-------------------------------------------------------------
Soldiers of Buddha Empire. United Under Buddha.
-------------------------------------------------------------
Scoring disabled. You must be logged in to score posts.
Related: S.Korea issues new principles over relations with Japan
Japan's bill on islets fueled diplomatic row with S.Korea
S.Korea lodges official protest against Japan over disputed islets
S.Korea slams Japan's bill on disputed islets
Backgrounder: Disputed islets in S. Korea, Japan territorial row
South Korea filed an official protest Wednesday over a Japanese prefecture's legislation aimed at boosting its claim to a group of disputed islets located in the East Sea (Sea of Japan). (Photo: Xinhua)
At an urgent press conference, South Korean Foreign Ministry spokesman Lee Kyu-hyung said South Korea would "take every necessary measure" to have the Japanese legislation scrapped, warning that "Japan is to blame for all consequences." (Photo: Xinhua)
TOKYO, March 17 (Xinhuanet) -- The website of Japan's Foreign Ministry was attacked Thursday amid a diplomatic row over a group of disputed islands.
The attacks took place at about 9:15 a.m.(0015 GMT) with flooded information clogging the server and denying access, a ministry official said, adding that the situation has come back tonormal.
The incident came just one day after the South Korean government lodged protest against the passage of a bill by Japan's Shimane Prefectural Assembly to designate a memorial day for the Takeshima islands. South Korea also claims the sovereignty over the islets, known as Dokdo there, and has control on them.
Relations of the two countries have dramatically worsened sincelate February due to the territorial dispute and the history issue.
Seoul has indefinitely postponed a visit by its foreign minister and vowed firmly to safeguard its territory. The South Korean public took to the street blasting the bill, with someone even cutting their fingers to show determination.
Japan's Kyodo News quoted a government source as saying that there is unconfirmed information that a South Korean website is claiming responsibility. The foreign ministry official gave no confirmation on the report. Enditem
-------------------------------------------------------------
Soldiers of Buddha Empire. United Under Buddha.
-------------------------------------------------------------
Scoring disabled. You must be logged in to score posts.
-------------------------------------------------------------
Soldiers of Buddha Empire. United Under Buddha.
-------------------------------------------------------------
Scoring disabled. You must be logged in to score posts.
-------------------------------------------------------------
Soldiers of Buddha Empire. United Under Buddha.
-------------------------------------------------------------
Scoring disabled. You must be logged in to score posts.
Who will the US back on this one. Both are allies of the Us so I think the US might just stay out of it. But if the US does get involved, it will probably be on Japans side because Japan is a bigger ally and Korea is starting to slip into China's influence.
Scoring disabled. You must be logged in to score posts.
Nobody needs to back us up. Anybody who's even remotely aware of history of ownership behind the island knows full well it's Korean territory, but it's just that the Japanese, from their position of advantage of being the superior power of two on the global stage, have undertaken a massive media campaign and political lobbying to try and convince the average foreign knucklehead that the island is theirs. Adolf Hitler put it in words perfectly. "If you tella a lie enough times it soon becomes the truth in the public mind" Petty Japanese behaviour at its best, is it just me or do Japanese people somehow manage to skip puberty? Or maybe it's just their deep-rooted inferiority complex stemming from their ugly 5'5" frame and their pitiful 2-inchers.
@Buran
Great idea Einstein, let's just "share" the island. Then they can go on to "share" Diaoyu and Sakhalin/Kurile islands, hell why don't we just share our whole country with them? Study the history of Dok-do, and you'll see why the majority of the academic community (excluding Japanese and Korean of course) backs Korean ownership of the island, and you'll see this is as ridiculous as asking Russia for half of Moscow. Korea's Shilla Dynasty claimed the island over 1,500 years ago, documnted many times over the course of history. Japanese historical text printed in 1667 clear mentions Dok-do as Korean territory, and also in a paper released by the Japanese Foreign Ministry in the 1880s. An 1894 French map also labels Dok-do as Korean. The Japanese only lay claim to the islands in 1905 after Russo-Japanese war insisting the island was under no previous ownership. Allied High Command officially handed back Dok-do to the Koreans after Japan's downfall, but Japan has refused to acknowledge this as they still do now. In the face of these overwhelming historical evidence, some even dug up from their own archives, Japan's has countered with only one very weak argument. That the island is geographically closer to Japan, and that it can't be seen visually from any point in Korea while it could be seen from Japan. Weak... lol
Japan can bitch all they want, the island is and has been occupied by a Korean garrison flying our national flag for the past 50 years and we ain't gonna budge. If they take this petty bitchfest of their making to the next level, we're gonna start putting SAMs and SSMs on the island and blow their midget @$$es out of the water if they try to pull anything.
French map published Sep.3/1894 in the newspaper Petit Le Journal
British map produced for Allied High Command, 1951
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
On April 21, 1954, three Japanese patrol boats (two of which were named the ´Hekura-ho´ and ´Oki-ho´) arrived to stage their typical show of force. Upon arriving at Dokdo, the Japanese ships came under mortar fire from the Korean forces on Dokdo. The ships returned fire, but the Japanese lost one boat and suffered 16 casualties, including a number of deaths.
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Republic of Korea Marine Corps (ROKMC) The Few, the Proud, the Best.
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Scoring disabled. You must be logged in to score posts.
Japan has had NO RIGHTS claim to the islands. the only claim they can keep is in 1905 when they, supposedly, "annexed" korea and the islands came with it. Otherwise, the Koreans own the islands for hundreds of years. The Japanese are regressing to their imperialistic attitudes again after passing the Takeshima bill. Korea should put Japan in its place for this; and if the US does not show support for the true owners... then they're fooled by Japanese (probably too much of that anime).
"Do not weep, do not announce my death. Beat the drum,
blow the trumpet, wave the flag for advance. We are
still fighting. Finish the enemy to the last
one."-Admiral Yi Sun-Shin, November 19, 1598
Scoring disabled. You must be logged in to score posts.
Share a territory, now that's one of the most ridiculous idea if I ever heard one. Ceding Dok-do means losing noty only the rich fishing ground, but also a large source of potential energy that comes with it.
It should be noted that most ROKAF response of intercept and control have come from the 2nd MCRC operated exclusively by ROKAF personal, and not the 1st MCRC which is joint USAF-ROKAF operated. First intercept order was for Japanese civilian newspaper aircraft, second from Japanese Maritime police aircraft, and the third JASDF RF-4 was intercepted by ROKAF F-4s just yesterday. Why a RF-4 was ingering so close to KADIZ is a question.
Scoring disabled. You must be logged in to score posts.
This issue is quite hostile, but due to the sphere of influence Japan has on these regions and due to the historical greatness the Japanese Empire imposed on the region, it is by right, theirs. Japan is an economic super power, one that should be respected, and as a country with an enormous population and a massive defense budget, as well as a great contributor to the Asian economy, Japan has the right to these islands. Korea must observe her line of control and submit. A conflict in the region is the least we want.
May God Bless China!!!!!!
"Be extremely subtle, even to the point of formlessness. Be extremely mysterious, even to the point of soundlessness. Thereby you can be the director of the opponent's fate."
-Sun-tzu, The Art of War. Emptiness and Fullness
Scoring disabled. You must be logged in to score posts.
You would risk war with the Japanese ? Please be realistic, Japan wrecked havoc on the region during her Imperial era, even posing great damage to the Middle Kingdom, whilst Korea was swallowed by the Rising Sun's emblem for over 50 years. A war with your former colonial masters? You have to be stupid and idiotic to think so. Korea, would fall and loose a war with Japan. I say again, be REALISTIC.
May God Bless China!!!!!!
"Be extremely subtle, even to the point of formlessness. Be extremely mysterious, even to the point of soundlessness. Thereby you can be the director of the opponent's fate."
-Sun-tzu, The Art of War. Emptiness and Fullness
Scoring disabled. You must be logged in to score posts.
Dont address me unless you have something legitimate for me to assess.
Your continual nefarious tendency and inadequacy continues to bore me.
May God Bless China!!!!!!
"Be extremely subtle, even to the point of formlessness. Be extremely mysterious, even to the point of soundlessness. Thereby you can be the director of the opponent's fate."
-Sun-tzu, The Art of War. Emptiness and Fullness
Scoring disabled. You must be logged in to score posts.
Sorry, too bad, there ain't nothing you can do about it...But, you calling the japs "your former colonial master" is just disgusting....YOu are absolutely no chinese.... I don't know what you are, but you are certainly the lowest life on this forum yet.... agian, phuck you...
MAY GOD BLESS CHINA!
Scoring disabled. You must be logged in to score posts.
Japanese military power is limited at the moment, what are they going to do? Shoot up international merchant ships? Try to bomb Pusan with Mavericks? We'll shoot their aircrafts down, mine their harbors, insert military operatives into Japan, and shoot missiles into Kyushu and Shikoku, take Tsushima island if nessecary. Basically, we'll fight dirty as hell. Do you even comprehend the military balance between the two? Or are you simply pulling stuff out of your ass?
Scoring disabled. You must be logged in to score posts.
Are you serious, the Japanese defense budget is the highest in Asia, as well as you have to realize there is an American nuclear umbrella in Japan. Do you seriously think the United States will allow such a conflict to occur?
Do you think the JSDFN will fall that fast? or the JSDAF? You belittle Japan too much, which I think is quite antithesant of you.
May God Bless China!!!!!!
"Be extremely subtle, even to the point of formlessness. Be extremely mysterious, even to the point of soundlessness. Thereby you can be the director of the opponent's fate."
-Sun-tzu, The Art of War. Emptiness and Fullness
Scoring disabled. You must be logged in to score posts.
"Are you serious, the Japanese defense budget is the highest in Asia, as well as you have to realize there is an American nuclear umbrella in Japan. Do you seriously think the United States will allow such a conflict to occur?
Do you think the JSDFN will fall that fast? or the JSDAF? You belittle Japan too much, which I think is quite antithesant of you."
So you think Japan owns Korea???? What do you think China vs. Japan??? Let me hear what you have to say about your former colonial masters....
-----------------------------------------
Al the chinese pretender wrote to KJ and Mantis "A war with your former colonial masters?"...
I mean what the phuck, this guy is a fake chinese through and through....
Scoring disabled. You must be logged in to score posts.
Hawkss, if you read my post and opened your eyes, you would realize that I was referring to Korea in that Japan was their 'colonial master'. Are you aware of your history at all? You do know that Japan war Russo-Japanese war in 1904, which by the treaty of portsmouth gave them the right to manchurian railway rights as well as the korean peninsula. Recognized by the United States and the faltering Romanov government of Tzaric Russia.
Japan controlled manchuria for over 2 decades and sole right to Korea, their colony for over 50 years. I have taken 2 semesters of Asian history and and quite saturated in this emphasis. Thanks and try to assess me with legitimate posts, thanks
The Ever Enduring Student and Philospher,
Al Tan
May God Bless China!!!!!!
"Be extremely subtle, even to the point of formlessness. Be extremely mysterious, even to the point of soundlessness. Thereby you can be the director of the opponent's fate."
-Sun-tzu, The Art of War. Emptiness and Fullness
Scoring disabled. You must be logged in to score posts.
Sorry Al, the fake chinese... Now I know why panda, Lee and others thought you were a fake... Yes, you are a fake through and through..
As for chinese history... what do you want to talk about.... I am all game...BTW, I am from Beijing when I was 17 and chinese history is what I love to read and talk about the most...
Any era and any topic, your choice... First, can I try to gauge your pinyin ability a bit????
-----------------------------------------
Al the chinese pretender wrote to KJ and Mantis "A war with your former colonial masters?"...
I mean what the phuck, this guy is a fake chinese through and through....
Scoring disabled. You must be logged in to score posts.
I am not interested in addressing Japan and China, the thread is Japanese claimant on a Korean island. Stick to the topic. Once again, dont address me unless you have legitimate posts.
May God Bless China!!!!!!
"Be extremely subtle, even to the point of formlessness. Be extremely mysterious, even to the point of soundlessness. Thereby you can be the director of the opponent's fate."
-Sun-tzu, The Art of War. Emptiness and Fullness
Scoring disabled. You must be logged in to score posts.
The Self-Defense Force is a purely defensively oriented organization until the late 90s, and Korea is simply too close. Underestimate Japan? No, I do not do that, I understand fully, and completely just what it is that they are capable of, and that is why I understand we are not helpless against Japan. Offensive requries less force than defense, enabling Korean forces to inflict enough damage to Japan to make them think war isn't a good option. Japan is simply making its move now, before South Korean moves further in its detterent military path by acquiring more powerful offensive arms, including the F-15Ks and domestic cruise missiles deployed on warships and submarines. Mining the Tokyo harbor would ruin Japan, just as it would hurt Korea when the Japanese mine Pusan.
And no hawksss, I do believe Al is lying about who he was from the start.
Corrected, I apologize. I became a bit hot-headed when it comes to matters like this It's been HBN who's been accusing Al of being no Chinese, wasn't it?
This message has been edited by KJlost on Mar 18, 2005 4:08 AM
Scoring disabled. You must be logged in to score posts.
sorry Al, you are phucking fake and I do what I want to do... Sticking with the topic is the last thing I want to do when I see a fake chinese and call the japanese his former colonial master... again phuck you, AL.
ni ta ma di shi yi ge da sha bi.... ni xiang tian wo pi yan ma????
-----------------------------------------
Al the chinese pretender wrote to KJ and Mantis "A war with your former colonial masters?"...
I mean what the phuck, this guy is a fake chinese through and through....
Scoring disabled. You must be logged in to score posts.
Please take down your offensive sig, before I report you to the mods, that is a direct offense to my personage. You have an hour to take that down before I message Faz and Justin.
You are warned.
May God Bless China!!!!!!
"Be extremely subtle, even to the point of formlessness. Be extremely mysterious, even to the point of soundlessness. Thereby you can be the director of the opponent's fate."
-Sun-tzu, The Art of War. Emptiness and Fullness
Scoring disabled. You must be logged in to score posts.
"Do not weep, do not announce my death. Beat the drum,
blow the trumpet, wave the flag for advance. We are
still fighting. Finish the enemy to the last
one."-Admiral Yi Sun-Shin, November 19, 1598
Scoring disabled. You must be logged in to score posts.
Allied probably, but will never be close enough to be more than non-hostiles. Well, I guess never is a long time, but I can't see Japan and Korea being considered 'allied' enough to be militarily cooperative in my lifetime at least. Japan has been historically our enemy since the end of tri-state era, has extremely bad modern history. Japan is seen as a rival at best, potential hostile to many.
Scoring disabled. You must be logged in to score posts.
"This issue is quite hostile, but due to the sphere of influence Japan has on these regions and due to the historical greatness the Japanese Empire imposed on the region, it is by right, theirs. Japan is an economic super power, one that should be respected, and as a country with an enormous population and a massive defense budget, as well as a great contributor to the Asian economy, Japan has the right to these islands. Korea must observe her line of control and submit. A conflict in the region is the least we want."
@AI
Dam you're a japanese ass kisser! So are you saying that China should do that same and let the Japanese claim the disputed Diaoyu Islands? Talking about respect, the Japanese aren't even respecting the Koreans why should they do the same? You're focked up dude.
Scoring disabled. You must be logged in to score posts.
"Do not weep, do not announce my death. Beat the drum,
blow the trumpet, wave the flag for advance. We are
still fighting. Finish the enemy to the last
one."-Admiral Yi Sun-Shin, November 19, 1598
Scoring disabled. You must be logged in to score posts.
ROTFL, City of Masan's city council met and announced Dae Ma-Do Day in response to Japanese Shimane Prefecture's implemantion of the Takeshima Day. Dae Ma-Do, Japanese name Tsushima Island, is an island between Korea and Japan. The island had been consquered once by a Chosun expeditionary force led by Lee Jong Mu in the 1420s, and has been included as part of the Kyung Sang Province even before that. This is just hilarious. I've been saying we should start a claim of our own on this island in response to Japan's claims, and this city council just goes and makes a statement after a single meeting.
Scoring disabled. You must be logged in to score posts.
Even though the topic is related to Japan, it seems no japanese is responding. I want to explain my point of view and what is general japanese people's view for this matter.
As far as I know the problem arises, the japanese ambasaddor to korea claimed that the Takeshima/Tokdo island is japanese island. And then every korean media started bashing very actively. I do not see anything wrong with that comment because he represents japan and claimed japan's stance for this issues.
I think general japanese people do not really care about this issues. If you look at yahoo japan news or other news paper, this topic is not treated as heading. However, more people start to realize this Takeshima/Tokdo island issues, particularly japanese net users. For example, people in "2-channel" which is one of the biggest japanese forum in japan realize this problem and they enjoy korean people's active response. Prime minister Koizumi keeps saying we should keep calm and develop good relationship. So, from my opinion, south korean people and government took aggressive action and make problmes bigger. I have never seen that japanese people burn other countries flag.
According to both japanese and korean forum, since a lot of both nationality think we should brake off diplomatic relations, I think we should keep distance each others more or less. If we cannot sustain a good relationship unless we accept other countries claim, I do not need such a fake good relationship.
Scoring disabled. You must be logged in to score posts.
don't know why. the japan is so stupid!!!
does japan really gona fight with Russia, China, south and north Korea at once?
japan claim 4 small islands and "other land" from Russia, and the small island between Korea and japan, and "diaoyu" island between china and japan. that's really stupid
ah!!! will that gona be russia-china-south and north korea vs japan and usa? or maybe US will say. hell you japanese. that's not my businese. if you want me to help you. fine. you take russia. south and north korea. and I take china. haha. japan will say: oh. no.I hate russia. you take china russia and north korea. and I take south korea. haha. that's funny
4 vs 2. that will be busy for japan.. hehe ^O^
This message has been edited by QQ007 on Mar 18, 2005 11:05 AM This message has been edited by QQ007 on Mar 18, 2005 9:42 AM
Scoring disabled. You must be logged in to score posts.
"Share a territory, now that's one of the most ridiculous idea"
Yeah this European, more specifically Scandanavian practice is crazy like you ever heard of it before. Then again the Republic of Korea is like the perpetual vicitim yes? they must scavange whatever loose peripherals Japan happens to drop recently.
All I see is the Tae Gukki flying high on the heliport and residence built there by those that administer it. Now why should a busy Japanese should give a crap about some out fringe inbred prefecture claiming sovereignty?
This message has been edited by Gohatto on Mar 18, 2005 10:19 AM This message has been edited by Gohatto on Mar 18, 2005 10:17 AM
Scoring disabled. You must be logged in to score posts.
No new information then? If the Japanese government does not care, why did JASDF RF-4 make a dart at the island and approached KADIZ? No, the Japanese people do not care about the island dispute, but than again, they don't care a lot about what happens to their country. They trust the government to do what is right for them. Rather placid attitude if you ask me.
Scoring disabled. You must be logged in to score posts.
Look at this pathetic Japanese playing the morality card like they always do when they have zero evidence to back their claim. I have shown you mine, where's yours? The way Koreans reacted to recent developments is only natural, this is a neo-imperialistic land grab attempt, and as the Japanese response, including the ones we've seen in this thread, has so perfectly demonstrated, their claims are completely groundless. I love how the Japanese avoid accountability by passing it onto others, central government claims regional affairs are none of their business, and the public claims what their government decides to do is none of theirs, yet these hypocrites are trying to place full responbility on our government in aggravating the situation because they feel we should have done something about the uproar from the Korean media and public who were merely expressing their freedom of speech. Liars they are, majority of the Japanese public is aware of the situation and giving their quiet support for Japan's return to imperial glory, they're just not very vocal about it. As the recent amphibious assault exercise on Iwo Jima (Shortly afterwards, the Japanese Deputy Defence Minister was quoted as saying that Dokdo/Takeshima will be taken by force if necessary), and repeated intrustion of Japanese reconaissance aircraft around Dokdo has proven, it is the Japanese government who has taken the aggressive stance in recent days. I'd love to hear the Japanese response to this, are you going to tell us you have no control over your military and whether your rogue general wants to play war commander or not is none of your concern?
We will defend what is ours, with our blood if necessary, we're not going to put on a phony smile for the camera like the insidious Japs. Take that fake courtesy of yours and shove it up your @$$
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Republic of Korea Marine Corps (ROKMC) The Few, the Proud, the Best.
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
This message has been edited by Mantis214 on Mar 18, 2005 4:47 PM
Scoring disabled. You must be logged in to score posts.
>>>ROTFL, City of Masan's city council met and announced Dae Ma-Do Day in response to Japanese Shimane Prefecture's implemantion of the Takeshima Day. Dae Ma-Do, Japanese name Tsushima Island, is an island between Korea and Japan. The island had been consquered once by a Chosun expeditionary force led by Lee Jong Mu in the 1420s, and has been included as part of the Kyung Sang Province even before that. This is just hilarious. I've been saying we should start a claim of our own on this island in response to Japan's claims, and this city council just goes and makes a statement after a single meeting.
ROFL, that's some funny $hit.
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Republic of Korea Marine Corps (ROKMC) The Few, the Proud, the Best.
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Scoring disabled. You must be logged in to score posts.
>>>This issue is quite hostile, but due to the sphere of influence Japan has on these regions and due to the historical greatness the Japanese Empire imposed on the region, it is by right, theirs. Japan is an economic super power, one that should be respected, and as a country with an enormous population and a massive defense budget, as well as a great contributor to the Asian economy, Japan has the right to these islands. Korea must observe her line of control and submit. A conflict in the region is the least we want.
Are you sure you're not some Wapanese guy pretending to be Chinese? This is a piss-poor excuse, so if the Japanese were to claim Manchuria tomorrow, hell half of China for that matter, would you agree it's a valid one since it's had a recent history of conquest and part of their "historic greatness"? (Only after a very recent spur of growth after lingering in the dark ages for over a millenia lol) Wake up and smell the reality, Japan lost WWII, losers don't get to claim anything, not that Dok-do was even theirs prior to 1905.
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Republic of Korea Marine Corps (ROKMC) The Few, the Proud, the Best.
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Scoring disabled. You must be logged in to score posts.
Thats besides the point. Manchuria, as prescribed withint he context of this thread. Lets get back to the topic. Maybe I confused people here, as incompetents such as Hawkass cleary diverge from the topic rather to flame and cause ubiquitious claims and exarcebate the dilema. Let me state my point okay?
KJ, I dont question your ability to answer and defend the Korean side, I respect that. However as a history major, we have to look at the contects on modern asserbations on the two claimants, which consists of the Republic of Korea and the Japanese Republic. The Japanese assert that they had incorporated Dokdo, an island that they considered to be a terra nuritus, into the Japanese Empire on February 22, 1905 when the Govenor of Shimane prefecture proclaimed the islets to be under the jurisdiction of the Oki Islands branch office of the Shimane prefectural government under the name "Takeshima", cited in Shimane prefectural proclamation number 40 of that year. This action by the Japanese government came about when, in September 1904, a Japanese fisherman from Okinoshima (Oki Island) named Yozaburo Nakai requested to be given exclusive rights to fish in the area of Dokdo (Nakai later recounted that he initially believed the island to be Korean territory, and attempted to submit a request to the Government of Korea, but was dissuaded of this idea by the Japanese Fisheries Bureau Director, Maki Bokushin). The fisherman also asked that he be given a ten-year lease of the island for sea lion hunting. Officials in the Japanese Government took Nakai´s request one step further and appealed to the government for the formal incorporation of the island. After having declared Dokdo (Takeshima) as a part of Imperial Japan in February 1905, Japanese officials entered the island´s name in the State Land Register for Okinokuni, District 4 on May 17th of that year.
Years later in 1966, the Japanese Foreign Ministry produced an extensive study on the history of the island. This study, Takeshima no rekishi chirigakuteki kenkyu (An Historical and Geographical Study of Takeshima), was authored by a Foreign Ministry researcher by the name of Kawakami Kenzo. The Foreign Ministry of Japan has since used Kawakami´s research as the Government of Japan´s basis for its claim to sovereignty over Dokdo. Kawakami attempted to show that Koreans were not aware of the existence of the island. He asserted that the island that Koreans cite in their Choson Dynasty (1392-1910) documents as Dokdo simply does not exist. He also states that Dokdo is not visible from Ullungdo and that Koreans did not have adequate navigation skills (until the late 1800s, when Japanese people taught the Koreans proper sea navigation) to reach Dokdo by boat, and therefore Koreans could not possibly have been aware of the island.
Based on the above precedents, Japan still declares Dokdo to be within its territorial boundaries. The Japanese still consider their 1905 incorporation of Dokdo into the Japanese territorial sphere as legally binding. They also believe that previous opinions of occupation authorities were made null and void by the 1952 peace treaty. Since 1954, the government of Japan has been inviting the Koreans to take the issue before the International Court of Justice. The Koreans have consistently refused, stating that Dokdo is not a disputed territory, but simply Korean territory.
To this day Dokdo is on Japanese registers as a part of Goka Village, Oki-gun, Shimane Prefecture. The Japanese government has even allowed their citizens to declare themselves residents of the islets. This is observed by not only the People's Republic of China as well as major south east asian states such as Taiwan, the Philippines, Malaysia, Thailand, Vietnam, as well as from the American hegemon in the region.
KJ, I am not trying to defame the Korean side, but merely applying a historical emphasis and basis to the Japanese side, believe me I have studied the Korean side, but history and texts imply that Dokdo is wherein Japanese territorial and historical limitations and thus are incomplemented into their own rights of rule. This is observed in the law of the sea as well as national jurisdiction by the codes within the UN as well as Japanese constitution. I feel sympathy for both Koreans and Chinese, trust me, after the crimes Japan has done on our people during the second world war, however, I will not allow such prescribed feelings to ruin my rights to asses the facts and law of the states. I hope you understand my view and the view. NO HARD feelings, please. Thank you
Truly Yours,
Al Tan
May God Bless China!!!!!!
"Be extremely subtle, even to the point of formlessness. Be extremely mysterious, even to the point of soundlessness. Thereby you can be the director of the opponent's fate."
-Sun-tzu, The Art of War. Emptiness and Fullness
Scoring disabled. You must be logged in to score posts.
I think Al is just trying to irritate Koreans to make them hate Japanese even more.
If this is the case, he is a twisted person to the bone...
Also there is no need for an irritate Koreans over this matter.
The people in Korea is really pissed, maybe all of the Korean race.
One of the state in Korea just officialy claimed that Damado(Japan's) is Korea's
island.
I am afraid that Korean might go all the way with this case...
this is stupid!
I like this one. But, I think I saw a simular picture before...from the middle east..
I want to see Korea places an econimic sanction on Japan!!!^ ^
This message has been edited by DeBong on Mar 18, 2005 5:39 PM
Scoring disabled. You must be logged in to score posts.
I am not. I have great respect for both Koreans and Japanese. Please read my previous posts, as you will understand why I state and defend my side. Please read my posts and implement a historical basis, as this is how I impose judgement on most matters dealing with territoriality as well as regional hegemonism.
Cheers.
Live by the heart..eat by the soul..breath by the will of self. RESPECT.
"Be extremely subtle, even to the point of formlessness. Be extremely mysterious, even to the point of soundlessness. Thereby you can be the director of the opponent's fate." -Sun-tzu, The Art of War. Emptiness and Fullness
This message has been edited by ChineseREADER on Mar 18, 2005 5:49 PM This message has been edited by ChineseREADER on Mar 18, 2005 5:43 PM
Scoring disabled. You must be logged in to score posts.
The Koreans, however, lay their claim to Dokdo based on earlier and more numerous precedents than Japan. They point to the document that named it as a territory that was first incorporated into the Korean Shilla Dynasty in 512 AD. They also point to various land surveys and maps that were drawn in later centuries that do, in fact, show Dokdo (in its accurate geographical position) to be Korean territory. Some of these documents were even published in Japan: Japanese cartographer Dabuchi Tomohiko cited Dokdo as Korean territory in "Kankoku Shinchishi (New Geography of Korea), Teikoku Encyclopedia Number 134", published in September 1905; six months after the islets were "incorporated" into Shimane Prefecture. In a survey of Korea that was requested by the Colonial Government, Ihohara Fumiichi referred to Dokdo as belonging to Korea. In a 1930 article, Japanese scholar Hibata Sekko mentioned that Dokdo belonged to Kangwon Province, Korea. The Japanese Navy had also cited Dokdo as an appended island to Ullungdo, and Korean territory, in its 1923 publication, "Chosen Engan Suiroshi" (Korean Coastal Straits).
Koreans also complain that the Japanese took advantage of Korea's political weakness vis-a-vis Japan in 1905, when the islets were registered as a part of Shimane prefecture, Japan. Koreans rightfully argue that Korea had not been able to effectively protest the Japanese action at the time because Japan had had already taken control of the foreign affairs of Korea via the Protectorate Treaty of 1905, also known as the "Eulsa Treaty" or the "Second Japan-Korea Agreement". (The ratification of the treaty itself had been forced on Korea by the Japanese delegation to the treaty "negotiations" led by Ito Hirobumi and General Hasegawa Gonnosuke, with no signatures given by either the King or the Prime Minister of Korea.) The Korean side also points out that the Japanese did not inform the Korean Government of their claim until 1906, and then only indirectly. Upon learning of Japan´s decision, Korean officials in 1906, at both local and national levels, did in fact recognize and document the Japanese action as a violation of Korean sovereignty. However, due to the loss their nation´s independence, no action was taken. Currently, the Japanese Foreign Ministry website states that it was not necessary for Japan to inform other countries of this territorial acquisition. This contrasts sharply with Japan's action when it acquired the Bonin (Ogasawa) Islands in the Pacific. Then Japan contacted Great Britain and the U.S. several times, which were only remotely involved in them and it notified 12 European countries of its establishment of control over the islands.
To bolster their claim to Dokdo, Koreans also point to the opinions SCAP rendered on no less than three occasions during the occupation that excluded Dokdo from Japanese control.
This photo shows as clearly false the argument made by Kawakami Kenzo that Koreans on Ullung Island, ´were not aware of the existence of Dokdo since the island could not be seen from Ullungdo due to the thick vegetation on Ullungdo.´
Koreans have also pointed out the falsehoods in the Japanese Foreign Ministry-sponsored 1966 study by Kawakami Kenzo. Kawakami´s disparagement of Korean Choson Dynasty documentation has been shown to be baseless. Futhermore, the claim that Dokdo was not (is not) visible to Korean eyes on Ullungdo is also a falsehood, since Dokdo is visible at a height of 120 meters or higher in elevation from Ullungdo, an island with a maximum elevation of 985 meters.
Japanese have also made claims that Japan´s "effective management" of Dokdo had been in place as early as the 17th Century, when the Japanese merchant families Otani and Murakawa obtained permission from the Japanese Government to travel to Ullungdo. Not only was Japan´s "effective management" of Dokdo highly improbable at this time (the merchant families were interested in exploiting Ullungdo, not Dokdo), it also creates a contradiction in the Japanese claim. In 1905, the Japanese recognized the islets as a terra nullius, and therefore ownerless (never having been managed) before that time. This contradiction has never been fully addressed by official or unofficial sources in Japan. Probably as a result of this contradiction, the Japanese Foreign Ministry Website no longer mentions the fact that Japan incorporated Dokdo as a terra nullius.
Yet another problematic issue for the Japanese claim to Dokdo, particularly Japan´s 1905 ´incorporation´, is the existence of a land survey conducted by Korean authorities in 1900, known as Korean Government Imperial Ordinance No. 41 (Article 2), which stipulated that the Ullungdo-kun office was to have jurisdiction over Dokdo. This Korean Government order was promulgated on October 25, 1900; over four whole years before Japan sequestered the island as a terra nullius.
Historical Context: 1870s-1905
Therefore, despite the seemingly "legal" aspects of Japan´s incorporation of Dokdo into the metropolitan area of Japan, the Japanese action must be seen from an historical point of view. It must be remembered that Dokdo was annexed together with the rest of Korea, when Japan extended its Empire over the former Korean state in the period, 1900-1910. Japan´s ´acquistion´ of Dokdo resulted from an overall increase in Japanese aggression in Korea in the late 1800s, when Japan began to openly acquire monetary rights, railway, mining, and fishing concessions in Korea, in addition to conducting outright invasions of Korea´s outlying islands. At first, when Japanese civilians began exploiting Korean islands like Ullungdo in the late 1800s, the Japanese Government acquiesed to Korean Government complaints and removed Japanese civilians who were illegally fishing and logging. The Japanese Dajokan, the Council of State, even ruled in 1877 that "our country has nothing to do with" Ullungdo and Dokdo .
However, the Japanese position changed after the Sino-Japanese (1894-1895) and Russo-Japanese (1904-1905) Wars, when these Japanese victories boosted Japan´s willingness and power to control the areas just outside of territorial Japan. The Korean islands in this area of the East Sea/Sea of Japan (Kommundo, Chejudo, Ullungdo and Dokdo) were seen to have value to the Japanese military in the Russo-Japanese War, and the Japanese military essentially invaded these sovereign Korean territories to establish watchtowers and to link them via submarine telegraph cables. It was also during this war with Russia that the Japanese public began to become aware of Dokdo, since many of the naval battles between the Russian and Japanese fleets took place in the area of Ullungdo and Dokdo. Previously illegal Japanese civilian encroachment in this sea area (and indeed the rest of the Korean peninnsula) was encouraged by the Japanese Government in this period. It was in this milieu of Japanese imperialist advance into Korea that Nakai Yozaburo approached the Japanese Government to secure exclusive rights to Dokdo, resulting in the Japanese acquisition of the islets.
Therefore, the Japanese incorporation of Dokdo into Shimane Prefecture was intimately connected to, and a result of, Japan´s imperialist aggression in the early 20th Century. However, the Foreign Ministry of Japan still clings to its belief that the territories it acquired in the period of 1894-1910 were "internationally recognized", and therefore were acquired validly. It is quite curious that Japan continues to hold onto a claim of territorial sovereignty that was enacted at a time when Japan was engaged in imperial expansion.
A final thought on this issue...
The Cairo Conference of 1943 stipulated that "Japan will be expelled from all territories which she has taken by violence and greed [since the time of the Sino-Japanese War of 1894-95]." Considering Japan´s methods, there can be little doubt that Japan´s annexation of Dokdo in 1905 (along with all other Korean territories by 1910) falls within the definition of territories taken by greed, as defined by the Cairo Declaration. If Japan believes that its methods in acquiring Dokdo in 1905 were legitimate, then Japan must believe that it can still, by the same logic, claim sovereignty over the rest of the Korean Peninnsula...
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Republic of Korea Marine Corps (ROKMC) The Few, the Proud, the Best.
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Scoring disabled. You must be logged in to score posts.
Japan's claims do not make way towards the korean mainland, KJ. Tokyo has no intention to do something that stupid. Their intent is merely to maintain the line of hold and control, in this case Dokdo is within their hold. It is truly sad to see that such amount of Korean hostility. Truly, from the bottom of my heart, I am saddened that such a riffed relation has errupted on something so basic of territoriality.
Peace.
"Be extremely subtle, even to the point of formlessness. Be extremely mysterious, even to the point of soundlessness. Thereby you can be the director of the opponent's fate."
-Sun-tzu, The Art of War. Emptiness and Fullness
Scoring disabled. You must be logged in to score posts.
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Republic of Korea Marine Corps (ROKMC) The Few, the Proud, the Best.
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Scoring disabled. You must be logged in to score posts.
Hahahha, sorry about that Mantis! =P Appologies, sir.
"Be extremely subtle, even to the point of formlessness. Be extremely mysterious, even to the point of soundlessness. Thereby you can be the director of the opponent's fate."
-Sun-tzu, The Art of War. Emptiness and Fullness
Scoring disabled. You must be logged in to score posts.
>>>Japan's claims do not make way towards the korean mainland, KJ. Tokyo has no intention to do something that stupid. Their intent is merely to maintain the line of hold and control, in this case Dokdo is within their hold.
Dokdo's occupied by Koreans, and as of now, we control the seas and airspace in and around Dokdo, the Japanese hold nothing, they are merely encroaching into our sovereign territory.
>>>It is truly sad to see that such amount of Korean hostility.
Some old men and college kids bitching in demonstrations is one thing, a high ranking Japanese defense official publically threatening conflict and sending armed warships and aircraft to the area is another. Just yesterday a JASDF RF-4C recce aircraft almost started a ****ing war, turning back just 16km and less than a minute short of crossing KADIZ, less than 40km from Dokdo. Their camera nose is known to be capable of taking high-resolution photos of targets ranging an excess of 50km, so it's a good bet they were able to take a few good snapshots for analysis by the intel boys back home. They're gearing up for war, we're simply protesting, and somehow we're the ones being unnecessarily hostile, LMAO.
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Republic of Korea Marine Corps (ROKMC) The Few, the Proud, the Best.
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Scoring disabled. You must be logged in to score posts.
Al, sorry to say but you have zero credibility to start with. Your first statement could basically be summarized as "The island should belong to Japan because they are more powerful than you are, regardless of the legitimacy of our claim", then all of a sudden you're so eager to look at the issue from a historical perspective (which delights me by the way, the deeper you delve into the historical aspect of this, the more evident it becomes that the Japanese argument has more holes than a Swiss cheese) that just shows how big a hypocrite you are. History major eh? At the University of Beijing? lol
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Republic of Korea Marine Corps (ROKMC) The Few, the Proud, the Best.
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Scoring disabled. You must be logged in to score posts.
I still stick to my base, as you with yours. This is an excellent example of exchange of ideas, whats wrong with such? As for my reasons to defend the Japanese side, I think that historically the Japanese side has a legitimate claim as well as militarily, which allows them to back up their claim.
I have read that JSDAF sent a flight of 3 to spy on the region, could this be a readiness for war?
"Be extremely subtle, even to the point of formlessness. Be extremely mysterious, even to the point of soundlessness. Thereby you can be the director of the opponent's fate." -Sun-tzu, The Art of War. Emptiness and Fullness
This message has been edited by ChineseREADER on Mar 18, 2005 7:26 PM
Scoring disabled. You must be logged in to score posts.
NO f*cking real Chinese will EVER take the side of Japan in a dispute between Korea and Nippon.
Al is not Chinese and people like KJ and Mantis need to take into account when listening the insane sh!t that he sprouts. Japan has a right to those islands because of the f*cking Imperial Jap Empire? Is he insane?
Scoring disabled. You must be logged in to score posts.
Please dont retort to barbaric name calling, as it is evident that you cannot carry a civilized conversation without having to resorting to flame calling. I have warned you once, you are warned again. Legitimacy and you are not in one...and i find it amazing how hawkss and panda post alike...could this be an emphasis of the duality of the two? Hmmm...who knows.
Cheers to everyone..and may you have a peace of mine, transgressed one (hawkss/panda)
"Be extremely subtle, even to the point of formlessness. Be extremely mysterious, even to the point of soundlessness. Thereby you can be the director of the opponent's fate."
-Sun-tzu, The Art of War. Emptiness and Fullness
Scoring disabled. You must be logged in to score posts.
>>>I think that historically the Japanese side has a legitimate claim as well as militarily, which allows them to back up their claim.
You "think", but you've yet to prove it. I can see your going back to your original argument with the latter part of this statement. Japanese Military > Korean Military therefore Dokdo = Japanese, regardless of historical evidence. Silly.
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Republic of Korea Marine Corps (ROKMC) The Few, the Proud, the Best.
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Scoring disabled. You must be logged in to score posts.
Isn't this island already under Korean Occupation?
I read about 1 year ago, Korean army has already occupied this island?
-------------------------------------------------------------
Soldiers of Buddha Empire. United Under Buddha.
-------------------------------------------------------------
Scoring disabled. You must be logged in to score posts.
"errrrr..bring it on bring it on I know you Choppari want the island, well you can;t have it because it's ours TALK TO THE HAND CUZ FACE AIN'T LISTENING~"
I should step away backwards..slowly..
Mantis: "Dokdo is ours!"
Cop: "What the *****? this is a B'z concert"
That knocked out bowl cut dude could be any non-voting Japanese male, even me, oh the inhumanity!
This message has been edited by Gohatto on Mar 18, 2005 11:15 PM This message has been edited by Gohatto on Mar 18, 2005 11:12 PM This message has been edited by Gohatto on Mar 18, 2005 11:08 PM
Scoring disabled. You must be logged in to score posts.
Japan obviously has the adavantage of more assets here, but since they can't exercise their advantage fully, it would be damaging could a limited conflict occur. Make no mistake, nobody is stupid enough to wage a war over this. Dok-do issue has been always a problem between Korea and Japan. The Korean people were more knowledgeable than average Japanese, but both government activities have been rather low for the past few years, until now anyway.
Scoring disabled. You must be logged in to score posts.
-------------------------------------------------------------
Soldiers of Buddha Empire. United Under Buddha.
-------------------------------------------------------------
Scoring disabled. You must be logged in to score posts.
Well I'm sure the disparity between the qaulity of Tertiary education may regain the confidence of many posters here. Yes and to reveal their pride were threatened by a technical college student and the threader has turned incapacitate through either crack, methamphetamine or other substance surely alleviated any insecurities regarding the Republic over the retarded and ever decadent Japanese race.
Scoring disabled. You must be logged in to score posts.
-------------------------------------------------------------
Soldiers of Buddha Empire. United Under Buddha.
-------------------------------------------------------------
Scoring disabled. You must be logged in to score posts.
Analysis: Seoul-Tokyo diplomatic ties strained
By Jong-Heon Lee
UNITED PRESS INTERNATIONAL
Published March 18, 2005
SEOUL -- South Korea is facing a crucial diplomatic test as its relations with Japan have been sharply strained due to a territorial dispute at a time when their policy coordination is necessary to curb North Korea's nuclear weapons ambitions.
South Korea has already distanced itself from the United States over how to deal with the communist nation's nuclear weapons drive. Seoul has rebuffed Washington's demand to regulate the speed of inter-Korean reconciliation and cooperation and join U.S.-led pressure on North Korea.
Analysts here call for Seoul to seek stronger ties with the United States to ease the territorial dispute with Japan and end the North Korean nuclear crisis. Japan and the United States are key players in the six-nation talks on North Korea's nuclear programs that also involve Russia, China and the two Koreas.
The planned visit by U.S. Secretary of State Condoleezza Rice to Seoul over the weekend would be a critical occasion to repair Seoul's frayed ties with Tokyo and Washington, analysts say.
Rice is due in Seoul on Saturday afternoon on the latest leg of an Asian tour that includes Japan and China to push for a restart of the six-party talks.
Relations between South Korea and Japan have been seriously hurt by the territorial dispute over desolate island, with the unprecedented strong wave of anti-Japanese sentiment sweeping South Korea.
The dispute was caused by Japan's revived claim to Dokdo island, which has been effectively controlled by South Korea since the end of World War II. The uninhabited cluster of islets, called Takeshima in Japan, lies about halfway between the Korean peninsula and Japan's largest main island of Honshu.
In the face of Japan's territorial claims, South Korea declared this week that it would no longer abide by a "policy of neglect" and issued a new doctrine on Seoul's relationship with Tokyo.
South Korea has long maintained a low-key stance in dealing with Tokyo's claims to Dokdo to prevent the issue from escalating into a full-scale territorial dispute. It believed high-profile moves would do more harm than good to its ownership of the islets as they could serve to legitimate the dispute.
But the Seoul government says it will no longer tolerate Japanese territorial claims, describing them as an attempt to justify Japan's brutal 1910-1945 rule over the Korean peninsula.
Japan's claim was "not a simple territorial issue but amounts to justifying its past invasion and denying our independence," Unification Minister Chung Dong-young said in the doctrine. The territorial claims "make us wonder whether Japan has an intention to coexist with its neighbors as a peaceful force in Northeast Asia," he said.
Chung, Seoul's top security and diplomatic policymaker as the chairman of the presidential National Security Council, ratcheted up his criticism on Friday, blasting Prime Minister Junichiro Koizumi for being "impolite" and "unreasonable" over the issue. He said Koizumi has a poor grip on the South Korean situation, referring to his comments that South Korea's President Roh Moo-hyun's recent demand for Japan's apology for is colonial rule was intended only for "domestic consumption."
"President Roh tried to lead the Seoul-Tokyo relations into a more future-oriented one by risking domestic criticism," Chung said. "Given Roh's best efforts, what Koizumi said didn't make sense and was impolite."
Koizumi has called for the two nations to overcome their emotional antagonism and promote future-oriented relations, in a gesture to placate angry South Koreans.
Japan's Foreign Minister Nobutaka Machimara also issued a statement, saying his country "humbly accepts the fact that in the past it caused great damage and pain to people from Asian countries."
But South Korea rebuffed Tokyo's statement, calling for its "real action" more than rhetoric. "Japan should show action, not words," said Foreign Minister Ban Ki-moon, who has canceled a planned visit to Japan in protest.
"What is important is action by the Japanese government. The government will continue to keep an eye on this," the Foreign Ministry said in a separate statement.
The Seoul government seems not in position to quickly mend ties with Japan because the territorial dispute is highly emotional, and anti-Japanese protests are sweeping the country.
Angry South Korean protesters burned and trampled Japanese national flags on Friday in front of the Japanese Embassy in central Seoul. A South Korean man also set himself on fire before police quickly extinguished the fire. Anti-Japanese protests were held every day since early this month.
Analysts say South Korea and Japan should set aside the dispute to repair their soured ties and discuss joint measures against North Korea's nuclear weapons drive.
"Close coordination among Seoul, Washington and Tokyo is vital to resolve the North Korean nuclear issue," said Yoon Duk-min, a researcher at the Seoul-based Institute for Foreign Affairs and National Security. "Worsened ties between South Korea and Japan could hurt the trilateral stance," he said.
Seoul officials hope the United States to play a role in persuading Japan to withdraw its territorial claims.
"The cooperation among Seoul, Washington and Tokyo can be further developed when bilateral ties between South Korea and Japan are re-established on the basis of Tokyo's correct understanding on the past," Vice Foreign Minister Lee Tae-sik said.
The remarks came just before the top U.S. diplomat travels to Japan and South Korea. Condoleezza Rice flies into Japan on Saturday before visiting Seoul for a two-day stay until Sunday.
-------------------------------------------------------------
Soldiers of Buddha Empire. United Under Buddha.
-------------------------------------------------------------
Scoring disabled. You must be logged in to score posts.
Stop distorting history's lessons
China Daily Updated: 2005-03-19 05:33
An attempt to justify Japan's colonization of Korea by revising a history textbook for use in secondary schools is adding fuel to ongoing bilateral disputes that have come back into public focus recently with renewed Japanese claims to a group of Korean islets in the East (China) Sea.
The situation is deeply deplorable for the two nations, who have vowed to free themselves from the shackles of the unfortunate past and look forward to a brighter future by building mutual trust and friendship.
A group of Japanese attempting to rewrite history in accordance with ultra-rightist views submitted a revised history textbook to the Japanese Education Ministry for approval.
The group claims that Japan helped modernize Korea and saved it from the threats of China and Russia when it annexed its neighbour for colonial rule in 1910. It also claims territorial rights to Dokdo, the rocky islets under the control of Korea.
Not only does the revised textbook contain misguided descriptions, it also omits historical facts about Japan's shameful acts of cruelty. But will it conceal what the Japanese imperialists really did -- forcing Korean women into sexual slavery for Japanese soldiers, mobilizing Korean men for labour under dehumanizing conditions, and even pressuring Korean families to abandon their names and adopt Japanese ones?
In the past, the Japanese Government has often attempted to deflect criticisms from the Korean people and government against misguided and historically inaccurate textbooks, claiming that there is a limit to what it can do about private publishing companies. But that is only a lame excuse. If that is true, why does it screen textbooks for authorization in the first place?
The Japanese Government and people are advised to resist extremist attempts by right-wingers to whitewash history just because the facts are unsavory to them. They will have to remind themselves that they cannot build friendship with or win respect from Korea and other neighbours by embellishing or denying what the Japanese imperialists actually did against them.
-------------------------------------------------------------
Soldiers of Buddha Empire. United Under Buddha.
-------------------------------------------------------------
Scoring disabled. You must be logged in to score posts.
-------------------------------------------------------------
Soldiers of Buddha Empire. United Under Buddha.
-------------------------------------------------------------
Scoring disabled. You must be logged in to score posts.
Sorry if any of contents already posted before.
Some japanese who know this issue are discussing in the following link.
Also, I would like to give an advice to Korean people because culture and custom seems so different between two countries. If you want to discuss any issues with Japanese, you should not be emotional and behave sensible. The following info may anger some people however, it is the fact so pls look back yourself.
Many feel this incident feel similar to Imperial Japan's activity in the late 19th centuary and early 20th centuary. Don't be so surprise if we get a little more than slightly upset with your government.
Scoring disabled. You must be logged in to score posts.
2005-03-18 14:51 RUSSIA JAPAN KOREA TAKESHIMA *
WHY DOES JAPAN NEED MORE PROBLEMS WITH NEIGHBORS?
MOSCOW (RIA Novosti political commentator Dmitry Kosyrev) - What is it? the world asks itself about the unexpected resurgence of the Japan-South Korea crisis. An unpleasant surprise for the Japanese government, or a failed political action?
Japan apparently does not need a territorial dispute with South Korea. The problem began when the Shimane prefecture decided to establish Takeshima Day on March 16. Takeshima is the Japanese name for the Korean-controlled Dokdo islets in the East Sea - long an issue of contention between the two countries. Dokdo is an area of barely 0.23 square kilometres located 100 miles from the nearest Japanese and 46 miles from the nearest South Korean territory. It has belonged to South Korea since 1950 and was snatched back and returned many times, though mostly on paper.
The islets were snatched from Korea and incorporated into Shimane 100 years ago on February 22, after the Russo-Japanese war of 1904-1905. Russia had to withdraw from the Korean peninsula, where Japan promptly established a nearly undivided rule. Later that year, Japan also took over Korea's foreign policy. Formally, the full occupation of the peninsula lasted from 1910 to 1945, when Japan surrendered in WWII and lost all occupied territories, including considerable parts of China, Russia, Indonesia and Malaya.
Shaking off its colonial past, Japan returned to its former boundaries - at least, this is how its neighbors saw the results of the war.
But now the Shimane administration launched a propaganda campaign for celebrating Takeshima Day on February 22 in a bid to "promote awareness among the [Japanese] public" of the fact that Koreans hold Japanese territories contrary to prior agreement.
What should Japan's neighbors, including Russia, China and several smaller countries, think? This is the revival of the Japanese militarist spirit and revanchism, the Asian countries said about the Takeshima crisis.
Indeed, if the Japanese public, acting with its typical stubbornness, complains about the results of WWII year by year, if new generations of Japanese grow up in the belief that the winners of the war maltreated their country, comparison to Germany between the two world wars will become apparent. A nation with such mentality can hypothetically become dangerous to the countries that have turned the page - the U.S., Russia, China, the two Korean states, and so on.
Worse still, this story has precedents. A similar dispute with Russia over the four South Kurile Islands prevents the signing of a peace treaty between the two countries and prolongs the territorial problem. The Takeshima crisis shows that the problem lies not with Russia but with Japan and its national mentality.
Who needs this, and why? According to one version, this is a typical situation for international diplomacy of the past years, when civil society advances initiatives that undermine its country's foreign policy. As a result, diplomats are forced to fight on two fronts - inside the country and outside it - to protect national interests. In fact, diplomats do not know how to act in such situations, as proved by sanctions against certain countries approved by some of U.S. states, though this is not a widely publicized fact.
Japan is probably facing the same kind of problem, which is damaging above all the government of Junichiro Koizumi. Why does Tokyo need a major conflict with South Korea in the Year of Friendship with it, proclaimed to mark the 40th anniversary of diplomatic relations? It should be said that North Korea is not supporting Japan's stand, either. Why should Japan provoke new suspicion in China, with which it also has a territorial problem (Japan-controlled islands)? Why should Japan complicate relations with Russia, a territorial dispute with which is a mirror reflection of the Takeshima crisis?
If Japan is demonstrating a growing appetite for more territories that had belonged to it in the 20th and 19th centuries and in the more remote past, why should we respect the 1956 Soviet-Japanese declaration that stipulates the transfer of two South Kurile islands to Japan? If we do, the Japanese public may push their authorities towards making more claims.
The Shimane prefecture, whose assembly nearly unilaterally voted for the scandalous law, has pushed the far from successful efforts by Tokyo to develop a normal foreign policy many years back, into a period of semi-isolation when it needed props in the form of a union with the U.S.
But there is another version of the events, according to which the actions of the minor prefecture were engineered by the central government, which had acted likewise to turn the "local" claims of the Hokkaido residents to neighboring Russia into national policy.
This version is confirmed by the refusal of Prime Minister Koizumi to join the other world leaders for VE-Day celebrations in Moscow. The Takeshima crisis can be interpreted as Japan's unwillingness to accept the results of the war and a desire to hinder the discussion of territorial problems with Russia.
This version may look improbable because it will not gain anything for Japan and may cost it very much. So, its neighbors should watch the actions of the Koizumi government in the "surprise" conflict with Koreans.
-------------------------------------------------------------
Soldiers of Buddha Empire. United Under Buddha.
-------------------------------------------------------------
Scoring disabled. You must be logged in to score posts.
>>>Many feel this incident feel similar to Imperial Japan's activity in the late 19th centuary and early 20th centuary. Don't be so surprise if we get a little more than slightly upset with your government.
Can I ask why many Koreans and their government talks about past issues whenever there is a conflict between Japan and Korea. For example, I saw a news that Korean president demanded apology and compensation from Japan about past issue. Can I ask what is the relationship between Takeshima/Tokdo issue and the thing happend 60 years ago? Do we have to accept whatever Korean people say and do because we did bad thing long time ago? I think we should discuss the issues separately without getting involving emotion too much otherwise it is very hard to solve the problem.
Also, I thought this year is a year of Japan-Korea friendship. It takes time to build relationship however, destroying it is very easy. Even though it is common that national interest collide quite often for next country, isn't it possible to keep more respected manner? There are variety of views when we discuss history in Japan. If you or other Koreans see Japan as an absolute Evil and still hate Japan, how come we get along with? I think some Japanese start to get tired to hear those bashing to Japan regarding 60 years ago. Japanese Korean haters are increasing recently on the net which I did not see much 5 years ago.
Scoring disabled. You must be logged in to score posts.
Those who have been wronged find it very hard to forget, do you understand this concept or no?
Things can be buried or hidden away long enough, but its rarely forgotten. Japanese find it easier to simply forget because they weren't the ones who'd been wronged. Korean, on the other hand, are always weary of Japan's intentions. No, Japan probably won't be able to invade Korea directly again in the near future, but the fear is still there. Fear is paper thin distance away from hatred. So whenever there is a move or motion in Japan even appears to threaten Korea, there is a passionate response, even among the young generations who normally don't give a damn.
This message has been edited by KJlost on Mar 19, 2005 5:48 PM
Scoring disabled. You must be logged in to score posts.
Well with Korea's extremely high military-to-civilian ratio and with personnel thrice our size with a sizeable marine shocktroop contingent while we have no such equivalent, it should be US fearing YOU and our froeign policy should act concurrently to that reality, the reality that Korea will readily deploy marines to disputed isles that should have been placed under joint UN Trusteeship long ago.
Pittiful
This message has been edited by Quagmire1 on Mar 20, 2005 1:44 AM
Scoring disabled. You must be logged in to score posts.
Especially now N.Korea has got nukes, that's something without mercy when dropped, no?
-------------------------------------------------------------
Soldiers of Buddha Empire. United Under Buddha.
-------------------------------------------------------------
Scoring disabled. You must be logged in to score posts.
Difficult to guess your composition of english words, no? lol
-------------------------------------------------------------
Soldiers of Buddha Empire. United Under Buddha.
-------------------------------------------------------------
Scoring disabled. You must be logged in to score posts.
-------------------------------------------------------------
Soldiers of Buddha Empire. United Under Buddha.
-------------------------------------------------------------
Scoring disabled. You must be logged in to score posts.
People on crack does not laugh at all, they usually keep quiet and think deeply like philosopher.
Ever tried crack (white one)? no?
-------------------------------------------------------------
Soldiers of Buddha Empire. United Under Buddha.
-------------------------------------------------------------
Scoring disabled. You must be logged in to score posts.
You're the ones with military shaped to be able to turn into offensive force with relatively short period of re-armament. You're venturing out to say WE are a threat? US, who've developed ground-only forces for the past 40 years because we've got a nut in the north? Who are you trying to kid?
Scoring disabled. You must be logged in to score posts.
But to be honest, N.Korea's nukes and ICBM's carrying nuke warheads are well big threat to Japan, no?
Suppose N.Korea fires only one 1 million ton TNT nuke by their Taepudong missile to Tokyo, how many would die? 20 million Japanese being killed in a couple of minutes? No?
It IS a BIG THREAT.
-------------------------------------------------------------
Soldiers of Buddha Empire. United Under Buddha.
-------------------------------------------------------------
Scoring disabled. You must be logged in to score posts.
Although North Korea claims to have this technology, HBN, I truly doubt the United States, which knows when a missile is being launched anytime anywhere in the world and has the capacity to take it down, will allow North Korea to do such. As well as you have to understand that Japan's defense budget, which is the highest in Asia, will allow its missile defense system to go unused. North Korea is all talk and no force, besides its use against its own people. I have no respect for North Korea at all nor do I have respect for Kim, Beijing should have taken the region during the Korean war, at least with Beijing's decentralizing government, the region would have prospered with Chinese booming economy and social services increase.
"Be extremely subtle, even to the point of formlessness. Be extremely mysterious, even to the point of soundlessness. Thereby you can be the director of the opponent's fate."
-Sun-tzu, The Art of War. Emptiness and Fullness
Scoring disabled. You must be logged in to score posts.
I don't think you actually have to have the bombs and the delivery means to post a threat....The perception that you do is plenty enough...And that's why Uncle Sam has not touched N.Korea and Iran....
MAY GOD BLESS CHINA!
Scoring disabled. You must be logged in to score posts.
The wings of the eagle remain unwavered in the reason because we dont wish to interfere with the already established status quo in North Korea, as well as a conflict, although would be won by us Americans, would pose great ramifications to not only our korean allies, our troops in the region as well as massed deaths in north korea and possibly near the manchurian border from saturated bombings.
LOL. You belittle the might the eagle can impose, Hawkss, she has never lost a war. How can a hyper power loose? LOL
"Be extremely subtle, even to the point of formlessness. Be extremely mysterious, even to the point of soundlessness. Thereby you can be the director of the opponent's fate."
-Sun-tzu, The Art of War. Emptiness and Fullness
Scoring disabled. You must be logged in to score posts.
Offensive weapons are cheaper and easier to develop than defensive weapons and missile shields. As of yet, I do not believe that the US has the capability to prevent and intercept all N. Korean missiles heading Japan's way.
There is every reason for Japan to be very scared. N. Korea has nothing much to lose whereas Japan is vastly different.
"Nam Quoc Son Ha Nam Quoc Cu"
(The Southern land (Vietnam) belongs to the Southern King)
Scoring disabled. You must be logged in to score posts.
www.princetonreview.com/college/ apply/acememb.asp?type=1&alpha=_ALL - 48k - Mar 19, 2005
istudy.iagora.com/Allegheny_College/reviews.html
my college web site:
www.allegheny.edu/
Enjoy Hawkss!!
"Be extremely subtle, even to the point of formlessness. Be extremely mysterious, even to the point of soundlessness. Thereby you can be the director of the opponent's fate."
-Sun-tzu, The Art of War. Emptiness and Fullness
Scoring disabled. You must be logged in to score posts.
I ain't interested... thanks, but no thanks.... It is a fact that these reviews never say anything bad...I am not kidding, I have never heard of your college before....
MAY GOD BLESS CHINA!
Scoring disabled. You must be logged in to score posts.
Plus, Al, you actually can use pin yin with that "Se mi mi" stuff...it's pretty good.... I certainly hope you are not a fake chinese and if you prove yourself in the future, I might apologize to you....cheers.... I am done flaming with you....
MAY GOD BLESS CHINA!
Scoring disabled. You must be logged in to score posts.
hahahahhaha are you serious?! my god..the impossible has happened...peace with hawkss!! LOL!
Hahaha just kidding hawkss brother, next time brother, lets not clash okay? I know that we're different in ideas, but the fact is brother, we are chinese. Let us not fight anymore, I will respect your thoughts and swear that I will not start flame with you. Deal. Hah..of course i can speak in pinyin..you guys just got me angry man..its like me accusing you of being indian, and yet know that you're chinese not indian..its offensive, brother.
Alright..ill end this here...tai ch en
"Be extremely subtle, even to the point of formlessness. Be extremely mysterious, even to the point of soundlessness. Thereby you can be the director of the opponent's fate."
-Sun-tzu, The Art of War. Emptiness and Fullness
Scoring disabled. You must be logged in to score posts.
"This issue is quite hostile, but due to the sphere of influence Japan has on these regions and due to the historical greatness the Japanese Empire imposed on the region, it is by right, theirs. Japan is an economic super power, one that should be respected, and as a country with an enormous population and a massive defense budget, as well as a great contributor to the Asian economy, Japan has the right to these islands. Korea must observe her line of control and submit. A conflict in the region is the least we want.
May God Bless China!!!!!!"
WTF are u talking about Al, japan has no rights to these islands. If SK and japan goes to war about this, I would love to see China join Korea's side on this and screw the japs over, thats right take our revenge from the ww2 war crimes and take the islands they have in dispute with us at the same time. What historic greatness are u talking about Al, there greatness when they raped nanking and killed millions of chinese? there greatness when they took Korea and raped and killed its last queen? There greatness in not admitting to any of there war crimes during ww2? Only thing they where great at was raping and killing ppl, and even now to this day the japanese culture is still sick in twisted a place where murders , raping dead people and canibalism is not viewed bad but worshiped and idolised.
"Come the millenium month 12, In the home of the greatest power, the village idiot will come forth to be acclaimed the leader" Nostradamus, 1555
"One of the great things about books is sometimes there are some fantastic pictures." George W. Bush
One man saw it coming...
Scoring disabled. You must be logged in to score posts.
Although North Korea claims to have this technology, HBN, I truly doubt the United States, which knows when a missile is being launched anytime anywhere in the world and has the capacity to take it down, will allow North Korea to do such. As well as you have to understand that Japan's defense budget, which is the highest in Asia, will allow its missile defense system to go unused. North Korea is all talk and no force, besides its use against its own people. I have no respect for North Korea at all nor do I have respect for Kim, Beijing should have taken the region during the Korean war, at least with Beijing's decentralizing government, the region would have prospered with Chinese booming economy and social services increase.
Al i'm losing all the respect i have for u, the US doesn;t have the power to know when A MISSILLE IS BEING LAUNCHED ANYTIME ANYWHERE IN THE WORLD ( after it has been launched maybe not when it is been launched), and it DOES NOT HAVE THE CAPACITY TO TAKE IT DOWN, not all of them at any rate, and the success rate is nothing to talk about. Plus a nuke doesn;t have to detonate right on target to be cause tons of damage, a nuke brought in a cargo ship or a sub detonated near Tokyo would do a hell of alot of damage and would be extremely hard to find and intercept.
Also a question to HBN, why would NK involve themself in a dispute between SK and Japan?
"Come the millenium month 12, In the home of the greatest power, the village idiot will come forth to be acclaimed the leader" Nostradamus, 1555
"One of the great things about books is sometimes there are some fantastic pictures." George W. Bush
One man saw it coming...
Scoring disabled. You must be logged in to score posts.
They must show face? North Korea has condemned Japan repeated for its claim on Dok-do. One statement released in...I think 2001 or so, had the phrases delivering the message that should the Japanese imperialist attempt to take the island, the people of Korea will fight until blood washes up to the coasts of Japan or something like that. They hate Japan, possibly as much as they hate US.
Scoring disabled. You must be logged in to score posts.
It's been HBN who's been accusing Al of being no Chinese, wasn't it? 
