among other evils which being unarmed brings you it causes you to be despised - Niccolo Machiavelli

http://www.savethebritishforces.org.uk



"...At the going down of the sun
And in the morning
We will remember them"

 
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roland
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La Grande Armee (France)

Re: When thinking how to punish terrorists, the murder of Edward II springs to mind.

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November 12 2004, 10:17 PM 

Notan:
if you believe it is with this kind of thinking you're going to fight eficiently against terrorism, that means you didn't understand anything.
Fight against wahabi terror is also a ideological war.
To win this war we must be proud of what is good on our society: progress and human rights.
I couldn't be proud of my country if it treats its prisoners that way.

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Re: When thinking how to punish terrorists, the murder of Edward II springs to mind.

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November 12 2004, 10:34 PM 

"To win this war we must be proud of what is good on our society: progress and human rights."

Unfortunately most Europeans feel the way you do. It sometimes seems to me that Europeans take pride in their defenslesness. As I said before, a liberal society cannot survive if faced with those who do not share its values. My only hope for my country and Europe as a whole is that the course of events will eventually show people the reality.

"Because our cultural identity has been well defined for thousands of years, we cannot bear a migratory wave of people who have nothing to do with us … who are not ready to become like us, to be absorbed by us … who, on the contrary, aim to absorb us. To change our principles, our values, our identity, our way of life. And who in the meantime molest us with their retrograde ignorance, their retrograde bigotry, their retrograde religion. I am saying that in our culture there is no room for the muezzins, for the minarets, for the phony abstemious, for the humiliating chador, for the degrading burkah."


 
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Re: When thinking how to punish terrorists, the murder of Edward II springs to mind.

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November 12 2004, 10:57 PM 

One more thing: this is obviously a war, this war against terrorism. Even the most liberal society becomes illiberal in a struggle to survive. Not an existentialist struggle, this war on terrorism, you say? Ironicaly, that's true for Americans. As for Europeans, take a look at your local school if you live in a city. Shrug

"Because our cultural identity has been well defined for thousands of years, we cannot bear a migratory wave of people who have nothing to do with us … who are not ready to become like us, to be absorbed by us … who, on the contrary, aim to absorb us. To change our principles, our values, our identity, our way of life. And who in the meantime molest us with their retrograde ignorance, their retrograde bigotry, their retrograde religion. I am saying that in our culture there is no room for the muezzins, for the minarets, for the phony abstemious, for the humiliating chador, for the degrading burkah."


 
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Re: When thinking how to punish terrorists, the murder of Edward II springs to mind.

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November 12 2004, 11:05 PM 

yes its a war but he have to the win the war of ideas as well as the war on the battlefield

What good if in wining we become that which we tried to defeate?


Among other evils which being unarmed brings you it causes you to be despised - Niccolo Machiavelli

http://www.savethebritishforces.org.uk



"...At the going down of the sun
And in the morning
We will remember them"

 
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roland
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La Grande Armee (France)

Re: When thinking how to punish terrorists, the murder of Edward II springs to mind.

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November 12 2004, 11:06 PM 

"Unfortunately most Europeans feel the way you do. "
I'm far from certain you know how I feel and I certainly don't feel like most of the Europeans LOL.
Well on the fight against terror perhaps. I think we are not so bad in Europe on that matter.
But no, don't panic. There is really no need for torture.

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Re: When thinking how to punish terrorists, the murder of Edward II springs to mind.

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November 12 2004, 11:16 PM 

"yes its a war but he have to the win the war of ideas as well as the war on the battlefield

What ideas? I'm sorry, but those people have a blind loyalty to "Islam," a loyalty all the more blind that they don't know exactly what they are loyal to. You can't reason with fanatics. Especially fanatics who believe that they have the support of the biggest religion on earth, and who often really do have that support.

"What good if in wining we become that which we tried to defeate?"

Europe has always been Europe up to this point in time. Forcible conversions into Christianity? That was done by Charlemagne, surely an European if there ever was one. The Spanish inquisition, the brutal bands of brigands that roamed over France during the Hundred Years War, Richelieu, the British quashing of the sepoy rebellion, imperialism, the white man's burden, the National Socialists, all of that was Europe. It was as much Europe as today's democracy and PC crap. Islamist theology and terrorism? That's "made in the middle east." Sorry, but to take the cold war saying , red being an Europe more like the Euorope of the middle ages and dead being an Islamist "Europe," then I say better red than dead.

"Because our cultural identity has been well defined for thousands of years, we cannot bear a migratory wave of people who have nothing to do with us … who are not ready to become like us, to be absorbed by us … who, on the contrary, aim to absorb us. To change our principles, our values, our identity, our way of life. And who in the meantime molest us with their retrograde ignorance, their retrograde bigotry, their retrograde religion. I am saying that in our culture there is no room for the muezzins, for the minarets, for the phony abstemious, for the humiliating chador, for the degrading burkah."


 
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roland
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Re: When thinking how to punish terrorists, the murder of Edward II springs to mind.

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November 12 2004, 11:24 PM 

"You can't reason with fanatics."
Reason. That's all the problem. That's a question of education. Either they come from a backward country under the oppression of there clerics and then send them back, either they were educated in your country and I'm sorry your school system didn't do it's job correctly.
The wahaby terrorists are a like the members of a suicidal sect.

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Re: When thinking how to punish terrorists, the murder of Edward II springs to mind.

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November 12 2004, 11:33 PM 

You know, most terrorists in the west are well educated, and not poor at all. The same is true of terrorists from abroad. This is not a matter of education, this is a matter of being part of "the army of Allah."

"Because our cultural identity has been well defined for thousands of years, we cannot bear a migratory wave of people who have nothing to do with us … who are not ready to become like us, to be absorbed by us … who, on the contrary, aim to absorb us. To change our principles, our values, our identity, our way of life. And who in the meantime molest us with their retrograde ignorance, their retrograde bigotry, their retrograde religion. I am saying that in our culture there is no room for the muezzins, for the minarets, for the phony abstemious, for the humiliating chador, for the degrading burkah."


 
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Re: When thinking how to punish terrorists, the murder of Edward II springs to mind.

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November 13 2004, 12:33 AM 

A telling comment, I think.

"As things stand, the Europeans are so enthralled by cultural relativism and political correctness that they are totally unwilling to challenge any idea, even the jihadists' program of creating a theocratic state within Western civil society."

"Because our cultural identity has been well defined for thousands of years, we cannot bear a migratory wave of people who have nothing to do with us … who are not ready to become like us, to be absorbed by us … who, on the contrary, aim to absorb us. To change our principles, our values, our identity, our way of life. And who in the meantime molest us with their retrograde ignorance, their retrograde bigotry, their retrograde religion. I am saying that in our culture there is no room for the muezzins, for the minarets, for the phony abstemious, for the humiliating chador, for the degrading burkah."


 
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Re: When thinking how to punish terrorists, the murder of Edward II springs to mind.

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November 13 2004, 3:47 PM 

hiccup excuse me

"Because our cultural identity has been well defined for thousands of years, we cannot bear a migratory wave of people who have nothing to do with us … who are not ready to become like us, to be absorbed by us … who, on the contrary, aim to absorb us. To change our principles, our values, our identity, our way of life. And who in the meantime molest us with their retrograde ignorance, their retrograde bigotry, their retrograde religion. I am saying that in our culture there is no room for the muezzins, for the minarets, for the phony abstemious, for the humiliating chador, for the degrading burkah."


 
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roland
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Re: When thinking how to punish terrorists, the murder of Edward II springs to mind.

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November 13 2004, 10:08 PM 

You know, most terrorists in the west are well educated, and not poor at all. The same is true of terrorists from abroad. This is not a matter of education, this is a matter of being part of "the army of Allah."

The leaders perhaps but the troops are a buch of retarded bigots. Easy to manipulate material. One goal would be to "counter manipulate" them.

"As things stand, the Europeans are so enthralled by cultural relativism and political correctness that they are totally unwilling to challenge any idea, even the jihadists' program of creating a theocratic state within Western civil society."

pessimistic point of vew but there is some truth in it. When you say something like we should let our value apart in time of war, that's also a kind of relativism imho.

Vive la Republique, mort aux cons !




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Re: When thinking how to punish terrorists, the murder of Edward II springs to mind.

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November 13 2004, 10:50 PM 

But this struggle against Islamofascism is more than simply a struggle against terrorists, especially in Europe. The asylum seeker from Mauritania or Syria constitutes a much bigger threat than Osama or Mohammed B. Terrorists can only kill a few hundred people at the most, a tragic thing, but hardly threatening to our way of life. More people die in car crashes every year in any western country than have died from terrorism in the past decade. Terrorism is named aptly, for its purpose is to instill fear of fear itself.

But the rapidly growing muslim populations in my country, and in yours too, they are a truly existentialist threat. Do you not see that even the most moderate form of Islam is incompatible with modern Western values? No alcohol, no mixing of the sexes, prayers five times a day, and on and on it goes. Christianity, even in its heyday of influence, was never as constricting as Islam is at its most liberal. Frankly, if you look at Islam as a human creation, and not as a work of God, then you see that it was created for a primitive herding society by a power hungry, violent man.

So now, you tell me of your atheist “Muslim” friends. I have no doubt they exist, but so does the fact that an extremist form of Islam fostered by the UOIF got the lion’s share of the vote in elections by muslims in France. There definitely do exist two parts of Islam in France and in Europe, but do we know which one will triumph? I’m just a high school student, but it seems to me that we have too much to lose by simply letting events take their course. All I know is, it was not Islam that made Europe great, but as far as anyone knows it just might be Islam that does away with that greatness.


"Because our cultural identity has been well defined for thousands of years, we cannot bear a migratory wave of people who have nothing to do with us … who are not ready to become like us, to be absorbed by us … who, on the contrary, aim to absorb us. To change our principles, our values, our identity, our way of life. And who in the meantime molest us with their retrograde ignorance, their retrograde bigotry, their retrograde religion. I am saying that in our culture there is no room for the muezzins, for the minarets, for the phony abstemious, for the humiliating chador, for the degrading burkah."


 
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roland
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Re: When thinking how to punish terrorists, the murder of Edward II springs to mind.

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November 13 2004, 11:22 PM 

So now, you tell me of your atheist “Muslim” friends. I have no doubt they exist, but so does the fact that an extremist form of Islam fostered by the UOIF got the lion’s share of the vote in elections by muslims in France.

My atheists friends didn't vote. They dont give a rats to those clerics stuff. Only the bigots feel concerned. But we have to let them speak, after all we listen the Christians or Jews bigots. So lets be fair, Islam is a religion like an other, nothing special.
Not That I don't feel concerned by what happens in the rest of Europe but I've no time to make my own opinion. Concerning France, I can be wrong but I don't see a good future for the religious extremists here.


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Re: When thinking how to punish terrorists, the murder of Edward II springs to mind.

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November 14 2004, 8:55 PM 

I've heard that in France, people now use the phrase "les jeunes" to denote street thugs, who are now overwhelmingly of African and Arab backround. This is amazing. How can you say that a country is allright if the young, youth, is now synonymous with gangs and crime?
Perhaps today 'les jeunes' make up only 20% or so of total French youth, but what about 20 years from now?
I was chargrined when I went on the website of the region Haute Normandie, and the first thing I saw there was the boast that it is the youngest region in France, with 31% of people being under 25. What they didn't boast about was that the bigger of its two departments, Eure, is one big ghetto. The other one probably is too, but I don't know, about Euro I've heard about. So I think we can tell why the French fertility rate is so relatively high compared to say Italy. But at least the Italians can speak about their few youths with hope, unlike the French and their "les jeunes."

"Because our cultural identity has been well defined for thousands of years, we cannot bear a migratory wave of people who have nothing to do with us … who are not ready to become like us, to be absorbed by us … who, on the contrary, aim to absorb us. To change our principles, our values, our identity, our way of life. And who in the meantime molest us with their retrograde ignorance, their retrograde bigotry, their retrograde religion. I am saying that in our culture there is no room for the muezzins, for the minarets, for the phony abstemious, for the humiliating chador, for the degrading burkah."


 
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GoItaly
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Re: When thinking how to punish terrorists, the murder of Edward II springs to mind.

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November 15 2004, 12:19 AM 

OK that is seriously sick, and any autopsy worth its salt could EASILY determine cause of death.

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