Will the Central Division be updating their website soon,and will the Ontario Division have their own website this season!

They should have their own. We also should be finding out what each league will be calling themselves soon too, since it is now inevitable that this is two separate leagues now that the Ontario Conference teams basically up and walked out on the OJHL.

It's also getting messy, because the Ontario Conference, from what I understand, wants to keep the OJHL name for themselves, but the OHA has told them that they cannot. According to what I've heard, the OHA told them that since it is THEM that chose not to be a part of the league, and basically walked out on the league, that they may not have the name and are lucky to be keeping their OHA registration.

Not that I blame them for taking the ball and going home. It must be frustrating sitting at meetings and being out-voted all the time. Perhaps the Ontario Conference teams should just form an outlaw league?

guess: the classic/ontario conference will last at most one year before being de-sanctioned from the OHA/OHF/HC. I wouldn't be too surprised if they didn't last the summer or even the season.

$$PM87$$

PM, are you saying that the 15 teams in the Ontario Conference may not start the 2009/10 season.

You really believe that.

What do you base that conclusion on.


I`d like to take a piece of that action!!!!

SMC, I don't think he suggested they would fold or anything like that.

What he is saying is that the OC teams are really ticking off the OHA and HC by refusing to participate as members according to their rules...refusing to attend meetings, refusing to participate in votes, in fact...I heard that four teams threatened to withhold their OHA fees this season in protest of the Central holding 21 votes to the OC's 15.

The Ontario Conference has forced this split, make no mistake. They are acting, in the words of one OHL scout I speak to on occasion, "like spoiled little brats". Meanwhile, the Central has acted professionally, cooperatively, and completely within the rules of HC, the OHA, the league, and its own mandate. No wonder the OHA would be siding with the Central on this.

To all of those who still want to support the OC and its teams, I wonder how it feels to be backing the wrong horse?

Sharpie, I don't know what language you speak, but I think that PM"s statement is VERY CLEAR and to the point, which is that the OC may not survive the summer or next season.

Am I missing something here or as I said, you must speak another language that I am not aware of.

Does anyone else out there know something that some of us OC backers don't know???

prior to the split happening the classic/ontario conference was openly planning a counter-governors showcase on the same weekend in buffalo as the OJHL which had been awarded (by the last year's core no less!) to bowmanville. that was in direct conflict with the ojhl constitution..and even the central last year attended the gov showcase due to that rule.

already acting like rogues/renegades!

$$PM87$$

I guess the Central did not act as "Rogues and Renegades" last season when they went ahead and set up the "Battle of Ontario" amongst themselves and the CJHL leaving out some 40 plus Junior "A" teams in Ontario. Should be quite a "fiasco" this year trying to include all 21 teams or are the 8 originals going to keep the tournament to themselves for fear of icing a mediocre team, wouldn't surprise me.

And when the Central played their Christmas tournament in Newmarket amongst themselves, that was not really the work of "Rogues and Renegades" either I guess.

Now all of a sudden, the OC teams are considered "Rogues and Renegades" for apparently having the audacity to think about having a "Showcase Tournament" in Buffalo.

Come on PM, who's kidding who here!!!!!!!!!!!!!

The Central has been pulling this "Sh*t since the day they were formed and have gotten away with it.

"Sharpie, I don't know what language you speak, but I think that PM"s statement is VERY CLEAR and to the point, which is that the OC may not survive the summer or next season."

No, that was NOT the point of PM's post. The point, which was CRYSTAL CLEAR to anybody willing and able to understand context, was that the OC may not survive the summer or next season AS AN OHA OR HC SANCTIONED LEAGUE OR TEAMS. THAT is what PM was talking about, but you always twist context and meaning to suit your own needs, don't you? Must be the lawyer in you.

"I guess the Central did not act as "Rogues and Renegades" last season when they went ahead and set up the "Battle of Ontario" amongst themselves and the CJHL leaving out some 40 plus Junior "A" teams in Ontario."

What rule or clause in the constitution did they contravene? Cite it to me. There is absolutely nothing preventing teams or divisions from setting up their own showcases, tournaments, or games. Otherwise, teams going to play exhibition tourneys in the states and whatnot would be in violation every year.


Same goes with their other showcase weekend. They did not book a directly contradictory showcase to the governor's showcase...rather they participated in the showcase. The OC broke a specific clause in the Constitution by booking their own to directly contradict the REAL governor's showcase, and thereby refusing to participate in that event.

Of course, I keep forgetting...SMC never lets the facts get in the way of declaring his perception to be the ONLY truth.

Hey Sharpie, what does "de-sanction" mean in your world?

In my book being "de-sanctioned" by the OHA/OHF/HC means that your league is finished and competing for the DUDLEY/RBC is OUT as you become an "Outlaw League" and that is exactly what PM's statement implies. What in HELL are you saying other than a "mishmash" of words that go in all directions and far from the point. So again what in your opinion does "DE-SANCTIONED" mean.

There will be a "BLUE MOON" in the sky before the OHA/OHF/HC de-sanctions the Ontario Conference.

Also according to PM's statement, the OC was PLANNING a tournament in Buffalo, you make it sound like it is a done deal.

"There will be a "BLUE MOON" in the sky before the OHA/OHF/HC de-sanctions the Ontario Conference."

If they keep thumbing their nose at those bodies as they have, that is EXACTLY what will happen. Hockey Canada does not take kindly to teams refusing to attend meetings, threatening to withhold their fees, etc.

well..its was planned (of course it hadnt happened yet!)

but now that we have two leagues both sides will do what they want.

and sharpie was right on the money. the central last year went above and beyond the miminum specified events. in the run up to the league split the C/OC couldnt even follow the rules they adopted unanimously a meeting before let alone the minimum rules (e.g. all teams must participate in the governors showcase). if they cant agree to follow the rules they approve a month ago what makes you think they will follow any rules? thats why i think they will have a run in first with the OHA (it has happened once already at least...)and then escalate to the OHF and beyond. This is why I think they could be de-sanctioned from OHA play. Its not what I would want but it is possible. There are good teams in that mix and talented players who would be hurt and nobody wants that.

$$PM87$$

you know i was trying to think back if any of smc57's predictions about the future or structure of the ojhl/opjhl and the central division pilot project being on/off or even if it would be continued after the pilot. from my recollection, he didnt get any right...

smc57, are you sure you're not actaully working for the central putting out the cover stories to keep everyone of their enemies guessing? if so, great job!



$$PM87$$

OK PM, you have found me out, I'm working as an "undercover agent" for the Central Conference. My calling card is "008". LOL

Thanks for your reply and confirming exactly what I thought you mean't by your statement. Too bad Sharpie can't seem to comprehend. Don't know about that guy!!

To be "de-sanctioned" by the OHA/OHF/HC would be totally disasterous to any league. I'm sure that the Ontario Conference will not let that happen and I'm equally sure that the OHA/OHF/HC would not really want to "de-sanction" the Ontario Conference given the past record and history of the 15 teams involved.

SMC, in your first post in this thread, you specifically said that you read PM's post to mean that the OC teams would all cease to exist completely...you said nothing about de-sanctioning, so don't try to pretend you understood the original post.

Also, yes some of the teams involved in the OC have a rich history, and it would be sad to see them de-sanctioned for not playing by the rules now. However, they can also not use their history as an excuse to bend and outright break the rules now, and the OHA, OHF, and HC cannot be lenient with them if they do, because that sets a dangerous precedent for the future. The rules are the rules, no matter who breaks them or what their history is.

"Your honour, Mr. Bernardo's father was a proud member of the Kiwanis club for many years, and his mother reads to children in the hospital to this very day. His brother helped raise more than one hundred thousand dollars for people with special needs last year. So, because of the history that the Bernardo name has in the community, we ask you to be lenient as it relates to all charges involving these young girls..."

sharpie you are sick!!! get a life and keep your stupid comparisons to yourself. you are so engrossed in this b.s that it seems to be all consuming to you. get some help

Sharpie, I really am starting to think that you are "one brick short of a load".

PM's statement mentioned "de-sanctioning" by the OHA/OHF/HC, so what in the hell did you think I was talking about???

If the governing bodies "de-sanction" your league YOU ARE FINISHED. Can you apprehend that?? PM had no problem understanding what I mean't.

Your use of Bernardo as a comparison to the OC comes truly from a very SICK SICK mind, one that should not be involved in Junior hockey or any hockey for that matter. I knew people involved in the Bernardo case, you should be totally ashamed of yourself. You are one SICK PUPPY and should seek help.

Wingfan is too kind, if I were in the Ajax organization, you would be gone.!!!!
Ajax obviously don't know what they are getting in the likes of you, I guess the Waxers had one person that knew about you, thank God.

The comparison might be extreme, but how is it any different than what you yourself tried to suggest on here? You stated outright that your opinion is that because of their history, the teams in the OC should be allowed to get away with breaking whatever rules and by-laws they want, without risk of de-sanctioning. So, although it is not nearly at the same level, it is the same as when Bernardo's lawyers tried to do the same because of his family's history in the community. YOU made the suggestion that was comparable, so how is it that I am the sick puppy?

I apologize to anybody who might have been offended by the Bernardo reference. However, SMC, are you going to apologize to me, because I am deeply offended by the suggestion that just because of a team or group of teams' history that they should be allowed to turn their backs on and walk away from their own sanctioning body without any consequences of de-sanctioning. I doubt you will.

I've changed my opinion of you Sharpie, you are not "one brick short of a load" you are a "whole load short".

I never ever said that the governing bodies should turn there backs on sanctioning the OC if they break rules. What I mean't was that before they would do that I'm sure there would be sit down talks to try to correct the problems before the OHA et al would sanction the league made up of teams with a ton of history and championships.

And many call me the "Master of Spin".

And as far as the Bernardo reference, that was totally out of line and you know it. As I said I know people who suffered greatly from that case.

Keep it up my boy, your credibility etc wains with every one of your posts to the point that I don't think many really care about your opinions any more.

Don't get too settled in Ajax, you may not be there that long.

"I'm equally sure that the OHA/OHF/HC would not really want to "de-sanction" the Ontario Conference given the past record and history of the 15 teams involved."

That was your statement. Cut and dry. Not "I'm sure they would want to discuss it, work it out", not "I think they would think twice". Your exact statement was your certainty that no matter what they do, the 15 teams involved would not be de-sanctioned solely because of their history.

That is not spin, it is your words. The spin is your backpedalling and trying to change your meaning.

As for the Bernardo reference, yes I admitted it was extreme, and apologized if it was out of line. However, your statement was equally offensive to me, yet no apology will be forthcoming, I am sure. Offensive is offensive, regardless of extremity.

Now, now leave all you little boys alone in the sandbox unsupervised, and all you do is throw things and have little hissy fits.
Let it go people, this is not constructive, and certainly benefits no one. Air out your dirty laundry in your own glass houses.

Man you are "thick" Sharpie!!!

"would not really want to" means that before anything would be done there would be room for talks and discussions.

The fact that someone does not really want to take action leaves the door open for discussions etc.

I deal with this sort of thing every day.

Sharpie, by quoting SMC's exact words, you haven't exactly done yourself any favours. You are way wide of the mark on this one.

"Whateveritis"

Thank you for your comment.

Sharpie is not too sharp, in fact he is the dullest knife in the drawer.

He doesn't have a clue about what he mumbles about and sounds like a gossip mounger.
THE 15 TEAM ONTARIO CONFERENCE WILL BE ACTIVE FOR YEARS TO COME.

"puckstar"

I think everybody knows that the 15 team Ontario Conference league will be around for many many years, now that they are a separate league from the Central.

Go easy on Sharpie, I don't think he has had a great deal of experience in Junior "A" hockey at the owner or management level.

I would say from his comments etc, that he is young and hasn't been around a very long time. Just an abservation, I could be totally wrong.

Anyway, here's to the Ontario Conference, may it live on forever!!

Yeah, 12 years experience sitting in offices, joining conversations with management, making literally hundreds of friends in hockey (dozens of whom I still communicate with regularly)...no experience at all.

It is NOT a rumour that the OC teams refused to attend meetings as soon as they realized that their fifteen votes would never create a majority on any issue. It is NOT a rumour that at least four OC teams threatened to withhold their annual fees from OHA and HC if they did not take away the voting privileges of six Central teams to equalize the voting. It is NOT a rumour that a combination of these very childish acts was what prompted the OHA to split them into two leagues, and why the OHA will deny the OC the rights to the OJHL name (which will likely become defunct, although the OHA might always start a bidding war for the rights to the name, speculation only but would not surprise me). It is also NOT a rumour that the OHA and HC are fed up with the OC's antics, and it would not surprise me at all to see those teams de-sanctioned. They seem to want to be their own outlaw league anyways. Maybe all 15 teams could apply to join the GMHL???

Folks, when I speculate on something, I state outright that it is purely speculation. Also, unlike most of you, I put my name on everything I post, because I will not say anything on here which I do not stand behind 100%. If you talk to me at the rink, I will tell you the same thing to your face. I invite anybody to step out from behind the anonymity of the forums and do just that, because I love to talk about hockey, as well as about the business end of the game.

Question for you Sharp. With the OHA's decision to create two separate leagues, I heard they also provided teams in both groups a brief window of opportunity to change sides again. I did hear a couple of the 15 might want to join the Central. Can you shed any light on this? Will the Central grow some more in a couple of days?

I heard that they were considering offering a brief window as well, but I do not know any details about the opportunity to switch, or whether there would be any teams switching to or from the Central, and that is something I wouldn't even hazard a guess to speculate on.

Actually, there are three teams that I do have enough contact with to decisively say they will NOT be switching, and those are Ajax, Whitby, and Markham. All three will be remaining firmly in the Central.

No wonder Sharpie that these 3 teams that you are associated with wont change. They only have to take a bus to 2 or 3 trips. They are the cheapest teams in the league. Get your money upfront.

sharpie

before you go off on your tangent saying that the oha can desanction the 15 ontario conference, be careful.

if the oha tries to do this, they will face a lawsuit from each of those teams. i dont think they want that publicity nightmare. that will not happen.

eventually there will be 36 teams eligible to be in the 'elite' division. the oha has standards for this division, not all teams will meet this and will then move to development 1 or 2.

Please tell us all what standards will teams have to follow to be an Elite club,and the cost to the owners to have this type of club enter such a league..i would say not to many out of the 36 clubs that are all ready divided into two leagues as of today!

Sharpie:

Have you ever thought that it was a good strategic move on the part of the OC to refuse to attend the meetings, if in fact that is true, thus forcing the OHA to separate the OC and the CC into two separte leagues. Now the OC and the CC can govern themselves within their own league. It also leaves the CC with 15 new teams that can possibly out vote the original 8 teams.

If this is true, I think the OC made a good move and you can forget about the OC being de-santioned, that ain't going to happen now or ever, you can bet on that.

By the way apart from your 12 years of experience of office conversations with management, whatever that means, what positions have you held with Junior "A" teams during the same period?

Your 12 year experience certainly makes my 45 years of experience "pale" in comparison.

First of all, my experience working with Pickering, Whitby, Markham, and now Ajax is well documented, and well known around the league. If you are thick enough to have missed it, that's your own cranial density and that is not my problem.

Second, when did I ever compare my 12 years to your 45 or whatever it is? It was YOU who dismissed my experience as being nothing at all. Extremely rude, and extremely disrespectful. And I sincerely doubt you would have the courage or the pride to say the same things to my face if I were in a conversation with you at the rink, which renders your opinion truly meaningless to me. I know what the facts are, and who the truly good people in hockey are. And you are NOT one of them.

Sharpie states,

"I know what the facts are, and who the truly good people in hockey are"

Sharpie, I would have a field day with this one.Some of the people you continually surround yourself with have had questionable backgrounds and are not very well respected by a many a people. Give it a rest and stop acting so pompous on the cage. Do you really want to open up another can of worms with the quoted statement of yours-"trully good people in hockey"...............give me a friggin break.

Yeah, TS, like you've got any kind of network in hockey of which to speak.

I like KP too, but the word around the rink is that the only reason you're kissing his tail so much is that you want to get your kid onto a Jr. A team, and nobody else will have you so you're trying to cozy up.

According to one scout I spoke to, when I asked "Will his kid ever have a shot at Jr. A?" (in reference to you), his response was "To put up with his father, the kid would have to be better than Bobby Orr, and he's not; so the answer is no." So now, I guess you figure if word gets out that you are big on KP, he will take a look at your kid.

Good luck to you.

Sharpie.....how old are you? You sound alittle bitter and jaded with your personal attacks

I'm 34 years old, and I'm neither bitter nor jaded. I enjoy everything about Jr. A hockey.

What I get sick and tired of is people taking subtle and sometimes not-so-subtle cheap shots at friends of mine who do not happen to frequent these forums.

If you want to debate hockey, then that's fine. But taking cheap shots at good, hard-working people within the game for no legitimate reason is ridiculous, and I will always defend a friend when he or she is attacked.

Sharpie, 34 years old? Your just diaper meat in hockey terms. You do not even have a clue what your talking about. You talk to a hockey scout to get your info, you wouldn't be talking to the socalled Windsor scout on the Ajax Attack, would you? Is that the same scout that has to buy his way onto a team because he doesn't have the faith in his kid to make it on his own. Is this the same scout who has to be on the bench, because he's afraid a real coach will really coach. Hmm

Sharpie, you state,

"friends of mine who do not happen to frequent these forums."

Sharpie, you don't even know how to lie properly. Let me give you some advice, your making a fool of yourself not only to ripper but to many others.

TS, when are you going to get it through your skull that your opinion of me doesn't mean bugger all to me?

I've been in and around Jr. A for twelve years. How about you? You may know a lot of Jr. A Hockey people, but they all have a very low opinion of you.

I would give you a fair chance and formulate my own opinion, but you've never once taken me up on my offer to meet me face to face, shake my hand, look me in the eye and debate hockey matters with me. So, if you choose to hide behind the forums, then that's fine. But don't expect your opinion to be worth anything to me.

Like I said though, you take shots at my friends, I will defend them, especially the ones who aren't on here to read it for themselves or defend themselves.

i have to wade in on this, i still question whether ripper is ts but i do know one thing. his kid has never had a problem finding a team to play for. everyone that knows his kid knows that not only is he a good player on the ice but also one of the most respectful and coachable kids a team could have. sharpie, your information is wrong and whoever is feeding you is wrong as well, cause from what i hear js will be playing out of town due to schooling. my contacts on pickering say js has not even skated with pickering and the guys on the team that know ts say he's not even interested nor is it possible due to school.

as for ts, do i know him, yes i do. ask anyone that knows tom and they will tell you that he is an idealist in a hockey world thats not ideal. i do know he has a lot of friends in hockey who like him but it appears the only people that don't like him are the parents of defencemen who are very jealous of his kid or coaches or gms that he has stood up to because they abused their positions. knowing tom nothing will change.

Get a life.... Rip is a ass when it coms to JR hockey,my kid would kick his boys butt day in day out, and first year as a minor midget player bring it on RIPPER!

Money talks bs walks my man!!!