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by anonymous (no login)

how many pod freshman for 2002-2003?

Posted on Sep 4, 2002, 9:05 PM
from IP address 205.188.208.42

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Don't know who to believe?

by Daniel (no login)

I interviewed many podiatrists in different areas of the state that I live in. They were all very happy with their podiatric career. One even stated that podiatry is like medical school. Later, this doc stated that pod surgical residents work hard like MD residents and the attendings kill the pod residents.

Was it a waste of time, to have met with all of them? I mean would they be afraid to share any of the problems that the podiatry profession is having?

The docs that I met with had graduated from a few to many years ago. Several have graduated within three to five years ago. One had graduated eleven years ago. Two, graduated in the late eighties.

Thanks for any response.

Posted on Sep 4, 2002, 7:05 AM
from IP address 24.161.139.188

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Re: Don't know who to believe?

by Anonymous (no login)

Why would they be afraid to share "bad" information on the profession? I think you did the right thing by going and visiting with different podiatrists. Maybe you should visit with or call podiatrists in an area you think you may be interested in practicing in the future. The profession does not have a lot of "jobs" available to new practioners because of our small numbers and the fact that most practice until they retire, so to establish relationships with doctors in an area you are interested in may be a good idea. I have a friend that did this and he is very well compensated for his efforts in his group practice. I opened on my own and am doing well. If you depend on a "job" you may be offered low saleries and little benefits. You need to either open on your own or find an ethical podiatrist who is willing to compensate you fairly and allow you to buy into the established practice. Or you can work for someone and save up enough money to open up on your own. I know of 2 pods that did this in my area and are doing very well. All 16 podiatrists I worked with during my 3rd year of residency are doing very well and all of the podiatrists in my area are doing very well. Good luck to you.

Posted on Sep 4, 2002, 12:05 PM
from IP address 64.196.60.17

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Kaiser is hiring!!!

by F.Y.I. (no login)


Hiring:
Podiatrist
Details

Company: Kaiser Permanente
Location: US-CA-Baldwin Park
Base Pay: N/A
Employee Type: Full-Time Employee
Industry: Healthcare - Health Services

Job Type: Medical Professional - Care Giver
Required Education: Contact Company
Required Experience: Contact Company
Required Travel: Contact Company
Relocation Covered: No


Description

Health care is changing. Kaiser Permanente leads the way. More than eight million people rely on us for their healthcare. Join our outstanding team and make a difference...every day. Our quality of care is unmatched and so are our health care careers. Employment opportunities are available throughout our California Region, made up of 28 acute care hospitals, including two specialty tertiary centers and 120 ambulatory care centers. Our 85,000 employees and more than 7,000 physicians provide the highest quality of care to over 6 million members. Come join our award winning team and enhance your skills in a full time, part time or per diem position.We are an EEO/AA employer. Women, Minority, Veterans and disabled workers are encouraged to apply.





Education/License/Certification:
CA Podiatric license. BLS. DPM degree.


Qualifications:
DEA license, minimum 2-year surgical residency training.


Preferred:
Board certified ABPS.


Duties:
All aspects of Forefoot and Rear foot surgery, (including reconstruction and trauma management). Medical and surgical approaches and treatment to various foot disorders. Treatment of the diabetic and percipheral vascular patient including ulcer management. Inpatient management of all post-op patient and patient’s admitted for infractions. Biomechanical approach with padding, orthotic support of various foot problems.


Skills:


Note:
Vacancy in an existing position : Dr. Darrell Paul

Job Category: Patient Care Services (Non-Nursing)

Position Type: Full-Time Regular

Shift: Days

Hours Per Week: 40

Requirements

none specified

Contact Information



Posted on Sep 4, 2002, 12:56 AM
from IP address 63.214.203.82

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Kaiser

by Anomalous (no login)

Of course it's great that this Kaiser is looking for a podiatrist.

But take this in context. First, as you can see, they have stringent requirements. What percentage of pods have this kind of training and experience? Second, do you know how many people in CA would be clawing at the door to get this job?

Don't get me wrong, it's definitely a great opportunity. The problem is that they don't come around very often and they are only available to a minority of podiatrists.

When I was a 2nd year in 1995, we had a rep from Kaiser come to our school to talk to us. Everybody knew that a position with Kaiser as a DPM was coveted and we were all excited to hear what she had to say. That is until she told us how many job positions are available nationwide for DPM's. She said that there were NO job openings for the current year and that, typically, there are one and maybe two in a normal year. Nationwide.

I'm not trying to be a downer, just stating what I heard back then and what I hear these days.

Posted on Sep 4, 2002, 12:45 PM
from IP address 63.203.100.199

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Hire ONE Podiatrist

by Anonymous (no login)

Kaiser is huge. Has a few hundred hospitals and Surgical Centers. And they are hiring ONE podiatrist.
Someone who is the absolutely best trained.

Is this an example of something in podiatry is going right?

ONE job.

Posted on Sep 5, 2002, 11:37 PM
from IP address 67.24.15.81

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Kaiser hiring one podiatrist.

by Anonymous (no login)

This is great. Kaiser hires a podiatrist at $100,000 a year instead of hiring an orthopedist at $300,000 a year to do foot and ankle. It is an economic decision.
The cheapest provider to do the service gets the job.
When more Podiatrists can do foot and ankle surgery, the pay will go to $80,000 for the newist hire.

Posted on Sep 6, 2002, 2:04 PM
from IP address 67.26.42.131

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Re: Kaiser hiring one podiatrist.

by Anonymous (no login)

The sole reason that they pay 100 K (as if you're complaining) is simply because they can. An orthopedic surgeon is worth 300 K a year. He is a complete physician and can do much more than any DPM could dream of.

Dont make DPMs out to be what they are definately not.

Posted on Sep 9, 2002, 9:57 AM
from IP address 65.100.215.207

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Chirporactor Rx

by Lauren (no login)

My DC recently tried to give me some pharmaceutical grade muscle relaxers called scolaxen - spelling? I asked him if DCs can Rx and he said "only for certain conditions". Is this true? I didnt take the bogus-looking drugs and I havent seen him since. Any Ideas?

Thank you,
Lauren

Posted on Sep 3, 2002, 6:16 PM
from IP address 65.100.215.207

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Re: Chirporactor Rx

by Anonymous (no login)

I don't know of the spelling of the drug you mention. Many DC's in many states can RX botanical, homeopathic and nutritional items that are only available by companies that sell to Physicians only. Some states DC's can recommend or give OTC drugs. RX drugs or Legend drugs are not prescribed by DC's at this time in the USA.

Posted on Sep 3, 2002, 11:36 PM
from IP address 65.33.191.74

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Re: Chirporactor Rx

by Anonymous (no login)

Chiropractors started out with a bogus science and they have elevated themselves to be at a higher plane than Podiatrists. All groups are doing better than dem good ol corn cutters.

Posted on Sep 4, 2002, 12:02 AM
from IP address 67.24.13.173

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practicing medicine w/o a license

by John Casey (no login)

If the drug was Skelaxin, it is a prescription medication (muscle relaxer)which he did not have the authority to prescribe or dispense (unless he has a legitimate medical credential). He should be reported to his licensing board for practicing medicine w/o a license.
J. Casey, PA-C

Posted on Sep 10, 2002, 5:43 PM
from IP address 216.189.32.74

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Nurse Anesthetist?

by Anonymous (no login)

Are nurse anesthetist programs difficult to get into? What are the political issues regarding them? Are they as capable as anesthesiologists?

I would appreciate anyones insight to the profession of the nurse anesthetist

Thanks

Posted on Sep 2, 2002, 2:59 AM
from IP address 65.100.215.207

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Re: Nurse Anesthetist?

by Anonymous (no login)

Yes, they are difficult to get into. You also have a significant time commitment before you can even consider applying.

You must have a BSN degree first (Hence the Nurse part). In addition to that you must have some experience in ER, ICU or OR nursing. Most of this in not what nurses typically start with right out of school. Plan on at least of few years of working before putting in an application.

Posted on Sep 2, 2002, 2:28 PM
from IP address 63.50.72.43

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Look at Merritt College

by (no login)

Go to my message on July 25th and follow the thread. I hope you can find the web page at:

www.samuelmerritt.edu.

I did not pursue my search beyond looking at the web page so I do not know if the DPM degree is acceptable.
Good Luck!

Posted on Sep 3, 2002, 12:47 AM
from IP address 216.119.8.34

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CRNA

by cma (no login)

Part of your text asks if CRNAs are as competent as Anesthesiologists. They are not. Anesthesiologists are MDs or DOs. CRNAs typically have a 2 year nursing degree. Even if they have a 4 year degree, it doesn't compare to an Anesthesiologist's education. Nurses take science courses that are watered down compared to what you had in undergrad. Generally CRNAs have experience in ICU nursing and know quite abit, but don't have the overall integration of knowledge and training that MDs have.

Nursing has a long history of administering anethetics. The surgeons wanted to operate. They didn't want to drop ether. They got their nurse to do it.

the development of Anesthesiology as a specialty has done more to promote safe anesthesia than you may know.

Studies show that patients are significantly safer in the hands of an anesthesiologist than a CRNA

CRNAs do not provide 68% of anesthetics. They may be involved in some large number, but mostly they are practicing under a physician.

To say that CRNAs and Anesthesiologists are equivalent would be the same as saying an RN (2 year degree) could take a one year course in Podiatric Medicine and Surgery and be equivalent to a DPM. ( I know CRNA is 2 years, my analogy holds in that MDAnesth. do 4 or 5 years of residency and DPMs do 2.

Posted on Sep 7, 2002, 6:48 PM
from IP address 209.183.88.75

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cma - CRNA

by Facts (no login)

You are incorrect, very incorrect. You need to visit several of the sights pertaining to CRNAs including the association of nurse anesthetists and read the FACTS and replace your opinions.

I have worked with several CRNAs in oral, facial, and plastic surgeries and think that they are very good. I have even seen them in action in OB cases with my wife who needed regional and epidural anesthetics who was all performed by a 'redident' CRNA. I was very impressed and sought others opinions because I was fairly new to the profession (a few months ago.

I almost sense a little haste or what not. Is it because you are a DPM without a job? Go to gasworks.com and look at what CRNAs aare startin out at. 100-220 K a year INCLUDING benefits of everykind and usually a hefty sign on bonus 10-20 K.

CRNAs are often the sole providers in 80% of the anesthetics in rural and community hospitals. They do neuro, peds, hearts, eyes, OB, PODIATRY, oral, facial, plactics, and general surgeries.

In conversing with my doctor, my foot doctor, who i fact is a DPM, he relayed that he uses them every single time in the OR.

He crackled and said something to this extent 'What MD would want to provide drugs for a pod case?' We laughed because I understood his humor just in knowledge of reading your kind of post. Its ok buddy, we all get hosed once or twice in life.

Posted on Sep 9, 2002, 9:51 AM
from IP address 65.100.215.207

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my reply

by cma (no login)

no everything I wrote is correct. I'm an Anesthesiologist. I said CRNAs aren't as well trained as an anesthesiologist. They are not.
I didn't say they were incompetent.
Only one state allows CRNAs to function independently New Hampshire. Everywhere else they work under an MDA or the surgeon.
My initial message was an answer to the question are CRNAs and MDAs equivalent. I don't know why anyone would say they are.

Posted on Sep 10, 2002, 3:09 PM
from IP address 209.183.88.81

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Are you positive?

by Anonymous (no login)

You say that your original post was accurate.

Are you really sure?

Please, please, please, tell me which CRNA programs are accepting ADN nurses. I have never heard of one. In fact, I can't think of any masters level program that accepts people with 2 year degrees. Can you?

CRNA programs REQUIRE a BSN (that's 4 years), along with AT LEAST one year of ICU, ER, etc. Which are generally not entry level nursing positions.

That you don't have basic information about this makes the rest of your material suspect. I haven't looked into specific numbers as far as the % of anesthesia provided by CRNAs, but I certainly won't accept your figures, since I know your other information is not accurate.

Cheers.

Posted on Sep 10, 2002, 10:02 PM
from IP address 63.50.65.166

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Absolutely Factual

by Anonymous (no login)

CRNAs do provide 68% of all the anesthetics administered yearly.
source: cnn.com search, association of nurse anesthetists, and several other web sites, including conversing with a CRNA in my city.

They are very similar to NPs and PAs in the aspect they provide a much needed service at an effective cost especially in rural cities. No programs accept ASNs. You must have a BSN.

NH is not the only state that allow CRNAs to work w/out a physician. There are 28 or 29 states that allow the CRNA to work without the direct supervision of a MDA.

I to ask why 'cma' is a MDA on the pod forum? I highly doubt you are a MDA. I highly doubt you even know a MDA.

You cannot argue with me on this one. I am an OR nurse and have been for 8 years. I have worked along side CRNAs and MDAs. MDAs are all big-headed and seem to only care about their handicap in golf and their new Mercedes S500. It seems like the only one who actually cares about patients needs and interests are RNs and APRNs. All MDs care about is whether or not someone is going to take over their job like a CRNA over a MDA.

You better do all your homework on nursing before posting. The research you do should also be credible and not some crazy thought you dreamed up while in the dental chair under nitrous oxide having a apicoectomy performed.

Posted on Sep 11, 2002, 12:01 AM
from IP address 65.100.215.207

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again

by cma (no login)

I looked at my original message and you are right. I said the typical CRNA has a 2 year degree. The typical Crna does indeed have a 4 year degree. There are CRNAs who do have a 2 year RN.
I don't think anything else I wrote is grossly incorrect or inflammatory.
I was a DPM but returned to MD school and completed a residency in Anesthesiology.
My handicap would be about 35 I drive a Volkswagen.
Why am I at this site?
I've been wondering the same for about 4 weeks.

Posted on Sep 12, 2002, 11:29 PM
from IP address 209.183.88.104

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What a job offer!

by (no login)

Long day at the links, finally getting to see pod notes. I have to disagree with some who disparge this young pod-if someone is so dumb that they believe the Podiatric Vascular Neurosurgon's will accept a podiatrist after he or she has been tainted by an ortho practice-they're in big trouble.

It sounds more like an hallicnatory episode.

By the way I got my DPM in the USA and I'm proud to say it.

Posted on Sep 1, 2002, 5:03 PM
from IP address 64.157.146.83

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wondering

by anony (no login)

As I was cleaning my basement I had a stack of old Podiatry Today mag.AsI flipped through an April 2000 issue on page 12 there was an article on the decline of enrollment in pod schools and how the apma hoped to increase the applicant pool to 3000 by the year 2005. I have a feeling that they are off on that number, but I don't know by how much.
What is the number of incoming 1st year students for the 2002-2003 school year? What efforts have been made to increase awareness of podiatry? What type of outreach has any of the schools done in order to educate people as early as high school about the career of podiatry? Besides the CD rom that was mailed to MCAT takers, what else has been done to at least bring the numbers up to where they should be?

Posted on Sep 1, 2002, 10:59 AM
from IP address 64.12.96.200

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Podiatry advertising

by Anomalous (no login)

I also view and contribute to www.studentdoctor.net and there was a post on the pre-allopathic portion about podiatry sending out mailings to physician hopefuls.

The consensus is that it's annoying, embarassing for the profession and the pre-meds simply throw them in the trash.

Check for yourself

Posted on Sep 1, 2002, 2:45 PM
from IP address 64.167.76.232

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Why? What is the problem?

by (no login)

I don't understand. Podiatry is a great profession. They are Doctors and wear beepers and scrubs.
They do big operations in the OR. They earn 90,000
in the first year, a little less then Medical doctors, but soon make 200,000 and 300,000 and 400,000.
It is a 5 day week with no call and no evening work.

There are thousands of students wanting to be podiatrists. It is very competitive and another school is opening up. That is urgent. There is a shortage of podiatrists as the country is aging and there are more sports injuries.

Podiatry schools everywhere are getting into the MD Medical Centers.

You are sadly mistaken. Podiatry is great and doing better.

The future is so bright, I gotta wear shades.

Posted on Sep 1, 2002, 11:52 PM
from IP address 67.24.14.131

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The future seems bright

by Anomalous (no login)

because you're wearing blinders, not shades.

Posted on Sep 3, 2002, 12:31 PM
from IP address 63.206.141.225

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Help Wanted

by (no login)

Podiatrist with a 12 month surgical residency. Attractive NY location. Great location.
36 hour week. 4 nursing homes. Office and Hospital surgery if qualified. $36,000, malpractice,
2 week vacation.

Posted on Sep 1, 2002, 10:16 AM
from IP address 63.215.172.155

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Resume'

by Anonymous (no login)

$36 K is unreal for a man/woman who has undergone approx. 8-12 years of school. I can make that managing a Burger King.

Posted on Sep 2, 2002, 1:49 AM
from IP address 65.100.215.207

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Work in Fast Food offers Better Pay than Podiatrics

by Alan Blankenship (no login)

Actually, I used to work at Wendy's before podiatry "school". I was an asst. manager, the starting pay was 45K, 40 hour work week, no weekends,(no college required but preferred), full benefits package (med/dent/disability, 401K) three full weeks vacation).

Compared with podiatry, these are true benefits and a nice lifestyle.

Posted on Sep 3, 2002, 1:05 PM
from IP address 134.174.157.123

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Alan

by Anonymous (no login)

Really! I cant believe that they pay 45K, are you positive that is the correct amount? Pretty good pay to make sure the fries are done and salted and to make sure the beef is lined up with the bun.

Posted on Sep 3, 2002, 10:23 PM
from IP address 65.100.215.207

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Re: Work in Fast Food offers Better Pay than Podiatrics

by Anonymous (no login)

Golly gee Alan, there's always time to go back to fast food biz. What kind of residency did you do? Or did you? I bet you make a mean burger!

Posted on Sep 3, 2002, 11:56 PM
from IP address 63.212.144.252

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Re: Work in Fast Food offers Better Pay than Podiatrics

by Anonymous (no login)

Great job at Wendys but you would miss the smell of the grinding of the mycotic nails.

Posted on Sep 4, 2002, 12:03 AM
from IP address 67.24.13.173

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Food service

by Marc Wright, DPM (no login)

I worked as an assistant manager in an upscale restaurant while going to UCLA full-time (believe it or not). This was back in 1986-87 and, all told, I was making about 35k with vacation, sick leave and all the free filet mignon, etc. I could eat. This did not require a college education either.

Posted on Sep 4, 2002, 12:49 PM
from IP address 63.203.100.199

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2 Year Pod iatry "Resident" works at Wendy's-PROUD

by Alan Blankenship (no login)

To the the reactitionary comments made by "anonoymous"
I take great pride in what I do, I do not steal, have demosntrated integrity/ethics, and would never sell surgery or take money from the federal govt. to perform pedicures or cosmetic bunion surgery on otherwise healthy geriatric patients. I work in fast food, charge a fair price, and make people feel better-since I am in the people business.

Indeed the salary is 45K for the asst. manager position and my responsibilities included training people, administrative -financial duties. There was a full, tangible benefits package w/o the BS incentives/"bonuses that permeate the problematic podiatry "profession." I have the W2s and H&R Tax forms for my employment since I am an employee not a devastating 1099 that also permeates podiatry.

Also, I was rigorously interviewed on two days for Wendy's, there were 12 other candidates for the one position. Compared with podiatry school applicant crisis, that is much more competition and Wendy's selected from other well-qualiifed applicants. Podiatry has less than 300 APPLICANTS for 600-700 seats.
And yes, I completed a 2 year "residency in "surgery" however, the training was so inconsitent and slip shot ( I was basically a private practice lackie driving to and fro to clip and do hammertoeing for 28K!?) that I decided to go back to fast food franchising because of the benefits, the salary, the 40 work week, and the job stays at the job. Furthermore, the hoop jumping to get onto to HMOs and theuseless money begging podiatry societies was even more of a joke that I thankfully got out. Good luck to all.

Posted on Sep 5, 2002, 1:30 PM
from IP address 134.174.157.203

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Honest work

by Center For Peer Review Justice, Inc (no login)

Alan,

When the truth comes out, one would be shocked at the number of Podiatrists who no longer do podiatry. They call me and I sense "shame" and "embarrissment". However, I see "anger" taking its place.

The Schools either don't recognize the Internet or they just ignore it. Either way, it is quite shortsighted. A far better way would be for a representative from each school to read this Forum and the others and participate by answering questions
and by adding their comments.

What do they have to lose? They can't fill 1/2 of their classes now and in the past years. Why not try something new?

Podiatry Colleges, I am not waiting for your comments.

We, the individuals who hold DPM degrees would only want more applicants to our schools as then our degrees have more value.

The Center For Peer Review Justice, Inc.

Posted on Sep 5, 2002, 8:09 PM
from IP address 67.24.12.44

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Ashamed

by Jeffrey C. Davids, DPM (no login)

Let's see - $36k a year. 52 weeks. 36 hours a week. Break it all down...$19.23 an hour.

I know somebody who is a Customer Service Representative (ie: answers phones for a company) and makes $35k a year. Works 37.5 hours a week. Didn't have to spend 4 years in college, plus 4 years in podiatry school, plus a one year residency.

You should be ashamed.

Jeffrey C. Davids, DPM

Posted on Sep 2, 2002, 11:10 AM
from IP address 152.163.189.129

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On Want Ads

by Resident (no login)

I saw that ad posted. It is genuine. I bet that he gets plenty of applicants. I expected to get a job for
$105,000, but I know some of my friends without a job.

Posted on Sep 2, 2002, 9:58 PM
from IP address 67.25.9.245

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Just say no

by Anonymous (no login)

All of those seeking employment-just say no to these offers. This guy is going to have some poor chap working 36 hours a week probably bringing in 150-200,000 for him and than pay this kind of money! Know what you are worth! What about a new practioner union?

Posted on Sep 4, 2002, 3:10 PM
from IP address 64.196.60.17

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MONEY MONEY

by Rich DPM (no login)

I am a 1st year student. My local OrthoPod offered to pay for my Podiatry school in return for a minimum of 5 years of service with him for $500,000 per year. I know that's not much but I geuss I'll take it. I have already been offered a 6 year residency wich I will do with the MD's as an orthopaedic residency when I finish school. Just wondering what I should do after my 5 year obligation? Maybe I'll go into Podiatric Cardiac Vascular Surgery or maybe Podiatric Neurology. Ah! The choices are unlimited! Only the millionaires may respond to this post!

Posted on Aug 31, 2002, 9:50 PM
from IP address 66.171.25.21

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Re: MONEY MONEY

by REAL DPM (no login)

I hope that this is a big joke. Because for one as a DPM you wouldnt get a 6 year residency if your dad was the president of the United States. There is no such thing as the specialities you are talking about (not as a DPM). And if you can make $500,000 a year you are set for life. 500 K a year is only about $41 K a month. Nice try buddy. Maybe you should talk to the DPM caddy.

You are going to clip nails, calluses, maybe do some forefoot bunion surgery, but you are so far out in left field I believe there to be no hope for you. Maybe you should check in to psychiatry.

Posted on Sep 1, 2002, 3:07 AM
from IP address 65.100.215.207

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It was a joke

by Anon (no login)

I'm pretty sure is was a joke. I'm only saying this because there wasn't one word in it that was possible true.

Posted on Sep 1, 2002, 2:47 PM
from IP address 64.167.76.232

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Real DPM

by Rich DPM (no login)

Thanks. Another great option-Podiatric Mental Therapist. I would rather do Podiatric Neuro-surgery. How about the podiatric neonatal intensive care unit PNICU! I just laugh at all the MD's. They have no availability for work diversity as we Pods! As I said before u can't respond to this post unless u make at least $1,000,000 per year! Let's hear from a Podiatric Thoracic Surgeon this time or at least a Podiatric Oncology Radiologist.

Posted on Sep 1, 2002, 6:51 PM
from IP address 66.171.26.88

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Rich DPM, Podiatric Neuro Surgeon Here

by Neuro Surgeon (no login)

I wanted to be a podiatric neuro surgeon once, after pod school I went and talked to hospitals about my wanted speciality. I have been here in this institution for the last 4 years. They locked me up immediately. I was diagnosed with some dilusional disorder that is said to only affect DPMs like you and I. Run for you life or I will see you here soon. They are all out to get us.

Run!
PodNeruoSurgeon

PS If you do wanna come here, the food isnt that bad and I just got a corner room with a window that has a great view, whoo hoo!

Posted on Sep 4, 2002, 12:36 PM
from IP address 65.100.215.207

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SADstate

by podluv (no login)

To make it in podiatry #1 you must be hardworking, #2 You must have business sense, #3 You have to have some type of personality and not be a total jerk, #4 you cant be a Immature whiner and finally you cant spend the majority of your time posting on the podiatry forum only losers do that.
enough said

Posted on Sep 2, 2002, 9:25 AM
from IP address 206.149.204.47

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Bad negotiation

by (no login)

Son, others will laugh at you for only accepting $500,000 after all of those years of training. The Orthopedic is getting you after only a 100,000 payment on your tuition. By the time you finish your excellent right toe, left toe, heel, bunion, forefoot, rearfoot, ankle and pimple Podiatric Surgical Residency, the going rate for Podiatrists like yourself might be 800,000 a year!! Don't sell yourself short. You know what the APMA states that the elderly are getting older and the Pods dont wear beepers, and lady DPMs can still do what ladys do ohhh so well, and DPMs are part of the mainstream of Medicine and on the healthcare team. Yeah and so are the Housekeeping staff.

It's the "Lies of Podiatry" Sad, but true.

Posted on Sep 1, 2002, 9:58 AM
from IP address 63.215.172.155

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N Y Podiatrist

by Realist (no login)

800,000 K a year? That is so far fetched it is unreal. Look at the average for orthopedic surgeons who do much more complicated work than a DPM the AVERAGE is somewhere around 3-350 K a year. Never will a pod make that kind of money and never will he get the residency to train him in complex rearfoot, trauma, and ankle surgery and if they did it would be a diamond in the rough. You should check out this link and see what the average, mean, and low salaries are for a ortho in practice 3 years. (link at bottom)

Be realistic. For a pod to even do those kind of surgeries in a healthcare system of today, they would need to get a ref. from a 'gatekeeper' who in most cases would never refer to a DPM, would you want a DPM to do your complex ankle surgery or a orthopedic surgeon? Me, personally? I would take the MD/DO ortho anyday. I would see my DPM for digital problems or forefoot disorders.

I am not trying to discredit DPMs, I have seen them for several problems and they (for the most part - another story) were pretty good. Leave complex procedures up to the orthos unless the training is suitable and proper.

http://www.physicianssearch.com/physician/salary2.html

Disclaimer: My opinions only

Posted on Sep 2, 2002, 2:01 AM
from IP address 65.100.215.207

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Bye bye those who have not chosen the way of Podiatry

by (no login)

I'll be at the Clubhouse for lunch and get to use the computer. There are four podiatrists here today-as guests-and they are sitting with some of the other doctors, it looks like they are trying to drum up some business-maybe they got they're c-phones and pagers to go off simultaneously to seem important. I'm not aloud in the dining room, being a caddy and all, but these guys are loud. The pods are high-fiving each other and talking loudly about this or that procedure they've done. One of the RDs from the table came back into the locker room and threw up. He said that he couldn't believe these guys were here-after all its a day off. he said it'd been a better day watching his wife shop than watch four hip-hop podiatrists drum up business.
I had to clean the puke off the shoes. Its my job.
Tell me please, you think you got it bad?

Posted on Aug 31, 2002, 11:03 AM
from IP address 67.25.23.152

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Caddy

by Anonymous (no login)

I think that you need to get off the forum and get a real job. Carrying a rich mans golf clubs and cleaning up puke is a job for a high-school or college kid not a man with a doctorate. I think this is the most pathetic stories I have ever heard. Leave and get yourself taken care of. How in the heck can you degrade yourself to this level. Why dont you get "LOSER' tatooed on you forhead or maybe even "DPM LOSER'.

Take you pick.

Posted on Sep 2, 2002, 2:04 AM
from IP address 65.100.215.207

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Cutting nails from Medicare

by (no login)

As some of these readers know, the Office of Inspector General ( OIG ) may investigate 25 Podiatrists regarding their nail billing. As I understand the current regs, Medicare pays for trimming of nails only if there is "marked decrease in ambulation" due to the long mycotic nails.

If anything is a "red flag", that is.

Will reimbursement for cutting of toenails still be around in 5 years? Well, what is the chance that Medicare would want to save the $300,000,000-$400,000,000 and put it in the Seniors Drug Benefits?

The Drug Benefit, which will happen one day, will cost Medicare $30 Billion - $60 Billion a year, every year.
The GOP Plan is 30B, the Demos want 60B. The money will comes from increasing your taxes big time, increasing what the old folks pay, or it will come from the savings from lower reinmursements from doctors.

Taxes will NOT go up. People don't want that.
Old folks will NOT pay more in Medicare. Old folks vote and they are can sway elections in key states.
The only thing to look forward to is getting paid less.

But, don't worry. I am sure that our Podiatry Leadership is so connected and powerful that they have convinced the Medicare folks that the trimming of nails must stay in the Medicare budget.

Read the newspapers, financial journals, health business journals, etc and the answers are really clear.

I just got a copy of Oregon Health Forum, which is a 16 page newsletter only on heathcare issues published monthly. It is full of bad news. There are big cuts in health programs everywhere. There is simply not enough money to go around to satisfy everybodies demand for entitlement.

I am responsible for what I write. I use my name and address, phone number, Email address, etc. If anyone would like to see the source documents that I use to prepare what I write, just contact me.

R Willner, President
The Center For Peer Review Justice, Inc
New Orleans, LA

info@PeerReview.org
504-621-1670

Posted on Aug 31, 2002, 10:49 AM
from IP address 67.24.15.77

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Another day at the `Club'

by (no login)

The old vascular surgeon left his shoes for me to clean while I bagged for a foursome this morning. The group consisted of an orthopedic surgeon, a dentist, a chiropractor and a DPM.
It was early and I was tending the pin on the fourth hole of a par five when someone let out a grueling sputter of flatulance. The other caddy looked over at me and we sort of chuckled, but there was that forced hush of silence when the winds died down and the golfers looked at each other in that "Who dunnit," sort of way.
The orthopedist snapped off his cap and tossed it on the ground. "This could have ruined my put."
The Chiropractor said: "My wife made beans last night and if something slipped out, I'm sorry."
The dentist shook his head from side to side slowly and had me withdraw his putter. "Its just natural he said.
The DPM had me remove his driver from his bag. He teed up on the green and drove a ball nearly seventy yards or so.
"Why'd you do that?" The chiropractor asked.
"Because I have privelages here."

Back at the locker room I was cleaning the old vascular sugeon's shoes when the DPM came in. He was very angry. I didn't look at him very long, I just went back to getting the mud out of the cleats. The DPM started cursing at me for being a bimmy, shining shoes for people-as if what I did wasn't good enough.
I slowly raised my eyes and ran my hand through my hair. "Sir," I said.
"What is it looser? Don't you know who I am?"
"No." I said.
"I am Doctor Buddy (deleted)"
"What kinda doc are you, sir?" I stood up slowly. The old vascular surgeon's shoe was still in my hand.
"I'm a foot specialist."
"Oh, your the chiropodist," I just wanted to piss him off a little.
His face went red and he rushed up to me and grabbed my shirt.
"You little twerp, look at you, who the hell are you some sort of nobody who mops up after people-he tossed me against the lockers. I brought my knee up to his crotch and jabbed my elbow into his ribs. The DPM slid to the floor, but braced himself on one of the chairs. "I'll have your job you little piece of ****..."
At that very moment the old vascular surgeon came into the room. The DPM saw him and steadied himself.
"Sir," The DPM said. Not wanting to appear the least disturbed by this incident.
"Buddy," How come you all aren't at the nursin' home clippin' them nails I referred to you? You ever wanna work in this town again?"
"Yes sir," The DPM said.
"Then you best be gettin' outta that golf suit and over to the nail garden and gettin's some work done.
At that moment the DPM and I locked eyes.
I'm sure its not the last I'll see of him.

To be continued...

Posted on Aug 30, 2002, 11:40 AM
from IP address 64.157.144.208

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Foot Caddy, r u a DPM or a DCh clubbin' in Canada????

by AnonPod (no login)

R u 4 real? R u a Diploma in Chiropody (DCh)graduate? If u r a DPM, which podiatry college did you graduate from? Y not get an anonymous email w/ur nik name so others can correspond w/u ?

Posted on Aug 31, 2002, 11:27 AM
from IP address 65.48.41.73

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Re: Foot Caddy, r u a DPM or a DCh clubbin' in Canada????

by N.Y. Podiatrist (no login)

Foot Caddy is a real Podiatrist. You see, if you don't make it in Podiatry, you don't have other options like Medical Doctors do. You cant go into a Doc in a Box, or a Clinic, or the ER, or in a Fat Clinic. Podiatry is dead end. We know it.

Posted on Sep 1, 2002, 10:02 AM
from IP address 63.215.172.155

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NY POD

by Anonymous (no login)

After all you have relayed to some other msgs. I cant believe that you would day such a thing as podiatry being a dead end. You act like it is a revolutionary speciality that has taken over healthcare and is is capable of salaries of 800 K when its not. My two cents is always free and realistic.

Posted on Sep 2, 2002, 2:07 AM
from IP address 65.100.215.207

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enough

by Calcenean (no login)

what is the purpose of these "stories"? to piss people off? we all get the point that DPM is currently a struggling profession. For once, instead of putting out discouraging comments, why not try some encouraging comments, write advices on how to succed, how to fix APMA, how to better DPM reimbursement.

Posted on Aug 31, 2002, 2:26 PM
from IP address 12.106.89.75

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How to "fix" the APMA???

by N.Y. Podiatrist (no login)

You want us to write stories on how to "fix the APMA"?

Now, that organization does not even return telephone calls and Emails!!!!

That is NO joke. Imagine that. YOUR national organization does not return telephone calls.

Or your Emails.

Does not even say, "Thank you for your Email. I will consider your comments". No. They ignore their members.

That is Podiatry.

The National Organization representing all podiatrists ignore podiatrists.

Don't believe me? Write to the Trustees and see what happens.

Posted on Sep 1, 2002, 10:05 AM
from IP address 63.215.172.155

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I agree

by DO MS IV (no login)

I do agree that these fabricated stories have gone overboard and have crossed the line to being in bad taste. Even if podiatry is struggling with internal issues, it is neither productive nor necessary to interfere with podiatrists who are trying to resolve their issues.

Posted on Sep 3, 2002, 2:05 AM
from IP address 129.107.101.104

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Re: I agree

by jj stiles (no login)

i agree with DO boy

Posted on Sep 10, 2002, 1:33 AM
from IP address 66.2.47.6

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What happened to the humor?

by (no login)

There were several pieces that were hilarious and subequently removed from the board: Cat Tenotomies, the DPM Caddy, Shoe-shoe, and so on.

This forum is so loaded with venom, despair and BS that those slivers of humor made it fun to visit. Why not show the young pods that no matter how bad things are there's always something to lighten things up a bit.

I guess its a typical scenario: Give a podiatrist an ounce of power and the DPM will use it to bend the tides to fit into his or her own fungal culture.

For those poor souls who can't laugh at themselves-too bad.

I want to laugh.

Posted on Aug 30, 2002, 11:07 AM
from IP address 64.157.144.208

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In need of some real answers

by Nurse Student (no login)

Do NPs have to be licensed under a medical doctor to be in a private practice? I have heard that they can prerscribe and do anything in their scope of practice without an MD over their shoulder. Could someone help?
Thanks

Posted on Aug 29, 2002, 11:08 PM
from IP address 63.230.16.223

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Nursing student

by Anomalous (no login)

I don't know for sure, but I know that NP's have a lot of autonomy.

If you don't get a satisfactory answer on this forum, I would suggest going to www.studentdoctor.net. This site has many categories and one might be helpful for you.

Posted on Aug 30, 2002, 10:52 AM
from IP address 64.167.76.232

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answers

by R wilner, DPM (no login)

The trends in healthcare is to give the NP and others more power. The idea is to LOWER the cost of healthcare. Medicare wants to PAY LESS. Insurance wants to PAY LESS.

For example, the NP bills Medicare at 85 percent of what doctors do. That is incredible as the difference in education, time of training and Residency is huge.

The managed care places hire NPs directly. IHS, I assume also hires them directly.

DEA license is independent.

By the way, Oregon is the next state that will allow psychologists full Rx powers. Will ODs be next?
What about DC's?

I would call the programs and ask them directly for all of the facts.

Good luck.

Posted on Aug 30, 2002, 11:34 PM
from IP address 67.25.11.246

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Rich

by Nursing Student (no login)

Just for the sake of asking the quesiton... Do you have a problem with NPs perscribing ect. Take a look at the difference in education between a (F)NP and a family doc.

MD, undergraduate, not in medicine. Medical School, 4 years, GP res. 1-3 years. Usually pvt. pract. following.

NP, undergraduate in nursing (BSN), 3 years hospital based experience as a RN (ICU, ER, OR, PICU, Critical Care are the requirements.. one of them), 2-3 years practitioner school, usually 12-24 mo. internship.

I believe that NPs are completely capable of performing everything and anything a family doc does. Where do you think they learned most of his/her clinical education, from other MDs? yeah right.

But I would love to hear your opinions ect...

I do not agree with PhDs having Rx authority at all (psychologists) I think that ODs can Rx (oral) for infections but no oral pain meds, just topicals. DCs? NEVER! It is not their philosophy although you know some would love to Rx.

MD,DO,DDS,DPM,CRNA,NP, PA-C, are the only qualified personnel to order Rx. Agreed? Opinions welcome.

Posted on Sep 1, 2002, 3:21 AM
from IP address 65.100.215.207

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in case anyone is interested . . .

by Career Changer (no login)

Nurse Practitioners are not qualified to do everything a family doctor is qualified to do; nurses, including nurse practitioners, are trained in the classroom according to the NURSING model; allopathic/osteopatic physicians, podiatrists, optometrists, and physician assistants are instructed according to the MEDICAL model (there is a big difference). While I do agree that nurse practitioners are trained, according to the NURSING model, to diagnose and treat patients, I do not believe that they are equavilent to FP's as far as diagnosing and treating. Why? Because I have been misdiagnosed by NP's on more than one occasion; I do not see them anymore; I either see a PA or MD. This is my experience, but I know quite a few nurses and I did extensive research; it is not my intent to bad-mouth nurses (they provide a needed service), but to correct the notion that NP's are equivalent to FP's, because they are not.

I say this to bring up an important point: DMP's are trained in the medical model, and are very competent to treat medical ailments of the foot. I think it would help DMP's to focus on this aspect when faced with competition from other occupations.

I am planning to attend OD school. Just like OD's DPM's are considered non-physican health care providers who are trained in the medical model. I am bringing up this similarity because OD's have been successful in focusing on primary care, not surgery; I have noticed on this site that DMP's need surgery to be board certified and get on insurance plans. Is it possible for podiatry to explore any primary care/preventative medicine options, or niche surgery options (sorry, my knowledge of the inner workings of podiatry is limited) so orthos would see it as more of a complimentary relationship rather than a competitive one? I bring this up because many OD's/OMD's have similar arrangements and the OD profession, overall, is doing fine because of it. Also, OD's have been very successful regarding scope of practice issues. I think this is a major concern for all non-physician health care providers; this may be something else that podiatry could be more vigilant about. (I apologize if I offend anyone with the term "non-physican health care provider," but if one is not a MD/DO, but diagnoses and treats patients, then "non-physican health care provider" is the appropriate term.)

Also, I perused our network provider booklet (just received it) because my husband has hammertoes and an infection that causes his toenails to fall off. There are 4 podiatrists in it! I am pleasantly surprised because I noted in a previous post that none of my prior insurances offered podiatry coverage. I know it may not be much, put we're going to a podiatrist to get his feet straight. I think this is great that we have this option.

Posted on Sep 1, 2002, 11:42 PM
from IP address 64.12.96.200

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Career Changer

by Facts are Facts (no login)

NPs are much more qualified than a physicians asst. A PA spends no more than 24 months learning medicine. Talk about a crash coarse in medicine. NPs have spent at the min. 6 years. Yes, I do agree that they are trained in the nursing model but ask any resident in internal medicine, family practice, or other form of primary care, Nurses will teach the physician more than any other MD/DO will. NPs are completely competent.

How do you feel about Nurse Anesthetists? A CRNA performing the anesthesia for your birthing, open heart surgery, or plastic surgery. 68% of the drugs administered are given by CRNAs. Anesthesia-related accidents are at an all time low do you think that is because of this nursing model?

The OD plays a very small role in healthcare overall. I had an OD from ShopKo try to tell me I had a vision deficit in my left eye and he gave me a Rx for contacts which completely caused eye strain. I saw my MD-eye doc and there was no need at all for this AT ALL. The OD isnt trained in squat except to give you a nice pair of frames. There is a reason you cannot advance in optometry such as Rx privelages and the respect of your colleagues. That is why you work at ShopKo and grocery stores.

When I need a pair of frames or lenses I will come and see you when I am at the grocery store in your corner otherwise none of your advice is even supported.

Have a good day Dr. Contacts

Posted on Sep 2, 2002, 2:00 PM
from IP address 65.100.215.207

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interesting . . .

by Career Changer (no login)

I take it that you are a strong proponent of the belief that NP's are equivalent to FP's. I also have to wonder whether or not you have a problem with PA's. PA's are fast-tracked through the FP curriculum, with the origins of this methodology based on the fast-tracking of training physicians during WWII; however, the PA profession has its origins from the Vietnam era, because a physician shortage in the military. Regardless of what you may think, the bottom line is that NP's, regardless of the speciality, are still nurses, trained according to the nursing model, and they recieve their training from shadowing MD's/DO's (this is out of the mouth of NP's themselves). MD's, DO's, DMP's and OD's are trained according to the medical model; if you do not believe me, take a moment to look at their curricula and compare it to the nurse's curriculum. (I have nothing against any of these professions, in spite of my negative experience with NP's.) No offense, but do you have your facts straight?

I have spoken to many MD's/DO's and while they have not said anything negative about the non-physician practitioner professions, the vast majority of them have expressed concern about NP's seeking to expand their scope of practice, especially the independent health care provider status. However, PA's understand that they are part of the MD/DO team. While I will concede that PA's may not necessarily know everything, they know their boundaries. Again, this is what I have been told by MD's/DO's.

As far as CRNA's, I have not had any experience with them as a patient, nor have any of my friends; therefore, I can not comment on them.

As far as the commercialization of OD's, it is a trend that will not go away. This is a reality of capitalism, to bring the services to the people, and people are in the malls and grocery stores. I'm sorry that you were misdiagnosed by an OD in the mall; everyone makes mistakes. However, I would be concerned if the misdiagnosis was chronic amongst different members of a profession (as in my experiences). By the way, most OD's do have Rx privleges. But then I have to wonder about people who pursue careers in medicine for the "status" versus the desire to truly diagnose and treat ailments. If the later is really one's desire, does it matter where this act takes place, as long as it provides the patient with confidientialty and a hygienic environment?

I visit this website because (an OD recommended that I do so)I have a sincere interest in the viability of the DMP profession because like OD's (my future vocation), they are non-physician health care providers, and I think we have a few (but not all) of the same issues in common.

(By the way, I doubt seriously that you will see me in a mall or grocery store; not that I have anything against anyone who works there, but I have already devoted my career to government service.)

Good luck to you.

Posted on Sep 2, 2002, 10:45 PM
from IP address 205.188.208.42

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Career Changer

by ucberk (no login)

I will tell you my personal experience. I am not a nurse or nursing student. I am a pre-medicine student at UC-Berk. I once thought I would go into family medicine as a physician so I contacted the people in charge at my university of student internships and they put me in touch with with a network of clinics (urgent care / family practice. I observed NPs and MDs at their best best and from my own observations made the decision that family practice was not complicated enough - so to speak - and the MDs deligated the NPs to do most everything from stiching to setting fractures. So naturally I thought this is nurse work. I saw NPs make skilled decisions that saved lives.

To say that Nurses learn from shadowing Dr.s, in my opinion, is well..... an oxymoron. Shadowing is what residents do. Seeing what your mentor would do and taking that on in your practice. From my research, I have concluded that NPs are totally competent to have private practice in pediatrics, OB/GYN, mental health, family practice, geriatrics, and acute care. And not to spar with you because I think that what you are doing is great and I praise you for the effort and time you are willing to put in to help your pts. and our fellow man, but PAs are very sneaky in this sense. Several PAs employ primary care physicians but not physically. They basically buy their 'permission' and then run their own family clinics in several aspects of medicine. I have shadowed a PA in Cali that is a Pediatric PA and yes he is very good but to say that PAs stay in their scope is terribly unjustified.

PAs find ways to slither around the laws ect. I am not anti-PA as it may seem. I think that they are excellent and I commend them for what they do everyday. They save lives and make them better for alot of people.

Doctors of Optometry are needed but in relevance to your comment I was actually misdiagnosed by 2 ODs in the same complex. The MD told me (who is a friend) ODs have a little scheme to make some $$$ by Rx contacts for people who dont really need them. But there are crooks in every profession and always will be.

I am interested to know your case about your misdiagnoses by the NP, could you relay your experience to me. (ie your symptoms, onset, NPs diagnoses - Rx, ect) I would really appreciate it.

Take care. Hope to hear from you soon

Posted on Sep 3, 2002, 6:00 PM
from IP address 65.100.215.207

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response

by Career Changer (no login)

I had post-nasal drip, fever, very sore throat, dry cough, and general malise. I was told that I had a cold and that my throat was sore because of the post-nasal drip and coughing. When I went back with the same complaint, I was told the same thing, except that it was sinusitis caused by seasonal allegies (which I do not have) and to take OTC meds for this. Turns out that I had a bacterial infection that (by this time) was allowed to spiral out of control; I was prescribed antibiotics by an MD (who ordered tests). The NPs' never ordered any tests for me. I missed school and work for almost 3 weeks, and on antibiotics for 4 weeks. This was not the first time something like this happened, but I decided at that time, it would be the last.

I asked an NP student in my statistics class to explain her training to me. She explained that they shadowed physicians and that is where they obtained their medical practitioner know-how from, versus how medical students are trained with the didactic curriculum. NP's have to pick their speciality as soon as they start, so an NP who majors in midwifery will not have expertise in family medicine, and vice versa (just a simplified example). Because there is so much to being an internist, and NPs are trained in the nursing model (focus is still on patient care) vs. the medical model, they will encounter things that they will not know. The NP student I spoke with clarified that with me and stated that the NPs I saw should have either requested tests or REFERRED me to a physician. For what ever reason, they did not. Because I feel my health is beyond the politics of medicine (i.e., what type of practitioner is "better"), I opted for a safer route and stuck with the MD's and PA's; I do know that with a PA, if I request the physician, I can see him/her (physicians were on site, versus the NP's who had clinics with out physicians on site).

I am not anti-NP; I had not-so great experiences. I just think that practitioners (NP's, OD's, DMPs' etc) who have to continuously compare their professions to MD's/DO's to reaffirm their worth should just go to an allopathic or osteopathic medical school and become an MD or DO. I think all non-physician health care providers provide a needed service in one form or another, but for those (not all, but those that do know who they are) that have the need to constantly say that they are as great, if not better than MD's/DO's tells the public they are more interested in status than the desire to diagnose and treat patients within the scope of their training (just about everyone probably has a misdiagnosis story). If they feel the need to do this, then I think they would be better off as an MD or DO.

"Anything thing that is worth having does not come easily." I think that those who want the MD or DO title and responsibility should go to medical school and not settle for a non-physician healthcare provider profession. Patients can sense their angst, and their angst reflects poorly upon their chosen profession.

I do not intend to bad mouth anyone and/or profession; I speaking from my experiences and opinions derived from them.

Good luck to all in their professional endeavors.

Posted on Sep 3, 2002, 11:45 PM
from IP address 64.12.96.200

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ucberk, almost forgot. . .

by Career Changer (no login)

The NP student in my statistics class also told me that NP students need a physician to "sponsor" them (i.e, agree to let the NP student shadow him/her during the clinical part of the curriculum, or the preceptorship) prior to admission in the program.

Other practitioners (i.e., MD, DO, DMP, OD, PA) do not need such a thing because as part of their curricula, they receive this training through the medical schools themselves via the clinical portion of their studies, and this is not limited to 1 physician or 1 clinical speciality (though DMP's and OD's are specialists, they usually get exposure to all aspects of clinical medicine, especially systemic diseases that tend to manifest themselves the most within those specialities); this is the medical model. All training occurs within the medical school and affiliated hospitals and clinics for the clinical phases of their respective programs.

Also, this NP student was in my graduate statistics class (required for the NP degree) at a non-medical school university. Now really, (not to bad-mouth NP's), how many medical practitioners take courses concurrently at a non-medical school while completing a medical practitioner program? (Though the t-test and ANOVA do come in handy when reading research journals, they are of little use for diagnosing and treating the patient. An undergrad statistics course would provide enough knowledge of stats to understand the medical journals.)

Though you may not be aware of it from your observations, there is a big difference in the training. Talk to them (MD's, DO's, DMP's, OD's PA's and NP's) and ask them the differences.

Posted on Sep 4, 2002, 8:30 AM
from IP address 64.12.96.200

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Career Changer Almost Forgot...

by Anonymous (no login)

OD and DPMs do not train at medical school nor anything like a traditional medical school. Ask anyone on this forum and they will tell you (the majority) that they expected or wanted to get medical training and didnt at all. ODs are far inferior to MD-opthamalogists - that once again is why they work in KMarts, ect. You dont see FPs, dentists, Nurses, or PAs in retail stores now do you.

Posted on Sep 4, 2002, 12:24 PM
from IP address 65.100.215.207

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Re: Career Changer Almost Forgot...

by Career Changer (no login)

OD's focus on the eyes (theoretically, non-surgically); OMD's are allopathic/osteopathic physicians who do surgery as well as primary care. I am not naive nor egotigistal enough to compare one knowledge base to the other because the bottom line is patient care within the context of the scope of practice, and all practitioners should be big enough to acknowledge their limits. (But if you want to know, all of the OD's I shadowed worked in clinics and hospitals.)

As far as the setting of patient care, the bottom line is as long as the patient is happy, why should the non-patient care? I know many OD's in retail outlets who are laughing all the way to the bank.

Posted on Sep 5, 2002, 12:52 PM
from IP address 205.188.208.42

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yep

by Anonymous (no login)

laughing to go take out a loan or a 2nd mortgage because Optometry doesnt pay the bills

Posted on Sep 6, 2002, 12:23 AM
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Let's not post about things we don' tknow about

by Ahem (no login)

Umm..you may want to check out the actual curriculum of an optometry school. We are NOT inferior to opthalamologists--they use surgical means, we don't. It's apples and oranges. We prescribe corrective lenses, and treat medical problems of the eye such as glaucoma. This can be done in a retail setting. Surgery cannot. Plus there is usually glasses and contacts (i.e. products) associated with eye care. That also lends itself to retail settings. No one goes to the mall to by a colostomy bag. Also, I don't know anyonoe who goes to m y school who used optometry as a backup. Those people are screened out by admissions

Posted on Sep 6, 2002, 1:05 AM
from IP address 24.164.252.125

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DPM school & training

by Anonymous (no login)

Podiatry students at Des Moines University take their basic sciences classes side by side with the osteopathic medical students except for OMM. They take gross anatomy with M1s but then spend more time with the lower extremity.

Scholl has just merged with Finch University and they take Gross also side by side with the M1s and will be integrating more of the classes.

Temple also has an allopathic med program as well as the podiatric med program.

Midwestern University will be opening up a Podiatric Medical program to be integrated with M1s in the ostepapthic program next year.

Residencies are required in order to secure the possibility of gaining employment. They are done in hopspitals and integrate with other MD/DO/DPM residents. I know of 6 Scholl graduates who are doing 2 and 3 year surgical residencies at Loyola University Hospital's Department of Orthropaedics.

To say that DPMs are far from medical schools is ludicrous. You should do SOME RESEARCH before writing something like that. I hope that as a pre-med or med student, you will broaden yor scope of thinking. Society does NOT need any more closed-minded ignorant physicans.

Posted on Sep 5, 2002, 8:36 PM
from IP address 68.20.215.46

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Pod School vs. Med School

by Anonymous (no login)

Listen to the DPMs here. Read their posts and hear their thoughts (more like horror stories) about the schooling and training of DPMs. It is nothing like medical school and neither is the residency. If you have this deliusion that you went to med school or that is what you may tell people to accomadate your fantasy of becoming a doctor you are wrong. DDS, OD, and DPMs do not attend medical school. They attend dental, optometry, and podiatry school(s).

I am definately a podiatry advocate because I have been worked on several times by one but to claim that they are trained in the disciplines of allopathic or osteopathic physicians is ludacris. They arent. In the majority of states they are not classified as physicians at all.

Podiatrists are a needed specialist. However, they may take the basic sciences with med students, big whoop, so do dental students and dental students dont claim to be in med schools now do they. Realize what you are and your profession will be better for it.

Posted on Sep 6, 2002, 12:34 PM
from IP address 65.100.215.207

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Re: are you that insecure?

by (no login)

whoever you are, or better whoever you think you are,
you must be pretty insecure to cast these accusations, which by the way are rather unprofessional. The reason that there is such a need for podiatrists is that we provide a service MD's can't and vice versa.As far as the training, it is equal. Or maybe you feel insecure about the choice you made during school and your specialty?
Best Regards,
Pasquale

Posted on Sep 22, 2002, 1:56 PM
from IP address 207.166.216.6

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Re: DPM school & training

by Anonymous (no login)

Dear 2-3-4-5-6 year resident,

Hope you enjoy cutting nails.

Posted on Sep 6, 2002, 2:07 PM
from IP address 67.26.42.131

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TUSM and TUSPM

by TUSM C/O 2006 (no login)

I am a first year student at Temple University School of Medicine and I just want to point out that not only do we NOT have classes with the pod students but they are not even on the same campus as we are.

Posted on Sep 6, 2002, 6:48 PM
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You LIE!!

by Medical Podiatrist (no login)

Everybody knows that the Podiatry students are in the same classes as the Medical Students. In fact, they piss in the same bathrooms!

What, you say? They are in different classes and different buildings? Could they be different professions?

Come to think of it, the new class is so small that it could be held in the Men's Room.

Posted on Sep 6, 2002, 10:25 PM
from IP address 67.26.40.155

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MEDICAL PODIATRIST?

by Anonymous (no login)

I had to post a msg. and tell you that I cant stop laughing. A 'medical podiatrist'? What is that? You must be the first of a new breed. You are what the next guy is a DPM. Not a medical pod just a plain ol' podiatrist.

Your education is nothing of a MD/DO. You know it and so does everyone else, everyone.

Posted on Sep 9, 2002, 10:01 AM
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Re: MEDICAL PODIATRIST?

by Anonymous (no login)

Medical Podiatrist has Boards on the left foot only.
Could not pass the Boards to allow him to treat the right foot.

He has to write the modifier on each CPT code.

He feels like half a man.

Posted on Sep 11, 2002, 12:50 AM
from IP address 67.25.9.60

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My opinion

by DO MS IV (no login)

Just for the sake of asking the quesiton... Do you have a problem with NPs perscribing ect. Take a look at the difference in education between a (F)NP and a family doc.

*** I have a problem with NPs prescribing and so do most physicians. Believe me, just because the laws allow NPs to prescribe certain drugs does not mean that NPs are actually qualified to prescribe. You ask us to take a look at the difference in education between a NP and a family MD? Big, big, big difference! ***

MD, undergraduate, not in medicine. Medical School, 4 years, GP res. 1-3 years. Usually pvt. pract. following.

*** Undergraduate, not in medicine, but in premedical courses such as physics, organic chemistry, biochemistry, anatomy and physiology, etc... The hardcore science classes unlike pre-nursing students.
Then began medical school and 3 years of residency. There is no such thing as a 1 year residency anymore so you can forget the 1-3 years that you quoted. It shows how much you know about the world of medicine. On the other hand, nursing students begin their nursing training right out of high school. Nursing courses taken during college, are not hard science course. Yes, nursing students learn how to make beds, take vital signs, and other nursing chores but don't expect any nursing student to know the pathophysiology, diagnosis or treatment of decubitus sores. A nursing student may be able to speak in medical jargons using terms like systole and diastole while taking vitals and but don't expect him to learn too much about the pathophysiology, etiology, diagnoses and treatments of congestive heart failure, myocardial infarction, patent ductus arteriosus, atrial septal defect, tetralogy of fallot, etc. just to name a few. ***

NP, undergraduate in nursing (BSN), 3 years hospital based experience as a RN (ICU, ER, OR, PICU, Critical Care are the requirements.. one of them), 2-3 years practitioner school, usually 12-24 mo. internship.

*** As stated above, that maybe all true, but the training is in nursing which means carrying out physician's orders, making beds, taking care of patients' hygiene, dispensing medications. Nursing students are not trained to think critically or in medical decision making. A nurse can execute a physician's orders all day long for 20 years but if he is never allowed to manage a patient independently, he will never gain enough experience or knowledge to manage a patient. ***

I believe that NPs are completely capable of performing everything and anything a family doc does. Where do you think they learned most of his/her clinical education, from other MDs? yeah right.

*** It's okay if you have that opinion but fortunately everyone who's sane doesn't think so. It's fortunate that most people are still able to differentiate between an MD (medical school and residency graduate) from a a NP (not a medical school and residency graduate). ***

But I would love to hear your opinions ect...

*** That is my opinion. ***

I do not agree with PhDs having Rx authority at all (psychologists) I think that ODs can Rx (oral) for infections but no oral pain meds, just topicals. DCs? NEVER! It is not their philosophy although you know some would love to Rx.

*** If nurses can prescribe why not the above professionals? Just your bias? ***

MD,DO,DDS,DPM,CRNA,NP, PA-C, are the only qualified personnel to order Rx. Agreed? Opinions welcome.

*** My opinion is only MD, DO, DDS, DPM, OD, and PA-C should prescribe as allowed by laws. Nurses have no business doing anything else but nursing. ***

Posted on Sep 3, 2002, 1:59 AM
from IP address 129.107.101.104

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DO MS IV

by Anonymous (no login)

If PAs are allowed to Rx then why not a NP? Just your bias? PAs are given a crash coarse in medicine and a simple didactic coarse for a 10-12 mo period. What are your feelings about Nurse Anesthetists? Are you aware that they provide 68% of the drugs administered each year. As I said previously, drug-related incidents are at an all time low and I guess this is because nurses are trained to make a bed right? WRONG!

I would like to know your professional credentials, are you a DPM?

Nurses are more than well trained to make beds and dispense medication. I think that a comment like that has some malice behind it. I am just making a point that nurses do provide mid-level healthcare in several areas as practitioners and do so very effectively. They provide anesthesia for 7 out of 10 procedures safely and effectively. Why do you think there is such a need for them? Is it because they make such a good bed? Probably not.

As far as coarses go? Maybe you should look at a nursing cir. They consist of Gen and Organic chemistry, biology - micro, immunology, histology, embryology, pathophysiology, anatomy, infectious disease, pharmacology, and biophysics. Uh! Maybe I skipped the bedmaking 101 but you get the picture right?

These are all coarses that I take along side nursing students (I am premed/dental at UC-Berk)

These are before you can apply to nuring school (- pharmacology) I really commend them and all they make the healthcare system out to be. It takes alot of hard work and dedication to be that type of healthcare professional.

Take a good look at the stats, with the way healthcare is going, you wont even be able to see a MD for your family care nor will you see a PA, but a NP so you better get used to it. Insurance co. like them cause they only bill 85% of what a physician does.

The ball isnt on your side of the court here.

Posted on Sep 3, 2002, 10:20 PM
from IP address 65.100.215.207

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DO MS IV's comments . . .

by Career Changer (no login)

DO MS IV makes some valid points about the BSN nursing curriculum. Yes, pharmacology is required and so is biochemistry and/or organic (usually 1 semester), and anatomy and physiology; general physics may or may not be required depending on the school, but I've never heard of biophysics for undergrad non physics majors; but the other HARD science courses that you noted are not typically required in nursing programs. Most nursing programs focus on nursing courses (community nursing; pediatric nursing; adult nursing, etc.) I have many friends that are nurses and I have looked at nursing curricula; however, UC Berkley may be the exception.

Nurses are in demand because it is backbreaking work. They work long hours, including mandatory overtime at most facilities; have a large number of patients to tend to; and are usually on their feet most of the time. Then, of course, it is a customer service oriented job, and most patients do not appreciate their nurses. The physician is the ultimate authority, and nurses have no real power. To sum this up, they feel overworked and underappreciated (I think they are) and are leaving the profession in droves. That is why there is a shortage (source: conversations with nurses I know supported by various articles I have read). Even this weak economy has not convinced former nurses to return to the nursing profession (do an online search for articles about the economy and the nursing shortage; I read this a few weeks ago in aol's business section). My sister-in-law left nursing; my friend is looking for a job out of nursing to get out as soon as possible, while preparing for medical school; my other friend is also looking for a way out. My cousin left nursing got a master's in healthcare administration.

Managed care is big business. Where do you think they get their business? From companies; Corporate America is a big client. So when I miss work because of misdiagnosis and when it's time for the annual HMO/PPO renewal, what do you think Corporate America does? They ask the employees who do we want and why. Corporate America's bottom line is worker productivity, which translates into money. When we are not well, they want practitioners who can get us back to work. The bottom line is still money, and Corporate America likes healthy workers so they can maximize their profits.

While I agree that NP's and similar are here to stay, they will not replace physicians, and it is highly unlikely that they will replace other non-physician health care providers.

Good luck with your studies.

Posted on Sep 4, 2002, 1:56 PM
from IP address 152.163.189.129

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reply

by DO MS IV (no login)

I am a fourth year MEDICAL student - not a DPM or a DPM student. Funny you mentioned nurse anesthetists but as far as I know, they operate under physicians' supervision. In the OR, the CRNA may be the one intubating the patient and admistering the anesthesia BUT there is always an in-house anesthesiologist just in case something goes awry. Another point you mentioned about PAs again shows you have no idea what PA's education is about. Nursing courses are taking during college and most nurses end up with a BSN (which is a bachelor of science of nursing, which in my opinion has more to do with nursing than hard science). On the other hand, most PA students when applying to PA schools, would have had a bachelor of science (not science, not nursing science I might add)already. Then they will be trained in the medical model, sometimes along side with medical students. Their training might be abbreviated but it is medical training nevertheless. I have yet to have heard of nursing students taking courses along side with medical students (oh, I'm sorry they're still doing undergraduate college work). In addition to that, many PAs go on to get their masters in physician assistant which makes them even more well trained than nurses. I apologize if what I'm saying pisses you off but I am married to a former nursing student who almost graduated with a BSN from a 4 year major university based program before she switched an went to medical school. She would be the first to admit that nurses don't even know enough to know their limitations.

Posted on Sep 4, 2002, 7:33 PM
from IP address 129.120.99.212

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Hello Career Changer

by Anonymous (no login)

I would like to tell you once and for all that ODs provide no viable service except give you a Rx for a pair of glasses. Lets say you wake up one morning and have a severe eye problem that is painful and oozing. Do you run to the nearest Target to see their OD? Call your family doc? Go to the ER? Go see a MD-eye doc? I would do all of those except see an OD. They may be trained to identify disorders and even Rx for them but you would (will) never be able to refer pts. to another dr. (because you are able to identify systemic disease right?) and your knowledge of infection and disease will be far less of any other healthcare provider that may render eye serivces.

Look at the propaganda of non-physician health care providers and how they claim that they are always the first to identify a serious disorder such as diabetes, CHF, high blood pressure, ect. Dentist, ODs, and DPMs all claim that they are the first to see these disorders. ODs are like psychics, they look deep into your eyes and see your problems, when infact they play the smallest role in healthcare possible. Have you ever thought about chiropractic or something else?

OK, and by the way this 'medical model' that you talk about, you will NOT be trained in any discipline even remotely similar to an allopathic/osteopathic model, so if you think that you are going to be trained like a physician, YOURE NOT. You are going to dispense contacts and glasses. Realize the facts. You will never be what physicians call a 'RD' -REAL DOCTOR

Posted on Sep 5, 2002, 5:27 PM
from IP address 65.100.215.207

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whatever . . .

by Career Changer (no login)

Did it ever occur to you that not everyone is as preoccupied with a job title as your post makes people appear to be?

OD's can do more than Rx glasses; they can Rx (medications) for other eye conditions, treat glaucoma, etc. But people who really know what OD's do know this anyway . . .

You're entitled to your opinions. You're also educated enough to do additional research on the OD profession. Therefore I do not feel the need to "educate" you any more on this matter. It seems like your mind is already made up.

Good luck with your professional pursuits.

Posted on Sep 6, 2002, 11:02 AM
from IP address 152.163.189.129

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Suicide rate joke..

by Justin (no login)

They say that dentists have one of the highest suicide rates among professions.

After reading this forum I have to wonder if podiatry is not just one of the highest suicide rates but actually the highest rate.

Podiatry, what a wonderful thing

Posted on Aug 29, 2002, 10:27 AM
from IP address 12.72.139.132

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Need Part 2 Study Aids too...been out of school a long time.

by sjpod (no login)

Hi,

I am looking for study material for part 2 of NB's.
Would anyone have the Presby Manual for sale?
I have a real old one, as I have been out of school for quite a while, so i have no real connections with any schools at this time, nor do i know of anyone that is in school.

I held off after graduating due to many having a tough time in the business. But, i have decided to at least give it a try.

Any help on other material would be great. I do have some, but am not impressed. I like Presby, but as i said mine is really old & has several pages missing.

Thankx

Posted on Aug 28, 2002, 11:06 AM
from IP address 66.203.10.169

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is DPM-JD a useful combination?

by (no login)

I have noticed that there are quite a few DPM-JDs is the combination helpful? Do DPM-JDs wind up practising law or podiatry? Both? What legal specialization? Is this combination financailly rewarding?

Posted on Aug 27, 2002, 4:56 PM
from IP address 216.248.99.36

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Sure, just practice law.

by Herbert Paul, DPM (no login)

One can make far more money practicing law than Podiatry. Consider the per unit costs. In Podiatry, the average patient is Medicare age. So you have to treat the patient, bill correctly, process the EOB, get the cost-share, etc. A lot of work for a 40
bill. And what do you do when Medicare cuts down the payment to way below what you would make bagging groceries? Medicare has no "feelings" for your entitlement, Foot Doctor.

In law, you can get a personal injury case that settles for 90,000 of which you get 30,000 and expenses.

The secret is getting the Clients.

By the way, great forum.

Posted on Aug 28, 2002, 11:42 AM
from IP address 67.25.8.237

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Re: is DPM-JD a useful combination?

by juju (no login)

interesting question, i'l like to know too.

Posted on Aug 29, 2002, 1:49 AM
from IP address 66.2.47.38

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JD/DPM

by Anomalous (no login)

"many" DPM/JD's??? I doubt it, but for the sake of argument, I'll believe you.

My fiance' is a junior associate attorney in Los Angeles. Her billable rate is $250.00/hr. Her salary plus bonus exceeded 100k her first year and last year reached 180k. Most pods make about $50.00/hr. Bottom line is that if you want to add a JD to your DPM, it would probably be a good move (though law school is like an endless train wreck and practicing law is akin to bathing in HCL). But, even then, being a DPM wouldn't necessarily qualify you for medical malpractice law or health care law. You're still not an MD. In my opinion, being a DPM/JD is really just a JD.

But the way, there is no person who has existed on this planet who got a DPM after a JD.

Posted on Aug 30, 2002, 11:01 AM
from IP address 64.167.76.232

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Re: JD/DPM

by Charlton (no login)

Thats is not true, There is one JD in my class who was a judge and a Lawyer who was in my 1st year, but didnt stay the course.

Posted on Aug 30, 2002, 1:19 PM
from IP address 209.227.6.18

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A failure

by Anonymous (no login)

What? A Lawyer/Judge who started Podiatry School and dropped out? Gotta be a failure.

Posted on Aug 31, 2002, 9:44 PM
from IP address 67.25.10.16

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Cat Tenotomies

by (no login)

Is it possibile for a podiatrist to hook up with a DVM? After all, there's only one different letter in the degree.

I read recently that there was a DPM who had his cat chew off fungal nails and by accident the Siamese took a swing at three bulging extensor tendons at the dorsum of the foot. The DPM, I heard billed for the Cat Tenotomies and went on to adopt several other felines from the animal shelter in our small town.

Since this is a relatively small town, the idea of having ones nails chewed off and tendons cut by well trained animals has caught the eye of a reporter for a national magazine.

I am wondering if any of the very rich podiatrists who have paid off their student loans and make a lot of money, like that doctor who said he did 20-25 surgeries a week and is going to osteopathetic school has considered this before jumping ship for another profession.

There are a lot of vets out there. Look at all of the Vet Administration hospitals and how few DPMs work there.

I sure hope someone doesn't take this great idea to bring podiatry into the mainstream does not delete this from this very important message board.




Posted on Aug 26, 2002, 5:46 PM
from IP address 64.157.146.67

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very witty

by Bruce W. (no login)

I enjoyed this flight of fancy.. Thanks.

Posted on Aug 31, 2002, 2:41 PM
from IP address 162.33.90.176

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"doctors negatitive views reflect anger"

by R Willner, DPM (no login)

Poll Finds Momentum for Radical Healthcare Reform

Fri Aug 23, 5:49 PM ET

NEW YORK (Reuters Health) - With many different groups expressing dissatisfaction with the US healthcare system, sentiment for "radical reform" is growing, a new poll suggests.



In the past, the public has been more dissatisfied with the healthcare system than have physicians, employers and health administrators, according to nationwide surveys by Harris Interactive ( news - external web site). But now a new Harris poll finds significant narrowing in the differences among those groups' points of view.

Doctors soured on healthcare beginning in 1999 and have remained less satisfied than they have been in the past. Harris believes doctors' negative views reflect lingering anger about managed care.

With health plans loosening restrictions on doctors, physician attitudes have perked up a bit in the past two years, the poll found. Still, doctors' sentiments are more negative now than at any time between 1984 and 1997, Harris noted.

Health plan managers also have grown notably more dour than they were three years ago, the poll found. And while employers are more satisfied than the public, they expressed more hostility this year than in any previous survey, Harris said.

Public support for a major overhaul of the healthcare system remains strong. While 17% think the system works pretty well, almost twice as many (31%) think it needs to be rebuilt.

Harris calculated a "radical change" score for each group based on its "overall view" of the country's healthcare system. Respondents were asked to indicate whether they believe that the nation's healthcare system works pretty well and requires only minor changes, that it has "good things" about it but needs fundamental change; or that so much is wrong that it needs to be completely rebuilt.

The public's radical change was highest, at 56, followed by hospital managers (51), employers (48) and health plans (50). Physicians scored lowest, at 46.

The poll was conducted between April and June with separate samples of 1,013 adults, 406 physicians, 301 employers, 101 health plan managers and 301 hospital managers. Data for previous years were derived from similar surveys.

Posted on Aug 26, 2002, 10:13 AM
from IP address 67.25.8.34

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Employee VS. Independent Contractor

by R. Wilner, DPM (no login)

Are you independent? Read your contract to make sure
Contract Language.

By Steven M. Harris, AMNews contributor. Sept. 2, 2002. Additional information


--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Prior to signing a contract with a hospital or physician group practice, you should determine whether you are considered an employee or an independent contractor by the employer.

The title of the document which you sign is not dispositive on the issue. So even if the document you sign says "Independent Contractor Agreement," that conclusion is not binding on third parties looking to reclassify the relationship as employer-employee.

Your employment status will impact all aspects of your contractual relationship, including licensing issues, liability insurance and coverage, and supervision liabilities. This column will explore various pitfalls of independent contractor status and highlight key areas to consider prior to signing your contract.

The Internal Revenue Service and the courts consider specific tax law factors to determine whether a physician is an employee or an independent contractor. The IRS has established a list of 20 factors -- not specific to physicians -- used to determine whether sufficient control exists to establish an employer-employee relationship. While no single fact is conclusive evidence, the IRS balances its 20 factors and comes to a subjective conclusion as to the status of the physician. The IRS factors include:

Whether the employer requires the worker to follow instructions.
Whether the employer trains the worker.
Whether the worker's services are provided personally.
The length of the worker's relationship with the employer.
Whether there are set hours for work.
Whether the worker has worked full time.
Whether the worker receives a set wage or compensation based on the amount of time worked.
Frequently, a physician may rely on the results of a prior audit, a judicial precedent or a commonly accepted practice in the health care industry to determine employment status.

While all of these considerations will shed some light on your status, the key issue is whether your employer has the right to control your physical conduct. This key determinative factor is the degree of control the hiring entity has over your manner and means of performing the tasks and accomplishing the results.

If the employer lacks the right to control your physical conduct, there is usually not an employer-employee relationship and instead the parties are considered as having an independent contractor relationship.

Because physicians exercise independent judgment in diagnosing and treating patients, this often blurs the line between employee or independent contractor. Courts will consider the language of the contract and also focus on the substance and operation of the parties' relationship to determine whether an individual is an employee or independent contractor.

A big distinction is that an employer must withhold federal income and social security taxes from the employee's compensation; however, such withholding does not apply to payments to independent contractors. The IRS treats independent contractors as being self-employed, and therefore responsible for payment of their own income tax and the entire portion of Social Security payroll taxes.

If an employment relationship exists, the employer pays 50% of the payroll tax. An employer is responsible for paying worker's compensation and unemployment insurance based upon amounts paid to employees, but independent contractor payments are not subject to these requirements.

Because employment contracts generally favor the employer, you need to make sure that your contract has a provision which clearly identifies your status. Also remember to plan accordingly for the associated tax consequences of the choice.

Practices that retain physicians as independent contractors often attempt to shift the tax risk to the contractor by requesting an indemnification for tax, interest and penalties associated with a reclassification of the contractor to employee status. Under no circumstances should you agree to such a provision.

No benefits for being independent
Independent contractor status also means that you will be excluded from participating in employer-sponsored benefit plans, including health, life, and disability insurance and pension, profit-sharing and other retirement plans. Independent contractors also do not receive employer-paid sick, holiday or vacation pay.

Unless specified, independent contractors are not covered under the hospital or physician group practices' liability umbrella and are usually responsible for securing and paying for their own liability coverage including any applicable tail coverage.

Employer-paid benefits typically account for 20% or more of an employee's salary. Therefore, you should consider the financial implications of having to pay out of pocket for such benefits.

If you are considering becoming an independent contractor, you should be aware and cautious of any kind of referral, fee-reduction or fee-splitting arrangement in place that involves payment by a federal health care program. Federal fraud and abuse laws impose severe penalties for knowingly soliciting or receiving payment or remuneration in exchange for the referral or arranging for an item or service which is paid by a federal health care program. As an independent contractor, you may not be eligible for protection under the safe harbor exemptions to the federal fraud and abuse laws.

Make sure you review your contract to ensure that the proposed relationship is and will remain faithful to your original agreement with your employer. You should also carefully consider the tax consequences, payment of benefits and regulatory considerations in order to avoid potential pitfalls.


--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Harris, a partner at Harris Kessler & Goldstein in Chicago, concentrates on health care law and has counseled physicians, physician networks and health care groups nationally.

Posted on Aug 26, 2002, 10:00 AM
from IP address 67.25.8.34

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