My name is Jeff and I found out that my wife had been having an affair on sunday.
Im not sure if I am posting this for advice or just to help myself get through this trauma. But here is my story.
I met my wife in high school and we have been together 8years. We have a 3 year old son and got married in june last year.
We started having difficulties in the bedroom. I began to feel like I was not wanted. We would have sex at least once a week. But only if I asked. She wouldnt turn me down without a real reason but this I kept getting this feeling that something was different. I became frustrated with her and began arguing about it. She would refuse to say anything and get angry she would just bottle it up and we would go on with our day. I would give in and make up with her as she made me feel like I was some sex freak who just wanted to touch her because I am a man and that is what we do.
I continued to get frustrated with her and she continued to not hear me. I tried to get her more interested by suggesting new things but she just made me feel like a pervert for thinking of such things. She began to feel like she wasnt satifying me when she absolutley was I felt the exact same way towards her and I told her so. She refused to say these things and everytime I would bring it up she would not say anything just lie there and resent me.
Then in January she began the affair. They snuck off during a lunch break at work (they worked near each other) and had sex in her car (that I bought her for Xmas).
I was completley unaware and she continued doing it and of course became even less interested in sex with me. So I tried harder I sensed we were having troubles hwoever didnt suspect an affair so I started becoming even more needy and worried and frustrated.
I thought things were getting back on track when we went out and had a lunch and walk on the beack followed by dinner then a romantic evening. Things were ok for a few days.
We went on a trip overseas for 10 days in febuary and had an absolute great time with our son. Not one sign of any trouble. She was completely normal. which looking back amazes me how she managed to keep a straight face watching me spend thousands of dollars on this trip.
We had not had any time overseas to make love because of our son, and when she retunred from the trip she was sick so a few days past. It was tuesday night and I asked her to have sex (she knew I wanted to and she made me ask)and after that I asked her why she made me ask. When it was obvious and I started to push and she said she wasnt sure if she wanted to be with me anymore. So I did the right thing and moved out I started the fight and I wanted to get out of there after a few days I realised how important she is to me and I came back begging to be let back in and promised we could work it out. She blamed my temper(which had become worse because of the tensions we were having.) and said I needed councelling so I promised to do those things and she continued to need more time. She refused to talk to her sisters or other close freinds and I was lost and couldnt believe we had problems this bad. I assumed we would just hug and make up and it would be over with. She said she needed time to think.
I lived out of a suitcase at my parents for 2 weeks until I took my son back to our home to drop him off she wasnt home from work yet so I waited and decided to check her facebook just to see if she had talked to anyone about this maybe a work freind or something just to get an insight into what was in her head. And this is where I found a message. I completely fell apart I went over to her work and confronted her and she denied it saying he was joking and it didnt mean anything. I beleived her and walked away feeling guilty for accusing her. Then I kept looking and found a chain of emails and links to websites with advice on affairs and divorce.
I waited till she got home and I asked her again and she admitted it. She blamed me and refused to give me all the details. I made her pack her things and leave. I imediatley wanted to forgive her. But she said she would feel to guilty to be with me.
The day after she was at our freinds house thinking she wants to work things out and then I pissed her off by sending the guy a message to stay away. This made her angry but she was there talking about getting back together.
I want to talk to her I want to either move on together or apart but not this in between waiting for her to decide dangling a sword of damoclese over my head. I know she needs space and time to think but I need her discuss it with me and decide one way or another.
I feel if she doesn't want to get back together that at the very least she should apologise for cutting me so deep. She lied and made me feel like I was the one that needed to change. When she was the one in the wrong all along. However I feel if i force this chat she will feel backed into a corner and will resent me and she will be gone forever. I also get the sense that she does love me but will feel to guilty to get back together. Which hurts even more because I feel she is just taking the easy and selfish way out.
I am totally destroyed inside my whole life is turned upside down I cant eat or sleep. I wish I could hate her enough to not miss her so much but I just want to get on with things and work things out. I feel guilty for making her do this I feel foolish and like Ive been taken for a ride. I am so lost
We are talking tomorrow (on my request) and I hope she will see what she is giving up but at this point I really fear that the end has come and I really don't know what to do.
I am so sorry you are hurting so bad. This is all so new for you and I remember what that was like. You arent alone, we all feel the same way, even with as crazy as your emotions are right now.
First and foremost, this is not your fault. Let me say that again, this is not your fault, you didnt make her have an affair, it was a choice she made all on her own. Affairs are not about the betrayed Spouse (BS) but all about the Wayward Spouse (WS).
Right now she is being a fence sitter, which is really quite common. She doesnt want to let you go and she doesnt want to let the Other Man (OM) go either. She will continue to do this as long as she is able to. Try not to enabler her in her fence sitting. OM has to be out of the picture. Reconciliation needs complete no contact with the Other person in order for it to work.
It is so good that you came here. It helps to write it out and hear from people who are or have been where you are. Read all you can on infidelity. To the left of this page there are a number of helpful links that can direct you to some excellent reads. Look into getting yourself some Individual Counseling (IC) it will help to have someone to talk to about this. Most of all try to be strong for your little boy.
This is a long hard road, but people do recovery. My husband and I are 7 years past his Affair and doing very well.
Okay, Jeff this is a bombshell. Your W has taken your life and turned it on its head and there is very little that hurts more than what she has done.
The first weeks after D-Day are pretty much a shock and your mind and emotional makeup is going to fall over itself to cope with the trauma in any way it can. I know this isn't a happy prospect, but prepare yourself for an absolute emotional rollercoaster from hell, because you will yo-yo between hope and fear and anger and forgiveness and desperation and the whole gamut in between. This is natural, you have undergone the emotional equivalent of a high-speed car crash.
In the weeks and months following my discovery of my W's A, I grasped every available avenue of support open to me, and I would say that you must not at any stage feel too proud to ask for help and support from those friends and family that you can count on (and this is where you will quickly discover who they are). I went to my doctor and got a prescription for anti-depressants to help me over the bump (just be warned though, these are not a quick fix, but an aid which you will need to be on for months if you go that route). I visited friends and took my daughter to play with their kids. I spent ages reading posts here, and venting and pouring out all my frustrations and anger and misery (and let me say that I found some very caring and understanding people here). Most of all, I did my damndest to stay in the game of life for my little girl, as her Mom had definitely gone emotional and psychological walkabout. You, too, have to stay in the game, drawing on whatever support you can muster.
I used to have a little book packed with advice about surviving - surviving accidents, hijackings, natural disasters, etc. etc. (At one point in my life I had something of a fascination for what it took to survive things). A lot of it was common sense, but I always remember the very first page of it. It said that the first thing that you have to do if you want to boost your chances of surviving ANYTHING, is to take a deep breath and make up your mind that you WILL survive it.
With apologies to Galaxy Quest, never give up, never surrender.
In many ways, misery loves company, and there is a sensitive and understanding community here that can offer real support to you in this. They helped me survive my darkest days, until I could reconnect with my W and recover our marriage. They can help you too!
Stay strong. Stay as focused as you can. And look after yourself physically.
Welcome. You going through a gut wrenching experience. Make sure you eat and sleep during this time. Try to find things to do that will divert your mind from this, even if for only a few moments.
Realize these facts:
1) You did not cause the affair, and your behavoir that she accused you of doing was (even if she was right) her way of feeling justified for what she was doing.
2) She did not choose the OM because he was better than you in any way. THe reasons wayward spouses chose their affair partners often turn out be be very, very shallow.
3) Knowing the score now, how you react will have an impact on the outcome. If you react by letting her decide in her own time, by compromising your boundaries for the sake the relationship, or by being over accomodating, it will very likely prolong her involvement with the OM. You will very likely loose self-respect if you allow your reasonable boundaries to be broken.
If you react by breaking the relationship totally, without any opportunity for reconcilation, then the marriage will, of course, end. You could ultimately regrete not being more open to allowing reconcilatoin to take place.
One book that you might find helpful, since your wife is trying to maintain both relationships right now, is "Surviving an Affair" by Willard Harley. It's on our list of books found under the "Helpful Links" section of the forum.
Jeff, I hope you find the help you need. I know some of what you're going through, and I want to assure you that you will heal from this.
We are here to support you. This site was my saving grace, I read all the posts, on all the sites, Healing, Deeper and Open posted when I needed help.. I read books.. all helped me .. we are 6 1/2 yrs past D-day and doing well.
Post often it helps so much..
take care,
Pat
"Time is precious, but truth is more precious than time."
Well I talked to her yesterday and she is definatley fence sitting. I am preety sure she has called it off with the OM but they were freinds at work for years apprantly.
I asked her if she regrets doing it and she said "I regret hurting you but I dont regret doing it - its what I needed to do at the time"
She thinks she feels guilty but has no real remorse. To me the guilt is selfish. She is living in a spare room at her grandmothers house and has nothing. I fear for my son as I dont think she will be capable of looking after herself and providing a stable world for him. Fortunatley I have the house and my son will spend most of the time with me.
I went out and got drunk with some good friends. I wasnt activley seeking out attention from other women but I really thought if someone came up to me and started flirting I would have taken it as far it could go. Does wanting to do that so quickly after the event mean I really don't love her anymore? Or this a normal reaction.
I want to try and work things out but I don't want to wait for months/years for her to decide she still loves me. I feel like I should get out there and start looking for the next person.
Let me give you an unfortunate welcome. I'm sorry we have another member but hopefully you can find help here. I know it has helped me.
I am relatively new here so I'm sure Tom and Dave my be more help, but maybe my newness can be helpful.
Dave is right about the roller coaster ride. I have been on it for 5 months now. It gets better with time. Now is probably not a good time to make these big decisions. At first I would have done anything to save my marriage. After a couple of months I felt anger that lasted for a couple of months, and now I feel the need to have an affair to get even. I know better than to follow through on this, that will just cause more problems.
My wife did not have the fence sitting issues so I am lucky in that respect. You cannot make this decision for her but you deserve an answer. She may need you to force a decision out of her(whatever that may be). I will never forget the MC meeting at about four months when I told th MC this was not working and I would have to leave the home. I was crying as I said it because it broke my heart to give up but things were not acceptable to me. My wife asked me to stay and started making changes to help me. I think we were just going through the motions until then and now she really started to work on things. Do not expect a one day meeting to fix things. You sound like you want the answers now and it doesn't work that way, at least in my case.
I also felt I needed to make a decision right away about staying together. After about three months of wondering what to do I realized that by staying the decision was made subconsciously. Even though I was still in the house I kept asking myself if I would leave like it was d-day again. If you have to live the movie groundhog day don't let it be d-day.
If you are having meetings with her there is still a chance of reconciling. It hasn't been decided yet and either one of you has the right to say no go. I have seen more than one person at work re-marry their former wife so there is no need to rush a decision. You need to get over this even if things don't work out with your wife. You say you want to start looking for the next person. Slow down and find out what went wrong here so you don't have the same problems again. I am learning a lot about myself that will help me either way. The way I look at it, if I have to start over let the first try be with my wife.
The recovery process is not quick and easy. I have never been divorced but those that post here say it is not an easy way out, which may be what you are looking for. I can tell you that recovery is hard. I have hope from those have posted that it is worth it. I hope I can add to those posts in the future.If I remember right the shock at your stage is terrible. I went through the unable to sleep and eat stuff as most did. I did not use anti depressants. It will get better.
One of the hardest parts for me was the falling back parts. You start making progress and then find yourself back where you were. I have found that this is part of healing. I start to get some acceptance of what has happened and then I lose it. I can't keep my grasp of it. Don't get disappointed. These feelings keep coming back and I hold them a little longer each time, to the point acceptance is here most of the time at 5 months. Forgiveness is another issue and I can only promise to post again when and where I find it.
Good luck in your situation and don't feel you have to make decisions right away. The first decision is apparently hers to make. She is going through confusion too since you found out. She didn't plan on having to make this decision, but you probably need to give her time and then demand an answer. This is something she will not confront without prodding. You didn't mention the OM's situation. Does she have options with him, or is unable/unwilling to commit.
I had a good day today and then I had a dream about her. - It was so vivid and real I woke up feeling sick.
I dont know what the OM situation is. She hasn't been with him or spoken to him but she defends him. I hope she is smart enough to take a break from him aswell but she is living in an uncomfortable circumstance at her grandparents place, it will be hard to spend time with my son there and she cant really afford to move out on her own. - The perfect environment to go running to him in haste.
Im preety sure he would take her back. Emails saying he loved her were found, He hasnt told his wife yet and he just lost his job so I do not know.
First let me say do not make any life altering decisions at this point. You are on an emotional rollercoaster ride from hell. On a real roller coaster the consequences would be far worse getting off mid ride instead of gutting it out to the end of the ride, it is the same with the emotional rollercoaster.
My history, in a nutshell, is that H had an affair many years ago and we reconciled and spent another 10 years together. He started another affair whilst working in another country on a temporary assignment. My advice to follow is derived from what we did to reconile after the first A and the realizations I came to after the second.
After the first A I bought into my "responsibility" for all that I failed in that caused him to have an A. The details are not important, but we went through MC and I made all the changes to become the person he needed me to be. In reflection (and the reflection is still somewhat distorted) I can see where I made major changes to accomodate his needs, I went on antidepressants, went to IC, broke habits, etc. etc. etc. I worked really hard to address all his ""issues". Life was good, or so I thought at the time.
When he went overseas to work temporarily he engaged in another A. After D-day all of the excuses he used for the first A came up as if the past 10+ years had been erased. I realized then that the A was about his issues and needs, not mine, and that no changes I could make could resolve those issues, only he could. He did not go to IC after the first A and never looked into "his issues" because he kept saying that it was about me and the needs I was not meeting.....and I bought that at the time.
I set boundaries the 2nd time around and insisted that the marriage could not survive unless he went to IC and worked on his deeper issues that led to his A's and he refused to admit that he had any issues at all beyond what I was not fullfilling in him.
The point I am trying to make is that do not lose sight that she has deeper issues that only she can resolve. The A had NOTHING WHATSOEVER to do with what you have done or not done for her, there is something much deeper that she needs to resolve. She can work on and resolve the surface stuff and you can do everything within your power to make the M work, but unless she takes ownership of her actions and does some really hard work to uncover and resolve her deeper underlying issues that in all likelyhood those issues will rear their ugly heads again in the future in some way shape or form.
I am now divorced and having done both reconciliation and divorce that one is not easier that the other. You still have to ride the emotional roller coaster until the end of the ride, the only difference is which side of the car you get out of at the end.
My will shall shape the future. Whether I fail or succeed shall be no man's doing but my own. I am the force; I can clear any obstacle before me or I can be lost in the maze. My choice; my responsibility; win or lose, only I hold the key to my destiny. ~Elaine Maxwell~
Welcome to the place where none of us thought we'd be. I am so sorry for the pain you are feeling. It has been over 3 years for me. All I can say is take it a day at a time. It's hard to think about the future when your just trying to get through the day.
When you commented on how you got drunk and were willing to meet someone, I...as many here...understood. We are hurt so bad that we want our spouse to feel that same deep pain. I know that in my brain I felt that it would make things even, and we could start over from scratch. However, I have kids and I am not sure I could ever do that to them or myself. What's the point? It doesn't take away the pain we feel or change what's happened.
As many here have stated, her A had nothing to do with you. You are not responsible at all for the choice she made. We are all affected deeply by it, especially when we weren't expecting anything at all. No clues to help us know that something was going on. My H did his thing during work hours as well. He would come home like normal. I never suspected a thing. I sometimes think, maybe there were clues, but dumb me didn't read them. Now things make sense.
Try to hang in there and not make any hasty decisions. Also, don't enable her to sit on the fence. As long as OM is there, she will contniue to sit. Keep strong for you boy. My kids, along with this site, were my saving grace.
Jeff - I have a sense of the insult or affront that is involved in my wife having her affair - It hurt me to my quick in that I felt I was being hated by the person I had put so much trust in - This, in turn, made me feel worthless, unloveable and unworthy - I felt like I was almost burned up and wasted as a person - no use.
Yet, I was still entangled with this other person - this murderer of my SELF - I am now 3 and a half years post d-day and still working on this - One thing I do know is that I have to sort out my relationship with my wife before I could be ready to make a good relationship with another.
Whatever happens now you have to sort out the tangled mess of rubble you find yourself in - And it will take time.
I am interested in what Bill said about decisions being made subconsciously - I feel that I did not and still do not really understand what all this means to me - And so, yes, I do feel I am feeling my way forward and events will just unfold one way or another. The idea that you can simply decide to make things better is certainly not right. Yet I read here and hear from others that, in the end, it is about some kind of intent (decision is too strong and too clear cut conscious a word), yes intent, that emerges - that shows the way forward.
What Chris says about boundaries is good advice too - For me this is about setting out what I want and making it very clear to my wife - The, at least, you have a kind of line drawn that helps show the way forward.
This is a very blurry situation - And, from what I hear, your wife is a bit like mine was, in that she believed that the other man actually did really want and even love her for herself. The reality has been dawning over .. yes it took three years, but the reality is emerging for her that it as lust and sex that was the engine for him (he even actually said this to her at the beginning but she wanted to hear something different!). Oh sure, a kind of artificial world sprang up in which she allowed herself to believe he really cared and he played to that and got sex (in almost all of their 1000 occasions of meeting .. yes 1000 odd over 18 years). And when, on a very few occasions sex was not possible he threw a tantrum.. True. Yet wife was absolutely sure that she was a "very special friend" and that "he really needed me because his relationship with his wife was not that good" - She said she gave him sex "to please him" if you can believe it. The message here is that she, like others I suspect, was quite capable of making up a story in her head to explain everything - meanwhile starting an affair with two children aged 5 and 3. Yes, she was quite prepared and able to justify this ... Oh, and yes "I still loved you all along" she says. Finally, now after all this time she has just entered therapy - If you want to understand insanity, just look at your wife my friend - Then just take a look around and see the madness that seems to abide in so many around us.
Thanks for the helpful replies. It helps to get input from others - here is the latest update.
I told her yesterday I was getting a lawyer to setup a interim writ confirming what we arranged for looking after our son(I have him 8 out of 14days). Because without this state law give neither of us protection from the other keeping him. Essentially if she has him for the weekend - there is nothing stopping her from taking him and not giving him back until its sorted in court which could take months. I didn't think she was capable of cheating so I don't know if she is capable of running away with my son. Her mother left her father one day and took everything out of the house including the kids and never came back. So I don't want history repeating.
She left upset and quickly after she dropped my son off.
She then txted me today with a message saying: "do you hate me" I rang her and she was very upset and I said I dont hate her but I was very firm with her explaining that she is absolutley in the wrong and what she did was selfish and cruel to me and our son. ( I think I seemed a little too keen to work things out on our last meeting)
I said to her that if you need space I will give it to you but you cant text me out of the blue like this and be upset and get a comforting answer from me. She then said "how can we work things out if we don't talk"
Long story short she was far more apologetic than last week and now wants to go to counselling on Wednesday with me. From what I could tell she doesnt want to face to me because she feels too guilty, she feels like she cant look at me without facing how much she hurt me (different from she doesnt know if she loves me anymore)So I don't know what to think - these seem like positive signs far more warm than on friday. And she started the conversation with me not the other way around. She wouldnt text me if she didnt want me to make some contact.
Hopefully things go well on Wednesday at the counsellor.
This message has been edited by podcat on Mar 22, 2009 10:37 PM
Hearing her mother's history reminded me of how I have seen the family history repeating in my own and that of my wife - not always the same but amazing similarities and impacts echoing down the generations. For example, my half brother left his young family and went away - just as my father did to him and then to me me and my sister in his second marriage.
Back to my point about intent - If your wife is beginning to feel and understand what she has done (and this is a very important part of resolution in your relationship), then she may be finding the intent to move forward with you. It is very difficult I expect and believe for the wayward spouse to face what they have done - Indeed I have read that some end the relationship rather than face this with their spouse. It is also very difficult for the betrayed spouse to turn towards their wayward spouse and remain open, at least to some level, to relationship renewal - I know this for myself - And I also know that the injury, the pain and suffering has to be faced sooner or later, if there is to be any chance of healing. There is just so much pain in the world, for all of us, in differennt ways eg physical illness, death etc - And betrayal of your intimate partner is one of these - for me the most hurtful of all I have experienced in my life. Facing and finding a way through this pain is the only way to find a way to live fully goingn forward, as, to turn away from the pain is to end up running away from it - and this means I would have to close down a large part of my life - which may emerge again somewhere, somehow. Facing up to embrace this suffering was my first action, and one I shall have to stay with forever.
Well we went to the counsellor this morning for the first time.
It went well I think. She agreed to come back next week with me. We talked about the problems we were having and the history of our relationship. We didn't really touch on the affair much but obviously the counsellor wanted to get a bit of an idea of our relationship first plus she sensed that my W was the least willing person there.
I feel really guilty as alot of the problems that came out were from my side and she brought up stuff from years ago that I didnt think was a big deal. So it was very confronting. I almost wish we went 6 months ago maybe we could have prevented this mess.
I know I shouldnt feel guilty but its hard to not wish I had done things differently so this wouldnt have happened.
The other part of the story is she went over to a mutual friends place last night and talked more which to me is a postive sign as this friend has been happily married for years after surviving and Affair and other nastiness.
Now I am just counting every minute until next Wednesday when we talk to the counsellor again. I was almost feeling better before Monday because I felt like there was no hope. It's the hope that makes me sick.
I know it takes time to solve these things one way or another. Its the waiting that hurts I want to get to the next bit of life, where we are back together or apart not this in between.
I'm glad you had a good experience at the counselors. I'm glad you're seeing signs of hope.
One of the things many of us who were betrayed have done is to think that somehow it is our fault that our spouse had an affair. I think we do this because taking on some (or all) of the blame reflects better on our spouse, makes them "less" at fault, casts them in a better light, and therefore makes forgiveness easier to give.
Forgiveness is very difficult, especially of someone who has intentionally done something so bad and has shown such poor character that they are now untrustworthy.
Aiding this tendency is the need of the offending spouse to justify their actions. After all, they want to 'look good' in their own eyes, so if they can come up with an explanation or some reasons that deflect blame away from them (and toward ANYONE ELSE), then they have reduced their 'fault' in the action.
But really, who are we really going to fool with all this? The betrayer, deep down, knows that no one forced them to have an affair. They know that the reasons for the affair didn't really become important until the affair became a factor in their lives. The betrayed also knows that their spouse is fully capabable of avoiding sex if that's what they want to do, they know that there were other options available than going forward with the affair. They know that their spouse is just as in control of their choices and actions as they themselves are.
That's not to deny that marriages have problems that should be worked. That's not to diminish the important of being a good husband or wife to our spouse. But, can they say that they were better, that that there weren't "unmet needs", or "devastating" hurts done to the betrayed spouse? Really? That wasn't true in my case. For every thing my wife pointed to as something I did that "caused" her affair, I could point to something she did that I could have used to have my own affair. It cut both ways. My wife gave up that approach pretty quickly, so she turned the fault toward the OM and her childhood. Ultimately, we didn't start healing until we both stopped that charade.
The counselor might help you stop this, but most likely they will not. You might spend a few minutes of your own talking to the counselor to find out what they know about infidelity. First, they need to know in absolute terms that the fault of adultery lies only with the offending spouse. It is never the fault of the betrayed spouse. That doesnt meant that the betrayed didnt contribute significantly (or even overwhelmingly) to the problems of the marriage. However, the choice to commit adultery is not made jointly.
Secondly, as a consequence of the first point, that the primary focus of marital recovery from infidelity needs to be on rebuilding the trust and unity in the marriage that was destroyed by the affair. While both spouses will have issues and needs to have trust rebuilt, the primary focus is on the betrayed spouse.
Third, they need to believe, with certainty, that the path to recovery and reconciliation is not in avoiding discussions of the affair, but it can only be achieved when the betrayed spouse feels that transparency is an integral part of the marriage relationship.
It seems that many counselors have little to no real understanding of how to help marriages recover from adultery. There are resources developed by experts in the field who have found what really works. Websites such as Dearpeggy.com, Smartmarriages.com, and Shirleyglass.com are helping to educate people on approaches that really work. There are also programs such as Retrovauille that offer assistance to couples in crisis, that promote better communication and transparency in marriages. Your counselor might benefit from these resources.
I found that I had to defend my right to the kind of healing that I thought was best. Friends and family, my wife, and her counselors seemed to be stacked against me at times, telling me to bury the affair, to not ask the questions that I wanted answered, and to just move on. For me, that was not acceptable, and I needed to know that my wife was willing to answer any question that I wanted to pose. I needed her to demonstrate that transparency, to rebuild my trust, to cement our unity.
I really hit the pit of despair after the counselling session on wednesday. Friday was a really tough day as I went to the Doctors and they told me I have probably had depression for months. This really filled me with regret that It was my fault if I went and saw someone about my depression earlier we wouldnt be here. So I felt really bad. I am on a waiting list to see a psychologist however after my GP saw me on friday they have rushed me up the list to monday morning - which is great. I hope they can help me.
When the psych rang me on friday and told me they were putting me in quickly I felt so scared that I might hurt myself or do something silly(it had not really occured to me before this)
Anyway I went to a friends place to hang out for the evening and we talked and joked about the whole thing and I felt so much better.
I took away one little gem from the night though. My wife told his wife that the OM lost his job because of the affair and he was pissed off at my wife.
I think at that point the reality of what the affair has dawned on her. Up until this point there were emails like "I love you", I miss you" blah, blah. Now he is cranky with her.
He hasnt left his wife(who knows nothing). He is at home and life is going on.
Whether we work things out or we go our separate ways its comforting to know that she might just understand that she was a "conquest" by an older man (he is 10 years older than my wife) a fling that was dirty and only exciting because it was a secret.
I know its cruel to take satisfaction in her suffering but Im allowed a little bit of a laugh in this process.
I could be all wrong about this to and who knows more of the story could come out at the counsellor and I go back to be being depressed and sad but for now I am taking a little bit of comfort in the whole thing.
THe other thing that occured to me is I have always had a strong group of friends. My mates and I are very close. My wife doesnt have a strong group like that. She has casual freinds from all over different areas of her life none of which are close. However the 2 freinds she has at work one of which is a swinger the other is an absolute party animal who sleeps with anyone and anything. I wonder if those freindships didnt plant the seed of "what would it be like to be with someone else". I also dont think these freinds would care enough about her to stop her if they knew about it (maybe they did know)
I remeber back while the A was going on we had lunch and cheating came up. I go away with my sport several weekends a year. We go out and drink and have fun without our wives and have a good time. I asked her "do you ever worry that I might cheat while Im away" she said "it has occured to me" I thought about it and knew that my freinds would never let that happen. If one of us got drunk and was about to do something silly we would look after each other. Maybe if she had a strong social group of responsible caring freinds this woudln't have happened.
I have spent almost every night talking to freinds either about this or something else to take my mind of this. She has not been able to do this. I wish I had talked to them before it all happened but they are helping now.
Do NOT buy into your depression being a valid excuse for her to cross the line. My XH used that one on me. I did a slow spiral into depression after my mom passed and then we relocated for his job. I did not even realize it was happening. He told me in counseling that he noticed the changes in me, but rather than say something and be supportive and give me the help that a loving partner should he CHOSE to have an affair. He CHOSE to ignore that something was "wrong" with me. Here I am years later and I wonder what if it had been cancer, or MS, or ????
My will shall shape the future. Whether I fail or succeed shall be no man's doing but my own. I am the force; I can clear any obstacle before me or I can be lost in the maze. My choice; my responsibility; win or lose, only I hold the key to my destiny. ~Elaine Maxwell~
I agree with Chris...there is nothing, absolutly nothing that you did to cause or encourage your wife to have an affair. If you had such power over people, you could would be more powerful than the best hypnotist, greater than the greatest fortune teller.
You wife had the free will to chose fidelity or infidelity, and no matter how difficult the circuimstances, she gave a pledge to choose fidelity.
If your behavoir is the cause, then you too likely had cause to do the same. You too could have created an opportunity, then blamed it on her.
I agree with your assessment of her friends. I'm not saying that she couldn't have associations with these 'friends', but to have the kind of relationship that allows her to start taking on their values, to depend on their integrity, to put herself under their influence is a reflection of a personality that isn't looking for constructive relationshps. I think there are probably reasons in her psyche for this, things for her to discover about herself.
My wife did the same. Several of her friends had been people who I did not consider a good influence on her. At the time of the affair she had a few that were good ones, but the OM was "a friend" who was separate from her good friendships. She kept that relationshp separate from the others, although she occasionally taked about the OM friendship with me, but her interactions with him were separate and private. This is something that enabled her to fall into the affair. It sounds like you've discovered a similar situation in your wife's experience.
One last question, is your wife still communicating with the OM? If so, then I would recommend that one of your boundaries with your wife should be that she stop all contact with the OM, and she should reject any attempts by him to make contact with her. It will greatly improve the possiblities of reconcilation and it will help your personal recovery.
I heard something on a local radio talk show (credit to Mildred Gaddis) a long time ago. Although used in a different context it is applicable to many aspects of our life. She said something to the effect of - if you want to know where you are headed take a hard look at your 5 closest friends for they are a reflection of you.
Perhaps if you want to know who someone is you should look at their 5 closest friends?
My will shall shape the future. Whether I fail or succeed shall be no man's doing but my own. I am the force; I can clear any obstacle before me or I can be lost in the maze. My choice; my responsibility; win or lose, only I hold the key to my destiny. ~Elaine Maxwell~
We went to counselling a second time today. The counsellor dragged out alot of the details of the affair and how it made her feel, and how I felt.
She had broke it off with the bloke. He has feelings for her but she does not feel the same way.
My W really felt guilty and sorry that she had hurt me so much, but doesnt want to get back together.
We are going to counselling one more time which I think will be my last. I will tell her how I feel one last time and that will be that.
I am moving on with my life. We have a son so we will be in contact forever so maybe time will heal old wounds and what we had can be rekindled. But for now I am just going to get on with my life and spend time with family, freinds and try to enjoy being single.
It still hurts more than anything but it is somewhat of a relief to know the waiting for her to decide is over.
I'm sorry things did not work as you had wanted. As I try to repair my own marriage I realize we BOTH have to want to be here. Maybe she can't deal with what she has done to you, maybe there are other reasons, or some combination of all.
You can't make her stay and you can't make her love you again. Affairs have destroyed many marriages beyond repair. It has to be two people that are both WILLING and ABLE to repair a marriage after this.
Hang your head high knowing you tried. We may not win all of the battles in life and you cannot win the ones you never try to fight.
Good Luck with your new recovery road. Spend time with family and friends while your mind settles. The decisions with your wife can be handled by lawyers because once the decision is made it's routine to them. As for your future don't rush things. Let the dust settle and see where you are in life.
As we travel this road of life we never know whats around the next corner. After this last stretch you should be due for something better. I have not gone down your road myself. I'm sure it is up hill for a while but a lot of pressure is now gone. A few months down the road should see tremendous improvement. Try to be optimistic and remember the future is what you make it.
I'm sorry to hear how things are unfolding. You've been through a lot in a very short time. I notice that it's only been a day over two weeks from when you learned of the affair and when your wife informed you of her decision to end the marriage. That seems very, very short to me for a final decision, although she could have started considering her options long before D-day. She may have even made her choice long ago, even before the discovery.
Despite that, I believe it's entirely possible that she has not given this enough time and thought since D-day to evaluate the option of reconcilation and she might eventually reconsider this decision and want to reverse it. You should be prepared for that possiblity, and consider what you would like to do, and if you wanted to work toward reconcilation then what you would need from her to commit to that.
Still, I'm really sorry that you've been put through this, and that your son will also be put through this.
TomJ
This message has been edited by tomj76 on Mar 31, 2009 3:24 PM
I would agree with both Tom and Jerry. A little over two weeks is not time for decisions for either you or your W. Although your wife says she does want the marriage, she could very well change her mind once the dust settles and she has a chance to make decisions that are not emotionally based. And you do need to be ready for that.
Don't wait around for her, start your life moving forward as you are, but keep in mind that she may change her mind and you need to expect it so it is not another curve ball thrown your way. You'll have had the opportunity to think it through. If this does happen my advice would to be reenter any relationship with her slowly and cautiously.
I feel your pain and hope all the best for you. Take it one day at a time and take care of you and your son. And try to find time for happiness everyday.
I am going out with my friends tonight. She knew this yesterday. She rings me at about 7pm saying that we will never get back together if I find another girl (the last thing on my mind) She was worried that I will go and find someone else. There has to be some chance for us yet.
So now there is this hint of wanting to work things out. I am so confused. I don't want her to have this power over me. I need to go on as if we wont get back together. If she comes back - great but I cant wait by the telephone for her forever. I'm talking not about going out looking for girls, but living my life and getting some joy out of it where I can.
This is exactly what the others were warning you about. Your wife is sitting firmly on the fence, wanting to keep all her options open. When I was a student, I dated someone I cared for as a friend but not lover. Eventually I told him there was no future for us because I just didn't feel that way about him, but I wanted to keep him as a friend. Then after a year he was with someone else and engaged to be married. And I resented that: I was just like your wife, wanting to have him in the background in case I didn't find an alternative - he was my fall-back position. I now realise how destructive that was for him: to have that continual hope that I would begin to love him and put his life on hold in case that happened.
Don't let your wife set your agenda. She has done something which has destroyed your relationship as you knew it. You do still love her, probably always will, but you are not her pet to be taken out on a lead when she feels like it. You said you have one more counselling session: use it to make her aware of your boundaries, what you will accept, what you won't tolerate. Not ultimatums, boundaries (see the excellent thread to Louise about boundaries). It's time to do the 180, to use tough love with your wife. If she says she doesn't want to be married to you, then she has no right to know what you are doing, to emotionally blackmail you into behaving the way she wants, to use you as her support and to have you waiting backstage to pick her up if she falls. If she needs these things from you then she has to re-engage fully in the marriage.
I hope your consellor can get this across to her and help you to set the boundaries and toughen your own responses. This is so hard for you and it doesn't help that she takes your hope away and then gives it back again. You can't move on in the marriage or out of it while she is like this. As others have said, two weeks is a short time to make this decision, unless it was in her mind for some time and OM was an exit affair. But she needs to know she can either work on the marriage or leave it; she can't do both!
I agree with the suggestions by Liz. It seems that setting boundaries in the relationship will be good for everyone involved: For you, because it will limit the emtional abuse that is put on you; your son, because he will not be witness to the cycle of emotions that your wife's indecision creates; your wife, because she is more likely to come to her senses, and respect you in either outcome.
You might check out the book "Surviving an Affair" listed on our "Helpful Links" section. This book can help a betrayed spouse work with a wayward spouse that can't make up their mind. It has some ideas in it that I don't like very much (such as something he call "The love bank"), but I think it's guidance on setting boundaries makes a lot of sense. I didn't personally have the problem where my wife kept changing her commitment to the marriage, or couldn't decide that she wanted it (although some of her actions might have not support her words of commitment), but I found some of it helpful anyway.
We spoke on friday and she kept saying I deserve someone better than her, that she cant come back because it would be too hard and that she does love me but just cant face me.
I think she really does hate herself for doing what she has done, and is not ready to face it, maybe in time she will come around and realise what she is going to throw away.
She dropped off my son on saturday and said she keeps sending me mixed signals and made it clear she doesnt want to work things out. But I think that she is still confused. Its easier for her to avoid it right now and not deal with it.
She also decided to not go to counselling the third time. I think because the 2nd session was very confronting.
So I am still holding out hope that she will come back one day as time goes on and she remembers the good times we had and the life we have together.
Time is everything I am going to move on and try to be happy and hopefully time will heal old wounds and she will see what she is losing.
I'm sorry that it's not more clear yet. Your wife's desire to forgo reconcilation on the grounds that she "can't face you" seems to suggest that she is under the impression she can avoid the hard consequences (i.e your hurt and anger, and her guilty feelings) by running away from the problems.
Does she have a history of running from her problems or ignoring them? If she does you might address this with her, and ask her if that's the person she wants to be, or if she'd rather be mature and responsible and start now to try and "right" this wrong.
I would expect your wife is living with a mixture of feelings that are leaving her confused - She will be afraid of you, ashamed of herself and wondering how she could have felt as she did to act as she did. She probably really does not know what to do and now is looking for a signal or indication from you about the possiblility of reconciliation. My advice is that you give her and yourself the chance to look at reconciliation before making an ealry move towards divorce. The fact is that the relationship as it was is already broken and gone - but this leaves the possibility of a new beginning. It is probably easier sometimes in the heat of the moment to walk away - but staying in there and facing up to things takes a strong person, inside, whatever your head and your friends and family say - facing up is always tough. Leaving is also tough but it may feel that you can leave your problems behind right now - there is no quick ending and you will be living with whatever you do now for the rest of your life.
Give it more time and keep the options open - but, remember, it is your choice to do this and you are not saying she did anything that is ok - because it was not. You will have anger and all kinds of other emotions - but these things also come and go - I am 3.5 years past d-day and still feel like murdering the OM - but I don't think I will do this - and, amazingly, I can still see the possibility of happiness in the marriage. Life just is not all easy - and the sh$t that we have to deal with is the very stuff that helps us find out who we are and what is possible - the pain may feel like it is killing you but it can bring some kind of cure with it too.
may you be safe and well and, eventually contented and happy
