Interesting that what I assume to be a Peace Ikarus F-4 is being used as a bomb truck.

I Hail The Flag

Oh look Greek JDAMS ..

Ibnelar,
this F4 Version a called a JAGDBOMBER.

Phucking useless upgraded coffins if you ask me.

Waste of bloody money, only to be used as massive exhibits only cause awe to clueless airshow visitors, nothing more.

Damn all those corrupt people that keep flushing hard earned tax money down the drain.

"Tell the Spartans, stranger passing by,

that here obedient to their laws we lie"

"this F4 Version a called a JAGDBOMBER."


LOL, so when did 71756 become a "JAGDBOMBER"

"Ibnelar,
this F4 Version a called a JAGDBOMBER. "

Malaka....if its a PI F-4 with APG-65 (AMRAAM Capability) missionized for air defence then it seems somewhat out of place for it to be used as a bomb truck!


I Hail The Flag

just because the turkish terminator can only undertake one mission type proficiently doesnt mean greek f4's cant undertake two type (A2A+A2G)proficiently.

"just because the turkish terminator can only undertake one mission type proficiently doesnt mean greek f4's cant undertake two type (A2A+A2G)proficiently."

Actually the F4-2020 is about as proficient in the A2A role as the F-4 ICE is proficinet in the A2G role.

But whats important is how they stack up against their peers in their missionized roles. My contention is that the F4-2020 is superior to the F-16C/D in the A2G role but the F-4 ICE could never match up against the F-16C/D in the A2A role!

I Hail The Flag

***My contention is that...***

Correct. Thats your contention and nothing more...

J J 6 o'clock

Now back to reality.
IŽll make it easy to understand for dummies.


Turkish F-4E-2020 have same radar like these;



HAF F-4-PI2000 have upgraded radar of these;

@JJ

nice sig.

Hi all first time post.

Hellenas in what respect are the HAFs Phantoms useless phucken coffins ??

Tellaks like it or not right now the upgraded Greek Phantoms are the best BVR a/c on the Aegean.

Loaded with minimum 4 AMRAAMS cruising at Mach 2.2 it outperforms the F-16 blk 52+ in BVR battle.

--------------------------------------------


Quoting a Turkish forumer:
"It's a well known fact that most of the boys or girls living in south-eastern Turkey are losing their virginities to horses or dogs of their villages, so I don't think this will suprise any Turk in this forum; we are used to these kinda news..."

lol, the F-4 has difficulties reaching mach 2 on clean configuration malaka..

HAF pilots say that APG-65GY is much better in A-G than F-16 blk radars.

"lol, the F-4 has difficulties reaching mach 2 on clean configuration malaka.."

i have no doubt turkgayish F-4's have tellak...

--------------------------------------------


Quoting a Turkish forumer:
"It's a well known fact that most of the boys or girls living in south-eastern Turkey are losing their virginities to horses or dogs of their villages, so I don't think this will suprise any Turk in this forum; we are used to these kinda news..."

Just to keep it simple.

ICE enhancements included F18D Radar capabilities.
Precise bombing and BVR capabilities.
So therefore it's a Jagdbomber.

BTW the Lightening Targeting Pod can also be used
to calculate impact point of unguided bombs.

It is supposed to be a second line interceptor.

F4 PI2000 is NOT a second line interceptor. It is an exceptional BVR/AMRAAM platform, and by far the most underated, overlooked AC in HAF/THK inventory.

These will serve at least until 2020+

They are not flying cofins, simply because they will never engage THK F16 at close range. Hellenas - you can complain all you want about the politicians but HAF isn't incompetent.

They have capabilities but they are old planes , that haven't received structural upgrades, nor engine upgrades.
Sooner or later they will produce problems that won't be fixable.
Serving beyond 2020 is science fiction scenario if you ask me.

"Tell the Spartans, stranger passing by,

that here obedient to their laws we lie"

Actually you are right. 2015 is a hard stop for F4. I just love that plane. In any event from a cost benefit stanpoint, I think the upgrade was a very smart move on part of HAF

The radar problem on the F-16 fighters is what Greece and Turkey makes alot of headache. The radome of the F-16 is too small to incorporate a liquid cooled powerfull radar, the APG-68 are the ONLY AIR COOLED RADARS now in modern fighters and the largest of their kind. So only Mirage 2000 and the greek F-4 have powerfull radars, the RDY (In actual practice engagements conducted by the French AdlA, RDY has demonstrated its ability to detect, reliably, fighter size targets at 140 km) and the APG-65. Turkey missed tha change to put such a radar into its upgraded F-4 and the smart jews sold them radars which can be put also in a F-16 or MiG 21.

my favourite:

Yannis,

Mig-21 LANCER (A/A versions) use ELTA EL/M-2032 radar but radar performance depends on several factors. One of them is the size of the antenna used and second can be the output power of RF transmitter as well as usig advance software to utilize the power. F-4E/2020 has larger antenna and higher transmitter power with SAR mode incorporated. Look at the size of F-4E'nose which can not even be comprable with tiny mig-21...The last, take look at ELTA's website and get an idea of EL/M-2032 power and operating modes...With SAR mode, Popeye, HGSS (Turkish JDAM), EL/L-8222 ECM pod etc, F-4E2020 still serves as an effective night bomber and deep strike aircraft...

Basicaly the guy that started this thread was focused on the greenish line on the top of the F4's tail fin. I do believe that this is an indication of the things to come in HAF. All squadrons are going to be identified by specific line colors. Allready the Mirage 2000-5 squadron has dropped the common squadron badge for a line on the tailfin, same also with the F16s in Crete of sqdn 347 (yellow-black), and 341 (blue with stars).
Personally, I liked the squadron badges better...like Jason, Phantoms, Aias, etc.

@Anatolian eagle

Yea,the israeli radar is so good that IDF/AF does not use it herself anymore,lol.
They still use their APGs even for the older F-16s.
Besides I doubt that you can tailor a radar like a bluejeans.
So they give turkish version larger antenna but no serious air-to-air modes for AIM-120?
If this is true THK is most stupid airforce around,lol.
All nato exercises have show that every single fighter within a COMAO needs serious BVR capabilities.
Turkish F-4-2020 depending on F-16 escort which will fight for their own life is funny tactics.


Btw,APG-65(GY) has also SAR A-G modes which are very good,some say even better than APG-68.

We have been having this F-4 upgrade argument about wihich country's choice was the best for many years.

I have reached the following conclusion; we were both wrong to upgrade these oldtimers and should have stored them in our museums. The Turks are accustomed to making wrong choices, but HAF should have gone for the second-hand F-16MLU option from the Benelux or/and acquire ex-US F-16ADF's. What we did instead was resurrecting a worn out and technologically antiquated plane and fitted it with electronics from the late 1980's. The result it can neither perform A2A or A2G roles effectively like any F-16.

Now we lost the MLU's to Chile and Jordan but we can still obtain some pre-block30 F-16's from the US and retire the F-4 for good.