Happy Independence day to all indians and may the fake Gandhis and pseudo-secular mullahs immigrate to taliban lands soon.
I was thinking about teh flag. They make all that non sense theory that orange/saffron stands for this value, green for that value and white for the all noble value whatever. But in reality that gandhi-nehru coterie wanted orange from hindu/sikh and green for muslims. And then their creativity took over from there to herd the general dumb population. Am I the only one thinking like this?
>>> was thinking about teh flag. They make all that non sense theory that orange/saffron stands for this value, green for that value and white for the all noble value whatever. But in reality that gandhi-nehru coterie wanted orange from hindu/sikh and green for muslims. And then their creativity took over from there to herd the general dumb population. Am I the only one thinking like this?
Nope millions of morons like you.
R.K. Laxman, India's renowned cartoonist, honours the hardy & humble Indian Jawan
\\But in reality that gandhi-nehru coterie wanted orange from hindu/sikh and green for muslims. \\
Its actually more than that ! India is not just a nation state.It is a civilizational nation state tracing its roots to classical Indian Empires and everything in between. The freedom fighters wanted to capture that essence in the flag. Hence different features of the flag came from different periods/different dynasties of Indian civilization.
The Saffron in the flag came from the Maratha Empire which immediately preceded British colonization.The short lived Sikh kingdom also had some what similar flag. In a broader context, Saffron is also a colour of Hindus/Sikhs/Buddhists/Jains.Since the latter three started as 'sects' from within Hinduism, they share a large number of commonalities. Along with Safforn, Red and Yellow are also considered as auspicious in Hinduism.So many Indian empires/dynasties through out history display these colours.
The Ashoka chakra in the center came from the Mauryan Empire of the classical period.(320 BC ). Askoka was a Buddhist (Buddhism in Ashoka's time was also just another sect of Hinduism and was not considered as seperate as in today).
Mauryan Empire chakra ( 320 BC)
The Indian national emblem also came from Mauryan Empire
Gupta Empire emblem with Sanskrit inscription (350 AD )
Rashtrakuta Empire emblem (800 AD)
Tiger is one of the national animals of India.That came from the Cholan Empire.
Cholan Empire Flag (1000 AD)
Kakatiya dynasty (1100 AD)
Vijaya Nagar empire flag (1400 AD)
The Green came from the Mughal empire which preceded the Maratha Empire.Green is also the colour of Muslims to which the Mughal rulers belonged.
Mughal empire (1600s)
Flag of Maratha Empire (1700s)
Flag of Sikh empire (1800s)
During the freeedom movement, there were many discussions on what the national flag should look like. Some of the ideas which were flaoted then were similar to the following
Rashtriya Swayamsevak Sangh flag (taking inspiration from Hindu Swastika emblem)
Early Indian nationalist flag (early 1900s)
Indian national congress flag ( 1930s)
Azad Hind Fauj (Free Indian Army) of Subhas Chandra Bose ( 1940s)
Krinvanto Vishwam Aryam
(Make this World Noble)
This message has been edited by AryanArya on Aug 15, 2012 4:37 PM This message has been edited by AryanArya on Aug 15, 2012 4:25 PM This message has been edited by AryanArya on Aug 15, 2012 4:17 PM
>>>o Kronic you believe in all that courage, progress and all that cr@p associated with those colors? Why Green and Saffron? Why not Blue, Red or yellow? Waiting for your non-moronic answer.
Please see what Arya posted above. Otherwise this is avery helpful link> www.google.com
If you live in India and are near any Indian university go to the libary and read on Sub-continental history,
including the ghandi-nehru era.
R.K. Laxman, India's renowned cartoonist, honours the hardy & humble Indian Jawan
the, you are viewing this issue in a simplistic way which it is not.
Technically you are correct.Safforn is a Hindu colour and Green a Muslim one.During the 1920s, the major effort of the Freedom fighters (who are mostly Hindu) is to make sure that muslims also get involved in freedom fighting instead of acting as British sidekicks which they were. While the Hindus were fighting for freedom from the British, the Muslims were fighting Hindus in the name of muslim separatism, thereby benefitting the British. The Muslim league party itself was founded with British support with the explicit purpose to put some rivalry against Indian national congress. Gandhi naively thought that by giving concession to muslims in the form of inserting the green colour in the flag, the muslims will come back to the mainstream and wont think about Muslim separatism.As we all know now, that was a losing battle and the muslim appeasement did not change the attitude of muslims and eventually the muslims with generous British help partitioned India and created Pakistan.
But that is only one side of the story since viewing the flag through Hindu-Muslim lens was primarily a Gandhi thing since not all freedom fighters thought in a similar way.There were other freedom fighters like Tilak, Savarkar, Bose , Nehru (the latter three were born Hindu but atheists) for whom the tri colour appealed not because of any joint Hindu-Muslim religious sentiments but because of its relationship with the glory of pre-British India.Nehru for example was instrumental in having the Ashoka Chakra from Mauryan empire inserted into the flag. Savarkar (by no means a leftist and secularist like Gandhi or Nehru) also championed this flag since he saw Saffron not just as a 'Hindu colour' but also as a symbol of Maratha empire and in a broader sense, various Indian empires (excluding mughals) before while he saw Green as a symbol of life and vitality (a typical Hindu view of green colour). Bose on the other hand was a leftist but also a nationalist and he saw Safforn and Green as signifying all the Indian empires before (including Mughals).For them, these colours dont represent Hindus and Muslims as much as they represent the glory of the empires associated with them before. Every freedom fighter saw what he wanted to see in the flag and it slowly emerged as a consensus flag.
these colours dont represent Hindus and Muslims as much as they represent the glory of the empires associated with them before. Every freedom fighter saw what he wanted to see in the flag and it slowly emerged as a consensus flag.
Aryan, you are kind of agreeing with me but with lot of words.
As you said, the past glory of saffron is from hindu/sikh empires and the past glory of Green is from islamic(mughal ) etc past.
But it is politically incorrect to say these things so they come up with all kind of non-sense to hide this naked fact. But of course as is in hindu self hating mentality, once the green goes into flag, nobody can ever dare to remove it. But fall over each other to become holier than thou. And so the green stayed even though they now say green stands for yada yada yada. But the reason why green came in first place is for muslims. There is no denying this fact no matter how much they spin it.
\\Aryan, you are kind of agreeing with me but with lot of words.\\
Only partially.As i said you are seeing in a uni dimensional way while the reality is multi dimentional. Yes, initially when the flag was designed, Gandhi had Muslims in mind when asked for Green. But others like Savarkar and Bose did not had that in mind and YET they routed for this flag. Why do you think that is ? Because as i mentioned, they saw something else in that flag which Gandhi did not see. And to be fair to Gandhi, in 1947 he refused to hoist the tri colour since his ideal behind the tri colour, the Hindu-Muslim unity never materialised. But by that time, others freedom fighters who saw the flag in different perspective was in favour and Gandhi relented to go with it.
Well the real proof will be what if we try to remove green and lets say replace that with blue and say it represents the same values nobility etc all that cr@p. I guess you can imagine the kind of reaction you will get from muslims and pseudoseculars. That will prove that green is for muslims. Lets call a spade a spade.
I think if initially green was not there in flag and blue was there instead, sarvakar and bose would have been fine with that too. But then I am just guessing now. But probably a good guess.
\\Well the real proof will be what if we try to remove green and lets say replace that with blue and say it represents the same values nobility etc all that cr@p. I guess you can imagine the kind of reaction you will get from muslims and pseudoseculars.\\
More than Muslims, it would be the Hindus (psudo-secular and others as well) who will be against it.The Muslims are non entity in all of this.They are not involved in its design nor they care about it.You are simply looking at it in a simple 'Hindu-Muslim' thing while in reality for many Hindus, its much more than that as i explained before.
why do you celebrate it ?. The British "donated" it, because too scared of a half naked starved crazy man running around. If British didn't "donate" it and still under British administration, India would be much much better place
Must you troll everywhere you fetus eating baby pee licking piece of chingpanzee sh1t? I will come over there to your container park in Auzzie and extract a live dog out of yur a$$ that you have eaten unless you bow down like the sick man of asia. LOL! Now, Shooo...!
This message has been edited by the-me on Aug 17, 2012 10:01 AM
tell me which areas india are better now than when the British "donated" your independence in 1948 (64 years ago) ? ... everything is worse, everything is falling apart. Even English is proudly spoken by most of stupid india and most of them refuse to talk other state languages.
think before you open your dirty and stink mouth
you shouldn't celebrate it, you should be sad .. you should "beg" the British to come back to rule you
This message has been edited by AntiTerror13 on Aug 18, 2012 10:19 PM
Mao killed more chinese than the Japanese did in their entire occupation of China which suggests that Japanese are far more humane towards the chinese than the chinese themselves have been.Should'nt it be a good reason then for the Chinese to "beg" the Japanese back to rule them ?