I know that my WS needs to suffer the consequences of his actions or he will never change. So far he has not suffered. Yes, maybe he suffered from some guilt as a WS does suffer, but he uses drugs to cover up those feelings instead of owning them and working through them. HE has no incentive to want to change. So basically there is no moving forward. If you do not work through the feelings you are stagnant. No wonder I feel we have made no progress in the marriage since d-day, 18 months ago. I feel like we are still at square one!
I should have followed my instincts on d-day and kicked him to the curb, let him hit rock bottom and let him work his way back to me and prove himself. Maybe then he would have been serious about wanting to work things out and would have saught help for his addictions. Being an enabler or codependent did not allow me to follow my primary instincts and let H suffer the natural consequences of his actions. Instead I rescued him by letting him stay and not enforcing my boundary, thus enabling his behavior. He learned nothing except that he can get away with what he did and not suffer...no empathy, no remorse.
H knew my boundary and willingly crossed it. I was weak in love, at a time when "love must be tough", and I did not uphold the consequences for him crossing that boundary. And since then he has crossed many other boundaries without consequence. The boundaries are there and he is aware of them but he does not respect them. My new counselor is going to help me to strengthen my self confidence and self worth so that I will have enough self respect to enforce my boundaries. My boundaries are reasonable and fair and it is not that I do not have boundaries, I just have a hard time enforcing them due to a lack of self esteem, self worth, and self respect. A lot of that has to do with his addiction and the affiar. Being the spouse of an addict errods your sense of "self" and the affair pretty much finsihed off what little I had left.
What I hope to accomplish through counseling is learning how to gain back my sense of self (self worth, self esteem, and self respect). Having a better sense of self will give me the strength to enforce my boundaries. He can still choose to cross them, but he will have to suffer the natural consequences of his actions.
Sometimes the long and hard road is the one you must travel to get to where you need to be. Even though the long and hard road is more painful and takes more time, it also more rewarding in the end. Short cuts dont work, they only prolong the inevitable.
Take care, Carol~
This message has been edited by pizzalady on Mar 7, 2007 2:50 PM
This was a big concern to me initially also. Was there a real consequence for him? We had 30 days of up and down hell together now he is back to his old life and I still have days when I wonder if it worth trying anymore.
I almost had him in counseling even early on when I said it is counseling or it is over. But I backed off and he backed out.
I see so many similarities between my situation and yours, Carol. Thank you for your posts. Maybe someday I can find the place you have gotten to also.
When I saw that we were back to where we started and made no real progress that's when I started to lose hope. When I realized that I was not helping things by rescuing my H and not letting him suffer the consequences of his actions that is when I relaized I had a problem too and needed help. I had taken all I could on Christmas Day. You could say that was my bottom and my awakening.
I am glad that my posts help you, yours help me as well.
hi carol, you have shifted so much and that is one of the most positive posts you have made in such a long time. positive in that you are giving yourself some direction, things seem to be clicking into place for you hon.
boundaries, my two sense, i wouldnt bother giving him boundaries, he wouldnt know what one was, but i would start to give myself some, eg instead of saying to him 'you are not allowed to smoke dope in the house' i would twist that around to empower yourself and say 'i will not accept dope smoking in the house'. a little shift in emphasis gives you the power not him.
I've been worried about you so I am glad to see your post. The new therapist is good way to start. You have to strengthen yourself as you deal around the situation. Addictions of any kind drugs, work, food, gambling, shopping can never really be dealt with until their life collapses.
Can you or have someone tell your H the police are watching him. Ask him what plan does he have in place. Does he realize the consequences of arrest and the biz etc. All the work hours in the world won't his butt if he's busted. There has to be someone he will listen to. Personally, I would just turn in the supplier.
hi carol, and also if the police are watching etc, then you need to do some stuff to demonstrate that you are trying to separate your financials or lifestyle from his. this is important so that you dont run the risk of being implicated in his activities, even if you have to admit you know that he is using, you can show that you do not condone it and have not been able to prevent it despite your best efforts.
i am not sure if you have a separate bank account, but it might be worth opening one and put some of your joint money into it, tell him that it is for your holiday or something, so that you have a nest egg in your name to get re established or to support yourself and the family if he gets busted etc.
i am not sure about over there, but here we have legislation that enables the govt/police to seize a dealers property, houses, cars etc, if they believe they have been gained from drug dealing or other crimes etc. sounds good in theory but in practice it has been devasting for families, even those who are not a part of or even aware of a family members activities. eg and elderly couple recently lost their home of 40 years because their idiot son had huge amounts of dope stored in their ceiling. there was some debate about whether they were aware that it was there, eg were they also culpable or not. either way they have lost everything. of course now the state has to house and support them, bit daft really.
so check out if there are similar rules over your way, so that you can distance yourself and the kids as much as possible. forwarned is a good thing hon
mmm in terms of dobbing in the supplier, i would be in two minds about that, yes it might stop his supply, but he will find another and you dont know who the supplier is or his connections, suppliers can get nasty if busted and they find out or believe they know who dobbed them in. it is not fair that we end up fearful or cant make a stand, because it keeps the cycle going but at some point you need to protect yourself and your children, so if you decide to do that, be very careful how that is done, eg anonymously or by a third party that cant be traced back to you.
believe me i know all about this stuff, sadly
take care
kath
I think that Carol needs to cover all her bases and really research what can happen. She can present this info to her H and he can see clearly in black and white what he stands to lose. Your dialogue is great and all the possibilities help C be more informed. Hugs, E
Thank you for your concern and I do take it to heart. I have been worried about the same things for a long time. Immediately after Christmas I opened my own checking account at a different bank. I thought to myself, what if on Christmas Day when he was doing 80mph and ran that redlight we got pulled over, and what if they found drugs on my H, then what? I have reminded my H that he stands to lose everything. But guess what, he is invincable! Didnt you guys know that? He is above the law! LOL. Seriously, he doesnt think it can happen to him. Like I said, he is delussional, no lie. The only good thing that would happen if he got busted was that he would finally have to suffer the natural consequences of his actions/addiction. Unfortunately a drug offense would be devestating to the entire family. We would lose everything, not just him. Which is something he really doesnt get. Even if he thinks it's ok to assume that risk, I dont! I dont want to lose our house, business, car, and possibly our children because of HIS addiction. It is unfair and selfish of him to even put his family in that position. But just like in an affair, they dont think of anyone else but themselves and their need for that fix. Nothing and no one else matters, PERIOD!!! Scary isnt it? This is what I live with every day, wondering if it will all be here tomorrow. But my H is blissful in his drug-enduced fantasyland without a care in the world. That's the "pot fog"!
That is why this new counselor is what I needed. He knows how people with substance addictions thinks. He knows what I am dealing with and he knows the tools I need to develope to get myself out of this predicament. That may eventually mean leaving my H. I am aware of that possibility and I am ready to fully accept that now. Before Christmas I couldnt do that, although it was in my thoughts. A lot has changed for me in that short amount of time.
You ROCK! I am so proud of you. You are standing firm in tsunami force winds and facing your situation head on. It's your life, and you are taking control of it. You go girl! Yes, I know what you are going through is painful, and I know you don't really want to give up on your marriage, but it is so good to see you realizing that sacrificing yourself to keep an unhealthy situation limping along is not right for you or your children. So major kudos to you! You are a fabulous, loving woman, and I admire you.
You are Woman, and we are ecstatic to hear you ROAR!
the other thing that might happen is if he gets busted for a small amount of dope he may only get a fine or something and therefore think there is no risk at all. as i said i am not sure of the laws over there, but here there is a difference between possession and having enough to sell or supply.
in fact we are allowed to have a certain amount for personal use, without any legal conseqence at all. one of my jobs is to screen criminal record, national and international, and the amount of people we see with 1 count of possess, 1 count of possess smoking implement who then only get a fine of say $100- $500 is heaps. so it may be that if he is busted, he may only get a small fine. sometimes we joke (ironically) if we didnt employ people who had a minor possession we would lose half our staff haha. lots of people still have such records from the 80's when they were younger and at uni etc.
the loss of home etc only happens here for big amounts, kilos of the stuff etc. but in a smaller town then maybe the pubic embarrasement might effect his business more than any court - which of course he wont care about either unless he starts to lose money, if people dont come in. mind you people who use in town probably already know he does, they tend to find each other. as long as he isnt selling from the shop etc, he probably wont have much of a legal consequence.
maybe another consequence for him and of more importance might be the reaction of his parents and family, who knows.
but you are doing the right thing, ahving your separate account and we can see in your writing that you are getting stronger, well showing the strength we always knew was there in you.
take care, slowly slowly catch the monkey
hugs
kath
oh and E thanks for you comments, dialogue haha i like that, i am into writing a bit at the moment haha
cheers
Kath said: "boundaries, my two sense, i wouldnt bother giving him boundaries, he wouldnt know what one was, but i would start to give myself some, eg instead of saying to him 'you are not allowed to smoke dope in the house' i would twist that around to empower yourself and say 'i will not accept dope smoking in the house'. a little shift in emphasis gives you the power not him."
WOW, Kath...this makes SO much sense!!
Carol....I don't know how/what/why my H decided to give up the pot (wish he'd given up the OW instead!!), but what I DO know is that, I HAD told him I did NOT like it, would NOT tolerate it, and it didn't matter if HE kept it up or not...I DID NOT have to like it, tolerate it, or support it.
Don't know if this helps, or not....but I think what Kath says is very important...give yourself boundaries....to H!LL with HIM...
You will feel better....because you will then be able to say "I DID NOT APPROVE, NOR SUPPORT what he is doing"....
I have given him boundaries, especially with the pot but he tramples on them and he knows how I feel about the pot but just doesnt care becasue he is addicted. I have to set MY boundaries and reinforce them. I need some more work with my counselor in order to that effectively. I am working on it! But he also said the samething as Kath...H doesnt respect boundaries, so trying to inforce them is impossible to do right now.
I love reading your posts lately. It is like watching a tulip bloom in the spring. You are doing so awesome Carol. If only you could stand outside like we do and look in you would see what a wonderful person you are and how much strength and self esteem you have gathered since finding us.
CAROL I AM SOOO DAMN PROUD OF YOU!!!! Fight for what makes you happy and what you believe in!
hi kid, great comment, it is lovely to watch carol's posts and she is like a blossoming flower, that man just dont realise what he has does he. i dont normally comment on anothers partner but as they say down here, the guy has to be one stubby short of a slab. that is one bottle (stubby) short of a box of beer (slab) hahhahaha
for our english friends that might have to say 10 pence haha
but i think they have the whole euro thing happening there
that doesnt sound like money, it sounds like a disease, like you could ring work to have a sicky (day off) and say "god man i have got a euro really bad" hahhahhaha
You guys are too funny! LOL. But thank you for the encouragement and support. This board and everyone here has made such a difference in my life. I would not be where I am right now, at this moment, without you guys
You are doing so awesome Carol. If only you could stand outside like we do and look in you would see what a wonderful person you are and how much strength and self esteem you have gathered since finding us.