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Greedy Urologists

April 18 2012 at 4:46 PM
Gupta  (no login)

Hi

I'm 22 years old and live in Delhi, India. Around four weeks ago, I tried having sex with my girlfriend for the second time. And like the previous time, this attempt too failed. Earlier, we had attributed it to nervousness/ inexperience/ tightness. This time however, the foreskin of my penis had retracted 25% of the way to the glans. It was very painful and the exposed glans was incredibly sensitive. I had never seen my exposed glans before, and was quite alarmed. I had no idea that the foreskin was supposed to retract all the way while having sex. I thought that an intact penis' foreskin wasnt supposed to retract ever. I thought that all porn actors were circumsized.

In a flaccid state, my foreskin would retract to around 10% of the length of the glans, after which it would hurt. In an erect state, attempting to pull back the skin even slightly further than the 5% it was on its own would really hurt.

The next day I showed myself to a senior urologist in a very good hospital. He told me try to retract my foreskin and when he saw how far it would go, he declared it to be phimotic. He recommended circumcision, told me it was the most normal course of action, and brushed away my concerns about loss of sensitivity with "you'll last longer". 15 minutes later the accounts department had handed me an estimate of how much the surgery would cost.

I talked to an uncle of mine, who is a gastroenterologist in the US, who told me that circumcision is normally the last resort, and I should get a second opinion. He talked to his colleagues, who recommended another urologist in Delhi. When i went to him, he himself tried pulling back my foreskin. To my surprise, he was able to pull it back completely behind the glans. it took some effort, and it hurt, but not as much as I thought it would. The glans was super-sensitive. The foreskin moving back over the glans for the first time looked kind of like two surfaces glued together getting unstuck. He said that I had a normal penis, with the ring slightly tight. He asked me to retract it on my own, and the same thing happened. my penis looked cpnstricted wherever the ring happened to be while pulling it down, but atleast it could be done.

He said that the easiest thing for him would have been to recommended circumcision, but it obviously wasn't the right thing to do. He told me to practice moving the skin up and down over the glans in a flaccid state for around a month, and then proceed to doing it when its erect.

In the three weeks since, the progress has been pretty great. When flaccid, the foreskin moves freely up and down, and you can barely see any constriction. When erect, it freely moves to around 75% of the length to the base of the glans. With a little effort, it moves down even further below the base of the glans. It doesn't even hurt much.

When I first read online about phimosis, I was directed to a lot of pro-circumcision websites. I'm really glad I was not suckered into getting what is so obviously a mutilated penis. Im sure this happens pretty often.

 
    
AuthorReply
Jim
(Premier Login jimsplacetofixthings)
Forum Owner

Even in India?

April 18 2012, 5:32 PM 

I'm amazed. My neighbor is an Indian physician, and I've often wondered what his opionion on the subject might be. He serves a community of immigrants from Mexico whose culture does not embrace circumcision.

Your progress is remarkable considering that you make no claims to using our recommended techniques. I suggest that you puruse this page and read every thread. You'll find a link and some pictures to guide you in very effective methods.

 
    
Gupta
(Login apoorv89)

Re: Even in India?

April 18 2012, 7:00 PM 

Hindu culture doesn't embrace circumcision either. In fact, things being the way they are between hindus and muslims, the state of your penis acquires even more significance.

I did try using some of the methods suggested here and on other sites. But since one of my wrists is fractured and in a cast, its a little difficult. And I was making very good progress by just moving the skin up and down. Also, 10 days after I started, I met him again to discuss my progress. I asked him about the stretching exercises that you mention. He seemed very reluctant for me to try them. He said that there's a chance that if I overdo it, scars might develop which could make it even tighter.

The way I figured, forcing the skin past the point that it would go comfortably was just another way of stretching it. Instead of my fingers forcing it wider, it was the width of my penis. Going by that logic, I thought that if I could somehow get my foreskin further down my erect penis, it would stretch it even more. So I pulled the foreskin back behind the glans in a flaccid state, and then got erect. I'd read about how it might get stuck behind the glans( which it did), and what to do in case it did, so I wasn't too alarmed. I held it in that position for as long as I could before the pain became unbearable, after which I pushed down on the glans, and with some effort pulled my skin back up. My urologist didn't like this method either. Same reasons.

 
    
Jim
(Premier Login jimsplacetofixthings)
Forum Owner

Myths

April 19 2012, 1:29 PM 

His beliefs about scar tissue are totally ridiculous. Any overdoing which could cause such trauma would hurt too much to endure it. In stretching, you are in a sense "damaging" the tissue, but it is the method the body uses to grow, so it's completely safe. A similar method is used in weight training. When you see him again, you might remind him of skin expansion techniques used with burn victims.

 
    

(Login Paul_B.)

Good points.

April 19 2012, 3:32 PM 

Noted the problems with the cultural primitives.

The concern about stretching "causing scarring" appears as a common mythology even among some doctors it seems - strange considering that urologists in particular actually perform procedures in which they dilate the urethra well beyond the level of comfort (thus: using anaesthesia). This is a gross confusion of cause and effect - stretching techniques are commonly required in medicine to treat conditions caused by scarring, the stretching is not what was responsible for the scarring.

In this case, any disease (as we discuss) which causes scarring, makes stretching more difficult and demonstrates as fissuring, but the fissuring is strictly a manifestation of the disease.

It is the case that techniques (as are used medically for "skin expansion") employing less force but applied most or all of the time are the most effective. Having only one hand free is clearly a major limitation but until that is solved you might look into using some sort of "device" to stretch - for much of the time - without even needing your hands.

Stretching by retraction only will be effective to some extent - after all, it is how the foreskin naturally becomes retractile in the first place - but will try your patience.

 
    

(Login phimosis)

Re: Greedy Urologists

April 24 2012, 1:15 PM 

Hey gupta,
Can u tell me the name of the doctor u talked about in your description.I also nead to see him regarding the phimosis thing.

 
    

(Login apoorv89)

Re: Greedy Urologists

April 26 2012, 1:29 AM 

His name is Dr Gagan Gautam. His office is at Medicity in Gurgaon.
The hospital I'd gone to earlier was Max, Saket.

 
    

(Login phimosis)

Re: Greedy Urologists

April 26 2012, 1:23 PM 

Thanx for the info.
I am really unable to decide whether to consult a doctor or not.
Non retraction of my foreskin has never posed any problem to me. I don't feel any pain in urinating etc.If i meet a doctor he might suggest me a Circumcision.
What is the fees of medanta doctor and will i get his appointment in a weeks time?

 
    

(Login Paul_B.)

If you don't want a circumcision

April 26 2012, 2:44 PM 

... and it would be very foolish indeed to do so, then what do you expect the doctor to do for you otherwise? Gupta has described that the good doctor simply demonstrated that the foreskin could be retracted and that he continued to do that. You can do the same without seeing the doctor, you don't need to be told "whether" you can stretch or not and you don't ever "need" a circumcision, even if you cannot retract at all - as you point out yourself.

If you do want to make your foreskin retractable, then you have all the information to do so, right here.

 
    

(Login apoorv89)

Re: Greedy Urologists

April 28 2012, 11:18 AM 

My friend, who had a similar problem, got an appointment the very next day. His fees is around 600 rupees. Incidentally, he told him the exact same thing, that with retracting the skin daily his condition would improve.

Paul, the problem is that the internet is full of conflicting information. For every website that advises against circumcision, there is a page that claims that those people don't have a clue and are deliberately misguiding people. Mayan would probably feel far more comfortable if a medical professional told him that he didn't need a circumcision. On the other hand, he'd only get more confused if the 'good' doctor decides that a circumcision is needed in his case.

Mayan, you need to understand that you can't undo a circumcision. Try the methods mentioned here for a while and be patient. There's nothing to lose. Just requires a couple of months, or more, of dedicated effort. In case you don't see any results, which is unlikely, there will always be plenty of urologists just waiting to cut you up.

I'm just really glad that the moderators of this forum take so much time and effort to give detailed advice to every single guy who creates a new topic. Even though the advice is mostly the same in each case, as someone mentioned on a previous page, everyone thinks that their situation is unique. Thanks a lot you guys.

 
    
Jim
(Premier Login jimsplacetofixthings)
Forum Owner

Professionals?

April 28 2012, 7:05 PM 

Don't overlook the fact that professionals advise circumcisions and carry them out!

How can you be so sure you haven't already had the advice of a competent professional? The answer is in the results posted on these numberous pages. We don't make up this stuff!

 
    

(Login Paul_B.)

Oh yes, I do realise

April 28 2012, 10:20 PM 

that the Internet is full of evil.

Nothing much that I can do about it, except as I do here, to provide factual advice in as clear a manner as possible.

Why do people promote circumcision? Well, this is not a "cut and dried" matter; there are clearly a variety of reasons contributing, not all representing clear malice.

In regard to men that are circumcised (and their female partners), there is the "misery loves company" aspect. They have no real way of reversing the circumcision, usually done to them at the behest of a parent and possibly a doctor, which makes it quite difficult to accept that those who did this and whom they would like to regard with affection and respect, were in fact (respectively) either quite stupid, abusive or both. Respect for parents is after all, fundamental to culture and respect for doctors, fundamental to health.

It is very uncomfortable indeed to know that you have been deliberately harmed by these people. It is consequently, difficult to accept this, and becomes quite attractive to believe that it was in fact, the "correct" thing to do and has somehow benefited oneself, which then unfortunately demands that the harm be performed in turn on children or clientèle - a "vicious cycle" of abuse.

And we can only suppose that those who as adults, actually choose circumcision even without any apparent justification, are reflecting the psychological damage consequent to an abused past.

For doctors, it also becomes profitable and an exhibition of "mastery", both very strong motivations. This would readily explain the attitude of your "senior urologist"(!), even presumably, if he happened not to be circumcised himself.

One really does have to be concerned about someone who is not circumcised, recommending it for any reason. Either the profit motive has predominated over any regard whatsoever for the patient's welfare, or he really does not value sexual function and by that implication his own sexual function since he should (and a medical professional most certainly should) have determined this from direct personal observation. I hold that the inability to discern this, reflects very badly on other aspects of professional competence.

Both the manner of your writing and your approach to this matter, carefully seeking the most appropriate evidence and sifting against your own "common sense", indicate that you are a pretty smart fellow. Unfortunately, others are not so blessed and may not fare so well. You indicate a fairly close familiarity with the medical profession and I am curious as to what your place in the system is?

It would have been myself who repeats the comment (often verbatim, from my reference file) that the problem and accordingly the appropriate advice - including the appropriate attitudes to sexual practice - is almost always the same; variations upon a theme. I do hope - sooner or later - to construct a "FAQ Tree" of this information and lodge it on a website so that we can simply link to each component.

As Jim points out, I deliberately do not stress my own credentials, as however "senior" they might or might not be, your experience - and that of many others who come here - clearly demonstrates that such credentials count for nought in determining either competence or honesty. sad.gif It really remains up to you - and every other fellow comparing what we post here against the rest of the Internet - to get it right!

Overall, your last answer there is commendable, elegantly summing up the points we have made, and with much the same sense of irony. wink.gif

 
    
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