We are hatching out purebred pied muscovy ducks and several breeds of geese. There is a min of 4 per order. The geese are Pilgrims, Pomerainians, White Chinese and possibly Embdens. The goslings may be purebred or mixed, the breeds tend to stick to theyre own kind but ya never know. We are taking down names now and all proceeds go to Angel Wings Waterfowl Rescue. Ducklings are $5 each and goslings are $9 each. Hope you will take some in to your home
Laura Phillips Angel Wings Waterfowl Rescue www.waterfowlrescue.org laura@waterfowlrescue.org
are these from stock you know where the parents came from?? A reliable hatchery? Or from the pond birds you take care of?or birds you bought and raise your self? I gather this is why the muscovies were not up for adoption ?? when buying any stock or pet its a good ideal to check into its background.
This is a terrible way to raise money for an organization that rescues waterfowl. Selling ducklings and goslings to raise money for the birds you rescue, most of which were ducklings and goslings as gifts to someone, grew up and were dumped where they are now. With the amount of domestic ducks and geese floating around out there that need homes, selling ducklings and goslings as a FUNDRAISER is a terrible way to go. Sell pieces of art, bumper stickers, mugs, etc. NOT LIVE ANIMALS.
I have to say I disagree with this being a bad way to raise money. If I was advertizing in the local paper ect and just selling to anyone I would see your point but that is not what we are doing. We are hatching VERY few mixed geese, from eggs collected at local ponds. The purebred Pilgrims are my own stock that I raised, not rescues and were purchased for breeding stock of pet quality birds. The muscovies are being bred because they are a rare and enjoyed breed by many people. I will be offering birds to good homes only. I know that most people on this board are hatching waterfowl this spring. We are no different. MANY people have emailed wanting to take in some geese but can not afford the shipping to get them as the adults are so large. It runs almost a $75 for one goose. This way people that wanted geese can get goslings. Rather than buying from a hatchery which they would do anyway they will be buying from us. And we raise more money for the waterfowl rescue. I plan to donate all the proceeds from my own pilgrim flock also into the rescue. I am sorry but I cant feel that anyone on this board who would order geese or ducks would provide anything less than the perfect home for them. We will only be hatching 20 of these mixed geese for the year. Enough for 5 people to adopt 4. I dont feel these will be unwanted birds that will be dumped anywhere if placed into a responsible homes. Muscovies will be hatched only on a per order basis also to responsible and current waterfowl owners with proper housing ect. This is the only place I have publicly posted for these goslings and ducklings. So far the only orders I have approved have been from people I personaly know.
On another note about researching history ect on breeders, I am very familiar with that and pedigrees. The Pilgrims were actually purchased by my dad. They are hatchery birds. So there is no background on them. Had I been buying them it would have been different. I breed chickens and keep very good pedigree records on all of them. And of course the geese at the ponds we have no background on them. We choose to set some mixed eggs because thats what people asked for. They like the unusual looks and color in a mixed flock.
I dont want to offend the many friends and supporters I have on this board, and the last thing I would ever want to do is create a waterfowl problem with more unwanted birds. I felt I needed to clarify what our plans were and that we will not be adopting any birds adult or babies to a home that we have any doubts to the care they will provide. If anyone questions what people need to do to get qaulified to get a duck or goose from us please go to our website and look at the adoption contract. There is ALOT to being able to qaulify. And it is even harder to get these babies, because like I said so far I have NOT approved anyone whom I dont personaly know.
Laura Phillips Angel Wings Waterfowl Rescue www.waterfowlrescue.org laura@waterfowlrescue.org
I understand what you are saying Laura and I know you wouldn't sell them to just anyone, and I suppose it is ok if you sell them to people you know, but for the people who are too far away to adopt, why not just advise them to find some abandoned birds in their area to adopt?
Ron, Jess...no hard feelings here, No score for this post
March 24 2003, 7:57 PM
- - but I just had to jump in and say that I have no problem with what Laura is doing to raise money for her rescue program.
Ron, buddy, you are certainly entitled to your opinion but can I ask why you seem so critical of Laura's efforts sometimes...There is no harm in her having pet birds as well as the ones she rescues. And if she can raise some funds by selling some babies this Spring, I say good for Angel Wings. Just my opinion, since people are sharing them.
Re: Ron, Jess...no hard feelings here, No score for this post
March 24 2003, 8:35 PM
Katy,
Thank you for the kind words. I appreciate it. Most people have no idea that we are working to get all the domestic breeds off the ponds and dams. That we have fed these birds and attended to medical problems at those locations when our facility was full. This is the first month since we have started Angel Wings that we have had more money come in then went out. And that is only thanks to all the people here. Locally we get no support. People just dont seem to care. They laugh at us when we are drugging through mud trying to rescue a duck or goose, most think we are either crazy or just plain stupid. It is sad. I thought I had a great idea to sell some babies to people who were going to buy them anyway....why not us get the profits instead of some hatchery? I dont mind if people are skepticle, but I hope that they would ask questions. I would be happy to answer any and all of them. You can always email me.
Laura Phillips Angel Wings Waterfowl Rescue www.waterfowlrescue.org laura@waterfowlrescue.org
Well,first of all i dont see that the questions I asked ,were No score for this post
March 24 2003, 8:55 PM
critical.nor Loris or Jessicas statment , thow a bit direct was on the nail head,I never asked for a pedigree.( BUT just because a boxer looks like a boxer doesnt mean it didnt have a collie for an aunt!!)I never said anything about her own birds. But Im honest , and after this, being treated as if were attacking someone one for simple questions i must say,I think saleing mixed gosling from eggs found at the park.Is to me distasteful.And I agree with Jessica.Putting more birds out there does not sound at all correct.Why am I being called critical?? Why were all my questions on the muscovies ignored except by Abby ?? Why than are the muscovy needing sponcers if Laura is breeding them and saleing the duckling?? There is nothing wrong with them if they are bred!! So Sale them to a decent home And RESCUE MORE BIRDS!!!!!why must i email laura?? if she openly asks for money here why am i critical or attacking her to ask the whys on the birds.If Jessica said she was saleing canadas, and i asked her did she have papers so i could prove they were not wild bred is that critical?? no its common sence.If I were trying to sale my muscovies or the new goslings I would be honest and say these came from strombergs and range from fair to good stock.rare color.holdereads birds are from show stock and would make good breeders.ive sold bred and showed Lhasas,many breeds of rabbit.as well as fowl. As well as bought.Always beware of not enough imformation.Its in my nature to ask,its common sence to ask,Its a good policy to ask,,I will stress it again just because a bird looks like a pom. or pilgrim,doesnt mean they are. Better to say they resemble that breed than to declare it.
(Now I am critical.)The questions I asked, were Questions I would ask any place ,any one.If I was interested in stock.AND i have been asked these same questions. I believe now that this doesnt set right!. THINK this out!! lets open a shelter for dogs,Abused and strays,Lets breed the pure breds or the ones that look pure and sale pups?? does that make sence?? why get so upset over honest questions?? jessica ,loris,and mine were not harmful.?? The people on this board are good and kind,we all help each other send gifts do what ever to lift each other.No one was attacking.I would respect angelwings alot more if they stoped the gifts ,sale them.this should not be a biz. but a charity.adopt out these birds.if you cant than sponcer them if you can.there was also an auction mentioned where young were offerd.??.very few charities are in the green.most are in the red.if you want to make money open a hatchery,if you want to save birds than take in what you can find homes for them and go on. but dont start a charity hatchery .I thought the ideal was saving birds and finding them homes?? mrs umbergoose painted on goose eggs get some artists to paint waterfowl on them id buy thoses!!! now ive said all im going to on this.But too add this has left a nasty taste in my mouth,i no longer have any desire to be on this board.Where questions are treated as attacks.Where Laura has to thank Katy for kind words. Il go to my kitchen on the cooking channel.where common sence and questions are expected.
This message has been edited by chefbelflower on Mar 25, 2003 2:25 AM This message has been edited by chefbelflower on Mar 24, 2003 9:55 PM
Be nice to Laura - she is a really great person who works hard. She is trying to do what is best. Don't discourage anyone who is doing good in the world.
So you think things should be done differently. Well then when you run a rescue organization you can do things a whole different way. But stop criticizing her. You sap her energy and make her feel bad and that's not good. When someone is trying to do good in the world you should either show support or keep quiet -- but for God's sake don't discourage and question and put down one's charitable work, ok?
She probably did not answer you about the scoves because she is extremely busy. She has an organization to run, a farm to take care of, a household to manage, and three little girls to take care of. She's got a lot on her plate everyday and is bound to overlook things once in awhile.
P.S. Some people really like the mixed breeds of geese. This can be compared to the cats and dogs you mentioned in your post... just as some people prefer "mutts" to purebreds (like me), some people like the "one of a kind-ness" of mixed waterfowl.
Re: Well,first of all i dont see that the questions I asked ,were No score for this post
March 25 2003, 4:45 PM
Ron: mrs umbergoose painted on goose eggs get some artists to paint waterfowl on them id buy thoses!!!
I paint on eggs and goose feathers as well, and of course regular canvas. I would again suggest selling art, bumper stickers, baked goods even. Not selling ducklings and goslings. To me there is no difference between a dog shelter and stray dogs, and a waterfowl rescue and stray waterfowl;both were dumped and abandoned, both are over-populated, and both need rescueing.
Everybody calm down! Jeez!! Ron - you sit down and listen and don't move your butt, mister!! You are NOT going anywhere buddy! First of all I think all this unease with Laura and what she is doing started when she first came online. She was always posting on here and on TPC asking if certain birds were show quality. She almost gave the impression that if people said yes - I think that sounds like show quality then Laura would go rescue it. Now I know Laura better and I do understand what she is trying to do and I do applaud her efforts. But after reading both Jessica's and Ron's posts I have to admit they both make good points. Laura I think there are countless other ways to make money other than breeding more birds and adding to the popluation. There are printing companies that just about charge pennies to put your logo on t-shirts or tote bags - you could sell them. Or I love Ron's idea - collect the goose eggs and then have someone paint them and sell them. That would be a big hit come Easter I bet. Most grocery stores around here have a cash-back program for saved receipts - look into that. That's an EASY way to make money -you can have familes from your kid's school help save the receipts for you. About the scovies - I think what some people are thinking is if you choose not to adopt them out then basicly YOU have adopted them and you shouldn't be asking other people to support them for you. The behavior you described in them is basicly (from my short experience) pretty normal behavior for adult scovies. They tend to stick to themselves and don't mingle well with other birds. They are also VERY strong birds. Perhaps you could say they are adoptable but only for pick-up only - they can't be shipped. It just sounds like you are keeping them for your own breeding program. Do you see my point? I think we all support and like you here Laura - please don't take any of this too personally. Perhaps the only problem here is poor communication.
And Ron - I don't think Katy was attacking you personally. You say you have the right to ask Laura questions - and I agree - but why doesn't Katy have the right to ask you questions also? I do know you are stressed and all but please don't leave us. You know how much I love you - you are in my heart forever. This board would be very lonely without you! Did I leave after LQ personally attacked me and hurt my feelings?? Called me selfish and self-centered and basically stupid? No I didn't. No one has even come close to doing that to you - so you are going NO WHERE buddy!!
Now let's all agree to disagree and PLAY NICE!! Or you are ALL going to your room!!
Thanks for taking the time to write and share your opinion and thoughts. I appreciate it very much.
I still feel I am very misunderstood. If someone is "looking" to buy goslings and ducklings and I "know" for a fact they are providing a good home, I dont understand how this is adding to a population problem. These people would order them from someone else if not me. I dont feel I should ever discourage someone who has a good home not to have waterfowl. Most people on this board are or are going to hatch waterfowl this spring. Why am I not soposed to? And I think people are forgetting that I also OWN some Pilgrims that were not rescued. Those are the ones I asked about so many times on TCP and did infact compare them to others I had seen at local ponds. Since my dad bought them I had no background on them or knew the slightest about wether they could be used for 4H or not. We bought them to breed long before we started the waterfowl rescue. I have orders that were paid last year that I need to fill. I have not shared this with anyone else but Abby, but after I fill these orders for Pilgrims I am donating my pair to a boy for his 4H use for 2004. I have decided not to breed them after this year. SO there is alot that people dont know. I would not keep waterfowl such as the muscovies for breeding purposes only. This is the first time I have ever had muscovies. I , even with theyre frightened nature have fallen in love with them. They are quiet and I find relaxing to watch. I would love it if someone local wanted to adopt them....but as Abby knows we get NO local support. Not one donation or adoption since we started. Just the last month have these muscovies become more comfortable here. I worry about them...and I am sorry but wont adopt any waterfowl to someone just to free up space or funds. I need to be sure they are going to the perfect family that will be able to meet they're needs...and I feel these ducks have special needs. As of today I plan to remove them from the rescue and adopt them myself. They will no longer be up for sponsership nor adoption.
Laura Phillips Angel Wings Waterfowl Rescue www.waterfowlrescue.org laura@waterfowlrescue.org
First of all I think your statement "there is alot that people don't know" sums it up perfectly. I think there may just be a slight communication gap going on and people are sort of filling in the gaps themselves. And my thinking on the selling babies issues is just that, in my opinion, you are supposed to be a RESCUE - meaning you take in and take care of unwanted waterfowl. Meaning I think you should be focusing on finding homes for the unwanted poulty you have now - not creating more. It's the same with any animal rescue - be it dog or cat or rabbit or potbelly pig. These rescues are not breeding and/or selling babies to support their cause. They are, for the most part, against breeding any more critters. Most of them will spay and neuter an animal before they will adopt it out. I have nothing at all against LAURA as a person breeding or selling waterfowl - but I just think the idea of a waterfowl rescue doing it just doesn't sit well with me is all. Do you see my point at all? And I also find it very sad that you are getting no local support. Have you visited any of the local animal shelters? Told them about your cause and gotten advice/support etc? How about the schools? Take a few birds in and visit the schools - talk to the kids - send home flyers with them to give to their parents. Just ideas here - I don't mean to rant!
lori, it does no good to rehash on this No score for this post
March 25 2003, 1:22 PM
and you did stay off the board for a while.LOL after the LQ abduction!!,Im not angry,I find this whole thing sad. and yes a bit shady.I really dont care one way or the other what happens.I made my points and im not wrong.to Abby, the crack about me running my own shelter my way, all i have to say is the right way is the way to go.i said all i have to say above.you are the one that compared it to the humane Soc.I will call them right away and tell em they got it wrong the way to really help them is to breed more and rescue less.May i also point out how defeated this is to only adopt to local,or people you know, or have birds already?? there are alot of great people and teens that dont have birds yet.so unless you are born with a duck on your back, LOL why have the site than? to rech so many people if they have to be knowen ?? rescue is hard work,ive done it,charity is hard work ive done it.You go in KNOWING hours are long ,its free time no pay little gain .The rewards are down the road.If you expect clap on the back and good job.A bonus .Go ask any other charity.See what they get.Ive done the soup kitchen I can out weigh your slipping in mud and being laughed at By a billion!!! I cant not feel sorry for laura she decided to do this but I can expect her to inform.to be open. thats all i asked .
katy does have the right to be vocal and i never said she didnt.again my frists posts were not critical, they asked questions.if you cant deal with honest questions than there is a big problem.laura is lucky to have such loyal and devout friends on this board.I know im not the only person thats sees shaded areas.i give jessica a big thumbs up for having guts enough to ask pointed questions.And if my questions sap lauras energy, for asking where they came from.LOL she better get prepared with the site you have and angel wings seems like a huge org. till you know whats going in.Others are going to ask.oters may want to see recipts .A charity ???? isnt this ???? no lori im on the cooking channel i have alot to do there il post my bird pics with food LOL I started that already!!you all need to reread my first posts. to get so much wear and tear I must have dug in an infected area.last words on this subject last words on this board. you can email me belflower3790@msn or the old yahoo addy.see ya on the cooking channel. ron
That was a really rude post. I never thought I would say that about anything you posted... I think most of what you wrote is just fine - you are simply stating how you feel and where you stand on things. But there are other things in your post that I have got to believe you wrote impulsively and rashly without thinking before you posted. We are all understanding people here though and time will fix this one in the end and hurt feelings will mend. I think though that somewhere down the road an apology will be in order but it's too soon for you to see that now. Take a break from things if that helps and we will welcome you back when you are ready.
This whole discussion is going circles NOWHERE! My words are being turned around and no one seems to get what I am saying.
I am NOT going to be a waterfowl breeder!!! I have ONE BATCH of eggs put in BECAUSE people I KNOW wanted them and ASKED for them. I thought just MABEY some of the people HERE who were going to order this year ALREADY...might want to order from us out of this ONE BATCH instead of ordering from a hatchery. This is NOT something LONG TERM! And we will NOT NOT NOT being doing it again.....this was a ONE TIME effort to help people who CANT get an adult still be able to have waterfowl!!!!
We DONT just adopt LOCALLY!!! I dont know where that came from. And I DONT just adopt out to people who already have waterfowl.....with these BABIES I did say the requirement would be people EXPERIENCED in waterfowl. So they KNOW what they are getting into. If I was breeding ALL YEAR....YES I would be greating a problem. If I hatch any waterfowl for friends that CANT afford the shipping of 4 ADULT geese then what is the problem?????? I am SORRY but I still DO NOT understand this whole thing. I think it has been taken wrong and that people are saying I am doing something that I am NOT. This is NOT an open advertized fundraiser, this was an idea I had to share AMONG friends HERE and that I have around the US. An idea that was brought to me LAST NOVEMBER by 3 different people who wanted to adopt. I thought it would be a great idea and these people would be able to contibute and get something in return....the geese or ducks they wanted.
If this and "I" am seen as shady because of this....I don't know what to say at this point. I am done going circles on this. I am not trying to make any enemies...I am trying to help the waterfowl and help people who want them be able to have some for them to enjoy.
If anyone that was "going" to order from hatchery or other source for some babies and want some from us, please email me. They are almost all spoken for at this time. Like I said it is a real small batch...and all may not even make it to hatch.
Laura Phillips Angel Wings Waterfowl Rescue www.waterfowlrescue.org laura@waterfowlrescue.org
A lot of assumptions were made about what you are doing. I think these assumptions should have been turned into questions rather than accusations and sent to you via email though - NOT posted here in the form of accusations. But what's done is done. The best thing to do from here on is when someone has a problem, they can email the person directly and discuss it with them rather than dragging the entire forum into a cross-examination exercise that eventually turns into name calling and rudeness. Let's all move on and allow my post to be the last one in this thread, shall we? Laura and Ron are grown ups and can discuss anything Ron needs clarification about via email (and Lori and Laura can as well if they need to). So let's officially close this thread.. If I see another post in this thread after my post here I will positively SCREAM ok? Or worse - I will record Baby screaming and make you all listen to it - and trust me -- the sound ain't pretty!
All I want to add to this is what you are saying here in this last post is totally different to how you came across in your very first post. Go back and re-read it - and you will see what I mean.
Welll , i promised my self i dood idood, but oweing any one an apology No score for this post
March 25 2003, 6:54 PM
is out landish.I didnt do a thing wrong but ask questions, Im to apologise for that!! I gave what i got .Lets not beat around the bush ok?? And WHY!!!! should I email her these Questions?? If So than her Donation Requests should also be EMAILED!! Several people asked me if i noticed my post questions were ignored.If lauras as time to post for donations Abby,She surely has time to READ the return posts .Im not playing a game.I was attacked for questiong. Go back and read just how terrible my first post was!! Give me a break I dont want to be on a board where you cant Question.Go back and start from the begining.AND no thanks for the welcome Back I dont plan on returning.Im saddend and unhappy .Laura isnt a victem.And as for apologies go.I believe IM the one owed!!! Enough said.To lori and Jessica .Wish you the best. See you on CC ron
This message has been edited by chefbelflower on Mar 25, 2003 7:42 PM
THIS BOARD IS FOR FUN AND ONE SHOULD HAVE A THICK SKIN TO READ OR POST... ENTER AT YOUR OWN RISK... NOT RESPONSIBILE FOR ANY OF THE THINGS SAID HERE... HAVE FUN AND REMEMBER THIS IS JUST A BOARD FOR FUN AND WILL GIVE YOU A HOOT..
Where did these babies come from??
lorif1 
You are NOT going anywhere buddy! First of all I think all this unease with Laura and what she is doing started when she first came online. She was always posting on here and on TPC asking if certain birds were show quality. She almost gave the impression that if people said yes - I think that sounds like show quality then Laura would go rescue it. Now I know Laura better and I do understand what she is trying to do and I do applaud her efforts. But after reading both Jessica's and Ron's posts I have to admit they both make good points. Laura I think there are countless other ways to make money other than breeding more birds and adding to the popluation. There are printing companies that just about charge pennies to put your logo on t-shirts or tote bags - you could sell them. Or I love Ron's idea - collect the goose eggs and then have someone paint them and sell them. That would be a big hit come Easter I bet. Most grocery stores around here have a cash-back program for saved receipts - look into that. That's an EASY way to make money -you can have familes from your kid's school help save the receipts for you. About the scovies - I think what some people are thinking is if you choose not to adopt them out then basicly YOU have adopted them and you shouldn't be asking other people to support them for you. The behavior you described in them is basicly (from my short experience) pretty normal behavior for adult scovies. They tend to stick to themselves and don't mingle well with other birds. They are also VERY strong birds. Perhaps you could say they are adoptable but only for pick-up only - they can't be shipped. It just sounds like you are keeping them for your own breeding program. Do you see my point? I think we all support and like you here Laura - please don't take any of this too personally. Perhaps the only problem here is poor communication.
Did I leave after LQ personally attacked me and hurt my feelings?? Called me selfish and self-centered and basically stupid? No I didn't. No one has even come close to doing that to you - so you are going NO WHERE buddy!!
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/ Blackkats4 
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