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Oglum Bilal, askerlik yan gelip yatma yeri degil artik vatanin milletin icin bol bol izmarit toplarsin. Turkiye seninle gurur duyuyor, heyyyt be yigit asker!
hellenas h olh sou sumperifora 8a ebaze opoiondhpote se ypopsies...tapeinh mou apopsh einai pws eisai kommatoskulo proskeimeno sthn antipoliteysh pou proti8esai na dysfhmiseis thn xwra sou prokeimenou na dei3eis poso "apotropiasmenos" eisai me thn katastash...sou eipa kai prin pws kaneis den goustarei thn e3wterikh kai amyntikh politikh ths shmerinhs hgesias, alla oi pio polloi kratoun ena epipedo (common sense einai re pousth mou) kai den dinoun aformes stous ka8ysterhmenous geitones gia sxolia.
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Quoting a Turkish forumer:
"It's a well known fact that most of the boys or girls living in south-eastern Turkey are losing their virginities to horses or dogs of their villages, so I don't think this will suprise any Turk in this forum; we are used to these kinda news..."
Kala kala, "ta en oiko ouk en dhm" kai malakies, h xwra exei ginei mpourdelo re.
I may had stopped posting against my country for a short time lately but the oncoming news compel me to launch a new round of critical commends.
Greek retired Major General in PTHSH magazine June 2009 issue that I just bought yesterday:
"It is a fact that our defense nowadays is in the worst condition since 1974..."
"We don't have the means to retaliate to any small or big island invasion conducted by Turkey..."
"We have "de facto" silently given up SAR operations in the Aegean to Turkey by not having capable helicopters."
"While Turkey is pushing on into a massive rearmament through a avalanche of procurements, we fail to replace defective equipment, fail to maintain it, fail to finalize overdue and overpriced deals of great importance(submarines, NH-90, Apache, UAV, F-16 ASPIS self defense system, LEO2HEL ammo, EW equipment) "
So keep talking sh.it in here, hoping that Turks will be terrified and feel better for yourselves.
It is a fact that our defense nowadays is in the worst condition since 1974..."
"We don't have the means to retaliate to any small or big island invasion conducted by Turkey..."
"We have "de facto" silently given up SAR operations in the Aegean to Turkey by not having capable helicopters."
"While Turkey is pushing on into a massive rearmament through a avalanche of procurements, we fail to replace defective equipment, fail to maintain it, fail to finalize overdue and overpriced deals of great importance(submarines, NH-90, Apache, UAV, F-16 ASPIS self defense system, LEO2HEL ammo, EW equipment) "
it is not, we have a very good defence i dont know how you reached this conclusion, we have plenty of means and a lot of modernization has taken place comparing to the past, we will order SAR hellicopters from France so the potential gap will be filled, it is not so much a matter of search and rescue hellicopters even if we had 100 Turkey would continue to put into question our sovereignty rights in the Aegean and they would continue to maintain their casus bellis against us too, it is rather a matter of having a bad and malicious neighbor with territorial demands which you are forced to face in the battlefield sooner or later
our mistake is not that we dont prepare ourselves from the military point of view, our mistake is that vote weak politicians and we have not fully realized the size and the proximity of the Turkish threat, Greeks always believed that Turkish threat will be averted by America the last minute which is wrong or that it is something very far from our daily routine, as far as our delays is concerned it is well known that it is true, and we have criticized it during the past
but nullifying every effort and as you intentionally do is a mistake and suspicious too as well, no matter what are your political beliefs you should not nullify our military power in this simplistic way
during the imia crisis you may accuse our military leadership for everything but no matter what you may think we were superior in terms of missile power and boats comparing to the Turks who occupied an isolated rock only inhabited by a couple of goats, we have trained elite troops for the re occupation of an islet and we have Zubrs to send reinforcements quickly, so you are not accurate in what you claim, the point is not so much to be able to reoccupy an island but to avert its occupation from taking place from the beginning.
i agree that we shouldnt have allowed it to happen, however it could have been averted if it was not for the incompetence of our political leadership and its cowardice to handle a crisis
ODYSSEUS KILLING THE SUITORS
This message has been edited by ontyseas on Jul 2, 2009 9:36 AM This message has been edited by ontyseas on Jul 2, 2009 9:33 AM
file eisai malakakos kai den katalabaineis orismena basika pragmata logw "komatikoskulopoihshs"...uparxoun kleistoi xwroi sto internet opou syzhtountai ayta ta 8emata xwris na ek8eteis thn xwra sou epeidh epeidh boleuei thn parata3h sou h olh sygkyria. phgaine ekei na peis o,ti 8eleis kai na akouseis alles apopseis paromoies kai mh. edw to mono pou kataferneis einai na 3eftylizesai kai na lambaneis eyshma apo hli8ious geitones epeidh brizeis thn xwra sou. poso blakas mporei na eisai gia na mhn to katalabaineis ayto?
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Quoting a Turkish forumer:
"It's a well known fact that most of the boys or girls living in south-eastern Turkey are losing their virginities to horses or dogs of their villages, so I don't think this will suprise any Turk in this forum; we are used to these kinda news..."
the main essence of your mistake Hellanas is not that you try to tell the truth in public, it is rather that you fail your effort to tell the truth by constantly nullifying the positive changes in our armed forces and anything positive that has been done
i have done myself a serious critisism concerning our politicians and our mistakes, but i dont fail to mention at the same time the positive things which have been done all those years
nullifying our accomplishments in such an unobjective and uncritical way, in a Greco Turkish forum is dangerous not only because you dont tell the truth but because you give the opportunity to the Mongols to be hironic against us without any reason at all
be careful my friend what you are doing is lacking of thought and you maybe accused of being unpatriotic
I cannot see Greece existing 100 years from now if present trends continue.
Greece has long passed the point where British-American pressure compelled Greek leaders into a military-economic orbit where they had less strategic importance than Turkey and we are at an epoch where Greek elites openly accept and now start to impose Neo-Ottomanism on their population. The biggest economic force and currency earner in Greece-Cyprus is its shipping, is nothing to brag about. Even outside Greece there is a huger ex-patriot Greek shipping community that influences policy back in Athens. Many of these rich shipping families are in a diaspora centered outside of Greece-Cyprus, they are in London, New York, Houston, etc. They are the spearheads of the political, media, intellectual elites in Greece constantly capitulating to Turkey. They have aligned themselves with the Western policies and elites in supporting Turkey as being geo-politically more important than Greece-Cyprus. For them Western capital and its interests are more paramount than anything. This why the EU bid of Turkey or the Anan plan could have been considered or debated on any level and why this is the center of Greco discourse on Turkey.
A serious country country would have looked at the total disrespect of its territorial integrity by a neighbor for over 30 years and done something about it.
I cannot see Greece existing 100 years from now if present trends continue
yes indeed, Greece will cease to exist if we listen to people like you or even worst if the majority of the Greeks surrender to defeatism as you do and they vote the wrong parties when the time comes
just a personal question if you care to answer, you are full of theories concerning how Greece will cease to exist in the future but would you fight for Greece in case of a Greco Turkish war or you would just try to save your skin?
what have you done in practice in order to avert those "present trends" and therefore rescue Greece from extinction?
A serious country country would have looked at the total disrespect of its territorial integrity by a neighbor for over 30 years and done something about it.
this is the only part of what you said that i fully agree with it, let this become a lesson to those who vote incompetent politicians unable to assume their responsibilities when it is required from them to do so
if we are not a serious state as you say then we first have to blame the public for voting untrustworthy politicians, and then the politicians for failing to accomplish their duties
finally we should blame the Eu for not treating our country as a member of the EU allowing Turkey to have territorial demands against us, the Americans for not respecting the fact that we are a member of NATO and they should not allow another state even if it is a NATO member to have territorial demands against us
blaming the others or our ourselves however is not enough the question is what should be done in order to change that.
ODYSSEUS KILLING THE SUITORS
This message has been edited by ontyseas on Jul 2, 2009 10:16 AM
People do not excercise independent control over their own lives. Especially one lone individual does not have any power to change policies implemented from the top-down by elites, media propaganda, political parties, government policy, etc.
A lone individual trying to pressure or change elites, it is like a mosquito trying to kill a person.
The political structure, the nature of Greek economic structure(powerful shipping elites that live abroad), ideological positions make it impossible for Greek foreign policy to stop Turkish aggression(while in Turkey the TSK has considerable economic/media/educational/ideological power). Instead Greek leaders are letting their country be Finlandized, and are making media propaganda for the population to support this policy!
This is the economic reality:
Government Budgets:
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Greece revenues: $132.4 billion, expenditures: $143.8 billion (2008 est.) [1]
Cyprus revenues:: $11.33 billion, expenditures:: $11.2 billion (2008 est.) [2]
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Turkey: revenues: $164.6 billion, expenditures: $176.3 billion (2008 est.) [3]
Greece-Cyprus have the economic power and resources to do something. Instead hardly anything is done, because there is no will. Turkey has infiltrated American power circles, Western media, backs up its territorial claims with 30+ years of violations, it is demographically setting up camp in Western Europe with 6 million immigrants and growing, it is spending as much money in Western Thrace now as it does on the TRNC, dumping its illegal immigrants muslim ummah brothers on Greece, etc. Where is a strong Greek responce to all this?
People do not excercise independent control over their own lives. Especially one lone individual does not have any power to change policies implemented from the top-down by elites, media propaganda, political parties, government policy, etc.
A lone individual trying to pressure or change elites, it is like a mosquito trying to kill a person.
The political structure, the nature of Greek economic structure(powerful shipping elites that live abroad), ideological positions make it impossible for Greek foreign policy to stop Turkish aggression(while in Turkey the TSK has considerable economic/media/educational/ideological power). Instead Greek leaders are letting their country be Finlandized, and are making media propaganda for the population to support this policy!
one alone maybe not, but many of them yes
so many years we have been hearing citizens thinking the way you do criticizing everyone and everybody except from themselves, the question is what will really change if we are not ready to change practices and assume our responsibilities in a personal level?
absolutely nothing my friend.
ODYSSEUS KILLING THE SUITORS
This message has been edited by ontyseas on Jul 2, 2009 10:18 AM
I can understand why Findland was "Findlandized" by the USSR which was a world economic and military power. But as I posted Greece-Cyprus despite the huge demographic imbalance have nearly as much economic resources (government budget) as Turkey.
You pretend that I am telling something so bad, but the Greeks who deny what is actually happening and instead relying on Greek media propaganda at its face value(instead of looking at what it is structurally saying) or their own fanciful thinking are worse.
Odysseus so why do you think Greek leaders are allowing Turkey to Finlandize their country?
Odysseus so why do you think Greek leaders are allowing Turkey to Finlandize their country?
you will tell me that, as you said im a citizen fully infuenced by proganda and therefore unable to think clearly as you do
just tell me for the sake of the conversation because honestly all this time i try to penetrate into your mind and find out the way you think
so tell me what are those policies on behalf of the Greek side which make Turkey aggressive towards Greece it would be interesting in hearing so, what are those policies which makes them to violate our air and naval space? or to send troops on inhabited islets which belong to Greece in order to escalate a crisis?
ODYSSEUS KILLING THE SUITORS
This message has been edited by ontyseas on Jul 2, 2009 10:29 AM
Turkey is a muslim country so it is structurally incapable of peace, even internally as we can see. The Koran openly has many jihad verses that invite to make war on infidel lands. This and other Islamic sources were codified into Sharia law which was the engine of the Ottoman Empire's legal system. Modern Turkey has inherited these stances. Wheras a traditional shahid is someone that dies in a jihad for Islam, the Turks will call a pilot even if he is shot down over Athens a sehit(their version of shahid) which in its closest equivalent to our way of thinking is a martyr for the nation or religion.
Instead of realizing this simple fact, due to various ideological pecularities Greek leaders seem to believe in converting Turkey to a peaceful, democratic neighbor by supporting its EU bid. This is naive on too many levels. First Turks already in Europe as immigrants as we see on this forum are racist, fanatic, genocidal, stupid liars. Second if Turkey is in the EU it will demographically dominate, and it would only make Greece's Findlandization more pronounced with Turkey having so much power in EU Parliament and institutions (due to Mohammedan reproducing like rabbits) :
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Live Births 2005
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France 774,355 [1]
Germany 685,795 [2]
Turkey 1,361,000 [3]
Greece 107,545 [4]
Greek leaders cannot envision any way to cope or deal with Turkey in the proper manner because they believe in myths, chimeras and face structural problems that prevent them from properly digesting what is actually happening and then responding in a decisive manner.
It is a joke for a country to respond for the perenial disrespect that Greece has received from Turkey by supporting to invest in Turkey or to support it diplomatically with an EU bid.
Blaming Turkey for everything LOL,loser mentality.
No attacks or anything bad will ever come from the east,unless you greeks instegate it or cause it.This is a guarantee.
we turks do things for our own benefit and not for ONE particluar country.
If that means a strong defence industry so be it.
Howver in all seriousness this is not aimed at one particular country,including greece.
It is simple get your heads cleaned up from conspiracy theories,biitching,complaining,propaganda and the BS Turkish threat.
Then and only then you might respect yourselves to fix what ever deemed problems you may have imagenary or real LOL
we Turks have our problems yes but we get on with life and business good or bad,not blaming it on one country or many countries,it comes from a stable clam dispositioned mind and make up
you see Nikephoros, if you say that those policies are that we dont assist them to enter the EU it is wrong, our political support has been given for their cause despite their numerous aggressive military actions against us
if you say that it is the fact that we buy weapons, of course we will do so when we have a neighbor who uses its military stength in order to back its territorial demands on a daily basis
if you say that it is the fact that we want to expand our naval territory to 12 nautical miles and thats the reason they have a casus belli against us, then i will asnwer to you that expanding our nautical miles to 12 nautical miles is not expansionism it is something compatible to the international naval law
so what it is it in your mind that we should have done in order to avert the the aggressive behavior of Turkey against Greece?
maybe to accept the grey zones and finally succumb to the Turkish demands?
we shouldnt have sent any troops on western Imia or we shouldnt raise the Greek flag on the eastern Imia because this way we wouldnt provocue the Turks?
i just hope that you dont believe anything of the above, because nobody calling himself a Greek would believe in such treacherous and unrealistic ideas.
Instead of realizing this simple fact, due to various ideological pecularities Greek leaders seem to believe in converting Turkey to a peaceful, democratic neighbor by supporting its EU bid. This is naive on too many levels. First Turks already in Europe as immigrants as we see on this forum are racist, fanatic, genocidal, stupid liars. Second if Turkey is in the EU it will demographically dominate, and it would only make Greece's Findlandization more pronounced with Turkey having so much power in EU Parliament and institutions (due to Mohammedan reproducing like rabbits
i missed your previous answer, just give me some time to think about it
i fully agree with what you said, Turkey will never change its structure and their political thinking which is closely connected to religion
i just misunderstood what you said thinking that you implied that Turkish agressiveness is mainly owed to the Greek foreign policy
in a way it may be so, it is true that we try to change something that cannot be changed , but i have never said the opposite in any previous conversations so we fully agree
Turkey should be faced as a primitive backwardish Muslim country and dangerous neighbor
The problem is that Greece buys weapons and largely does nothing, except for chasing out their coast guard, air force violators.
When Turkey buys weapons in the USA it imposes on the American defence firms and centers of power to support them diplomatically, politically, geo-strategically. Greece does none of this. One example the US has Joseph Ralston(ex-airforce general, on the board of directions of Cohen Group international relations firm which Turkey retains, Board of director of Lockhead Martin) as a co-ordinator for the PKK-Kurdish issue to allay Turkey's concerns. When has Greece ever got an American defence firm to do a similar for its interests? Never, infact many Greeks are so leftist anti-American they would attack such a position. When the ROC tries to buy weapons Ankara and the its TRNC puppets always try to bring up internationally how this is bad for "talks" or the situation or whatever. If you look it things in simple terms it is amazing.
Basically Turkey is allowed to challenge Greek and Cypriot territory with no real reprecussions, except that Athens threatens to "not support their EU bid"! This is the crux of the problem but few Greeks can see it in such terms because of successive media portrayls.
Edit: @Ontyseas:
I was wondering how you could have thought I said that it is Greece's fault that Turkey is so aggressive.
Without reading such an article it is hard to imagine how any country in the world can allow itself to be treated the way Turkey has been treating Greece, and to normalize such a treatment by continuing with "friendship" fantasies.
This message has been edited by Nikephoros on Jul 2, 2009 11:26 AM This message has been edited by Nikephoros on Jul 2, 2009 10:55 AM
When Turkey buys weapons in the USA it imposes on the American defence firms to support them diplomatically, politically, geo-strategically. Greece does none of this. One example the US has Joseph Ralston(ex-airforce general, on the board of directions of Cohen Group international relations firm which Turkey retains, Board of director of Lockhead Martin) as a co-ordinator for the PKK-Kurdish issue to allay Turkey's concerns. When has Greece ever got an American defence firm to do a similar for its interests? Never, infact many Greeks are so leftist anti-American they would attack such a position. When the ROC tries to buy weapons Ankara and the its TRNC puppets always try to bring up internationally how this is bad for "talks" or the situation or whatever. If you look it things in simple terms it is amazing.
Basically Turkey is allowed to challenge Greek and Cypriot territory with no real reprecussions, except that Athens threatens to "not support their EU bid"! This is the crux of the problem but few Greeks can see it in such terms because of successive media portrayls.
my friend i really misunderstood you and i apologize for that, you are really taking like an angel right now
Secular my ass. What kind of secular country has its religion the Turkish state worship centered around Turkism and merely has Muhammed idolatry only replaced with the cult of Mustafa Kemal.
Christian democrats in Netherlands or Germany are more staunchly secular than any Kemalist clown we have seen here. Kemalists are nothing but a bunch a fanatics who make Kemalism into a new religion of the Turkish people.
AS much as you worship greekism or hellenism nikoruspu :0
Of course not to mention orthodoxi papaz are in all instututes in greece and you cannot even buy a Tank without some Papaz blessing it or pouring so called holy water (as if the rest of the water is evil) over the Tank or something LOL
Dont bag other countries look in the mirror first.
I dedicate Micheal Jacksons song "man in the mirror" for griiks
This message has been edited by Deccal-Akinci on Jul 2, 2009 11:12 AM
When Turkey buys weapons in the USA it imposes on the American defence firms to support them diplomatically, politically, geo-strategically. Greece does none of this. One example the US has Joseph Ralston(ex-airforce general, on the board of directions of Cohen Group international relations firm which Turkey retains, Board of director of Lockhead Martin) as a co-ordinator for the PKK-Kurdish issue to allay Turkey's concerns. When has Greece ever got an American defence firm to do a similar for its interests? Never, infact many Greeks are so leftist anti-American they would attack such a position. When the ROC tries to buy weapons Ankara and the its TRNC puppets always try to bring up internationally how this is bad for "talks" or the situation or whatever. If you look it things in simple terms it is amazing.
Basically Turkey is allowed to challenge Greek and Cypriot territory with no real reprecussions, except that Athens threatens to "not support their EU bid"! This is the crux of the problem but few Greeks can see it in such terms because of successive media portrayls
_
TRUE,but
its also the fault of greek diplomacy!!
napoleon once said"it is easy to make my friends and allies do what i want them to but the challenge is to make my enemys do what i want them to"
turkeys provocations go back prior to the collapse of the soviet union.what would have happend if greece had said to uncle sam"either recognise our soverignty in the agean and tell the turk to stop violating our airspace and to recognise our soverignty or we turn towards moscow?"
those politicians we have are traitors anyone else would have played the game differently!
I have reached to believe that voting the right party(if there is actually such in Greece) can accomplice nothing anymore.
I believe that people have to begin protesting, massively , in an orderly fashion throughout Greece. We have to throw of their chairs all 300 scums in parliament along with the armies of their subordinates that feast on our nations wealth.
I would appreciate any politician who would come forward and admit the foul state of our country and ask from the people to tolerate the heavy burden of bring Greece back on course. Unfortunate there is no such guy around our country.
Nikephore since i enjoy talking to you because you seem to be a good thinker and we agree in many aspects let me express my own point of view concerning Turkey taking into consideration that im not an expert on the topic
Nikiphore in my opinion the basis of the Turkish population are being manipulated by their religion as a result they have developed anti western insticts and feelings, this fact combined with the big power of their army in politics which is mainly owed to the fact that they have completely falsified the ideals of Kemalism, Kemal was a pro western leader in favor of the modernization of Turkey and maintaining good relations with the West, however the Kemalists in Turkey are far from thinking this way, for them the Kemalist ideals have to do with the army being the guarantoor power of the Turkish state guaranting its interests by the use of force and maintaing relations with the Europeans only to the extend that it does not jepardice the power of the army in this country
so it doesnt have to come as a surprise here that the strong Muslim insticts of the Turks combined with their Kemalist super nationalistic ideas is the most dangerous mix for Greece, thats why the Turks never supported the entrance of Turkey to the Eu in the first place, and the majority is against it and their political leadership is just in favor of it not because they love Europe or they think that they have much in common with the Europeans but because their entrance to the EU will greatly financially assist them and give them priveleges that they dont have right now
the Turks hate the Europeans believing them to be acting against the interests of Turkey as they have said numerous times taking as an example the invasion of the British in Kallipoli and the role of the allies for the dismantle of the Ottoman Empire
thats why i said above that you talked like an Angel, Turks are hypocrites which have been rulled by Kemalists, or Muslims as it is the case right now most of them more or less do not wish to have any relations with the west apart from those which will guarantee the interests of their country, or to put in a different way to guarantee that Turkey will be able to be rulled in an undemocratic way and fullfill its fantasies to become a regional superpower or even worst to revive their fantasies for a new Ottoman style Empire. Thats why all those years they failed to solve the Kurdish issue, in their internal affairs they continue to be unfair to their minorities failing to give them rights, they continue to violently surpress freedom of speech and they manipulate the west by buying weapons in order to continue to act so without any reprecussions.
ODYSSEUS KILLING THE SUITORS
This message has been edited by ontyseas on Jul 2, 2009 11:45 AM This message has been edited by ontyseas on Jul 2, 2009 11:37 AM This message has been edited by ontyseas on Jul 2, 2009 11:35 AM
P.s as can be seen from what i wrote earlier with the greeks,they are a lost cause mentaly not healthy at all.
You might as well talk to a wall or monkey you will get better understanding and response
your politicians are crypto jews that lead you by the nose.its one thing to be a traitor and quite another to be ruled by foreigners whose loyalty lies elsewhere.
Kemalism is not secular and pro-western. Structurally it has the same hate for non-muslims as islam. Only Turkish propaganda has changed this perception and the co-operation of Western elites in this propaganda to facilitate Turkey into NATO and its geo-strategic role.
Almost 85 years after Ataturk formed the modern state of Turkey from the remains of the Ottoman Empire, millions of Turks still flock to the mausoleum that contains his grave here in the countrys capital. So many that 2007 was a record year for visitors, according to the Web site of the mausoleum, called Anitkabir.
Last year, a total of 12.7 million people visited the monument, a figure lifted by a large demonstration in the spring, but still a 50 percent rise over the previous year and more than in any other year in the 54-year history of the monument, according to the Anka news agency.
Why the surge in visits to the grave of a man who died in 1938? For one, Ataturk is no ordinary man. He is referred to as the immortal leader and unrivaled hero, in the preamble to the Turkish Constitution. Insulting his memory is a crime in the penal code. The entire nation stops to mourn on the minute, each November, when he died.
...
Newspaper headlines last week told of a group of high school students who painted a Turkish flag using their own blood and sent it to the commander of the military. Last year, the authorities were forced to discontinue a lottery scratch card because its design was an outline of Turkey, and scratching off the eastern part was seen as an act of sedition. ... ...
Is that secularism? WTF, 12.7 million of them visit Ataturk's grave amusement park in one year! Exactly like I say, for Kemalist Turks Ataturk is the new Mohammed.
So the Turkish politicians that turn Turkey into regional superpower are driven by Jews or are Jews themselves and that is bad for Turkey.
And that is worse than having Greek politicians turning Greece into nothing actually , not even Finland(cause Finland fought the USSR at some point)?
turkey is not a regional superpower,dont kid your self that they are.believe it or not they have more problems than us and had we had gnisious politikous ki oxi masonakia prodotes we would not have these issues today.
So the Turkish politicians that turn Turkey into regional superpower are driven by Jews or are Jews themselves and that is bad for Turkey. And that is worse than having Greek politicians turning Greece into nothing actually , not even Finland(cause Finland fought the USSR at some point)?
they dont turn it into a regional superpower they fantasize that they will are going to do it, in reality Turkey still remains an opportunistic barbaric country driven only by the instict of expansion failing to understand modern realities, actually the Turkish policy is self destructive, their many problems with their neighbors and their failure to solve the Kurdish issue and improve the conditions of life of their minorities actually proves how wrong is the Turkish approach
ODYSSEUS KILLING THE SUITORS
This message has been edited by ontyseas on Jul 2, 2009 11:54 AM This message has been edited by ontyseas on Jul 2, 2009 11:53 AM
Basically we should eliminate whole bloodlines just to be safe. Executing the perpetrators is more costly than you think.
Killing just 5-6 of them won't make the others behave, it will just make them less bold.
We have to dispose the 300 parliament members and their close collaborators. My estimates are that half the population of Greece will have to be cleansed.
Ataturk was never pro-western but pro-Turk. you guys never understood him. oh btw, entire world hates west and her values
it was the one who changed the Turkish Alphabet from Arabic to Latin if im not mistaken, this man was indeed in favor of a close cooperation of Turkey with the west although deeply in heart he remained a Mongol as we judge by the barbaric way he treated the Greek populations in Turkey, anyway i have no reasons to deny that in the surface this man was in favor of the modernization of Turkey and developing strong ties with the west
the moral lesson to be learned from this, is never trust a Turk no matter how much pro western he might be, deeply inside him he hates west and Europe
Basically we should eliminate whole bloodlines just to be safe. Executing the perpetrators is more costly than you think.
Killing just 5-6 of them won't make the others behave, it will just make them less bold.
We have to dispose the 300 parliament members and their close collaborators. My estimates are that half the population of Greece will have to be cleansed.
"Tell the Spartans, stranger passing by,
_ _
it isnt about eliminating bloodlines it is about punishing the guilty
mitsotakis was an ss officer in occupied greece during ww2,he helped bring in the junta by destablising the government of 1965.he sold greece on the fyrom issue to which he would have recognised them as macedonia had not the greek diaspora erupted in wrath all over the world.
do you want more detailed examples?and of the others also?
and if it means disinfecting half of greece in the process than so be it,otherwise there may not be a greece left to fight for!
papandreou ,dora mitsotakis and her old man,aleoskoufis,karamanlis were at the bilderberg meeting
did they open their mouth to tell our nation as to what is being planned?
what did they agree to?
what have they sold?
they are traitors plain and simple and their actions speak volumes infact their actions are written on tombstones.
He changed the alphabet and made the language re-engineering so he could rewrite history. Not to be pro-Western.
After that reform even the small minority that could read before, could no longer do so. This allowed his regime to completely rewrite history as they wanted. For a time the Turkish govenrment totally controlled all writing activity and had paid government writers like in the Soviet system. Historians, novelists, translators all as state employees of a new created language.
"Is that secularism? WTF, 12.7 million of them visit Ataturk's grave amusement park in one year! Exactly like I say, for Kemalist Turks Ataturk is the new Mohammed. "
Its called respect moron.
Millions in Turkey also visit Mevlana which doesnt make it another religion.
Since you dont have any person on your history to be respected, you dont know the difference between them.
Forget about Kemal, he was a man who lived 50+ years, owned your fvcking ass and passed away. But Turkish nation before him, and after him keep owning your nation in your minds, in your nightmares which is the best part and amuse us. Thats the best part of this forum. Otherwise i dont give a shvit in my life what griks do what griks eat or whatever.
Your problem is you all take yourselves and your country seriously. You loosers are my relaxation source here nothing more.
karamanlis sold cyprus.
papandreou sold the agean
mitsotakis sold iperos
kai sinehizoun ta enklimata tous.yia ti efiges HELLENAS apo to forum?
ella piso yia na doume ton patriotismo sou.libasai na katharisis tetia akatharmata?
ego to vlebo megali doksa na soso tin patrida mou!!
those might be the results of the above reform however i have reasons to believe that when he changed the Alphabet he had also in mind to make the Turkish language more compatible to the western languages.
the fact that many Turks were illiterate is something different, the elite of the rulling parties in many cases did not wish the public to get much education because they wanted to maintain their status in the high society as the Russian nobles used to do when they were speaking in French in their close circles during the era that the Tzars were rulling Russia.
ODYSSEUS KILLING THE SUITORS
This message has been edited by ontyseas on Jul 2, 2009 12:18 PM
Aietus, will you become my servant ? My summer house needs one, you could look after the tomatoes in my garden I promise i won't treat you like kunta kinte !
men with heart and conviction would rather die then be subjegated but they die but once.
cowards like you do not die once but everyday.
i will only serve you by placing your corpse under you tomatoe plants to give them growth and taste.
My God the greeks are dumb,
Now they have become experts on why this and that LOL even on Ataturk lolol.
Idioties,he changes it because it was easier on our dialect and tounge to learn from the mixed arbaic persian sort of ottoman we were using,nothing more nothing less.
Plus it got people away from Papaz like figures and into the classroom.
The alphabet was easier and suited us,thus overnight people embraced it like duck to water.
There is no law that stops people from learning old ottoman or arabic as well if they so choose.
He would have changes it to chinese if he thought it suited our mother tounge we talk in.
But yet again the one and only griiks will make a mountain out of a molehill lol.
Aeitus stop playing god it is bad for your Faith and Health.
Not even jeusus knows when he is coming back exactly but the high one only.
yet you let some low ranked Papaz sell you story tales of prophecy.lol
exactly my point he changed the barbaric Mongolic alpabet of your people not only because it was easier but it was more elegant and more compatible to the western languages, how could have possibly initiated Mongolia in the elite European group still having a barbaric aphabet difficult to use and completely incompatible to the west?
this man was a visionary im telling you Mongol boy.
Aeitus stop playing god it is bad for your Faith and Health.
Not even jeusus knows when he is coming back exactly but the high one only.
yet you let some low ranked Papaz sell you story tales of prophecy.lol
_ _
jesus knew exactly when he would return but also knew that man would change calenders so he said
"only my father knows the day of my return,but i will give you the signs"
There is no law that stops people from learning old ottoman or arabic as well if they so choose.
He would have changes it to chinese if he thought it suited our mother tounge we talk in.
there is no law but nobody would actually do it if the official language was different either they liked it or not people would change and Kemal knew it, and he didnt change it to Chinese as he could have possibly done he adopted a western alphabet Mongol boy
lol dude, ataturk never ever praised west. we left arabic alphabet because it's hard to teach, not practical. strong ties with west? LOL, that's exactly what he didn't mean. you guys are so obssesed with your funny tales. seriously. ataturk's bottom line was be self-sufficient and set an example to others. oh also, you can't believe how much panturkist he is!!!
Ahhh, what do they need Lesvos when all they have to take is Agathonhsi . Later, in 10-20 or 30 years after continuous negotiations with a trembling Greece they will have their share of the Aegean.
You see AHERON, Turks are not only better in arms than Greece , but the also have established diplomatic agenda that will deliver in depth of time. The plan of Greece, is to try and absorb the Turkish blows and receive as little damage as possible.
"Tell the Spartans, stranger passing by,
that here obedient to their laws we lie"
This message has been edited by hellenas on Jul 2, 2009 1:25 PM
You see AHERON, Turks are not only better in arms than Greece , but the also have established diplomatic agenda that will deliver in depth of time. The plan of Greece, is to try and absorb the Turkish blows and receive as little damage as possible.
why dont you become a Turkish citizen re file if you think that Turks are much better than Greece? im sure they will accept you, eleos pia re file mas ta prikses me tin tourkolagneia sou.
ODYSSEUS KILLING THE SUITORS
This message has been edited by ontyseas on Jul 2, 2009 9:21 PM
I only despise the Greek political elite and all Greeks that don't share our ancient values of our civilization and Christianity.
I the fact is that 80% of the Greeks are among those that I despise , then so be it , I will do my best to have them out of Greece instead of me moving out.
Salonica revealed already that you are a Pomak. Stop the takiyye[1]. Salonica's explanation allows every data from your successive posts and shifting alliances to make sense.
Hellenas, you come off as someone with severe neuroses.
You are essentially torn between being loyal to your ummah brother Turks and Greece where you live, to use as few words as possible. You alternate between courting the favor of Greek posters and the Turkish. The Greeks rightly don't accept you due to your neurotic takiyye, but the Turks will accept any scoundrel, because the majority of their nation are scoundrels.
Example: > It is patent that all of diaspora Turks live in the West, yet they hate the West fervently and are fanatic anti-Christians. If they had the numbers and power to do so, they would destroy the countries they immigrated to, like they brag about doing to Armenians in the past(that is when they abandon the takiyye on this issue). Total nation of scoundrels.
[1] A lie muslims make it when it is not expedient for them to reveal the truth. It is mentioned in the Koran and explains why muslims incessantly lie, even internally their discourse is one of deception.
You call me Pomak when Turkish Leos will be rolling down Aristotelous interrupting Salonica's coffee time.
You don't even have the dignity to accept the fact that there are Greeks that have the balls to face the critical situations of Greece. A fact you are scared to admit and therefore face.
Salonica obviously hacked your pc and learned the truth. His explanation is so plausible because it totally explains your erratic and frantic behavior and shifts of plate tectonics. Mate, I am not someone that takiyye can work on.
To an extent I honestly feel sorry for you. But your example in this forum really shows the Greek propagandic discourse of "Greek muslims" in Thrace 100% loyal to Greece is not true, except for a minority of instigating Turkish agent provocateurs. I am sure if we had other posters from this minority they would fall into your posting pattern.
What Greece lacks is vision. Without vision it is impossible to move a country forward. This causes frustration, which is what underlines every single post in this thread.
A true leaders number one responsibility is to give the forces that he or she leads, a clear vision and sense of mission. Otherwise you are forever caught trying to balance between trivial interests and agendas that leave a nation effectively ungoverned.
Greece has been ungoverned ever since Simitis. For all his faults, Simitis clearly took Greece from a point A to a point B. Cyprus joined the EU and Greece jointed the Eurozone.
My point is that nationalist, communist, left, right or center, we may all have different views about what is best for Greece, but I think what we all share is a deep frustration at the lack of progress during the last 6 years.
LOL, this guy hellenas is a riot! He must be one of those lefties burning shyt in the street.
No point for you Greeks to argue with him. Why doesn't he just list the turdgay military equipment that give the tellaks any military advantage?
In MBT's, who has the superior equipment (quality and quantity)? How many Leo2's or Leo1A5's?
In SPH's, attack helicopters, mobile SAM systems, tactical UAV, etc.?
In the air, who has the most advanced fighter aircraft and weapon systems?
You're free to provide some evidence of tellak superiority at ANY level and explain how that translates into a significant factor in a war.
Hellenas personally speaking i dont care if you are a Pomack or not, thats not the point
the biggest curse which Greece has to face right now is defeatism, lack of responsibility and corruption.
we spend billions of Euros to acquire modern weapons and you say that our defence is much worse than it was in 1974, i mean take a brake name me a rational person that is going to believe what you say
i can meet you whenever you like, what did you think that we are scared chickens talking on the net? no fellow we are daily citizens of Greece and very much real
lets meet in person whenever you like , this way we will really find out what you really are
ODYSSEUS KILLING THE SUITORS
This message has been edited by ontyseas on Jul 2, 2009 11:03 PM This message has been edited by ontyseas on Jul 2, 2009 10:57 PM
Hellenas change your name to AnthEllinas it gonna suit you better.
ti malakia etoimh thn exeis ,vrwmokoumounoskylo ti douleia exeis se stratiwtita forums esy re giwta?
trava kalytera sto site twn oikologwn prasinwn.alhtara.
Ottoman army surrenders to Hellenic army the great city of Thessaloniki.
Kicking the Turkish cancer out of Europe since 1912.
This message has been edited by NukeGr on Jul 2, 2009 11:10 PM
Hellenas, as far as i remember you have never said anything positive about Greece therefore im obliged to personally challenge you to appear in person, no internet and bullshvit
just you and me face to face
what about tommorow afternoon Syntagma square , in front of the Entrance of Metro at 6:00 o clock afternoon?
Hellenas, as far as i remember you have never said anything positive about Greece therefore im obliged to personally challenge you to appear in person, no internet and bullshvit
just you and me face to face
what about tommorow afternoon Syntagma square , in front of the Entrance of Metro at 6:00 o clock afternoon?
Someone should teach what democracy, freedom of speech is. Noone has to think same as you uneducated fashists. You all have to be removed from this world by force for the good of the humanity.
Someone should teach what democracy, freedom of speech is. Noone has to think same as you uneducated fashists. You all have to be removed from this world by force for the good of the humanity
listen Mongol boy freedom of speech is something given in this forum, however i want to meet Hellenas in person in order to find out what he really is, internet as you know is place where everybody can hide his true face and identity behind a mask
now i want to see reality, do you get it Mongol boy? and before you call us fascists you better wash your mouth with vineguard, it is your pathetic country which does not allow the Theological school of Halki to operate, it is your pathetic country which imprisons thinkers because they offend Turkishness, and it is your pathetic country which has been fighting the Kurds because they fight for their rights
now go to wash your ass and whip it with a wet towel, before you talk again about freedom of speech
ODYSSEUS KILLING THE SUITORS
This message has been edited by ontyseas on Jul 3, 2009 12:20 AM
You first go read the whole post what other fashist greeks here wrote the person who is trying to mention his thoughts. Instead of thinking what he says, you keyboard warriors threaten him and asking him to leave his own country.
Now take a mirror and look at yourself before accusing others and dont even dare to change the subject with fvcking orthodox schools you bloody fvcking fashist.
You first go read the whole post what other fashist greeks here wrote the person who is trying to mention his thoughts. Instead of thinking what he says, you keyboard warriors threaten him and asking him to leave his own country.
Now take a mirror and look at yourself before accusing others and dont even dare to change the subject with fvcking orthodox schools you bloody fvcking fashist.
nobody threatens him, it was just a suggestion on my behalf if he feels that Turkey is a better country to live, he should go over there, as far as what the rest of Greeks said they are entitled to be angry with his opinions which are not patriotic, however i will not apologize in favor of my comrades since it was not me who threatened him. Better see what your compatriots did to those of your fellows who according to their opinion offended Turkishness or Allah with their opinions you facking hypocrite.
your nation instead of genociders and murderers are exactly those people who do not allow freedom of speech , now as i said go to wash your ass and whip it with a wet towel
the Mongols are the last ones entitled to speak of freedom of speech
ODYSSEUS KILLING THE SUITORS
This message has been edited by ontyseas on Jul 3, 2009 12:28 AM
In this modern world either you are to learn to listen what people says even if they are not patriot, or you will get ready for the real exit.
Now be human, if you are not, at least pretend you fashist pig.
we listen to him Mongol pig, nobody as far as i know complained about his right to express himself in a free way, but listening to him doesnt mean that we agree with him
as he has the right to express his opinion in public we the same have the right to disagree with him
Nearly all of us here trying to defend our countries, be proud of our armies, our history, while doing that being inside very hot conversations, sometimes insult eachothers, talking about invading ourselves etc...
But im sure most of us doesnt in that mood in their real life except some really morons.
I dont really care hellenas nor he does me but what some of yours behave to him today had shown your real faces and thats why this time i really mean it;
You are a fashist person and dont know anything about freedom of speech & democracy.
But im sure most of us doesnt in that mood in their real life except some really morons.
I dont really care hellenas nor he does me but what some of yours behave to him today had shown your real faces and thats why this time i really mean it;
You are a fashist person and dont know anything about freedom of speech & democracy
listen dude we are not here to play games, of course we provocue each other just for the fun of it but we love our country in real life we are not a bunch of liars coming here to adore our country when in real life we hate it such a behavior would be incompatible to a real person and a patriot, this doesnt mean that we dont criticize the wrongdoings of our country when we need to, and of course are not Morons those who admire their country , its history and its achievements, unless like your country you have no achievements to display in order to be proud of them.
personally speaking i will continue to criticize the wrongdoings of our politicians no matter what the opinions of the other members are going to be, we are not here to become popular but to tell the truth
however when somebody like Hellenas does not have anything positive to say about his country this becomes rather suspicious, so we wonder if he is really a Greek in the first place or if he is such a defeatist that he finds nothing right in his country, if thats the case then he better leave Greece immediately because we have fed up with defeatists in this country, what we need is strong personalities ready to fight and change things
as i said earlier but you are rather too stupid to remember it, im not the one to apologize for the behavior of my own compatriots, you Turks suddenly became the supporter of Hellenas just because he opened a negative thread against Greece, it is you who play games and it is you who have threatened your compatriots when they opened threads which you conceived against your country so shvut the fack up, we know your real faces no matter how hard you try to hide them
now you say that im a fascist person based on what? on my hatred against your country and your people which is completely justified based on the historical and the present facts?
or maybe because i was the one to threat this particular member when in reality what i want is to find out his real identity?
in any case if im a fascist you are an idiot and a Mongol scoundrel, but exchanging insults will lead nowhere , we should better focus on the facts.
ODYSSEUS KILLING THE SUITORS
This message has been edited by ontyseas on Jul 3, 2009 1:24 AM This message has been edited by ontyseas on Jul 3, 2009 1:20 AM This message has been edited by ontyseas on Jul 3, 2009 1:19 AM This message has been edited by ontyseas on Jul 3, 2009 1:18 AM
Greece will not collapse.yes we are driven in that direction but we will not arrive at that destination.IMO the best thing that can happen to greece is a greek turkish war.if you do not understand this now you will understand it after the fact.fire both harms and cures.
now i want to see reality, do you get it Mongol boy? and before you call us fascists you better wash your mouth with vineguard, it is your pathetic country which does not allow the Theological school of Halki to operate, it is your pathetic country which imprisons thinkers because they offend Turkishness, and it is your pathetic country which has been fighting the Kurds because they fight for their rights
Today 6p.m. Syntagma Roger that. I might actually be there. But how the fvck are we going to recognize each other?
sorry but i was bussy due to excessive work, the place remains the same the time and date will be adjusted according to my schedule it will definetely be in the afternoon because i cant earlier you will recognize me because i will be standing exactly in front of the entrance of Metro, i will be wearing blue t-shirts and long black trousers, i will be tall with short black hair, as i said in previous thread my age is around 32 years old, believe its not difficult to recognize me i look like a mountain now tell me how the fack im going to recognize you
ODYSSEUS KILLING THE SUITORS
This message has been edited by ontyseas on Jul 4, 2009 11:43 AM This message has been edited by ontyseas on Jul 4, 2009 11:40 AM
G/T unity (Login Molon_Labe2007) The Conquerors (Turkey)
Re: Time till total collapse of Greece ?
July 4 2009, 11:49 AM
my age is around 32 years old
_________________________________
Around??????
You ARE either 32 or not, dont you even know your own age Ontyseas????
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