I dont know guys. I am just thinking out loud here. I dont even think this is a vent, lol. Im too exhausted to get that worked up.
I often wonder if it's too late and that too much damage has been done. H shows no signs of coming out of the pot fog or any fog for that matter. Every day I get a little closer to wanting it all over with. It's like Im not even taking baby steps, I am literally crawling along here. But I am exactly where I need to be at this moment.
However, as I focus on me and going to IC, and taking care of myself, H is moving further away. I feel it. It makes me sad I guess. I have held onto to hope for so long and with such determination. When I look back at things (hindsight) I should have done things so differently after d-day. But when you are in such pain it's pretty hard to think straight. What am I talking about, it's still hard for me to think straight. LOL. I have to stop beating myself up and admit defeat.
I dont even know what Im doing here anymore. Guess Im just having a bad day
Carol~
This message has been edited by pizzalady on Mar 7, 2007 2:49 PM
I am so sorry you are struggling and in pain still. Please don't waste time or energy on asking yourself fallacious "What if" or "Should I have" questions. The past is past. We can not change it. We can only change how we view it. What is the saddest part is that I can't help but think it may not have mattered WHAT you did because your H is so deep in his fog that he can't see the world around him. Please don't beat yourself up for his decisions.
You constantly amaze me by your strength, personal integrity, and generosity to others. I'm sorry your H can't see the wonderful woman he is in very real danger of losing.
I think you've reach what's come to be called here as "The Plains of Lethal Flatness"
which isn't the worst place to be.... it allows one to rest without being emotionally exhausted. It allows one to plan, to prepare, for the kids to finish grade school at the highest ranking school...blah blah blah, to update the resume or switch jobs...and to heal a bit...
I think it's a place you reach when your mind and body just can't take the trauma... at some point I think we've all visited....
The dangers are staying too long in The Plains. Nice place to visit...you don't want to live there.
all I can add is that you are getting stronger and Your H is staying the same or seeing you grow and pulling away because he doesn't want to deal with anything.
Carol the past is past...we can not change it but we can learn from it...yes we may second guess decisions we did or didn't make..but the decision you made was the right one for you then...
Your next decision will be the right one for you at that time... and you will know the time is right...
Take care of yourself, your children.. and keep moving forward...
Carol Your H had the opportunity to help you heal...go to MC and put the relationship back together...you can not save a relationship by yourself...it has to be a joint effort. No pun intended..and his joints hinder you and everything you do.
Oh, Carol. I feel where you are at right now. Seems like you are supposed to just move on and forget about it , huh? They don't understand that everything is still alive and kicking. My H always says, "I thought we were past all of this". How can we be past it when we never really dealt with it????
I don't think it matters how you dealt with things after D-day. To me D-day never ends, and it is just the beginning of a new miserable direction in life. What you did after D-day can't change that it happened. Nothing we did before or after can change that! Like everyone says, "It was their decision". Here's the mess I made out of your life, you deal with it. They are just the same spoiled little boys. I blame my H's mother for a lot of my H's issues. In his family the men were treated like little kings, being waited on by all the sisters and women. Barf.
You have been so amazing and strong. But who knows, maybe the real fight for your family is just getting started. Maybe he does need to lose his family to wake up! He's used to you picking up all the pieces and keeping things together, while he acts out. And what if you're not there? Is he a workaholic for himself? or for his family? See, I think these guys would fall apart without their spouses. Somewhere,somehow they need to break open and get a little emotional about wanting to keep us happy and work on being a family.
It bums me out that they just go merrily on their way, ignoring the baby elephant over in the corner of the room. Once again, "hey, I didn't know it was going to get so big". The only words of encouragement that I have is to keep working on yourself. Time is going to pass anyways and it will be great if on the other side of this storm you come out strong.
They should offer classes in "how to not give a **** anymore"!! At this point I think, it's what do you really want. Don't know if I am making sense, it's 3am! I just want to give you my sometimes odd perspective. Ha! Take care Carol. Hugs, E
Thank you ladies! All of you have helped me so much.
I feel like I just want to give up because he doesnt get it and I am fighting a losing battle. I want to crawl in a corner and just sit and cry for awhile. I havent cried much since Christmas, except during IC. I guess I need to get it out.
I think some of it has to do with my H and him buying me "things" instead of giving of himself. And yesterday I was thinking "here we go again". Lets buy Carol some "thing" to make her happy. Well, the lease is up on my car next month. I have had the car for 3 years and I like it a lot. But it makes more sense to buy a new one than to buy out the old one. So H wants to buy me a new one. We're talking about an expensive luxury car and I just sat there not feeling very happy about it. My H says that nothing he does makes me happy and he's right. I wanted with all of my heart to say "I dont want the car, I want you! I want you to spend time with me, take me to dinner, go to a movie, or just sit at home and talk" I have said it many, many times to him, but he doesnt hear me. I know I cant have him. I know he doesnt want to spend time with me. So what good would it do me to say it again? He doesnt get it. And I thought "another pair of golden handcuffs" to add to my collection.
It also doesnt help that my old car was leased when he was seeing OW still. And the day we picked up the car when it was new I should have been so happy, but I knew it was a guilt gift and did not come from his heart. I also feel this car is not from the heart either, but more to keep me off his back, to keep me quiet....to keep me feeling obligated to stay. I dont want to feel obligated to him for anything! And whenever we get into an agruement it will be used against me. He will say "If I didnt love you I wouldnt have bought you the car". Then he will say "I have to work harder to pay for it, so why are you nagging me to come home?" Geesh, he's got a million of those daggers to throw at my heart.
So I am feeling bummed out...feeling defeated and like giving up and really wanting to move on. My C says I can do that without having to leave my H. He isnt going to tell me I have to leave him. He says that is not his job and it's up to me. He says what his job is is to get Carol to a place where Carol can make good chocies for herself and her children. Where Carol can stand up for herself and feel important. So I guess I need to be patient with myself until then. But at times it is so very hard to do that.
Carol, I don't know if you are ready for this step yet but the car thing kind of reminded me about my own car situation.
My H always picked out the cars and then acted like I was the one who picked it out.
I have wanted an SUV for years. He is major anti SUV. He would decide that he wanted a mini-van for me and would shop around for months, then pick out about 5 vans and we would go test drive them. Then I could pick from those.
And it was always, ME who picked out the car. Yeah right!
Well, guess what? I now have an SUV. It's my car, I picked it out all by myself. H hates it but is happy for me.
So...are you ready to maybe say, "Thanks for the car offer, but no thanks."
Then you go out on your own and get the car that YOU want.
Come home and tell H you got yourself a car and leave it at that.
It's a big step I know and I am in no way pushing. Just dropping a thought.
I love my car and when ever I get in it I have a feeling I can't describe.
It's about growth and self-worth and competence, etc.
Carol, when I look at all the hard work, emotional soul-searching, posting, attempts at problem solving and all the other things you are engaged in to help your marriage, I'm almost jealous (in a sense) of your husband! Does he, at any level, realize the GEM he married?!? Had I behaved like he does, I would have been unceremoniously shown the door by my W years ago (she who betrayed me!)
What accounts for such blinders in a man? As you are aware, the haze of pot smoke is a main issue, workaholism is another.
One of the major tenets of any 12 step recovery program is that you cannot control another person, much less an addict. You must be painfully aware of this by now....
Despite his using you disdainfully, you are the one in your relationship who is deeply and proactively engaged in trying to draw him closer to you. And where there's life, there's hope. It appears to me that you have what I call a "trauma bond" with your H--much like the feelings many of us BS's have in our desperate attempt to restore our relationships shortly after D Day. But despite the trauma, it is a BOND, nonetheless. For better or for worse. I can relate it to my own personal experience of multiple betrayals. This is a reason that you (or I) have not left our respective relationships.
Ride it out, and take care of yourself--and let him take care of himself (or not). Acknowledge to yourself that the love you have for this man has value--whether it is reciprocated or not--because it is the measure of your own good heart!
Thank you for your empowering words. He has picked out every car I have ever had since we met. It is always what HE wants. Once he let me pick the color at least, whoopie! Of course at first we had to buy what we could afford, but now we have the luxury to order exactly what we want..,but it's not what WE want it's what HE wants, even though it's my car. And even though my C told me to stand up for myself I am not ready to take H's wrath and go without a car at all.
But it's not even about the car, although that is part of it. It is about him buying me "things", spending money on "things" when all I want is him and for him to spend some time with me. He cannot give me what I truly want, which is some of his time. He has no time for me so he buys me "things". This is a huge issue and sore spot for me. He found time for OW but not for me. It hurts so much! He gave her what he cant or isnt able to give me...his time. That's what tears me up inside more than anything else.
Thank you so much for your reply and kind words. It was beautiful and I am in tears. I wish my H saw what you see in me, what you all see in me even just a little of it.
I am painfully aware that you cannot control others. And addicts have a real bad habit of not being able to see anything unless it can get them their high. It is so hard to stand by helplessly as some one you love thows their life away. But when you are married to that person it is even harder, because they're not just throwing their own lives away. They are throwing away their wife and childrens lives right along with their own. But they dont see it...they dont have a clue. It is so very sad and heartbreaking.
I am sorry for all the pain you are in. If I still lived in PA, I would come over and hug you in person. Then I would put you in my car and take you out car shopping. Believe me, my friends are well aware that if anyone can get them to buy something they really want but are hesitant to buy, it's me! LOL
What if you just go out and buy the car you really want BEFORE you turn in the old one? That way you wouldn't be without a car. You could always tell your H that you know how busy he is at the pizzeria and you wanted to surprise him by removing the burden of car shopping from him when he is soooooooooooo busy at work. Do you think he would get the message?
That way he would not have the chance to control your choice.
You said "He found time for OW but not for me. It hurts so much! He gave her what he cant or isnt able to give me...his time. That's what tears me up inside more than anything else." Isn't that just so much the point. My H is a bit like yours: basically he does what he wants, and if it doesn't suit me he pretends to agree and then goes ahead and does it his way. There are just some things he can't let me control (like NC with OW or when he does things with his fellow adulterer best friend) so he does them his way in spite of me.
We are changing cars too. The OW never went in the current car, but we were in it when he told me about the A, and on many other occasions when I was upset. Often driving to work I howled in this car and many times I cried along to songs on the radio which just brought it home to me how he had betrayed me. So I will be glad to get rid of this one. And we have managed to make the decision about a new one together and got the one we both think is right. In fact, just talking aobut a new car and going to the dealers for test drives was doing something together and it felt good. It was certainly something he never did with OW!
Lots of hugs to you - I am sure you will come through this as you have all along, but I know it's hard!
You know, when we leased the car he was still seeing OW, so yes, I am sorta glad to get rid of the car. But it is a really awesome car and I am sad to see it go. Maybe that's another reaon it is hard for me to get another one..it's kindof a trigger. And I dont know if he bought OW a car or went car shopping with her at some time. He wouldnt tell me even if I asked. He loves to buy "things" so who knows exactly what he bought her. So I am not even letting my mind go there.
___________________________
FF,
Thanks for checking up on me. I hate this day! Valentines Day is such a trigger for so many of us and I am no different. Although it doesnt hurt as bad as last year, the triggers are there.
He bought me the usual gifts...flowers, card and candy. But this year he sure did not put much HEART into it.
LATE YEAR (during the A & Prior to): He would always get me one dozen gorgeous red roses from my favorite florist, hand pick my favorite chocolates at Josh Early, and a lovely card that always said "To My Loving Wife" and most of the time he'd handwrite something nice on the inside and write I love you, and sign his name. (and he bought all this for OW as well).
THIS YEAR: 3 wilted roses from the grocery store (obviously all they had left), pre-boxed candy, and a generic card signed Love, H.
What did I get for him: I wrote notes leading him from the front door to the hot tub, where I was waiting with champage and uhm only my birthday suit on. He said he didnt feel like getting wet and sat there with me and drank the champagne though (ouch!). So I got out and got on some sexy lingerie. Then we went into the dining room where I had prepared dinner by candle light and love song playing in the background. For desert we had a a giant fortune cookie, hand-dipped in Belgium chocolate, with a personalized fortune inside of it that I had pre-ordered for H (he likes fortune cookies, so I thought it was cute). Then we went upstairs where I had a singing balloon ("How sweet it is to be loved by you"), a single rose I placed on his side of the bed along with a GIANT CARD that I handwrote some romantic sentiments including I love you.
It really hurts that I went through a lot of trouble and he just ran by the grocery store on the way home. I am not feeling very special or very loved right about now! Curse that Cupid dude!!!
Hope you're having a better Valentine's Day than me.............Carol~
Lisa.............You have me rolling on the floor, laughing my ass off! You are too funny. Thank you for making me smile! You made my day...and for that you can be my Valentine any day
Yes, my H loves to buy "things" but of course he had no time for me this year. I guess he just wasnt thinking about Valentines Day this year and was not prepared. Oh who cares? I need to stop making up excuses for this man and his lack of sensitivity...almost makes me want to switch teams as well! LOL
