Hi there! Let me introduce myself, I'm James, and I have phimosis.
I am 23 now, and found out I had it when I was about 20. I read up on it, got scared to death at the prospect of circumcision, so started doing a few excercises and gently tried to retract further and futher. This worked reasonably well, but I soon stopped because I feared that if I stretched any further, I would get the foreskin trapped behidn the glans (something I nearly did once and it scared the life out of me!)
Now I am engaged to be married, and both me and my wife are virgins and will remain so until our wedding night, due to our shared beliefs. I originally thought that I would have to have a circumcision (and QUiCK! 8 months to go before the wedding) but after reading your boards I have come to the conclusion that if I do gentle stretching every day, and perhaps with you guys help and assistance, I will be alright. In the 2 days ive been doing it, I can get 2 fingers inside my foreskin to pull it apart a bit, and can almost retract to the end of the glans when flacid, and about 2/3 the way when erect (I stop from going furhter for fear of paraphimosis - am I being paranoid or wise? Shoudl I keep going further)
Is anyone here in similar state to me? Whats sex like with phimosis? Is it possible? Painful? Pleasurable? I understnad that for sex to be good it is important the glans are uncovered during penetration (right? Excuse my ignorance, Im a virgin so havnt tried lol) but im worried about paraphimosis? I assume there are some here who have done stretching and been able to achieve full retraction?
Congratulations on the engagement, and upon your commitment to remain virgins until the wedding. You are indeed are rare breed. I'm glad that you found us, for what you can achieve from our simple instructions will reward you and your future bride for the rest of your lives.
Keep doing the stretching and don't hesitate to retract further. Paraphimosis is really nothing to worry about at your age. The way it results is from neglect to take action. Your foreskin is already quite flexilbe, and will return back over the glans with some gentle tugging, and you'll have plenty of time to do it in the event it offers resistance.
JamesUK (no login)
December 18 2004, 6:29 AM
Thank you for the welcome! I think that if I were a little braver, I could probably retract fully when flacid if the glans were wet (from shower or urination) but I am just being super cautious, and might leave that for a month or so after doing stretching. I already seemed to have made good progress with just 2 days worth of stretching, so Im sure after a while I will be ready to try full retraction.
Is there a quick way out of paraphimosis if it should happen? When I retract as far as I can when erect, it does feel quite tight and with some swelling of the glans, so thats why I dont attempt any further, just in case. If I can keep up the stretching and I notice a widening, I will attempt it, but the last thing I want is a trip to the surgery!
These are the things Ive noticed so far, and a few questions, perhaps some of you have comments on them:
1) When attempting to urinate with any kind of retraction, it goes all over the place in about 8 out of 10 attempts. Somtimes a straight stream will come out altho it feels like I have to strain to do this. So I prefer to urinate with foreskin completly forward, much tidier!
2) When attempting retraction I can fold the foreskin about 2/3s the way down the glans and it will stay there when I'm semi-erect, but often the foreskin looks a bit...its hard to explain.. like baggy, too much skin? Beause the skin has made a fold, and there is one area where it seems there is too much skin and its just empty, like a half deflated balloon? Maybe this is perfectly normal, or I have a long foreskin. (The stretching seems to be making it longer too, but then again I suppose it wouldnt, woudlnt it?)
3) When stretching, I am holing the foreskin from its very edges and pulling it apart, is that right? Because that just seems to stretch the outer skin, rather than the inner opening, which is what Id imagine needs stretching? I was pleased with myself last night, I was able to insert both my THUMBS into the opening and pull it apart for a while in the shower, is this a good thing to keep up?
4) I am worried about getting infection from putting dirty or infected hands into the opening. For instanec, if I have a cold, would it be inadvisable to do the stretching (germs, bacteria on hands from touching hankerchiefs etc going onto foreskin or glans?) and should you wash your hands fully before doing stretching, or can you do it at any time? I'm not one who can hold it open for 5-10 mins, I just do it briefly but often.
Im sure with all your help I will continue to make good progress and I'm very glad to have found this site.
Be brave. Nothing ventured, nothing gained. Please read Paul's explanation of paraphimosis. Trust us on this one. You won't have a problem unless you pass out and neglect it for several hours. Squeezing the glans will make it smaller and allow the skin to recover it.
1. If you are having problems urinating with the skin pulled back, leave it forward. When finished, retract at that time to exercise the skin. Once you have completed the stretching process, you can resume your effort to pee with the skin back. Lots of men do this, so it is possible for you to master also, and is really advisable because it keeps the skin flexible.
2. There's a saying about not having too much money or too much foreskin. Hey, we're all different, so whatever you have is right for you. There is bound to be some bunching up as the retraction takes place. Keep in mind that your body is not symetrical, so one side could have more skin than the other. Stretching the opening shouldn't necessarily make the foreskin longer.
3. Try this:
4. This shouldn't be a problem. Guys have been handling their penises for many thousands of years without causing themselves to become infected, so you won't be a first. However I would think you would already have clean enough hands before you start this process. In itself, the penis is not a dirty part of the body as, for example, the other part of our elimination system. Urine is actually sterile as it is excreted, and smegma is no different from the oils produced by your skin in other parts of the body. The myth that they are dirty was created by some very sick minds in the 1800s, eventually leading to the crazy practice of altering baby boys' bodies to prevent them from being dirty. It just isn't so. Washing hands before handling the penis is, however, vital in the case of smokers, but what does it matter, for the cigarettes will get them one way or another, regardless of the care they take.
"Is there a quick way out of paraphimosis if it should happen?" Yes, just grab the foreskin behind the head on both sides (may need dry fingers or a cloth to get a good grip) and pull the foreskin forward as firmly as necessary.
It's that simple.
You need to read the "thread" just before this one where I deal specifically with the urination matter. Then you should read through a number of the others - most of this has been explained before, more than once, and applies to yourself.
If you have fingers inside the foreskin, pulling apart, you will feel the tight part, and that it the part that requires the stretching.
If you have clean hands - and Jim has mentioned the incredibly foolish habit of smoking which I presume your beliefs expressly forbid - then you are not going to cause trouble with your foreskin. Just wash them first, that's all. If you have a cold, you have a cold; it's already in your body so it makes no difference.
The only thing about which you have to be careful is if you have a "cold sore" which you could transfer to your penis if you did not wash (your hands) carefully between touching either place.
Jim and I are both particularly pleased to help and guide those who acknowledge the risen Christ, though we are equally committed to helping those whose understanding does not follow the same path - you may note we try and focus on what He did - teaching the importance of love and respect for partners.
I'm sure you can find the answers you seek in older messages, and I think you should research and do this, so I'll be briefer than I might if I were to try and explain in every last detail.
I should be surprised if you did not masturbate, notwithstanding what your beliefs may be. The Bible in no way mentions directly or condemns this practice, though makes some oblique references to it in the Old Testament Deuteronomic law. The reason for mentioning this, is to make it clear that if masturbation is not only possible but comfortable and even pleasurable with a non-retractile foreskin, it takes little common-sense to realise that intercourse should be the same.
Next, you mention paraphimosis. Were you to constrain yourself to reading reputable descriptions on this matter, you would realise that this problem is essentially limited to those who are unable to look after themselves, viz.; children who lack practical skills, the elderly who are enfeebled and demented, the very ill who are unconscious (and those under anaesthesia if not competently managed by medical staff) and those who render themselves incompetent by taking alcohol or drugs.
The over-arching principle is that if in the process of stretching, you pull your foreskin behind your glans, then you can pull it forward again provided that you do so reasonably promptly - and this means within minutes and hours, not seconds. You should acquaint yourself (read through the older postings here) with the method(s) in advance. Nevertheless, it really isn't a difficult matter.
To give you perspective, let me suggest to you that with very few medical exceptions indeed, of which simple phimosis is definitely not one, circumcision remains in essence a ritual mutilation of the genitals (and that includes all the related procedures practiced on women and girls) whose motivation is conformity with the beliefs of the circumciser. I put it to you that if that is what you want, and only if that is what you want, then you might consider it.
Next, be reassured that stretching with the fingers is more effective than using your erect penis to stretch against (and of course, stretching against your flaccid penis is quite impossible anyway).
What this means, is that at some point as a result of stretching, you will be able to pull gently and your foreskin will retract behind your glans. Obviously if it retracts easily, it will be equally easy to pull it forward again. Also obvious is that if it can be pulled forward again easily without an erection, then getting caught behind an erection is not a problem since all that is necessary is to "lose" the erection.
"Good sex" means different things to different people. All too many men try to emulate either animal copulation or what they view on pornography which rarely resembles reality (especially when it comes to female behaviour). My "take" is that your wife's expressions of pleasure are, and certainly should be, more sexually stimulating than the sensations of your penis, and that is by what "good" sex is measured.
I will therefore summarise it by stating that many men (and in a world context, millions!) are completely satisfied by having (varied modes of) sex, and fathering children, despite a completely non-retractile foreskin. Nevertheless it is reasonable to say that sex with a retractile foreskin (that is, one that will both cover and uncover the glans during thrusting) is probably better than with one that is always covering, and that either of these conditions is better than having a circumcised penis with neither the protection of sensitivity, nor "buffering" action in intercourse, that the foreskin provides.
One situation however, may be a problem - where the foreskin will retract but only with difficulty over the erect glans, this retraction may prove painful when it is forced back during thrusting in intercourse.
This is not a problem with a very tight foreskin as if it does not come back at all, it cannot get to the point of tightness, and of course it is not a problem if the foreskin comes back easily either. This may mean there is a "touchy", temporary point in the process of stretching. In your case though, eight months sounds more than enough to get beyond that point.
JamesUK (no login)
Re: Came to the right place then!
December 18 2004, 2:18 PM
Thanks again for the comments... today I managed to retract as far as the rim (I forget what the band is called, is it the phimotic band or something?) which was a sort of blueish/red colour. I have never seen it so uncovered before, so I must be doing something right. I noticed a nasty smell (slightly cheesy, a bit of a smegma sort of smell) - if I am able to retract to this point, is there anything I shoudl do to clean the area? In past I have retracted as far as comfortable, then poured a little water over the glans, and that was it. How should I go about cleaning this area, or do I just put it under the shower head?
I did get an email from a very pro-circ guy (who was circumcised at birth) who insists that the reason for a fully retracting foreskin is that it is the rim of the glans which stimulates the womans vagina, so when a guy cant retract, hes effectivly masturbating himself within the sheaf of the foreskin, and not pleasuring his wife as fully as he should if he could retract. Is this correct?
Thanks for your common sense points about paraphimosis. If I can get it back, surely I can get it forward again. It was just a worry when it seemed very tight, but since the stretching I havnt reached a point when it seems in danger of "choking" me! Looking good so far, only 2 days in ! 8 months to go! :-D thanks guys
Don't worry too much yet about cleaning. The smegma thus far has not created a problem, so in the next few short weeks, it's not likely to be a problem. Plain water is the best substance to use in order to prevent irritations caused by soaps. Clean what is easy to reach.
These guys who make comments about the role of the glans, and the problem of having a foreskin in the way simply don't take into account the history of man. Think about how many billions of intact men there have been throughout the ages who have not given the position of their foreskins a second thought while they are making love. Obviously, something was working right, wasn't it? Let's look at this man's particular situation. He didn't have a choice in the matter of losing his foreskin, did he? He is male, owner of a fragile ego, right. Men have a difficult time with expressing loss, and especially so when it involves their masculinity, and what is more graphic than a penis to display masculinity? Without a great deal of courage, he is not likely to face the truth of his loss, so he's simply covering his inner true feelings with this idea that he's enjoying better sex without his foreskin. If he were correct in his assertion, why are some 80 to 85% of the world's males chosing to remain intact? Obviously, if losing the foreskin were beneficial to sexual feelings, the word would get around, and men would be lining up to get shorn. Dismiss this man's thoughts as being simply folly.
No, the "rim" of the penis is called the corona (Latin: crown). The "Phimotic band" was just a little-known rock group back in the '70s.
The "ridged band" is a name given to the sort of "concertina-like" part that closes your foreskin over - that's its function, to "seal in" the penis and - keep it clean - until you need to use it each time. Obviously in your case, it's too tight at present, but stretching it is the way to go.
The "bluish-red" (Royal Purple) colour of your glans is because the skin is very sensitive, relatively thin as skin goes, and moist, so you can see the colour of the blood vessels without the gray-white "glaze" of thicker skin if it were more exposed. I think you'll find it goes a little pinker when you have an erection; the bluish tinge means the blood is moving relatively slowly - especially if it is cold.
Now as Jim says, you don't need to get too upset over the smegma - it's been there for ages and nothing has dropped off so far! However you will prefer to keep it washed to control the "sweaty" smell (just as you have to wash your groin and armpits to manage the sweaty smell there, which is probably stronger). It's a sort of a balance - the "musk" smell is of course a sexual attractant (except to those who have sexual problems), but too much "sweaty" smell can be hard to take.
I do actually suggest you make a habit of putting it under the shower head every time you wash. You'll learn some things about your sensitivity, such as that showering the top of the glans is more unpleasant than sexy, whilst spraying underneath (if you have a mobile shower head) can be used to masturbate. (YMMV however!)
Hmmm. You haven't lodged an e-mail address here (not necessary - we like to keep everything in the open so people can see whether what we - and others - say is sensible or rubbish and make their own decisions), so from which forum list did you cop this funny "pro-circ" guy?
Sexology 101: There is something you really need to know about a woman's vagina - you will be able to confirm it for yourself in due course - it has almost no feeling. So it cannot be "stimulated" by the corona. Only the outer third (as they say) - the area of the hymen - actually has sensation, even pain sensation. The inner part can be cut, burnt, frozen, injected; with only very fuzzy sensation.
Of course, only doctors do those funny things, since the vagina is normally hidden and protected except from the stray penis which hardly constitutes a "sharp object", it has no need for such accurate sensation, and it has been noted, you would not want such sensation during childbirth.
Pushing on the cervix (in certain positions or with a long penis that permits this) produces an internal "sinking" sensation by stretching the inside lining of the abdomen, which is as likely to be unpleasant as desirable, particularly early in intercourse. The "G-spot" is the "trigone" of the bladder felt through the vaginal wall, essentially the same area as the prostate in the male, and firm stroking of it produces the pleasurable sensations that relate to peeing and ejaculation.
Now if you recall back to the "ridged band" of the foreskin, it is interesting to note that the vagina has "rugae" or circular "concertina" ridges which do two things - they stroke the penis, pulling the foreskin back on the in-stroke and forward on the out-stroke, so they are there for male pleasure even though the woman does not feel it; and the "concertina" effect permits the vagina to stretch for childbirth. Neat, eh?
Of course, the woman's sexual sensation is in the clitoris, same as your glans, and the labia, of which the inner lips correspond to your foreskin (so the practice of female "circumcision" is directly comparable to male). And contrary to what is implied in pornography, women enjoy stimulation of all these areas (and more), not just the clitoris, whilst vaginal stimulation alone is of virtually no interest.
Your correspondent regarding the "rim of the glans which stimulates the womans vagina" is therefore simply ignorant (and by implication - is probably also a "loser" whose relationships with women or wife are infrequent and unsatisfying, since his partners wouldn't tolerate his self-indulgent fumbling very well).
As to masturbation, it is a further sign of the "loser" that he makes a distinction between masturbation and "real" sex. In reality, they are part of the same continuum - what is called "mutual masturbation" is enjoyed by many couples just as much and sometimes more than intercourse - if you have read adequately on this subject you will note that most women do not experience orgasm from the penile thrusting of intercourse (because as stated - the vagina is minimally sexually sensitive) but rather from manual stroking.
I seem to have covered a rather wide field here, but therein is the point - you have to know all this to understand the situation - it's not just a "simple" matter of a foreskin not retracting - and that being some supposedly critical problem - but rather a complete understanding of the overall process of sexual functioning.
And yes, it sounds as if you have the "paraphimosis" concept in hand now - "common sense" is the operative term.
Hi guys! Im so glad I found this place, its quite an education!
Paul -- when I was talking about the "bluish-red" part I wasnt referring to my glans. Basically, its the (lower) edge of the glans, the part where the glans "stop", it has a definate edge, and I suppose the ultimate aim is to be able to retract beyond this point when erect. I have almost managed this when flacid. And today, for the first time in my life - I CAN URINATE WHEN FULLY RETRACTED! And it doesnt make a mess! Only squirts a little when I first start and when I finish, after that its perfect! Yes gentleman, all this can be yours with a few days of stretching and NO CREAMS! :-D
Attempted further retraction while erect, and while the foreskin seems to be able to slip back and forth (to about 2/3s the way) while erect with the minimum of pulling, it can be a bit problematic getting it to its normal forward state, the outer edges (the ridged band?) seem to sort of get folder on itself, so I no longer have an definate rim/edge, more of a smooth hole (sorry if that doenst make sense, its very hard to explain, but I dont think its anything to worry about)
Thanks for the info on showering. Ill try that underside thing. In the past Ive tried to shower it directly but didnt find it too pleasant, understandably. (What does YMMV mean?) Should retracting as far as I go and pouring warm water over it suffice? I rememeber reading somewhere that the glans need the same ammount of direct cleaning that your eyeball does - i.e none!
I dont leave an email address because I dont want more spam than I have already, and I dont want more dubious "experts" telling me what to do. I trust you guys so Ill come here for my advice. If any want to talk to me direct, let me know and Ill email you myself. I got this guy from one of the alt.circumcision or alt.sexuality groups, I forget where. Anyway I shall be discounting all his advice, as even I could tell that it didnt sound right to me, when I was reading it.
Thanks for the Sexology 101, Paul B, you confirmed what I thought was correct anyway, but I had doubts thanks to the confusing email I got. I think Jims theory on the writer is correct! Thanks!
One final question - I'm not so keen on pulling my foreskin apart for long periods of time (I can manage a few minutes before my hand gets bored or I end up loosing cos it slips off my fingers)... would getting erect, retracting the foreskin to its maximum ammount and leaving it there for as long as possible give adequate stretching, or is this not as effective as just giving it a good pull with the fingers? When erect my foreskin stays where I leave it, most of the time.
Thanks again for all your advice and time, I really do appreciate it, and I'm sure my wife will be thanking you in 8 months time, too :D
Thanks for the vote of confidence. It's good to know when someone appreciates our advice and then actually makes use of it!
The edge of the glans, which, btw is singular, is called the corona. The little groove just past the corona is called the sulcus. Yes, it is desirable to retract to just past the corona. Some guys have the ability even to flatten the pulled back skin, a feat which depends upon the flexibility of the frenulum. Congratulations on your new method of peeing. Yes, anyone can accomplish this with the right attitude AND implementation.
We'll have to wait for Paul to interpret that little code. I have no clue either.
I understand your reluctance to post an email address. If you'll notice, neither I nor Paul does either, and so far it's working just fine.
I still maintain that using your fingers to do the stretching is preferable to allowing your erect penis to do the job for you. The reason I feel this way is that you create more tension through your fingers. It really doesn't take a lot of time or effort when you think about it. Look at the progress you've already made. Since your at least half-way there, just bite the bulllet and complete the job with your finger. Of course, erections help, but with most young guys, it's the manipulation that does the job.
Yes, the "edge" part of the glans is as I say, called the "corona", and this part as you say, is the more likely to show that colouration.
Little odd behaviours of your foreskin when you pull it forward again are to be expected, due to friction and will "straighten themselves out" over a few minutes as the skin slips back into its original position.
YMMV is a very standard acronym - Jim, I'm surprised at you! And it's not as if it isn't easy to look up the term when you're online!
Well, I wouldn't go so far as to say the penis needs no cleaning, though I would say that I believe it has (in addition to urinating itself) a mechanism for regular (daily?) cleaning which is effected by having intercourse - and failing that, masturbation. But since perhaps neither of these might be enjoyed quite that regularly, then daily cleaning sounds a good idea to me and I do feel that something just a little more vigorous than pouring water over, might be good, which is why I suggest a shower, or "swishing" in either in a bowl or bath.
I'm really not keen to make a big thing of it, except to say that there should be no reason to suggest anything rough (such as a facecloth) with intent to "de-sensitise" it. I mention this as considering its actual purpose, it has no need whatsoever to be deliberately "de-sensitised".
Similarly soap is not a good idea, so that whilst people often say that they have used soap for years/ a lifetime on their glans with no ill effects, and I have little reason to doubt them, if anything should go wrong with the glans, the very first item to be suspected of causing trouble, would be the use of soap.
As Jim says, we do not post e-mail addresses in general, though I think mine comes up from time to time when the system "remembers" me.
Anyway, as stretching goes, I think "every little bit helps", but you will undoubtedly find that stretching with fingers is substantially more (speedily) effective than with your erect glans - which really doesn't get that "hard" when it comes to stretching - and you also need to stretch it "oversize" to get it to become comfortably loose. Nevertheless, you don't have to get ridiculous about it - however long you can manage to hold a stretch with your fingers, then that's probably the right amount of stretching for you.
Please note - use "Preview" to check what you have written and how it will appear before you "Respond", and because this forum is moderated, you will not then see your submission until the moderator has a chance to confirm it.