I've been reading so many book on infidelity and how to recover from an affair. My H reads nothing and feels that they are hurting me more than helping me. I have make huge efforts to be a better wife/person by doing more things for him. I apologize everytime I make a mistake and I listen to every suggestion he has regarding things I can do to better myself. However, he seems to be irritated with me, like I'm bothering him.
He tells me that he just wants me to be myself, I don't understand this because when I was myself he complained about me constantly to my brother-in-law and the OW, so why would I want to be myself again? I am in therapy and he is not. I asked him to make a list of things that I need improvement on and when I asked him to name one thing that he needs improvement on he says that he can't think of anything.
It seems to me that I'm busting my a$$ to make a better marriage and to make him happy and he just thinks that there is absolutely nothing wrong with him and I should be doing all the work. After all, it was all my fault that he had an affair, if I wouldn't have been such a horrible wife/person and if I would have worked hard to make him happy than he wouldn't have had to have sex with another woman.
This stage of affair recovery needs it's own name. I had the most intense deja vu when I read your post. For a moment there I was positive that you had copied and pasted one of my posts from four years ago.
I would bet everything that I had that you ARE busting your ass to make a better marriage, that he thinks there is nothing wrong with him (or at least says that he thinks that), that you should be doing all of the work, that you are in therapy (he is not), that he can't think of anything that he needs to work on, that you have read every book on infidelity (and that he has read a couple of pages at most), and that he seems irritated with you much of the time.
I remember being on the boards shortly before Christmas, about four months after d-day. I asked for help with ideas for a present for my (then) wife. We didn't have much extra money at the time. I liked someone's suggestion and had several large photographs of our family made from some recent negatives. The photos were expertly cropped, mounted, and framed. It took alot of time and effort and I thought the photos looked great. On Christmas morning, she was clearly disappointed (I think she was hoping for jewelry). She made it clear that my gift was further evidence of my failure as a husband.
I was devastated. It seemed very cruel. I agree with Teri that it is a cruel game. I'm doubt it is intentional. I'm sure you've read about 'pursuer-distancer' cycles. From what I've seen they are completely normal after the discovery of an affair. The more he withdraws, the more you pursue. The more you pursue, the more he withdraws. It's a terrible vicious cycle. It was hard as hell for me to break out of a pursuer-distancer cycle after d-day. I tried and failed more often than I succeeded. One marriage counselor mentioned that it was very common for women to be the pursuer but rare for men. I was an interesting specimen. I don't think she knew too much about affairs.
I'm hoping to get those photos back as part of our property settlement. These days, my X would rather give up her left arm than part with them. It's mind-boggling how much things can change.
Shelley, I have been in that exact same place. For at least a year (maybe more) after the A I tried to do so much. I lost weight, I cut my hair, bought new clothes, was as agreeable and friendly and accomodating as possible but...to no avail. My H had no intent on fixing our issues and at one point after I threw my hands up in the air and said "what do you want from me?", he said he felt the marriage was over and didn't want to do any work on it.
Okay...that was a complete waste of time.
I'm not saying your efforts will be a waste. Your marriage is your marriage and your H is a different man. But I guess what I learnt from all this was that not all of it was a waste of time.
Losing weight, getting healthier, doing those things that improved me as a person were the things that were worthwhile in the end. I couldn't MAKE my H feel any differently. He would feel whatever he wanted to feel. The things that were a waste of time were trying to bend over backwards and fall all over myself pleasing HIM.
So I say, Shelley, please yourself. Look at yourself and your life and your situation and invest your time and energy into making yourself feel better. And if your H wants to come along, then he will. Because in my opinion, it should be HIM bending over backwards to please YOU.
At least this way if it doesn't work out, you'll be in a better, more confident place to do whatever you need to do.
Shelly wrote >>It seems to me that I'm busting my a$$ to make a better marriage and to make him happy and he just thinks that there is absolutely nothing wrong with him and I should be doing all the work<<
I don't know whether this is inability to recognize reality or the guilty mind avoiding responsiblity. But I do know that this is a common "state" of mind that the all of WS "live" in for a period of time after the A. For me, when you describe the things that you are doing, I feel like I was watching a picture show of myself doing the exact same thing. Come to think of it, I am sure that's how I found BAN. I search thru the internet for anything to do with A; any explanation, information... and justification that I am not losing my mind.
Anyways before I digress further, do the self-improvement and changes and the reading ...etc with one goal in mind only - for you, for you to feel better, because it's good for you or simply because you feel like it. I do believe that the more you let him be and ignore his feelings, the more he will want to know what you are up to.
Thank everyone for your kindness and advice. My H and I had an arguement on the phone earlier this afternoon. I said that I am not healing from his affair because he refuses to talk about it. He got really irritated and said "What more do you want me to say?" I asked him if he really expected me to just never speak of it ever again and be all crazy, madly in love with him? He says he doesn't know "he's not me". He says that he can't take all this up and down with his emotions. He pops Xanax like they're candy and says he just can't take it anymore. Well, I supposed to have sympathy for him? He created this situation, did he not? And now he's complaining because he "hates living like this". Yea, life is a bed of roses for me. Please! I asked him why do you love me so much now and why do you think that the next time temptation comes up you'll be able to turn it down, what is so different? He says "I will never do that again." I asked him how am I so different now, why am I such a better wife now? He says "I don't know". I think it's fair to say that my H doesn't know his ass from a hole in the ground!!!
How do you know when you should end the marriage or keep trying? When do you realize that you're relationship is damaged beyond repair and you're never going to trust that person again? I don't know. Sometimes I feel like I should call the lawyer but then I feel some tiny bit of hope, like light at the end of the tunnel. That is how I've been living for a year now, back and forth. When does it get better, if ever?
This is just like reading one of my own posts. You sound just like me at that point. If you look at the stages of grief, I think what I was doing was the "bargaining" stage, thinking that if only I became the perfect wife that everything would be okay. It just doesn't work that way, I had to accept that the affair happened, and that nothing I could do would undo it.
Gina is so right, you need to do whatever you need to do to heal yourself. It can take a long time, much longer than any one would want, but you can heal. Hang in there, --Rosie
Can I make a suggestion? My C helped me with this and it has really helped me. Don't know if it will help you unless your H is willing to try.
But, when your H asks you what you want him to do, give him a direct answer. Think about exactly what it is that you want and be totally honest. And tell him why. Then if he actually does it, thank him.
Things like, "I need to be able to talk about the A with you. I need to be able to ask you about what you did and how you feel and I need you to just answer me as honestly as you can. Even if it's the same question that I asked before. More than anything I need to you to reassure me that you love me and not her."
How about, "I need you to stop saying that you don't want to talk about it because that makes me feel like I'm not worth the effort, or that you don't love me or ..."
Of course you use your own words and your own feelings and deal with the issues that pertain to you.
And do it nicely. Don't yell at him. Don't be afraid to get your feelings out. He can't read your mind, so possibly if he understands why and exactly 'what' you need, he'll make an effort.
Really think about what it is that you want.
I know for me I hounded the heck out of my H. I was lucky that he understood the need to have the questions answered. And still does.
You need and deserve to have YOUR questions answered.
You may get to the point where you give him an ultimatum like - if you are not going to make an effort to talk then it's time for you to move out. Then kick him out.
But you have to be ready for this because he might not come back.
>After all, it was all my fault that he had an affair, if I wouldn't have been such a horrible wife/person and if I would have worked hard to make him happy than he wouldn't have had to have sex with another woman>
Shelley, repeat after me: I am NOT responsible for my husband’s decision to have sex with another woman. This is your new mantra. Now say it again. Out loud. Repeat daily, hourly if necessary. Unless you were standing next to him when his hands went for the other woman’s pants and you told him “Go ahead honey. I don’t mind,” then you are in no way to blame for his affair. There may be problems in your marriage and you may be partly to blame for some of them, but all marriages have problems, and affairs never solve them. Sometimes, a WS may realize that the affair was the result of personal issues that he (or she) needs to work on and the marriage may heal, and even become stronger (often with the help of a good counselor). But a man who hurts you and then makes lists of things you can do to improve yourself is not a man who’s doing a lot of self-reflection. I might have a suggestion or two on what he could do with that list. I don’t mean to sound facetious. I know what you are going through. I’ve been there. I could have written your post a few years ago. Like you, I read all the books. I went to counseling (he wouldn’t go). I apologized for things that weren’t my fault. I bought ridiculous underwear at Victoria’s Secret, I put blond highlights in my hair, I filled the bedroom with scented candles and oils and strange tickly things (I still don’t know what you do with them) and you know what? I felt humiliated. While I was busy trying to prove that I was better than the other woman I really proved that I had no respect for myself. Fortunately, about that time, I was offered a part time job. I’m convinced that it, more than anything else, saved me. It’s not a particularly fabulous or uncommon job, but it gave me the chance to see myself in a different way. Little by little, I started putting the pieces of my life back together. On my good days, I believe I have become a better person. If you need to be a better person, do it for yourself, not him. His seeming irritation with you is a control tactic – it’s meant to make you feel that he’s doing you a favor by putting up with you. His complaints about you to his brother- in- law were his way of justifying his affair to himself. The things he said to the OW about you were simply foreplay. The affair was about him. You are not responsible for the things that are lacking in him. You could be anointed Saint of the Millennia and it won’t make him happy. His happiness is going to have to come from within and so is yours. Do things that enrich you and make you feel better about yourself. When he sees that you are not going to let him manipulate or define you, it’ll probably scare the hell out of him (it did my husband) but that’s not necessarily a bad thing. I love this stanza from an ee cummings poem:
losing through you what seemed myself, I find
selves unimaginably mine; beyond
sorrow’s own joys and hoping’s very fears
"My H reads nothing and feels that they are hurting me more than helping me."
That may be because he's afraid of outside influences on you and would prefer to have his own sense of 'control.'
"I have make huge efforts to be a better wife/person by doing more things for him. I apologize everytime I make a mistake and I listen to every suggestion he has regarding things I can do to better myself. However, he seems to be irritated with me, like I'm bothering him."
Stop it right now. Stop 'making yourself better for him.' Stop apologizing, except for things that really require an apology. Perhaps his 'irritation' comes from you not standing up to him when appropriate.
Look, some people, perhaps your H too, are immature control freaks. I mean 'emotionally immature.' This means, with certain communication, you need to realize that you are interacting with someone whose emotional level may not be much advanced beyond the grade school level. I'm not kidding, BTW.
Shelley - you need to firm up boundaries here. He sounds like the kind of person who will walk all over you if you give him half the chance. Part of interacting with someone like this is not allowing them to get the sense of you as 'victim.' That makes you an easy mark in some ways.
"He tells me that he just wants me to be myself"
That's because he has learned that he can control you when you are 'yourself.' Maybe this is a good time in life to consider what being 'yourself' means to YOU, and living that. Nothing will unnerve him more or help adjust the out-of-balance power struggle in your M more than for you to find new interests, find your true self, allow people to do things for you and expand your life. Mark my words, if he is the type he sounds like it will drive him crazy.
So ... don't 'be there' for him ... go have fun, alone, with GF's whatever. Join the gym ... do something different. Give every indication that you could potentially be moving on with your life. You are independent, strong, capable.
Watch what happens.
"It seems to me that I'm busting my a$$ to make a better marriage and to make him happy "
So stop it. Right now. Today. Stop busting your a$$. You can't 'make' anyone happy anyway.
Make a New Shelley. FOR Shelley. DO less ... BE more.
Love must be Tough!
SWN
This message has been edited by SoWhatNow on Oct 1, 2004 4:03 PM This message has been edited by SoWhatNow on Oct 1, 2004 4:02 PM
Hi - I completely relate to what you are saying. We are a week away from dday 1 and I get the impression that my H is now just tired of the grief and the drama and feels like he has been put through enough of it and it should be away by now. All he wants is and to quote "my old life back" and I too have to question this as it was the old life that he threw away to have an affair. I have moments of reasonable clarity when I can see rationally how easy it is to get into an affair and then how difficult it is to get out. Then.. I have other days when I can make no sense out of any of it and have begged him for an explanation - there is of course nothing he can say that will make it any better. My H uses exactly the same reasoning but I think you have to try to console yourself with the fact that very few OW are going to have sex with a man if he says that his wife is really quite nice and he is only doing this for the thrill. I have been filled in by letters / texts / in person etc by the OW as to exactly what my H told her and to be quite honest it's certainly not me that she has described. He also now has the added horror of having to justify to me all this stuff he told her and give me some sort of explanation. I do actually sometimes feel quite sorry for him as most of this stuff would have been throwaway comments in response to things she was telling him or just said to try to dampen his guilt a bit. Good days and bad days. Good days I can see that he would tell her things because it is what she wanted to hear. She wants to think that I am some evil troll that he has endured for years and that he is such a martyr. That is their justification for it but sadly in the end there is no reason. There are no valid excuses for affairs except selfishness. Your H sounds like mine and I think he had the wake up call of his life after I found out and he realised that what he was going to gain in the OW fulltime didn't stack up much to what he was going to lose in me and the kids. I think this in itself is enough for him but I still constantly look for more answers and I just don't think that they exist. I think if I started to just try and extinguish the demons rather than listening to them then I could move on. Heres hoping it gets better for both of us ...
