Some of you may recall that I haven't had much success with damp bunning. I'm trying again today and having yet more and new problems. I just can't get it right and I'm looking for some tips. I'm going to start with today's problems and work from there. The main problem I'm having is that my wet/damp hair doesn't handle well. This means it's difficult to comb any of it when it's damp or towel dried (patted dry or towel wrapped) for even just two minutes. So I'm trying to get my hair into a bun with 1. minimal wet/damp handling and 2. so hair looks acceptable against the head (not messy).
Today what I did was a CO wash hoping that would help the hair close to the scalp lay nicely. I didn't use anything else (i.e. no leave-ins).
After rinsing in the shower I held my hair length with one hand as if I was making a ponytail, wet hair close flattened and smoothed against the scalp, holding this in position I ran my other hand down the length several times until the dripping had stopped.
Then I twisted the length into a bun and secured with hairpins.
This was good so far because now it all looked smoothed and sleek and it wasn't dripping so I could dress and go off to work (I didn't towel dry at all to avoid messing this up).
But here are today's problems:
I guess I made the bun too low because when I was commuting to work the collar of my suit jacket got wet. Note to self, make the damp bun higher next time.
I feel that my hair is now so sleekly smoothed against my head that the weight of the damp bun is pulling it too much. It's only a bit uncomfortable but I don't think the pressure is good for the scalp nor the hair. It's been up this way for about 3 hours now and the hair close to the scalp is still damp at the sides but dry at the crown. If I go redo my bun to fix the pressure I anticipate the hair close to the scalp will end up looking wet/damp and messy with flyaways too. I don't mind the bunned length looking a bit messy but I don't want the hair near the scalp to look separated or clumped or fuzzy.
Maybe I've got this right after all, maybe this is what it's like for others too, but it doesn't seem right to me. Maybe I NEED a leave-in to do this? If I had towel dried before making the damp bun I would have needed to comb the hair close to the scalp which I find damaging and want to avoid in order to arrange it nicely in a bun. What else should I be doing to get this right?
I am wondering at the benefits people experience with damp bunning.
I would imagine this would make for serious tangles.
I know with my hair, wet hair in a bun or braid never dries. And I really mean never.
I have always been taught by every single hair care professional I know to not manipulate or attempt to detangle wet hair as this hair is heavy from the water and more importantly, stretches a lot in this condition which can cause undo hair stress and even loss of good hairs.
A while back on this board there was a discussion with me about the hydrating features of water wherein I explained that water is not a hydrater, rather an activator for product to do its job of cleansing or conditioner bonding to the hair (simply put).
Water can hydrate for about 5 minutes or until it dries--that's a very temporary benefit and simply a point of technicality. Yet once dry, it does not continue to hydrate. There may be a benefit for a brief period of time. Our hair is protected by sebum (oil) and/or additional oil we add to our hair length. This is a protective coating.
In humid weather or rainy weather I suspect people's hair feels softer after becoming wet in these conditions not so much from the water itself but from the fact that water may indeed help the sebum to emulsify (smear) and then coat the hair a little more creating softer hair texture. The humidity adds the fact of warmth which in turn, especially when combined with one's body heat (head being most warm!), helps to open the cuticle a tad. I do know that recently I experience quite hot & humid weather versus my California semi-arid climate, and my scalp hair became quite gummy very quickly. I had to scalp wash in a shorter time frame than my norm in California.
So, I'm trying to understand why people do damp bunning and why it works for them? I suspect that curly hair types may have a tad more success with this since it may help their hair be less poofy with the air drying process.
Most people I know personally, if their long tresses are in a bun, like mine, it never dries.
So perhaps the point is to stave off drying and get water to the cortex where it stays for a duration of time.....yet eventually, somehow hair dries and the water no longer hydrates even what little it did hydrate. Water passes through the cortex; the more porous the hair, the more quickly it passes through.
So, let me know why this works for you. Attempting to learn all I can about hair care and what works for different hair types. In Martine's case, she has hair color and type (fine & straight) quite similar to mine according to the photo.
OH, and Martine, you inquired some time ago about trimming 2 inches? I wouldn't do it; it doesn't seem necessary in your case. A microtrim at best to work on horizontal volume over time. The only thing is your pictures you posted in that thread didn't show the ends very well in the last 2 photos--the ends were cut off, so I couldn't tell if you might have any weak spots in your hair ends.....(this refers to zones where within 6 inches from center line on either side the hair is the same length or not. If not, mictrotrimming for a while at the same length yet not trimming the weak ends to allow them time to catch up to the remainder of the length is an option to consider. Also, I do understand that you purposefully trim in a u shape.)
Thank you in advance for explaining this procedure.
heidi w.
Karen Marie - the first person I learned this method from
September 15 2004, 2:17 PM
The first time I ever heard of damp bunning several years ago now was from Karen Marie whose incredibly stunning hair was to her knees. From what I remember she explained that her hair was much easier to handle when wet/damp which naturally lead to her doing this on a regular basis. I think she may actually have been doing this daily, I recall she had been washing daily. I don't know if she had other reasons for doing this but as she had successfully grown extra long beautiful hair (that she said didn't have split ends) many followed her example and damp bunning caught on in the long hair community on the internet.
My understanding is that most who use this method do it as a way to keep their hair hydrated/moist for this extended period of time, since as you mentioned, hair does not normally dry when bunned. The method is used to counteract the many external factors that can dry hair out. It is a kind of treatment. Some use the time to deep condition hair so conditioner may be left on during the damp bunning time. I believe most will damp bun for a part of the day but not overnight. For example as I did today, wash in the morning and damp bun for the workday. Hair is freed from the bun at some point during the day (rinsed if a treatment was used) and then allowed to dry.
While moist hair may be more vulnerable than dry hair when it comes to handling, it is not being handled when bunned and it is prevented from becomeing dry and brittle which can also make it vulnerable to damage.
Many believe that water IS moisture and that benefits of hydration from washing remain in the hair for a period of time afterwards, which may vary between individuals based on hair type, condition, weather, and haircare products used.
I've had nothing but problems attempting to follow this approach so I'm not really the right person to be asking for advice However I do see the benefits and would gladly incorporate the method into my haircare routine if I could (and maybe have NO splits like Karen Marie! ). I am one of those who believe water IS moisture and feel there are benefits to frequent washing that last longer than after hair has dried. But I wash only weekly because I find that more convenient due to the length of time it takes to dry my hair. To me damp bunning would be a treatment if I could only get it right.
While people's personal experiences vary widely, and what works for each person is what a person should (and I do mean that "should") do for their hair care, I must confess that the science of water being a hydrator/moisturizer does not bear out. (I must be clear that when I hear people use the phrase 'water is a hydrator' that I interpret this to mean that they believe water is moisturizing and therefore bonding to the hair much like a product or conditioner or oil itself). Scientifically speaking, water does not attach itself to the hair and remain as a moisturizer over time.)
Yes, I do get that the dampness is purposefully being extended to improve hair's integrity and moisture.
I do not want to suggest stopping, though, if this method is somehow working for individuals.
Always do what works for you!!
I just always question belief versus science in that my understanding of these 2 words is that belief is a kind of faith whereas science has some kind of study attached to it that bears out some fact. Belief can also be interpreted as a theory or hypothesis whereas science proves or disproves the posit.
Interestingly, and as a huge aside, there are plenty of things I believe in that have no basis in fact yet they do work for me.
My guess is that somehow the heat from the head (body temperature) and the warmth of hair being wrapped up (moist environments tend to become warm) may well open the cuticle thereby allowing any applied product to penetrate.
Yet I worry that hairs being coiled may actually not only experience some degree of stress but may even be bent....I have had the situation of hairs becoming bent while wet and air drying if I sat on it, for example. These hairs appear at angles and one might initially think this hair has been damaged. I found that re-wetting will straighten it out immediately although in a select few cases the hair was damaged. I also suspect that different hair types may have more or less success with this. (This could be an interesting theory to attempt to prove/disprove.)
For me personally, I would never choose damp bunning. My hair is quite fine (in the sunlight an individual strand is nearly invisible), tangling quite easily,stretching unduly while wet (and the weight of wet hair may well pull out some valid hairs!). For me, oiling for 10+ years has been a great moisturizer for my hair that is now descending to my calves (55"). Oiling prevents splits, breakage, dryness, flyaway, brittleness, excellent for after coloring/perming (once color or perm is set), closely mimics as a waxy ester the function of one's own natural sebum to coat and provide a protective layer to the hair; oil adds weight so the hair moves attractively as a mass in that undulating pattern that so many respond to visually, oil keeps the health of the oldest hairs in tact so that horizontal and vertical volume can improve, and finally it helps hair's texture to be soft & supple with a beautiful sheen that reflects the light well whether in soft or intense light. I've had my hair dusted by 2 professionals in the past 2 years, and I am told I have few splits. I also personally dust my hair fairly regularly.
Thank you for the info and for responding so quickly.
I could easily be talked out of damp bunning since it's problematic for me
September 15 2004, 3:59 PM
If I had to choose between damp bunning and oiling I would SURELY choose oiling without a moment of hesitation. I can apply a small amount of jojoba oil daily, mostly to the top layer of hair (particularly at the front where hair has been highlighted), some extra to the last few inches and also swish onto the very tips and go on that way for many weeks just doing scalpwashes
Since my hair is slightly wavy it separates into smaller clumped sections as it begins to dry. Soaking wet it's completely straight and smooth but as soon as it's no longer dripping the clumping and separation is there. When I attempt to damp bun, this natural tendency of my hair's texture means the coiling and winding into a bun is actually starting the styling process. I see this as yet another of the problems I'm having with damp bunning, This makes me worry about the effect a bun can have in creating bent hairs as you mentioned. When I let my hair out of a damp bun it is still very damp and all heavily clumped together and I have to shake my head in order for the clumps to release from the other clumps. Then another process I don't enjoy begins: airdrying. But I'll save that for another discussion.
Heidi, I noticed that you favor coconut oil and I wonder if you were choosing it over jojoba oil. After reading this from your post I pulled two of my coconut oils out of hiding to revisit, one from the cool darkness of my basement, the other from my fridge (Monoi Tiare). I used them for the past few days and I have to say I much prefer jojoba oil. I found the coconut oils don't seem to distribute as evenly and don't seem to detangle as well as jojoba oil. Last night I went back to jojoba oil again and it was like my hair had come back. I was really hoping for the Monoi Tiare to work well because I love the scent and now that I'm a regular oil user I thought it would be great to use that up. I think the last time I used it I hadn't mastered oiling but now I have. Maybe the Spectrum brand is somehow better?
Yes I have chosen Coconut Oil by Spectrum Naturals as my oiling choice. This version is not the same as found in the salad dressing section. I find this version in a Whole Foods store in the Beauty Supply section. This version by Spectrum Naturals is specifically for use on skin and hair--the label states this.
This version comes as a solid. I keep it stored in the refrigerator so that it remains a solid.
When I use it, I scrape a tad off the top of the hard surface (I have given it as a gift in little glass pot jars by melting my supply in the microwave, pouring it into a little round glass pot jar, setting in the refrigerator to set and then screwing on the lid)....approximately a fingernail full (keep in mind that I maintain my fingernails rather short, at the tip of my finger pads.
I rub this amount between my palms and often add a drop of a scented "essential" oil such as grapefruit, rose, rose geranium, ylang ylang....whatever suits my fancy at the time.
Then I downstroke into my already air dried and detangled hair after a fresh hair wash, using the oil as my leave in conditioner. I place my palms on either side of my hair after leaning over on one side. I start at approximately ear lobe length since my regular sebum manages to coat quite nicely up to that point a protective layer. I repeat everything on the other side (given my length, I have to do 3 applications in sections, drawing my hair up and I use my leg to help me.) I always follow with Boar Bristle Brushing to distribute the oil evenly.
I like this version of Spectrum Natural's Coconut Oil because it's cheap (around $5.00 US for 15 oz), lasts forever as long as I keep it in the refrigerator, blends well with chosen scents, and mostly is a heavier oil that helps my hair to lie nicely as a mass. My hair takes it quite well, and given that it comes in a solid, I find it easier to manage the amount of oil applied. I always say A LITTLE BIT GOES A REALLY LONG WAY.
Monoi Tiare: I received some as a gift a few weeks ago and have used it now and find that I like this very much too. I used the same process for application. My hair readily absorbed it and the aroma was really nice and lasted for a while. I had a little bit harder time managing the amount since the jar's bottle opening is rather wide and not much like a dropper.
When I get too much on my hand, I pad my palms on a paper towel to absorb excess. When doing repeated applications on different sections of hair, there is a bit of buildup on my palms, so I now always use a paper towel to absorb excess from my palms to avoid applying too much and ending up with stringy, sectiony hair.
To me, Monoi Oil seemed like the in between oil -- between Coconut and Jojoba. Not quite as heavy as coconut; not quite as light as Jojoba.
Jojoba Oil:
For me, I found Jojoba Oil (I do recommend that if this is your oil choice to buy on line HobaCare--the best Jojoba Oil on the market being that it's very clear, clean amber color. I know of other brands and they aren't as ambery and tend to have a more cloudy color--less transparent.) to be too light for my hair and my goal of having healthy, moisturized, and mostly protected hair. This readily absorbed and I found I had to apply it nearly daily to maintain moisture, especially on the older hair portion. Personally, I don't like fussing with my hair daily (less fussing = healthier hair. People always ask what my secret is. I always reply that I leave it alone.)
However, it's important to note that of all the oils, Jojoba Oil most closely mimics one's natural oil, sebum.
All oils are a waxy ester, a protective coating to the hair -- much like what one's own sebum does.
I have heard from a few people, Lady Godiva being one who mentions this, that one's climate that one lives in can effect the choice one makes for their oil. She likes Jojoba Oil and believes Coconut Oil to be more suitable for those in a more tropical or semi-arid climate. She noted that she saw little tiny balls of coconut oil in a friend's hair who lived in a colder climate. I do live in a semi-arid climate, and I did recently visit a friend in a more humid climate and did note that my hair became more oily quite a bit faster in this humid climate as compared to my semi-arid climate that has a blazing sun most of the year round--except winter when the touly fog sets in.
I want to note that I am not at all used to a humid, midwestern climate and it's quite possible the oiliness came from sweat more than anything else. Perhaps if I became used to it, things would calm down. I did a full hair wash and the next day I had to do a scalp wash -- I think that's how it went...or was it scalp wash and next day scalp wash?
Anyway, I mention all of this as points of consideration and to note people's personal experiences -- in case anyone out there has a similar experience, they will know they aren't alone.
Here's links:
Here are my oiling instructions on www.tlhs.org/hair care/dry. Note the photos show a woman with wet hair. This woman is (a) not me and (b) not at all representative of how I oil my hair. I apply oil to dry hair!!
Hope this helps you make a great oiling choice for your hair! My hair guru, Eddie, taught me about oiling. His mother, who's Latino hair he cared for from the mid to late 40s, had nearly ankle length hair. She oiled her hair. It was a common practice for Latino women, Philippino women, Hawaiian women, and other Asian and East Indian women...indeed, many of these cultures still use this practice. (East Indian is Asian but I wanted to be clear.)
Mostly, this is a very old practice that has worked for centuries. Many women had beautiful hair up until the 20's, when shorter lengths became more in vogue.
Thanks for sharing your thoughts on that Heidi! I enjoyed reading your oiling tips as well. I am just wondering how often you oil. If I read the article correctly, you do not oil every day. So.. I'm curious as to how often you oil. I love oiling and I am always interested in how other people do this!
Thanks in advance for your reply!
-Fox
17/35.5/35+ Type 2CMii (3B underneath layer) Somewhat fine, slightly wavy (with curls on the underneath layer), Hennaed Auburn. To see more pictures, click on the gallery collection link found here: Forever Fox
"Watch your thoughts, for they become words. Choose your words, for they become actions. Understand your actions, for they become habits. Study your habits, they will become your character. Develop your character for it becomes your destiny." -John MacArthur
Products Used:
Aubrey Organics S&C
Nature's Gate Conditioners (As well as Forest Pure, another brand made by the makers of Nature's Gate)
Vinegar/herbal rinses
I oil after every single full hair wash. On rare occasions I oil in between full hair washes, but it is uncommon for me.
Coconut Oil is heavier and adequately protects my hair for the full two weeks or more when applied once. Plus I Boar Bristle Brush the initial oiling in and BBB between hair washings as well. (My goal is to always find ways to lessen my detangling needs to improve my Horizontal Volume.)
I also oil very heavily all of my hair, including scalp hair, when swimming in the ocean's salty water or in chlorinated water. It really helps to prevent "penetration" of those salts that can be so drying and damaging to hair!
Again, oiling provides a protective coating to the hair (essentially mimicking what one's sebum does) on the lengths where one's natural sebum doesn't necessarily descend to on its own. Oiling provides weight, and that protective coating assists with preventing breakage, increases elasticity, prevents splits and other types of damage, assists with reducing issues of flyaway & static (even in humid weather), brittleness, and really softens hair to be supple and move heavily as a mass of hair that undulates attractively in all light, and brings out the pattern of one's waves/curls and also brings out the undertones and overtones of color that exist in everyone's hair. Oiling is also excellent after a perm or coloring (be sure to wait for hair to set, say, at least 3 days) so the hair doesn't dry out unduly from changing the cuticle structure and having increased porosity of the cortex from these procedures.
Do not oil scalp hair as this can, especially if done consistently over time, upset your skin's natural pH balance!
17/35.5/35+ Type 2CMii (3B underneath layer) Somewhat fine, slightly wavy (with curls on the underneath layer), Hennaed Auburn. To see more pictures, click on the gallery collection link found here: Forever Fox
"Watch your thoughts, for they become words. Choose your words, for they become actions. Understand your actions, for they become habits. Study your habits, they will become your character. Develop your character for it becomes your destiny." -John MacArthur
Products Used:
Aubrey Organics S&C
Nature's Gate Conditioners (As well as Forest Pure, another brand made by the makers of Nature's Gate)
Vinegar/herbal rinses
I think I might stick with jojoba over coconut oil
September 17 2004, 4:47 PM
I used the Monoi Tiare again last night (that's a few days now) and it just doesn't keep my hair sleek like the jojoba oil does. Too bad because it smells so good! I do wonder why the jojoba oil works SO much better and I wouldn't be surprised if it was related to the humidity level as you mentioned.
Thanks for the link to the oiling page. I haven't been to TLHS for quite some time and don't recall seeing that. It's very detailed and helpful.
When I oil I don't usually apply to the underside of my hair but instead focus on my ends and tips, the top layer (canopy) and two needy sections at the front that are highlighted. I do this because I find the oil needs of my hair are not the same all through.
I still wonder if the traditional practice of oiling is as effective as the 'modern' practice of more frequent washing/conditioning and if available local resources are really what determine is the best approach. But it's good to have a choice and my own is to oil due to it's incredible convenience.
I heartily recommend as always, and always support doing what works best for each person. A variety of factors influence decisions: hair type, budget, geographic location, among other limiting factors.
I would suggest seeing my post above on Scalp Washing & Horizontal Volume (GM) to better consider frequent versus less washing. This insight may help you decide what may yet be more suitable.
I think that you are far more observant and methodical in your evaluation of your hair care routine than I am in mine. Keeping that in mind, in my own hair I never noticed bent hairs nor hairs with white dots until I wore my hair in damp buns and braids regularly this past Winter. A few months ago, in late Spring, I began to notice this damage.
I wore braids last Winter far more often than buns (and damp braids might be harsher to hair than damp buns would be.) The damage could also have occurred because of more frequent washing and detangling (though I was quite gentle, I thought), winding my hair too tightly into the buns that I had just learned how to make, or something else entirely. Last Winter my hair had reached a length where I had to learn to wear it up at last, and I changed a number of things about my routine at that time. One (or more) of my changes resulted in damage to my hair.
Because of this experience, though, I am wary about damp hairstyles and now leave my hair loose now as it dries. I thought I would mention my experience, vague as it is, in case it is of some help to you as you evaluate wearing damp hairstyles.
Before I started to grow my hair long I was used to playing around with my hair (various hairstyles and lengths, coloring, etc). At the time I'd already grown it to BS and I didn't have any problems with it. I washed daily, blow dried, styled, put it up when I felt like it, left it loose most of the time. I never saw a split end until I found the hair boards! I think part of the reason is because I started to experiment rather than doing what had always worked. Probably the second most significant activity where experimenting caused damage for me was in drying wet hair (the most significant activity is cap highlighting). I had always known that manipulating wet or damp hair was to be avoided but since air-drying was routinely being recommended for long hair I followed that advice. This is still a problem for me and so washing weekly is the best solution I've found.
Yes, I know what you mean. I feel strange saying it, but
September 16 2004, 3:13 PM
my hair was at it's healthiest when I did nothing to it. Wash, condition, air-dry, and wear it loose was what I did. This routine worked for me until my locks grew to tailbone length last Autumn; at that point my hair was just too long to wear down everyday. If wearing my hair in everyday braids and buns has damaged my hair, I have little choice about it at this point. I cannot, for example, scrub the kitchen with loose hair that drags on the floor all around me.
I do think that growing long hair requires finding new solutions to the challenges of new lengths. And, as with all else, what works for us at one time in our life will be of little avail at another time in another situation. I wish that I could have kept my hair in the relatively-pristine condition that it was in prior to reaching tailbone length. For this to happen, though, I would have had to keep my hair shorter than tailbone length. Instead, I am on a new adventure of Really Long Hair and learning something new all the time. I do try to keep things in perspective, too: we are often our own worst critics when it comes to finding perceived damage in our own hair.
Your statement of I do think that growing long hair requires finding new solutions to the challenges of new lengths. And, as with all else, what works for us at one time in our life will be of little avail at another time in another situation.
I think that our routines do have to grow with our hair. After all, your tips of your hair were once only a few years old, but they get older and more worn every year! Keeping them protected and "in shape" will require changes. You may need more conditioning or deeper conditioning, less washing and more updos! You do have to grow with your hair!
And by the way... I never see any damage in your hair, so never fear.. it still looks gorgeous!
-Fox
17/35.5/35+ Type 2CMii (3B underneath layer) Somewhat fine, slightly wavy (with curls on the underneath layer), Hennaed Auburn. To see more pictures, click on the gallery collection link found here: Forever Fox
"Watch your thoughts, for they become words. Choose your words, for they become actions. Understand your actions, for they become habits. Study your habits, they will become your character. Develop your character for it becomes your destiny." -John MacArthur
Products Used:
Aubrey Organics S&C
Nature's Gate Conditioners (As well as Forest Pure, another brand made by the makers of Nature's Gate)
Vinegar/herbal rinses
I do believe you have something there with the reaction of oil to the weather. Since I live in a damp area which rarely gets hot and dry, I use a much lighter oil. I did notice a change during the warm months, but didn't really consider it in this light. I have to be very careful with the shea butter that it doesn't ball up on me, I bet that is why! I shall oil accordingly. I'd love to try the coconut oil, but I'm pretty sure it would be too heavy for my hair.
Original style very, very short, been growing out for 12 years off and on.
Original color, auburn, now multicolored grey, auburn & white. Dyed auburn
1b to 1c with a curl around hairline underneath. Fii
Length 27" now trimmed to 24.5 April 24th
May 1st 25"!!!!!
When I do damp bunning my hair has to be just slightly damp, not wet in any way. I just mist my ends lightly and twist my hair up in a bun, without combing or detangling. If the bun is too wet I don't have much success with it. Usually I don't do wet bunning, though. I just mist my hair lightly and leave it to dry, that seems to work too. Because for some reason wetting my hair down every day is a good thing for my hair. Lately I've been too lazy to do that, though... it's just not very fun to have to deal with damp hair on an everyday basis.
Unrelated, but I just noticed you had a link to a page with articles, and I found your 10-strand highlighting method. It's very interesting. I've been trying to highlight my hair on my own, and by mistake I happened to make too many highlights in my bangs area, realized that I liked it a lot, and has now tried to touch them up on my own. Now I've decided to only highlight the bangs instead of all of my hair, but I've also been debating whether to just henna my hair instead. MM has some marigold blonde henna that I've been eyeing. And that's when I found your 10-strand article. And I can't decide whether to go chemical-free and henna, or if I should do your 10-strand highlighting method and have blonde streaks in my growing out bangs.
I guess I'm writing to ask you for advice somehow, since you're the experienced highlighter here. If I try out henna I will have to stop highlighting (I guess?), so therefore I feel it's a big decision.
What I like about highlighting is that I get to be somehow blonde, but yet keep my natural haircolour which compliments my face nicely. I'm afraid the henna would make my hair too golden/red, and I know from experience that reddish isn't the best colour on me. On the other hand I'm worried that highlighting will make it a bit damaged in the long run, even though it's only the bangs-area. Have you thought about these things, and what's your take on it? I think our natural haircolour is quite similar, and your hair looks so healthy and shiny. I'm wondering if I'll be able to achieve it as well.
I'm so happy with just having medium thick light blonde streaks at the hairline and the rest natural (including a few grays I haven't decided how to deal with yet) because when I make my buns the blonde streaks are pulled over the rest of the darker blonde hair so it looks blonder.
I highlighted my own hair for many many years but when I began to grow my hair long it became a great big problem to continue doing. Eventually I came up with that 10-strand method and I've been doing only that for the past year.
The problem was that I couldn't keep using the technique as when my hair was shorter because it caused excessive tangling with the longer hair. I researched this and experimented with different methods over the next few years. I did foils and that probable worked the best but it was a heck of a lot of work. In the end everything I'd tried was either too difficult, too much work or too time consuming for me to bother doing. And I didn't want to have it done at a salon and spend extra money -- I wanted what I could do myself.. I wrote about all the troubles I had and this article is with that 10-strand article you mentioned if you're interested in this.
I'd say that having these highlights IS a trade-off. The highlighted hair isn't in the same condition as the natural hair, that's certainly true. Due to my various failing experiments of the past I have two side pieces at the front that are only BS length. I've been alternating between haircolor and bleach preferring the results I get with bleach but the condition I get from haircolor.
I would say henna is a big decision, and doing a 10 strand highlight at the hairline is not such a big decision. You can henna over bleach but you generally can't bleach hennaed hair. Basically it's best NOT to do both although they CAN be combined. Bleach removes pigment from hair and doesn't leave anything behind whereas haircoloring leaves pigments behind that can interact with henna and produce undesireable results. I remember one gal on a hair board said she would use bleach to put in her highlights (doing only the roots each time), then use henna over top to get the light red she liked and the conditioning and shine from henna.
My advice is do your research and then decide -- I'm sure that's what you'll do anyway but I think it's important enough to be stated and repeated. And let me know if there's any way I can help you!
Thank you for writing such a long response, it was really helpful. I did find your other article about your haircolouring past, but that was after I had already written to you.
I read your response this morning, and now I've been thinking about haircolour for a while. Fox wrote below about Marigold henna, and from the description it sounded really nice. I think henna might make my hair a little lighter because it adds shine. And gold is a good colour on me, just as long as it isn't yellow or red. I do have brown eyes, and my colour chart consists of warm colours as well as cold colours.
The direction my thoughts are going now is that I'll try the henna (strand test first), and if I don't like it I'll let it wash out for half a year or so, and then re-do the highlights. I've just re-done the highlights so I think now is a good time. It's really only my bangs that are highlighted. I did highlight a few single strands all over the crown of my hair, but they were so few and thin that I won't get growth lines.
As I wrote before, I want to go completely chemical free, and highlighting isn't very good if chemical free is what I strive for. Therefore I think that I might give henna a try, seeing that gold is a good colour on me. I also want to grow longer hair now. Exactly how long I haven't decided yet, but at least past waist length.
Gosh, this is hard. I still haven't decided what to do.
I did colour my hair brown/red one and a half year ago with a semi-permanent colour, but I think it's all washed out now. (That was when I thought I wouldn't ever have long hair again...) IF (I haven't decided yet) I do henna, then I'll do the MM Zen Detox first, to make sure that no chemicals are left.
In my experience (and others have done it also with no problems, in a salon and by themselves)) is that you CAN highlight over henna, as long as the henna has been good quality and not contained metallic salts. Henna might be a bit tougher to bleach out than color, maybe the same as if you had colored your whole head more than once. But if you just have a slight tint of marigold henna then it should lift pretty easily. If you had full-on flaming red it would be harder.
So if you decide to henna it doesn't mean that you can't have a few highlights as well.
Wildhoney
Wildhoney
20" dark honey blonde
Thick, wavy, medium texture
Goal: A lion's mane
"I will be brave or die trying"
I think I'm leaning towards trying the henna, and I hope it will produce good enough results so that I won't feel the need to highlight. It is so great to hear that I could actually highlight after the henna if I want to (well, I'd wait a few weeks anyway)
Feye, I don't think you will find Marigold Henna to be red at all. I didn't! I started out with the blonde shades out of fear! I found it gave a golden highlighted (natural highlighted) look, a glimmer of gold really. It fades over a couple of months. It would be nothing like chemical highlighting where you instantly "see" highlights. This would be a very subtle glimmer over all your hair. You would have to strand test to be sure of how it works on your hair, but with that color, I seriously doubt you'd have any red at all. Please keep in mind that I used Marigold by Rainbow Research. You might even be able to get some samples from them to test out colors. They also make a Golden Blonde, which to me was barely golden on my hair.
If I can dig up a picture of what it looked like on my natural hair color, I'll be sure to post it. I can't do it tonight because I hav a download going on, slowing down my connection to a crawl!
-Fox
17/35.5/35+ Type 2CMii (3B underneath layer) Somewhat fine, slightly wavy (with curls on the underneath layer), Hennaed Auburn. To see more pictures, click on the gallery collection link found here: Forever Fox
"Watch your thoughts, for they become words. Choose your words, for they become actions. Understand your actions, for they become habits. Study your habits, they will become your character. Develop your character for it becomes your destiny." -John MacArthur
Products Used:
Aubrey Organics S&C
Nature's Gate Conditioners (As well as Forest Pure, another brand made by the makers of Nature's Gate)
Vinegar/herbal rinses
The colour chart shows Marigold henna to be only gold, no red. And gold is a good colour on me. Red isn't.
You don't have to go search for the picture (It sounded time-consuming for you! But thank you for asking ) Your words described it very well. "very subtle glimmer over all your hair". Very nice! Thanks, Fox!
that's the henna that really tempted me to try henna
September 16 2004, 11:49 AM
The promise that a colored henna like the Marigold Henna (neutral henna with herbal colorants) could make my hair shinier, thicker, stronger, and a bit 'brighter' is something I find VERY attractive. But I never got around to trying this because the Rainbow brand can't be found around here and because I might want to color my few grays one day and having hennaed would pose a major obstacle. The one brand that's readily available is Colora Henna who offer their product in a wide range of colors including Buttercup and Wheat (don't those sound nice for me???). But henna just seems to be too much of a committment to me because of it's imcompatibility with haircoloring products.
give it up. You don't like doing it and it doesn't seem to work for you. Why do it? Water doesn't do me much good, as you can see in my before pic!
I don't wet bun my hair unless it is really hot outside and I want to keep a bit cooler. When I damp bun, it is just barely damp, I spritz it with water when dry, or let it pretty much dry and just bun it when it's slightly moist. I used to do that to get some curl into it, but I've discovered that oiling it slightly actually keeps the curl in better.
My hair is so fine I always use a leave-in conditoner or oil. Back when I actually went to a beauty school to have my hair done, I mentioned I had to have a conditioner, or she would never be able to comb my hair. She assured me that SHE didn't need to use a conditioner. So I just shut up and waited till she was done shampooing and rinsing out the conditioner. Not only was my clean hair imposible to comb, it was sticking like crazy to her fingers. The first time I used jojoba on my wet hair and it untangled I felt like I had just had my very own personal miracle!
You have beauuuutiful hair. Who cares if it doesn't damp bun?
Original style very, very short, been growing out for 12 years off and on.
Original color, auburn, now multicolored grey, auburn & white. Dyed auburn
1b to 1c with a curl around hairline underneath. Fii
Length 27" now trimmed to 24.5 April 24th
May 1st 25"!!!!!
I don't know WHY I continue to try this!!! I guess I just hate not being able to do something that I think would be beneficial periodically -- you know, another trick to put into the repetoire. Ok, so call me 'too stubborn for my own good'! LOL
Jojoba oil really is fantastic isnt' it? Now that you mention using it on wet hair I'll add that using oil as a leave-in is another thing I haven't been able to master. I just don't see how it can be applied evenly to damp hair length using my hands. I think a spray application of whatever you're using on the damp length is much more effective. Applying 'product' to a long length is just not the same experience as when hair is shorter, say BS or less. I can see applying oil on sopping wet hair in the shower and I've tried that but it seems to me I'm wasting it because it needs more in that situtation than once hair is completely dry. I'll just add this to my list of things I still need to master then! LOL
Thank you for your input and for your kinds words! You always make me laugh WCD
Damp bunning has never worked for me either, till I tweaked it and made it into something my hair liked.
Firstly, I bun while damp and not dripping wet. The hair is almost dry - the same time you would begin to blow dry, or you would put rollers in your hair. I too don't like to handle damp hair too much. Out of the shower I will comb my hair free of tangles, and then leave it till it dries. Just before I put my hair in a damp bun, I comb the scalp hair back to lay smooth, and then I put my hair up.
Secondly, the cinnamon bun is something that stopped working for me when I reached about 27-28". It is too tedious for me to do all of that twisting and rolling! I imagine the same is similar for you, with all that hair. I remembered a bun I used to do when I had long hair as a child - the Swirly Bun (it's in the Styling Station).
Cinnamon damp buns made my hair tangly and I had all sorts of problems. The swirly damp bun, however, made my hair soft and smooth and straighter after I took it down. It had almost the same effect as drying my hair on big rollers.
I hope these suggestions help, though everything doesn't really work for everyone. Let us know how your damp buns work out in the future!
Love,
~*Leia*~
2bNiii
18/33/35?
First goal: 30" in March <-- goal reached
Second goal: 33" by September <-- goal reached
Final goal: 35" in February 2005
Growing since January 2003, found TLHL end of June 2003 and was at 25"
For some reason I've always though damp bunning was a technique used after washing hair so all the hair on the head would be damp. But you and others have described damp as being closer to dry than to wet. I was looking to this as something I could do after showering and towel drying because I perceived that was damp hair. I was thinking that way I could have my hair up in a damp bun within 5-15 minutes after washing and that would be convenient since I could just leave the house for work or go about with my day without having to fuss with drying my hair.
But to get to the damp that's more dry than wet that would be much longer then 5-15 minutes, more like 30-45 minutes. If that's the right damp, then I don't see any point for me to do this at all really because it doesn't same me any time. Since I started daily oiling with jojoba oil I never mist my hair anymore because there doesn't seem to be any need to. I oil my length before bed and it takes no time at all and I can get right into bed. Wetting it at that time would require that I let it dry first (taking up time!) otherwise I could end up with kinks in it depending on how it dried loose over my pillow. If I misted it in the morning before putting my hair up for work I'd worry about kinks from being in an updo.
Well . . . [scratches head deep in thought], maybe I should just forget about damp bunning. The only time I could see doing this would be evenings while on a beach vacation.
Mostly because I don't wear my damp buns out anywhere, so I've never cared what they looked like! LOL! When I do it, I usually only wet the length, so the crown is never wet to start out with. I am sure it is tricky trying to get your hair to lay a certain way without combing it and having it al be wet!
I like to leave my wet hair wrapped up in a towel after washing, and later I put it in bun after taking the towel out and appling some oil. I know you don't like sleeping on wet hair and you have longer drying times that I do, so that routine probably would not work well for you.
I still haven't figured out if healthy hair dries faser or damaged hair. I always thought it was damaged hair since water absorbed, would certainly seep back out of those pin holes in the cuticle... don't you think? I know my ends always dry out faster than the rest of my hair, and I know the ends are in the worst shape! Anyway... that's another topic!
-Fox
17/35.5/35+ Type 2CMii (3B underneath layer) Somewhat fine, slightly wavy (with curls on the underneath layer), Hennaed Auburn. To see more pictures, click on the gallery collection link found here: Forever Fox
"Watch your thoughts, for they become words. Choose your words, for they become actions. Understand your actions, for they become habits. Study your habits, they will become your character. Develop your character for it becomes your destiny." -John MacArthur
Products Used:
Aubrey Organics S&C
Nature's Gate Conditioners (As well as Forest Pure, another brand made by the makers of Nature's Gate)
Vinegar/herbal rinses
Fox, you're right -- you aren't much help at all!!!!!!!!!!
But you know, after reading the responses so far I think I may have misunderstood why people were damp bunning. I'm not sure why I'd ever damp bun if it wasn't something I could do to make drying after a full wash more convenient. It would also be a great way to do a treatment if I could leave that in once a week when I'm at the office. I find air-drying so very inconvenient because I need to block so much time out for it, then make sure I find time to comb it out thoroughly once it's dry (this is a very important step for me after airdrying).
My understanding is the same as yours, that damaged hair dries faster, but other factors will play a part too such as hair texture, humidity level, and products used. The highlighted sections of my head are always the first to dry.
You could always just wet your length, apply your conditioner/oil, and wrap into a bun. Only the bun would be wet, and that would make keeping your front area styled easier. Is that any help?? I'm trying here... I don't know about Betty and Nitsa... we'll just have to shout louder for them! BEEEEEEEETTTTTTTYYYYYYY! NIIIIIIIIIITTTTTTTTTSAAAAAAAAAAA! Let's see if they come running now!
-Fox
17/35.5/35+ Type 2CMii (3B underneath layer) Somewhat fine, slightly wavy (with curls on the underneath layer), Hennaed Auburn. To see more pictures, click on the gallery collection link found here: Forever Fox
"Watch your thoughts, for they become words. Choose your words, for they become actions. Understand your actions, for they become habits. Study your habits, they will become your character. Develop your character for it becomes your destiny." -John MacArthur
Products Used:
Aubrey Organics S&C
Nature's Gate Conditioners (As well as Forest Pure, another brand made by the makers of Nature's Gate)
Vinegar/herbal rinses
Although I'm still not a big fan of treatments (because I don't find them much more beneficial than using a deep conditioner in the shower for a few minutes), I think damp bunning done for a treatment is something altogether different because then I'd be rinsing it out. Rinsing it out would mean my hair wouldn't be starting to dry in a bun, and that's a good thing.
But what you mentioned is a really excellent method of conditioning the length
Just in my case, since I seem to have no natural oils at all, when I started oiling my hair and it got healthier it dried faster because of the oils. Maybe this is only true for people with extremely dry hair in the first place. My hair still seems to take forever to dry now I'm used to the slightly faster drying time. Especially now I've figured out that I shouldn't touch it after the intial soppy wet detangle.
This turned into a really informative thread. Should we keep it?
Original style very, very short, been growing out for 12 years off and on.
Original color, auburn, now multicolored grey, auburn & white. Dyed auburn
1b to 1c with a curl around hairline underneath. Fii
Length 27" now trimmed to 24.5 April 24th
May 1st 25"!!!!!
So that won't help you at all! I will say that I do that when it's only slightly damp - to the point that I sometimes have to mist the very ends. But, that's not the info you need so I'll shut up now.
Avrilon
20"/29.25"/36"
2a - Wavy with body
F - fine
ii - normal volume, 4" ponytail
Growing out years of perms (about 3/4ths done!)
Blonde from a bottle
First let me say that you have beautiful hair! I love your current photo.
Second, it sounds as though you do not detangle your hair while it's wet. Reading further in this thread, I see that others do not, either, and all I can say is that if I did not, my hair would NEVER be detangled. Waiting until it's dry, or even just damp, causes unbelievable tangling. I think damp hair is the worst, because the drier sections stick to the wetter sections, causing max hair tangling grief. However, I have never, ever waited until dry to detangle. The thought sends shudders through me.
It was KT who reported about 2-3 years ago that wet hair naturally is more capable of stretching up to 20% longer than dry hair, and the important point of her information was that this is natural and undamaging for wet hair, though not not for dry hair, because dry hair loses this elasticity. Hence, detangling when wet should be perfectly fine, if using a comb and approaching the activity with usual standards of carefulness, of course.
Using a brush on wet hair is still a big no-no, as brushes grab hair in a way that combs do not. Brushes will stretch wet hair far more than it naturally can handle, going beyond the point of no return, meaning to where it cannot regain its dry shape.
Apparently my hair has passed the 70-inch mark (Husband measured last night; I'm so happy!). I have essentially no damage to my hair except for thinness at the very ends that is due to lack of education about the finer aspects of long hair care from years ago, and which is unrelated to combing while wet. I also know that I have remnants of some damage to a thin lock in the back of my hair from a watercraft ride 6 years ago, but I can't find that anymore.
I remember Teresa from TLHS also always detangled when her calf-length hair was fully wet, not waiting until damp or dry, and I don't think I've ever seen a head of hair more beautiful than hers. Also, I believe it was Karen Marie who suggested detangling with a wide-toothed comb while in the shower, even under the water.
Maybe you might find that trying this would be helpful? I don't know your past hair history, but it's an idea. Perhaps then your hair would damp bun with more success?
As for damp bunning, where I live, it gets humid. Even leaving my hair down after washing, it won't dry quickly because it is thick at the neck. Of course I can't leave it down for drying, but I'm also not going to blow it dry. So yeah, I damp "bun" my hair, putting it actually in my usual wrapped twisted updo based on the French twist, as I demonstrate at TLHS in the Hair Care/Styles section (5 1/2 years ago pix). It does tend to stay wet forever that way, but for what it's worth, my hair does not reflect any damage from this. In fact, if anything, I've noticed my overall hair volume has increased over these last many years. I think the trick is to make sure the updo is balanced, with no pulling strands, but this goes for anytime, and if a person's hair is very long, they have to deal with the extra weight anyhow.
Much good luck, and may your struggles smooth out,
Jennifer Eve
I don't think I've welcomed you to The Loom yet so WELCOME Jennifer!
And thank you for the compliment
I'm really so very glad to have someone with hair that's longer than mine to exchange ideas and experience with. Wow, 70 inches! Congratulations Jennifer!!!
So you too are using damp bunning successfully in your air-drying process then. Others have mentioned the dampness level is more towards dry so perhaps I'll just have to try doing this more as a mid-to-end drying process than immediately after hair has stopped dripping.
No wait, before this week's experiment with fully wet but not dripping hair that's what I'd been trying that I was completely unhappy with and the reason I tried this with much wetter, damp hair.
Perhaps I just need to find the right level of dampness for my damp bun, so the hair close to the scalp can be arranged or combed to lay attractively in an updo and also not pull. I just know I've tried this so many times and have never been happy with it except once when I scrunched and put hair in a topknot to go to a party. But that time my length was SO tangled even though it looked fabulous. Though wavy, my hair is safer from tangling when straighter.
I can't even remember how long ago it was now but I think it was years ago, that Karen Marie shared her method for detangling in the shower under the spray of the water. That really caught my attention and I've been detangling this way when I wash ever sine, with no further detangling until hair is dry.
The problem is more with damp bunning. Perhaps I should explain further. After my damp hair has been in a bun for a while, the hairs arrange themselves in clumps that are like ropes rather than smoothly together as one mass. Only my sopping wet hair (or dry hair) lays together smooth. This is just what wavy hair does but the result is that when I take down a damp bun, the hairs are 'set' in each of the wavy ropes as though styled with curling tools and products. The hair within each rope is released from the others in the rope more and more as hair dries.
Sorry for taking so long to get back to ya. And thanks for the congrats. Husband has to do a trim soon, maybe this evening, so we'll trim my hair back to 70 inches exactly, my plan. I'm aiming for 72 'cuz it's eggzactlee 6 feet.
I admit that sopping wet bunning is really heavy for my scalp, so yeah, damp bunning is more successful in my hair, but it's mostly a weight reason. I don't see a hair health problem with it as long as the weight is evenly spread over my scalp. In fact, my hair is damp bunned right now at work (Infinity Bun). What I usually read from other women is how incredibly soft damp bunning makes their hair. I do know that my hair is super duper soft when damp, but honestly, I've never even considered whether wet or damp bunning did any good for my hair. I put it up because I can't and won't deal with all the tangles that leaving my wet/damp hair down would bring. Aacckk!
Aha, so you, too, detangle while under the water in the shower. I created a poll over at LHC about this matter (when do people detangle after washing), but I didn't include that option, hmmm, a failure of mine. I was considering only AFTER the fact, not thinking that some might not detangle afterward because they had already detangled while in the shower. Duh, Jennifer...
Are you not fond of your wavy hair? The reason I ask, now that I think of it, is because a lot of wavies seem to like the effect that damp bunning increases their waves. You know yourself how the longer your hair grows, the more it pulls waves out, so lifting your hair up will sort-of lighten the mass, especially the scalp hair, which could encourage your hair's waves to wave. Maybe that's why the locks are clumping, because they want to be wavy?
Ever try detangling once again after drying off and before putting your hair up in a bun? I bet that way you could encourage the straightness, if that's what you want. I also tend to comb thru my length after each wrap around while I bun, so to keep things neater. Maybe doing that would help strighten more. Hmmm, also, do you start the bun with an elastic band at the base/nape, or without? Maybe that would hold the scalp hair flatter? I don't do this, but I've never had any waves in my hair aside from those times eons ago when I got perms (aacckk again), so I'm sorry to be of little help. :-/
My hair guru, Eddie, did suggest that a pre-detangling of hair while still in the shower with a wide toothed comb, dipping the comb into and coating with one's conditioner and using the power of shower water streaming down is an acceptable method of detangling wet hair. He mentioned that this was particularly useful for curly hair types.
I also know that there exist on the market many creme rinses which are different from conditioners in that this product is meant to assist with detangling....wet hair, I believe. I know that the GM line carries such a creme rinse for this specific purpose. Creme rinses are also supposed to assist with reducing tangling issues overall, as I understand it. Anyway, it's a thought to consider looking into.
I need to think about elasticity. I may have some notes somewhere about this topic. Like you say, Jennifer Eve, some stretching is acceptable but there is a point of no return whether wet or dry. Those squirrely hairs that sometimes appear in our hair that might loop back on itself or is wavy in a pattern that is most unlike the rest of our hair often is an overly stressed hair.
I completely agree that detangling wet hair with a brush is just asking for trouble, but for many, detangling wet hair with a wide toothed comb can work out. However, for my hair specifically, detangling while wet is quite problematic. And my hair guru advised against it for me. (I once had a situation in a salon where they used all the creme rinse in the world and it was a tangled knotty mess. It took nearly 2 hours to smooth my hair out enough for them to do a microtrim. That was the last time I ever trimmed wet! Yep, live & learn!)
It is so interesting how different things work for even very similar hair types!
How annoying is that? Write a response and somehow never post it.
I simply wanted to expand on the subject of hair rinses, noting that like the ACV rinse, they're most useful in situations where people have hard water, which means that I actually don't have a lot of experience with them, as I have a whole-house water softener. That said, when I travel away from home, I always try to find out what the water is like at my destination, if I'll be there long enough to require washing my hair. If it's hard water, I've brought along creme rinses. Aubrey Organics makes three rinses, two of which I've tried: the Egyptian Henna Shine-Enhancing Clean Rinse, and the Green Tea Finishing Cream Rinse, both of which I liked well enough. I've not tried their BGA Protein + Strengthening Cream Rinse, but it sounds interesting. Generally, I'm not a fan of AO shampoos, but their rinses seem pretty good, for the little I've tried them.
What an amazing accomplishment! You're really inspiring!
-Fox
17/35.5/35+ Type 2CMii (3B underneath layer) Somewhat fine, slightly wavy (with curls on the underneath layer), Hennaed Auburn. To see more pictures, click on the gallery collection link found here: Forever Fox
"Watch your thoughts, for they become words. Choose your words, for they become actions. Understand your actions, for they become habits. Study your habits, they will become your character. Develop your character for it becomes your destiny." -John MacArthur
Products Used:
Aubrey Organics S&C
Nature's Gate Conditioners (As well as Forest Pure, another brand made by the makers of Nature's Gate)
Vinegar/herbal rinses
I am not really sure how to help you with your quick styling damp bun. Jennifer may of hit on a good point about combing hair out in the shower so that you don't have to detangle afterwards.
I feel damp buns as well as just plain misting my lengh occasionally are very good for my hair. My hair loves the extra moisture.
But, my damp buns are more like what Leia and Avrilon described.
When I tried to put my hair up while it was still wet my sclap area looked awful because the hairs seperate in clumps.
What I do is let my hair mostly dry and then put it up. I also remoisten the length by misting it with rose water before I bun because the length drys before the nap of my neck and scalp do.
I know this didn't really help you at all, I guess I just want to say good luck:)
Dark Brown hair with Reddish highlights
Length 33" Fine and Wavy
Henna for color and strength
Herbal washes and rinses,
Misting with Rose Water
Jojoba, Aloe Vera Gel and Jatamansi oil. (Spikenard)
It seems that as I mentioned in an earlier post in this thread, I've misunderstood what damp buns are as well as how and why they are used!
When my hair is freshly washed there's enough moisture in it to simply bun to style into smooth waves. I don't need to mist it or make a bun with damp, almost dry hair for that. In fact misted or damp hair might just end up with kinks in it if I bunned it. I'm going to stick with bunning DRY hair. But it's good to know I can also bun fully wet hair if ever I see a reason to do this, like for a treatment or when on a beach vacation.
I don't think damp bunning would be either good for my hair or bad for my hair. But the fact is, I can't put my hair up neatly unless it's almost dry, and I won't settle for a sloppy, lumpy bun and rumpled scalp. I have an image to keep up, you know.
I am a consistant damp bunner. My life is just much easier when I damp bun. I do it for several reasons.
1. I find my damaged length doesn't get dry and crunchy nearly as quickly after a fresh wash if I have put jojoba oil over damp hair and then put it in a bun for several hours. It is my experience that the oil keeps the water trapped in my hair for a longer period of time....days even... When my hair is like this, it tangles less and looks better.
I KNOW it's not just the oil giving me that affect because oil applied to my dry hair simply makes my hair become "cruncy" more quickly.
2. If I try to let my hair dry while down, it will undoubtably get frizzy and tangled. The bun keeps my hair in place during this fragile time....up and out of the way.
3. I love the soft waves that hair drying in a damp bun creates. My hair is just much smoother and easier to maintain between washings if it has dried in a bun.
Of course it's not for everyone, but just wanted to talk about the positives I've experienced.
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However I do see the benefits and would gladly incorporate the method into my haircare routine if I could (and maybe have NO splits like Karen Marie! 
). I am one of those who believe water IS moisture and feel there are benefits to frequent washing that last longer than after hair has dried. But I wash only weekly because I find that more convenient due to the length of time it takes to dry my hair. To me damp bunning would be a treatment if I could only get it right.
